Trad Gang

hey guys im intrested in going even more traditional and getting a turkidh recurve and was wondering if any of you can give me any information on turkish bows
thanks david

You may want to look up Saluki Bows. I have one of his Turk recurves, very sweet bow.

Are you interested in a traditional horn and wood composite or one of the modern reproductions with fibreglass?James Parker makes a good looking and preforming bamboo reproduction and Lukas Of Saluki makes both horn and modern reproductions,depends on what you have in mind.

thanks i would love more info and the turk saluki is awesome i want one but expensive i like the grozer junior turkish bow on hunarchery.com

i'd contact james parker at  www.huntworthyproductions.com (http://www.huntworthyproductions.com)   james is making traditional horn bows, glass horn bows, and the only bowyer making them out of wood and bamboo.  i've own a couple grozer's and have shot several saluki models, i'll only spend money on a parker from now on.  in fact, i own several and have four ordered.

thanks
any other info guys is all helpful ive really got an itch to get one turkish bow or two muh hahah

Nothing against the grozers but I would pass on it,Jamesmakes some excellent bows and am waiting to meet him and try his bows,One of the reasons why I started making my own was of the prices second the satisfaction of making my own crabbows.
Cheers

I think the original designs were meant to be shot with a thumb ring. So there could be some finger pinch issues with a three finger draw unless the bowyer stretches out the design a little.
A year or two ago there was post on paleo planet about some turk bows Adam karpowicz had done and tested on a shooting machine. One was a replica turk flight bow, shooting 126lbs@28. They shot a 250 grain arrow arrow off of it and were getting around 360 FPS. There was three bows in the test and one of them, shooting at 9 grains per pound was getting 205 FPS, both bows were shot with dacron and they weren't completely cured. It would be fun to make one of those with carbon foam limbs and carbon fiber siyas.

why pass? thats intresting and i love his turkish style bow buts its $300 and im lookin for a bow in the 150-180 dollar range but maybe i will just get his bow i love it

ttt

http://www.atarn.org/islamic/Performance/Performance_of_Turkish_bows.htm

I've seen and shot James' bows and they are exceptional. I watched James shoot one that pulled 50# and it pushed a carbon arrow(I don't know the weight)at 280fps and a hunting weight cane arrow(may have been Mechslasher's arrow) at 190fps with a thumb ring.
 Rambo, check out 3Rivers. They sell a couple of different "Turkish" style bows relatively inexpensive.

thanks pat everyone is saying james bows are great i just may go with his turkish bow

Contact James. He is a great guy and very knowledgeable about lots of stuff and very generous with info. I promise you won't be disappointed.

I found some videos on UTUBE showing how to shoot with a thumb ring in case you were interested.

Can anyone post some pics of the Turkish bows that James makes. His site's pictures aren't very detailed.

TTT I want james Turkish bow so freakin badly know  hope it won't be long before I get one I'm 16 and have 2 recurves know    :thumbsup:

Check out this site.   www.siegeworkcreations.com. (http://www.siegeworkcreations.com.)  They may have something you would be interested in.
Lynn Hunt

James is a class act.  I have talked to him a couple of times and if I were in the market for a bow he would get my business.

As far as Turkish bows go they are normally short and sensitive but more fun the a barrell of monkeys. I own a Grozer Crimean Tatar which is a Turkish bow without as much reflex 55# and shot with a thumb ring.  These bows seem to shoot better with this style vs. fingers.

As far as the thumb draw goes it is a very different experience from fingers.  The biggest difference is the sight picture(the arrow is on the draw hand side).  The reason the arrows is on that side is because when you perform the thumb draw you "lock" the arrow against the arrow pass.  Another difference is that you hold the bow verticle almost like a FITA style and your grip needs to be very soft.  Spine is also less of an issue (I spine my arrows around 15# over).  

The most overlooked aspect for a new thumb draw archer is the thumb ring.  It must fit properly otherwise you can really hurt yourself. I would recommend getting Kays Thumb Ring Book.  I also think you need to just shoot with the ring if you are going to master that draw style.  Once you start and practice you will find it is like an extension of yourself.  I find it easier and I am more accurate with the thumb then I ever was with fingers.

TTT

If you want a bow that's all aces, you can't expect to pay 150-180$. If I were you, I'd wait until I had the cash to get a great bow, instead of a cheap, mediocre one.

TTT

May I ask what question it is you want answered?

yes I would like to know who sells a good Turkish bow like James but its $300 and I dont have that money (im16) so I'm looking for a relatively cheap but good one $150-$180 range I have 2 samick recurve hunting bows but this would be my first Turkish bow and one maybe that is all wood and no leather like James his bow is so nice. Thanks

also where can I buy spare strings for a Turkish bow and I will be putting camo puff silencers on it.  It will be a hunting bow about 65-70# and I'm 16 but I might go with 56# so its easy to string

and will be shooting Easton xx75 arrows with feathers and snuffer broadheads

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As I suggested... you should save money for a GREAT bow, instead of buying a cheap, sluggish, mediocre bow. Trust me. I am so happy that I didn't spend money on a whole bunch of bad bows, before I got my Tomahawk longbow.

But, if you really just want a bow, check out Grozer or Kassai.

I would not consider James Parker's bow mediocre he makes an outstanding bow especially when you consider some others are selling the same design at almost 3 times as much.  You will get great performance from his bow.

TTT

Not mocking James at all, in fact I'm advising Rambo to buy one of James' bows (or a bow of the same quality and performance), instead of one that may cost a 100 bucks less, but won't be half as good.

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hey guys any more info would be awesome I'm already fantasizesing about me taking game with a true Turkish short bow off the hand turkeys the most then a ton of deer and even caribou I live In PA I'm 16 Its a passion not an obsession but if you new me you would know I'm obssesed I get my gear ready for next year 10 days after the seasons end and just my world revolves around bows bucks broadheads and family (friends count as family) enough talk

... saw this thread a few days ago - but thought I stay clear, as I dont know a thing about Turkish Bows - well, with a myriad of TTT's I finally may say something:
Spend the small money you have in some good literature and a few tools and start making bows for your own. For every TTT you can produce a big pile of shavings - and before long - you have a servicable bow, if you are lucky ...!

Please use the correct nomenclature. A Turkish Bow is a horn composite. If you are lucky, you may find one second hand for less then $2000. Maybe Edward McEwen is still making them, or his Krim-Tatar? The later is pictured below (out of my old catalog) and was available over here about the year you are born - for 3500DM. Since then almost everthing has the same price tag, but reads in Euro nowadays. So to gestimate Dollar, take this number x1.4 = $4900.-
 (http://www.broadheads.de/Bilder/Foren/TradGang/McEwen_E3719_640)

I have a friend who build horn composit bows and they are shooting okay and looking pretty neat. But have a tendency to produce cracking sounds during the draw, due to the thick sinew layer etc. Nothing you'll need in hunting.

If you can find a copy, you may want to read the following book (I paid only $115 for mine):
KLOPSTEG, P.E. (1947): Turkish Archery and the Composit Bow. – 187 p., 52 figs.; Evanston (Klopsteg).

cheers

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rambo1993,

I admire your determination in searching for an inexpensive turkish bow.

Check out Attilasarchery.com

He has a u-finish bow for $149.

Good luck with your search.

TTT

thanks Shifting Shadow

TTT

I don't think there's anymore we can help you with mate. Shifting Shadow even offered a direct link to a cheap, turkish bow. It's alright to ask for help, I tend to do it all the time, but it would seem that you've gotten an answer to your questions.

Actually, check out Grozer:

 http://www.grozerarchery.com/index_b.htm  

He sells a "junior" turkish bow for 120 euro. Has a maximum draw weight of 50#, and maximum draw length of 30". There's a normal one for 250 euro too. Right now, that 120 euro one is the closest thing you will get to a cheap and yet useable turkish bow, I think.

Not yet
if i took a turkish bow hunting and a little water cause of rain or snow because i always hunt the winter bow season would this ruin my bow because my bow is covered in leather. the grozer junior turk is what im getting and its leather covered thats why i asked

ttt

Have you shot a bow of this type?  I have two and while fun, they are darn hard to shoot well.  I think I know my way around a bow and unless you use the thumb ring you will be hard pressed to shoot them consistently enough to hunt ethically.  The performance is awesome (thats the idea), but IMHO they were created with war in mind........not hunting.  They are very good at throwing huge arrows vast distances, and equally hard to be accurate with.  Just my $0.02

Love mine as oddities and conversation pieces at shoots.........but I wanted to hunt with one too and never could shoot them well enough to despite not having any trouble with any other "regular" trad bow I own/have owned.  

Oh, and I'm not some funsucking "adult" either.......I bought one when I was 15 and one when I was about 18!

matt

I guess all stiff-tipped recurve bows were made with war in mind. English longbows too. Yet still, if it can kill a man, it will kill deer. Depending on the length of the bow, it should be suitable for hunting. Every type of bow can be used to hunt with, a very short bow is probably just a bit more... noisy. And inaccurate, depending on your skill with the particular bow.

Have to disagree on the short bow being inaccurate and noisy. I have a Saluki Turk 54". Dead quiet, very quick and sends an arrow where I'm aiming.

Now as far as finding a Turk bow that performs as well as my Saluki Turk at such a ridiculous low price, don't think so. Lower cost would be a used Saluki, Black Mountain Sheepeater (on sale now!!), Siegeworks looks like they make a decent bow. Heck I'll even include my Great Northern Ghost, with it's static tips, it's "Turk" like, and you won't find a tougher bow than that.

I guess both mine are quite a bit shorter than 54".  I am thinking 46" or 48".  Very severe string angle.  The Saluki is made for the modern archer in mind (they most often hunt) and has (I think) been modified to that end.  I was not saying they are inaccurate.......just that shooting them well is a chore compared to a regular bow.

Matt

no i havent shot one but if i took a turkish bow hunting and a little water cause of rain or snow because i always hunt the winter bow season would this ruin my bow because my bow is covered in leather. the grozer junior turk is what im getting and its leather covered thats why i asked

My experience with my Grozer CrimTartar is that as long as you treat it like any other bow in wet weather i.e. wipe it down and dry it off there is no problem.  The reason I switched to a thumb ring is because of this bow it performs so much better with the thumb draw.  I think you will find that true with the Turkish bow as well although these bows are the "coolest bows EVER" (according to my daughter) they are a hard mistress and dedication is a must to get the full potential out of this style of bow.  Good luck and have fun once you master a short bow you will never want to shoot anything else.

thanks another qt. who ever has this bow does this bow pitch black total black as shown on hunarchery.com

TTT

QuoteOriginally posted by LongStick64:
Have to disagree on the short bow being inaccurate and noisy. I have a Saluki Turk 54". Dead quiet, very quick and sends an arrow where I'm aiming.

Now as far as finding a Turk bow that performs as well as my Saluki Turk at such a ridiculous low price, don't think so. Lower cost would be a used Saluki, Black Mountain Sheepeater (on sale now!!), Siegeworks looks like they make a decent bow. Heck I'll even include my Great Northern Ghost, with it's static tips, it's "Turk" like, and you won't find a tougher bow than that.

54" is short, but not what I would classify as a short bow. The junior Turk from Grozer measures 45". That's short!

You're right about the performance, by the way. I don't think you will find more than a few handful of bows which perform as well as the Saluki models, for a lower price. I hope to get my bow sometime during spring.

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am i able to attach a small bow quiver on the turkish bow thanks

ttt

I know these horsebows look cool, but the truth is, performance beats cool all day long. I had one of these horsebows. I could never get any accuracy out of it and I tried everything I knew of. It also had tremendous problems casting the arrow, i.e. it was almost like this 60# bow was a 25#. Could it have been me? Perhaps. But the minute I sold this horsebow and bought myself a Martin Saber recurve 50#, accuracy returned. Imagine that.

Look, when I saw that horsebow, I thought that horsebow was just too awesome. I tried it. I was very unhappy with it. If you're planning on hunting, the coolness factor of the bow isn't your first consideration. Your first consideration is to the animal: What bow will make a clean kill? I would strongly suggest you start hunting with a standard recurve or longbow, get accurate with that, hunt with it. Most American traditional bowmakers and bowyers have been making bows for several years, if not several decades, with hunting in mind. We're not fighting wars and shooting people with bows anymore and that's specifically what these horsebows were made to do. These bows were the weapons of war of nomadic people that lived a very tough, harsh, and often very short life. They lived in a society that afforded them the time to practice constantly with these bows because they were warriors. And these modern horsebows, I think, are made as novelties that an archer can play about with. I really don't think they're made with hunting in mind.

 I see you've "TTT'ed" several times here. So, look, I'm telling you the totally unvarnished truth here. Those horsebows look cool, yeah, but do you have the cash to go through several sets of arrows to find that perfect matched set? These bows are not centershot and are very finicky about arrows. More so than the standard recurves and longbows out there. Just one little thing off and you've got arrows flying around all over the place. I know, because this was my experience.

 I've been shooting this Martin Saber for years now and am pleased as can be with it. And, look, the principle is absolutely the same. Pull string, release, arrow moves forward. The design varies from people to people, tribe to tribe. But way back when, no one saw casualties of a battle and said, "Yeah, this guy got nailed with a horsebow. This guy over here, he got tagged with an English longbow. Check out this guy; he got doinked with some old grandpa's neolithic flatbow." Bows were made as per the needs of the people they served and the materials they had to hand. If the English had fiberglass in 1440, they'd have made fiberglass backed longbows or even recurves and avoided having to import yew from less-than-friendly nations. The tribes here in the U.S. were all about steel arrowheads the second they could get them. Again, the principle is the same. We like looks and I'm not saying it shouldn't be part of your choice. I'm just saying don't make looks the sole deciding factor. Because that's a good way to get something you'll be frustrated with.

 Really, if a person could go back in time with, say, a Martin Dreamcatcher, people in an ancient era would think the bow unusual, but not necessarily something as unusual and outlandish as, say, a compound bow. They'd think you had a lot of gold to pay some artisan bowyer to have made it for you, that's all, or that your come from some far-off tribe or people. If you went back into ancient time with a production Howard Hill longbow, most people wouldn't know any difference from what they had until they got close enough to you that they could see your eyelashes in detail.

 All I'm saying is, put your skill as an archer first. Hunting isn't job one with a bow. Shooting that bow very well is job one. Hunting comes after that. Practice does not make perfect. Perfect practice makes perfect.

 Anyway, good luck to you and hope this helps.

i do hunt with real recurves i shot 2 deer this year and thanks for the input

I have a Grozer Hungarian of the Middle Ages for sale for $250. It is 43#@28". It is a good bow, quiet, very little hand shock with 1816 arrows. Let me know if you have any interest.

(http://i337.photobucket.com/albums/n395/ibehiking/DSCF0174.jpg)

(http://i337.photobucket.com/albums/n395/ibehiking/DSCF0178.jpg)

thanks but no thanks i really want the turkish junior for x'mas

Soooo...by all the TTT, what else do you need to know if you've decided on the bow already? Just askin'...

if I can put a small bow quiver on a turkish bow that is leather covered in leather and if I hunted it in winter bow that snow would ruin it thank you sooooo much

The answer to that is to call and ask the manufacturer of the bow you've decided to get. That's the only way to know for sure. It also saves a lot of time from TTTing.   :D

Just because it's a "horsebow", doesn't mean it can't be used for other purposes. Yes, they were weapons of war, which means you are most likely sacrificing accuracy for increased speed. Just gotta train some more then!

I, by the way, was inspired. I too find the turkish bow design interesting. So I ordered a Jr. Turkish bow, for thumb and flight shooting  :)