I am switching to carbons!! At least for this year. I swore I would never shoot a carbon out of a longbow, something about being sacreligous oe something, and it might be. But I was having a heck of a time getting my woods and alum to tune. Probably me, but none the less, it was driving me crazy. So I won a half dozen gold tips here ( thanks mike aka yellow dog), first shot out, flew like a dart. My confidence has now skyrocketed, which as we all know is the real key to shooting well, so I am making the switch this year. Now I need to play with some different brands to find a heavier arrow and get the same performance. So here goes a new chapter.
Yo're on the right track!! I used to feel the same way untill I started shooting Carbon Express and Gold Tips.You can bump up the weight with 50 - 100 Grain brass inserts and increase you FOC.I put 100 grain inserts in my Gold Tip Trads and 50 grain in my Carbon Express and they fly GREAT!!Incresed my penetrtion on Big Game dramatically also.I started getting pass thru's more often.Easier to tune.
give away your wood you wont be commin back to the forest...LOL
Ol Guru got me shooting carbons and I love them.
I still love my POC's and will always have some for my selfbows so I wouldn't get rid of them.
The way you were shooting in Utah last year Ryan I pitty the next animal to cross your path if your confidence is up, You were nailing everything we shot at on that mountain. :bigsmyl:
Tracy
Got to have my confidence high in case I draw a certain tag here, and if I run across a certtain buck out there.
:bigsmyl: :bigsmyl: :pray:
Tracy
Love wood for sure, and have a bunch of it...but the efficiency of carbons is insane! I shoot CX 400's through my 54# longbow and front load them to the hilt, 100 gr. brass inserts, 200 Griz. w/100 gr. adapters and they fly awesome! These shafts should not shoot through this bow if you reference the charts. I can bare shaft these with this FOC out to 15 yds. They do build your confidence as Steadman mentions above! Penetration on game is exceptional...but still, I am romanced by wood!
Kris
I like carbons, too. I don't like to label things as traditional or not, so no sacrelige from me. When I feel like shooting wood shafts I say I'm feeling nostalgic :)
What I really like about carbons is that if they ain't broke they're straight.
Stan
Say it ain't so! :(
Carbons out of my fg bows, woodies out of my self bows. Kinda has to be that way...so far. The Gold Tips are really nice though. I like them.
Just hide them under your skirt when you come out here!
I also heard they dont perform well on peacocks!
I fought carbons for years.... I will admit Gold Tips are by far the best arrows I've ever shot. Tough, accurate and easy to tune.
I will say that I only shoot POCs from my selfbows.. I think I would burst into flame using any other shaft material in a selfbow.. LOL
Love woodies but carbons, I don't feal so bad you when I mess one up.
Straight or broke. I like mine. I have a healthy apprcieation for a good dozen wood arrows though.
Sounds like most of us struggle with, or at least feel somewhat uneasy about how we appreciate the "superior" performance of carbon. We all love wood and I think this is the one unifying commonality we have for traditional archery. I have hickory, maple, birch, larch and POC shafts and arrows. Nothing like the smell of broken POC. I find it hard to discard broken POC shafts and probably have all the ones I have ever broke. There was time when I refused to run an aluminum or carbon shaft through any of my bows. Hmmmmmm?
Kris
Just goes to show you ... never say never, but you'll be back they always are ....
Just starting this "sickness" this year I like both. I shoot axis 500s with 100 bras insert and 145 grain heads. They are awesome. But just got in 12 POCs.
Something about staining and cresting and fletching them make me proud :)
love to look at them and carry them. Feels great and they shoot great to.
Love both but have only hunted with the carbons a guess for the "insurance" or confidence thing.
Love both... In process now on a bamboo osage blank from Dryad.
I see it as a wood only bow.
Ken
Don't get me wrong, I won't be giving up on woods. But I need the confidence right now. So I think it's a phase, but you never know.
Shane don't forget to drop your purse at the state line if you draw your tag, it will weigh you down when you climb up the tree! Unless it has donuts in it, then it will be a good thing for ya :D
Show me a man shooting an honest self bow shooting wood arrows,and you've shown me a man I can respect.
Show me a man shooting a totaly modern R/D bow pretending to be a longbow,carrying wood arrows with plastic nocks,machined steel heads,die cut feathers,FF string,and then crowing about wood arrows being traditional,,,you've just shown me a complete hypocite.
I don't shoot a self bow,I do shoot a modern carbon wood recurve with FF string,elevated rest,adjustable tiller,metal riser.
A modern American style straight limbed longbow with fast flight string,,,and carbon arrows.
If I had to shoot wood arrows and then pretend I was a traditional archer just because I shot wood,I'd give up the sport,,,an that's after 43 years of being both a hunter and competitive shooter.
The double standards in this sport are the very reason that after 12000 odd years of history it still has a very small and fragmented following.
We all love wood,,,get real,,today wood has become just another lever of division used by trad pretenders.
Earthdog "Show me a man shooting an honest self bow shooting wood arrows,and you've shown me a man I can respect."
Do I have to shoot this way and only this way to get your respect?
I hope we can meet someday, I'd love to show you that because we don't happen to agree I can still respect you.
With all the love of Christ
God bless,Mudd
"Show me a man shooting an honest self bow shooting wood arrows and you've shown me a man I can respect."
Earthdog
I make and shoot self bows and self wood arrows in addition to shooting carbons through other "wheel-less" bows. I try to keep it as real as I can, in addition to experimenting with the more technical aspects of the sport. I don't pretend to be anything. Nor do I need any title. I enjoy all aspects of this sport that we loosely refer to as "traditional". Call it what you want. I personally struggle with getting too sophisticated again and wrapped up in the latest and greatest "stuff". It is the very thing that turned me off about compounds back in the early 1980's. Hence my apprehension towards carbon. I posted "I love wood" because I really do, not as a "lever of division". Don't read more into it.
I do hear what you are saying though.
Kind Regards -
Kris
Ps – Invite me down to NZ and we'll go "stumping". One of the most beautiful places I've ever been to. Lucky you!
"Show me a man shooting a totaly modern R/D bow pretending to be a longbow,carrying wood arrows with plastic nocks,machined steel heads,die cut feathers,FF string,and then crowing about wood arrows being traditional,,,you've just shown me a complete hypocite" Earthdog
I guess it depends on what genre someone is thinking about when they use the word "traditional". Does it matter? I wouldn't get too hung up on the semantics. For most of us, it means w/o wheels.
Keep it fun!
Kris
mistake, please delete
I love wood arrow and the way a properly spined wood shaft fly,but how many efforts to have a very good matched dozen of arrows.Lot of cares and a eye always open to every change in humidity and after every shoot.So wood for romance or for special occasion,otherwise all way to the Carbons.LOL
Im sure you guys could out shoot me with your dominant eyes tied behind your backs.and Im sure that carbons would help improve my consistancy too.I wont say never,but I like to be able to make as much of my own as I can.
My besy bud shoots with wheels,I cant say I'll never do that either,and Ive thought of it.Sights would have really helped my confidence after a missing streak I had.I guess it just depends on our own views and what were trying to get out of it.
My best bud is my best bud training wheels or not.Wer'e still bowhunters,He just is mostly concearned about filling his freezer,not the romance of the obsolete equipment.I guess I am on the other side of that.
We all have a little Hypocracy in us.So its best we stick together with the people who seem to like us anyway.
Robert.
I really wasn't asking for anyones respect or not by switching this year. I brought this up only to say that there is room for change and at times change is good. I am doing this for me, not for anyone else. And ultimately, that is what this is about. I really don't care what kind of equipment anyone shoots, as I too have friends that shoot both, and I'm not going to look down my nose just because someone does. But I am going to rib them because that is me, and my friends give it back and it's all in fun.
This definitley was not meant to be a one vs. another arrow material. I now shoot all three. And hands down, right now the carbons give me more confidence. And that is what I am looking for right now.
(http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj8/fatman60/BearQuest053.jpg)
PhD Archer Bowman shoots carbon from a '59 Kodiak; surprisingly, the earth did not open to swallow him, and he was not struck by lightning. :bigsmyl:
I hope everyone gathered that my posts were meant to be funny. Steadman is one of my best friends and I just like to poke fun a little. I would be friends, and hunt with steadman if he were switching to a compound. Take care and I hope to see those dreaded carbons soon!
Everyone ought to give up on wood and send them to me. PM me and I will pay for the postage, no use having those inferior shafts laying around.LOL.
All about ethical hunting regardless of tools. Who'd question your ethics after 2-days tracking 5 miles for the bear? Plenty of carbon advantages!
Carbons bring out the best in me and my bows (I need them). The older I get the more I realize you should never see something someone else is doing and say you would never do that because I'm doing things today I thought I would never be doing when I was younger.
I shoot both. Frequently switching back and forth at a 3D shoot. My woodies cost less than my carbons. If the shot is long or the animal small in a lot of brush or around rocks, I shoot the woods. They both shoot to the same point of aim. I love woodies, I hunt carbon. Knowing the arrow is straight and each one is adjusted to weigh exactly the same adds to my confidence.
Arrow type has little meaning in regard to archery. At one time we had wood, aluminum, fiberglass, graphlex and stainless steel to choose from. So there is nothing new here with carbon...nothing at all except an advance in the way materials are manufactured and used.
We felt the same way about the 24SRTX and XX75 when they became readily available. I still like my XX75, and if you can't tune them to your bow, it certainly is not the arrow 8^). The key is to shoot what you are confident with, and one isn't really any better than the other when the rubber meets the road.
People who tell you carbon arrows aren't traditional, have no sense of archery history.
I have a feeling you may not go back, well not exclusivly that is...Carbons have a lot of pros. They can be a little finicky to tune but most of the time with a little tinkering they shoot perfectly, and easy to get high foc!
Hope the switch works out well for ya Ryan!
It took me a while to settle this in my mind:
I only shoot a bow for the purpose of hunting. When I have a very desirable big game animal at close range, the LAST thing I'm thinking about is aesthetics. I want that arrow to go deep and go accurate. I want a short blood trail and a very dead animal. Give me a Beman please.
That said, I love woodies and shot 'em for about 20 years. One of my good friends still shoots woods exclusively. He's wearing me out making me help him with all his dead critters!
after 20 years of shooting wood exclusively and the total stisfaction of staining dipping cresting tapering and fletching and killing with them,i decided to try some carbons.i did feel that rolling on a cap wrap wasnt too trad it was quick easy and and bam i have some great shooting arrows.thats not a bad thing,i still have a love for wood but shoot carbon.i look at it this way i still pick a spot draw with both eyes open anchor release and hit the spot,thats trad to me no matter what kind of arrow hits the spot.its the way we hunt and shoot not what kind of arrow we shoot!imo
I went Carbon too. I said I would never do it until I started bending arrows in league on tricky shots.
I made the switch to Heritage 250s and instantly started shooting better. When you don't have a lot of money and you are worried about breaking arrows - you lose confidence fast.
I am confident that my arrows will make it through anything and my shooting has improved drastically not having that worry hanging over me.
I think if our ancestors had access to carbon arrows, they would not have used wood.
Gilbert
Like Kevin, my purpose for shooting is to hunt. When I started I wanted a new Kodiak magnum!The pro shop owner had advised me a Kodiak would be better for my draw length. When the time came to buy He told me He had taken in 1 year old magnum and if I wanted I could use the extra $20 to buy microflite arrows instead of wood, after all He said "you'll never kill anything with your bow but hopefully something with your arrows", buy the best you can afford.I bought the used bow and microflites and the next year I traded for a Kodiak!Of course no one knew what "traditional" was in 1965.
Ryan,
I have to agree with you about the confidence that carbons give. It is a striking difference in the visual of the arrow taking off when shooting carbons vs woods.
I'm finding it harder and harder to find the time to make arrows yet I love the process. Carbons just shorten my time and I don't ever question the arrow being straight.
Its all good fun either way. Enjoy your year long experiment.
Chris
I too used to cringe at the thought of carbon, but I use them almost exclusively on selfbows now. My guilt left as my confidence went up. lol
We definately all have to do what works for us.If it stops being fun its not worth it.
Kudos for starting a topic like this,you had to know it was a hot topic.To be honest,If my shooting was good enough that I really thought they would matter,I would plobly try some too.
Robert
Fred Bear shot Fiberglass arrows, a laminated fiberglass bow, with machined metal tips, die cut feathers, with plastic nocks. I guess that makes him a hypocrite too???? Give me a break.
I shoot wood. The time I spend in my basement shop, either by myself, listening to the radio or watching a video or with my kids ,teaching them the craftsmanship of arrow building, is time well spent.
At one time, a quality wood arrow was far cheaper than carbons, but looking at the prices they were selling for at Kalamazoo ( 85-130 dz) I'm not so sure.
I love the entire process of crafting my woods. I don't care how hard ya try, I have yet to see a carbon as good lookin as a wood. Personal preference for sure.
I have several friends who shoot carbons. I don't go lookin down my nose, or makin some ridiculous statement that they aren't "tradtional". Thats pure horse droppings.
there are as many definitions of traditional as there are archers. I have shot carbons, I once had a dozen gold tips that flew great, but my wife accidently sold thm in a garage sale with a bunch of other "odds and ends arrows" for .25 cents a piece. LMAO. By the time I got home, there was 1 left.
I may hunt with them again, who knows. The beauty of archery is we all find our own niche. What ever gives an archer the confidence he needs to put it on the spot when it counts is what matters. What matters is that he takes ethical shots at game. What matters is he enjoys that time behind the bow, and is as good as he can be when the moment of truth is at hand.
It doesnt make a hill of beans difference whether the broadhead is delivered by a wood shaft, a carbon shaft or an aluminum shaft. As long as it flys true, and the broadhead is as sharp as it can be, then the arrow material is not whats the most important.
Good luck with your switch, and I hope you find the success you seek.
After all, carbon is just really really old wood.
I made the switch last year. I, too, am hooked. Definitely give the Beman MFX Classics a try. Check out my signature for details.
Beman MFX classic 340 is my shaft after trying a lot. With 50grain Insert and 125grain point it gives me an 550grain arrow. Works best for me.
Would never switch back to wood. Much better shooting with carbon.
Thanks for the comments guys. Pro or con, it's great to hear responses. And to get more ribbing from friends. :D Now I have to choose a shaft. I have the gold tips which I like, but I am intrigued with the AD shafts as well. So what size do you all think I should shoot? 57-59# longbow not centershot. Draw 29". Thanks, Ryan
Autumnarcher, you must have stopped by my booth.
Rick you build some beautiful arrows. Mabey that's my issue with woodies right now, I can't get a good enough set built :D ;) Hmmmmm.