I hope this is in the right forum.
I prefer to do everything myself as far as hunting goes, i.e. no guides. I see lots of people saying so an so offers elk hunting for $5000 or so and "that's not too bad a price". I go to eastern Oregon elk hunting when I can and it's all on my own. I have a blast. Why are some people happy to plop down what to me are huge sums of money for one hunt when you could do it yourself (after proper research) 4 or 5 times over for the same amount of money? Any opinions?
Rob
Probably because no everyone has too much time to hunting.
If a metropolitan hunter has 1 week or 2 per year available to hunting he need help from a prof that can bait or scout in advance from him to increase the probabilities to be successfull.
This will be my first year on a guided elk hunt. We have always done the backpack-in set up. I loved it and didnt think I would ever want to go on a guided hunt.
But the real reason I hunt now, my father,is getting old. He has a hard time walking the hills and sleeping on the ground. So the guide will take my father on hoarse back and I still get to walk around. We will get a bed to sleep in, and real food not the frezze dried. To me the money is not an option as long as I am with my father.
I agree it is Time, that's why ppl spend thousands of $$$$ on hunts.... There are some guides I would like to use, but don't have the money to pay and hunt with them. But You are right about DIY to save money or do more then one hunt for large amounts of money. It's the hunters that has to do what he/she can to get the game they are after.
I'm a big DIY guy but use guides as well. If you don't use a guide you wont be hunting Cananda.
That's why I don't hunt in Canada. I prefer to do it myself. It's not a money thing. For me, I get out of a hunt what I put into it.
Well, one would think that in a sport that seems to take pride in doing things "The Hard Way", guided hunts would not be the most popular way to go.
Of course, I say this as a total neophyte in the sport who has hunted little more than squirrels and the odd jelly donut.
There are lots of reasons, the average success rate for a nonresident archery elk hunter is like 6-7%, thats roughly a 1 in 15 chance, thats a lot of hunts with little success for most guys and with the drawing situation in many states, you won't get drawn that many times in a lifetime and the expense may end up way above that $5000, plus the time, how many guys can use several weeks of vacation just for elk every year? Also the drawing odds, it varies from state to state, but in some places the license is guaranteed or the odds are far better for the guided hunter. Also lots of out of state guys just don't know HOW to hunt elk or have the gear to do it with and if you do get an elk, you are not going to pack it far on your back, no matter how cool that sounds and paying someone hundreds or even more dollars to pack your elk out with horses, removes much of the money advantage that not having a guide with horses saved.
Its true that hunting isint all about killing the game, but man it sure feels good when you can.
The reasons are there, but I don't quite see nearly as many when you are talking about hunting whitetails.
I aint never done a guided hunt for anything yet, but I'd like to. I graduate from PT school next may and I plan booking myself a pronghorn hunt as a graduation present. I plan on spending an OBSCENE amount of scratch on this hunt. Its not that I want to spend that much just to go flinging arrows at an animal, but I just want to reward myself. I want to be catered to. I think thats whats the best thing about having to pay to hunt.
You wake up in the morning and this guide fella has breakfast made for you. Makes you lunch and dinner too, I hear. Shoot a pronghorn and he's the one who's up to his elbows in goat guts in 90 degree heat, while you are enjoying a YooHoo and a strawberry Moon Pie in the shade of the tailgate. And when your hunt is over, you don't have to break camp..you just leave.
I think it'd be nice to try it once at least.
Cam
I would tend to disagree with the idea that your not going to pack it far on your back. To date the shortest packout I've had is 8hrs. My last two elk I packed myself on my back the whole way. One took two full days and the other took every bid of one. Its one of the reasons I tell people to get in shape before they hunt elk.
MAP
When I finally go on an elk hunt it will be on private land with high elk numbers and little pressure. That will probably necessitate hiring a guide. If the above is available without a guide I'd be grateful for the info in a PM.
I say all that because I want the elk to act like elk. I want them to respond to calling. I am sure there are public places like that but in reality they take time/scouting/foreknowledge to find. I don't have that. I live in Delaware, get 3 weeks vacation a year and have no acquaintences in the west.
My dream is to call in and shoot at extremely close range a dominant bull. Complete with him screaming his head off and the flang flying, and the brush breaking...
Once again the best chance of that happening is by spending the money to hunt high pops of unpressured animals.
QuoteOriginally posted by gehrke145:
I'm a big DIY guy but use guides as well. If you don't use a guide you wont be hunting Cananda.
Or sheep, brown bears and goats in Alaska. Personally I would never hire a guide but I have the time too spend on scouting, what I lack is the funds. Most of the folks I know who hunt spend about twice as much on one hunt as I do on the entire season.
How do you find your hunting spots in Oregon if you don't mind me asking? Is it public land? I have relatives up there that I might have to go visit.
Each of us has a dream and each dream is obviously different. I myself would feel ten times as good killing a rag horn on my own, after working my butt off, than if I was handed a herd bull to shoot by someone else. Now... I didn't say I wouldn't shoot that herd bull !
I want to hunt a moose, in this lifetime, and that will probably mean a guided hunt in Canada or a trip to Alaska. Sometimes we do what we have to do.
ChuckC
I see both sides of the issue....I have been on guided/outfitted hunts and I have had very good success. That being said, I get more personal satisfaction out of deer hunting right here in Indiana. That is not to say that I didn't thoroughly enjoy hunting black bear and caribou in Canada.....I liked it alot! Time is the major factor for me. I do not have any vacation time or a paid vacation, so if I am not at work there is no money coming in. Not complaining, just a fact of life in my line of work. In my mind, for me to hunt elk for instance, I would need to research the area (via computer first), scout the area prior to the actual hunt and then allow myself adequate time (10-14 days) to hunt. I would be looking at a minimum of 3 weeks off of work. Understand that not only is the money a factor, but the work hours also come into play. I need to work a certain number of hours per year to maintain my pension credits and a certain number of hours per quarter to maintain my insurance. I am looking into outfitted versus guided hunts. I DON'T want someone to find, call in and gut and quarter my game for me. BUT for me to set aside a 2-3 week block of time per year to hunt elk, is not financially practical at this time. I have friends with different work situations that have hunted a particular area for several seasons. It took them at least a couple of years to get familiar with the area to where they were comfortable enough with the terrain and animals to start at least getting into game. Finding a buddy to hunt with that is familiar with the area/species you intend to hunt is obviously the way to go....hint to all you elk huntin' tradgangers! Hunt hard and hunt safe!>>>--------->Mike
My buddy spent $10,000 last year with a big name guide and didn't see an elk. It was late season, and they'd moved. He was stressed out, to say the least.
This year we're going to camp on public land in CO where the terrain isn't too steep, relax and do a little bowhunting- no pressure. If we get into elk or deer, it'll be a bonus. We will do it for a few hundred bucks each, and not kill ourselves trying to get our money's worth out of a high-priced package hunt. We have the gear, so it's just getting there and buying the licenses.
Enjoyment is the objective, whatever it takes to get there. We always have a good time when we're hunting together, as we have for the last 20 years.
I can tell that some of the guys who have never been on a guided hunt, think that it would be an easy thing. I can just about guarantee you that most guys that go on a real guided hunt, hunt far, far, FAR harder than they would have on their own. Some guy from the east at near sea level hunting with a guide often 20 years younger, who lives in or near the mountains and spends time up there year round. I know guys that considered filling the guides pack with rocks, just to slow him down a bit. I was on a guided goat hunt and it was the hardest day of my life, in a lot of hard days. Just because it is a guided hunt, dosn't mean you are guaranteed an animal or even a shot or that you won't earn it.
I don't have the time to go out to Colorado/ New Mexico or wherever on a scouting trip and then go out there again to hunt. I wish I did. For me it's worth it to have a guide because I've never been out there to hunt before. As far as the rest of it goes...you answered it for yourself...wht you consider to be huge sums of money may not be huge at all to someone else.
Hunting should never be about the money.
Hunting isn't about the money. Not sure where you are going? If I had the money I'd hunt alot more in alot of different places! :bigsmyl: If it comes down to an expensive trip or something for the family, the family always wins out....no contest! In the meantime, I wish it was October! Mike
Success isn't the goal of a hunt, but I can say that I have never layed down money for a hunt where I didn't learn something.
What else you gonna do with money, burn it? I think learning new things is a great way to spend your money.
Jeff is right. You can't take the money with you. My time is the one variable that I cannot put a price tag on. All you can ask for on a guided hunt is professional guides and opportunities at game. I've been on many guided trips. Some of my early guided trips were terrible and a waste of my money, but I did learn the lesson that you "do get what you pay for"...
I've seen game and country that most people will never see. Killing an animal is just "gravy".
I might have done more DIY trips but none of my buddies are as serious about chasing stuff with a bow as I am. After college and we all were moved for jobs/married ect... their hunting time and dollars seemed to dry up. I love to chase deer at home; but there is so much more to experience.
I spend the money to hunt animals that I can't hunt near home. Meeting the people and seeing other countries is worth every penny.
I myself agree with ChuckC, I would rather shoot a spike or raghorn or nothing doing it all myself than have someone else do it for me. Also, If you can plunk down 5 or 10 thousand for a hunt I don't think missing work unpaid should be a problem. I feel that the feeling you get doing it yourself, successful or not, is what it's all about.
Matt, I first decided on Oregon due to over the counter tags and cheaper price. Then found public lands available and number of tags in certain units. Then you can talk to DNR people. I hunt in the Starkey and Ukiah units. Not a lot of bowhunters plus deer coincides with elk if you buy that tag too. I have shot some smaller bulls and seen some big bulls. Decend sized muleys all over.
Rob
I am planning a DIY for elk in 2009, or 2010 depends on how the house buying thing goes this winter. LOL
I have no doubt it will be tough and odds are stacked against me, BUT I am probably one of the most stubborn folks you will ever meet, and my wife will confirm that statement. I have alot of experience backpacking none in the backcountry of those big mountains, so tough, yes. But I am in good shape, physically, I stay that way as a firefighter PTing every day, dont know about mentally, guess that stubborness will show through though.
I dont fault anyone going for a guided hunt, would if I could but that is way too expensive, and extra 3-4 grand over DIY.
My worry is this though, I run an at least 10-12 miles a week, (know guys that do that a day!, not me)but then this is in the flatland of NC. The thin air of the mountains will take some acclimation I think. Planning on getting out there a few days early to hang out before going in.
Anyway as usual it boils doen to each his own.
J
I learned more from one good elk guide than 3 years of diy. Now my diy for elk is more successful.
When I want to learn something, I tend to seek out people who can teach me.
I could have spent a weekend here and a weekend there traveling south for years to gain half the knowledge about hunting wild hogs I gained in three days of learning from Curtis Kellar.
Two years ago I spent a couple weeks learning about moose hunting with a guide in northwest Ontario. Yes, I ended up killing a bull. But long after the meat is gone and antlers are faded, I'll still have the education I gained that late September.
Why is it OK to ask a farmer for advice about the animals on his farm, or listen to a friend when hunting his land, but it's somehow looked down upon to hire a guide? The end results are the same with respect to "do it yourself".
Does the taboo come into play when money changes hands? My college education wasn't free either.
If we're discussing the type of guided hunt where the guide is really a babysitter who says "sit here, shoot that", then all I can say is I prefer not to hunt that way. When I go on a guided hunt, the first and foremost thing the guide needs to be is a teacher. I'm there to learn more than I'm there to kill. If that loses me some points in the DIY department, I'm OK with that.
I just wanna say I have nothing against a guided hunt. If that floats your boat, go for it. If I made more money I would definantly do a guided. Can I learn from a guide, yep. But can I push myself hard and get on critters no matter where I am, yep. Will I make mistakes?, yep. All part of it.
Like I say I would do a guided and have no regrets, period. Deputy Fire Chief salary dictates I DIY. :D
Tenacity accounts for alot, "Always be stubborn", a U.S. Marine taught me that.
Happy hunting no matter how you do it :archer:
J
My first hunts out west were guided, and we had a ball! Killed a few hairy beasts, too. Now that I know how, the only downsides to DIY are not having someone to come in to the cabin tent before daylight and light the stove and the lantern, and not having a hot breakfast ready, and not having a hot supper when we came in, and not having to make a pack lunch, and not having to do dishes, and not having to pack out the game alone, and... you get the picture.
After I got to know that corner of Colorado pretty well, and the guide and I became good friends, I helped him guide some. It's no picnic for them, lots of work, and clients can be unbelievably crude or drunks or slobs. He let me hunt for free in return for helping him with the hunters. A good deal for both of us, and it was about as much fun for me to take someone out and help them get on game as it was to hunt, when they were decent folks.
Just can't take them mountains around Telluride no more- we will hunt the plateau this year.
I also don't buy the argument that someone who can lay down the cash for a hunt can also afford to take unpaid time from work...some people are willing to work overtime and sacrifice in other areas in order to spend their precious time doing something that they can't do in their backyard...and I admire the ambition to do that.
some people's boats float in different waters; there's guys who would RATHER spend time in the back forty hunting deer that they see all year and become familiar with. Others have the desire to become a proficient hunter of, say, elk...even though they don't live in elk country. Still others want the opportunity to see all they can in their alloted time on earth....
There's plenty of options for everyone.
QuoteOriginally posted by Buckeye Trad Hunter:
Hunting should never be about the money.
I agree. It shouldn't but it is. All the DWF's are about money, the hunting shows,etc...
This is part of the reason I am glad I started to shoot traditional archery. I was getting tiered of the people that had to buy a $800-$100 bow every year and all the hoopla around them like they had some great revolution in technology.
To the OP, Time is money. If you don't have alot of time, you better have some money to hunt.
The fact is that the success rate for a first time unguided elk bowhunter from the east is in the 1-2% range, being in shape and willing to make the hard effort helps, but thats where the 2% comes in. A guide is no guaranttee, but raises the odds 10 or 20 times, my recommendation is to get a good guide the first time and learn all you can. If you go a few times it will be the cheapest money you ever spent!
Rick, Statistics are the third biggest lie! pay em no attention!! LOL.
I am hard headed as I can be, my wife will verify that. For me it is not about spending the money as I would if I had it to spend. But by the time that comes I will be too old to even follow a guide. At 35 I am pretty well good to go, least in this NC flat land, physically I will be ready.
Past that it is a mental mind game, just like any tough situation a man cares to throw himslef into.
Hunt hard yall,
J
I guess if killing is why you are out there then a guide will help up the odds. I myself don;'t care if I kill or not. It's the experience that I want to savor.
leatherneck, most of us don't think killing is necessary to have a successful hunt, but if you have almost no chance at killing, you aren't really hunting, you are just hiking with a bow and many of the experiences involve at least the possibility of getting a shot.
I just love hunting, and the new friendships that are formed every time I hunt with new folks. I have hunted all over the world both DIY and guided. As long as you get hunting thats all that's important. Other obligations such as jobs and families come first and dictate what $$$ some have for hunting. As Mr. Struberg said earlier YOU CAN'T TAKE IT WITH YOU. I've watched way too many a close friend work their a$$es off saving for retirement only to drop dead or become stricken with some illness that does not allow them to do all they planned. LIFE IS SHORT - GO HUNTING!
All great points yall, Rick I hunt many many days that I dont see a thing, sometimes wonder if I am in the same zip code as a deer or bear. Still hunting I just not doing any good! I must hike alot and never known it.
Yeah I agree you cant take it with you but if something happens to me before retirement My wife and daughter will need every penny I busted my butt and saved all these years, and all the life insurance I have. Antlers on a wall wont do them any good.
I think what you guys speak of now is just a reality that some have enough money to go around the world and hunt. Some have jobs that will regulate they stay in their back yard, still others can save a bit and do a hunt or two guided or not. Nothing wrong with any situation mentioned you just have to prioritize what is important to you and live within your particular means. Hunt it there said it best.
I have always been a meat hunter, and when I go out west I will try and get into a unit that any bull or cow is legal, or have tags as such. Whatver the law is. Up the odds/statistics that much more.
Later yall,
J
Hard to find an excuse for not being in shape to hunt. You gotta practice shooting, so why avoid hiking and camping?
If I want an easy stroll and a guarantee to see big game, I can spend an afternoon at the National Zoo. Instead I find more fun hiking the woods and marveling at the ability of whitetails to detect and avoid my bow range. Most of the ones I see, however, would be easy kills with a rifle.
Trad shooting takes a lot of preparation. If I was looking for a sure thing, I would never have picked up a recurve. That being said, if you really have to max out the Mastercard to ease your hunting jones, go for it.
A friend of mine spent a few hundred dollars on a one-day-guided steelhead fishing trip. He said he learned more in that half-day about flyfishing, reading water, and catching fish than he could have learned in a year of weekends trying to figure it out for himself. Now it costs almost that much just to drive to that river one time, so he saved in the long run.
Rick,
I just said that a guide will help UP the odds for those who wish. I don't consider a DIY hunt just walking through the woods with my bow. I would not hunt if I did not feel I had a chance to harvest the animal that I'm hunting. I just feel that I don't HAVE to kill to have a good time and enjoy the hunt. Guides are not a bad thing nor was I stating this. I just think some people would rather a guide put them in front of the animal instead of them trying to hunt it themselves. To each his own.
Mike
Wow this thread is crazy! I cant believe how many anti guide guys are on here. I guided for a few years and met alot of great people. A guided hunt teaches you alot, and just helps you narrow down the area for game and learn how to hunt a new animal (well thats how I look at it).
Anyone ever think about picking up a book? The most positive things I've heard about guided hunts is how much you can learn. Don't get me wrong I know there are things you can't learn without experiencing them, but there's a lot you can learn from reading as well. Guided or not to each his own but you can learn from books.
You macho chest beaters out there just need a few more years packing out your elk. :-)
At 53, I have no problem tipping a guy $300 to pack mine out while I drink a coffee.
I work my A&& of 48 weeks a year to fund my passion most of them 65 hour weeks. I've done enough setting up and taking down camp and packing out meat that time is more valuable to me now than money. When I take a week off and drive to camp, I'd just as soon it be set-up, the wood cut and stacked and the cook already in the cook tent.
Some guys enjoy the camping part and that's fine. Again I used to do all of that too and still do on occasion.
When I was younger I shared many of your opinions that if I couldn't do it myself I wouldn't be going. I not only couldn't afford a guide but I thought in some way if I didn't do it myself it would some way diminish the satisfaction I would get from the hunt. I went on my first DIY western hunt in 1975 and many more over the next twenty years. I didn't go on my first guided hunt until my two daughters were older and I thought I could afford it.
Going on guided hunts has expanded my horizons. It has allowed me to hunt different species of animals in places I have only dreamed about in the past. If it weren't for guides and outfitters I would still be dreaming and never had the experience of going to those places and hunting other game.
Well Biggie....you don't work it completely off 8^). I have nothing against guided hunts....just not canned hunts.
Any guided hunts I have been on the guide is always 20-30 years younger than I am, has a stride that is 50% longer than mine, willing to hike another 3 miles to another area and seemingly oblivious to the fact that wherever we walk to, we will be walking back!
Always pushing-one guide made me take my boots off so I could put the stalk on a resting hog!! And guess what? I got close enough-his job; and missed-my job! LOL!!
It is a love-hate experience for sure.
A good guide works his tail off-and yours-in an effort to give you value and a memorable hunt.
Just be sure you get a good guide and you will have your money's worth
Never been on a guided or canned hunt but I don't see anything wrong with either one. Its your time and your money use it how you please.
Guided hunts are relativly new to the Aussie hunting scene . I have bowhunted since the late 70's when game and access was plentifull and cost no more than a days works or a reef fish .
I have never paid for guide simply as these hunts are out of my price range .I hunt a property 5 hours from home that charges $25.00 per night to hunt there .
My more financial mates have hunted the same area's I hunt in years past with moderate success but now pay big dollars to hunt in area's that support large accesable populations of game , they pay for opportunities .
All of a sudden they are shooting excellant trophy's and meat animals are usually thrown in the package .
Its a sign of the times that wealth pays a part in hunting success from a trophy point of veiw here in Australia .
When the kids are raised I plan on treating myself to a guided hunt or 2 .
regards Jacko
Yeah I will take smoe guided trips too, like Jacko said when the kids are raised or I get as old as Biggie I will go guided. Just now it is not possible and I cannot wait! But yeah when I get a little more settled ad the kids get out I will treat myself.
Yall be good
J
Jason Westbrook and Biggie said it all. I used a guide my first elk hunt. I didnt know squat about it when I went...and wanted to learn. Ive been several times since...and was into bulls, big bulls, all the time I was there...thanks to what I learned from Jeff and Ice.
I have guys come down to pig hunt who've never been around them..but in 2 and 1/2 days they know enough to chase them somewhere on public ground and have a fighting chance to kill one.
Walking with weapons is NOT my idea of an effective way to spend my vacations- I do it sometimes, due to circumstances beyond my control, but you guys that are thinking guided hunts are somehow a cake walk are talking out of your axx...you haven't been on one but you have an opinion. Based on WHAT????
It's like a librarian telling you a book is no good, but she hasn't read it.
No one said "CANNED HUNT BEHIND A FENCE" they said guided hunt. My one week trips are for hunting...I cook at home, a lot, I cook in camp for others who come hog hunting..I don't want to come in at Oh-Dark thirty and have to fix supper on a coleman stove and crawl in teh sack at 130 am to get up at 430 to start all over again..I want to H U N T, and hunt HARD!!!!!!!!!!!!
Every guide I've ever hunted with has been like a buddy to me...and paying him for his expertise and hard work- setting up camp ahead of my arrival, doing a little leg work before I get there to narrow down where the game might be, is worth every penny.
Half the GUIDED HUNTS I've been on resulted in no animal taken....but they were great trips. It's difficult with my schedule and limited draw tags to get two, three or four guys to all draw, and all have the same week off to go out west and hunt together if we wanted to do it.
I find myself most often in camp with total strangers, who later become my friends. And I am grateful for that.
If you wanna be macho man, be macho man. Just don't tell other guys its not "good enough" or "trad enough" if they don't go on their own on every hunt.
If they had elk in Georgia, and mountain goat, and caribou, I would be able to spend the time and learn how to hunt them on my own. Unfortunately, the last elk was killed by "do it yourself" hunters 200 years ago and danged if I dont have to drive to New Mexico to chase em.
Ray, you've just told this here "macho man" ( me ) to take a chill pill and enjoy life, thank you. I've noticed you always come from behind for a sweep on sensitive issues like this one on tradgang and tell it like it is. I love you and your great common sense for that. Very few people have the gift to explain things the way they are, for everyone to understand. Thanks man!
Alex
cool :archer:
I cannot imagine someone telling me when to shoot; what to shoot at- I could not stand that.
But that is less likely for bowhunters; and less likely than me: ever having the money for a guided hunt.
Its a matter in great part that concerns opprotunity. If you had the money; had the time; and had to have a guide- would you? If you don't have the money- like me- its an easy decision.
-----------------------------------
"Guide? - I don't need no stinkin guide!"
........(Amelia Earhart)........
Brian, I've been on dozens of guided hunts and only once have I had the guide tell me when to shoot. I told him to sit down and stay put.
As Ray said, most become friends and are just along for the hunt. They may make suggestions on the trophy quality of an animal, if that's important to you but it's your hunt and 99% of the guides know and respect that.
Like I said, if you haven't been on one, how can you form an opinion?
My kids when they were little used to look at new food and say "yuck, I don't want any".Then they'd be forced to try it, and we'd hear "can I have some more please?"
As far as not being able to afford it, I believe if ANY of you analyzed your finances you could find a way to go on a guided, or semi-guided hunt within a year or two.
Give up the beer or smokes, cut down trees for folks and sell the firewood, get a second job and sock the money away, don't bet on fantasy football, go on a cheaper vacation, are some ideas. I bet you can think of others.
This isn't about "stealing" from your family. You are a person just like your wife/husband and your children. Sacrificing your entire existence for the benefit of everyone else is noble, but I think destructive behavior.
You have batteries that need recharging- your spirit needs revitalization- to help you work better, feel better, and be a better husband/wife and father/mother- living longer for them as well.
Use American Express instead of cash to buy gas, food, and entertainment and pay the bill off at the end of the month. Earn SKY MILES and fly for free essentially. I have enough miles to buy four round trip tickets right now.
Nobody tells me when to shoot, ever. I've never heard of anyone being told to shoot. As Biggie says, I've heard stuff about trophy quality but the choice is yours- its your hunt.
Alex B, wazzzzzup?
WOW! I see some that have taken offense to something in this thread. I'm not sure who's post was pounding on there chest, acting like a macho man, etc. I must have missed those. I have been on several guided hunts and have enjoyed all but one. ( the guide used us as his moose pushers as we were bear hunting)Have made several good friends along the way. My previous statements just stated that I enjoy trying things on my own. I'm going on my first elk hunt in a month. Although this is a DIY hunt, I've used the resources as elknut videos, primos videos,friends who have hunted the area, etc. to help educate me on this hunt. I'm only 39 years young and maybe when I'm older I might want someone to cook my food, clean my game, and haul out my meat. But for now I want to still do this on my own. I hunt very hard on any hunt I'm on. I've also ate tag soup more than I've filled my tag. But thats how I wish to hunt. Will I use a guide again, sure I will. But there is still nothing wrong with a DIY hunt. It's not chest beating, it's not macho, it's fun! Isn't that what hunting is about? Good luck all on whatever hunt you decide to go on.
BTW- I have a phone number of a guy that will pack out an elk if I shoot one. I guess he is considered a guide of sorts. I may be only 39 but I ain't dumb. I've put too many miles on these boots with a pack on my back to be stupid. Later.
Mike
Nevermind, I see nothing wrong with a guide I just care to go on my own. Whatever floats your boat.
I do not believe I need a guide to hunt hard - the kill is not everything - though I want to kill everytime I am out. Do not believe if I do not kill I was just walking in the woods - I hunted hard and got skunked. Lastly thinking of family first is far from destructive behavior.
Yeah I agree w/Ray and Biggie no one tells me when to shoot, or what to shoot. Never heard of a guide doing that? He might suggest you wait for something bigger, or that a animal is legal or not - per local regs and stuff. But to shoot or not is totally your choice.
J
I base my opinions on the fact I have been on guided hunts.
Brian, I have guided lots of hunters, some very experienced, some almost their first time and I don't ever remember telling one what to shoot or when not to shoot. I have told a few to "shoot again" to keep a wounded animal from escaping or as insurance to keep US from getting killed. I also have suggested to hunters that a particular animal would be a good one to shoot at, since most of them just don't have enough experience to make that call. One of the hunting experiences I will never forget was Ryan Rothaar and his water buffalo, we made a nearly impossible stalk and when it looked like we might get a chance, I just told him, "you are experienced and know what to do, when I say get ready, take the shot anytime it feels right" and he did.
Everytime this topic comes up, it comes down to two sides, the ones who have never been on a real guided hunt and suggest that they just show up and a guide leads them over to an animal and says, "shoot that one" and then the hunter goes back to camp and breaks out the "good stuff", while the guide does the work. Well I am sure if you have enough money and I am NOT talking about the 5 or 6K hunts, you probably can find hunts like that, but I can tell you, some of the HARDEST physical hunts I have ever been on and the single hardest physically day of my LIFE were on guided hunts. I have nothing against anyone making their own choices on how they spend their money and I have never been on a guided elk hunt myself, I have been on several, diy and outfitted, but unguided hunts and I know what an unguided trad hunter, who has never hunted elk or in the mountains is up against. I know a group of guys, six or eight of them, from the midwest who went out to hunt elk every year for five or six years, these guys had killed 100reds of whitetails collectively and in all those years, they killed ONE elk, a spike bull and that was pure luck on a shot, that never should have been taken. After all that time they decided to go on a guided hunt and started to kill some elk, would they have done better to go on a guided hunt the first year, instead of going on the cheap and then doing it by themselves? I have no doubts. EVERYTIME I go on an elk hunt, by the last day of a one week hunt, I'm the only one still there, all those guys that were so fired up the day before the season are burned out and depressed after three or fours days of not seeing or getting close to elk, at least if they had a guide, ego alone would force them up the mountain another day or two.
Well said Rick, your points are valid. An dmaybe next year I'll say, man I need a guide for these critters. But for now, I'd really like to experience it for myself. Tag soup or not. Thanks for the input.
Mike
My mates have told me they where paying for opportunities to hunt quality game . I should have qualified it with they all said opportunities came as a result of the guides experience as well .
regards Jacko
I agree with all that has been said, Biggie, Rick, Ray, Leatherneck. all great points. But I agree with Mike in saying I may come back and say, Yeah I need a guide to do better. But being my hard headed self I want to go at ot by myself first.
Jason Baker