I shoot traditional because it is fun. I can pick up a bow grab some arrows hit the great out doors at shoot. It is simple. My first introduction to bows was a fiberglass deal with a surveyor line for a string and whatever I could scrounge for arrows. Some how I hit alot.
Now there's alot to worry about: brace height, foc, spine, fletch height, draw weight, the list goes on and on and on.
Now I'm not saying that for some of you these things arn't fun to figure out and mess with but for some it takes the "fun" out of archery. For the average guy looking through the pow wow on any given day you would think that your indeep trouble if you don't have all these things mastered.
I recently fell into this trap by reading and taking to heart too much here. I lost the fun because I was messing with gear instead of just shooting. I was lucky because I spoke with a few archers that I respect who basicly said don't worry about it just shoot.
I just wanted to post to let all those out there who like me are/ were drowning in the gear talk about what is right to not worry about it and just have fun shooting. The reality is alot of animals have been taken using most setups out there.
Mitch
I like to be sure my bow is set up correctly so I can shoot well and have fun, and not get hurt.
Well said Mitch!! I to almost got caught up in all of the "technical stuff". One day it hit me...I just want to find arrows that fly good and go shoot!! I find it is fun for me to sit here an read some of the threads to see what other people are doing and what they are finding. This is just my $.02 and like you said some guys I am sure enjoy doing all the other things. That is what makes this all fun!!
I probably need to spend more time tuning. But heck i just like flinging arrows.
Maybe we are all guilty of (compounding) issues when it comes to trad archery. Most of the "poor shots" I see on the range just need a little help with their set up and then it's... FUN, FUN, FUN!!!
It is a simple way to shoot, as you say. Having a good time goes with getting better. Alot of us, myself included learned the hard way. Maybe some archers are tryin' to learn everything too fast. That will take the fun out of anything.
... mike ... :archer: ...
I agree. All I heard was trad shooting is so simple. Yea right. Just look at these boards and see how technical things get.
You can always take those threads with a grain of salt and keep on shooting like always.It works pretty good and keeps the head clear. ;)
Unfortunately what you are saying is all too true and most likely a product of the technically advanced society we live in today. I mean lets face it we are here discussing "traditional archery" in an internet message board, a virtual campfire. Not to mention a lot of the guys here have come back from compounds like myself and there is always something to tinker with on those set ups.
If you want to keep things simple and thats what you find fun then by all means I say keep it simple. I came back from compounds to get away from all the tech stuff and all the silly little adjustments myself. Others have as much fun tweaking and adjusting as they do shooting and again if thats what does it for ya I say go for it.
Bottom line is there is an abundance of great information here on these boards that we may choose to put to use... or not. I say as long as your set up is capable of quick and humane kills and you are happy with it theres no need to get wrapped up in the technical stuff unless thats what makes you happy.
"Now there's alot to worry about: brace height, foc, spine, fletch height, draw weight, the list goes on and on and on."
Whats to worry about, tune the bow and shoot it.
Eric
I think is important to have your equipment set up correctly but after doing that once you should not have to worry about it again for quite some time. When I first get a new bow I get it all set up so that arrows fry the way that I want them to then I shoot. If arrows start flying funny I look to find what is wrong, fix it and then shoot. Some of my bows have not been "tuned" for years. Every once in a while I make a fist with my thumb sticking out to check brace height in case the string stretched but that is about it.
I agree, this is suppose to be fun. Just enjoy!
You search out the posts on here that indicates "FUN"-trips to BC for goats,elk hunting trips,etc... I scan over the posts and if they're debating all the different baloney I could read over on the compound or crossbow forums--I move on to FUN stuff. I got my shooting equipment lined out years ago and I see no reason to fret or stew or debate all that with anyone. LET THE FUN BEGIN!!
AH Yes the good olden days. When ya bought 100 ceder shafts sorted them by shootin them, The "FLYERS" were set aside for rabbits and such. Ya hot glued some ole green Bears on the front of ye shooters. How many grains ?....enough.
Somethings never change Brace, knocking point and such. Some things will always be evolving for some I guess. But one thing for this gay ole guy will always be consistent. FUN. And I am darn sure set in these old ways.
Every once in a while I will be shooting poorly and get myself all worked up. I have to have a little talk with my self about how I'm just a big kid playing in the back yard. I make myself relax and smile... normally I start shooting better
AMEN
AMEN
My carbons are set up with the findings of Dr. Ed. My cedars are set up with the wisdom of Ishi. They both make me happy. Many times when practicing, I will stand still, close my eyes and listen to wind in the trees. Good times.
Is one bit of advice that I have picked up on here, guys were saying how long the string or bow, once I get it set up I don't know string it, it stays set, and then you just have to worry about the fun, I hassle over the arrow that I will shoot simply because I want to know if I'm making mistakes, or if they're the mistakes of unbalanced equipment, but once you get it down, you're good to go.
If you get everything set, it constitutes consistency :clapper:
And I like that !
Carl
I'll respectfully disagree. When I first started shooting a couple of years ago, I was picking aluminum arrow sizes based on the Easton charts and was way overspined. I had to to point the arrow a foot to the right to be remotely on target. By having the technical stuff correct, there was one less peice of the puzzle that needed to be solved in the journey of shooting accurately. The biggest enjoyment of shooting, for me and probably a lot others, is watching an arrow fly true and to the mark.
Is it spring yet???
Gear Cheer is nice....but I'd sure like to see more chat about hunting, hunting tips, woodsmanship, scouting/hunting methods from different regions, hunting camp tips, set up scenarios....etc...
One thing I also noticed....since the TX Sweat and Jig and Pig...there haven't been any group hunts to follow along....anyone going on a big hunt soon?
We definitely have more sources of information and advice now due to the internet. It was not too long ago we were in the dark as far as some technical issues were concerned. Now all you have to do is post or read a post. If you were shooting with one person, I am sure you will take some of their advice. Now, you have thousands in TradGang for advice. Take your pick, but YOU pick. Remember Fred Asbel's article in TBM on short bows and how many posts were a result? How many went to short bows? Know how many bows Rod Jenkins sold for ACS due to Masters of the Barebow? I for one, think it is more fun than ever with so many people and the resulting accumulated knowledge. My father said: If you took advice it's because you needed it.
I personally get just as much enjoyment out of experimenting, tuning, and finding what's right for me, as I do shooting the sucker once I get a tune. Can't help it, I'm an obsessive-compulsive problem solver.
Hey, it's all shooting, and it's all good...
Me too NDTerminator... no cure for us.
I do love to mess with stuff, but it's always in the interest of shooting better. I'm personally glad that forums like this exist, cause lot's of people don't have access to knowledge that can help them shoot better. I do think everyone is too worried about whether this or that setup will kill something. The latest "high foc" info has got people scurrying around in a panic; now they aren't sure if an arrow with only 10%foc will actually kill a deer. Kind of like going to church: take what you need, and leave the rest there. Paul.
Ditto NDTerminator's post.
String'em, and fling'em!
Just watching arrows fly is fun. And right you are, it is too easy to "complicate" everything to death.
im with terry.....lets go hunting!
I set my bow up to hunt with and I try to hunt hogs or something at least twice a week, most times more. I guess you could say I am a bowhunter and not so much an archer or a tinkler with equipment as once my bow is set up like I want it( I haven't changed my set up in years) I hunt. I practice and I hunt. Don't have time or desire to tinker with my setup. Terry us south Ga boys get together quite often. I'll give you a heads up on the next one.
I think there's a fine line between "string it and fling it" and needing a Mossy Oak slide rule.
Ignoring proper tuning and correct arrow flight is how we end up with people who are perplexed as to why their broadheads wind plane, or the fact that they can't shoot through a deer with a 60# recurve.
On the other hand, there's no reason to take things to extremes either. I don't need a setup capable of shooting through Tembo in order to hunt deer, elk, or even moose for that matter.
A bow tuned to shoot through an elephant... Cool idea.... :D
I've been banging my head over this issue for some time. I just kept thinking "it's the simplicity that got me into traditional archery". I want to be well tuned so I get good accurate flight. A numb-skull can figure 9-10 grains per pound, but all the mental calasthenics that goes into some arguments make my eyes bleed! I can read along and follow the physics well enough, but I don't want to. I been around long enough to know that the current thoughts will evolve again soon enough. If folks are lucky it won't change much before October and they won't have to feel guilty shooting their current set-ups. LOL. I get much more pleasure reading about hunting and craftsmanship and friends and camps.
But... after that lengthy diatribe I will give credit where it is due. These things are good for some to know and teach. Everybody gets there jollies somewhere and that keeps this site fun for everyone. :)
Agreed Mitch! Now when are we going to make you a new bow? :thumbsup:
It's been said on here a thousand different times and a thousand different ways over the years, but why let anyone else have a say in what brings you joy? If you are interested in performance issues then the "techy" threads will flip your switch. If not, don't read 'em. If you know your set-up will be adequate for your intended quarry, then why let ANYone's opinion influence your confidence? That's just giving somebody else power over you. It's bad enough to let someone you know do it, but to let somebody you've never met steal your joy via an internet forum is ludicrous.
I love this place for the vast array of information, but there are forums I've never even felt the least bit compelled to peruse and I open very few threads. The choices are great and serve me.....I won't serve them.
I am currently enjoying the discussions on arrow weight and FOC issues although I've never posted to a single thread on those topics. When I shot a compound I used the heaviest arrows I could find, put the big Snuffers on the end, never used a release or sights and always had the slowest arrows (~185 ft/sec) and shot the lowest 3D scores of all my friends. Yet I managed to kill deer when my friends didn't. Nowadays I shoot similar set-ups with about 11gpp, FOC of about 32% and not a necessarily fast bow. It amazes me that all this happened while the conventional wisdom (friends and mfrs' marketing) were telling me something else. But I never let the detractors take any of my fun away and now I feel a little vindicated by some of the testing. BUT.....if you like the lighter, faster set-ups, shoot 'em because YOU want to not because someone else said you could. :archer:
This is some good stuff right here. It's much like where the rubber meets the road issues. The heart of why we do this silly stuff.
Back in the 50s when I really started my adventure with this stuff, I found something that I could embrace that seemed to be less competitive than High School sports. Most likely because there were much fewer involved, most were playing sports. The few of us that did do Archery formed a very close brotherhood.
All of our journeys with Bow in hand turned into mythical adventures. Where Robin Hood, Fred Bear, Saxton Pope and Art Young's adventures could be lived out in real time and real life.
My High School years we spent many hours in the same areas that Chester Stevenson was writing and reminiscing about. As we wandered those haunts it was ever present, that we could be walking the very path that Chet and Grover had walked, we could be smelling the same smells that they too smelled.....What a rush for a young budding archer. That was the beginning for me.
That was my VERY first Relationship, I formed a bond with an old Bear hand me down bow that I cherish today.
A relationship that I endeavor to preserve to this day with every bow that I take a field.
I learned that I may not be perceived as being as good a shot as Howard Hill. But in my relationship with my Archery Equipment and within myself, I could do everything he did. Then as now that was, and is all that really matters. I am totally happy with what I can do, confident that we can and will get any thing we attempt done.
With My bow in hand I have a PERSONAL relationship with it. it has come from many hours of time spent together. My bows have names those names have been formed from this relationship. I know these bows as well as I know my family and better than I know some of my friends. Like Robin Hood, Bear, Pope and Young, Bows to them had a soul. So BooBear has a sole to me.
For those of us who have had the fortune to have in our hands a piece of the OLD ARCHERS history, or to walk the pine covered paths of the old ones, gaze across a valley that Pope and Young once gazed across you'll know exactly of what I speak.
For those of you that are still dreaming of those Special Flavors....Enjoy archery and press on with your Personal Relationship, the FUTURE is NOW
Before I started really chasing deer; I shot a 45 pound Ben Pearson; and I would shoot arrows and mark the arrows that hit the target best. The arrow that hit the best I inked #1 on and such until I needed to replace the 'good arrows'. I was shooting groundhogs on a regular basis and having fun doing it.
It can be that simple...
I do though like to have my whole quiver full now: with '#1' arrows.
Fun is still there !
But yep; the best way to ruin the soup- is to add to much stuff to it: trying to make it better.
:campfire: :archer:
some interesting thoughts here.
you can defiantly over complicate things trying to find better more efficient ways of doing things, but that is natural to humans and is why we are the top of the food chain. however everything we come up with is often as destructive to us and our surroundings as it is beneficial.
i like to tinker with my hunting set-up and make sure i have the best set-up for whatever im hunting.
I look at the great Archers of old how they where always testing and trying new things to improved there bows, arrows, broadheads etc..
i would love to see more hunting threads and adventures posted.
as with everything you get the "Do"ers and the "Dreamers"
QuoteOriginally posted by MW:
I just wanted to post to let all those out there who like me are/ were drowning in the gear talk about what is right to not worry about it and just have fun shooting...
Mitch
I hear ya Mitch, but to be honest, the better I shoot the more fun I have. And I think if I hadn't started following the threads on this board 3 years ago I would still be shooting like I was 3 years ago - and it wasn't pretty. ;-)
Last Sat at my club I watched a guy have fits trying to make his compound machine shoot. At first it was funny but then it got down right sad. I went out and shot our 3D course twice and went back to the clubhouse. He was still trying to make it shoot. I remember the 2 years I spent in the compound ranks and this guys situation brought back into focus the reason I came back to trad. Sure I tune my bow and arrow set up, but it doesn't take long and once its done its all shooting and fun from then on.These poor guys are constantly tuning, I kinda feel sorry for them and sure as hell will never go back.
You can get as technical or not as you choose to. There is enough room in traditional bowhunting for everyone.
To me, the most fun is hitting something with a longbow/recurve. I ain't no Howard Hill and found that if I pay attention a few of the technical aspects, my shooting is markedly better than when I don't...if I do my part. Some guys can hit whatever they want with any old stick and string...I just ain't one of them.
All the tuning, fiddling, preping goes away when I'm at a shoot (stumping or otherwise) and certainly for a hunt. I have utmost confidence in my gear and that relaxes me even more....allowing me to have more fun. You don't necessarily have to do that to have fun, but it can be fun in itself. I consider the tinkering, testing, and trying something new part of the fun of this lifestyle.
I agree wholeheartedly with Mr. Westbrook: To me, the key is, not to take either extreme (tech or not) too seriously, plenty of folk have wonderful success with both. Folks may just have differnt definitions of "fun" (watchin golf on TV is my idea of torture). Your mileage may vary.
Andy, I would love to be able to tell more hunting tales as I'm sure the majority of the guys on here would...but a 50-60 hour work week and taking care of a farm, my boys sports etc., it doesn't leave much time for hunting. Course, I don't think I would ever have enough time hunting no matter how much free time I had. :goldtooth:
Hey,
Part of the fun is setting up your new bow. You want to get the right string, the right nock setting for your arrow, you want to get a new quiver for it, and what's more fun than setting up brand-new arrows, down to make them yourself. That's what I'm doing with my new "Whip"
Haven't you ever heard the expression?
"Fun is a choice ! Make lots of choices, have lots of fun"
Especially when it comes to traditional archery, just decide your going to put some fun back into your stuff, you're the only one that can enjoy it, and you are the only one that can take the joy from it. Don't let others mess with your stuff, especially your attitude !
Life is a choice, live it !
There is only one phrase I can't figure out???
" Misery is optional "
And the man that said it live in Iowa !!!!
Pastor Carl
Ignorance can sometime be a blessing! Since Curtis ("Littlefeather") handed be a bow and said; "go shoot this" and I did, I've enjoyed every opportunity I had to get out and shoot.
As for the ignorance; I don't know much other than the arrow goes on the rest and in front of the string and you pull-er-back and let-er-fly. What could be more fun than that. Sometimes I hit something but most times I don't, but it doesn't concern me a great deal.
Pop
My signature says what it does for a reason. :archer:
I think it's human nature to tinker. I also think a lot of newcomers seeking the simpler way, may be unnecessarily confusing themselves to discouragement. Many of the technical threads, coupled with a lot of hype IMO, are the starting points to a lot of newbies to traditional and they may not have that basic foundation of principals to fall back on yet.
Yes we have this great knowledge base here to draw from, but many may not have that mentor at hand to clear the BS...and there's a lot of that too.
The gear, no matter how primitive, or trad-techy, will shoot better than we are capable of shooting it. And it will mostly all act the same if you know some very basic principals of matching it up.
Newbies need to seek out a mentor if possible, and like has already been said, learn what you can, but know that you can simplify it as well if you want. Get a good settup to start and develop your experience level, and then, then seek out improvements by tinkering if you need to, or want to. And have fun, no matter how you do it! :thumbsup:
Been there done that, there's no simple way ! If everything was easy, nobody would do it.
Understanding something, is building character, the hardest thing is understanding yourself, and why you do something. You get the answer, when you accomplish the task.
That's what makes traditional archery a challenge, but also fun. It shows me more about myself than anything else I have ever been involved in.
Carl
Mitch... Lately (for numerous years now..) I have been experiencing the same thing, and have even rebeled a bit, much to the deep shame of my buddies.
I know...I know that I should have more drive etc toward perfection, but I have been experiencing a real revulsion to high tech, high competition, high worry-about-everything attitudes. Everywhere around me I see that. It is fine for you if you enjoy that, but I don't.
I have watched my friend work his butt off trying to tune his arrows to his bow, with some degree of success. I slap three 5.5 inch highback feathers on my arrows and I can shoot damn near any arrow. Now...yes... he shoots better than I do, but I have as much, maybe more actual fun just watching my arrows fly. and I hit. I may not hit the x-ring, but I hit.
Is my set up tuned....heck no. fact is, I tried to shoot one of my best arrows bare shaft and broke it when it hit the target sideways at 7 yards ! But it flies perfectly with those huge fletch.
At this stage in my life, the competition part ruins the game for me. I just like to roam my little few acres and send feathered sticks to flight and see them hit, or very nearly miss my intended target.
Maybe next year I will get serious. There is a heck of a nice few studies going on in this site that IS gonna change and better define bowhunting. I am all for it. The info is wonderful.
But I still like those big, noisy, beautiful feathers.....
ChuckC
That said it best for me ChuckC. My bow is set up for hunting big feathers and heavy arrows 100% of the time. I watch the arrow if it flies well I'm tunned.
hey! I use 5 1/2 inch fletch and heavy arrows too!! Works for me :)
MW, I agree completely.
The best thing is to have a friend that worries about the technical stuff-that way I don't have to. My buddy Bonner can go on for HOURS about FOC, limb wedge design, spine (you name it) and he just loves that part of it. I just like to pull back and hit what I'm looking at. To each his own I guess...
MW,Iron bull and Terry. :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
Tracy :campfire:
I have to agree. When I first found this site I really got caught up in speed, penetration, flattest shooting, two vs. multiblade BH and the rest of that.
I think it might have been JC or Terry Green that made a comment that set me straight.
It was something like "The bow that kills the fastest is the one that you shoot accurately into the kill zone."
All I really use the tech stuff for now is geting the right spined arrows ordered and recently getting supersharp BH's.
After that, I just want to throw some bottles around the yard and try to hit 'em. I need to get some Muzzy grass catchers so I don't lose so many arrows.
For all the guys out there that are tech savvy, my hat's off to ya'. I just can't do it.
Thanks for the post,
-Charlie
Mitch,
Right on man! I know for me I don't disagree with having your set-up tuned for optimum performance, BUT it was getting to the point (and I still struggle with it) where I was using the gear and tinkering as my road to be a better hunter. I have enough gear, I have done enough tinkering. Now I need to do the things that really make a difference, hunt harder with more confidence, practice with 1 set-up and not keep switching every couple of weeks, spend more time scouting, HAVE FUN!!
Now who's going turkey hunting?
Nathan
Well said Nathan
I agree with Nate. One of the best times I had this year was stump shooting while on a bunny hunt. Few bunnies, but many stumps. I just forgot all the junk and shot - great time.
What will help free you is finding someone more knowledgeable that can coach you . Just like anything else worth its salt takes work and practice...and alot faith!!! good luck...Mark#78...if it makes you feel anybetter my shooting stinks today LOL :)
I like to tune my bow taper my arrows and mess around with things but my mantra is keep it simple, keep it fun.
You`re right with keeping it simple,but not so simple that your arrows fly like a galopping horse and your bow is loud and kicks like a mule.
We have a lot of people over here just shooting like that, and a few may be happy with it...
But after a while they`re not so happy anymore, especially when they see me hitting my mark most of the time. Until 1.5 years I had a severe case of target panic,really bad. I was very close to give up all the clutter, because the fun was gone.
I bought a DVD explaining the problem with a cure technique and it was gone. Now it is fun again,because I can sent my arrows to my mark under my control.
Without other people try to advance something, this DVD may have been never produced and I would have probably changed over to a smokepole.
The good thing in Trad archery is, that the technical stuff is done before going to the range or hunt and NOT all the time.
As a travelling archer I have to adjust to the ever changing airplane regulations, without technical innovations that would cost me a bunch of money everytime I use an airservice(TD bows and arrows). Tougher arrows like carbons yield in less arrows and thus less weight....
JUST DO WHAT YOU WANT AND NEED AND DON`T FOLLOW COMMUNITY HYPES!!
I don't post much as some of you can see by how unfamiliar my handle "Nightstalker" is. I come to this board on a regular basis, and what I do for the most part is, I read. My first and most enjoyment I get is the way you all treat one another. Respect and dignity. These ar two very hard things to find these days in the world we live, but on this board they seem to always be the theme for the day.
Secondly, depending how deep you want to immerse yourself in this sport, you can bet you can do it here as well, but then again not do it. I find this site to be the greatest resource of information I have found anywhere with a group of the most unselfish people that are always willing to share thier experiences and knowledge with you.
If you are going to go out and just punch holes in paper or shoot stumps, then one probably doesn't have a need for all the techno stuff and can keep it as simple as they need to in order to keep the fun in thier shooting. On the other hand, if you are going to hunt, I think you owe it to the animal and the spirit of the hunt to have your gear tuned to the one shot kill.
I probably won't post again for awhile, but I will be here, in the night, stalking, listening, reading, watching.
Doc Noc......you going to be up at Whittingham this year? I missed you last year, was on the road on business. I always enjoy your campfires.
Well said Vance! And Terry reminds us this is supposed to be the hunting forum.
I like to see an arrow fly perfectly with a spiral of feathers to the target and almost no wobbling.I also like the arrow to fly where its pointed and not a foot to one side or the other. Seems like I find these set ups more often by experimenting and luck than any technical expertise.
Charlie Lamb said, "See if you can hit that can." to me the other day in Texas. I had been frowning at the poor (mismatched) flight of the arrows I was trying out. The next arrow looked like a sidewinder as it flew to a perfect hit. Picked the can off the top of the first target and pinned it to the one behind. Big smile, go figure.
I love to tinker with gear, but all that crazy stuff melts away when I step into the woods with bow and arrow, and then a more righteous purpose fills my heart and brain.
I think where a lot of frustration comes in (at least for me) is being new and wanting to get my stuff set up correctly. You hear how "simple" things are, then I come hear to learn, and got blown away by some of the ultra-technical issues that I see debated. I'm used to having my gear in tip top performing shape, and with a compound that was simple to do.
Setting up and "tuning" a new trad bow, for me was the farthest thing from simple that I could have ever imagined.
And people make fun of compounds! I never see compound guys messing with there set ups like some trad guys do. They buy a bow, buy some carbon arrows weighted for it, sight it in and there shooting, no more messin. I shoot both and my compounds are to me more simpler to shoot.
Simple means different things to different people. As feve316 says, many who shoot compounds set them up and then just shoot them. Many of the compounders I know may leave their bows sitting except when they pick them up to go hunting. They never even touch them in between times. For me I like the simplicity of a long bow because I can easily build my own strings, string it without a stringer and shoot with nothing but a single piece of leather for a tab. However, I do like to hit what I shoot at. I found out the hard way over many years of just flinging arrows that it takes a little bit of fussing to find the best set up (unless you just get lucky the first time). Plus I just like the process of fussing around with arrows, points, fletching, brace height etc. Part of the fun is trying different things - including new bows, which necessitates more tuning and fussing. From a practical standpoint I would be much better off just using one bow that has arrows tuned for it. But who ever said a hobby has to be practical?
Great point Mr. Skinner.
QuoteOriginally posted by Greg Skinner:
Simple means different things to different people.
I recon what it amounts to with me is. When I'm fishin and catchin fish. Somebody comes up and tells me their bitin somewhere else, if I use somethin else. Do I start chasin fish or be content catchin fish, where I am, usin whats workin for me. Pretty simple to ME.
QuoteAnd people make fun of compounds! I never see compound guys messing with there set ups like some trad guys do. They buy a bow, buy some carbon arrows weighted for it, sight it in and there shooting, no more messin. I shoot both and my compounds are to me more simpler to shoot.
Only if you are letting the shop do the setup for you.
Guys, I usually keep two kinds of carbons, 40-60, and 60-75 spined, 4" vanes, a flipper rest on my two bows, nock squared on string and some puffs on the string to quiten her! I know this may sound lik blasphemy, but its simple, works extemley well for me, durable, and leaves a lot more time for stumpin',huntin, and time with friends and family, cause once time is gone we cant get it back!