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Main Boards => PowWow => Topic started by: ron w on January 04, 2010, 09:18:00 AM
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Just asking for opinions,and I'm sure I'll get a few...lol! Would you hunt elk with a bow that draws 50-52# and shoots a 575 gr. arrow. Shots kept to 25 yards or less. Also I would be use'n a 2 blade broadhead. Just wondering about this set up!!! Thanks........ron w
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no... Many would but you asked if "I" would and I would not.
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If your arrow is tuned and flies true, absolutely....
Todd
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Sure
DEAD IS DEAD NO MATTER HOW FAST YOUR ARROW GETS THERE
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no.
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Sorry, but no way regardless of tune.
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It would do the job, but like Buff I would not. That is on the border line in my opinion.
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No hesitation. My father's elk last year was killed with a 52# recurve and 480 grain arrows. The bull turned at the shot and the first arrow was a shallow hit right behind the shoulder, the broadhead was literally wedged between the shoulder blade and the ribcage. This shot turned out to be non-lethal, but he took another shot, fearing that he had hit one lung, while the elk was facing straight away. This one completely penetrated the ham and made its way a good 3/4s into the chest cavity. I thought this penetration was extremely impressive. One thing to keep in mind though is dad draws 32", so that certainly helps his bow performance ;) It's more important, IMO, to get your arrow tuned perfectly than to pull a lot of weight or shoot a really heavy arrow.
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No, elk are big tough animals and anything less than a perfect hit with that weight is a lost animal.
Can you kill one yes, would I hunt with one ... no!
An extremely reputable bowhunter, bowyer and lifelong elk hunter has told me despite what you read and hear elk, should not be hunted with anything less than 60 lbs. He has seen a very high percentage of lost animals over the years due to guys hunting elk with their deer hunting rigs.
You only hear of the success, but the lost ones are well kept secrets.
BTW, there may be a 400 lbs difference between the two, and the chest width of an elk is 2x that of a deer.
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I prefere to hunt elk around 65#,but kids and woman kill them with much less.In your case everything has to be perfect.At the end shot placement is the most important factor.
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Never have had the chance to hunt elk with a bow (have bumped a big bull off with my 338), but based on what I have done over the years with bow I would be completely comfortable up around 60 lbs at my draw length with one of my TD recurves (amazingly enough, I have a set of limbs that will give me 60# with my CM H2). With a 575 grain arrow & good 2 blade, at 25 yards I have no doubt it would bury to the fletching...
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Not to ding anyones opinion here, but I am noticing that the guys who hunt where elk live are saying yes, and the guys who don't are saying no. Having lived and hunted where elk are abundant all of my life, I know a lot of folks who have done it with less. Not reccomended mind you but it has been done. Lighter set ups demand perfect shot placement. Nothing is worse than wounding and loosing an animal.
I hunt with a 55 lb longbow and can tell you that a 575 grain arrow will work just fine. I will also say that shooting at 25 yards and under, a much heavier arrow will penetrate far better, and won't have that much different of a trajectory.
My elk arrows are 684 grains and optimized per the Ashby reports. If your keeping it at 25 yards and under, I would set up some heavier high FOC arrows for the hunt.
The key is to stay calm, keep your shots at 25 yards or less, and don't take iffy shots. Slighty quartering away or broadside are the only shots to take. Make sure your arrows are tuned perfectly and don't get excited and take a long or bad angle shot. Elk are tough and will travel for miles if hit wrong. Hit them in the boiler room, and they will run 60 to 150 yards and expire, and then fun is over and the work begins.
No 2 inch wide, super steep angle heads. They will be stopped dead by a hard hit on a rib.
American Indians killed millions of elk with 30 to 40 lb bows. You can definately kill one with your set up.
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I killed a mature cow elk with a 53# at 28", 420gr carbon with sharp Silvreflame bh. Clipped the scapula nearside. broke rib, then off side rib and buried in the offside leg.
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Originally posted by Ragnarok Forge:
Not to ding anyones opinion here, but I am noticing that the guys who hunt where elk live are saying yes, and the guys who don't are saying no. Having lived and hunted where elk are abundant all of my life, I know a lot of folks who have done it with less. Not reccomended mind you but it has been done. Lighter set ups demand perfect shot placement. Nothing is worse than wounding and loosing an animal.
I hunt with a 55 lb longbow and can tell you that a 575 grain arrow will work just fine. I will also say that shooting at 25 yards and under, a much heavier arrow will penetrate far better, and won't have that much different of a trajectory.
My elk arrows are 684 grains and optimized per the Ashby reports. If your keeping it at 25 yards and under, I would set up some heavier high FOC arrows for the hunt.
The key is to stay calm, keep your shots at 25 yards or less, and don't take iffy shots. Slighty quartering away or broadside are the only shots to take. Make sure your arrows are tuned perfectly and don't get excited and take a long or bad angle shot. Elk are tough and will travel for miles if hit wrong. Hit them in the boiler room, and they will run 60 to 150 yards and expire, and then fun is over and the work begins.
No 2 inch wide, super steep angle heads. They will be stopped dead by a hard hit on a rib.
American Indians killed millions of elk with 30 to 40 lb bows. You can definately kill one with your set up.
I guess living at 7500 feet in what amounts to the southern rocky mountains isn't Elk country? We've got more elk than WA.
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First elk I shot was with my longbow at 53#. My total arrow weight was 550. Shot it with a 125 grain 2 blade Zwickey broadhead. She only went about 100 yds before falling over. I was able to watch her the entire time. Second elk was shot with a 60# longbow. Same arrow setup. He went less than 100yds in the aspens. I was able to watch him also the entire time. He laid down and it was all over in 9 minutes. The bottom line is your bow will do fine so long as the broadheads are sharpe and you can shoot it accurately. Good luck.
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I've killed a few elk, not a lot. I think 50# is marginal. Can it kill an elk, sure. Something 5-10# heavier would be better, IMO.
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Since I don't live in elk country and am in the planning stages I would not want to risk losing an animal if presented with the shot due poor equipment performance.
You might only get one chance, and due to the expense and time incurred, you might not ever get another chance. So, my viewpoint is to maximize my hit potential, but then again I use 60 lbs for deer for the same reason.
Many westerners use light cartridges to hunt elk and do fine, but would I spend over $5,000.00 and take anything less than a 60 lbs bow or a 30-06?
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You might be interested in reading the latest reports from Ed Ashby that compare the penetration performace of a 40 lb bow, with a well designed arrow, to heavier bows in the 70-80 lb range. The bottom line: arrow design is perhaps most important. Go read the reports, then re-think you arrow design (which two blade broadhead?, which shaft?, etc). After having successfully hunted elk for more that 30 years, I would say you will be OK.
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Yes. If you are drawing full draw and getting perfect arrow flight, it will kill quickly; quicker than a 60 pound drawn to 26". You need to look at the complete dynamics, not the numbers written on a bow.
If you asked that question about a sixty pound bow, few would disagree with you, even though they don't know anything about draw length, accuracy, etc.
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Clay,
Unfortunately, in many cases, non residents have more experience hunting elk than residents of western states.
False assumptions are sometimes easy to jump to.
I would not do it, but then I don't have to either, since I shoot heavier than that.
I'd bet there's someone who will come on here and talk about their 13 year old who did it wiht a 35 lb at 17" draw bow and a 327 grain arrow.
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I consideration to George's post, I am assuming perfect flight and form at my 28" draw. There are many variable indeed.
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What they scribble on the side of your bow is relatively meaningless. I have 50# R/Ds that shoot circles around my 60# longbows and I shoot the 50#s more accurately. So how is the 60#er a more lethal weapon just because it has higher numbers scribbled on the side of the riser? Accuracy and arrow tune will trump anything else.
And for what it is worth, there is a small herd of Elk that lives within 10 miles of me-I guess I live in Elk country. Yippee!!
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There are some of us out there that were not designed to draw a 60# bow and shoot it well. Does that mean that we're not eligible to hunt elk? I've killed a few with bows in the 52# range,but I'm picky about my shots, and I practice a lot.
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Originally posted by Cool Arrow:
There are some of us out there that were not designed to draw a 60# bow and shoot it well. Does that mean that we're not eligible to hunt elk? I've killed a few with bows in the 52# range,but I'm picky about my shots, and I practice a lot.
Many states do have a minimum poundage requirement.
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I am in complete agreement with those who have said that draw weight has become next to useless in determining whether or not a bow is actually adequate for a certain animal. Like others have said, a 50# ACS may well outperform a 65# or even higher Hill style longbow. There is such a huge spread in traditional bow performance today that one draw weight could easily produce a difference of at least 20fps between different bows depending on the bow you use. Draw length, as mentioned, is also a very valuable piece of the equation when figuring your bow's lethality potential. A 50# bow drawn to 30" is going to put out roughly equal energy to the same bow at 56# drawn to 28", or 62# drawn to 26".
Besides, I know a 13 year old kid who killed a 14 point bull with a 35#@17" longbow, 327 grain arrows, and mechanical broadheads, so I'm sure you'll be fine ;)
Craig
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Well, as they say, a little knowledge is a terrible thing 8^).
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Absolutely, I'd use a 3-blade magnus SnufferSS instead with 200-225 grain total head weight though!
Probably don't need the extra head weight but I like it that way!
ElkNut1
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Let me say that My bows are 50-52# at my draw of 29", I can shoot more wieght but not well. As I have gotten older I have dropped down some. Right now I have 2 bows that are 54# @ 29". Is a couple of pounds gonna make it or break it??? Like I said I like to keep shots 25 yd. or less.
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fifty pounds is plenty for elk,oregon minimum draw weight for elk is fifty so wherever you are hunting make sure your bow is marked at the required poundage or you run the risk of being cited. EXAMPLE: your bow is marked [email protected] have a 30" draw and the poundage at 30 is 54...you can be cited for shooting an under weight bow.i have seen it done so make sure it says the required poundage.fifty is plenty for elk. like stated shot placement and a razor sharp broadhead plus a smooth release are the keys to good penetration.
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Here is how I see that. Will it kill and elk? Yes it will. I have seen that be true more than once.
Would I recomend that set up or use it myself probably not.
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Elkherder brings up a really good point about the release-a good release can be worth as much as 10% over a mediocre one, and it is for 'free'. Check it out.
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Originally posted by just_a_hunter:
If your arrow is tuned and flies true, absolutely....
Todd
DITTO!
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Years ago I had 2 brothers bowhunting elk with me. They were probably the best hunters I have every been with. Almost daily they could get within bow range of elk. They both shot 50-55 lb. bows / wood arrows and bear 2 blade heads. Of course this was many years ago and this was about what everyone shot.
Anyway, they wounded more game than I ever shot at. They were very good shots, but just did not get the penatration. We all thought they were on the low end of bow weight.
I have shot a 70 lb bow for 35 years and would consider anything below 60 lbs as marginal. I know not everyone will agree, but that is my personal recommendation. There is a big difference between a whitetail deer and our elk.
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see, I told you someone would say they knew a 13 year old kid who did it with a 35# @17" bow- now, just to prove I'm not just lucky but also KARNAK the magnificent, the note in my mayonnaise jar says the next guy is going to tell us about his hunting buddy's wife who killed one with a 39# bow and 345 grain arrows- and the arrow went out the other side and stuck in a ponderosa 42.5 feet past the elk.
tap...tap....tap
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That combination is more than adequate. My hunting buddy's wife killed a B &C bull with a 39# bow and 345 grain arrows. Not only did she get a complete pass through but the arrow was found stuck in a ponderosa pine 42.5 feet past the elk!!! :bigsmyl:
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I can draw more #'age but I know in a hunting situation more is not always better, I think that a bow shot with confidence is better than being over bowed and shot poorly.
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You guys are something!!!
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There is lots of info here but much of it is slightly tainted. I guess my question is if you own and shoot 50# bows and plan on using them for elk then why ask the question? Everybody who doesn't shoot meadium weight bows (60-70#) is going to tell you that you're fine and everybody who shoots medium to heavy bows will tell you you're just a tad light. Don't fall too hard for the I shoot ACS or other R/D type bows and they outperform Hill bows of even heavier weight. I don't shoot Hill bows and still have to say that if you're shooting heavy arrows you would be hard put to match their performance with anything out there.
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Originally posted by ron w:
Just asking for opinions,and I'm sure I'll get a few...lol! Would you hunt elk with a bow that draws 50-52# and shoots a 575 gr. arrow. Shots kept to 25 yards or less. Also I would be use'n a 2 blade broadhead. Just wondering about this set up!!! Thanks........ron w
In a heartbeat. If I remember from the latest TBM, Fred Eichler hunts with a 54# recurve and arrows that weigh slightly under 500 grains. I'd say he's killed a critter or two in his day.
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I have never personally met anyone that has lost an elk due to low poundage. I think sometimes poor penetration gets blamed on low poundage when it fact they were shooting at extended ranges, put the arrow right on a bone or shoulder blade, or poor broadhead choice. Bottom line is, from guys that I know who have lost elk, they made a poor shot and/or did not wait long enough. I would not hesitate shooting low 50's for elk but my 25-30 yard shots would be out of the question. And 10-15 is what I would have to have.
We should not be debating poundage because ft/lbs of energy would be more informative. Who cares what the poundage is considering the major differences in efficiencies. Just one personal example. I have an 80# Bushmaster Hill style longbow that I think shoots very close to the same speed as my Centaur Chimera at 65# with the same arrow. Also as previously mentioned, you can't put too much stock into what is written on the bow.
Arrow placement will always e the most important element. Out of control increased power will do little to help you bag an elk.
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why does increased power REQUIRE you to be out of control? Where in his question does he say " don't tell me to shoot a higher weight because I can't handle it"?
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Fred Eichler killed the Super Slam of North American big game animals with a 54# Palmer. Think about it...draw your own conclusions.
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longbowman,
I shoot 68-70#@30" currently and I still think a good performing 50 pound bow with a perfectly tuned arrow and good dependable 2 blade broadhead would do a number on them :) I think most penetration problems come from poorly tuned arrows. I've experienced this myself. I was shooting a 60#@29" Border recurve one year (before I gained another inch in draw) with 680 grain arrows, and I didn't take the time to tune them properly. I just watched them fly and said "Good enough". I shot a whitetail doe with this combo and failed to get penetration. I originally thought it was a shoulder hit, but thinking back on the shot I'm pretty sure it was just a rib. The arrow didn't make it past a puny whitetail rib! Now, I'm sure there are several reasons for this. I'm sure it was partly the slight wind, partly my bad form from being excited and shooting a bow that was too heavy for me at the time, but the arrow struck the doe in a good place, but nearly sideways. That's one of the reasons why I'm now a huge proponent of perfect arrow flight. I've since had arrows get complete penetration on whitetail vertebrae with only a 52#@30" bow and 420 grain arrows. Arrow flight is too often overlooked in the penetration equation :)
Craig
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I probably wouldn't take a shot(on an elk) with any weight traditional bow OVER 25 yards...whether it was a 50 pound bow or a 100 pound bow...too many bad shots are made beyond 25 yards...but at 25 or under; yeah I'd take it: if the angle was RIGHT...WOULD a heavier bow be better, PROBABLY if you can put the arrow where it belongs...
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Fred Eichler hunts with a 53# bow for everything in N America... So yes.. I've killed 3 with 53.5#.. just pick your spot and only take the high % shots.. No different than any other hunter. Just my humble opinion...Joe
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Lots of good info and varying opinions in this post. I am really enjoying it.
Key elements to a clean kill in my view are.
1. Put the shot in the boiler room
2. Perfectly tuned arrow
3. Optimized arrow weight and FOC
4. optimized cut on contact broadhead
1 & 2 are the most important in my view. Arrow weight, FOC, etc.. are insurance to help make a quick humane kill on the animal. A perfectly tuned arrow that is lighter can outpenetrate a poorly tuned heavy arrow. An optimized lighter arrow can outpenetrate a non-optimized heavier arrow. The key is to optimize everything you can in your system to ensure a humane kill.
I agree with the earlier posts that worrying about bow poundage is low on my list of worries, so long as it meets the state legal requirements.
Lots of guys can shoot 70 lb bows accurately. I am not one of them. I am far more accurate at 55lbs and a 30.25 inch draw length.
I have seen it stated that 1-inch of draw length = 5lbs of bow weight. I shoot 55 lbs at 30.25 inches with my bow. That would be equivalent for arrow speed to 65-67 lbs at 28 inches for the same bow design and arrow weight. The weight written on the bow is not an indicator of arrow performance.
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I spend considerable time chasing them..
Early season when it's warm and I'm dressed light... I carry and shoot right at 57-61# for elk.
However, when it gets cold, below freezing... I start adding clothes. when this starts along with the fact that the muscles and hands are cold, I have often dropped down to a lighter set of limbs [53#] I find I shoot the lower weight better in the cold.
I do use some foc and keep my arrow weight right a 10 gpp. and I use 160 grizley and 130 no-mercy single edge SHARP broadheads.
I have never felt under-bowed with either set up.
When I was younger I also shot the 70# bows, but with a lifetime of hard work and shoulder surgeries on both sides, those weights are no-longer an option... I refuse to let old age and it's complications, keep me from doing the things I live for !!
Besides I can hunt elk within 10 minutes of my home. Waayyy better than getting old in front of the TV. [ My wife says I'm a "Teenager With Wrinkles"] :wavey:
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Easy answer: Yes
I have taken elk with both similar and less efficient setups. Also, I have taken them using bows between 57 and 65#’s. The one thing I have learned when shooting an elk (like most big game animals) where you hit them is a lot more important then how far the arrow goes out the other side.
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Yes - I hunt with a 55 lb bow and 575 gr arrow, 175 gn broadhead. I have several nice bows with heavier draw weights that i can shoot fine, BUT THIS IS MY MONEY BOW. Penetration doesn't matter if you don't hit the bread basket! Stick with the weight that will make you feel confident with your skills on the trail. (at least 50lbs legally here in Wyoming)
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Thanks to all for your input.....I think I'm good to go with the bows and arrows that I have and hope to get the chance to hunt elk in the near future.......thanks again!!! ron w
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Originally posted by Ray Hammond:
why does increased power REQUIRE you to be out of control? Where in his question does he say " don't tell me to shoot a higher weight because I can't handle it"?
Evidently I may have come across wrong.
My point was, everyone has a limit at which accuracy begins to diminish with higher poundages and they start losing control. I did not imply that he was anywhere near that point or couldn't handle more. My message was simply intended to be, don't let others talk you into being over-bowed.
His proposed setup and similar ones have been proven effective on elk, but not what I would consider ideal. And definately would not recommend it out to 25 yards. It is adequate and I would not tell someone not to hunt elk because of that setup.
I figured that everyone would shoot on the upper end of their comfort level in the poundage range when hunting elk. If am wrong in that assumption, and probably am, they should be shooting at higher poundages. I am a big fan of shooting the most that I can be consistent with. I like shooting heavier bows but life gets hectic and I can't always shoot everyday and sometimes I even miss weeks. I can't do that when shooting 75-80#, that is why I shoot 65#.
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The question was will a 50-52# bow shooting a 575 grain arrow be adequate for Elk? I suspect is would be. However, I am probably in the bigger is better crowd. Lots of opinions. I have been in conversations with gun hunters that won't hunt elk with a 30-06 or 308, they feel they need 338's or 300 magnums. I suspect they would say their wasn't any traditional equipment adequate to be hunting Elk. Lots of opinions.
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I shot a 5x5 bull this past September broadside at 29 yards and only got 16 inches penetration. The hit was 6 inches behind the leg and about half way up the body. Dead elk, but never found him. I was shooting a well tuned Robertson long bow 63# @ 29 with 20/20 easton shafts with Wensel woodsman broad heads. Next time I'm using 2 blades.
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No. . . 60+ for me. I don't care what others have done. I won't do it.
ChuckC
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Yep, no problem! Heck don't listen to Buff he wouldn't hunt itty bitty bunnys with less then 60#s.
I've hunted elk my whole life and yes I grew up hunting in Washington, Oregon and Idaho.
I've killed elk with "all natural" bows that were in the high 50s and shot through everyone of them.
A modern glass bow in the mid 40s shoots the same arrow at the same speed.
heavy arrow, sharp broadhead, good shot!!
Go for it!!
Mike
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If you are asking if a 50 pound bow is enough for . . . you ain't Fred Eichler. There is a lot more involved than just the bow and the arrow.
ChuckC
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Ron, is there a minimum weight required in the state you would be hunting in? Thats the only thing I would worry about. The rest is putting the BH where it needs to be.
If you are going, best of luck.
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ChuckC, Just ask'n for opinions,got a bunch, Never said I was Fred Eichler or anybody else!!
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Don't see any problem the indians did it with bows of less draw weight sharp broadheads and good shot placement will do a number on anything.
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Originally posted by moose eye levi:
Don't see any problem the indians did it with bows of less draw weight sharp broadheads and good shot placement will do a number on anything.
while on horseback from a distance of 6-8 feet to boot.
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Originally posted by Cool Arrow:
There are some of us out there that were not designed to draw a 60# bow and shoot it well....
That is a well made point.
I don't think it helps a lot when the guys that can pull a 60, 65, 70lb bow tell us that that is the minimum they would use on elk and by inference it therefore follows that everything under those poundages will somehow be inferior in performance. Great, if you can shoot those bows. And so continues the idea that heavier is better, and the heavier even better still. I know the intention is not to do this, but I think we all can fall prey to that myth.
Maximise the potential of the kit. Shoot a kit that maximises your form. Without accuracy pounds are all pretty much pointless, at least in any ethical sort of way.
Someone made a good point by asking where the cut off is when going down in weight- how far is too far when any poundage can be argued to be lethal when deployed under the right conditions.
What would that be? 40lbs? I think we should all argee there is a diminishing return regarding effectiveness farther down the scale. But the original question suggests a bow that is not testing those limits.
Joshua
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What Jason and Bill said, Also Bjorn in his first post. With that setup and a well tuned arrow and razor sharp broadhead I would not hesitate.
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:thumbsup: You bet. I shoot a heavier bow but not because I don't think a lighter one wouldn't work.
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Flight of the arrow is far more critical than how fast you can send it.
When I first switched to carbons I was shooting about 550 grains out of a 69# Harrison Lobo. I only pull 27" so figure 65#. I had marginal flight, but blew it off. Hit 320 bull between ribs, never even made a mark inside the chest on the far side w/snuffer at 25 yards.
Cured me of accepting poor flight.
I then shot another bull w/another Harrison of about 63# at my draw. Had great arrow flight at about 525 grains and had to pull the arrow out of the gumbo on the far side.
It's flight that matters.
That said, most of us will never shoot a setup that should be aimed at the shoulder blade.
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Well if 50 is plenty for elk and 45 will get it done, then 40 should be ok. And 35 will work if you put it in the right place. Where's the cutoff?
The NA indians mays have done it but there's a reason they were legendary for they're tracking skills.
I've hunted elk about 13 times and never shot less than 65 lbs. I was always told that you should shoot the most bow you can handle and 65 lbs really isn't that hard.
Bull elk are huge and you can't expect to always have a perfect shot with a perfect release in a hunting situation. A little insurance can only help.
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Craig Warren (bowyer, Black Timber Bows, Bow-Bolt) killed a 1040# Maine bull moose this fall with a 53# longbow, cedar shaft. Supposedly a state record for weight.
My guess is his rig would kill an elk too but maybe not. Elk are big animals. :)
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That set-up will kill elk. What is important is shot placement. Hit one in the shoulder and it won't matter if you're shootin 75#. Last trip I was on, my partner shot a bull with a 52# bow, 600gr arrow tipped with a crazy sharp 2 blade zwickey. Complete pass thru at 20 yds, bull walked 10 yds, stood there looking around for a minute, and tipped over dead. Arrow was floating in the water hole.
Shot placement is key, as is a shavin sharp broadhead. Elk have thick hides, and ya gotta cut through it. Practice out to 30-35 yds so the closer shot is a slam dunk for ya. Trust me, when you get a screamin bull comin in, you'll be shakin, and the closer your shot the better. I had to let down on a 30 yd shot once cuz my arrow was bouncin on the shelf I was shakin so much. Thats elk huntin. Never did a get a shot at that big herd bull, but I won't soon forget it either.
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Then their is no need for a heavier bow for elk than an average well tuned deer hunting rig despite the fact that a bull elk will weigh 400 lbs more and twice the width at the chest? Not to mention how tough they are reported to be.
I know when I finally get to go, I will be in shape, shoot as much as I can, ensure my bow and arrows are well tuned, and my go to bow will be in the 60 lb range all just to enhance my chances.
That said many of the gun forums often discuss how the .338 mag is the most potent elk killer. That is far more gun than your avg. deer gun.
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Yup, and the .338 is far more than your average elk rifle too.
For many, 60 is just too heavy. I think an archer who choses to go with the 50 because it's what he shoots well is a lot smarter than the fellow struggling with 60 because some guy who can shoot it tells him he needs to.
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Is a 35 lb bow enough for elk? Not in Washington state. 40 lbs is the minimum legal limit here. My wife hunts with 40lbs, it is what she can pull. She just has to shoot em at spitting range. As in their spitting on her when they buggle. She was 20 feet from a huge herd bull two days before early elk started this year. She thought she was stalking a deer in a small swamp ahead of our position, and spooked him out of his bed hidden behind a tree. I think she was more scared than he was.
An excellent point has been made above, the american indians were incredible trackers. Lots of info on how to become a great tracker in books and on the web, plus schools on it as well. How many of us make the effort to improve our skills in this important hunting skill? I know I work on it every time I am in the woods. It has helped me recover some animals that took bad hits over the years.
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Here is the regulation for Colorado.
3. Handheld bows, including compound bows, using arrows equipped with a broadhead with an
outside diameter or width of at least 7/8ths of an inch with no less than two steel cutting
edges. Each cutting edge must be in the same plane throughout the length of the cutting
surface.
a. During the archery seasons for deer, elk, pronghorn, bear, sheep, goat, and moose, only
lawful hand-held bows may be used by archery license holders.
b. Bows must have a minimum draw weight of 35 pounds. The let-off percentage shall not
exceed 80%.
c. No portion of the bow’s riser (handle) or any track, trough, channel, arrow rest or other
device, excluding the cable(s) and bowstring, that attaches to the bow’s riser can contact,
support and/or guide the arrow from a point rearward of the bow’s brace height.
d. Bows can propel only a single arrow at a time and no mechanism for automatically
loading arrows is allowed.
e. Equipment using scopes, electronic or battery-powered devices cannot be incorporated
into or attached to the bow.
f. Hydraulic or pneumatic technology cannot be used to derive or store energy to propel the
arrow. Explosive arrows are prohibited.
I haven't hunted elk yet, but I plan to. I'll use a razor sharp Zwickey on a high FOC carbon arrow perfectly tuned for and shot from my 52# Kanati. It's about 50 percent heavier than required by law in Colorado and I know I can put my arrow where it needs to go. If I can't get close enough to do that, I'll just enjoy the hunt. A 60+ pound bow won't make me shoot any better or any farther. My creaky old shoulders won't let me shoot that heavy anyway. If I put an arrow in the chest cavity, I have no doubt that it will pass through any elk. I would have no confidence in a shot anywhere else with any weight bow.
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I get exit holes with my recurves in the low 50s and arrows around 450-500grain (28 inch dl)
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For what it's worth, I believe Fred Eichler bumped off his Trad Slam with the same basic set up and relatively light carbons topped off with Muzzy Phantoms...
I should probably clarify my earlier post. I would use my 60# limbs because I already own them and a riser to bolt them to, more than a belief my usual 53-55#@ my 28.5" draw bows would not do the job. I doubt I would do anything different with my arrow set up either. What I shoot every day has proven it will pass through a deer at 20-22 yards several times over, so I have no doubt it would give plenty of penetration on a broadside elk at the same range...
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You have plenty of bow , provided you are pulling at least 27 inches to get 52 pounds. Draw length has alot to do with preformance. Longer draw lengths get more speed out of lighter bows say 30" at 45pounds will out shoot 50 at 28", with simillar set ups. I put an arrow through the heart of an elk and the aeeow stopped at the offside leg bone with alot less.
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Git after it. You will be just fine with that setup.
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Certainly, watch your shot and stay within your parameters and you will do just fine.
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Yes you will problbly get a pass thru with that set up, given your shot distance and your equipment.
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Absolutely!
Jerry
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I shot a caribou with a 52lb matlock predator X longbow with my draw length of 26" with 600 grain wood arrows with a grizzly head. The arrow broke the off shoulder and pentrated right through. The shot was 20 yards. My friend took a 6 x 5 elk with a 52lb recurve and wood arrows and two blade magnus. The arrow penetrated to the flecthing and the bull only went 70 yards.
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Also, like an earlier post the Ashby report is an eye opener when it comes to extreme foc and that it can increase penetration greatly.
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Ill be out next year with 56# and 600 grains i dont think 52# wth 575 would bother me eather.
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Different strokes for different folks. I would definitley hunt them with a bow that weight! its all about arrow tuning.
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My good friend shoots a #54 recurve with a tad under 600 grain arrow and this year marked his 26th bull down and in the freezer.........
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Yes,a 50# bow with a SHARP broadhead will kill anything in north america if you put the arrow where it belongs.I would build an arrow with efoc to help with penetration.
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Geez Ron, If you hit a nerve like you did with this thread, you'll do just fine :thumbsup: :)
BTW are you going elk hunting soon?
Cahrlie
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Charlie, hope to before I get to old....lol!!!
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Ron,
Your bow is most certainly adequate for elk. I believe a well tuned 550+ arrow and a scary sharp two blade from your bow is great. I know several people in Colorado who have had consistent succes with 45# bows. The owner of Rocky Mountain Specialty Gear here in Denver has a nice 6x6 mounted that was taken by the owner's son with a 46# Chastain recurve and a 500 grain easton shaft.
The key is shot placement--Broadside and quartering away up to 30 yards. I personally hunt with a 50# bear Montana and a 625 grain tube weighted shaft with a 2 blade magnus stinger. If you want a good testemonial, do a search for the handle Dougtreat. He has killed several elk with 47-50# bows with 600 grain arrows. One of his was taken at fourty yards with full penetration. Like many have already stated, a well tuned arrow with a quality SSSharp braodhead and good shot placement will take the elk. Use the bow that you shoot best with.
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One of the bows on my rack happens to be a 50# Montana,I draw 29" so that would be 53-54#. I think I should be good to go!!! All my arrows are 500+ to 625,depending what I'm shoot'n.
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No. Not enough arrow weight, and it depends on the type of 2-blade head.
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no problem,its all about placement.
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I shoot a 50# @28'' thunder horn hear stopper long bow with AD Trads cut to 30'' with 175grn Aboyer brown bears heads, w/75grn inserts for a total arrow weight of 630grn w/23% EFOC. At twenty yards they will completely 800# angus heifer broadside. Does this help answer the question?
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A friend of mine got a cow elk with just that same set up,20 yards or so and broad side.
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“Would you hunt elk with a bow that draws 50-52# and shoots a 575 gr. arrow”.
Yes! But I can draw more weight comfortably so I would use more and I would use a bit heavier arrow as well (650 grains min.). If 575 grains is optimum for this bow in all regards, then use it. As George and Bjorn have suggested the numbers on the side of the bow don't nearly tell the whole story either. Not all 52# bows shoot the same. Lots of variables to work with here. I haven't read all the posts either and I'm sure it has been brought up, but I would definitely adhere to Ashby's suggestions on arrow setup. I would pay more attention to the arrow setup anymore and not the bow weight as much. Are you confident with this setup? Have you shot any other animals with it? How has it performed? What does it have going for it? What’s lacking? These are important questions you need to ask yourself. I echo Ragnarok Forge's advice as well.
Good luck
Kris
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"Unfortunately, in many cases, non residents have more experience hunting elk than residents of western states"
Thats an unusual statement, no offense but I'd like to know where you got that stat from, or is it just opinion.
I've seen 300 win mags not put an elk down. I doubt they were wondering if it was enough.
Shot placement and arrow is everything.
My best bud is going with me this season with a 42# bow and 650 gr arrows and I KNOW if he gets a broadside shot @ 20yds and under his set up will be the elks last day. Not opinion, been there done that. It COMPLETLY depends on the man behind the bow, no question.
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Surprised this is still around....thanks for the all the input. I think good to go ,just gotta do my part with arrow placement and a good stalk.....
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Originally posted by ron w:
Surprised this is still around....thanks for the all the input. I think good to go ,just gotta do my part with arrow placement and a good stalk.....
This is the best post on this thread... Good luck! We hope to see you in a hero photo this fall!
Todd
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Sure why not! more is allways better but thats lots of weight and will work if you do your part. The hard part is getting the shot or should I say getting close enough for a good shot!