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Main Boards => PowWow => Topic started by: Richmeister on August 26, 2022, 08:06:51 PM

Title: Anybody using stone points on deer
Post by: Richmeister on August 26, 2022, 08:06:51 PM

I'd like to try a couple next year as well as a self bow. Wondering who has done this and how you attatch the stone point to the arrow.

Title: Re: Anybody using stone points on deer
Post by: tippit on August 26, 2022, 09:56:12 PM

I've shot a couple black bear with sone points and my Osage selfbows...tippit
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Title: Re: Anybody using stone points on deer
Post by: Wile E. Coyote on August 27, 2022, 09:12:46 AM

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I created a slot in the arrow shaft with hacksaw blade and dremel, then attached the point with artificial sinew.

Title: Re: Anybody using stone points on deer
Post by: tippit on August 27, 2022, 09:58:00 PM

I also use my own forged broadheads as I enjoy making & using my own gear...tippit
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Title: Re: Anybody using stone points on deer
Post by: Onehair on August 28, 2022, 08:42:37 AM

I am working on it now. I have a half dozen river cane arrows ready and working on the heads. I’m not sure if it’s going to be from now on but for at least a couple early does.

Title: Re: Anybody using stone points on deer
Post by: Sam McMichael on August 28, 2022, 08:49:16 AM

I plan to try them again. I have carried them afield several times but have not gotten a shot opportunity.

Title: Re: Anybody using stone points on deer
Post by: flntknp17 on August 28, 2022, 12:56:59 PM

I've shot a few deer with stone points over the years.  I've honestly never noticed a difference on an animal between a properly sharpened stone point and a properly sharpened steel point....which shouldn't be surprising since the stone points fed people for tens of thousands of years before we invented metal.  My one caution would be that people make a real effort to learn how to PROPERLY sharpen a stone point.  I have been playing with flintknapping since the late 80s and I still need to concentrate and make sure my technique is good when I am putting a hunting edge on a point; remember, it won't feel like a steel edge because it works a little differently, but its just as deadly.  I also would caution folks on obsidian....yes, it is absolutely easier to make a decent point and it is easy to sharpen, but that also means it is easy to break.  Get some good chert and you'll be happier and the heads will be tougher for sure. 

I slot a wood shaft perpendicular to the grain in the same way you would for a self nock.  I always encourage people to use real sinew rather than the artificial sinew.  Artificial sinew will certainly work, but it is made from nylon and it stretches significantly.  Real sinew, applied wet and then allowed to dry will shrink and bind the head TIGHT.  Also, make sure you have a smooth transition to the shaft and also don't skimp on the sinew.  I see a lot of heads that don't have sufficient sinew to prevent the shaft from splitting if you hit something hard.  Also, remember that if a stone head breaks inside the animal, it will by definition reveal a new razor sharp edge and will continue cutting. 

The point on the left has passed through two deer and is ready for a third.

Title: Re: Anybody using stone points on deer
Post by: pintail_drake2004 on August 28, 2022, 01:44:33 PM

I slot the shaft, and epoxy them in. I then wrap with artificial sinew.

this is the style of point I prefer. Shot 1 deer, and lots of squirrels, rabbits, and coons with them.

Title: Re: Anybody using stone points on deer
Post by: Richmeister on August 28, 2022, 02:29:27 PM

I'm wondering when choosing a stone point...does the 3 : 1 taper ratio make sense to choose a long tapering point for better penetration...?
A couple posts back mentioned there wasnt a noticeable difference between stone and steel performance.

Title: Re: Anybody using stone points on deer
Post by: SlowTurtle on August 28, 2022, 02:52:27 PM

Quote from: Richmeister on August 28, 2022, 02:29:27 PM

I'm wondering when choosing a stone point...does the 3 : 1 taper ratio make sense to choose a long tapering point for better penetration...?
A couple posts back mentioned there wasnt a noticeable difference between stone and steel performance.

All I know to answer is ‘I don’t believe so’. Some of the small Native American points that have been called bird points have been found to have deer blood on them. It seems to hinde on the old saying of having sharp points and arrow placement.

Title: Re: Anybody using stone points on deer
Post by: flntknp17 on August 28, 2022, 09:29:14 PM

Quote from: Richmeister on August 28, 2022, 02:29:27 PM

I'm wondering when choosing a stone point...does the 3 : 1 taper ratio make sense to choose a long tapering point for better penetration...?
A couple posts back mentioned there wasnt a noticeable difference between stone and steel performance.

I would say that a sharp point of appropriate width is most important (and a well-tuned arrow that is flying straight).  If you look at the archaeological record, you will see very few arrow points that are 3:1, or really even close to it.  I suspect that is for durability because stone isn't flexible like steel and it would be significantly less durable.  Honestly, the "true" arrowpoints that we find from the Woodland time period are often maybe 1.5:1 and are 5/8" to 3/4" wide.  They are MUCH smaller than we hunt with nowadays.  I suspect they favored penetration and an exit hole over wide cut.

Matt

Title: Re: Anybody using stone points on deer
Post by: Killdeer on August 31, 2022, 10:15:46 PM

I don’t think I could drag a deer any more. But here are points made for me by Steve Allely. I like the angle, and the leaf shape.

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Title: Re: Anybody using stone points on deer
Post by: Pat B on September 01, 2022, 10:30:28 AM

That's a nice collection of Steve Allely knapped points, Killie.  :thumbsup:

Title: Re: Anybody using stone points on deer
Post by: Richmeister on September 01, 2022, 03:59:37 PM

The primitive bug bites pretty hard. I'm going to give it a go with  "attempting"   to knap out my own point.
I have a few wood shafts and a fist full of turkey feathers.  Had to order some deer sinew.

Do you folks recommend a pitch adhesive as well as binding with the sinew...? I probably wont hunt with it this season but for sure next season if Father time Grant's me another season...

Title: Re: Anybody using stone points on deer
Post by: arrow30 on September 01, 2022, 05:03:32 PM

i have everything i need , its just a matter of taking it out and using it. i made everything myself. except the string. maybe this will be the year i get it out to use.
(https://i.imgur.com/127CJj4.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/iL0WNOt.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/LXwEKp2.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/NLBswRc.jpg)

Title: Re: Anybody using stone points on deer
Post by: Pat B on September 01, 2022, 05:56:05 PM

Richmeister, I always use pitch glue when hafting points. If the point comes loose from the glue a slight bit of heat will soften the pitch glue so the point can be reset. I prefer real sinew because it shrinks as it dries holding the stone point tightly and keeps the shaft from splitting if you hit bone. Artificial sinew has a tendency to stretch and loosed over time and once the wax wears off it begins to fray. I also use pitch varnish(hard, brittle pitch dissolved in alcohol) to seal and waterproof the sinew wrap.
(https://i.imgur.com/HM0RYpR.jpg)

Title: Re: Anybody using stone points on deer
Post by: Richmeister on September 01, 2022, 09:20:13 PM

I appreciate your advise Pat, I'm going to do Alot of research from here on ... hopefully all of you helpful  folks dont mind if I still ask questions here and there. Its going to be a fun new adventure ... it kind of reminds me when I first had interest in archery when I was about 4 or 5...
   

Title: Re: Anybody using stone points on deer
Post by: PrimitivePete on September 06, 2022, 05:28:43 PM

Dang I love this thread !!!!