Post by: Roy from Pa on January 22, 2021, 05:06:36 AM
He said they are wavy not perfectly flat.
He has seen my videos of me running lams through and he has a grizzly sander like mine.
I gave him some suggestions and I'm seeking you guys input.
Post by: Bowjunkie on January 22, 2021, 05:38:09 AM
This is going to be hard to troubleshoot without more info, and without actually being there to inspect his machine and see how he's doing it. There are just so many variables.
I'd check to make sure nothing came loose, all bearings and bushings are good, check feed rate and the amount of material he's trying to remove. He might just have to slow the feed rate and take less material off each pass. What grit paper is he using?
Also make sure the lam isn't slipping on the sled, the sled isn't slipping on the feed belt, the feed belt isn't slipping on its drive roller, and the drum drive belt isn't slipping on a pulley, etc... could be lots of things bud. I'm just throwing some things out there, I've never had wavy lams, but my machine is a little different than yours too so, maybe some of this doesn't apply, but those are the sort of things I'd be looking at first.
Post by: Roy from Pa on January 22, 2021, 05:50:41 AM
I'll have him jump in here.
Not sure about your first question of if he did get good lams.
I don't think he has gotten good lams.
He sent me a pm late last night and I told him to check a lot of things you listed.
Post by: Bowjunkie on January 22, 2021, 06:00:22 AM
Post by: mmattockx on January 22, 2021, 10:28:21 AM
Mark
Post by: Roy from Pa on January 22, 2021, 10:37:51 AM
Post by: Flem on January 22, 2021, 10:41:18 AM
Post by: mmattockx on January 22, 2021, 11:01:46 AM
Both and sled is flat.
Hmmm. How bad is the waviness in terms of measured thickness?
Mark
Post by: kennym on January 22, 2021, 11:58:08 AM
Post by: Shredd on January 22, 2021, 12:08:54 PM
If there is lots of short waves the drum might not be rolling true... Check as flem said...
The Junk man had lots of good suggestions...
Post by: Shredd on January 22, 2021, 12:21:16 PM
Post by: Roy from Pa on January 22, 2021, 12:23:43 PM
They had to take him in an ambulance for lung problems last night.
So we will have to wait till he gets home, thanks guy's.
Post by: kennym on January 22, 2021, 12:46:37 PM
Post by: Shredd on January 22, 2021, 03:39:09 PM
Post by: Crooked Stic on January 22, 2021, 04:33:12 PM
Post by: Roy from Pa on January 22, 2021, 04:33:57 PM
Post by: deercraver on January 22, 2021, 07:38:57 PM
this is what is going on we have a brand new grizzly drum sander we will cut lams at 0.200 then run them thought the sander fast slow very small bites where it does not make any sound change a little bigger bites. the target let say is .125 it will be .125 then 4 inches down it may be .133........0.136..0.129 and so on some times i can get them perfect but i have to run the lam through 150 times.i have removed the velcro from the drum and taping on my paper..
Post by: deercraver on January 22, 2021, 07:40:26 PM
thanks for the concern i will pass it on..
Post by: Mad Max on January 22, 2021, 07:45:34 PM
measure it at 10" and 20" and see if it's good or every inch from 10-20
Post by: deercraver on January 22, 2021, 07:48:56 PM
Post by: kennym on January 22, 2021, 08:07:08 PM
If your paper is wound tight without the velcro, it should be closer. May have a bent shaft somewhere, I would suspect the conveyor first since it moves slowly and the sanding drum is fast.
Post by: Crooked Stic on January 22, 2021, 09:17:10 PM
Post by: Mad Max on January 22, 2021, 09:32:56 PM
Post by: Flem on January 22, 2021, 10:19:26 PM
Post by: deercraver on January 22, 2021, 10:21:49 PM
Kenny m this is Jason from mi got my order thank you for the quick service...
Post by: Mad Max on January 23, 2021, 12:14:13 AM
You should not be troubleshooting a new machine from Grizzly. Get a return voucher, send that P.O.S. back and get a new one.
Yep
Post by: Roy from Pa on January 23, 2021, 04:30:12 AM
I agree with calling grizzly
Hope your dad makes out well and they release him soon.
Tell him I said hello.
Post by: kennym on January 23, 2021, 08:14:36 AM
Post by: Roy from Pa on January 23, 2021, 08:37:14 AM
Just sayen:)
Post by: kennym on January 23, 2021, 08:58:16 AM
Post by: Roy from Pa on January 23, 2021, 09:03:11 AM
Post by: stack on January 23, 2021, 03:56:45 PM
Post by: kennym on January 23, 2021, 04:06:27 PM
Post by: Roy from Pa on January 23, 2021, 04:09:58 PM
About the sanding dust, there are some woods that bother me when sanding.
Maybe that's what happened to you.
I now wear a facemask when around fine sawdust.
Post by: stack on January 23, 2021, 04:32:36 PM
Post by: Roy from Pa on January 23, 2021, 05:32:32 PM
Bamboo is nasty to me so I mask up and wear goggles when running boo through the drum sander.
Maybe because I've done so much boo.
IPE gave me a severe reaction years ago and messed up my immune system.
Post by: wood carver 2 on January 23, 2021, 06:05:42 PM
For me it was pau ferro. I built two bows with it and I noticed that it made me itch. Now I find that I’ll sneeze quite a bit after sanding. Sometimes hours later I’m still sneezing my head off. I used to be covered from head to toe in wood dust with no ill effects when I was younger.
Dave.
Post by: kennym on January 23, 2021, 08:14:02 PM
Post by: Crooked Stic on January 23, 2021, 08:48:28 PM
A guy ought to used to wearing a mask now days. :bigsmyl:
Post by: wood carver 2 on January 23, 2021, 09:36:00 PM
The company I work for bought one for our painter. Really nice. $1500.
Dave.
Post by: Crittergetter on January 23, 2021, 10:08:34 PM
Roy you were talking with my father.
this is what is going on we have a brand new grizzly drum sander we will cut lams at 0.200 then run them thought the sander fast slow very small bites where it does not make any sound change a little bigger bites. the target let say is .125 it will be .125 then 4 inches down it may be .133........0.136..0.129 and so on some times i can get them perfect but i have to run the lam through 150 times.i have removed the velcro from the drum and taping on my paper..
If your just taping on your paper on the ends that may be the issue.
The centrifugal force may be causing the paper to lift off the drum. I use spray adhesive when changing paper on my baby drum sander.
Just a thought
Post by: Roy from Pa on January 24, 2021, 04:26:23 AM
Jason you may want to check that.
Did you also remove the velcro that is adhered to the drum and only wrapping new paper around the bare drum?
Post by: BigJim on January 24, 2021, 08:05:19 AM
Grizzly has some good tools mixed in with some bad tools. I have a few that I like or love. Got rid of the rest.
BigJim
Post by: stack on January 24, 2021, 01:32:43 PM
Post by: Flem on January 24, 2021, 01:46:29 PM
Post by: stack on January 24, 2021, 02:08:42 PM
Post by: Roy from Pa on January 24, 2021, 02:32:23 PM
They are amazing..
Ya have a PM..
https://youtu.be/u3Qkn8oPq5Q
Post by: Bob D on January 24, 2021, 02:36:24 PM
My wife who is a retired RN (and a woodworker) agrees with Flem on the N95. She always wears one in the wood shop (and now grocery store) and frequently had to wear one when caring for patients.
She also wears glasses and says this stuff really works with the fogging.
Good luck. ~Bob D.
[ You are not allowed to view attachments ]
Post by: Bvas on January 24, 2021, 03:01:15 PM
If your glasses are fogging.....your mask isn’t sealed.
If your mask isn’t sealed dust is getting by.
I prefer a full face respirator mask. Keeps dust out of lungs and eyes.
Post by: mmattockx on January 24, 2021, 03:09:45 PM
I use spray adhesive when changing paper on my baby drum sander.
This is a very good idea. On my home made sander I hit a problem where the paper wasn't quite tight on the drum and some dust got under the paper and caused a high spot that started bevelling off the edges of the lams. I've cleaned it out and it is now a maintenance item to watch but the next strip of paper that goes on will have 3M77 on the back of it.
Ditch the fabric masks and get a respirator mask.
+1. One of the respirator types that uses the plug in cartridge filters can be fitted properly so nothing gets out and glasses don't fog.
Mark
Post by: Flem on January 24, 2021, 05:03:49 PM
[ You are not allowed to view attachments ]
This is a reasonably comfortable set-up. Those P-100 filters are cheap and they flow better than vapor cartridges. If you get a half mask or like Brad said, the full face, be sure to get the silicone version. The cheaper dark grey plastic version does not seal as well and gets uncomfortable quick. If you have a beard, please disregard everything I said.
Post by: OldRawhide42 on January 24, 2021, 06:13:33 PM
And a grizzly air filter G9956
It helps pull the dust away from
You
Post by: Roy from Pa on January 24, 2021, 06:31:37 PM
Works great.
Post by: Mad Max on January 24, 2021, 06:42:01 PM
you can turn the lights out in the bow room with the air filter on, and a flash light and see the dust going around to the filter.
Try it :thumbsup:
Post by: OldRawhide42 on January 24, 2021, 07:13:55 PM
Had the air filter turn on buy its self ??
Post by: Roy from Pa on January 24, 2021, 07:23:28 PM
Nope never turned on by itself.
Post by: kennym on January 24, 2021, 07:46:54 PM
Post by: Roy from Pa on January 24, 2021, 08:18:07 PM
Post by: Mad Max on January 24, 2021, 08:24:16 PM
Roy or Mad Max have you ever
Had the air filter turn on buy its self ??
YES
I have to unplug mine every time I leave the bow shop.
Some of that good china made stuff.
Post by: Roy from Pa on January 25, 2021, 05:12:03 AM
Post by: OldRawhide42 on January 25, 2021, 08:27:07 AM
Too. Thanks
Post by: kennym on January 25, 2021, 08:29:54 AM
Post by: OldRawhide42 on January 25, 2021, 08:36:33 AM
If I loose power it starts when
the power comes back on
Post by: Roy from Pa on January 25, 2021, 08:45:34 AM
My remote takes a battery.
If yours runs off 110 vac, you may be right there.
Maxi, does your remote run off ac?
Post by: Mad Max on January 25, 2021, 09:00:49 AM
It was coming on by itself.
It has a 3 speed motor, it was cycling threw all speeds , over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over :banghead:
Post by: kennym on January 25, 2021, 09:23:09 AM
Post by: Mad Max on January 25, 2021, 09:58:31 AM
they could have used a pull chain on mine too.
If it was made back in the day, it would work for ever :tongue:
Post by: Roy from Pa on January 25, 2021, 10:59:46 AM
The remote can adjust the speed in a variable amount.
I just ordered a new inside filter for it, it's eaten a lot of dust and I fuggered it was about time.
$84.00, damn....
Post by: Flem on January 25, 2021, 11:12:15 AM
Post by: Roy from Pa on January 25, 2021, 11:13:31 AM
It has been washed many times.
Post by: Mad Max on January 25, 2021, 11:20:06 AM
Those triple bag filters are washable. I blow mine out and wash it regularly.
With a water hose?
Post by: deercraver on January 25, 2021, 11:21:52 AM
i also purchased a air filtration system for the shop it is on its way.
How thick is the sled you all are using mine is 3/4" and is flat ?
how much material are you removing at one time i only move my handle 1/8th of a turn barley taking any material off?
i have looked through my sander all looks good nothing loose nothing binding up drive belt looks good no high spots in it.
Post by: Flem on January 25, 2021, 11:29:02 AM
Post by: Roy from Pa on January 25, 2021, 11:36:03 AM
What did you do for attaching the paper now?
Sled is 1/2" thick.
I turn the handle one complete turn after running the lam through twice.
Cool on air filtration system
Post by: deercraver on January 25, 2021, 11:57:14 AM
Do you think maybe i am taking off too little and it is allowing the lam to rise a tad bit causing my life havoc.
I end up running these through 100 time (maybe not that many but it sure feels like it) in order to get a usable lam.
What is the starting point you use when cutting the lams out on the band saw? i cut mine at .125"
Post by: Roy from Pa on January 25, 2021, 12:07:55 PM
I would clean all the residue off the drum if you totally removed the velcro that was adhered to it, them use a high tac glue" spray can" and coat the whole drum and back of the paper, then use reinforced tape on each end.
But honestly, I have no problem with the hook and loop paper getting decent accuracy.
Your 1/8th turn on the adjustment handle ain't gonna do nothing, do a complete turn and do 2 passes before going another complete turn.
For belly lams that I want 1/4" when done, I cut them to 5/16th thick.
Core lam I cut to about 3/16th
Post by: Flem on January 25, 2021, 12:29:36 PM
When you guys are running a sled thru the sander, how many revolutions does the feed belt make during one pass?
Jason, have you had problems with one species of wood or many?
Post by: deercraver on January 25, 2021, 12:50:54 PM
I will try gluing it on now see how that works.(paper)
Feed belt revolutions not sure i can mark it and see if i had to guess 4 maybe?..
maybe i need to asses my lam lay outs what are you guys running how many lams in a stack ? How many tapers?
I talk with some guys the have 2p 3t and 2 glass how?
To hit my .350 i use (2) .030 glass (2) .100 par (1) .090 taper
Removing the velcro did not really help much.
Post by: kennym on January 25, 2021, 01:02:29 PM
If I remember right, the baby drum has a conveyor long enough to run a 36" lam without being on the belt splice (which by the way usually makes a thinner spot on the lam) I mark both ends of splice and stay off it on last couple passes...
what are you guys running how many lams in a stack ? How many tapers? -----
I run 4 wood or boo lams, usually 2 veneers @ .030 and 2 tapers - .001 and .002 but you could run 2 - .0015 tapers in my bows. ( make sure if one bends up riser ramps to be thin enough to bend) This is on d/r bows from 56 to 64"
To hit my .350 i use (2) .030 glass (2) .100 par (1) .090 taper -----
In my bows I would use 2 - .040 glass --- 2- .030 parallels --- 1 - .001 taper @ .080 ---- 1- .002 taper @.130 or a variation of that.... :thumbsup:
Post by: deercraver on January 25, 2021, 01:11:21 PM
Post by: Roy from Pa on January 25, 2021, 02:11:17 PM
Post by: kennym on January 25, 2021, 03:47:18 PM
There is no splice in my baby drum sander feed belt.
I'm bettin there is... :saywhat:
Post by: Roy from Pa on January 25, 2021, 04:05:37 PM
Post by: kennym on January 25, 2021, 04:11:00 PM
Post by: Roy from Pa on January 25, 2021, 04:13:09 PM
Post by: Mad Max on January 25, 2021, 04:53:28 PM
There is no splice in my baby drum sander feed belt.
x2
Post by: kennym on January 25, 2021, 05:27:22 PM
Post by: Flem on January 26, 2021, 08:45:44 AM
It seems like it has to be feed rate related as long as their are not any mechanical defects.
Have you tried different feed rates, if its possible, Jason?
Post by: Roy from Pa on January 26, 2021, 09:05:06 AM
I been exchanging pm's with Jason.
He has only been turning up the feed table height 1/8th of a turn at a time.
That is not taking hardly anything off, I turn the handle 1 full turn and do 2 passes then another turn up.
I have not heard back from him since I explained that to him.
Post by: stack on January 26, 2021, 06:02:52 PM
Post by: Roy from Pa on January 26, 2021, 06:24:47 PM
Get a good dust protection outfit.
Post by: deercraver on January 26, 2021, 09:08:27 PM
I am going to get a 2x4 and cut them up and run every combo i can until i get it figured out.
Post by: Flem on January 26, 2021, 10:07:19 PM
I know it would bug the crap out of me!
Post by: Mad Max on January 26, 2021, 11:53:44 PM
I have removed the velcro.
i also purchased a air filtration system for the shop it is on its way.
How thick is the sled you all are using mine is 3/4" and is flat ?
how much material are you removing at one time i only move my handle 1/8th of a turn barley taking any material off?
i have looked through my sander all looks good nothing loose nothing binding up drive belt looks good no high spots in it.
I took the Velcro off mine.
half a turn grinding lams until I get close--60 grit--3/4" thick sled.
I crank my pressure roller down to the lam, turn on the sander, as it going threw I crank down until I here it sanding, then half turn until I get close to thickness.
Post by: Roy from Pa on January 27, 2021, 05:06:01 AM
With sander off, I push the lam into the pressure roller back and forth while cranking up the height till it gets a little snug. You need to do this with both ends of the lam, then adjust the height to the thicker end. Because if you adjust the height to the thinner end and along comes the thicker end through the sander, you could smoke the sandpaper on the drum.
Ask me how I know, LOL.
Then run it through, it may or may not sand the lam even on first pass.
So from that point on, I do a full turn on the height adjustment and run the lam through twice.
I can run the lam through 3 or 4 times and it will still take off a tiny bit.
Then repeat the one full turn and run lam through twice.
As I get closer to my final thickness, I'll do a half turn then a quarter turn.
I don't really care for the hook and loop Velcro system and I can see where you glass bow guys wouldn't want it because you need your lams precise, within a few thousands of an inch to get your stack correct.
But for me making all wood bows, my lams come out good enough.
Post by: Mad Max on January 27, 2021, 08:53:48 AM
Post by: Roy from Pa on January 27, 2021, 08:57:43 AM
The drums I've seen without Velcro have a spring type clamping assembly for holding the end of the paper tight.
Post by: Mad Max on January 27, 2021, 09:09:47 AM
NO velcro, 3M spray glue and 2 rounds of strapping tape at the ends.
NO clamp on my roller :thumbsup:
EDIT roy I took my hook and loop off
Post by: Roy from Pa on January 27, 2021, 09:19:04 AM
NO velcro, 3M spray glue and 2 rounds of strapping tape at the ends.- OK
NO clamp on my roller- No there wouldn't be since it was designed for Velcro.
EDIT roy I took my hook and loop off. No kidding? LOL
Post by: JamesV on February 01, 2021, 03:11:40 AM
James
Post by: Roy from Pa on February 01, 2021, 04:08:14 AM
Good to see you back with a new shop on higher ground.
Looking forward to the planer process.
Post by: Mad Max on February 01, 2021, 07:24:38 AM
Post by: kennym on February 01, 2021, 07:34:46 AM
That metal sled and planer just spooks me a little... :o
Post by: Buemaker on February 01, 2021, 08:16:24 AM
Post by: Flem on February 01, 2021, 09:33:34 AM
My drum sander was too complicated for my pea brain so I let someone else have the headache. I switched to an adjustable steel sled running on a rail system thru my planer. Cuts perfect lams and tapers and I only have to sharpen the planer blades occasionally. As some of you know, my shop in the delta flooded two years in a row with 4 ft of water and ruined some of my equipment. I have moved to a "hill" and built a new shop, will be back in production in the spring. NO my planer and sled didn't get wet. I am thinking I will video a build-along and detail the planer in action for those that are interested, especially for "flem" who informed me that without pitchers it didn't happen.
James
It worked! :cheesy:
Post by: mmattockx on February 01, 2021, 10:19:30 AM
I switched to an adjustable steel sled running on a rail system thru my planer.
I would be interested in seeing some pics of that sled set up.
Mark
Post by: stack on February 07, 2021, 07:02:22 PM
Post by: Flem on February 07, 2021, 07:08:54 PM
Post by: stack on February 07, 2021, 07:14:17 PM
Post by: Mad Max on February 07, 2021, 07:36:57 PM
Post by: stack on February 07, 2021, 07:45:44 PM
Post by: Mad Max on February 07, 2021, 07:56:43 PM
Post by: Longcruise on February 07, 2021, 08:49:43 PM
I ordered the hog grinder and it showed up yesterday. Hooked it up and ran a couple of samples through it and I think this is going to be a great way to grind our lams and parallels. They came out real close. Just need to work with it now.
Iv
I've been looking at that but haven't found a suitable motor. What did you use?
Post by: Mad Max on February 07, 2021, 09:01:04 PM
I still have 2, but one I used the motor for my Hog. :thumbsup:
Post by: Longcruise on February 07, 2021, 10:09:26 PM
Post by: Mad Max on February 07, 2021, 10:30:25 PM
I haven't been looking at fans. Might try that.
I have a backup motor, A bench grinder I never use :bigsmyl:
Post by: Roy from Pa on February 08, 2021, 08:36:54 AM
Post by: stack on February 08, 2021, 08:43:04 AM
Post by: Roy from Pa on February 08, 2021, 08:45:37 AM
LOL I understand...
Post by: stack on February 08, 2021, 08:55:08 AM