Sorry another one of these trash talking threads....
For me the most underated bow is the Toelke Chinook. It is very quiet, and extremely accurate, superbly made. I am craving another one.
Most overated I own, Saluki Turk. Don't get me wrong, I love the bow (until I trade it for a Chinook), awesome performance and looks. But I'm just no where near comfortable shooting it.
That means it doesn't fit you. I'm sure others just love it.
Apex,
that is what this thread is about, what you have found that you like and what others may like but does not fit you. Saluki is a great bow no doubt, just doesn't work for me. No bashing, just simple truth.
My Bob Lee Hunter one piece 54" 46 @28, no bow I own is over rated. I don't think Bob Lee gets the credit he deserves his bows give you the best bang for your buck and will shoot along side any.
i ahve a brackenberry peerless proyotype that i just love and i dnt see many people shooting bracks... most people are shooting widows and bears(my other favorite), and martins.
To me, the most underrated bows out there in a general sense are recurves from the 60's. Most of them are superb shooters, and can be picked up and enjoyed very inexpensively. I have had more than a few, and like them all.
Overrated is a matter of opinion. if you like a particular bow and shoot it well, then it's not overrated. There are a few bows out there that I consider to be overrated, but then that's why I don't own one. ($1,000+ for a bow? give me a break!)
zipper bows r all 800 to 1000+ but they shoot great... and bill howland doesnt get nearly the popularity and credit that he deserves... all his bows are costum made for the shooters style, grip etc...
Interesting topic...
Most underrated bow for me is the Bear Grizzly from the 60's. Maybe it's not as sexy at the Kodiak, but they are still easy on the eyes, great shooters, and have prices we all can afford.
Most overrated bow FOR ME is a Morrison. I've owned lots of their recurves and longbows, but did not find they live up to the hype. No bashing here...just never found one that I wanted to keep.
Vintage Ben Pearson bows are under-rated esp their longer recurves and semi curves..
Lower their brace heights and use a quality flemish string, they are shooters!!!!!
I would also say a 57 Bear Cub Dual Shelf is a sleeper. They shoot awesome if you set it up right.
Most underrated bow IMHO the Bob Lee (either longbow or recurve). They are just plain shooters. Most overrated bow I've owned, a Shrew longbow. Just didn't shoot that well in my hands.
Underated - Ben Pearson
Overated - A lot. No further comment from me.
I think the Navajo Scout Longbow is underated.
:rolleyes:
My bob lee is awesome and I have a Zipper on the way Shoot I like them all
I have trouble shooting reflex/deflex or recurve bows consistantly, I am sure that is because I have sloppy and inconsistant form at this time.
I find a straight "D" shape bow the most forgiving for me. So I find the American and English longbows the most under rated.
lil jake: Brackenbury bows aren't "underrated"....just under-available.
When a bow has a long wait for a new one and is rarely available in the classifieds that tells me every owner loves 'em.
I've shot a Peerless prototype and it's amazing.
Underrated- 1960 Bears, I know they are collectible but I believe they are the best shooting Bears out there.
Overrated, do not have an opinion, I have owned most all of the highend bows out there and they all shot well, most just did not fit me.
lil jake, I agree Bill makes the best bow for me I own a custom Quest and have another that will be completed soon. My go to bows.
My most underrated bow must be the Samick Lightning! It is the perfect beginners bow!
I have two selfbow on the way which still stands to see ^^
Also have a Toelke Whip Classic, but that one has a well deserved reputation!
So no overrated bows for me :)
underated - Chek Mate
Howatt bows
Samick
Browning Recurves. Some people even think they were made somewhere else for Browning. These are great bows.
sam
Checkmate is one of my favorites btw. Smooooooooth as silk.
sam
for me an old fiberlgass ben pearson green take down longbow, 50#, bought it cheap for 10 dollars, can shoot left or right and point and hit. Overrated for me, was Saxon, early on in my longbow carreer, had alot of handshock considering what I heard.
Most under-rated in my opinion is one of Bill Stewart's bows and the man himself. As smooth as any and faster then most - the bow I mean! :bigsmyl:
Over rated? I won't go there.
most under rated-whatever bow I just bought.
Most over rated- whatever bow my best friend and hunting buddy just bought!
The most underrated bow's would be the one my kids(maddog from Vermonster 13) shoot and the most overrated one is my buddies wheels.IMHO
The most underrated for me is a Renegade Spirit 1 longbow made by Dave Nedigh from Texas(not sure if thats how he spells his name). It is an awesome bow for the money, beautiful craftmanship. I wont say anything about any being "overrated".
Most under-rated? Mid-late '70s Bears. The Kodiak Hunter & Super Grizzy to name just two. Both are great shooting bows & shoot well beyond their price-point.
Most over-rated? (I know this'll upset a lot of folks, but hey, it's my opinion! :D ) Howard Hill Longbows. Inefficient design, slow, handshocky & the most god-awful uncomfortable grip ever thought up. Don't like 'em at all!
the most under rated that I own is a Treadway....got rid of all my over rated ones :)
ROB...Didn't that design originate in your MotherLand?????
Where's the Spirit Buddy?
So Rob, how do you really feel about Hills? :D
Underated - Liberty Chief and Fox High Sierra
Overrated - there are bows that just don't fit me, mostly because of the grip. Lots of bows I don't like, some of them very highly thought of. I don't think of them as overrated, just not for me.
under-rated: Korean Traditional Bows
and J.K. Chastain Wapiti 2 piece-TD Spike Longbow
over-rated: I may get some bashing,but BW in my opinion, overpriced CNC-produced plywood with a lot of advertising to create demand
:D
QuoteOriginally posted by tecum-tha:
BW in my opinion, overpriced CNC-produced plywood with a lot of advertising to create demand
:D
That comment really shows a lack of class. :readit:
QuoteOriginally posted by robtattoo:
Most over-rated? (I know this'll upset a lot of folks, but hey, it's my opinion! :D ) Howard Hill Longbows. Inefficient design, slow, handshocky & the most god-awful uncomfortable grip ever thought up. Don't like 'em at all!
Like he read my mind...Yet for some reason I've been wanting another D shape.No clue why.
Underated...hmmm.I'll have to try some more bows and get back to ya on this.
The most under rated bow I own is my Hoots longbow.
Even though I don't own 1, I have shot a few and don't get the hype with the Widows. Although I keep looking at the PLX, can't bring myself to dish out that kind of money for one.Definitely retain their value though. :thumbsup:
QuoteOriginally posted by DW:
ROB...Didn't that design originate in your MotherLand?????
Where's the Spirit Buddy?
Not really Don, English Longbows are far, far worse! :D
I have more than a few Bear bows any ware from 1956 thru 1966 including a 59 Kodiak and Grizzly (my birth year) But the bow you don't hear much about is the 1966 Kodiak. I just picked one up this winter and man does that thing shoot. Every thing about it is perftic IMO. As far as underated I wont go their but I do have a couple of Black Widows that are real sweet.
doug77
QuoteOriginally posted by frassettor:
QuoteOriginally posted by tecum-tha:
BW in my opinion, overpriced CNC-produced plywood with a lot of advertising to create demand
:D
That comment really shows a lack of class. :readit: [/b]
Maybe a bit harsh, but I don't think low class. It's his opinion about a bow that he thinks is overrated, which is the topic.
Underrated was my ben pearson colt
Dont have an overrated have only shot 4 different model bows
Most underated are Pearson bows. Ben
Ok guys let us make remarks based on experience please. Like most of us I've probably bought, sold and traded enough to get an idea of whether or not a bow deserves the hype. And probably there are many more that deserve more than what the big boys get in terms of accolades. I've had bows that cost me 1200 and I found them not one bit better than a 500 Hill made by Craig, in fact the Hill had much better craftsmanship.
Most underrated, RER vortex TD longbow with the bowbolt. Not many of them out there, but it's my go to bow. Most overrated, I'd rather not say in a public forum.
The Mahaska recurve for under $500.00 is a stellar performer,and in my opinion underrated. Another I would have to put in the way underrated catagory would be the Kohannah take-down recurve. That bow has TONS on bang for the buck....maybe the best I've seen. Don't know if I can even think of an overrated bow. Different strokes for different folks there....My opinion
Most underrated would be my Wes Wallace recurve; I'm not sure his bows are really underrated, but they don't get the press of something like a Widow (which is a good bow, too). Most overrated, and this is for me only, is the Dalaa (DAS) recurve. Many people absolutely love them, but I tried one for the second time (first time I bought just the riser and aftermarket limbs; this time I let 3Rivers set whole thing up for me), and I can't tune this bow. I have tried every adjustment and just about every size arrow I can find, but everything kicks left out of it for me. Like I said, they must be good bows cause many people swear by them, but it is the only unshootable bow (for me) that I've ever messed with.
i love em all ,but have a hornes, 1 piece long bow ,that really, really never stops amazing me, i picked up used for 200. none overated overated for me i also have a SAG osage that i dearly love smokes an arrow and a pleasure to shoot it was also used and not expensive considering.if its a trad bow i like em!
Under rated the Chek Mates and the Bob Lees. I have owned 2 Chek Mates and a Bob Lee both nice handling bows. I just perfer RER and Bear bows.
Some of this is kind of comparing apples and oranges. Those 60s Bear bows were certainly not underrated in their day, though they may be under-appreciated 40-50 years after their day. The same could have been said for the Pearsons and other fine production bows of that era. Saying a 50 year-old production bow is underrated while a current, custom (or semi-custom) bow is overrated is hardly a fair comparison.
I couldn't afford a Bear bow back in the early 70s, so I bought a Herter's Model Perfection 56" 50# @ 28" recurve. I passed it on to my eldest son, and it is still slinging arrows today in spite of it's $37.50 price tag when new. I think the Bears were 10 to 15 dollars higher at the time. I just couldn't scrape up that much cash at the time. I guess that means the Herter's was underrated.
As far as overrated, I have shot some high dollar bows that didn't work for me (including Black Widow). Others are more than happy to pay the cost because those bows fit them to perfection. The bows that have fit me the best have been some relatively inexpensive ones as custom bows go: JK Traditions Kanati and Dryad Orion. Both are great values. Are they underrated? Not by me!
It's a good thing we DON'T all like the same bows!
My wife's 56" Darton, my old 72" six lam Bear Kodiak.
Most underated: Assenheimer
(http://i893.photobucket.com/albums/ac138/hemdell/Thread/PBS3-1.jpg)
Most unknown but awesome:
Arnold Smit V Archery
(http://i893.photobucket.com/albums/ac138/hemdell/Thread/Pamsbowrisercombi.jpg)
Most inovative and cool looking:
My Son's Kajikstick and Mojostick by JD Lund
(http://i893.photobucket.com/albums/ac138/hemdell/Thread/Kaja4.jpg) (http://i893.photobucket.com/albums/ac138/hemdell/Thread/IMG_0044.jpg)
Under-rated: Seven Lakes Longbow.
Most over-rated? I have shot a lot of bows and what I found is some fit and some don't and there are a lot of mediocre bows and only a few really nice ones.
It seems that even if the bow does not really "fit" me, if its one of those nice ones I can shoot it well too. If anything a bow should be smooth drawing and mild mannered even if its a performer.
Joshua
I'm with the Ben Pearson group for UNDER-RATED!!! And don't think I have found an over-rated one yet, but I will let you know if I do!
QuoteOriginally posted by ckanous:
I'm with the Ben Pearson group for UNDER-RATED!!!
Wow there are quite a few of us, LOL! :cool:
The problem is I love all bows. Still reminisce about the many stick bows I made as a child. Can't recall seeing kids do that anymore. My favorite bows of all times have always been the ones that fit me. Thank goodness most don't.
Sentman longbows get my vote for the most under-rated.
Question, who cares?? This is totally subjective, based on opinions that don't mean or prove anything. This argument will go on forever and will never be resolved, because there is no definite answer, just pure speculation.
Overrated to me are most bows that have 10 different kinds of fancy wood in them and cost over $500. :) Not my cup of tea since most times they shoot no different than a cheaper model and shooting qualites are my goal when buying bows.Once you get over about 4 or $500 in a bow you are paying for looks and it adds nothing to the shooting of the bow.
I also agree about the Hill bows.No way they would ever sell if they did not have the Howard Hill name on them. :D
Underrated would be some of the imports in recurves and 21st Century in longbows.Both of these give lots of shooting for there value.
Who cares? I guess I care. I have found this to be a very interesting topic. If you don't care, don't read (and respond) to this. I feel that there are many underrted bows. I love my Dwyer, my Fox's and my Orion, but not too sure any of them are underrated. As far as overrated, can't really say. Never shot a widow that fit "me" very well, but not to say they aren't the cats meow for many other people, which they obviously are.
This is purely an opinion thread and if you are afraid of reading that someone else doesn't share the same opinion as you then don't read it!
I personally like opinion threads...Good luck this season to all
Travis
I agree with you, Travis, 100%
I guess I'm not experienced enough in trad to have a viable opinion. All I know is that after shooting by my count 12 different makes of bow, my Lost Creek is by far the best shooting bow I've experienced. Shot a couple BW's and was....underwhelmed. Still want a PTF though for some reason. Diaper budget won't support ordering one new.
I'm with Colongbow on the Lost Creeks. Not sure they are under rated as much as not well known YET! I have 2 of Chads bows and love them both. The other I would like to mention is Ed Mikuta. He makes great shooting bows and if you ask guys who have them they are shooters.
Over rated for me are Palmers. Had one and shot it well, but did nothing for me. Giving it the rating more for very poor customer service which to me is an absolute no no.
QuoteOriginally posted by pdk25:
QuoteOriginally posted by frassettor:
QuoteOriginally posted by tecum-tha:
BW in my opinion, overpriced CNC-produced plywood with a lot of advertising to create demand
:D
That comment really shows a lack of class. :readit: [/b]
Maybe a bit harsh, but I don't think low class. It's his opinion about a bow that he thinks is overrated, which is the topic. [/b]
Your right, my apologies. Thanks for bringing that into perspective for me. :thumbsup:
I would say the Ben Pearson bows of the 60's. I really appreciated the "Mustang" model. It was a 58" bow that was suited to hunting or target.
I won't say anything negative about a bow or bowyer. Usually when we don't like a bow it's because we aren't tuned to it, it's too heavy, or we don't like the handle. It's a personal thing, and the bow may be perfect for someone else.
I like to shoot a lot of bows but I won't take a lot of time to tune. If none of my arrows suit the bow then I usually move on to another bow. I once had a bow that pulled about 50# but it wanted an arrow that spined at about 75#. It didn't stay around long.
I have not found a bow that I have found to be not what I thought it might be. Some bows that are not well known, but shoot just great. That don't mean they would be underrated,just unknown. I recently got a Chad Holm-"Holm-Made" which I have found to be an excellent shooter and a good performer.I can see myself getting another of Chad's bows. :thumbsup: I have a bunch of bows and have had a bunch of others,I guess the jury is still out on the overrated ones....lol!!!
I would agree with others here that the vintage Bear bows are way underrated. For $75 to $200 you can get yourself a fantastic bow that shoots darts.
Ol' Fred really knew what he was doing.
I only own 9 recurves and I love them all. I don't shoot them all and I could get rid of 3-4 of them for this reason. However, I can bear to do it-I am the original owner of all of them. Very strange, I don't get attached to anything else like this except my wife and kids! I have bows ranging from $400-much higher. The bows I've spent above a certain figure that many critize are worth every penny. The high-dollar bows are beautiful in terms of fit, finish, uniqueness, and performance. While I won't say it is my favorite or "most underrated" my BEAR TD Supreme (new model) is beautiful (most would consder too shiny) but folks the guys who design and make it are from a very old line of famous bow makers. The grip on this bow is amazing although very simple. I can shoot my favorite bows hundreds of arrows and am very satisfied with my results. Then I pick up this Bear and shoot equal or tighter groups without even practicing with it! I'll have an A riser to go with the B riser in a few more weeks. A moderatly priced great bow is the Predator, I like the Custom Classic because I like fancy wood (the Anniversary model is my fav but it is salty). My bows are more than just tools to shoot. I think, this is what is drawing me away from compounds and back to recurves -- the aesthetics. I have no overrated bows and overrated for one might be quite different for another. There are two brands I wouldn't shoot if they were given to me, but it isn't about their bow, I don't like the their advertising.
I meant to right "I can't bear to do it (get rid of one).
Under-rated? In terms of performance? Accuracy? Quietness? Speed? Looks? Grip & Fit? All of the above?
We all measure a bow by a number of different characteristics. Some are happy to pay extra for fine woods & flares & custom grips or checkered or carved grips, inlays etc. Some bowyers are talented artists & capable of producing fine works of art that could be considered under-rated as pieces of art.
For myself, there is nothing like the pure magical flight of an arrow. It reminds me that there is yet still witchery in the world.
If a bow cannot do that, it is over-rated.
All the best! - Q.
Every bow has its strengths and weaknesses. I will say some are overpriced compared with others 1/3 the price that shoot better. I think the martin bows are way under rated by many/most. The Martin Hunter and the Howatt Bushamaster are really fine hunting weapons, the equal to some 3x the price.
"Most over-rated? (I know this'll upset a lot of folks, but hey, it's my opinion! :D ) Howard Hill Longbows. Inefficient design, slow, handshocky & the most god-awful uncomfortable grip ever thought up. Don't like 'em at all!" [/QB][/QUOTE]
Hills and several other D style bows are by far the most stable hunting weapon made. Plenty fast enough to kill any game animal a recurve can. It also feels alive when it's shot. Some may call this "shocky" I wouldn't trade a Hill or any other good designed D style longbow for a closet full of curves. Just my opinion. Many people can shoot curves very well. To each his own. I respect anyones choice of weapon.
I think Bob Lee bows are way underrated.I`ve owned several and they shot as good or better than some really high price bows.
As far as Hill bows go. I think they are the best longbow made.Matter of fact...if you got one you don`t like send it to me and I promise to keep it fed.RC
I've never shot a *bad* bow - I just like some better than others.
NOW, I have shot a *nasty* arrow or two.....
:rolleyes:
Shoot straight, Shinken
longstick, I think what Apex Predator meant was just because a bow doesn't fit you does not mean its overrated- it just doesn't fit.
Overrated means it has a public image to live up to which it doesn't do- that's bashing someone's work, which I don't think is your intention...
not trying to get into semantics but OVERRATED has a meaning very different and "just the truth, no bashing" doesn't quite say what it is.
I've never shot an Abbott longbow, Thunderhorn longbow, or Brackenbury recurve I didn't like. And I have a thing for early 70's Bear Grizzlies too. I have "settled" my collection to one of each.
I was perfectly satisfied until I shot almost every Northern Mist Steve had in his booth at Baltimore last week. Don't know how or when, but I will have one someday. Really nice bows.
There are bows I just don't care for like Hills, metal riser recurves, and BW's (or any takedown with the limbs on the wrong side). :) I wouldn't say they're overated, I just don't care for them much.
Ray
I'll agree to my bad choice of words, basically the point here is I'm sure there are bows you own that probably surprised you on how good they are, and the same could be said with the "hype" some others have. So when I say over rated, I mean, the bows that in my opinion over hyped and do not live up to it, compared to others.
Underrated...Belcher Union Jack, Dave Miller Longbow, Liberty "English" ,I'd say Hill bows but amongst us we have enough devotees to know that we shoot the best hunting bow around...hehe
o
Overrated..haven't met a bow yet that i didn't love shooting except this one bow that i shot once ...it had these wheels and cables and it was called.....
Like mentioned before I think some bows/bowyers are not underrated they are just not as well known. For me my pronghorns are awesome but I also have a Yellostone longbow from Rich Wormington in Wyoming and it's a tremendous bow. he does an awesome job on everything but not as well known as others bowyers. if you get a chance google Yellowstone bows and take a look.
For the prices I've had to pay for mine, I would say there is no such thing as an underrated trad bow.
Most of mine have been bargains IMO.
But not underrated.
I have no idea on the overrated factor.
Some have just not fit me well and I sold them.
I may have lost money on a few over the years but not enough to cause concern in respect to thier worthiness.
Best value? 3 early 60's Red Wing Hunters.
58" 49@28 refinished by Don Ward is no doubt my favorite.
I am new to trad, but I have to say that I am very pleased with my Mohawk Longbow :archer2:
I take full liberty of shooting every bow possible at any shoot I go to, bunny hunts, etc. IMO the most overrated is the ACS, I am not used to such a delicate fellow. I feel that almost all bows considered quality product from almost any reputable bowyer seem to do as they were intended. They all shoot smooth and with negligible difference in noticeable speed. D bows have a little vib, R/D smoother and a bit shorter, forward handle shorties slower but still stable due to handle design, curves just depend on the shooter and preference...I have my favorites but would shoot any of them if I didn't have a choice and would be glad to do it. I really never met any I wouldn't enjoy shooting.
Underrated, Big River bows they all shoot well just do not see many around and hardly ever see them for sale.
Overrated is hard to say, just becuse a grip does not fit me or I got a weight that is not working does not make the bow overrated.
I didn't read all 6 pages of posts so someone may have already mentioned the Quinn's. I think they are VERY under rated.
I have a 1968 Bear Kodiak Hunter, an original Damon Howatt Hunter, a 1968 Red Wing Hunter and a couple of other "custom" bows but (as I have said in other posts) they have been gathering dust since I got a Quinn Stallion.
It's not that I don't still appreciate the other bows, or shoot them on occasion; the Quinn is just so much more natural in my hand and smooth to my 31 and 1/2 inch draw. It's tough, well made and a bargain even at a new price (bought mine very gently used). It is the only take down that I have but the fit and finish seems to be as fine as any of my buddies' take-downs that were 2 or 3 times the price and mine is quieter to boot.
No fancy or exotic woods to scratch and ding, no inlay to have to baby, no fine finish to protect from the hazards of everyday use. Just a well made tool designed to do its job.
I know I will get lots of raspberries and make people think I'm an idiot when I say it but I just don't get the fanaticism about the Black Widow bows. I have never owned one but have shot quite a few. I borrowed a couple from a buddy for more than a year and shot them regularly. I have shot other guys, 50 to 100 arrows at a time. They shoot fine, so do most other bows. Their aesthetic just doesn't appeal to me. Some of the longbows look good, but the recurves, not so much (in my opinion).
Under rated, Quinn Stallions; Over rated, Black Widow Recurves
OkKeith
Most underrated would be the newer Bears, Martins, and Hoyt GameMaster. I had a bunch of nice custome bows but I always go back to one of those. I shoot them the best out of any bow I shot. They are smooth fast and accurate. I love my Super Kodiak.
Over rated I would have to say Shrew and Black Widows. Not that they are not great bows but I don't feel like you get nothing more for $1,000 than I get from my $275 Super Kodiak or $300 Hunter.
Let me see if this comes out right...
Most Under Rated bows... The Simple, plain, functional ones....
Most over rated bows... The overly Flashy ones....
Hope this came out right......
Underrated - Steve Abbott Longbows and the Quinn Stallion.
Overrated - Can't say in a public forum.
I can't answer the question because there are some bows that I'll never shoot for a variety of reasons but they must be good bows because I read stories from the shooters(a lot of shooters) telling me how much they love their(whatever).
I know I may lose out on something good by not at least giving them a try but for one reason or another I don't have any desire to pick one up and shoot it even when opportunity presents itself.
God bless,Mudd
Quote"I recently got a Chad Holm-"Holm-Made" which I have found to be an excellent shooter and a good performer. I can see myself getting another of Chad's bows. I have a bunch of bows and have had a bunch of others, I guess the jury is still out on the overrated ones."
I would agree on the Holm-Made. I came across mine second hand and I have to say it fit me perfectly. The bow shoots good for me. And it is my go to bow.
As for over rated bows its more the shooter then the bow. MHO
I own several Widows of various shapes and styles and love them all. I just picked up a Widow PL III used and it is unbelievable!!!! At 49# it is very fast and shoots an arrow that you would never think of using with a bow that light. I'm shooting 2020's cut to 30" with 250 gr up front and just barely make them shoot straight. Going to try Axis 400's next. I don't know what makes this bow different but it sure does shoot and is my go to bow for now. While I don't have a Bob Lee I have always felt that they should be a great bow. Lots of experience and resonable price what's not to like?
From Two Arrows "Question, who cares?? This is totally subjective, based on opinions that don't mean or prove anything. This argument will go on forever and will never be resolved, because there is no definite answer, just pure speculation."
I agree ....
________________________________________________
The most under rated bow is the one a guy unwraps, strings, nocks an arrow points shoots and drills the spot he was looking at!!!
The most overrate is the one that he can't hit a garbage can with at five yards with :)
The most frustrating one is the one that's better looking than Marilyn Monroe but you still can't shoot and know you have to sell !!! :banghead:
I know frustrating was not in the topic, sorry :)
"Some People make a living showing Hate for the Popular AND the pretty"
Benny Crabtree
Senior Class Philosopher
Class of '82
This is an interesting Thread and it's enjoyable to see the opinions.
underrated not sure overated BW iv shot several recurve and one t/d longbow . just not thrilled esp when the price is ssooooo out there.i really enjoyd shooting 21st centery rfdf lb. i love my thomahawk thunderstorm though mine outperforms the new ones ive seen.and the prices r gettong toooo high. grizzlylongbows by mike vigeria. i think r great and the prices r well within reason for the craftmanship and customerservice as well.
I am sure it has been brought up here,but with this topic nearing the capacity of a good read,I have not taken it all in.
In my eyes you have bows that are functional,
they get the job done and they do it well. No questions asked. Then you have bows that are functional and a work of "art" so to speak. They get the job done and are just down and out beautiful.
I myself tend to be a more functional guy,so that being said I go for the more dressed down
look. Let's get the job done and I am content.
Some of us are content with a print on the wall,others need a signed original.
Good Shooting,
Craig
well said Monkeyball. This really IS a subjective topic and not really fair to any of the bowyers out there. I am in the mfg. business and know how I would feel if this question was posed on a different site regarding my line of work. It just opens the door for someone to take an unfair poke at someone based upon someones' own prejudices. Some bow companys, (like Black Widow), have larger production staffs, facilities, payroll then say , one of the smaller, independent bowyers...so they are going to have to charge more.They are also a status symbol that many recognize and are willing to pay a little more coin for....Lots of great performing bows out there in all the price ranges...pick what suits YOU. If it costs more that you wish to spend,buy a less expensive model. I don't personally shoot a 900.00 to 1,000.00 model but respect those who do....just my opinion.....john
Most underrated bow I have shot or owned: Mohawk. :readit:
QuoteOriginally posted by jackdaw:
Time flies like an arrow, Fruit flies like bananas.
Haha! Decent!
My Holm-Made is the most under rated bow I own in that it performs far beyond its price range. As to over rated -- I own one bow that is a very good one and I am glad to have, but many people hold it out to be far nicer than it actually is for the price. The bow shoots very well, but not significantly better than many bows that are a fraction of the cost. It is more of a production bow than a custom bow, and does not have the beauty or the quality of construction of many other bows that shoot just as well. I won't mention the name, because I do really like the bow, but I do consider it to be over rated, as that term is typically used to mean that people often say it is better than what it turns out to be.
Allan
I must be pretty lucky. I have yet to own a bow, of any make or brand that can't be shot well. It all comes down to feel and appearance to me because all of them shoot just fine. I have always appreciated superior workmanship and beautiful woods. Nothing better than holding a piece of rainforest in my hands and wondering if a tree hugger is shedding a tear somewhere --in their concrete jungle. Every bow has its fans and a few have foes. I dare say some who dislike certain bows have probably had an interaction with an owner who was a tad bit on the snobby side.
I have found that in my opinion a Dick Boss bow is underated. I had a one piece longbow, musk ox tips, skins and a cocobolo riser that was as as fast as some of the fastest touted bows out there. It also drew smooth and had little to no hand shock. I am basing that opinion on that one bow, but you rarely see them come up for sale and when they do they are very reasonably priced.
I have shot many and most were great. I have only had one that I thought was over rated and actually sent it back to the bowyer and paid a restocking fee. I couldn't sell it, because I would have had to be honest when asked and said I thought it stunk. Hard to sell a bow that way.
Gil
The most underrated bow for me has to be RER bows, the first time I shot an Arroyo I had to have one. I have never owned an Overrated bow but, I have had a few high dollar bows that left me more then disappointed.
Most underrated: Chek-Mate, easily. I'd have to say that it was intentional for the most part. The founders/owners never cared for the spotlight, never had a "look at me and all I've done" mentality, and generally just wanted to be left alone to work in a sport that they spent a lifetime loving and supporting.
Here's a little information about one of Chek-Mate's Founders. Something to brag about to say the least, but she never once mentioned it to me. I found out by accident.
http://www.sportshall.ca/accessible/hm_profile.php?i=25
The current owner, and bowyer for the last 25 years or so, has the same mentality. Although he is one of the best in the business, and has probably made more bows than any other individual bowyer (somewhere between 12,000 and 15,000) you'll never see him bragging about himself.
Most overrated? Of course some names come to mind, one in particular, but like some others I don't care to post it in public. Word gets out sooner or later anyway.
I will say that when I hear someone say (or see it posted) "you can't go wrong with this bow", they are overrating it individually. There's no such thing as a bow that is perfect for everyone.
I'd like to jump in here. I've got a 21 century long bow that is Top shelve. I've bought and sold a bunch of bows in the past 15 years and I never ever once considered selling my 21C. Not ever even considered it... Yet I keep buying other bows and selling other bows.... oh I need help...Please..
Joe
Ps 2 months and 4 weeks 6 days until Colo bows season and I did not draw.....
Under: Thunderstick MOAB... LOVE THEM!!!
Over: For me... almost any recurve... kinda lost my taste for them. Shot them exclusively for years but now I'll grab a longbow 99.999% of the time when I'm heading to the woods.
Also have to add... Bow that lives up to the hype: Morrison Shawnee, love the foam core and carbon foam Dakota limbs!
Underrated: Martin/Damon Howatt line up especially the Mamba. I don't know about overrated but there are definitely some overpriced bows (BW, etc...). Black Widows are great bows and I like them but I would never buy a new one. A used one will hold its value long enough that you can get your money out of it when you're ready to sell it.
1978/9..,Proline Saxon 75#@28" & 68" NTN (Hill style). 2 weeks later I killed a running javelina & a long list of animals since. Although not considered "custom" few were made (& sold) by custom boyers for Proline. I know the possible maker & bow integrity as top notch excellent quality. Bow is long before Darton who kept no records of these bows when they took over. If you have additional info I'd like to confirm. PM or e-mail me please. I love this bow! Thanks
Most underrated is a Dwyer original.
Most overrated the dozen or so I have tried since shooting the Dwyer. BUT, I am still looking. BILL
I've owned 3 bows built by Bob Jones, an elderly gentleman that lives in the area and for the price $250-$300 they are great shooting bows. They are great shooting bows period! Mr. Jones has won a lot of competitions, 3-D, shooting his own bows. I presently have one of his split limb T/D recurves and a Hill style longbow that he is now building. I haven't shot either of the bows very much, but I have shot them just enough to know they are excellent shooting bows.
My favorite shooting bows, in no particular order, my Marriah Thermal which I received last August, my used Schafer Silvertip which the new limbs Dave built for me arrived last Friday and my Dale Stahl T/D recurve which Mr. Stahl is still in the process of building. You might ask why I would list a bow which I haven't received yet. It is really quite simple, I've owned 4 or 5 of his bows and they were all great shooters.
The one that is overrated from my perspective is the ACS D/R longbows. And it doesn't matter whether I'm talking about one of the one piece bows I owned that OL built or the 3-PC T/D I owned that was built by A&H. They just didn't live up to the expectations I had for them based on everything I had/have read about them.
Bill
Been shooting since the 60's and I have never owned an overrated or underrated bow, and I have owned quite a few.
Underrated- Hoyt GM and Assenheimer. Overrated-well i had a Palmer that was so loud it sounded like a .22 going off, but i think i just got a bad one.
Most of us who have had a bow that we really liked or that performed well would consider it underrated. Likewise, any bow that did not work out well for us will be considered overrated. Consequently, most of us will differ somewhat in our opinions. Maybe that's why they make lots of different styles... the old "different strokes for different folks" approach.
Underrated - Lewis Hollow Archery, just because the quality of Chris' work on my Hyansani longbow far exceeds the cost of the bow.
There are others like Quinn and Check-mate, but I feel that these bows are already well recognized for their quality and price points, therefore aren't really "underrated".
Overrated - Most of the bows that are fetching well over $1300+ seem a bit over-rated; in the sense that you don't get double the performance for twice the price. However, beauty is in the eye of the beholder and this viable market will continue to exist, as many folks are glad to pay extra for these beauties.
For me, I am glad to spend between $700-$800 for a well crafted new custom bow from one of our many fine sponsors. But alas, I try to scoop up the other really expensive ones that I mentioned on our classified ads, as used. But what do I know, I am a self-professed trad bow junkie! :laughing:
Underrated in terms of you get more than what you pay for I would say my Lost Creek. It absolutely smokes an arrow and has no hand shock and is very quiet with a nice grip. I am going to sell mine and buy another one because I am dropping down in bow weight. Another is the Kanati. Very nice bow that is quiet, smooth and has a really nice grip. Both of these bows are worth more than you pay for them.
Overrated- I would rather not mention by name, but have purchased a few bows that some very respected people on this sight love and they just were not for me. I sold a couple of them almost immediately upon getting them and shooting them for a few days. It just goes to show you we have different preferences in bows. Not that they were bad bows, just bad for me.
I am always amazed at the talent of many of the bowyers we have in the traditional archery industry. We are very lucky indeed. Barry, I am a sort of bow junky myself. Get a bow that I absolutely love and then say I am done, but then I just love to try new bows. I will say I have thinned the herd considerably and have decided to only keep around 4 bows at one time that I really enjoy. Just ordered a Holm-Made Osprey and I think it is going to be a keeper. One of the underrated bows by many who have posted on this topic.
QuoteOriginally posted by larry:
the most under rated that I own is a Treadway....got rid of all my over rated ones :)
Have to agree regarding the Treadway...ridiculously low price, in comparion, for the craftsmanship.
I don't like the term "overrated" in this context....it neve makes sense to me to insult another fellows bow. Bows are very subjective, what one man shoots well with can be unuseable to another.
Quality of workmanship matters though. I have shot just about every bow that is "main stream"....bowyers popular enough to have a booth at Compton or Kalamazoo....and while some of those bows didnt shoot for me, they were all well made.
As an aside, I just spent a few days down at Black Widow, and watched every aspect of a bow build. Anyone who say they aren't worth the money, or refers to them as "plywood" doesn't know squat about bows or manufacturing. A#1 quality. And no, I don't own one.
I can't hardly believe that this thread went through my mind as I was trying to go to sleep last night but it did.
You asked and even though it took me awhile to realize I did have an answer to your question and here it is.
I thought about it and I do have one to add to the underrated list. I don't recall it being mentioned previously so I'll go ahead and just say it.
(IMHO)
The Bear Montana has to be severely under rated. I've shot more than one of them and own one. They shoot as good and in some cases better than some of the higher end longbows I've shot. The design is classic "D" and it's just as forgiving as you'd expect that style of bow to be. It's easy on the bow hand, smooth on the draw and hits where your looking.
It's not that flashy, but flash never killed any critter that I'm aware of. Very functional bow you don't have to baby in the woods.
The other bow I think of more as a lesser well known as apposed to under rated but give it time and I think folks will begin to take real notice. That's the "Spirit Bow" by Bryan Holley from Colorado. You can check them out at RMSG. One of our great sponsors.
Thank you!
God bless,Mudd
I always thought the Howatt/Martin ML-18 Bushmaster bows were underated. I do hear rumors that the Barta bows are a copy.
I'd say the most overated bows are the ones I don't shoot well :) LOL.
3 Under-rated bows: Don Dow Stikbows,
Ben Pearson Cougar,Martin Hatfield.
Over-rated: ?, I've liked pretty much every bow I've shot(in my draw range), just some more than others.
I actually think most custom trad bows are way underpriced(sorry).
QuoteOriginally posted by tarponnut:
I actually think most custom trad bows are way underpriced(sorry).
Considering the fact that the most expensive of custom bows, only cost a fraction of the most expensive of hunting rifles and shotguns... then I actually agree with you. Even the most expensive custom bow can be acquired by pretty much anyone.
QuoteOriginally posted by Roger Norris 2:
I don't like the term "overrated" in this context....it neve makes sense to me to insult another fellows bow. Bows are very subjective, what one man shoots well with can be unuseable to another. ...
Not to mention some may not be tuned well. I have shot a couple of super respected bows considered top shelf and one had so much hand shock I thought it had been plugged in and set on "vibrate"
But I know that bow was not set up right. Even if I didn't like it, no way was it indicative of that makers design quality. The other bow (a Howard Jet) had serious top limb vibration after the shot and again either it was my form, or the bow was not tuned well for the arrows.
Unless we have really explored all ways a bow can be set up we can't really say they are over-rated, can we?
To go even further, I have my Dad's 1958 Yellowjacket longbow. I can shoot that bow well, but a lot of the time it has pretty good handshock. Yet sometimes, when I do my part form wise, there is none. Is the bow junk because my form sucks most of the time and I get handshock? Clearly if I "do it right' the bow will deliver an arrow as gracefuly as a swan.
It makes me wonder how many bows get moved along simply because we have not mastered them.
Joshua
Well for modern day bows I'd say the Fox bows are underrated just because I don't see many of them out there. After recently acquiring a Royal Crown I'd say it is one of the finest shooting R/D LB's out there.
For "vintage" bows I'd rather not say. Don't want to draw too much attention to them so I don't get anymore competition when I want to buy one! haha
As for overrated....well that would be several that some guys and gals love to shoot and I can't see why. But if it works for them well then great. It just means we both won't have to wait as long when putting in an order! haha
Most Underated: The number of quality bowyers we have to choose from. For the small "market" traditional archery represents we have an incredible selection of fine tools in all grades, shapes, sizes, and flavors. Be thankful there are enough bows out there that you have the option to like or dislike.
I don't think the 83yr old John McDonald (Big River bows) get enough credit for his bows.
Last weekend John told me he was just about to turn 81. Yes, he does build a great bow. He is not as well known because he doesn't advertise or have a website. He doesn't need to. Word of mouth from 50 plus years of bow building keep him busy. Chad
I will have to agree with LBR that Checkmate and Mark are the most undertrated of all bows and bowyers. As a bow builder myself I have to say that Checkmate offers more for the money in the way of workable design, great craftsmanship and lines than any other bow made in that price class.
Overrated: That is subjective. Someone said that there is no such thing as a bad bow. Wrong. LOL. I saw one that someone paid a thousand dollars for that was painted with a green can of spray paint. That was one bad bow.
I'm not sure I've ever owned a bow that is overrated based on it's performance although some have been a bit pricey. Some bows fit me better than others but all shot well after tuning.
Underrated? If price is the criteria, I have several 40-50 year old bows that cost from $25 to $300 that shoot great.
QuoteOriginally posted by Roger Norris 2:
I don't like the term "overrated" in this context....it neve makes sense to me to insult another fellows bow. Bows are very subjective, what one man shoots well with can be unuseable to another.
Quality of workmanship matters though. I have shot just about every bow that is "main stream"....bowyers popular enough to have a booth at Compton or Kalamazoo....and while some of those bows didnt shoot for me, they were all well made.
As an aside, I just spent a few days down at Black Widow, and watched every aspect of a bow build. Anyone who say they aren't worth the money, or refers to them as "plywood" doesn't know squat about bows or manufacturing. A#1 quality. And no, I don't own one.
What is a thin flat piece of wood clued to another one uni- or undirectional?
Plywood. The so called- SA laminations and riser blocks are unidirectional plywood.
When we speak about custom bows, these bows should reflect someones personality or workmanship. CNC is manufacturing, so please keep the price according to a manufactured product or call it customized factory bow or whatever.
For example:
Jim Belcher took over SKY Archery, which is a bow manufacturing business,but they're made out of the same plywood material than the BW and don't carry such an overpriced custom bow price tag.
And I am not affiliated with SKY, because of the example. It is easily judged by their pricelist.
I know one of the bow builders which is almost as long in the business as BW and I like to glue one up by myself from time to time. So I know very well how to build bows and as an engineer I know enough about manufacturing also....
lost era: yes i luv mine too... the first deer i got this year was taken with it
i also won cloverdale with it 2
This topic has gotten ridiculous...as expected.
Chill out tecum-tha. I don't see where this thread became a definition contest, and I don't care whether you call them custom, semi custom, or manufactured....they are built in a quality manner. My reference to "plywood" was based on it being used in a deragatory manner when describing BW bows.
Most underrated- Every bow by someone who has not yet turned to bowhunting.
Overrated-I made one out of a pear tree limb when I was a 3rd grader in 1963 -- injured a Robin with it in my neigbor's yard. I remember telling Dad what a terrific killer my bow was.
I have a hoyt pro hunter, 49#. Its older dont exactly know the year on it I'm guessing late 70s early 80s. But its probly my most underated, really fast, quiet and forgiving. But I never hear much about them and I dont know why.
I had a Hoyt Pro Hunter from about 1988 (I think). It was a GREAT bow.
Will not elaborate on over rated bows. Most higher end bows which I have both owned and shot just don't fit me due to the grip. Too bad for me.
Currently have a Vyperkahn on order and am shooting a loaner which happens to be a Montana.
Have only pumped a couple hundred arrows through it thus far. This bow has been one of the most enjoyable bows to shoot. In comparison to a formerly owned LB that is $1000 more expensive, of which I belive to be great, I have been made to rethink my rational. I have put together extensive justifications for purchasing a certain bow. Maybe my justifications are truly rationalizations.
The Montana, in my book is vastly underrated. The form, fit and function was there for me.
Enjoyment and accuracy is where its at.
I agree with Jackdaw. The Mahaska is a great, no nonsense hunting bow for the money.
check-mate very underrated.
Wow, I can't believe this post has been resurrected.
I guess all us thinking people on this site can agree that Dymondwood and Actionwood are not really "plywood", right?
That being said, and getting back to the original subject, I'm not sure how to define "underrated", but the design of Lost Creek bows lends itself to a very FAST arrow.
And mine is pretty as well.
Compounds=overrated
I don't discriminate. I like all recurves and longbows
I have shot many brands of bows, I admit there are a ton more that I have not had a chance to try, but for me, my Bob Lee bows measure up to any of them and even though I have alot of different brand bows hanging in my house, shop, office among other places and love everyone of them, my Bob Lees are the only ones I use when I head out hunting. They are awesome, along with the service I get from Bob, Rob and JJ at the Bob Lee shop.
Most underated is usually the bow I shoot best.
Most overated is usually the bow that I don't shoot as well. :campfire:
Under Rated... Early Wing's and Brian Holley's Spirit Longbows.
Over Rated.....Widow
Best "Craftsmanship wise"...by far my Hyak df/rf longbow by Fred Anderson
Gene :coffee:
Big River and Bruin bows have always exceeded my expectations in terms of shooting performance. I think they are underrated. Not sure about overrated but I have owned several bows that I just didn't care for.
Underated - Martin Hunter
Overated - ditto what Ray Hammond said.
I think at one time or another almost all of the well known bows we are familiar with have gone through a period where the hype has taken on a life of its own. The duration of the hype can be extended if some of the more respected/influential members of our Gang extoll their blessings on the bow or if someone is overly agressive at taking every opportunity to promote their favorite. But, after awhile the buzz subsides and a different make/model becomes the next "gotta have" bow. I believe all those bows are fine bows in their own right and each will have pros & cons that will attract or dissuade folks from buying them at the asking price. I think for the short period of time bows go through the next hot thing phase they can become overrated.
Interesting as only shoot Hills & Hill style for 33 years. My 68" ntn 75#@28" Proline Saxon I bought new in '78 (?) is one I can't get rid of. Had it sold a few times & backed out. Thinking back to recurves (now all sold), my short Bear Kodiak Mag was way overrated finger pinching radical shooting snakebit sonofagun.
Under rated:Fredrick longbows,cause they are very hard to find and the limb design is like none I've seen yet.Super quiet,excellent performance,and great grip.
Overrated:Habu,It's by far my favorite bow EVER but the price is over the top.Wapiti,workmenship is terrible and never could get that thing to bareshaft anything and the bow blew up on me.Talltines,for the money,there are bows w/ alot better finish work out there.Great shooter though.
I didn't go through and read all the posts but my opinion is that I have owned alot of bows and all bows are not created equal, even when they are made by the same bowyer. Meaning I have owned 4 bows made by the same bowyer and one of them shoots noticably better in my hand than the exact same weight bow with different woods and same lenght. On a side note I have a buddy who can pick up anything and be a deadeye with it.
the most underated bow I own is the first one I built, I loved it but everyone else that shot it got a big laugh.....go figure LOL
I don't own any overrated bows-not for long anyway. :bigsmyl:
Actionwood and Dymondwood are types of plywood, and they work very well.
The most underated bow I have had was a Turkey Creek. The only reason I sold it was because my best freind talked me out of it. They had a good thing going.
I have owned all of the big name bows and the one that has lived up to it's reputation for me is the Toelke. Best workmanship on any bow I have owned regardless of price.