Post by: Bowguy67 on April 28, 2020, 02:53:57 PM
It’s easy to avoid em by not clicking, and guys are entitled to do as they wish. To me it’s just not scouting and never will be.
I like to be involved in my sport. Making arrows, strings, sharpening knives and broadheads. Watching deer come into a hayfield at night from long range behind a bale.
Scouting means actually figuring where the best spot to intercept our lives w deer or any animal under fair chase rules. Planning for the hunt by using our brain, woodsmanship and relying on determination, not what time a camera says the deer are coming to the corn pile.
I’m not cursing no one so don’t get bent if I’m describing you. Guess I’m wondering if any old style hunters exist?
I will say this morning my buddy who is def about the dead animal said something warmed me up.
Couple years ago he shot a turkey roosting on a roof w his bow. Each morning it’d gobble, come down, pass the swing set and pass the same tree. He went there and killed it and was excited it was by bow. Happy for him but I’d not do it.
Same year his friend had a giant yard. Birds come into every day in the exact spot. He sat there killed another. Dif mentality than me.
Today he said they were doing the same thing but he wasn’t going there. It was like shooting em in a turkey farm. Seemed accomplishment is starting to mean something to him!!
This was the same guy when I had brain surgery and struggled to shoot said if he was me he’d be using a crossbow. I let him know he wasn’t me.
I got a light bow n worked my way up. He comments positively about that too now
No dis to anyone, I’d just think on a trad forum there’d be more old school mentality guys.
This is not a modern technology bash so don’t mistake me. Not an anti anything bash
Post by: The Savage Rabbit on April 28, 2020, 03:33:06 PM
I'd assume throwing in a baited tree stand archery hunt every year would be similar.
Post by: Trumpkin the Dwarf on April 28, 2020, 03:35:54 PM
Put it another way... I'm a fly fisherman. Dedicated, hardcore, good at it, and most would call me a purist. Heck I don't even know how to use a baitcaster. Lately I've been thinking about how enjoyable it would be to dunk some worms and put a bunch of Crappie in the freezer. and then I realized, I don't even know how to do that! I have been so proud of the fact that I'm a FLYFISHERMAN!!! that I let it get in the way of relaxing and enjoying the process of catching fish. If it's fun, it doesn't matter whether it's fly fishing or spin fishing. I'm still trying to catch fish either way.
Back to your original question, I think trail cameras are absolutely effective scouting tools. Doesn't mean I have to agree with the use of them. Generally speaking I don't have much use for them. But I wouldn't consider them to be nontraditional, necessarily. Eventually it comes down to where you draw the line. Arrows, and bows are made of fiberglass. Binoculars have really only been good enough to be useful in the last hundred years. Boots with goretex certainly aren't what the native americans used. We drive cars to our hunting grounds. We wear synthetic clothes.
Trad is a relative term. There are a few non negotiables, namely single stick, single string, no wheels. But beyond that, I think everyone gets to decide if their equipment satisfies the intention behind their choice of weapon. If you can honestly say a rangefinder, and lighted nocks and vanes still meet the intention behind why you hunt with a recurve or longbow, then use them!
Post by: black velvet on April 28, 2020, 03:39:38 PM
Post by: Bowguy67 on April 28, 2020, 04:27:41 PM
Imagine you were sharing land w a group? I myself have. I’m finding it increasingly tough. Everywhere you look there’s trail cams, bait piles, etc. Getting tougher and tougher to avoid. Thank God for mountains to climb.
That land though if shared by guys just like myself is where I’d like to be.
Idk if that makes sense. Look if it doesn’t it’s because you don’t think that way. Less n less do, was hoping more guys were hiding in here that did.
Black Velvet Id hunt with
Post by: YosemiteSam on April 28, 2020, 04:59:52 PM
Here, a fella can put in a hard, honest effort for a few years and still fail to SEE a legal buck during the season, let along shoot one with a rifle (bow, including compounds, is really low odds). Our regs are set to accommodate several thousand hunters in the space of a single county, meaning that success rates are such that only a few % will take home anything. Tags are more like lottery tickets -- low-odds gambles. Last year, I hunted about 12 full days and got one opportunity for a stalk on a bear (didn't yet have a tag on me) and saw no legal deer. None. Zippo. I've seen 2 legal deer in about 5 years. Both went to the freezer. If people out here decide to take a few extra legal advantages, I can hardly blame them. Yes, I could rack up some preference points and hunt more productive areas 5-7 hours away in a short 2-week season. But I want to hunt places I know, places I can learn & in a more flexible time frame.
That's just my view on things here. We don't chase whitetails on farm land.
Post by: BAK on April 28, 2020, 05:31:14 PM
I hunt land that I've been hunting on since 1957. Roughly 230 acres give or take. I know where the deer feed, bed, and travel, so cameras help me with none of that. My wife and I just enjoy browsing the pictures for all that's there. Yes, we see deer, and turkey, but squirrels, rabbits, coyote, and last year a pair of otters. I also use them to make sure we don't have anyone trespassing, at least not more than once if we can help it.
I think you're using too broad a brush.
Post by: Mark R on April 28, 2020, 07:13:23 PM
Post by: Bisch on April 28, 2020, 07:57:51 PM
JMHO!
Bisch
Post by: Crittergetter on April 28, 2020, 08:00:29 PM
Most people are to lazy to hunt/scout as hard as I do so I’m not concerned with how they do what they do. It simply doesn’t affect me.
Post by: woodchucker on April 28, 2020, 08:17:12 PM
As time goes on, I focus on the days of my youth. More and more, I do things the way I did as a kid.
Recurves and wood arrows, open sighted rifles, wool clothing, walk more and sit less...
I don't know? Makes me feel young again...
Post by: Bowguy67 on April 28, 2020, 09:05:09 PM
Bisch the bait and trail cams by me are rampant. You can’t do what you want or hunt as you wish. I prefer not to be in the same woods as feeders. The guys often put them in oaks where I’d set so I gotta use somewhere else no matter I had hunted a farm or parts of it 30 years. I need to go and I will but it’s not like the way someone does things isn’t effecting others. Should I add consideration is an old school value too? . Maybe guys carrying all this stuff in ought to figure out if they’d be changing an area negatively for someone else?
Now I agree w the legal thing, the old school in me disagrees bait will ever be ethical.
Before guys get bent again this is not my intent, just my opinion.
Do not want this turning into a peeing match. I’m just wondering if anyone else is old school.
Post by: twrecurve on April 28, 2020, 09:49:42 PM
Post by: monterey on April 28, 2020, 10:14:29 PM
Quote
Lately I've been thinking about how enjoyable it would be to dunk some worms and put a bunch of Crappie in the freezer.
Go with minnows for those crappies. :)
Post by: Pine on April 28, 2020, 10:31:01 PM
I don't use my trail camera for "SCOUTING" , it's used in my case as a way to enjoy watching the little ones grow up as well as watching antler growth.
So for me it's a form of entertainment because I'm going to hunt in the same spot regardless of trail camera pictures.
I do feel the need to explain that not all hunters are capable of negotiating the great outdoors due to limited mobility.
They hunt where they are able to get to and rely on others to assist with recovery.
So don't be too judgmental on this subject and realize that some just can't do it any more.
And also there's some traditional hunters that are trying to learn without a mentor to guide them.
Post by: Pine on April 28, 2020, 10:33:33 PM
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Post by: GCook on April 28, 2020, 11:06:50 PM
I always enjoy these threads. Mostly because I just finished a dinner of venison of a deer I shot at a feeder, from an elevated plastic shell blind that seals up and contains my scent and I chose to shoot her because she never had a fawn with her in all the pics I had of her all summer, knew her to be older and she had a big cyst on the front of her chest. I shot her with a bow with fiberglass laminates in it and a shelf cut past center, a carbon arrow I cut and fletched as well as glued in the insert and used a lighted nock. I used a digital camera in my cell phone to take pics and I did brag a bit. I used a replaceable blade knife to skin and quarter her and paid a processor to cut and grind her for me even though own all the equipment to do it myself. However in the hours it takes to process a deer I can make about $600 in my business and since they only charge $85 to process a deer (and I know the people well) it's stupid not to spend money to make more.
Now I could try to justify camera use with the fact that my ranch is 175 miles from home but I really don't feel the need to. The fact is that I'd bet my next paycheck you'd likely never kill a deer on my place still hunting with a bow. Just isn't the kind of cover and terrain to facilitate it. Not to mention you'd spook them off the property for the day and after a while, push them into nocturnal activity.
I enjoy sitting in a stand, taking photos of deer and sending them to my family and friends while hunting. I enjoy seeing theirs as well and even though we may be hunting places hours or even thousands of miles from each other, it's almost like sharing a hunt or camp with them.
You know I've only been around a little over half a century but I understand that when I start a sentence with "no offense" I'm certain I'm going to offend someone and it's usually the person I'm trying to convince I'm right.
However, it's a long off season for many of y'all up north and with current restrictions and such I can see you getting a tad antsy.
Even though I could go on my A.D.D. is kicking in and I need to go check other threads.
Post by: GCook on April 28, 2020, 11:09:48 PM
Post by: Mark R on April 28, 2020, 11:47:04 PM
Post by: achigan on April 29, 2020, 07:42:48 AM
Post by: kennym on April 29, 2020, 08:55:36 AM
I put trail cams on the lease I manage for a neighbor lady so I can show the fellows coming to hunt what we have, but I still have to know where to put a cam to get a deer pic. Baiting for cams or hunting illegal here. Before salt or minerals became illegal, I had a couple licks for pics and for deer needs.
I have never killed a buck I had pics of so that's out the window. I did find a deadhead that a bud had pics of 3.04 miles away.
Cameras don't guarantee kills.
Do what blows your skirt up, you only have to answer to yourself in the end . (or the game warden) :)
Post by: Bowguy67 on April 29, 2020, 09:01:57 AM
Post by: Sam McMichael on April 29, 2020, 09:35:11 AM
Post by: achigan on April 29, 2020, 10:13:23 AM
"No judgement if you use it."
Excuse ME?
I'm not a man if is use a trail camera to take pictures of wildlife in my own backyard?!
Your two sentences are mutually exclusive. Please clarify what you mean.
Post by: Witherstick on April 29, 2020, 10:18:33 AM
Further many are blind to the fact that the more modern gadgetry you employ the less of yourself is invested in the pursuit. So, the less YOU did means there is less for you to brag about. Of course these people try to deflect by mentioning fiberglass, or the vehicle you drove, your phone etc. But these things do not help you once you step in the woods any more than walking to the woods or any message delivered any other way prior to actual hunting. The fiberglass and other materials comments are a favorite attempt at deflection tactic and one of the most ridiculous. Fiberglass and other materials have made traditional equipment easier to produce effeciently and more tolerant of weather. Actual performance and ease of use is not significantly different than a well designed composite bow of centuries ago.
Also it us absolutely sad that so many want the government to determine what is ethical by their claims of whatever is legal is ok! Sad! Our ability to vote and express opinions are where those laws come from! Hence get in the game and hve a thought. Just saying whatever legal is ok is just abdicating your responsibility while pretending to have a deep thought.
HOWEVER, that all being said, the amount of modern gadgetry one uses should be within the legal boundaries and then within their own personal boundaries. I know that I hear all the time that hunting from the ground with trad bows and no blind is nearly impossible. Well, my wife and I have taken numerous deer that way as have our children. In fact, ur youngest took his first trad bow buck on the ground with no blind at 12 years old hunting by himself. His second buck was two seasons later. No cameras were used to pattern any of our deer. Although cameras were out over the late summer and spring just for our enjoyment. They were pulled well before the season.
We have a group of gun hunters across the road who use all the modern equipment they can. They never shoot a deer scoring under 140. They come up from out of state for opening weekend of gun season and within a couple of days all 3 have shot their trophy for the year. Works for them. Because this is a game rich area it doesn't bother me a bit. In fact, they are great guys and we all get along great. But where public land and land shared by many hunters comes into play, I admit the excuses for buying your shot could get bothersome. Hence, get active and have a genuine opinion. Express it and vote it.
Above all we should stay civil to each other. I think the need to know we aren't alone in our pursuits and ideas that define us are what generate these topics. So, rest assured that others do pass on cameras completely.
Post by: Crittergetter on April 29, 2020, 10:24:15 AM
Guys make me shake my head sometimes. The point is I’m looking to see if anyone besides me hunts like a man to put it bluntly. No one said cameras guarantee anything. It’s just the person being 100 percent involved w no technology. No judgement if you use it.Guess I gotta spell that out. And if I’m sick of the trail cam pics why would someone put them on here? As Bill Engvell said, here’s your sign.
Hunt like a Man??? Do you mean by scouting months out of the year? Do you mean by going miles and miles on foot past everyone else? Do you mean driving 100+ miles by river in 3 days to get to the spots no one else will when it’s flooded? Do you mean spending 2 weeks packed in the mountain without a shower to get to where the elk are? The list goes on an on......
oh by the way, I use aerial photography to pre scout spots, I also use trail cams to get an idea of what deer are using the spots I scout in the off season to get an idea of who is in the area and where they will be during our hunting season.
if you doubt my manhood, work ethic, and commitment and how and where I hunt based upon whether I use trail cams or not then your being narrow minded...
Post by: Hackbow on April 29, 2020, 10:42:06 AM
I'd bet there's a dating app that can help you out with that.
Post by: achigan on April 29, 2020, 10:51:36 AM
Post by: David Mitchell on April 29, 2020, 10:58:31 AM
Post by: Orion on April 29, 2020, 11:27:33 AM
Post by: buckeyebowhunter on April 29, 2020, 11:47:59 AM
The other option is public land, which baiting is illegal. Public can be fun, but crowded. Especially during the rut, not knocking non residents but Ohio's non resident tag is one of the cheapest I know of in the mid-west area, which adds another obstacle for local guys trying to hunt public. So as far as hunting the public land goes I'm going to try and use as much as I can in order to be successful as I am essentially competing against many others. I still take my trad bow though, maybe its nuts but that is what I prefer to bowhunt with exclusively..
So my conclusion is, we are all hunting with Trad bows, which is pretty cool. Why does it matter whatever else you decide to use in your strategy? It doesn't, just as long as you're having fun and staying legal it's all good. :thumbsup:
Post by: Pine on April 29, 2020, 12:54:10 PM
Post by: Yooper-traveler on April 29, 2020, 02:05:38 PM
Lots of good perspective and advice offered by Witherstick. I've always found it paradoxical that on the one hand, folks chose a low-tech hunting weapon like a longbow or recurve, but then employ many other technologies and practices to make the hunt easier. Society and societal norms have changed over the years. Nowadays, most folks want it now and they usually want it as easily as possible. For me, I still get the most out of hunting by putting as much of myself into it as I can. That means no cameras, no bait, no food plots, no scents, no scent controlling clothing, no 4-wheelers, etc. I do wear camouflage at times. Hope that doesn't make me a bad person. :bigsmyl:
Wait you use camouflage? Men don’t use such gadgetry in the noble pursuit of game. :goldtooth:
Post by: GCook on April 29, 2020, 02:11:56 PM
Guys make me shake my head sometimes. The point is I’m looking to see if anyone besides me hunts like a man to put it bluntly. No one said cameras guarantee anything. It’s just the person being 100 percent involved w no technology. No judgement if you use it.Guess I gotta spell that out. And if I’m sick of the trail cam pics why would someone put them on here? As Bill Engvell said, here’s your sign.You see the fly in the ointment is in the statement "The point is I'm looking to see if anyone hunts like a man like me to put it bluntly. " which infers you think those who don't hunt as you do aren't men or real hunters. Which is why you've gotten response that has you shaking your head.
Post by: David Mitchell on April 29, 2020, 02:18:54 PM
Post by: kennym on April 29, 2020, 02:26:53 PM
See ya, man ...
Post by: Roy from Pa on April 29, 2020, 03:13:51 PM
My Uncle KennyM hunts like a man:)
Post by: Rob DiStefano on April 29, 2020, 03:31:10 PM
Guys make me shake my head sometimes. The point is I’m looking to see if anyone besides me hunts like a man to put it bluntly. No one said cameras guarantee anything. It’s just the person being 100 percent involved w no technology. No judgement if you use it.Guess I gotta spell that out. And if I’m sick of the trail cam pics why would someone put them on here? As Bill Engvell said, here’s your sign.
as mentioned in other posts in this thread, no one should give a hoot what anyone does as long as its legal and ethical.
besides the specificity of weaponry used, we don't condone high fence hunts. the rest is up to discretion. if there is a hunting tool or method that you don't like, but is legal and ethical, respectfully, just keep it to yourself, please.
i don't think anyone should have to be put into a position to defend their legal and ethical manner of hunting. all yer doing is stirring up a nasty pot. it's counter productive to the core focus and goals of trad gang, and divides the community ... and we can all see that happening in this thread already.
next we'll be getting yet another rash of "only real bowhunters use wood arrows" or "HMPE strings are better than dacron" or "you ain't a real bowhunter unless yer pulling 60# or better", etc etc etc. geez louise.
let it all go, please.
thank you.
r.
Post by: GCook on April 29, 2020, 03:55:49 PM
Post by: Rob DiStefano on April 29, 2020, 04:06:48 PM
Sorry Rob I posted before I saw your intercession which I am grateful for.
not at all a problem, sir :thumbsup:
Post by: Bowguy67 on April 30, 2020, 12:22:51 PM
"The point is I’m looking to see if anyone besides me hunts like a man to put it bluntly."
"No judgement if you use it."
Excuse ME?
I'm not a man if is use a trail camera to take pictures of wildlife in my own backyard?!
Your two sentences are mutually exclusive. Please clarify what you mean.
I didn’t say you’re not a man. A camera isn’t human though. It doesn’t involve the actual hunter.
Post by: Bowguy67 on April 30, 2020, 12:26:20 PM
Guys make me shake my head sometimes. The point is I’m looking to see if anyone besides me hunts like a man to put it bluntly. No one said cameras guarantee anything. It’s just the person being 100 percent involved w no technology. No judgement if you use it.Guess I gotta spell that out. And if I’m sick of the trail cam pics why would someone put them on here? As Bill Engvell said, here’s your sign.You see the fly in the ointment is in the statement "The point is I'm looking to see if anyone hunts like a man like me to put it bluntly. " which infers you think those who don't hunt as you do aren't men or real hunters. Which is why you've gotten response that has you shaking your head.
If that’s what ya think. Some guys don’t know what they don’t know. Sounds like a few are the type. Think about that
Post by: Rob DiStefano on April 30, 2020, 12:40:53 PM