I was lucky enough to draw a bison tag here in Wyoming. I know they are a huge animal. My set-up will be a 60# Pronghorn, cedar shafts, and either 160 STOS, or 125 gr Woodsman Elite. With the 160 gr. STOS, my arrow weight is 650 gr. With the Woodsman, it will be around 615 gr.
What would you shoot? I dearly love the Woodsmans, and have taken tons of game with them from turkeys to elk. (the woodsman passed through on my last elk, 58# PH, 12 yard shot, old style wider woodsman) The WW Elite is a tad narrower. Should I use it? I have heard of other folks killing bison with a Woodsman? Would you? Or should I stick with the STOS on this hunt?
Thanks,
Tracy
Congratulations on drawing that tag.
If I were in your situation I believe I would shoot the STOS. I've only hunted whitetails and only ever used a three blade but with the size and what I guess is very large bone structure I would want the added penetration.
Whatever you choose I can't wait to see pics of your hunt.
Dusty
Terry Green has.
70# Morrison Cougar - 630 grain Arrow Dynamic - Wensel Woodsman - 2000# plus American Bison.....You can judge that set up with your own, and the fact that the Elite is narrower.
Either head would work fine IMO....have fun.
(http://www.tradgang.com/upload/terry/tgbuff2.jpg)
Last year a issue of TBH had a story about bison hunting in Utah I believe. I tried to find the article for you but could not. And I cannot remember what the author/hunters rig was other than he was shooting a Fox Royal Crown...sorry
I would stick with the heavier arrow. Bison are big animals and the extra weight can only help. Both head would work great if razor sharp.
I shot right through a decent Moose with a 670 grain cedar arrow with STOS BH out front from about 20 yards. That was from a 59# Pronghorn Ferret.
But that is not an American Bison either.
I honestly think they both would work, but for me it would be the STOS.
Do not take this as a knock on the Woodsman, I just have more experience with the STOS on larger than deer game and they have always worked. The woodsman is a great head.
DD
Tracy we need to talk. :campfire:
I hear ya Doug, I shot through Shiras bull with my 58# Ferret, 145 gr. Journeyman Eclipse, around 545 gr. total arrow weight. Only 6 yards though.
I think moose are thinner skinned than bison. I really don't want any mistakes.
Thanks for the replies, keep them coming. I'd love to see more photos if anyone has them.
Tracy
Very nice Tracy! Congrats o a great tag, wait didn't you draw a sheep tag too. Man you need to play the lottery LOL!! Good luck!
Tracy: I am going this October to BC on a free range bison hunt. My likely set up from bows I have are a 66# longbow, I have Douglas Fir shafts that should produce a 750 grain arrow, and I'll probably use 160 grain Grizzlys.
Tracy I think your set-up should be fine.Razor sharp stos and put 'er where shes suppose to go you should have no problem.
SteveH,I'm originally from BC,I would imagine you'll be hunting the Pink Mountain herd.I know for a BC resident drawing a tag is harder than winning the Lottery,keep us posted,thanks Steve
congrats! This is a hunt I consider putting in for every year, and have yet to do it. Still holding out hope on a moose tag.
I wouldn't hesitate to go with the woodsman, IMO, though the STO would work as all have said. However, the only one with experience to this point is terry, and his Woodsman did fine.
Good luck and congrats on the great tag!
I shot one this winter with a BW PSR 56# at my draw weight, used a grizzly tipped ramin arrow that totaled out about 670 gr. Hit a rib going in and only got one lung. Second shot took her out. I would use the two blade myself but am sure the woodsman would work.
(http://i140.photobucket.com/albums/r27/sparson_bucket/Buffalochips005.jpg)
I worked for Wind Cave National Park for 34 years. In that time I gutted many bison that went down during our annual roundup. Their hide is probably the thickest you will find on the North American continent. That said, all of the bison that have been shot by friends and acquaintances using wheelies to selfbows have used 2 blade broadheads with good results. My concern would be a not so good hit. Such as putting the arrow in the curly front shoulder hair instead of the smooth hair behind the shoulder. A 3 blade would have a tendency to tangle in the hair and lose momentum, which I have personally seen on mountain goats. And that is where the heavier hide on the critter starts, on up through the shoulders, neck and head areas.
Just my thoughts for what they are worth.
Just for clarification....(I was too tired last night after closing the Auction)....my posting here was for general equipment consideration by the topic starter.
My kill wasn't a hunt, but more a harvest. And it involved a 2 blade that didn't penetrate and a 3 blade that did....at a longer distance, and in the cape.
Not knocking the 2 blade....but just telling you the best laid plans don't always work....and to use what you have confidence in. That's pretty important in my book.
Dale Karch has killed at least one with the original WW and a 70# longbows as well.
Montana Longbow Adventure (http://tradgang.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=4&t=000120)
My brother Mark took this one in Dec with a two-blade flint. 70# GN bush bow. The photos is of the head after the kill, and it's still usable. Like Terry said, confidence is key to any hunt. Good luck and have fun! They are great eating. Mike
(http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff289/MittenM/hero/markbuf1.jpg)
(http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff289/MittenM/hero/stonehead.jpg)
Wow. WITH FLINT!! That's cool.
I bet the curly shoulder fur would make great string silencers.
powduck- it does make great silencer material, I like it better than woolie whispers.
My setup was a 55#@26" longbow.
27" Beman venture/bowhunter shaft,100grn insert, 125grn magnus 2blade = 500grns arrow weight.
passthru shot @ 20 yards.
I wouldn't hesitate to use a Woodsman, they are just about the only BH I use now.
Remember to keep your shots in the lower third of the chest cavity, the hump area is deceptive.
(http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p31/smallwood1972/northamericanbisonvitals0jd-1.jpg)
i was asked by a friend to kill one horseback using his great grandfathers bow, 100 yr. plus sinew backed, unknown wood, and an agate head on a reed arrow that was about 70 years old.
since the kill was for tribal use and there would be a rifle there for a quick kill if i failed i did it.
was afraid to pull the bow back much at all in fear it would break, so probably managed around 40# max.
we rechipped the head and i shot him from about 2 feet exactly lined with the lungs.
he went about 40 yards, stopped and put his head down and fell over about 1 minute later.
enough penetration to get both lungs and also cut the big artery and he bled out fast.
the tribe let my buddy have the hide complete with the head and he has it on one of his walls with the bow and arrow.
i am not a stranger to killing buffalo and butchering them so knew where to place the arrow, and i was riding a good horse.
Thanks' Smallwood, I searched for an anatomy picture and couldn't find one. That's exactly what I was looking for.
Thanks' for the replies folks.
Larry, that is too cool!
:notworthy:
Shedrock, did'nt you draw a sheep tag for this year also? What a year man! Either way please share some pics and stories.
Thanks,Phil
Yes, what a year!
I would love to share pics with you all. I need to learn how to post pics here. I'm not very computer savvy, just a hunter.
Tracy, I shot one a couple of years ago with a WW on a carbon arrow from a 66# Yellowstone Longbow. I had it on video. It was 36 seconds from the time the arrow hit until the bull fell over. The Woodsman did a great job.
Blake
I plan on doing a "harvest" hunt for one this fall, and I'm planning on using my 51# Hill bow with 160 gr Grizzly heads. I'll let you all know what happens when I'm done.
Great story larryh.
First and foremost CONGRATS!!!!
Great thread with super info from guys in the know.
I can dream......
The woodsman will work fine. I use 55-60# bows. I shot a cow bison on a "harvest" hunt a few years back with one. Arrow went clean thru and buried in the dirt. 5 moose so far with 3 blades too. No problems. Shoot what your comfortable with.
Killed mine with a 63# Robertson, 650 gr lam birch arrow with a 200 gr Ace super express on the front for a total arrow weight of 850 gr. Shot distance was around 25 yards. Shot went through the elbow and heart and he was down in very short order, the head was still shaving sharp when removed from him.
The two blade will always be sharper.
QuoteOriginally posted by 3arrows:
The two blade will always be sharper.
Yep, maybe so, but make sure is a DURABLE sharp edge. I can make one so sharp its NOT durable, and will roll at the 1st sign of a rib.
A razor blade is very sharp....but not very durable as a broadhead application.
2 blade = razer blade,you lost me on that one.
QuoteOriginally posted by 3arrows:
2 blade = razer blade,you lost me on that one.
The angle of the grind on a razorblade is very fine. Extremely sharp but not very durable when/if it hits a bone. The edge will "roll" or dull very quickly.
A broadhead blade would have a greater angle on the grind that would withstand more "abuse" when going through the intended animal.
Please guys, no debate on which head is sharper. I am just wanting to hear first hand experience hunting bison, and what bow weight, arrow weight, and broadhead used.
I can get a 3 blade really sharp 3arrows. I have had them blow through countless deer, antelope, elk, and other game. Sometimes the Woodsman still feels sharp enough to kill again without resharpening. (not that I would ever try that)
Have you shot a bison 3arrows? Please tell me your experience.
Thanks' for all the replies. I want the best for this animal. I do not want him looking like a quillpig! I like one shot kills. We, (Bowhunters Of Wyoming), worked for years to be able to use archery equiptment for bison hunting, I do not want to mess up anything.
Thank you
Tracy
QuoteOriginally posted by Shedrock:
We, (Bowhunters Of Wyoming), worked for years to be able to use archery equiptment for bison hunting, I do not want to mess up anything.
Thank you
Tracy
That is how screwed up our system is. The Indians have done it for generations, and then we come in and decide it is no longar an acceptable way to kill an animal. Involve politics, and everything gets screwed up.
I agree Grapes.
Tracy,I guess i out of my leauge with the other guys.The biggest i shot is moose,but i will stand behind my first post.
Anyone else have a story to share?
Try to avoid a quartering away shot,the ribs are heavy and close together.A broadside shot in the right spot will put a bison down quick.Hunt safe and Good Luck!
Leland
3arrows, I never said a 2 blade = a razor blade...not sure where you read that in my post...
While you are 'standing by your post'....I'm sitting behind my 2000# 3 blade Bison.
Like the man said....he wants experience, not silly debate. Yes, I said silly debate. Its silly to try and debunk the sharpness of a 3 blade head. If you don't think a 3 blade can produce a deadly sharp durable edge, you do need more experience.
Shedrock.....best of luck no matter the choice. :readit: :thumbsup:
Congrats! Ive never shot a buff but Ive guided some hunters on them when I guided antelope hunters in Wyo. Ive been on 7 kills with archery tackle and 3 were trad kills....2 of those were with ww and one was a zwickey. all the shots were about 20 yds. the bow weights are not very clear in my mind but around the 60# range all were very clean kills with what I call complete penetration (both lungs)....I personally love the STOS and think that would be my choice if I were to go, although I wouldnt hesitate to throw a ww out there. I just think the STOS is an awesome head man. just make sure you tonto the tip as they will bend a little on a heavy bone. Just my 2 cents......Good luck!
First off, I have never hunted bison. I have shot a few elk with two I hit and killed in the scapula. Bigger animals need more penetration. I would use the broadhead I am the most comfortable with. I think both those heads would work fine. I personally like the two bladers, but that is my preference. There are heads I would not use but you didn't mention any. Gary
Hey Tracy there is an article in one of the TBM magazines by Aram Barsch. I have the honor of hunting with him in Florida at Marty's. I know you have probably already read that but maybe there is something there that can help as well.
Have never taken anything that large, but will offer some important advice. Before going on your hunt consider how your going to handle the meat. A buff makes for a lot of ground meat, sausage, steaks, etc and it is all good to eat. Processing and storage once you get home can be costly. Heck, you might even have to buy another freezer. Check with your hunting buddies, they might be willing to share some cost for a share of the meat. Just a thought but something worth mentioning.
I got decent penetration with a bear razorhead 60# bow 620 grains. the bull was already wounded by another but long story...they ended up taking it with a rifle ,they didnt want to take any chances...