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Main Boards => The Bowyer's Bench => Topic started by: Pompano Joe on August 31, 2021, 08:54:32 AM

Title: Question about steam bending for an apprentice bowyer
Post by: Pompano Joe on August 31, 2021, 08:54:32 AM: Just curious, I’m in the tillering process and am still considering adding more reflex deflex to the bow(red oak self/board bow). Can this be done after it’s been tillered ? Or has too much wood been removed from the limbs?

Also, how long do you steam the wood before bending? I’ve rigged up a large piece of pvc pipe that is taped off on both ends(after the bow is placed inside) and will stick the hose coming from a 67$ steam machine I got from Amazon

Thanks in advance,

Danny
Title: Re: Question about steam bending for an apprentice bowyer
Post by: Pat B on August 31, 2021, 09:31:45 AM: Yes, you can steam after tillering. I would suggest one limb at a time. You won't have enough time from the steam chamber to the caul before the wood cools to much to alter. Also, depending on what glue you used for the riser steam and the heat associated with it can cause a glue failure at the handle riser...and tip overlays if the same glue was used.
For a little bit of reflex dry heat might work and would be easier to control.
Can we see an unbraced pic too?
Title: Re: Question about steam bending for an apprentice bowyer
Post by: Pompano Joe on August 31, 2021, 09:49:31 AM: I appreciate the info. Man I never even would’ve thought about the glue melting under steam. I used tightbond 3. Would be cool to find out if steam, etc would weaken it. I’ll try and get some pics of it unbraced
Title: Re: Question about steam bending for an apprentice bowyer
Post by: Roy from Pa on August 31, 2021, 10:21:39 AM: Titebond glue releases at 135 degrees.
Title: Re: Question about steam bending for an apprentice bowyer
Post by: KenH on August 31, 2021, 10:40:32 AM: Yep Titebond probably gonna come un-stuck if you steam that bow. Heat gun will probably be better, unless you can figure a way to only steam the limbs and not the handle.
Title: Re: Question about steam bending for an apprentice bowyer
Post by: Roy from Pa on August 31, 2021, 10:43:16 AM: I would leave it as is and make another one.

Chalk it up as a learning experience...
Title: Re: Question about steam bending for an apprentice bowyer
Post by: Mad Max on August 31, 2021, 11:26:36 AM: X2
Title: Re: Question about steam bending for an apprentice bowyer
Post by: Pat B on August 31, 2021, 11:30:37 AM: What Roy said. :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Question about steam bending for an apprentice bowyer
Post by: Flem on August 31, 2021, 01:41:55 PM: You could always steam the bow as you would like to and then glue the handle back on. It does not look like it is sculpted into the bow, so who cares if it comes off? I would continue tillering, steam it and re-glue the handle with some epoxy.
Title: Re: Question about steam bending for an apprentice bowyer
Post by: Roy from Pa on August 31, 2021, 02:51:01 PM: Not sure what you are looking for as far as the shape of the bow.

But in this picture all the bend now is happening just outside the ends of the riser and the rest of the limbs are flat.

The limbs look very thick also, how thick are they?

You want those outer limbs bending in a nice even arc "first", then work your way back into the end of the riser section with a very slight arc there. If the limbs bend too much into the riser, the riser will pop off.

And if the riser pops off, the bow could break there.
Title: Re: Question about steam bending for an apprentice bowyer
Post by: Roy from Pa on August 31, 2021, 02:56:40 PM: This the arc you want to shoot for.

Also is the bow sitting level in the tree cradle?

When I put a bow on the tree, I level the bow so the limb tips are level before ever pulling it.
Title: Re: Question about steam bending for an apprentice bowyer
Post by: Mad Max on August 31, 2021, 04:45:36 PM: Long strings lie
Long string to me means as short as you can get it.
Make it Nock to Nock long :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Question about steam bending for an apprentice bowyer
Post by: Roy from Pa on August 31, 2021, 04:49:17 PM: Good point Mark, I forgot to mention that.
Title: Re: Question about steam bending for an apprentice bowyer
Post by: Mad Max on August 31, 2021, 07:43:28 PM: :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Question about steam bending for an apprentice bowyer
Post by: Pompano Joe on September 01, 2021, 03:35:25 PM: Thanks all for the info. A lot of great help on here for a newbie like me. So I steamed it and learned a pretty good lesson. The rawhide backing pealed up and needs to be removed. The handle and tip overlays are still in tact and the bow is now in the shaping jig.
Title: Re: Question about steam bending for an apprentice bowyer
Post by: KenH on September 01, 2021, 06:17:10 PM: Yep. Backing should not have been on during tillering IMHO. It does not affect the bending of the limbs. That kind of backing -- rawhide, silk, snakeskin etc is primarily cosmetic and secondarily a preventer of splinters arising. Has nothing to do with the draw weight/power of the bow.
Title: Re: Question about steam bending for an apprentice bowyer
Post by: Flem on September 01, 2021, 07:03:22 PM: You forgot to tell us that you glued rawhide onto it! That would have been good to know before giving any advice. In fact that was probably the most critical bit of information regarding whether or not to steam that you could have shared.
Title: Re: Question about steam bending for an apprentice bowyer
Post by: Pat B on September 01, 2021, 10:18:28 PM: Yeah, that would have been nice to know. You can clean up the rawhide and use it again.
Title: Re: Question about steam bending for an apprentice bowyer
Post by: Pompano Joe on September 02, 2021, 07:42:17 AM: Lesson learned. Many thanks
Title: Re: Question about steam bending for an apprentice bowyer
Post by: Eric Krewson on September 02, 2021, 10:47:40 AM: Make a tillering gizmo if you don't already have one.
Title: Re: Question about steam bending for an apprentice bowyer
Post by: Roy from Pa on September 02, 2021, 11:03:47 AM: Tillering Gizmo link

https://www.tradgang.com/tgsmf/index.php?topic=108906.0
Title: Re: Question about steam bending for an apprentice bowyer
Post by: Pompano Joe on September 02, 2021, 11:32:39 AM: Quote from: Eric Krewson on September 02, 2021, 10:47:40 AM
Make a tillering gizmo if you don't already have one.

I have been considering this ever since I saw Kramer Ammons use one in one of his vids. Many thanks
Title: Re: Question about steam bending for an apprentice bowyer
Post by: Eric Krewson on September 02, 2021, 02:32:09 PM: Kramer uses it wrong in his video, I put a message to him in the comments but last time I looked he hadn't responded to my suggestion.

Follow the instructions in the link that Roy provided, if you have an questions I would be glad to answer them for you.