Trad Gang
Main Boards => PowWow => Topic started by: hat creek on June 13, 2009, 02:33:00 PM
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Howdy all....I am looking for input concerning a solid performing broadhead for deer hunting this fall. My Quinn Stallion is rated at 45# @ 28 inches, but I draw 27" and figure I am shooting closer to 43#. My shoulder problems allow me to shoot a lighter bow without the repercussions of shoulder pain. My question is: should I shoot 2 blade 125 grain broadheads to match the 125 grain field points I now use? What 2 blade BH should I consider? I will be hunting blacktail deer that may go as high as 130 pounds but average closer to 120 pounds.
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I like the Magnus Stingers.I think either the 2 or 4 blade will work fine for you.I like the 4 blade head.The bleeders are small and should not impeed penetration.Shoot about a 10gpp arrow and you should blow through any Blacktail.
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I shoot 42# at my 30" draw. My bow likes an aluminum arrow with a 150 grain point so I'm going to go with a 130 grain Stos glue on 2 blade broadhead with an 11/32" Zwickey 36 grain long broadhead adapter. Total point weight will be roughly around 166 grains before sharpening the broadhead. After sharpening the broadhead, the total point weight will be around 150 grains.
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Look at Charlie Lamb's post that is going on now regarding penetration. Sharp and sharper works better than anything! I used 125 & 150 grain Magnus stingers and silver flames last year with great results on deer & hogs from 45 & 48 lb longbows. i used 100grain inserts and skinny carbons also with these heads!
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Stingers work but I consider the Stos number one when you are shooting light gear for a two blade and the woodsman for a 3 blade.It don't take much to put either out the other side of a deer.jmo
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Last season I shot a 45# Bear Grizzly, I realy had good luck with Zwickey Black Diamonds in both the four blade and two blade models. They come in 115 grain glue on or 135 screw in, I just buy the glue on and use my own inserts with carbon arrows, but I have taken deer with them on wood shafts also. If you get them sharp with the proper placement and yardage from a well tuned setup you could get pass through's with your setup the same as I do with mine. They have proven themselves time after time, and wont break the bank.
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Muzzy Phantoms, Zwickey, Magnus, Stos, Ace, Silver Flame...
All good heads and have taken tons of animals. Get them sharp and go kill something.
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I like Magnus and Zwickey's for 125 grain two-blades. Both heads fly well and sharpen easily.
Claudia
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I like that I can get the Magnus stingers hair poping sharp with a DMT fine diamond stone.I can get the others listed sharp but not as sharp as the stingers YMMV.
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I also, like the 125gr Magnus Stinger. They fly real well. Haven't harvested anything with them but, they shoot well into my broadhead target.
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Several excellent choice suggested above. For more than a decade in my youth literally all of us locally shot 45lb bows, many not drawing 28 inches.
My best friend, and the best lifetime trad hunter I've been blessed to know and shoot with and while we hunt alone, we share the "draggin out" fun together, annually.
For background, between us were approaching 100 whitetail with this equipment.
He literally shoots your exact set up. 45lb (Bear Super K), drawn to 27 inches, with older carbon steel Bear razorheads, until lately, for our 120-210lb whitetail.
I tend to stay mainly with the two blades that have worked for us for decades but , while most will claim something different in results, each of us have harvested more than a few with 160 grain Snuffers.
For the past few years, the Snuffer has been my friends "go to" head but I still mainly hunt with a two blade.
WE DO shoot heavy arrows in the 12-15 gpp range and have had zero problems with adequate penetration, more often than not sending either head out the opposite side. More than that I've yet to see a "need" for.
About any of the traditional standard size two blades will give you the best penetration, and I love my old bear heads and looking for some OLD Ben Pearson heads to whack a couple with....but I'd not flinch at all using a Snuffer the remainer of my days afield.
The one you shoot best with and can sharpen the best will be the one for you,
I thought I would add our experiences with very similar equipment.....that was also used for a very long time in the 60s (concerning the Bear Razoread)without complication if on a balanced set up.
God Bless and keep em sharp.
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Thanks all of you for the feedback and directions. I guess I'll order a couple of Magnus Stingers and see how they fly for me.
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Ron....I think you will do well with those stingers.
Russ
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Good grief, Snuffers with a 45 lb bow! Wow I shoot 70-75lbs. Maybe I should get some sharpening lesson from your friend!
I would stick to a good two blade with your setup stingers would do great. But I highly recomend Zypher broadheads the Scirrocco would be a little wider than the stingers. Just don't get the sasquatch as they are just to wide to shoot well.
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Some spelling lesson too.LOL
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How about the SilverFlame 1.5s? Do you think they are to wide for the lighter set ups?
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slowbowke, do you more often than not achieve pass thru's shooting the 160gr snuffer? or just poke the head out the other side? with your light setup. Curious as I am trying them out on whitetails this year.
Stinger 2 blade is a very good choice, as is any good two blade cut on contact that is as sharp as you can get it. I would think that would maximize your chances for an exit hole or pass thru.
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The issues of "pass-through" is more related to quality arrow flight and broadhead sharpness than it is to draw weight. You wouldn't be questioning a guy with a 60 pound, straight-limbed longbow about penetration, but a good 45 pound recurve with low stretch string will shoot nearly as fast...and sometimes faster than that 60 pounder, depending on the draw length of the archer and form of the archer.
When you look at things in a one dimensional manner, you only see what you want to see, rather than the variety of answers that can apply to such a dynamic endeavor.
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I'm shooting about 46 lbs and will be using 125 snuffers this year on deer and small hogs. If i come against a big hog (200+) Ill pull out a two blade unless I'm convinced by then the snuffer will do what I want it too.
Its great to build from experience of guys on here but do your own trial and error. Everyone has opinions...
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100 grain Magnus Stingers with a 50 or 100 grain brass insert behind it. The thinner main blade will help with penetration and very small bleeders really open up the entrance and exit holes. If you don't get a complete pass through the backs of the blades are sharp also and would create carnage inside a body cavity as the deer was running off.
I shot 7 Kentucky whitetails with this setup and it is what I'm sticking with this season.
(http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa121/kyTJ/Arrows/broadheads.jpg)
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"slowbowke, do you more often than not achieve pass thru's shooting the 160gr snuffer"
I guess I WASN'T clear on that. I mean head only and also meant any more than the head going through was unimportant TO ME, others think differently of course.
If good and sharp youll not have a problem taking deer cleanly and quickly with any legal set up that shoots an arrow well with them.
Ive only seen one deer taken with a Snuffer, sharpened by me or my buddy, go 50 yards, shot placement and head sharpness have more to do with how fast they go down than the type of head.....that said, I still have LOTS of faith in a well placed Snuffer taking them down NOW!
The exception was a bad shot hitting quartering back taking out the liver and innards, found 120 yards away the next morning.
Just my 2 cents.
An interesting thought too....about 20 (30?? YIKES) years ago these discussions were debating IF they wanted the head to go through, AT ALL...let alone a "pass through".
Some did, and still do prefer a head that stays in the animal doing more damage as it runs but I personally cant tell the difference but prefer an exit hole for a more quickly produced blood trail JUST IN CASE.
Better than half the time, I see the deer go down if I'm in a tree. On the ground, losing sight of them is pretty easy but with a sharp head, I have no trouble with blood trails using either head but do think the Snuffer shot ones go down faster.......so far LOL for me and while I prefer the lines of the old Bear, I do have a snuffer on me if I end up hunting in some "monsoon" due strictly to how fast Ive seen em go down on the average.
There can always be exceptions. Any deer on its "toes" so to speak, cause he knows something is "UP"....tends to run further, I think, than one that has no clue.
Some of my best memories are ones I shot that hopped a few yards looking around......then "kerplunk"....down they go, some literally steps from where shot.
Im going to stick my neck out here showing HOW MUCH I believe in a good sharp head's efficiency.
I dont shoot far and always see my arrow hit barring any problems. THE ONLY TIME, I wait more than a minute or so to follow is strictly if it WAS a less than good hit.
If I see the arrow hit where I wanted, that deer is on the ground in less than 20 seconds, some of which I could see and normally it's less than 10 seconds.
No I don't run after them and know I CAN be wrong so I mark where I saw them last, VERY WELL, an start at where they were hit easing slowly in their direction with my eyes open for blood AND movement.
Only the bad hit ones,(flinch) took more than a few minutes to find and those werent started till hours later.
I dislike doing that SO much that I've passed up some awful nice deer when I wasn't 110 percent sure there wasnt a branch inbetween us in low light.
Keep em sharp and shoot em well. There are MANY great heads out there that will do all you want.
This is only my experience with the Old Bear heads and Snuffers I use now. Magnus and Zwickey two blades are heads that never left me wanting either. As I've aged the old Bear has become a piece of my soul that wont let go is all.
Not a heavy head, and while it works well unweighted, I find much better flight with some added weight and a higher FOC.
As I said in my previous post, TODAY.. 42-48lb bows are "light weight".....in the 60s it was the NORM without anyone feeling they needed more, feeling they were disadvantaged nor having ANY CLUE how fast their set up was.......or caring. I haven't a clue how "fast" my arrows go out of any of my bows.
To make my point, I've a 1956-57 Ben Pearson cat. number 950, in a "take apart" at the handle that has plans this fall.
Regardless of the younger members in my family ribbing me.....none of em are willing to place any bets against the "ol man" and his "old bow" not doing quite well.
I don't feel "under gunned" at all and truly wish I had stayed with 45-50lbs bow all my life. I MISSED some dandies shooting 70plus lb bows that I thought "had an advantage".which they do but not in MY hands.
Those deer haven't gotten any tougher than they were decades ago and we have LOTS more of them, making a close shot more possible.
OUR attitude is what has changed.
I'm NOT positive but am told Fred Eichler used his 54lb recurve on that honker AK Yukon moose that went down in about 60 yards.
Unless I misunderstood, the shot hit quartering forward and didnt exit. If you watched the film on TV.....you know how fast that huge thing went down.
Do a aize of animal and bow weight comparison there using that and your bow weight and a deer.
You've NO reason to worry, at all, IMHO.
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Thanks for the info Steve, as I said just curious and was not trying to start something. If I was I certainly would have asked for more details about your rig. Not being one dimensional in thought only curious for general info. from someone who has loosed a few arrows at deer. Certainly agree with George that MANY factors go into a pass thru with quality of arrow flight very high.
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good post Steve, I've found a fair percentage of the guys that shoot 3 blades don't really know what a sharp 3 blade is...get yourself an actual SHARP three blade and a true flying arrow and bow weight becomes a non issue.
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Lots and lots of great advice above and you should reread it a couple times for it all to settle in. With that said the Magnus Stinger is a great broadhead and one you should consider for sure.
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Has anybody used 4-blade Zwickey Eskimos? Just wondering how they worked out for low poundage bows. I'm thinking the small "bleeder-blades" will put a little more blood on the ground without limiting penetration too much.
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I'm with the Stinger crowd on this
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SuperK - 4 blade Eskimos are what Mike Treadway uses out of his 41 pound longbow. He killed an elk with that same setup.
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Thanks for the info LongbowWally.