Post by: Flem on December 04, 2018, 05:18:35 PM
Post by: Roy from Pa on December 04, 2018, 05:36:37 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jo8QibHyQDg
Post by: Flem on December 04, 2018, 05:39:49 PM
Post by: BMorv on December 04, 2018, 05:58:11 PM
Post by: Flem on December 04, 2018, 06:05:59 PM
Post by: Flem on December 04, 2018, 06:20:05 PM
Post by: Roy from Pa on December 04, 2018, 06:30:58 PM
Post by: Flem on December 04, 2018, 06:48:42 PM
Set your cell phone camera setting to the lowest size.Didn't know I could do that. Just checked, it was at the lowest size. Never had a problem before.
Anyways... I like that set-up the guy cutting the Redwood is using. I have a spare bar, I could drill some holes in.
Post by: Roy from Pa on December 04, 2018, 06:57:06 PM
http://www.tradgang.com/tgsmf/index.php?topic=160865.0
Post by: BMorv on December 04, 2018, 08:02:16 PM
Post by: Flem on December 04, 2018, 10:12:36 PM
Post by: fujimo on December 05, 2018, 12:14:59 AM
alaska mills are great, but remember they are a huge kerf, but if its the only way, then thats better than nothing. there is also a cheaper side mill option, for once you have the log canted- then you can cut off vertical boards, however if you attach a stout plank to the top, and shim it to get it all true, you can make your first cut with one of the side mills, then roll the log, now you have a flat top to work with.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OCRgbA1QavE
like said before- a good ripping chain is a necessity, and not the standard cross cut chain.
the older saws ran at a lower rpm, and were actually way better for alaska milling, but the best saw, is the one you have i guess!!
i have seen some pretty handy band mills built with two car rims and tyres, on a carriage- giving a horizontal, mobile mill.
Post by: Shredd on December 05, 2018, 08:09:34 AM
The chainsaw will will not give you your best cut, large kerf and wastes wood, fatiguing and is slow to operate... Get the wood down to a manageable size and zip it through the bandsaw...
If you got a 14" saw with a 3/4 hp motor, you may want to up size to 1 1/2 hp if you are gonna be going through a lot of thick and dense wood...
If you got questions about the bandsaw, contact Fujimo... He is the resident expert on them...
Post by: Flem on December 05, 2018, 11:06:17 AM
Post by: Roy from Pa on December 05, 2018, 11:59:44 AM
Buy the best and only cry once..
Post by: BMorv on December 05, 2018, 12:36:34 PM
I plan to do like Shredd suggested, rough out the log with the Alaskan mill, then run the rest through the bandsaw.
You should be able to get a riser block for your 14" bandsaw which should get your resaw capacity to 12", but you need HP if you plan to do a decent amount of resawing over 6".
http://www.grizzly.com/products/Grizzly-Riser-Block-Kit-for-G0555/H3051
Post by: fujimo on December 05, 2018, 02:27:11 PM
it sure is easy to proclaim and tout what the best tool for the job is, but i always maintain the best tool is the one you have- and we all figure out a way to make it work, however if you are lucky enough to have a wife like BMorv, the 17" is a great option, that allows you to run a true resaw operation.
hp is critical, because if you lug the motor down, the blade speed drops, and then the gullets cant clear the sawdust adequately, then it starts to spill excessively past the blade- at best leaving a rough cut, or at worst sending your cut off at an angle. but by far the biggest issue, is now with the excessive friction you will be overheating the blade- and heat is a bandsaws enemy no. 1!!!
on my personal shop saw- i have a 16" saw. i run a 7/8" tooth pitch blade ( thats one tooth every 7/8") with lots of set and its .042 thick.
and i upgraded the motor to a 5hp.
smaller wheels wont like that thick of a band- on our big shop saw we run .050 bands.
and with smaller wheels you will need thinner bands, and in turn that means more TPI. Get as low a tooth count as you can get with lots of set, it will ensure adequate chip clearance, making for a faster more accurate cut, kinder on the saw, sure there will be a bit more kerf but we are only talking thou here!!
Set is so often overlooked, and its the most critical thing, you can get a hand setter- its a lot cheaper and a bit laborious- but its worth its weight in gold!!
we sharpen and set our own blades/bands- and we get an average of about 10 sharpenings per band- but we make sure they run cool all the time.
get the bands as tight as you can get them- you will never crank them tight enough with a hand crank to do them any damage- on our big saw they will tighten up to 2100 psi with a hydraulic ram, a blade can handle 15 000 psi of pressure- but will the bandsaw itself handle that???
there will be a lot of folk that will disagree with this, but if your machine has bearing guides- i would run bearing guides on the top and cool blocks on the bottom.
the cool blocks should just be clearing the band, so there is no scraping noise but as close as you can get them, the idea is, they will scrape the residue off the blade( sawdust) . on bearings, the sawdust falling through the blade guide will get "wheeled " through between the bearing and the blade, jerking and jarring the machine on a minute scale which in time will cost you bearings and other wear and tear.
learn how to tune your saw- lots of opinions on that out there too- and thats another whole can of worms~~~~
Post by: Roy from Pa on December 05, 2018, 04:42:53 PM
Quote
resident expert
Now that's funny right thar:)
:laughing: :wavey:
Post by: fujimo on December 05, 2018, 06:35:32 PM
Post by: Shredd on December 05, 2018, 06:49:44 PM
When I started seeing the newer band saws with bearing guides I thought it was great... But after getting sawdust and resin stuck on the wheels and having to replace bearings more often than blocks, I think I prefer the blocks over bearings...
Quoteresident expert
Now that's funny right thar:)
:laughing: :wavey:
Hey, resident wiseguy, somebody's got to be the expert... :laugh:
The man knows his way around bandsaws... :thumbsup:
Post by: Flem on December 05, 2018, 09:24:06 PM
I had a riser block on my 14", it needed more motor, so I took it off.
Post by: Roy from Pa on December 05, 2018, 09:38:54 PM
Post by: Flem on December 05, 2018, 09:45:30 PM
Go for it...I never saw a pitch fork in any of your shop pics ;)
Post by: Phil-D on December 06, 2018, 12:31:50 AM
Post by: fujimo on December 06, 2018, 01:15:20 AM
however, i do like a back bearing that runs against the back of the band- to help prevent deflection on the skinnier blades, but i use 1.3/8" blades on my big shop saw and also as the resaw blade on my 16" saw in my hobby shop.(that way i can resharpen them both without messing with my sharpeners settings.)
the 1.3/8" blades dont deflect much( only when they start getting dull- so its a great indicator to watch) as they are nice and wide and stable, so i dont even have the back bearings on my shop saw.
my shop saw is a 24" saw, and i have a 36" saw i am busy refurbishing as our back up saw.
if you set up the cool blocks correctly- they are great IMHO.
they need minimum clearance- just a few thou- just so that they are not rubbing, but also check that the weld on the band clears the blocks.
everytime you change the blade, or everytime you adjust the tracking- recheck the blocks or bearings for clearance.
A wider blade will run "stiffer" and will not be a straight line from the top wheel to the bottom wheel, it will be kind of bellied out slightly more than a narrower, blade.
always check your clearances- people neglect that, then their cuts turn to poo, and their blades dont last as long.
Bandsaws are my favourite tool, i do everything on them, but do require a bit of tweaking here and there to get optimal performance from them, and longevity on the blades.
i also buy the best blades i can/balanced against expected lifespan of the blade.- currently using woodmasters. or Ripper 37's.
used to use stellites- but at $200 a blade- it gets a bit expensive when they break on their first go around :knothead:
Post by: fujimo on December 06, 2018, 01:17:59 AM
always cut it through the heart, if you "box the heart" on a cant ( leaving the heart in the middle of the cant) it will check like crazy!!!
Post by: BMorv on December 06, 2018, 10:00:50 AM
Yeah that 17", 2hp Grizzly has been calling my name. I am working on rationalizing spending $1100.I just nagged my wife for 3 years and did a bunch of honey dos. I'm not sure it was worth it though :bigsmyl:
I had a riser block on my 14", it needed more motor, so I took it off.
Fujimo, what's your take on these "Euro-style Roller Disc" like on the 2 HP 17" Grizzly? I don't know a thing about them.
Post by: fujimo on December 06, 2018, 10:16:59 AM
Post by: Flem on December 06, 2018, 10:28:58 AM
Post by: fujimo on December 06, 2018, 11:59:12 AM
same idea as the cool blocks.
i have had a saw in the past, that had those sideways back bearing. personally i didnt like them- i prefer if the blade is going to touch- that it touches the roller face- not the side. but i am not an engineer so who knows.
problem i found with the side on bearings, was that you have to be really careful where the blade may contact the side face- too close to center and the bearing wont spin, and the blade will cut into the bearing pronto!
But, having said that, there should always be about 1/4" to 3/8" between the back of the band and the bearing, especially on bigger bandsaws, with wider bands, on skinny bands and smaller height bandsaws, that gap should be a lot smaller.
Ideally with normal cutting, and normal feedrate- the band should just be clearing, and just not touching the back bearing.
the back bearing is there to prevent the band from stretching backwards- and breaking the blade. too much pressure against the back bearing, will cause the band to flip, or tilt one way or the other- causing your cut to go crooked.
so its all a balancing act between a sharp blade- that hardly flexes at all, a slower feedrate, big enough toothspacing, to give adequate chip clearance, (but still ensure a nice finish), and as the blade gets dull, you have to slow the feedrate down, i really watch that back bearing, thats the tell tale for me, besides a " feel" and the sound of the blade getting duller, and the feedrate needing to be adjusted ( same as when you go to a bigger piece of wood and a deeper cut) but if the blade is going to touch the back bearing, then i missed something in my "feel" i need to pay attention, or sharpen the blade etc.
but its also horses for courses, we can make a 10- 12 " deep cut by 4' long in under 30 seconds, and i am still not happy with that rate- i am going to double the hp on the big saw to improve that.
when we cut Sitka spruce, as soft as it is, sawyers and bladesmiths will tell you, its so tough and fibrous, that you actually have to treat it like a hardwood. tooth hook angle and feedrate as if cutting hardwoods.
if i cut D. Fir, i can get at least a 30% increase in feed speed.
our biggest issue, is that the blade slows down then the chips dont clear fast enough, and that slows the blade more, an ever descending spiral.
i only draw comparisons to the commercial side of band saw application, just to offer a comparison. i never expect my hobby saw to perform the same, its a lot more finnicky- but the knowledge from the bigger saws- really helps with the smaller saws, and visa - versa.
Post by: wood carver 2 on December 06, 2018, 02:16:04 PM
My second was a 17 inch German made saw. Wow you might say, a European saw. Must be good. Not so. It was anything but. The table was extruded aluminum and not flat. The guides were too small and the lower guide support was a thin little piece of cast pot metal that broke twice. This saw also had the sideways back guide bearing. It began to clog with dust and the blade quickly cut a groove in it.
Now I have a 19 inch Grizzly and I love it. I looked long and hard at all their saws before ordering the one I have. Being a Canadian, I also looked at local dealers and I saved a thousand dollars buying from Grizzly. A similar saw from a dealer here in Cambridge was listed at over $3000 plus tax. I got mine from the USA delivered to my door for about $2000. I almost bought a bigger one but it was too tall to go into my shop. I normally run 1/4” and 3/8” blades because I cut lots of tight radius curves. The biggest blade I have is a 1 1/4” ripper. I re-sawed some still damp 12” doug fir that had been salvaged from a canal lock. The saw cut it perfectly straight and with absolutely no resistance. Wayne, I like your idea about running cool blocks. I think I’m going to give them a try.
I’d like to come up with a way to hoist small logs onto the saw to do my own re- sawing.
Dave.
Post by: fujimo on December 06, 2018, 02:31:45 PM
https://www.princessauto.com/en/detail/220-440-lb-electric-cable-hoist/A-p8041840e;jsessionid=lPgmB9fsAP3ojKi53wZpw90Y.pal-prod-com3
but being P.A. one might expect the same quality as your german saw maybe- but they are pretty cheap- and would be overpowered for the job, so may last.
i have a friend who has one in his shop for light work- he says it works really well.
Post by: Flem on December 07, 2018, 10:18:03 AM
I've managed to justify about $500 toward a new saw, $700 too go! Got some stuff to post on Craigslist today
Post by: wood carver 2 on December 07, 2018, 03:25:30 PM
I’m dying to see the inside of this log. It’s a gnarly bugger and there might be a couple of bow risers in it too.
Post by: wood carver 2 on December 07, 2018, 03:33:54 PM
Dave.
Post by: fujimo on December 07, 2018, 05:06:33 PM
in the old days they used lignum vitae, a wood from a tree indigenous to the Caribbean, but i think its now on the Cites list.
"cool blocks " are actually a phenolic with graphite in them. and so many other alloys are used nowdays besides the phenolic.
if the uhmw works, and its handy- thats the best tool for the job.
in fact i may give some a try- nice thing about it, is that it kind of " self lubricates" so reduces friction, just like the cool blocks!
Post by: Flem on December 07, 2018, 06:28:34 PM
Post by: BigJim on December 22, 2018, 09:40:25 AM
I am constantly switching companies ..or models of bandsaw blades because I'm never happy with the longevity or cut, but then I am a tough customer and very hard on them.
The absolutely best yield I get is with the wood slicer and as far as it goes, as long as I'm cutting dry and clean wood, they will last fairly long for me. I'm capable of getting 12 or more veneers out of a 1" thick block of ebony with a sharp wood slicer.
I bought a second laguna so I didn't have to change blades all the time.. or won't change them and then subsequently damage the blade. I find bamboo to dull the wood slicer quicker then ebony or ironwood.
I have bought several different carbide tipped blades and have found the best for me to be Lenox tri master 3's. I have cut up over 2000 bd feet of macassar ebony for Bear and tried all of the carbide models they have. I have only been happy with the tri-master. They cut clean and last long, but the kurf for cutting veneer is thick!
Now I am not done searching for the "best" blade and am a bit frustrated. Probably just need another saw or two!
I have tried USA blades... won't do that again. Have also tried starett. They were pretty good. Tried the lenox woodmaster CT.. won't waste that money again. Won't buy the Laguna blades anymore either.
So far, for carbide tipped, I have found the laguna tri master 3 to work the best for me and on non carbide, the wood slicer.
Not giving up on finding the "magic perfect indestructible" bandsaw blade.. So many guys out there looking for the magic bow, this is my version of that search.
On bandsaws... love my laguns's for resaw. My Grizzly's are good radius saws. Again, I hate changing blades so I don't, but I'm sure the laguna wood cut good radius if set with the corect blade.
BigJim
Post by: Flem on December 23, 2018, 07:27:18 PM
Post by: Roy from Pa on December 23, 2018, 09:12:55 PM
LOL
Post by: BigJim on December 24, 2018, 12:15:43 AM
Post by: Roy from Pa on December 24, 2018, 07:52:30 AM
:biglaugh:
Post by: Forwardhandle on December 24, 2018, 08:49:21 AM
Post by: Shredd on December 24, 2018, 11:23:14 AM
Post by: BigJim on December 24, 2018, 02:49:11 PM
I was told by Carter that the bearing guides were superior to the ceramic for resaw… That might be, but not my experience. I love the ceramic guides on my Laguna saws.
BigJim
Post by: Forwardhandle on December 24, 2018, 03:32:24 PM
Lenox venerre blade that will cut paper thin veneerers works good with this saw !
I had a smaller 14" saw I got rid of that now I wish I had of keeped for smaller blades ! I can run any blade on the Agazzani but kind of a pain to change blades all the time !
Post by: Flem on December 24, 2018, 04:33:30 PM
Post by: Forwardhandle on December 24, 2018, 05:22:27 PM
Post by: wood carver 2 on December 24, 2018, 10:05:06 PM
Dave.