Just received my new catalog from ABS. On the inside page is an ad for the new Ashby Broadhead:
* Machined from one piece 440B stainless steel
* .072 blade thickness
* 58 Rockwell hardness
* Straightedge 3:1 design
* 25 degree single bevel (R or L)
* 300 gr.
* 3 per pack......$89.95
Hmmm...$30 each for a broadhead. Not sure, but I don't think I'll buy more than a couple dozen.
:eek:
If I had posted before going to bale hay, I would have beat you to the punch Ric! I got my catalog and my Samarias ordered! My catalog said $79.95 for 3 and 200gr. is the highest wt.?
they look good and shoot well, a friend of mine has one and I was able to shoot it, looks to be indestuctable. I am looking forward to them being in production so I can order some
b.glass -
200 gr. is the maximum weight and 3 for $79.95 for the Samurai Broadhead.
The Ashby Broadhead is 300gr. only and priced at 3 for $89.95. The only option shown is right or left bevel.
hogdancer - ABS is selling them now for delivery in early October.
These heads are undestructable as i have said before..IMO there is not a bow strong enough to damage or break this head.... Finally a solid one piece head out of 440 stainless. Hogdancer had his Prototypes flying like a dart...quality is expensive.
joebuck - "quality is expensive." You got that right. I've spent less on a quality custom longbow than it would cost for 2 dozen of these broadheads. I'm certain theyu are well made and are quality broadheads. When I said, "Not sure, but I don't think I'll buy more than a couple dozen" I sincerely hope you understood the tongue was buried firmly into the cheek.
im looking forward to some pics
Yeah I am looking for some pics too, If they are remotley shaped like the griz I might buy some for this season. I hate to spend so much but I think it may be worth it. I am no griz expert just started shooting them, and they shoot great!
But sharpening is like hand to hand combat. between file and BHd. If these are sharp, that is the key. I am picky about sharp. Alot say hunt ready out the pack but very very few deliver it in a fixed blade trad style head.
Someone get some pics up!
Jason
Ric, I understood your comment, and I agree totally, but this go around I might just suck it up! LOL
All I have is Prototype pics that i took...let me get permission from the board of directors...i'll be back
Yeah, I'd sure like to see what they look like..
I've not seen the Samurai either. I went the web page but they're not there, or I didn't find them.
I'd like to see what they look like. Waiting....
AAAuuuggghhh!!!! I didn't order the BH I wanted!! I guess I turned too many pages! I'll have to call tomorrow and change my order.
Would it be ok to show a picture of the picture in the catalog?
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/BearsandBows104.jpg)
For some reason I think I might get in trouble for this but here it is!
J-dog,
I made up a simple jig for grinding the 25 degree angle. Then finish with a Gatco/Lansky type sharperner for the final edge. Works well. Here's the link"
http://tradgang.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=060487
(http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j87/SOS_321/GFinishedEdge.jpg)
These heads are on their way to Africa on Thursday!
I'm telling!
It was all your fault!!! You started it!!
:p
LOL. Thanks :D . Looks pretty sweet.
Ashby can't make a glue on? My cedars aren't tapped. Do they make a glue on at about 150 to 175?
HI SOS, I have drooled over that jig since I saw your post. But I have no belt sanders or equipment. That looks sweet. I started using the 160s this year and am really impressed with the way they shoot. I have two more to grind down then I am gonna start them on the stones.
I like the looks of the Ashby head, looks like it could withstand a bomb hit.
J
Just out of hospital, and not doing all that well, so this will be brief.
Roadkill, I don't make this BH, or any other. Ed Schlief at ABS asked me to help him develop the best screw-mount broadhead I could devise; regardless of the cost; and that's exactly what I did - and for free too. I've no financial connection with this BH whatsoever. Ed asked if I would mind if he named it after me, and I said that it would be okay to do so, just as long as it was up to what I expected from a truly great broadhead - and it is.
I did recommend a slightly longer blade length after testing the prototypes and understand that change is being made on the production model. That was the only change I recommended. It looks like the photo in the catalog is the prototype version, so the final version should be just a bit longer that that shown. The extra length helps with the degree of bone splits created. The final version should split bone bone every bit as well as the 190 Grizzly (if not a bit better), is very easy to get truly sharp and holds that sharpness exceptionally well. On all test shots it remained shaving sharp after penetrating through a buffalo. I also don't think there will be any bending of this head on any animal tissue, of any type, at any shot angle. The steel is great.
The photo doesn't show the ferrule profile well. It is unique, and not only allows deep blade penetration with minimal resistance, it permits the 25 degree bevel to be honed across the ferrule. This ferrule design can't be duplicated in a glue-on version.
As for a glue on 'Ashby style' BH, I've given a lot of input to Todd (at STOS) for their glue-on single-bevel that is under development (that's for free too) and I'm hopeful that they will have an absolutely great glue-on single bevel head out soon.
I used the 190 Grizzly as the benchmark, and tried my best to better that great broadhead's performance by a noticeable degree. I think this BH does that.
Ed
Glad to hear from you Doc and thank you for your generosity in helping these fine companies make a dynamite head.
These look like a 3:1 screw in ABowyer. Which is a good thing as far as Im concerned. Totally bombproof.
QuoteOriginally posted by Dr. Ed Ashby:
Roadkill, I don't make this BH, or any other. Ed Schlief at ABS asked me to help him develop the best screw-mount broadhead I could devise; regardless of the cost; and that's exactly what I did - and for free too. I've no financial connection with this BH whatsoever. "
" I've given alot of input to Todd (at STOS) for their glue-on single-bevel that is under development (that's for free too) and I'm hopeful that they will have an absolutely great glue-on single bevel head out soon.
I used the 190 Grizzly as the benchmark, and tried my best to better that great broadhead's performance by a noticeable degree. I think this BH does that.
Ed
Very generous of you to give your time and opinion for our benefit. Much appreciated.
Thanks Doc, and I hope you get to feeling at least up to par soon. An eagle would be nice!
(My husband golfs).
You guys must be shooting light weight girly bows.How else can you find arrows stiff enough for a 300gn broadhead? :D
Dr. Ed - Glad to hear that you are out of the hospital. Sorry that you arn't feeling that well as yet. Prayers that as time goes by you will get back to feeling normal. :)
To all - From looking at the design, material and construction it is very evident this is an extremely fine broadhead. My problem lies in justifying the dollars for my hunting.
6 Grizzly Sticks - $89.95
6 Broadheads - $179.90
Add shipping, fletch, etc. and you've got over $300 invested in 6 arrows. $50 each! How can the average guy that has kids to raise, clothe, feed and put through school justify spending this kind of money for 6 arrows? Put a quiver full of these arrows together and you've just spent you kids inheritance.
I'm happy for those of you that can afford them. I hope you buy all you need and want. But as for me, my old Bear Razorheads, Zwickey, Grizzly heads and cedar shafts that have worked for decades look better all the time and will just have to do.
Danny
How Can I get this catalog :confused:
Ric: It is a lot, but given that the combination is near indestructable, six arrows could last an awfully long time for hunting as long as they're not lost. The thought occurs to me that at $50 an arrow, we're likely to become even more selective in the shots we take. (Perhaps making sure that our arrows have a clean landing spot after they pass through the critter (L0L). I shoot woodies so don't have a dog in this race, but I am looking forward to the new glue on single bevel heads that STOS and Abowyer will be introducing soon.
Last year I took two shots during hunting season, killed one hog and a fat doe. Full pass through and easy recovery. This year I will once again hunt with WW broadheads, the old green Bear Razorheads, or or some 125 grain Magnus heads I've owned for several years. My broadheads are razorsharp and have always performed well for me. The extra money I would spend on the above mentioned heads will be spent on gas for my truck so that I can get to my favorite hunting spot(163 miles one way) and back home again. I'm anxious to see one of these heads in action but I will not be shooting them anytime soon. Good luck to those that do and keep'um sharp. :campfire:
I've seen too many large size critters go down with selfbows and stone points to be able to care, beyond a certain passing academic interest, in such research that supposedly almost mandates "high end" EXPENSIVE broadheads! It just bothers me on principle. There is a point to be made however if these broadheads actually last longer and therefore become less expensive in the long run. I'd like to know what the profit margin is.
Well every time I have had to replace a broadhead it was because it was lost, not failure of the broadhead.Just because a broadhead is super tough does not mean I won't loose it when it buries under a patch of canes or the much sucks it up.:)I personally can't carry broadheads I am afraid to shoot so the price rules me out of ever useing them.On a good season hog hunting it is not uncommon for me to go though a half dozen or more arrows.I just can't justify the extra cost when I have no problem with other heads doing the job.Could never shoot a 300gn broadhead anyway unless I used rebar for arrows. ;)
Personally I'm not sold on the 440 stainless. It's the stuff that most of the cheap knives from China, Japan, Pakistan, etc. are made of. It's darn near impossible to sharpen, and then doesn't hold it long. Locally I have a reputation for be able to put a razor edge on almost anything, but that stuff has me stumped.
i buy goltips 5575's at 65.99 a doz. nocks and inserts are free. i am going to natural turkey feathers as soon as i kill a bird, i like the natural water proofing and stiffer feather. so i am looking at 5.50 per arrow without broadhead. that is cheaper than you can make good cedar arrow. if i get some of these broadheads i can tell you i am not going to stump shoot with them or shoot small game. its going to be something big. but i don't stump shoot my grizzly's either.
i besides heads i have bent i have only lost 1 head shooting at a animal in 3 years and that is about 25 or more animals, "deer and pigs" the head i lost was a muzzy phantom and it didn't penetrate the shoulder, i am pretty sure the pig is still alive, have it been a single bevel i am confident it would have spilt the bone and at least got both lungs if not exiting on the other side. the fear of losing a head is really small, i would be far worried about losing the deer. if you find the animal you almost always find the broadhead.
the german kinetics sell like hotcakes and i suspect this head will to. that is if the steel is on par with the GK heads
"if you find the animal you almost always find the broadhead"
Finding the animal has nothing to do with finding the head if you are shooting through them The arrows keep going and are lost in the marsh when you are hunting from the ground.Don't hardly ever lose one deer hunting because I am shooting from a treestand and they just stick in the ground.
Quotehave it been a single bevel i am confident it would have spilt the bone and at least got both lungs if not exiting on the other side.
C'mon BM you're smarter than that!
That's like saying "if I woulda taken the shot, I woulda hit him perfect"
Unscientific testing done on dry bone with no tissue absorbing the impact doesn't prove much.
BUT, the important thing is that you shoot whatever you have the most confidence in. Just make your own decisons based on your experiences.
The day I spend $30 on a broadhead would someone please just whack me over the head with a 2 X 4 and dispose of the body? Thanks :saywhat: ...Van
My catalog came today and I was amazed at the cost of ALL broadhead and shaft products contained therein. I am sure that they are great products, but I am not convinced that I have to have them. That being said, I found myself trying to get to $150 worth of things I do need so I could get a free poster. That one on the cover rocks! :bigsmyl:
Gregg
lol but you kill everything you shoot at van. it has been a long time, i missed you at chester this year.
i have the shot on video the pig ducked, my shot was slightly high not more than 2 in. on a 150- 200 lb. pig, but he ducked a good 4 or 5 in. the reason i made such a bold statement biggie was the fact i shot 2 pigs of about the same size earlier in the year and shot behind the shoulder and threw the opposite shoulder into the dirt with a magnus stinger, and i shot a doe through both shoulder blades and spine, the head was sticking out the other shoulder. i attribute my lake of penetration on the pig to such a large broadhead in the phantom and not in the pigs arrow proof shoulder. the phantom as a 2 blade isn't that big but when you add the bleeders i think it has more surface area and take more energy to get the same penetration than a big snuffer.
you are correct i don't think i can say scientifically that yes it would have been a different outcome but i can say i would have gotten a lot better penetration , and to say i would have penetrated the shoulder instead of stopping at it wouldn't be that big a step, once you break the shoulder there is nothing but air and small bit of tissue until you hit the other shoulder.
remember 99% of the traditional archery community doesn't have a 32 in. draw. we can't all shoot a 55 lb bow and a snuffer through anything. some of us need a little extra edge to do the same things you can do with just the huge power stroke you possess.
James, this "girly" shoots a 47# longbow and 700 gr. arrows using Carbon Express 150 shafts. I have a better choice of spine on arrows to choose from since going to the heavy points.
This has to be a joke!!!!!! I'll cut my own hands off before I pay anyone $30.00 for a broadhead. Someones nuts!!!!!!!
Look Biggie.... I respect you and your vast experience, but fact is... you're dead wrong on this.
My own personal experience and years of study have shown that every shot I should have or could have taken would have been perfect. I have never missed a shot taken under these conditions!!!! :D
I'll pay it atleast once. If it's everything they say it is, it will be worth it to me.
Molson, I know, I know....I've been trying to tell you that you need to shoot more!
Guys like Van and George S. wouldn't pay $30 for a new truck. I think George saves eggshells. BUt quality takes time and time = money. Like the Silverflames, each one is HANDSHARPENED. What would YOU charge?
Is such a head worth the extra money? Will a $30 head kill a critter quicker and better than a $2 Bodkin. IMO...NOPE! For me, I'm amazed at what a really sharp head can do and I can't get a head as sharp as a Silverflame or a Muzzy Phantom right out of the package. So, the viable alternative for me is to pay someone else to do it for me. Doesn't sound good to you do-it-yourselfers, but I hired someone to lay the brick on my house too.
Dr Ed,
Your work is turely an inspiration! It must be a nice feeling to see all that coming out for the bowhunter. I know I have certainly enjoyed trying to capture your ideas.
As to 300gr on rebar, Here's my 300gr Asby style head piloted from a selfbow...mighty strong too! Thanks :notworthy: the other Doc
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v110/tippit/Broadheads/AsbyStyleForgedBroadhead003.jpg)
Biggie - I beg to differ with you regarding Van paying $30 for a new truck. He's spend at least that much on bailing wire just to hold the camper on his F150. Not to mention the fenders.
:bigsmyl:
Van:
I'll take you up on your request. Make sure you e-mail me in advance so I can be in San Antonio when you make that purchase. If you like, I'll bring Danny with me to tote the board and dig the hole. Have a great hunting season and keep your old, hand me down heads, sharp. :wavey:
I hope Dr. Ed reads all of these posts and has a good hearty laugh at what he reads.
All I know is Im going to trust him first and formost on all this broadhead stuff before anyone else.
I see people saying where the phantoms are sharp out of the package? The two packs I bought wouldn't shave the hair on my arm, not even close. I like the phantom but it takes a little work to get it sharp.
Or I was jipped? or they new biggie the celebrity was buying them, so they gave him sharp ones! LOL
Later
J
J-dog, mine were sharp, for cutting tomatoes in the house, but not SHARP for hunting.
Biggie the celebrity...that's funny right there now :-)
Man I bought (actually won at the banquet) 3 packs of 220 grain, they're sharp enough to shave.
Nothing like the silverflames though.
I just wish I could sharpen stuff. All this would be meaningless :-)
I have to buy two new knives a year....
Looking at price from Mr. Schlief's perspective, here's what you have.
1. Initial tooling and development costs. For a small business this is a considerable amount.
2. How many of these broadheads, two- and three-bladed, can Mr. Schlief realistically expect to sell per year? If you're honest, you know that the market for HEAVY broadheads is small. Yet he must earn his costs in #1 -- remembering the small size of his business.
3. Market analysis: If Mr. Schlief were to lower his price 50 percent, would he sell more than twice as many blades as he projects he will sell each year? Were he to do so, would this sales figure be reached every year? What about a price 30 percent of what it is now?
From the other way, how many sales would Mr. Schlief lose because of excessive cost were his price to be 25 percent higher?
Until or unless bowhunters migrate from lusting for arrow speed to penetration, the market for HEAVY broadheads will remain miniscule. Larger manufacturers will not sell enough heavy broadheads at attractive prices to warrant a small manufacturer offering "best of breed" broadheads at a semireasonable price, recognizing his market is large enough to warrant its price.
Now, the situation is reversed. Apparently, this is the same situation that occurs with Silver Flame broadheads. And this broadhead, being first to market, has set a price-value floor.
LOL Biggie, I am not the best sharpener either, maybe it was the difference between the 220s, and the 125s? who knows.
J
I guess I don't understand the whole cost thing, if I think something is worth the price I buy it if not I don't, simple ! I don't waste time second guessing what someone is asking. If I can't afford it, that's MY fault not the sellers.
Thomas, quit being so practical.........
We've said for a long, long time that Biggie was not very sharp...wait a second, are we still talking about broadheads?
I bought the 125 phantoms last year and they were sharp enough to cut butter at best. Never even shot them
doug77
I told ya'll I was sharpening challenged....maybe I just don't know what sharp is!
The phantoms I have bought would easily cut hair.I touch them all up any way because I shoot each one so it is no biggie if they are not razors out of the pack.It is a lot easier to touch up a head that comes pretty sharp that starting from scratch like a lot of trad heads. :)
For me it depends on what the product is: I'll overpay for some things, (like two Superbowls!)try to find the best value for others, and only buy some things if they are well undervalued. And ya know, it is all generally independent of how much money I have. I don't like paying for water but I'll buy a $3 Starbucks without a blink. I might not buy a product if I think I am being "taken" even if I can afford it. Again, it depends what it is and sometimes it's dependent on if there is a similar product that works as well in most instances for less money-like a broadhead-something I have no real emotional attachment too unlike what I have with some of my bows. Oh, some products I will let others pay for the "start-up" costs then buy them at their true value when the market is saturated and the price drops. In fewer words-if it is worth it to me I buy it but not before going through the little (usually) rapid mental gymnastics that I describe! :)
Hey guys,
Here's a link that shows the new Ashby. It's actually the link for the single bevel Broadhead Pro sharpener, but it does show the Ashby.
http://www.alaskabowhunting.com/Broadhead_Pro_Single-Bevel__P141C17.cfm
Hope that helps.
SOS, nice looking jig! Looks like getting the Grizzly to 25 degrees just got a lot easier!
todd smith
I was able to shoot the Nanook prototype as well, I really liked that one ! I really liked both heads but for whitetail I will still probably use my Woodsmans.
Where can a guy get 300 gr. field points to see if will work with his setup?
I have some woodsmans as well that I like, not killed anything with them yet, course ain't killed anything with a grizzly either? First year trying both of them. I just chose to try the grizzlies for whitetails this year and gonna use the WWs for bear (if I should get so lucky as to get a shot at one).
I held off buying the woodsman becuase everyone talked about how hard they were to sharpen, btu I found that they were quite easy to sharpen, did like Charlie Lamb's video.
It is everyones choice what to buy and what not to buy. The 440 stainless being used in cheap knives?? that 440 is hard to sharpen probably cause it is so hard as far as Rockwellm I imagine.
Last months TBM Ashby said that 440 hardened to 58R would be the finest BHd steel. Though he aslo said something about tool steel that hard would perform similar? I don't know I trust what he say! he forgot about more kills with different heads than I probably ever will!!!
J
ABS will have the 300 grain heads soon. Right now you can get them from Morrison Archery (http://www.morrisonarchery.com/html/broadheads.html) . Give em' a call.
For 300 grain field points, try Kustom King: http://ns1.bowsite.org/acb/showdetl.cfm?&DID=6&Product_ID=1579&CATID=6
I am no steel/knife expert but I have been playing around with knives lately and find AUS-8 to be a great, very functional steel. It holds an edge well and sharpens very easy (even after severe blunting), from what I heard the steel in the Ashby head is 440B and that is very similar to AUS-8.
Plain old 440 (kinda like 420) is not nice stuff and I would never buy it at any price. But again, 440B is a whole different animal and I think that is what the heads in question are made of. It will make for a sweet (but pricey) broadhead for sure!
Heres the Prototypes Hogdancer and I and been shooting from ABS. The holes are not present in final head. We'll show ya'll some dead elk in a couple of weeks with them. So sorry the rest of you have to wait.
:jumper: :jumper: :jumper: :jumper:
(http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c114/swamprooter/AshbyandNannuck.jpg)
now that is a no nonsense, utilitarian broadhead,
form follows function,
ugly and deadly
Yep looks indestructable. One piece eh?
Is it stamped or machined?
Doc get better. I have met Ed and he is a no-nonse guy and these broadheads-just got his catlog-are jsut like him-no-nonsense. I may have to try his Sitkas with some of these.
Like reading your research, Doc-so get well and back at it. Prayers for you....
I spent $500 on a truck just 15 years ago. Wrecked it and collected $2700 from the bozo that ran a red light and t-boned me. Still had my 1973 F100 backup. Took that $2700 and bought a $5000 truck 6 years ago. So there. I ain't cheap.
In regards to BM22. If he says it's so it's so. He's the most ethical, smartest, youngest, best cooking bowhunter I've ever had the pleasure to hunt, camp, eat, lie and shoot with. We certainly need more like him :thumbsup: ...Van
Is it just me or is the ferrule totally off center in that first pic?
They do look bomb proof. I'd buy some or Silver
Flames for my first Elk hunt but other than that my WW's and STOS kill everything they stick for a lot less.
I bet they get lost just as fast as the cheapest heads out there.
:D
Top head is Nanook Prototype. Final head is vented
Bottomhead is Ashby.
Both heads machined on a CNC from a single block of 440B stainless. No other head I am aware of is made to this standard. Quality is expensive.
I have experience with CNC machines, what 300K nowdays? plus skilled labor for someone who can run one. I take it they are farming them out to a machine shop. I hope so for there sake.
There ain't no way you can justify a CNC mill for making trad broadheads.
I'll buy 3 anyways just so I have some if for no other reason....Van where is that 2x4?
:knothead:
not off center, the bevel on the one side is causing an optical illusion,
Machined from billet!!!!!
Someone is redefining strength in broadhead manufacture.
QuoteOriginally posted by MikeW:
Van where is that 2x4?
:knothead:
Home Depot. You can buy a truck load for $30. You ain't that far away. Maybe I just come up there and whack you myself :knothead: :bigsmyl: :bigsmyl: ...Van
This is my totally independent broadhead test,
(http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c114/swamprooter/ashbyww.jpg)
How many shots did that take Joey?
3! at 4 yards.miss, nick and then center punch... I had to Gap shoot it with a slight point of aim reference,.....Now Don, how do I cook this this thang?
mmmmm, i hear them things is tasty
I wish they'd make a 4.5" long by 1.5" wide version. :bigsmyl:
Joebuck, what does the blade look like after you resharpened it ? I know you have already !
I ground down on coarse diamond to get nicks out , then placed 25 degree shoulder on med diamond and got back to serrated sharp in several minutes. BUT i didn't put on leather strop to get final razor razor sharp because it shoots through my black hole to easy so I want to practice more!
QuoteOriginally posted by joebuck:
This is my totally independent broadhead test,
(http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c114/swamprooter/ashbyww.jpg)
They say a picture is worth a 1,000 words :thumbsup:
Now, have you tried the revers, the WW into your broadhead.
Joey, and this proves?????????????????????
I mean besides the fact that you have waaaaaaay too much time on your hands....
i would agree with biggie on this one.
but i would like to see after pictures to see how bad those gouges are on the broadhead after you resharpened it.
QuoteOriginally posted by Biggie Hoffman:
Joey, and this proves?????????????????????
That a Woodsman will pretty much destroy the edge of a $30 broadhead? :biglaugh:
QuoteThat a Woodsman will pretty much destroy the edge of a $30 broadhead?
It sure looks that way. :biglaugh:
Heres the head resharpened. It's really neat to finally work with a head machined out of one piece of 440B stainless. This head was touched up with a medium diamond then leather stropped with 60,000 grit oxide paste. Quality is expensive. This head has got to be on any bowhunter's short list that is headed out for heavy big boned dangerous game. I certainly didn't mean to ruffle any WW fans but IMO structually speaking, i can not find a head out there that can stand up to this head. All will kill deer but this head stays together and resharpens better than any head I have touched in 30 years. I am excited for those of you who have ordered these heads. You will certainly understand what I have been talking about when i say bomb proof..........for the record again, I am not on any ProStaff, nor recieve free merchandise or money from ABS. This is my oppinion and has nothing to do with ABS.........
(http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c114/swamprooter/Ashbyredone.jpg)
I agree....that indestructable broadhead is ruined except for a newly ground edge. OOPS.
By the way... here's a $3.00 Ribtek I shot into a cinder block this morning....57# longbow and 500 grain cedar. The arrow was crushed but there was no structual damage to the Ribtek. I'm betting it would also have went through a "hollow" ferrule on a Woodsman as well.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v134/oldearcher46/ribtek001.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v134/oldearcher46/ribtek002.jpg)
"I agree....that indestructable broadhead is ruined except for a newly ground edge. OOPS."
sorry don't understand ! broadhead looks like new to me and was "touched up" not newly ground
Ok George...thanks for the info..you can go back to Archie Bunker reruns :notworthy: :notworthy:
now that's funny !!!
Joey...is that a spot of blood on the table??
How did you put the s/s back on the edge that was mmmmissing?
If that $5 woodsman can tear the edge up like that, what will happen if it hits a legbone? I thought that was the whole idea behind this miracle of miracles.
Why don't you shoot one of the other prototypes with a prototype?
Some folks like and can afford a Mercedes while others can only afford a used car, both get you from point A to point B. And then there are other folks who can afford a Mercedes but choose to drive a economy car anyways.
This seems to be the case here also.
:campfire:
Heres the same head sharpened again shot out of a 58# recurve, 780 grain Superceder arrow at 8-10 yards. Head busted completely through broomstick and buried up in the black hole target about 5". head then ( not resharpened) shot through this 1 1/16" WET ( thanks Fay) treated lumber 1 x 6 plank . The 440B stainless head would still grab and shave hair after removal...I have been fortunate to kill over a handful of really big hogs over the years. This head will be devasting through a big boar shield IMO. Especially a close treestand shot where so many big hogs are lost due to poor vertical penetration. I believe this head was designed for Africa and Down Under BIg Big game but here in the states..this head will be unreal on knarly boars
(http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c114/swamprooter/ashbybroomhandle.jpg)
Can I borrow that quarter?
Velly intellesting.....
After scanning through all these posts, I'm not seeing the Ashby head dimensions. What will the final product's width be?"
i think it is 1 in. wide and 3 in. long a true 3 to 1.
i don't think the edge was that torn up, that is a really close picture. looking at the before and after pictures the holes seem to be in the same spot indicating he didn't take a lot of metal off to get a true edge again.
also i hope for the wensel woodsmans sake it is ALOT stronger than a deers leg bone. if not it would curl every time you hit a bone.
seems like this head is going to have a lot of competition coming up at a lot lower price if the new abowyer is also single bevel and the steel force.
Other heads ( Abowyer and Steelforce) price will reflect on quality of metal and construction. How many heads out there today are CNC machined out of a solid piece of 440B stainless or =?...I may be corrected but this head may be the first of it's kind considering quality of metal and construction...
For the record I have taken many deer , hogs, tundra swan and turkeys with the WW. It is an excellant head for hunting big game when a bowhunter can get it razor razor sharp.
At the last Denton rendezvous I bought a beautiful Black Widow MA II, 62", 55 lbs.@28, graybark for the same price 18 Ashby broadheads would cost me.
Lets see...18 Ashby broadheads or another Widow...HMMM????
IMHO,anyone who would pay $90.00 for 3 broadheads whether they could afford to or not, must be sniffing or snorting their buck lure! I agree with buying quality, but $30.00 a piece is insane when there are so many excellent broadheads out there for way less! Cotton
Call me crazy but I ordered mine as soon as I could. How many bows can anyone shoot anyway? Time will tell as to their worth. I intend to find out for myself.
:cool:
Finally ! someone who is willing to find out for themselves and not just jump on the bandwagon without ever even seeing one, at least borrow one and look at it before you pronounce it not worth it.
Thomas, loan me yours?
$30 is a lot for a broadhead,given what we are used to paying.It seems to me there are quite a few people willing to pay $700-$1500 for a custom bow but we think $30 is too much for a broadhead that can be used over and over.Isn't the projectile what does most of the work?Dr.Ashby's studies show that optimizing the broadhead/arrow setup can increase penetration 100 % or so.That's pretty amazing.How much would you pay for a bow that would give you twice the penetration of your current setup,at the same weight of draw?I'm starting to rethink what I would pay for arrows and broadheads.Having said all that,I'm sure there will be non CNC machined versions coming out soon also,that will be a lot cheaper.This one may be the Rolls Royce of heavy heads for those willing to pay for it.Broadhead collectors may want to grab a couple-just in case.
i thought about the same scenerios...guys buying $500 used "Custom" bows that don't shoot any more accurate than a $50 pawn shop Pearson Javalina complaining about a $30 head.......if anyone is considering these heads, i would not hesitate in ordering today. They are pretty busy with orders.
Biggie, Thomas craftfully snatched mine right off my arrow....
Aw come on now Biggie, a celebrity like you ought to be covered up with them :goldtooth:
Marty, don't plan on Joey traveling to Florida to hunt turkeys next March. He'll still be making payments on his 3-pack of broadheads.
Sorry guys, you can hard-sell all you want. What you have is an expensive broadhead that isn't any tougher than many already in use, and you think we are hard-headed for not buying some to try. Well...I'll just muddle by with my Bear Razorheads and Ribteks, which should get much cheaper now since nobody will want them 8^).
Anyway....that broadhead must be used...someone already drilled holes in it 8^).
and I will muddle along with my Wensel Woodsmans, I don't think you are hard headed for not trying them, it's fine if you don't, does'nt matter to me ! I just think it's the height of ignorance to go on so much about something you have never even SEEN ! but that happens on the internet I guess, you don't have to have any experiance with something to broadcast your opinion. Is an informed opinion too much to ask for ?
Easy Thomas....all in fun here......
I don't have to see one to know it isn't any better than all of the rest. Would I spend $30 on a head? Sure, I would, and have. Bt this new head is being touted as the end of all ends...propped up by a bunch of "testing" that has led you right to it....THAT I don't buy, $30 or $3.
QuoteOriginally posted by hogdancer:
Is an informed opinion too much to ask for ?
It would be nice if that were the case. In this instance, then only a couple of people would be posting. That would certainly be a boring dialogue. The rest is speculation, which doesn't seem unreasonable. For some, money is no issue. For others it is. I remember the hype with the woodsman and have talked to enough people that have shot them and had problems to be willing to wait for the test audience that is buying these broadheads to weigh in on how great they are in the future. On the surface these look like great broadheads, and well constructed. Necessary for deer? Probably not. And that is what the majority of people would probably be using them for. Helpful for hogs? Not sure how much improvement over modified grizzlies. Some independent testing down the road should help to answer that question.
IMO this head will not kill a deer any quicker than a modified Grizzly or George's Cinder block crusted Ribteck! However........Having held the head in my hand it sharpens so easily due to bevel present and quality of the 440B stainless ( not 440 or 440a)...440B stainless!
........Also the one piece CNC machined head is absolutely bomb proof in a 58 rockwell......If the head cost $3 or $300 it would still be more hunter friendly compared to others..........If your a grizzly fan or single bevel or follow Ed Ashbys penetration tests...This head IMO is what you have been hoping for in a high quality head.
Sorry Biggie , I shot your Woodsman you had a hand in designing with the twins. Will you forgive me? I should have shot a Ribteck!!!!! :D
QuoteOriginally posted by Biggie Hoffman:
I don't have to see one to know it isn't any better than all of the rest. Would I spend $30 on a head? Sure, I would, and have.
Now that I think about it, I have actually spent $30 on a single broadhead. I was a pristine, unmounted, unsharpened '46 Ace Hi-Speed I got on an internet auction site to give to Bob Mayo, the owner of Ace Archery Tackle. It turned out he already had one, so I figured after 60 years of collecting dust it should probably kill something.
This year, it will. ;)
QuoteOriginally posted by Biggie Hoffman:
Bt this new head is being touted as the end of all ends...propped up by a bunch of "testing" that has led you right to it....THAT I don't buy, $30 or $3.
what part of the 2 blade single bevel "testing" do you have a problem with. i have heard a lot of people that don't believe the testing but have yet to hear anyone point to ONE thing that have a problem with.
is it the twisting in flesh
twisting bone
finer cutting edge due to 25 degree
3 to 1 penetrates better than other heads
WHAT IS IT!!!!!!
i would agree biggie if i had a 32 in. draw i could shoot any head i wanted with a heavy arrow and pretty much shoot through any deer in the U.S. but i have a 29 in. draw and most people have less than a 28 in. hunting draw and need a little help to insure a pass threw given a nonperfect hit.
i know this seems like i am pointing just at biggie, i am not, i am talking to anyone that disagrees with dr. ashby's research. i am trying to learn and want to hear what you disagree with.
as far as the head goes i think it would depend on what your time is worth to you and how much you want to pay for comfort. in that i mean the head is almost the same thing as a grizzly you just don't need to work at sharping it for 20 or 30 min. each head to get it right the first time and with the stainless steel you wont have to touch it up every 5 min. to keep it sharp.
PDK25 well said, I don't think these heads are neccisary for deer, like I said I will still use a woodsman . certainly don't mind a differant opinion or criticizm (sp?) I just think if you don't have first hand knowledge don't talk down to others or ridicule something you don't know about. a differant point of view is fine. I could care less if anyone uses this head or not, I saw one , was impressed with the quality such as I have never seen before in a broadhead and figured I would relate what I have seen to other like-minded archers and all of a sudden I am accused of "hard-selling" something. I am just telling what I saw and my observations, that's all, take my opinion for what you paid for it.
bm22....you bring up an excellant point. This is a broadhead developed,designed and finaniced by ABS. They used the information from Ed Ashby tests, recomendations and approval of name. Ed Ashby on the record has not taken one penny from ABS or any other BH company to sell his name. I find that so refreshing in this day in age. Maybe some people have a problem with a retired optometrist's extensive testing broadhead penetration on big game or do they also doubt a retired chiropractors writings and lectures on how to kill big whitetails or an ex IBM middle manager on how to shoot instintive......gosh I sure don't..the body of their work speaks for theirselves no matter the old or present occupation.
Joebuck & JimB...Just so you know...when I got into trad shooting, I shot so many trad bows that I just could not shoot well...Bear, Shakespeare, Hoyt, Wing, Pearson, Damon Howatt(sp?), and on and on...
When I picked up my first Widow and shot it, I was in heaven. It reeked of quality and performance.
If I could have found one of those "$50.00 pawn shop bows" that shot anywhere near as sweet as my widow, I would have owned one. Having said that, I never did shoot a Pearson Javelina but I am going to keep my eyes open and if it shoots as well as my Widow as you said it will, I will have one in a heart beat.
Agreed, hogdancer.
By the way...as for the broadheads...If I could find any that perform as well as the Ashby at a fraction of the cost, I will use those also....Oh Yeah...I already have...WW's, Razorheads and Zwickeys etc.
However...in my first post I did say "In my humble opinion", and that is what makes this site so great.
Do I think $30.00 for a broadhead is ridiculous??You bet I do! (Unless a rare one for a collector) Do you think a custom bow performs like a $50.00 pawn shop bow??? Obviously you do. God bless the ability to have differrent opinions!!! It would be a dull world without it! You shoot the Ashbys if you wish and I'll keep shooting my Widows and hopefully we will both make quick, clean kills, no matter what we think of each others choices! Be safe this season! Cotton
Point well taken Cottonwood...I can understand how you like that Widow. Extremely well made bow. I bet you like custom grip,inlay, exotic wood veneers, fast flight string, dry fire proof tips..etc. This bow certainly needs no defense..........I like these Ashby heads also...440B Stainless at a 58 rockwell that really sharpens easily to razor edge unlike some other BH with lessor quality steel. I also like how it is machined out of 1 piece of metal unlike other heads. This head is super tough.........I know they are expensive like those Black Widows you like.....we're just alike, we both like quality and we'll pay for it...........you in a bow and me in a broadhead... We're the same my Yankee brother, have good season yourself
I cant wait for the next expensive broadhead to come out...Maybe those ABowyers will sell for 40 bucks a pop then we will be in business.
So many memories created.
WTF, 90 bucks for 3 bh's? 440b ain't that great of a s.s. steel either. If it was S30v or S90v or something of that ilk maybe the cost can be justified, but how many have split a Grizzly head or the like? A good carbon steel will usually, not always but usually will sharpen easier, is tougher(less prone to chipping), will be abit more maleable in that it will bend before breaking etc. etc. Man most of us hunt whitetails and I'm gonna use a 30 buck head on one? They almost look as good as my old Moosewhack heads from 20 yrs ago. keepem sharp
Joey thinks that just because he is from Oxford and plans to send his boy to school there that he is so much smarter than the rest of us!
i love edged objects so i am always keeping up with knife and braodhead and axe and tomahawk "technology" so to speak. I also love sharpening things. even just pencils, yeah its a problem.
Anyways I dont buy everything with a keen edge that is out there but i sure enjoy reading about it.
Excuse me guys, I'll be away for awhile.................i just saw a mountain lion across the street!
Longbow from LW....here you go. Have a good evening.
(http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c114/swamprooter/grizzly1.jpg)
This is almost as good as watching reality TV. I tune in every day!
I like that Ashby fellow :D
These heads are not very strong when hitting something that ain't alive, but they will kill. You could compare them to the Thudy-Thudy of rifle whitetail kills. Can you guess the brand? :p They are cheap :bigsmyl: ...Van
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v77/VanTX/Broadheads/BH1.jpg)
Very interesting, but I'll stick with a broadhead that has never let me down and flies like my field points... The Snuffer ! God bless Roger.
Amen Serg!!
This is very interesting stuff....I've enjoyed it!
Seems all living love conflict