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Main Boards => The Bowyer's Bench => Topic started by: bucknut on November 08, 2019, 09:24:23 PM

Title: RASPS?
Post by: bucknut on November 08, 2019, 09:24:23 PM: Getting ready for my journey into the selfbow world. I have been prepping for a few years and now have about 30-40 yeller staves and want to start this winter. I have also been slowly gathering the tools I need. I have read a bunch on rasps and it seemed that the Nicholson 49 and 50 were the gold standard for years but quality seems to have dropped significantly? I noticed a big difference in quality of their files when they went foreign. What would you recommend to someone getting started? I have the buy Quality-buy it once mentality, but also don't want to totally break the bank. I have been looking at the Torges rasp and would like some input/opinions on what you like or what you wish you would have bought.

Thanks, John
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Roy from Pa on November 08, 2019, 09:30:04 PM: Other than Nicholson 49 and 50, a good farriers rasp works nice.
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Mad Max on November 08, 2019, 09:37:08 PM: The Original Save Edge farriers rasp
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Forwardhandle on November 09, 2019, 08:23:40 AM: I only use Grobet rasps I would never go back to Nicholson these rasps never seam to dull I have hand cut glass sight windows & even glass doesn't slow them down there more $$ but worth every penny !

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Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Roy from Pa on November 09, 2019, 09:15:13 AM: Gonna hafta check them out....
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Pat B on November 09, 2019, 12:50:02 PM: The #49 and #50 are very similar. If you decide to buy one either will work but be sure is is US made. Farriers rasps are very useful and relatively cheap(about $20 or less) or if you know a farrier you can sometimes get them free. My old one came from a farrier that couldn't use it anymore. It has made many bows and still cuts well.
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Bowjunkie on November 09, 2019, 08:31:11 PM: The new Nicholson 49 and 50 rasps aren't quite as good as the old ones were, but they're still good, and better than any dept store or big box store junk. I use newer model 49's and 50's, among others, and they're just fine.

I got a pile of used farrier's rasps from a horseshoer and gave or threw them all away. They don't cut at ALL like new ones, so I buy em new. I like the tangless Nicholson farrier rasps, with the orange plastic on either end. They're more comfy to use, imo.

Happiness is a new sharp rasp... or file.
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: bucknut on November 12, 2019, 02:12:33 PM: Thanks for the info.
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Forwardhandle on November 12, 2019, 02:22:04 PM: Also you might want to check out the Shinto rasps they are cheap & can make quick work on most woods ,I primarily use those for ruff work & switch to cabinet rasp for finer work !
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Roy from Pa on November 12, 2019, 02:29:59 PM: Shinto rasps..

I bought one and gave it away...
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Forwardhandle on November 12, 2019, 02:32:44 PM: There pretty aggressive rasps but I like them , what didn't you like Roy ?
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Pat B on November 12, 2019, 03:44:05 PM: I have a Shinto I like and use too. When I got it it had a strange handle on it I didn't like it so I got rid of the handle and just use the blade/rasp. I like the rounded portion of the #40/#50 for working around the fades and any curved or crooked areas.
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Forwardhandle on November 12, 2019, 04:06:39 PM: I bought the one with no handle on it & it's longer to I went to buy the same one for a gift for a bowyer friend & couldn't find the longer one ,If I don't work tomorrow I'm going to use it to ruff floor tiller my stave tomorrow ,I like it quick & controllable !
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Roy from Pa on November 12, 2019, 04:14:18 PM: I ordered a shinto and told them I wanted one just like Ritchie has.

They sent me a pink one...

I gave it away.
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Forwardhandle on November 12, 2019, 05:12:30 PM: That's ok this is a diverse community here you can have what ever color rasp you want ,the older I get I'm just happy to have a rasp that still works :bigsmyl:
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Roy from Pa on November 12, 2019, 06:44:01 PM: :biglaugh:
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Forwardhandle on November 13, 2019, 06:59:47 AM: This is the Shinto its basicly a bunch of hack saw blades stacked together it particularly works good on osage just took off 1/8" of wood smoothly in a few minutes it can be slid for smoothing I could do a whole bow from start to finish with it and some sand paper if I had to ! But I wouldnt be surprised if it doesn't turn pink soon :biglaugh:
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: bucknut on November 17, 2019, 09:38:43 PM: The Shinto's are definitely different!
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: scrub-buster on November 18, 2019, 01:56:39 PM: I prefer a sharp well made farriers rasp, shinto, and some USA made Nicholson half round rasps and files. I haven't found a USA made #49 or #50 yet but I'm still looking. You could get by just fine with the farrier and shinto with a file to remove tool marks.
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Roy from Pa on November 18, 2019, 02:37:25 PM: I use a Heller Black Master Farrier RASPs, little more money than most farrier rasps, about $44.00.
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: monterey on November 19, 2019, 03:28:51 PM: Mine was bought used in a hardware store in a small town. Think it was $4. It has a flat side and a rounded side. Strictly for hoggin. It does a lot of things faster than a spindle sander or bandsaw.
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Roy from Pa on November 19, 2019, 04:15:28 PM: Got pichers?:)
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Forwardhandle on November 19, 2019, 04:32:20 PM: I think I'm going to add one of those Hiller rasps to my collection, Clint is that the Hiller black masters rasp ?
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Roy from Pa on November 19, 2019, 04:44:13 PM: I posted that, Ritchie and yes.
Check Amazon..
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Forwardhandle on November 19, 2019, 04:51:38 PM: Yep got it how does the less aggressive side cut ? Sorry I thought Clint posted that ! I'm road tired sorry :cheesy:

I can't believe I just apologized to Roy :laughing:
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Roy from Pa on November 19, 2019, 04:56:34 PM: LOL

Less aggressive side cuts great.
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: scrub-buster on November 19, 2019, 07:11:20 PM: It's a far stretch to confuse me with Roy. He's like 4 or 5 times my age.
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: bucknut on November 19, 2019, 08:49:29 PM: Ritchie is there a certain model on the Shinto rasp?
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Roy from Pa on November 19, 2019, 09:09:58 PM: HEY CLINT..........

Ah never mind:)
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Forwardhandle on November 20, 2019, 11:33:08 AM: Man Clint Im so sorry Bro please forgive me :knothead: Im banning my self for a while, Roy makes dirt look young :cheesy: John I got mine on Amazon It was the longer one I think 15" with out the goofy tip handle I think there $22 I just checked they still have that size !
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Roy from Pa on November 20, 2019, 12:18:55 PM: Im banning my self for a while, Roy makes dirt look young :cheesy:

Ritchie, I kin help ya out there..

:laughing: :laughing:
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Forwardhandle on November 20, 2019, 01:42:57 PM: :biglaugh:
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: rainman on November 25, 2019, 02:55:03 AM: If you find used Nicholsons 49 and 50's there is a company that sharpens files very inexpensively. Find at yard sale or estate sales and you can have a very nice file or rasp to be made like new.
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Flem on November 25, 2019, 09:30:28 AM: Big fan of the rasp and cabinet files. I got a Shinto, with the goofy handle. Nobody mentioned that they are double sided. One is about 10tpi and the other about 24tpi. I agree with Ritchie on the high end rasps/files, the hand cut ones seem to be superior to the machine cut.
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Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Forwardhandle on November 26, 2019, 01:56:13 PM: I'm with you Flem the hand cut ones far and away better, there better quality tool steel to ,but they don't seem to lose there sharpness very quickly but it sure seems a lot of the company's that have made them in the past don't make them any more ! Good hand tools are a real pleasure to use I have wasted a lot of money on them being penny wise dollar dumb in the past !
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: OkKeith on November 27, 2019, 04:18:42 PM: I buy whatever Farrier's rasps they carry at the local farm and home store. I usually keep a new sharp one for rough work and an older one that is less sharp for finessing larger areas. When they get too dull to use they get turned into knives. I have a Farrier buddy that goes through a lot of rasps. The first time one skates on a hoof he pitches it and I get a few from him occasionally. I have a couple Nicholson rasps (no idea what number) that I have been using for 20 years and they seem to still work fine. I also have a large Nicholson Babbet file that works good on harder woods but takes some practice to use without gouging.

Honestly the rasp I use the most is one of the cheap Stanley or Nicholson 4-in-1 Handy Rasps. It has a flat course/fine side and a half round course/fine side. They are about $10 anywhere.

All mine aren't the high end stuff but they are not the crap grade either. They all work well for me. I think one reason is that I keep them clean, dry and chalked. I never let any wood chips or saw dust (especially Osage!) build up and set in the teeth and cause corrosion. I wear out more file cards than I do rasps.

OkKeith
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: slowbowjoe on November 27, 2019, 04:48:27 PM: Is it OK to clean them with a file card, or wire brush? Think I read a post here saying it's better to use a stiff bristled nylon brush?
I do chalk my metal files, didn't know it's also a good idea for the rasp.
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: OkKeith on November 27, 2019, 05:23:37 PM: Slowbowjoe-

I chalk my files and my rasps as well as use a file card on them all. I guess I don't really know any better. I don't think I would consider a regular steel wire brush but I don't see why a brass brush would hurt. I sometimes get chalk off the rasps on the work piece but it comes off easily.

If I'm not supposed to do my rasps that way... I'm sure someone will kindly let me know.

OkKeith
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: slowbowjoe on November 27, 2019, 06:04:57 PM: Just learning myself, and I also use a little brass brush sometimes, thinking it won't hurt the steel rasp.
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Forwardhandle on November 27, 2019, 06:33:09 PM: I use the file card brass brush all the time on my files & rasps and never had a isssue with dulling , I never tried the chalk the shinto is pretty much self cleaning or just shacking it or blowing it out !
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Forwardhandle on December 13, 2019, 11:33:07 AM: Finaly got around to ordering the Hiller BM should get here tomorrow will let you know my thoughts !
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Roy from Pa on December 13, 2019, 11:58:09 AM: Cool
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Forwardhandle on December 13, 2019, 05:06:44 PM: Well Roy I see these post about hand tools and guys asking questions then I'm the one that ends up buying new hand tools :cheesy: I love quality hand tools have whole collection guess I'm a addict :goldtooth:
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Roy from Pa on December 13, 2019, 05:30:43 PM: I understand Ritchie.

:thumbsup:
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Forwardhandle on December 14, 2019, 05:32:31 PM: Got my Hiller BM today super quality the steel is really ,really hard ,Im going to get wood & give it a few strokes to check it out tomorrow !

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Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Roy from Pa on December 14, 2019, 05:41:51 PM: I love mine...
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Pat B on December 14, 2019, 06:31:15 PM: That's like a farrier's rasp. Rough side to hog off wood and other side to smooth it out.
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Roy from Pa on December 14, 2019, 06:35:38 PM: Yes Pat, it is a Farriers rasp.
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Forwardhandle on December 14, 2019, 06:45:27 PM: Yea but it's like no other one I have seen or used very top notch quality it should last a life time for wood !
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Roy from Pa on December 14, 2019, 07:39:17 PM: Told ya so Ritchie.

I requested 2 of em for xmas last year and Mrs. Santa came through....

Best farrier rasp I've ever had.
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Forwardhandle on December 14, 2019, 07:54:12 PM: I have a collection of hand cut files , rasps & other high quality hand tools and it's on par with them ,I noticed they have a single sided one for a cheaper price if somebody needs it , I really like the size & weight of this one !
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Forwardhandle on December 15, 2019, 09:57:07 AM: Im going to put it threw the test going to hog this hickory to floor tiller with it !

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Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Roy from Pa on December 15, 2019, 11:33:53 AM: Twins(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191215/9203dd6be6af9846a45bb4f2ac526b18.jpg)
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Pat B on December 15, 2019, 12:19:54 PM: I have 2 farrier's rasps, one a farrier gave me many years ago after it wasn't usable for him anymore and one Clint gave me a few years ago. The difference in the two is like night and day. The one the farrier gave me was relatively dull(especially for his work) but it still hogs wood off better than any other rasp I have. The one Clint gave me is very sharp and quite heavy and also hogs wood off with probably a lot less work. My point is a farrier's rasp, good, bad or ugly will still hog wood off.
I don't have the means to buy the best tools out there but with what I can get my hands on I can still build wood bows. I don't have to have the best. I'm not putting down anyone's choices I'm just saying you don't have to have the best to do what you want to do. You can build a very effective bow using only stone tools. Most of us don't have the patience to do that but if you have nothing else to work with, it can be done.
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Forwardhandle on December 15, 2019, 01:13:48 PM: I agree with Pat I made my first bow with nothing more then one of those cheap scraper plain do hickeys the sell in the hard ware store a cheap draw knife & sand paper but fast forward I have a shop full of power tools & still very much enjoy going back to the therapeutic use of hand tools , it's a good thing sense most of my bow work goes on between 1:30 am & noon as I don't make much noise but I have learned over the years buy right buy once really apply's to hand tools !
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: bucknut on January 03, 2020, 10:48:44 PM: Got a Black Master in the mail today. It's a ripper for sure and smooths out really nice with the back side.
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Flem on January 04, 2020, 10:55:19 AM: Quote from: Forwardhandle on December 14, 2019, 05:32:31 PM
Got my Hiller BM today super quality the steel is really ,really hard ,Im going to get wood & give it a few strokes to check it out tomorrow !

Holy Cow! I need to get me one of them also. :bigsmyl:
Title: Re: RASPS?
Post by: Walt Francis on January 05, 2020, 10:42:17 PM: Quote from: Forwardhandle on December 15, 2019, 01:13:48 PM
........ I have learned over the years buy right buy once really apply's to hand tools !

It doesn’t take many tools to make a selfbow, I built my first one with a hatchet, Nicholson 4 in 1 rasp, and a Scraper made from the blade out of a broken hand plane. If you take proper care of, and use them correctly, your quality wood working hand tools will last a lifetime. At times, I still use the above tools and the farriers rasp I bought to make my second bow.

That said, there is a huge feel and functional/cutting difference between most inexpensive rasps and those that cost more. Use a cheep rasp made in China and an old Nicholson #49 or #50 (that’s been properly cleaned and stored) on piece of Osage and you can see and feel the difference. There is a significant difference between my #49 & #50 and the Japanese files Dean Torres sold around 2007.

When my #49 disappeared at a bow jamboree a few years back I replaced it with a new one, it was not near the quality of my old one. I bought a second #49 off the auction site, it hadn’t been maintained properly and wasn’t any better the new ones. After a lot of research I found some hand cut files made by Aruiou on the Lie Nielsen web site, then let my wife know what I was getting for Christmas. For less then the cost I paid for the new and auction site #49’s, I got a hand cut file (Made for using left handed. Ya, I didn’t know they came right or left handed either) that cuts and feels better then the Japanese made rasp I bought from Dean.

My recommendation is to buy the best quality you can the first time.