Trad Gang
Main Boards => The Bowyer's Bench => Topic started by: C. Johnson on August 11, 2018, 02:10:00 PM
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So, I recently placed an order with Kenny for some of the Bearpaw clear glass and Stabil-core. It is my first time working with these materials and my first time ordering from Kenny. I wanted to give some feedback and observations.
First, Kenny is a pleasure to work with. He made the whole process very easy for a technology retard like me by patiently talking me through the use of PayPal. ;)
Also, the material arrived very quickly and very securely packaged. Top notch job with that.
I will most definitely place more orders with Kenny in the future.
As far as the glass is concerned, my initial impression after glue up and removing the tape is that this Bearpaw glass is much clearer than Gordon's. I have no way of proving this scientifically, but it is very obvious to the naked eye. Even to my highly near-sighted eyes. ;)
I found NO streaks at all, only a couple of very slightly cloudy spots which I can't even capture with the camera.
As for the Stabil-core, we'll have to see how it acts when the bows are finished, weighed, and shot. I'm building a pair of mild D/R longbows which don't necessarily need something to help prevent limb twist, but I had got into the habit of using a strip of Uniweft as more of an accent in the stack. In this application, Uniweft is probably better in that it is available in more colors and is thicker. Also, though there are many competing theories about where in the stack a guy should place the Stabil-core strip, I place mine right under the riser. I do this because I believe it adds to the strength of the thin fade outs of the riser while still helping to prevent twisting of the limbs.
Mainly, I wanted to try the Stabil-core in a couple of my recurve designs, particularly, my #3. I build this mainly as a kid's bow and I wanted to add some stability without adding too much to the stack thickness. I have a pair of these coming up and I will document my experiences for that application.
I was initially a little worried about cutting the Stabil-core, as it is almost 2" in width, and I needed it to be 1 1/2". I shouldn't have been concerned. It cuts very easily with a good pair of ordinary scissors. I think Monterey figured this out on one of his excellent bows.
Anyway, the project is ongoing and I'll keep posting updates as I go along.
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(http://i.imgur.com/YWMQdBQ.jpg)
Here are the riser blanks. Mirror image Bocote and Beli wood with accent strips of Zebra, black palm, and maple bordered with strips of maple.
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Not the best pic, as I only have a smart phone camera, but the wood grain is very visible and clear through the glass.
(http://i.imgur.com/qpt9iCD.jpg)
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Here's the Bocote. One of my favorite woods to work with.
(http://i.imgur.com/mv5vaPc.jpg)
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Side by side, after glue up and sanding square.
(http://i.imgur.com/ARcdmmw.jpg)
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One more. I'll post more pics as I progress with the build. Thanks for looking!
(http://i.imgur.com/24NGV8W.jpg)
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Very nice it looks great !
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Thank You, Craig! My pleasure ! :thumbsup:
And talk about quick, didn't I just send that stuff out? :o
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Thank You, Craig! My pleasure ! :thumbsup:
And talk about quick, didn't I just send that stuff out? :o
Yeah! It's almost like you used a Star Trek transporter to beam it into my shop!
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This is a great opportunity to learn more about stabilcore. I'm especially looking forward to your impressions of it in a recurve.
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I meant quick on your end! Two glued up already!!
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Sweet..
Not you Kenny, meant those 2 risers above:)
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That’s a relief !! :laughing:
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Ok, so I have both bows roughed out and overlays glued on. I cut string nocks in one of them so I could get an initial draw weight. At present, this bow is drawing 44# @28". This is fairly typical at this stage with this bow. My target weight is 40# @28". I should come pretty close to that. As such, I'm going to say, at least at this point, the Stabil-core and Bearpaw seem to make a negligible difference in draw weight at the same total stack as Gordon's and Uni-weft.
.400" total stack thickness.
66" NTN
18" riser
1.380" at fades. Full width to 12" from center line. Then, tapers straight from 1.380" to .520" at base of string nocks. And a partridge in a pear tree. ;)
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(http://i.imgur.com/ja56gqz.jpg)
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(http://i.imgur.com/ceK5Glp.jpg)
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You are a bow making machine there Craig Awsome :thumbsup:
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Nice..
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Nice..
Yes they are, love the veneers.
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(http://i.imgur.com/YrE58ms.jpg)
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I have them nearly done. I'm in the process of filling the grain with superglue before I spray the finish. It's a slow and tedious process, but the smooth finish will be worth the effort. Hopefully, I'll shoot clear coat after work on Tuesday.
(http://i.imgur.com/ym2YWdT.jpg)
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Can you explain a bit about that "filling the grain with super glue"? First time I'm hearing about that.
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Can you explain a bit about that "filling the grain with super glue"? First time I'm hearing about that.
Sure. As you know, some species of wood have an open grain structure. Some examples of this are Wenge, walnut, oak, ash, and Beli. If a guy doesn't fill the grain with something, the open pockets in the grain will show up as dimples or "pockmarks" in the finish after spraying.
Think of it as spackling any nail holes in a wall before it is painted so that a guy gets a smooth paint job.
I use superglue because it dries very fast, is crystal clear, and has the added advantage of being able to seal oily tropical woods which may prevent adhesion of the finish. (such as rosewood or cocobolo)
What I do is blow off the wood with an airhose, wipe down with acetone, and then simply rub superglue, a few drops at a time, into the wood. Let it dry completely, and sand smooth with 220 grit. Repeat as necessary until I can't see any pores in the wood. I just use my fingertip to apply the glue. I just have to stay in motion to prevent gluing my finger to the wood. ;) Also, don't use acetone between coats, only to wipe down the bare wood. (acetone will melt the superglue)
There are a lot of guys who use this method. I'm sure a guy could find a video on YouTube as well. I know my description isn't the best.
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I use superglue as well. Love the fact that you can apply and sand in the same day(usually just an hour or two).
I will add that I also use my finger, but wear a rubber glove. Like Craig stated, as long as you keep moving it wont stick.
Also, make sure you do it in a well ventilated area. The fumes are terrible!! I do mine outside with a nice breeze.
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Oh yeah....bows look sweet Craig :thumbsup:
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Thanks Bvas!
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Great looking bows!! :thumbsup:
On my trade bow, I filled the wenge with ea 40 and acetone mixed 50/50 . It worked great. I try different stuff on trade bows that I think will work because I can get feedback from somebody else that way along with my own.
You will have to ask Dannon if the finish fell off later... :biglaugh:
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Ok, a little back story on these two bows.....
In my non-bow building life, I am the foreman of the plumbing shop for one of the larger public school districts in southern Colorado. I'm very fortunate to have some rock solid, good, dependable guys working for me. While I love virtually everything about working in the public sector, it does have a couple of draw backs.
First off, even with the recent pay raise we received, the salary isn't exactly competitive. Second, there is absolutely no mechanism for merit based rewards. In other words, I can't give a raise to a guy who's busting his ass and doing an amazing good job.
Lately, there's been a lot of ass busting going on. I've asked my guys to do more and more without adequate labor and resources to meet the demands of the job. These things are beyond my control. We have a bunch of MBA's and engineers upstairs now, but I digress....
What I do have control of is doing something on my own to recognize and reward these guys for their hard work and dedication. These two guys in particular have really stepped up. One is a compound shooter who finally agreed, performance aside, a trad bow is a living, breathing thing with a soul. The other used to shoot with his dad when he was a kid and would like to get back into it. How convenient. :goldtooth:
Anyway, I built these two longbows for them.
I'm going to give each one of these guys a bow, a dozen of my laminated arrows, and some basic tackle to get them addicted, er, I mean started. ;)
Don't worry, I'm doing this privately so as to not stir up trouble.
Anyway, I just wanted to let all of you know these bows are going to a couple of terrific guys.
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This isn't the best pic, but I hoped to illustrate what I mean about filling the pores in the grain of the wood with superglue. This is sanded smooth, but still needing a couple three more coats before finishing.
(http://i.imgur.com/pRerTb2.jpg)
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Hopefully I can shoot clear coat tomorrow after work! This just came a couple of days ago. :goldtooth:
(http://i.imgur.com/zE0VQTc.jpg)
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Great looking bows!! :thumbsup:
On my trade bow, I filled the wenge with ea 40 and acetone mixed 50/50 . It worked great. I try different stuff on trade bows that I think will work because I can get feedback from somebody else that way along with my own.
You will have to ask Dannon if the finish fell off later... :biglaugh:
I love wenge, it is one of my favorite woods. I would use it more frequently if it wasn't such a pain to finish.
I think I've tried just about everything at one time or another. I haven't tried thinned out EA40 though. It's certainly worth a shot!
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Sounds like a couple of guys who deserve a bow! Well done! And the bows look great.
I have used super glue in the past also. Then I switched to using tru oil, no fumes, but it does take longer. My last 2 bows I used thunderbird and filled the grain using just the thunderbird finish - worked well.
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Got 'em done. Now, I just have to finish the arrows. I swear, building arrows from scratch is 10 times as much work as building bows, but that's a topic for a different thread.
(http://i.imgur.com/zOSmhli.jpg)
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(http://i.imgur.com/ncyi4ta.jpg)
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(http://i.imgur.com/6mdu7BS.jpg)
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(http://i.imgur.com/ymq8bVH.jpg)
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(http://i.imgur.com/ZIs4mAJ.jpg)
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(http://i.imgur.com/QjaumR1.jpg)
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(http://i.imgur.com/3bYRFo5.jpg)
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In conclusion, I'm very happy with the quality and especially the clarity of the Bear paw glass. I will most definitely be using more of it in the future and I will definitely order it from Kenny.
My next double build is going to be a pair of my small pattern, Recurve #3. I think this will provide a better evaluation of the Stabil-core.
I'll keep you posted. Thanks for looking!
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Very nice, Craig.
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That finish is sweet that post cat rat rod finish is got to be tuff as nails ! They will love it.
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Nice job Craig and extremely nice to your employees!! :thumbsup:
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They look great Craig! I am sure you are going to have a couple of happy guys.
I agree with the bearpaw glass - I will be using more as well and I really like buying by the inch for little to no waste - thanks Kenny!
On the stabil-kore, I think it is worth putting in the stack in both the hybrid and recurve I built. No data to support my claim, but I think it does make for a more stable bow. You do have to like the black stripe you end up with in the limbs though.
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I’ve been looking for a how-to on laddered riser accent strips. Is anyone aware of a build along that has this part included? It’s a beautiful effect, and I want to do it. Lol. Thanks for any info.
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Not sure what that looks like... Can you post a pic of an example???
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Maybe it's also called a mosaic? Here are pics of an example. [ You are not allowed to view attachments ] [ You are not allowed to view attachments ]
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Mike L. my guess is this stuff is what you need...
https://www.rockler.com/search/go?ts=custom&w=inlay%20banding
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Oh, those are cool! It never occurred to me to look for them like that. I just assumed those were going all the way through the riser. You think this is an inlay? I guess it’s more realistic than gluing those little tiny pieces together.