Recently went up about a 100 grains in point weight it seemed at the time the bow was quieter Just here in the last week I've noticed more bow noise. Nothing has changed as far as I know. I checked brace height.
This morning I played around with the brace height. In and out, every couple of twists and nothing seems to help.
I even went so far as to add 10 strands of rubber spider legs below the already existing wool silencers.
Its not really LOUD. It just seems like its gotten a little more noticeable in the last week or so of practice. Maybe I'm just hearing it better now for some reason.
It almost sounds like arrow noise against the riser. I think. But it hasn't been a problem in the past. Rest material wearing out? Wool silencers worn to a frazzle maybe?
Arrows are bareshafting great. Bareshafts and fletched are hitting in the same spot so I don't think thats the problem.
Bow is a super shrew scout 58"
53#@28"
shooting easton xx75's 400/2117
cut at 28.5"
200 grains up front.
total arrow weight right at 590 gr.
Tried brace height at every couple of twists between 7 and 7 1/2 " now at 7 1/4"
Thanks
Brad
interesting
what string material you using? 450+? number of strands?
have you tried bow hush?
If everything is the same as when you started shooting then nothing has changed nithe sound level. Are your groups as tight as normal? Bad form can increase string noise.
Did you change arrow spine? Another thought. When you change the tip weight, you change how the arrow flexes around the riser. it may be that the fletching are hitting the riser right as they pass now and increasing noise. If this is true, you need to change spine on your arrows so they will flex properly. Or change back to the other heads. Check for fletching wear. fi the arrow is flexing properly then the fletch should completely clear your riser and you wont have fletching wear.
Tradtusker, It is the original string that came with the bow. Haven't changed it out yet as its in good shape. Havn't tried bow hush but its on my "to get" list.
ragnarok, My shooting hasn't changed, If anything it has improved a bit over the last month or so.
Only change in spine would be from cutting down the same arrows. I was shooting the easton xx75's 400/2117 at 30" with 125 gr up front. I'm now shooting the same arrows cut to 28.5 with 200 gr up front. The bareshaft great and fly great fletched as well. I'll try some baby powder on the fletches and see if I'm getting any contact but I don't think I am.
Thanks guys!
Brad
Ragnarok Forge:
Could you expand on your message on fletching hitting the riser? I have never considered that before. But recently I noticed one fletch on my arrow is consistantly bent in the middle in both directions. Wished I had taken a picture of it now. I can't remember seeing that before, at least as noticeable as it is now. Also, I have been practising with thin mechanics gloves under my tab.
What do you think that is indicating? Release problem or spine problem?
Thanks, Gary
I would guess that you are stiff in spine and the tail of the arrow is hitting the riser. The 2117 cut to 28.5 with 200 up front has a dynamic spine of 66.6#. The Shrew comes out to 57.7.
you might try about 250 gr up front and see what that does.
Mike
I guess it could be wingnut but they sure do fly nice bareshafting out to 20 yards or so. But if I could go up another 50 gr, I sure wouldn't complain.
I just came in from shooting. I dusted the riser with cornstarch, ( all I could find handy) and shot several arrows. Nothing showing on the riser to indicate contact with the fletching or arrow.
Thanks
Brad
QuoteOriginally posted by swampdrummer:
It is the original string that came with the bow. Haven't changed it out yet as its in good shape.
Strings can be shot out, I new string may be the ticket.
+1 on arrow hitting riser ...
QuoteOriginally posted by wingnut:
I would guess that you are stiff in spine and the tail of the arrow is hitting the riser. The 2117 cut to 28.5 with 200 up front has a dynamic spine of 66.6#. The Shrew comes out to 57.7.
you might try about 250 gr up front and see what that does.
Mike
What mike said.
"sounds" like a stiff arrow to me :)
QuoteOriginally posted by L82HUNT:
QuoteOriginally posted by swampdrummer:
It is the original string that came with the bow. Haven't changed it out yet as its in good shape.
Strings can be shot out, I new string may be the ticket. [/b]
Had the eact same problem on an old Roy Hall Navajo. Replaced the string & the problem went away.
robattoo, "Strings can be shot out." Splain' that one to me partner.
Adding another 100 grains to the front softened the spine, so it's a little confusing. 2117 should be stiff for that bow, unless it has ample centercut, and you are using low stretch strings. Adding more weight will soften more, which I think should be good for that arrow length/bow weight.
He also cut an additional 1.5" off his arrows George. I don't know how much that would effect the spine of his arrows. It may be enough to make them that stiff.
Those babies would be stiff at that rate.
Thanks guys,
I bareshafted the 2117's when I went from 125 grains to 200. Started out way nock left and cut a 1/4 inch at a time till they were hitting just a hair nock right. Fletched them up and they fly great. Bareshafts and fletched are hitting in the same spot. I know it doesn't make sense but it is what it is.But that being said, I'm more than willing to try and go another 50 grains up.Maybe even a hundred grains up.
What I can't figure is I wasn't hearing this noise when I first made this change, and now I am. Again. I'm not getting any fletching contact on the riser when I dust the riser with powder.
Possible causes in my mind are, worn out string. It is pretty frazzled looking although well waxed.
Worn out silencers. They are little wool balls that came on the string when I bought it used.
A worn glove. I'm using a damascus glove that has been worn all year to shoot. Been soaked a time or three and the tips are pretty stiff.
I'm not argueing the fact that the 2117's are supposed to shoot stiff at this length and weight. I know that. But I'm also confident that they are shooting well for me.
Do I need to start over? I thought I was in pretty good shape tuning wise.
Thanks again
Brad
I had a bow that was dead quiet. Then over time it got louder. The string wasn't that old but it was shot out. Changed the string and got quiet again.
Shrew's are very sensative to grip....... change it a bit, and you get noise....
I have had bows shoot very well bare shaft and be way stiff with the shaft bouncing off the riser and edge of shelf. It can be done.
MnFn,
To answer your question, watch videos on the web of arrows being fired in slow motion. Look under arrow paradox or archers paradox for them. You will see that a properly spined arrow will have the nock and fletch arc'd away from the riser as it passes. This means that large fletch or small you will have adequate clearance, it also means cock vane in or out is not important. At least when you have the right spine and length of arrow.
A stiff arrow will have the fletch and nock arc'd towards the riser which can cause noise and nock left or right.
What extema312 said + 1. I have three sets of arrows that bareshaft perfectly and all have fletching wear indicating stiff spine. My latest set has no fletch wear and also bareshafts perfectly. If you have good form and the arrows or fletch hit the riser the same your testing will show a perfect match. They key thing to look for is the fletching wear or shelf padding wear.
Sounds to me like a new string is in order either way. I would try that first and then adjust head weight after.
Thanks again guys,
I've got a new string on the way. New bow hush and hush puppies.Brass inserts to bring my point weight up another 100 grains if needed. I can bring it up less than that with diffrent weighted inserts as well. Also ordered a new glove.And while I was burning up the credit card I ordered primal dreams and one with the wilderness. That outa do it! LOL.
Thanks!
Brad
Thanks Ragnarok Forge. I saw it.
I have increased my broadhead/insert weight from 245 grns to 275 grns on a 28" 150 Carbon Express Heritage shaft. Total arrow weight is 597 grns. At my draw that comes to about 12 gpp. It has quieted my Shrew CH carbon very noticably and from initial practice made for more consistant shot placement. I have not exceeded 20 yards in practise, but that is about as far as my abilities allow. If I calculated it right, FOC is about 16%.
I was not trying to get to a predetermined FOC or weight- just trying to tune the arrow,(bare shaft method). The reduction in the noise level was just a by-product/pleasant surprize.
Gary
Bumping this back up cause I gots questions.... :p
I got some 100 gr brass inserts this week and put a couple of them in these 2117s this morning. It definetely made the bow quieter. I haven't bareshafted them but they seem to fly straight. Will continue on with the bareshafting after I get a better grasp on whats going on here.
I also downloaded Stu's spine calculator today and thats where the questions start. I also weighed all the components and what I posted at first was a bit off. I'm shooting the aboyer javalina lites at 135gr. with a 75gr steel insert. The aluminum insert is 25 grains for a total point weight of 235. Punching all that in and inputting my bow info of 53# at 28" drawing 28" with a center shot of -1/16" I'm getting a dynamic spine of 62.4 and a required spine of 67.9. That makes the arrow weak doesn't it?
Adding another 75 grains by removing the aluminum insert and installing a 100gr brass insert and I'm getting a dynamic spine of 48.5# :scared: :scared: How can these arrows even fly anywhere close to straight like that?
That is way way weak, isn't it? I'm so confused.... LOL.
Brad
Back up for the sunday morning crowd. I laid in bed last night thinking about this. Couldn't sleep! Somebody educate me please! LOL
Brad