I'm just looking for some advice with the above stuff. I just finished an elk hunt which was great but I came away without a bull and some ???? I know the recipe for elk is heavy arrow. I'm shooting a Two Tracks Echo #62 @ 30" and I'm drawing 31". I'm shooting a Black Eagle Vintage 350 32 1/2" long with a 50 gr brass insert and a 250 gr head. Total arrow weight on my scale 640 gr give or take. I'd like to drop some in weight to improve trajectory some, I'd like to shorten my arrow as well, to make it easier to haul around on horseback. I was thinking of dropping the brass insert and dropping to a 400 spine and cutting the arrow shaft to 31 3/4". I bare shafted the 400 spine at that length but that will reduce my weight significantly. Thoughts? Advice? Suggestions? Thanks Guys. I had a couple opportunities that I would have taken but I was concerned about trajectory.
Don't know if I fully understand your question. "I had a couple opportunities that I would have taken, but I was concerned about trajectory." Seems to be a way of saying they were too far away (and you made the correct decision not to shoot). If you're concerned about trajectory, you just have to learn what the trajectory is at the distances you were considering and practice until you're confident at that range.
The combination you're shooting now seems pretty good to me. What you're proposing will drop overall arrow weight to around 550 grains, I expect. Still plenty and it will flatten trajectory some. However, you'll always be faced with the "concern about trajectory." It's your subconscious telling you the shot is too far.
Long(er) shots are more difficult for a number of reasons, trajectory being only one of them. Much more difficult to "pick a spot" because the critter may be too far away to decipher detail. Distance (for the subconscious) is also more difficult to judge. The critter's size has a greater chance of misleading the farther away it is. And so on.
Long story short, you did good. Passed on shots that were beyond your range. Practice and experience are the best way to increase your range. Just keep at it. Of course, the other goal should be to get closer. Good luck.
Thank you. The shot was in the open 35-40 yds. But there were a couple limbs obstructing the flight path. My mind was in race mode. I knew the distance without the limbs wasn't a problem. That's where I thought I might have gotten it done with a flatter trajectory. I know that a heavy arrow penetrates better than a lighter arrow, but is there a spot where heavy and slow meet lighter and not as slow in the penetration dept. ? I'm just rethinking all my decisions on the hunt. I passed on all 4 opportunities I had that were in bow range. The one I just explained was the only one I thought I had a fix for. Thanks
For me, the happy place where I find the best blend of speed/weight/Trajectory is 9-10 gpp. I've played with various weights and that "range" seems to always give me the performance/penetration/trajectory I seek. Your rig is about 10gpp or so.
The bow/arrows I'm carrying into the woods on Monday when season opens comes in at about 10.2. A friend makes his own bows and arrows and prefers his around 16-17 gpp. Yours may well be different. I don't shoot at animals past the 20-25 yard mark myself, but I don't have much of a trajectory issue hunting stumps and targets out to 40 yards.
But next time the limbs may be lower and a slower more arcing arrow might clear them.
I dropped 100 grains in my arrow over the summer, from 12 grains per pound to 10. It changed my point on distance all of 2 yards - so you may not see significant change in trajectory.
I will stay with the lower weight arrow as it has a slightly better tune, has higher foc, and is still heavy for deer hunting. I went from about 18% foc to 27% foc and find the higher foc is much more forgiving. Did this by changing from a easton FMJ shaft to a black eagle rampage shaft in the same spine, everything else is the same.
I think I'm just trying to fix something that probably isn't broke. As usual. Coming home empty handed has had me re-living every encounter to see what I could have done differently. Last night I re enacted the shots in question and with any archery set up it was 50/50 at best. Down hill with obstructions just isn't the shot for me. Thanks for the help Guys
If you are truly shooting 62@30 then you aren't going to have an arrow weight problem with anything over 550 grains. No need to nit pick your self to death....just worry about getting back in the field after those elk again.....that's your real challenge!!! :readit:
Best of luck.... :campfire:
Thanks Terry. I told myself I wasn't going to release unless the shot was perfect. I had weight on the string 3X. It was a great hunt. Working out the logistics to go again as we speak. If I could have only one more hunt it would be a wilderness elk hunt with my longbow. Thanks for the comments Guys.
Chain2, 65# with a 650g arrow is perfect in my book. With a Hill style bow, you could drop 100g of arrow weight and not see much difference in speed, thats just how they are. Kind of like a Diesel truck, not a big difference between loaded and empty.
Not sure how long you've been shooting that setup, but I would stick with it and get to know it real well. With a 31" draw your makin' a lot of horsepower and with Elk there is no such thing as too much...especially when thing go less than perfect.
Yes Westbrook...
65@THIRTY ONE is the main asset. If everyone shot that format.....there would be no need for most things bowhunters worry about. :readit:
Quote from: Terry Green on September 27, 2018, 10:28:41 AM
Yes Westbrook...
65@THIRTY ONE is the main asset. If everyone shot that format.....there would be no need for most things bowhunters worry about. :readit:
Except finding a variety of arrows to try because you really can't trim them down to tune with a very few exceptions! I wish my draw was 30" instead!
Goat I hear ya,... luckily most people don't have to worry about a 31 inch draw. If it were, there would be many more options for arrows. :thumbsup:
I tried dropping some arrow weight and stuck with it for several months but just a day before going hunting 2 weeks ago, I threw that lighter setup in the corner and went back to the 665 grain set up I usually use. Much better!
You'll likely pick up some noise, vibration and shock by lightening your arrow. Maybe not noticeable at first. Burt it can get to you and mess up your shooting.
The 10 GPP standard was for a 28" draw. Even at 650 gr your still shooting flatter than most hunters.
My bow and draw length is 59lb#30". I used to be at 31". I must have shrunk! Also some bow grips tend to need a little extra arrow length to keep the blade from hitting the riser. The longbows I have now seem to give me more breathing room.
Tedd
Really?... the thin piece of leather or rubber or Gator tail is actually causing people to adjust the length of their Arrows by that amount?
I have to say it... boy, we do have too much to worry about. :o
I think Tedd means the depth of the riser .
Jmho.....I shoot 55 @ 32 with 32.5 CE Heritage 250 or 350 from 640-670 grains. Shot a bull @ 15 yards this year out of a treestand, he dropped and I spined him. I "WOULD NOT" change a thing with your draw length and arrow combination. Absolutely lethal for elk.
Remember elk move.....I shoot pretty well, anything over 30 yards...they move! No matter your trajectory...elk move. Kinda repeating myself, but I hope you get it. Good luck on your next hunt. You are shooting a great setup.
Scott.
Thanks Guys. I'm sticking with what I have until I figure out how to shoot wood arrows.
Yes, The riser depth. (Distance from the throat of the grip to the back). Not a problem these days w some longer arrow choices but it used to be a real hassle trying to tune when you couldn't cut the arrow off.
Tedd
Quote from: Chain2 on September 28, 2018, 11:02:47 AM
Thanks Guys. I'm sticking with what I have until I figure out how to shoot wood arrows.
Great thing about woodies is the ability to have them footed to get extra length. Killed a good bull last year with a Douglas fir arrow footed with purpleheart. 33 bop and total arrow weight of 688 grains. Very lethal setup, and QUIET!
Scott.
Still seems odd to me since I've shot self bows non dished Howard Hill bows 115 pound War bows and lower wrist recurves and everything in between with the same exact Arrow length , yes the same exact Arrow length....29" bop... for every bow I have shot
My carbons are as quiet as Woody's.... I have never shot a noisy set up and never will if I had a problem with carbons I wouldn't be shooting them or killing all the stuff I have for the last 20 years.
Sorry about the grip thing my draw length is 28 and my arrows are 29 in b o p and I've never had an issue. Maybe that's because I have an inch leeway, so disregard my odd comments above regarding those issues only.
However, I will reiterate that I don't shoot loud arrows or loud setups at all. I have found that my Woodys and carbons are about the same as far as noise, and I can't say the say the same thing about the hollow aluminums that have a ring as they travel down range.... again if my carbons were noisy Not only would I not be hunting with them, I would have never have managed this collection of some of my most favorite big game kills along with some some small game such as pheasants and quail.
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I shoot 640 grains off a 45# at my draw and feel like the trajectory is perfect. It's all what you like.