Trad Gang

I know this get discussed a bunch, but it always interests me. I hunt off the ground every year, I have killed several deer from the ground, but for whatever reason I just don't feel proficient at it. Here is what bugs me:

I see fewer deer. Even seeing deer I can't shoot keeps me going...and I think it teaches me something about the area I'm in also.

I'm never satisfied with the spot I'm in...that bit of brush "over there" always looks better.

You guys that commit yourself to the ground impress me quite a bit. It takes a mental toughness I just don't have, I suppose. How do you do it???

Its a test of will thats for sure! I've had deer spitting distance from me and could not get a shot off. I've threatened to hit the trees but being on the ground is so much more simple. I bought me a leaning seat from Big Jim for this year, havent killed anything "yet" still a month or more to go, but I'm for sure starting to fell the pressure!! HA! Jason

Being on the ground is hunting and you get to see a whole lot more country than bushwacking out of a tree...PR

Have confidence in your spot.. I will not move after I'm set up unless the wind is fickle.  

Your best chance to kill "any" deer is the first time you set up on them.  I don't build permanent blinds but move my set ups around the funnel, crossing, ridge ect. ect..  

Build your "blind" and sit in FRONT of it. Stay still and stay calm when the moment comes. Deer will look through you. Let them move PAST you then get them killed.

John III

It helps to be both too cheap to buy a tree stand and too lazy to lug one around the woods.  Besides, hunting from the ground is a blast.

  :bigsmyl:

it is dead simple i want to live a little longer the trees are for the birds not me as i cant fly to well full stop .  :clapper:      :clapper:

"Being on the ground is hunting and you get to see a whole lot more country than bushwacking out of a tree...PR"

Thats debatable...


John3, I agree with your "first time" theory. Thats one of the things that does draw me to the ground...treestands get burnt out pretty quick, but on some of the small pieces I hunt, they are a train wreck to move.

I have a ridge in mind for next year. My son and I killed 2 bucks this year back there, out of the same tree. Sadly, it's the ONLY decent tree back there, and it's marginal. There is a great spot to sit in some brush on the downwind side of 3 trails coming out of the swamp. I haven't sat there because I never think about it until the season is in full swing....and I don't want to trim that brush during the season. Hmmm....

QuoteOriginally posted by HO'NEHE JEFF:
it is dead simple i want to live a little longer the trees are for the birds not me as i cant fly to well full stop .    :clapper:          :clapper:  

Yep, gravity is a law not a suggestion, and I can damn near fall off the ground.

Growing up out west I was taught to hunt off the ground so thats what I do. I think that I might kill more if I would stay in a tree. But to me I feel I don't see near as much from a tree but my shoots are genrally better. I am almost too impatient for ground blinds and will only sit in the if I know for sure they will walk by. I see lots of game off the ground but blow 95% of my chances. Two weeks ago I drew back 4 times and never had a shoot, twice on a real super toad. I think that it is funny but I want to spend more time in a tree. I think the key to hunting on the ground just takes time to get in the right mode. Flow with the land, move slow,and notice everything. Some days the mode never comes to me.

First year of hunting and I've been on the ground since opening day. It is definitely for me. I've already had encounters with deer at 10-20 yards. I haven't harvested any yet but I have some great stories.

I have a few weeks left...I'm hoping I can take one. My biggest problem has been overpopulated public hunting areas but even that hasn't been that bad.

There is nothing like hunting from the ground with your instincts and natural cover. Even seeing something is such an accomplishment.

I've been on the outside looking in at this topic for the last several years.  I couldn't understand why anyone would want to give up the comfort and commanding view that treestands allow.  But now I'm started to want to try it on the ground. Lots of good spots don't work for treestands and the wind is another problem.

How do you guys deal with the issue of limited visual distances?

Do you guys stand up to take a shot or stay seated.  What type of camo/ghille are you using. Can a guy get by with conventional camo on the ground or do 3D suit really help?

Chris

Chris,

This was my first year to hunt ever. There was mostly ground hunting on the 4500 acres. I started on the ground and like other's have said, you see much more.....up close. I saw wonderful things that made my heart pump and just smile. I didn't get anything....yet. I guess I'm not that much in a hurry to either. I sat in a treestand for about a half an hour before I had to get back on the ground. To me it just seemed natural. Plus it was cold and breezy! I didn't want to be in a tree! LOL!

As far as limited distance...that's a factor. From the ground if it is a natural blind or a tent, you are limited depending on the "construction". I made sure that I could make shots with confidence from several angles and that was about it.

I'm new at this and what I found was the treestand was very comfortable to sit in (septin' fer the wind), but being on the ground was more fun.

QuoteOriginally posted by Chris Kinslow:

How do you guys deal with the issue of limited visual distances?

You don't see deer as soon - that's how.  Heh.  You can still (usually) hear them, though and that (IMO) adds to the anticipation.

 

QuoteOriginally posted by Chris Kinslow:

Do you guys stand up to take a shot or stay seated.  What type of camo/ghille are you using. Can a guy get by with conventional camo on the ground or do 3D suit really help?

Standing / sitting - I've killed mine when I was standing but then again I was stillhunting at the time.  I've missed a couple of shots while I was sitting and have missed other opportunities due to impossible angles, inability to draw, etc.  My biggest problem is usually that I set up too close to where the deer end up being.

As to camo - I tend to wear very little camo and have had no trouble getting close to animals (or getting them close to me).

Roger, I don't "still" hunt, nor do I "stalk" the deer that I hunt. The only ground hunting that I do is "ambush". I try to figure out what locations are potential ambush spots by hunting from a tree where I have a huge visual advantage (flat as a pancake around here). It allows me to identify movement patterns from afar, BEFORE I make a decision to move in for an ambush. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't.

In most cases, my ambushes have been successful the first or second time in that location. If it doesn't happen, I move to other areas and don't allow that setup to get "hot".

Obviously, wind direction is a key element to successful ambushing. Wind speed (10 mph or better) is a big help, as they can't pick-up your movement as easily as when it is fairly calm. Being pretty sure of the deers' directional movements in a particular scenario (whether it be morning or evening) is a big plus in the confidence factor. It is difficult to sit (or stand) there, not knowing what is going on around you until the very last moment (in some cases, only a few seconds) when the deer arrive. It is tough going when you are mostly hidden from their approaching direction and all you have is the confidence that a deer WILL pass by.

An ambush scenario. I had seen deer (from my tree stand location) entering the bean field in the evenings on many occasions. They were mainly crossing through a tree line and hitting the beans at mid-field. So one day (at mid-day), I went over there to find the trail they were using and whalaa! Intersecting trails at the tip of a tree line 80 yards north of the bean field in a grassy field.

I got lucky the first time I had good wind for that setup. Two bucks walked across the field at sunset heading for the bean field, and I took the second one that passed by.

Another scenario.... I had been hunting in a tree stand about 200 yards north of a willow/marsh area. The deer were not reaching my location until very late (evening hunts). They were coming from the south and had to cross an open field before arriving at my location.

I decided to place my stand in a lone little willow that was barely adequate for a decent tree stand setup. But it provided me a vantage point to see exactly where they were crossing a waterway from a really thick marsh area.

Needless to say, after observing on several occasions.... the deers' favorite crossing point (and ambush location) was identified. I didn't get an opportunity from that setup, as I was a bit too late on that one.... the gun season opened thereafter and the deers' natural pattern was broken.

I hunt whichever way the spot dictates.  I would probably hunt on the ground more if I could hear properly. Also for some reason I have yet to figure out. I seem to shoot much better out of a treestand and I'm kinda impatient so the tree stand forces me to stay put. I wish we had more spot and stalk opportunities like the guys out west. But not many places here lend themselves to that type of hunting.

There's nothing complicated about hunting from the ground, it's been done for centuries. I bow hunted here in Michigan for 20 years from the ground before tree stands became legal. When they finely became legal I still didn't buy a tree stand, I just stood or sit on a limb of the tree. My first tree stand was a climbing stand called a Baker. It was notorious for slipping on the tree if your weight wasn't to the outside of the stand. I think I've still got the scars on my belly..   :)

Before tree stands we made ground blinds from natural materials in locations where deer traveled, mainly runways to and from bedding areas to feeding areas.

In the areas where the ground was soft or sandy I sometimes made pit blinds. A pit blind got you down to ground level keeping the profile of the blind less noticeable. The drawback to the pits was the deer had to be close for you to make the shot. None the less the pit blind worked very well in some areas.

My Wife Nancy killed her first deer in 1963 from a ground blind near a runway. The runway was 10yds in front of her blind and I instructed her to let the deer pass then raise off her stool and shoot. The first deer came by and when she raised off her stool the stool squeaked, spooking the deer. Next bunch, same thing. Finely a lone deer came by and she shot through a hole in the blind making a fatal hit...   :archer:

Nancy still prefers to hunt from the ground with good success.

Here's one of her ground blinds in the pines.

  (http://www.shrewbows.com/rons_linkpics/Nancys_Pine_Blind.JPG)

  (http://www.shrewbows.com/rons_linkpics/redbirds_ready.jpeg)

I've been hunting on the ground for 3 years+ now. I sat in a stand Sunday night. I was reminded why I like hunting on the ground.

hunting on the ground is not always an option.  I live in eastern NC, were the brush is so thick it will pick you up off the ground, and the open areas are too noisy for practical stalking.    

Getting deer close is definitely not the problem, to close maybe!! I had a doe walk to within 5 yards, right at after she had already seen me, just trying to figure out what I was! the more I do this ground thing the more I learn! good fun, Jason

Ron, that looks like a great setup!

Guys, notice in Ron's first picture that there is cover material behind his wife and see how it helps hide her silhouette.  In my limited experience, it seems that what is directly behind you is more important that what is in front of you.

As for "how do you do it" mentally, it's a lot like playing the wind.  When you are in a tree, you don't expect to have deer come from down wind or if they circle that way, you expect to get busted.  Hunting from the ground, most times, you just expect to not be able to see quite as far and you can expect to get busted moving if you are not careful.  The comments about letting a deer walk past you then drawing for the shot are dead on.  If you can see their eyes, they'll pick you off when you draw.

About the only tip I can add is that I like to set up somewhere about 10 to 15 yards off a trail with heavy cover behind me.  But, I also look for places where there is some sort of large obstruction close to the trail itself.  Might be a brushpile, large tree, boulder or whatever.  The closer it is to the expected path of the deer the better.  The idea is to use it as a chance to draw when the deer walks behind it.  The catch is, especially if it's a tree trunk, if it is closer to you than to the deer it will block your vision more than the deers.  You loose sight of the deer for quite a few feet but as soon as you move to draw, he picks you off because from his point of view, your elbow or bow limbs stick out past the tree and he sees you move.  BUSTED!

Here's an attempt to show what I mean.

Below, imagine that (H) is the hunter, (T) is a large tree, and (D) is the deer.  The * is the line of sight as blocked by the tree close to the deer and the + shows the hunters line of sight as blocked by the tree.  The angle is much sharper for the hunter because he is far from the tree and it only blocks his view for a little more than the width of the tree trunk but for the deer it is a much wider angle because he is close to the trunk.  Make sense?

It's worth planning for when you set up.
*.....................((..........................
....*..................\\\\.........................
.........*..............)).......................+
...............*.......//..........+..............
...(H)...........(T).(D)..........................
...............*.....//............+..............
.........*..........((...........................+
....*................\\\\...........................
*.....................))..........................

I do wear camo, but Kahn(who does not wear camo) has killed deer and I have not. I stay on the ground because I HATE heights. I also tend to set up too close to the deer and often wind up not being able to draw.

I do have a super secret spot where I will be setting a blind up next fall. There is a small 1/4 acre grassy field inside the middle of a horrible (and I mean HORRIBLE)tangle of brush and thorns on all sides. There are trails going in there, but you have to crawl. Let's just say I plan on crawling next year and maybe even this year! No one else is crazy enough to go in there, so I intend to be the 1st and get the biggest deer. That is what keeps me hunting on the ground. There is no place for a tree stand in there!  :thumbsup:  

-Charlie

I've never hunted from a stand nor even sat in one. Here in Oregon Blacktails cannot be patterned like Whitetails. I'm not saying they cannot be hunted from a stand as people do it all the time but, if you want better success, it has been my learning experience to get out and move.

I hope they don't mind me throwing their names out but, TreeKiller, Santiam, Elkherder and others have taken some nice size Blacktails and Elk from the ground so, I'll just keep doing what I do and leave the trees to the winds.   :thumbsup:

anybody have kill photos from the ground?

Nice tip on the large tree setup, Dave.  I never thought of that.  I also agree the cover behind is more important than in front...need to break up that silhouette.  

I hunt both from treestands and from the ground for deer. It depends on what the situation dictates. If I find a spot during the deer season I'll typically hunt it from a tree so as to not scent up the area as much making a natural ground blind.  If I find an area prior to or after the season, if I won't be hunting it for some time, if there's no good trees, or if I'm baiting I'll many times build a natural ground blind. The nice part about the natural ground blind is you can use it year after year with just a bit of upkeep.  The not-so-nice part is other public land folks notice it...the spot isn't as secret.  
  I will say, though, that treestands are easier and, many times, more effective.  Deer just don't seem to notice me as easily when up in a tree, even when I stand out like a sore thumb...a blob in the hardwoods.  I also like the visibility of a treestand as I see more area.  I'm not the most patient when it comes to sitting in one spot.  Seeing deer helps me stay in stand longer.  The drawback is having to lug the stand around, put it up, and take it down every night (at least on public in WI).  
  Now, I definitely prefer to hunt western critters from the ground, hiking and glassing.  Man I love that kind of hunting...but that's another thread altogether.

Happy hunting fellas, Matt

My son and I both left the trees this year for good.  I've killed several deer from the ground before treestands were invented but only one in the past 20 yrs. or so.  I didn't kill a deer this year but I had 10 different buck at less than 20 yds. but due to antler restrictions I couldn't shoot any of them.  My son doned his home made gilly suit and shot a deer at 10 yds. right out in the open.  I hunted from treestands since they came out and I too love seeing deer but to be 100% honest when it comes to having deer within shooting range I have just as many from the ground as from the treestand and with a lot less phyiscal effort.

I tree stand hunted for over 30 years.5 years ago I became a total ground hunter.My ground huntings done a little different.I hunt different farms on each of they I have a couple ground sites scouted out from winters past.With my lanes trimed with the winds totally in my favor.So when I pull up to my area.The winds totally in my favor walking to and while i'm there as well as when I leave and walk back to the truck.
  Never do the bucks on that farm ever knows I'm there.Or I've done something wrong.No scouting or checking a new area out looking for rut sign.I've already did that last winter and I will not hunt it with out the correct wind.And those blue bird days and there no wind I don't hunt my good area's.I have area's along hollows,river or creek cliff tops that dose have a wind at all times.Most of my sites have a short walk from truck to site if possable.I call from all of my sites so If I can I set up with an open area behind me so bucks can't get down wind when called.
  I may only have one good site per farm so I make sure the winds totally right as well as time of year etc.I stay totally descreat at all times.Once a buck knows he's being hunted.Exspecialy mature bucks the games perty much up.You can move on.
 Not everyone has this convenous and have to hunt there farm or lease or peice of ground they have.You can kill a buck put the odds start out against you.

Good topic Roger. I have been trying to kill deer on the ground for several years, and it can be summed up in one word- frustration.

I have several blinds built from deadfall and brush that basically look like a brush/branch pile with and idiot sitting in the middle of it LOL. I make sure I have plenty of back cover, and a good amount in front too. The deer wehre I hunt are super skittish, doesn't take much to alert them. I sit on a small stool, and try to build my set-ups so I have a tree to lean against which helps to keep still.

Had one new one this year I thought was gonna be The One. I did get a shot off on a doe at 13-14 yds, maybe less, and shot right over her back.

Had several encounters with other deer from various stands, but no shots. I try to have a few shooting lanes, but I like the heavier cover as it helps to hide me as well. Getting that string back undetected is tough. I try to wait till they walk past, but no matter what I do, no matter how well I camo myself and my setup, wind, etc it seems they never walk past. They might not know what I am, but they know something is up. Drives me nuts.

This year we had a lot of easterly winds, which kept me out of some of my favorite areas.I wont hunt on the ground if the wind is fickle and swirling. Had a lot of hunts this year too that come around sunset, it gets dead calm out, which also makes it hard to move to draw undetected.

A friend of mine never uses blinds. He finds a good sized tree near trail intersections, and stands leanign against the tree. scrapes leaves back so he's quiet, smokes like a freighttrain, and kills deer all the time on the ground. I'm too fidgety for that. Tried it and failed miserably.

Regardless of all of my frustrations, I keep at it. I love the challenge of getting close on the ground, and getting a shot off. I still like treestands, but they are more of a pain in the arse.

If I find a good looking spot in my travels through the woods, I'll throw a set-up together.
Might be pretty simple, but I back into so thick brush, snip out some branches to give me room to sit and shoot,and use the trimmings to brush in in front of me. I don't worry too much about snipping some stuff out of the way. With wind, rain, snow etc the woods change every day anyway.
Deer don't notice that as much as say, pitching a pop up tent blind in the middle of their bedding area. Keep it subtle and its no big deal.

I see deer, close, and have a great time. My luck sucks, but that makes me even more motivated. Afterall, I took up trad archery for the challenge. If it was easy, everyone would be doing it.

Why not hunt on the ground when the wind is 'fickle and swirling'?  If you are in a tree, surely that fickle, swirling wind can manage to blow your sent around (and up and down, etc.) just like it can when you're on the ground.  Up in a tree, though you don't have the option to easily and quickly reposition to the other side of the trail (for example).

Seems to me the crummier the wind is, the more attractive ground hunting gets.

Some of us have it, some of us don't. Some of us work really hard at all the wrong things. Keep trying, keep learning. Don't get caught up in all of the 'this is how its done' or 'this is what you need' stuff. The best teacher, ever, is experience. Pay attention and use common sense. Try to think like a prey animal. When I'm looking at fishing lures, I try to ask my self,are manufacturers trying to catch fish, or fishermen?

Miss La clare has a good idea, lotta loggin goes on around here and tree tops are all over, find the rite one and your in business,and if it dont suit you, you can customize it to your liking with a few tools and some nails, as long as you do it way before season opens.  
 But I like ground huntin just fine, I got a short attention span and it gives me a oppertunity to walk around and look for something interesting,  lotta fun.

QuoteOriginally posted by GingivitisKahn:
Why not hunt on the ground when the wind is 'fickle and swirling'?  

I don't think it matters if you're on the ground or in a tree. Wind that is constantly changing direction (or swirling about for whatever reason) pushes your scent in just about every direction around you. And since deer don't usually move through the woods (or fields) like bulls in a china closet, they become aware of your presence before they arrive at your location.  

Undisturbed deer are comfortable moving in a direction where the wind isn't blowing into their nose.... until they have smelled a human in that particular area. From that point on, they are no longer "undistrubed" deer.

With wind direction and the element of surprise in your favor, the occurance of successful hunts (those in which you kill a deer) increase dramatically.

QuoteOriginally posted by Pinelander:
 

QuoteOriginally posted by GingivitisKahn:
Why not hunt on the ground when the wind is 'fickle and swirling'?  

I don't think it matters if you're on the ground or in a tree. Wind that is constantly changing direction (or swirling about for whatever reason) pushes your scent in just about every direction around you. And since deer don't usually move through the woods (or fields) like bulls in a china closet, they become aware of your presence before they arrive at your location.  

Undisturbed deer are comfortable moving in a direction where the wind isn't blowing into their nose.... until they have smelled a human in that particular area. From that point on, they are no longer "undistrubed" deer.

With wind direction and the element of surprise in your favor, the occurance of successful hunts (those in which you kill a deer) increase dramatically. [/b]

That's kind of my point.  Inconstant winds increase your chance of getting busted without regard to whether you are hunting high or low.  I'd think such days would be better spent being more flexible with your positioning (like you can be on the ground) rather than less (as you must be in a tree).

I'm not a tree guy, but I'd think the best day to hunt a particular tree stand is the day when the wind is blowing constantly towards that tree from wherever you anticipate the deer may be.  No?

Yes, and the same when hunting on the ground as well.

Gillie suit. Had a squirrel nest in mine today.

I just try to use what is the most applicable for the condition and situation.If a ground blind makes better sense then I have the most confidence.But I enjoy both tree stand and ground blinds.I almost always use natural blinds with face mask and leafy wear,with somthing behind me and at least a little somthing in front.I havent killed much from the ground but it is very exciting. (http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff194/mlw015/coloradokansas034.jpg)notice the chair and here is the result (http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff194/mlw015/coloradokansas031.jpg)my first ground kill.Now I am hooked.

Nice deer Michael, is that an Arkansas deer? Like that red colored arrow in the quiver too!

swp.That is a kansas buck.Ground hunting is somthing I have done a lot more of in the last couple of years and I have had some great hunts.

I wrote this a couple years ago, so I hope it doesn't bore those who've read it. If you are extremely careful with the wind, I think the ground's the place to be. Where else can you get so close to the thing you love? (don't answer that!)


I own a good treestand, and I'll sit in it, if I have to. But it's my least favorite way to hunt deer. I love to get down "Among 'em"...


My friend, Paul Jalon (Elite arrows) says, "If Mother Nature offers a kiss, only a fool won't pucker up!"
I'm beginning to think he may be right. The second week of October, I had an opportunity to shoot a nice doe, broadside at about 20 yards. I hunt deer, and not horns, and I surely would have put her in the freezer, but she had a small fawn with her. The cute little rascal was just out of spots and dumb as a post. I knew if I shot her, he probably wouldn't make the Winter, so I let them walk. I Must have insulted Mom Nature by passing on her gift.

Having recieved a reprieve from work this morning, I was determined to go. No matter that it was raining and windy. The Red Gods must be served.
I put on my MTO-50 raingear and Muck boots, grabbed the recurve, and took off. At 7AM, I was oozing along a dry creek bed, still too dark to shoot, constantly amazed at how much noise a fat man in rubber boots can make, and how the expensive raingear that sounds fine in the kitchen at 6AM, suddenly sounds like a cheap shower curtain in the woods with a wind.

I came to a narrow spot where a picked cornfield joined a small bluff that fell down to the creek. I climbed up out of the creek and leaned against a little arm-sized tree with the hope of glassing a deer out in the field. I had just done a quick scan and put the glass back in my pocket, took 10 or 15 steps, when I noticed the Gray back of a deer behind a fallen log, maybe 25 yards ahead. I immediately knelt down in the weeds. Rewind to where I compared the rain pants to a shower curtain. The deer heard me and stood up. He was about 20 yards, but the vitals were behind the log. He decided to investigate and stepped out-looking right at me. He knew I wasn't Kosher, but couldn't decide what to make of me.

I eased an arrow out of the side quiver and onto the string.....

The deer stood facing me. His rack was ample and well out past his ears. He had seen more than a few winters. I hoped he couldn't hear my heart beating--I sure could!......I became a statue.

And then things got stupid.

He came closer.

He eased around trying to catch my wind, but the bluff on one side and the creek on the other kept him from it. He did the usual stomping, head bob, and the fake look away with a quick "gotcha!"........I am like a nervous statue.

And then he came closer.

About 7 yards separate us now. He still has his front to me, and is watching me like you'd watch your young daughter's boyfriend. I have been squatted down here for maybe 10 minutes now, and my old body is beginning to quiver...I am like a statue in an earthquake.

And he comes closer!

I know the Jig is up. Even with the wind against him, that bloodhound nose will make me out any second. I could try for a frontal heart shot, but I've been in the game way too long for that.

At maybe 5 yards, I looked up into his eyes and said "You Win!" and he turned inside out and was gone, leaving me laughing in the rain like an idiot.

Folks, THAT'S WHY I LIKE TO HUNT ON THE GROUND!

Well, the whole point is, " you ain't going to shoot one on the ground, sittin in a tree"!

Amen brother Steve, Amen!!! Jason