Trad Gang
Main Boards => The Bowyer's Bench => Topic started by: twigflicker on January 20, 2016, 04:25:00 PM
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I hope you guys that are true craftsmen will indulge me a little... this build along is underway, but who knows how long it will take...
So to begin with let me share a little background...
My dad passed away 11 years ago today… He was a craftsman with many talents and abilities… He crafted Muzzleloaders for many years, scales on knives, cabinetry and pretty much anything he decided to put his mind to… and just the spring before his cancer diagnosis he had “caught” the bow building bug… selfbows particularly…
He had through the years accumulated numerous stock blanks, woods, etc. that had resided in his workshop for years…
I thought shortly after he passed away that I would love to build a bow in his memory using woods that he had put back for projects he was planning on starting once he retired… problem was I had no idea how to proceed… knew absolutely nothing about building laminated bows or how to go about it…
So the project was put on hold…
Jonathan
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About 6 – 7 years ago a good friend of mine, Kevin Bishop, formally introduced me to a fellow that I’d known of, and about for 25 years, but had never officially met, Monte Dunaway… I’d known of Monte through another mutual friend, whose property Monte has hunted for years…
Monte and I struck up a friendship and started doing some bowfishing together the last few springs and attending some local shoots as well as Cloverdale and Compton… Numerous times we discussed building this bow, but just never got around to starting it for one reason or another…
Jonathan
PS The next update may take a bit as photobucket is having issues and I have some pics coming up...
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looking forward to watching your build along. Great sentiments too.
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Very nice, looking forward to the build.
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Good mojo. Reverence. Respect. I like it.
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This past spring of 2015 we started getting more serious about building a bow… One on trip to go bowfishing Monte suggested I bring up some of the wood so we could evaluate it and see where we needed to go from there… Pop had put back a piece of birdseye maple that I’d wanted to use,
(http://i.imgur.com/DY49cgr.jpg)
but after some examination it was really figured on one side of the board and the other more plain… Monte was afraid that it might not be as attractive as I was hoping… so scratch the original idea…
We’d also discussed putting micarta in the riser for strength and Monte set about ordering some from a contact that he had used in the past…
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Another plan began to form… I had some really pretty curly/quilted maple stock blanks that pop had also put back for projects that never came to fruition…
(http://i.imgur.com/YEOwUIC.jpg)
And some figure in it...
(http://i.imgur.com/KL30kJK.jpg)
Another trip to Monte’s and he felt like this piece in combination with the Micarta would make a really pretty riser…
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Monte offered some birdseye maple veneers for the back of the limbs… it is some of the most figured birdseye that I’ve ever seen…
(http://i.imgur.com/R1wHJOu.jpg)
and we went on the hunt for some curly maple for the belly of the limbs, which we were able to find on **** for a really reasonable price for numerous sheets of veneer... best of all it was a local place for me and I was able to drive over and pick it up saving the shipping…
(http://i.imgur.com/xxhbOf3.jpg)
So all the pieces are coming together… slowly but surely…
Jonathan
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Sorry about the jacked up pic sizes...
Jonathan
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All right... the stage has been set... the materials have been acquired...
Please forgive for a lack of pictures in the next couple of sections... I'd not determined to do a build along in my mind yet... so I didn't take any pics...
Saturday, October 3, 2015
This was the day Monte and I officially started to put stuff together… yeah, we probably should have gone hunting, but it was raining and pretty cool for the first part of October, so Monte sacrificed a day of hunting to get the build started… I showed up at his house pretty early that morning and he started showing me how to proceed… He had a riser he had built as an “experimental project” several years ago that I fell in love with… the contour… the feel… the look… all of it was just what I was looking for… I’m going to be using it as my template to go by… so we took all of our materials and began getting them square… running them through a profile/template grinder that he made several years ago… (That will be a theme you hear regularly… that Monte built or made) and also using his drum sander…
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Once everything was square “we” (and I use that term loosely in the beginning as I was watching more than participating) began to cut out the pieces we wanted on the band saw… sorry about the lack of pictures here… but Monte was doing the cutting as I was a bit fearful of screwing it all up from the get go… and I’m a cheap son of a gun… but also because he knew his bandsaw and how it wanted to track and cut…
Once it was all cut out back to the profile/template grinder to square up the pieces again for gluing the riser together… I allowed myself to do that task as it was pretty hard to mess it up to bad… as Monte again had templates that allowed for precise grinding of both the maple and micarta…
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We were able to get all the pieces ready and Monte applied the smooth on and set the riser blanks up in a set of jigs that he had made… it was square pieces of steel that he had welded, that allowed him to put shims in and put pressure on the blank as it was curing from two different directions… the double approach kept the pieces from “walking” on us… and then we added the extra c-clamps, and other clamps...
(http://i.imgur.com/zMmxUgJ.jpg)
then it went in the hot box…
Actually two risers went into the hot box… During our discussion, Monte had mentioned that it was just as easy to build two at once… so I decided I was going to surprise my wife with a bow as well… hers will have the curly/quilted maple on the back and micarta on the belly… and mine will be micarta on the back and curly/quilted on the belly…
And then we kindly interrupted this build for this past bow season ;-)
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Saturday, November 21
So bow season is over and the men of orange have now invaded the woods… I lived in Ohio almost 25 years ago and because of those 5 years of living there… I’m still spooked to hunt during gun season… I didn’t know that many guys could be in the woods…
Anyway, Monte had cleaned up both blanks and traced the pattern onto them…
(http://i.imgur.com/jBsQ8Br.jpg)
We then cut some with the band saw and then took it to the profile/template grinder to grind the limb pads to the correct angles… again, Monte had a jig that makes this a precise grind… if you look closely you can see a rub collar at the bottom of the sanding wheel that rode on the bottom of the pattern… made it possible for even hacks like me to do the job right…
(http://i.imgur.com/n0FmgoY.jpg)
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Once the limb pads were ground, Monte broke out another jig that he had put together… It was a jig that allowed us to place the rise in it and secure it… Then we were able to drill holes for both the limb bolts and the pins for the limbs…
Here’s a pic of the jig
(http://i.imgur.com/gkIkjE6.jpg)
And the jig with the riser in it…
(http://i.imgur.com/PjdqEJ7.jpg)
Monte drilling my riser… showing me how it’s done…
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I really do some work… I drilled my wife’s riser (ok… that really doesn’t sound quite right, LOL)… As Monte assured me it was pretty much impossible to screw it up… the jig is made of steel and the collars that you use as guides are hardened steel to keep them from wearing…
Here’s the riser drilled and ready to be tapped…
(http://i.imgur.com/fiYPx26.jpg)
Once the riser was drilled, we tapped the limb bolt holes… Monte takes brass rod, turns it down and threads it on the outside… drills out the inside and taps it as well… then it’s epoxied in late on… that is coming down the road at some point…
(http://i.imgur.com/hkCrWzu.jpg)
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We then broke out a small router to cut the shelf out… Monte again has a jig that bolts into where the limb bolt will mount that allows the router to follow it for again a very precise cut that crowns the shelf perfectly…
(http://i.imgur.com/YwYVBJQ.jpg)
And here’s a pic of the shelf after being cut…
(http://i.imgur.com/d0oRGhd.jpg)
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From here the band sawing begins again… here’s a pic of Monte cutting the riser closer to profile…
(http://i.imgur.com/fnp6lUb.jpg)
Remember I’m a cheap son of a gun… so Monte’s been cutting mine… and I’m cutting my wife’s… thinking if I jack it up to bad… well, I guess she’s out of luck… did I really just say that… LOL
Then we cut the sight windows into each of the bows…
(http://i.imgur.com/WwhLQn3.jpg)
And the sight window cut out… and the bows cut closer to profile… getting it down close to the pattern so I could take it to the pattern/template grinder and grind down to the lines…
(http://i.imgur.com/bLYPjyY.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/798YzhW.jpg)
And that wrapped up the day for us and I headed back home…
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Great build a long. Thanks for posting it. Good luck with the rest of the build.
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Awesome
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Thanks for the encouragement... glad you're enjoying it... now for more...
Monday, December 28
Monte and I both had the day off with the holidays… probably should have been hunting again, but by this point I’d pretty much hung it up and calling it another year…
I again don’t have many pics of the time at Monte’s as I was working on grinding both the riser’s to profile on the template…
Monte was working on a knife that he is donating to the PBS banquet coming up in FL this spring… so while he was working on that I finished up the risers… once they were down to the template lines, Monte then broke out the oscillating spindle sander and said… have at it… just start taking off everything that isn’t a bow… yeah, right… you remember I’ve never done this right…
So he started knocking off some of the edges and whatnot… then he handed it over to me and I was to put it no other way… paralyzed with fear… thinking… man it wouldn’t take a whole lot to jack this up royally… And the whole time Monte is simply reminding me of a truth my pop had said a thousand times… “You can always take material off… but you can’t put it back on.” Great!
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Well, after some discussion, I’d decided that rather than using power tools, I would take the risers home and use some good old elbow grease, filing, rasping them out…
I got home, and after eating a bite of dinner went to the workshop to start… I got out all of pops old rasps, files, and other tooling that he had accumulated through the years and started... well, let’s just say that is completely for the birds… after working up a good sweat and accomplishing very little, I texted Monte and asked, “Hey man, can a fellow put a sanding drum in a drill press or in a dremel tool and go at it… He said, “Sure can,” and then he again emphasized, “You can always take material off, but you can’t put it back on.” I had a 2” sanding drum from grinding turkey feathers so I started piddling a little on my wife’s riser… (catching a theme here?)
Well, you need to have a dust collection system to keep the mess down… Monte uses a huge shop vac that attaches to each of his tools… so I thought… hum, I have a big shop vac… let’s redneck this so here’s my first dust collection system…
(http://i.imgur.com/JUXnVfr.jpg)
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It worked really well, other than the vac didn’t have a bag in it so I ended up with all of this fine dust all over everything in the workshop… well, shoot hard lessons learned…
I’d fully intended to keep my wife’s bow a secret, but the cat got out of the bag pretty quick when I started asking, “Hey, how’s this grip feel to you?”
So the next day I took a trip to the local Menard’s that opened this past spring and I’d not taken time to even stop by… while there, I bought a couple of clamps, a ¾” drum, 1” drum, 1.5” drum and sanding sleeves for all of them, and vacuum bags for the shop vac, and an upgrade on the dust collection...
(http://i.imgur.com/qUpS0Gn.jpg)
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That evening I commenced to again working on my wife’s riser… I took it down to here and stopped till I could see Monte again and ask questions about how to proceed…
(http://i.imgur.com/usuJUpu.jpg)
At this point it’s really blocky and plain ugly… but that old adage… “You can always take it off, but you can’t put it back on” was constantly ringing in my head… I had yet to start on mine yet… I was getting some quality practice in beforehand…
So, I’m stuck at this point… Monte lives 70 minutes away so, you don’t just hop in the car and run over for a few minutes… or at least I don’t… remember I’m a cheap son of a gun… ;-)
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Wednesday, January 6
The company Monte works for had a booth at the ATA show in Louisville and he came down to check stuff out at the show and to pick up some supplies at a local store for the company… while he was coming through, I’d asked if he could stop by the office as I work just a few minutes from the interstate…. He was happy to and we talked about the show a bit and then commenced to discussing the riser and him pointing out what needed taken off where… and how if you did this then it would flow into here… and to work some around the limb beds as it would help it flow…
And the whole time I’m thinking crap… this is a bit “artsy” for me… I’m not sure I’ll be able to do this… You see while growing up, I was a bit of a bull in the china shop… and pops would routinely tell me I could tear up an anvil… so I was less than optimistic…
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Well, I went home that evening and proceeded to do some more work… and felt halfway decent about how the riser was beginning to take shape... Here’s some pics to illustrate where I’d gotten to at this point…
(http://i.imgur.com/L7uj2t4.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/xhjIZnP.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/2yiJQXW.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/KKiP184.jpg)
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Once I got this point on my wife’s riser, I decided I would start tackling my own and got it down to this point…
(http://i.imgur.com/kNTEd5D.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/usBCCIX.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/1BdD8wl.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/yrXCS6k.jpg)
And there’s where I stopped…
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Looks great!!
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Very nice..
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Thanks Mark and Roy... have a couple more installments before I'm caught up the present....
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January 23, 24, 2016
Now the beauty of technology today, allowed me to take those pictures and send them to Monte for his perusal… He sent back a text later and said, “Your bow handle is taking shape. You can cut it a little deeper in the sight window.”
Now I thought I’d texted back asking, “How much deeper is a little?” but I can’t find that in my text now… so I guess I hadn’t asked and proceeded very slowly and carefully at this point… no more power tools here in the sight window… rasps and files only… well at least for a bit as you’ll see shortly…
(http://i.imgur.com/Z1kKcwp.jpg)
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When looking at the risers, I ran a string from the center of the limb bolt holes down the front thinking I could gauge how deep I was to center… the upper part of the sight window was pretty close, but flared out toward the shelf so I slowly started rasping and filing, being sure to keep the crown of the radius over the deepest part of the grip or close… and keeping the “top” of the shelf radius in the same area… In my working I’d developed some little “ledges” for lack of a better term on the shelf… I think they came from not filing and rasping close enough to the shelf top and for the life of me I couldn’t hardly get that micarta to cut with a file on those “ledges”. So in a moment of weakness I broke out the dremel tool with a small sanding wheel and went very slowly… if you look closely at the following picture you can see what I’m talking about with the “ledge”.
(http://i.imgur.com/5XRNl7b.jpg)
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Once I got that evened out and felt pretty good about how they looked… I again took some picture and sent them to Monte for his perusal once again… here’s where I’m at as of today…
My riser…
(http://i.imgur.com/pgJTERo.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/aFA4riK.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/ybWlLWa.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/XrnshsX.jpg)
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And my wife’s riser…
(http://i.imgur.com/2AgbP3z.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/E0Qrp1L.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/7a2vyj1.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/kb8bVgT.jpg)
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So Monte sent a note back saying, “Looks like you about have them under control. Looking pretty good, are you happy with them?”
And I said… “They are getting there… have some more shaping I want to do yet, but overall pretty happy with them.” Then a few minutes later I sent this note back to Monte…
“I think I’m going to quit while I’m ahead and not grind off too much and let you take a look.”
Monte quickly responded, “That might be the best thing to so. You can always take it off, but you can’t put it back on.” LOL
So that’s where we are today… who knows when we’ll be able to get together again… we both have teenagers with all their activities,, upcoming hunts, conventions and who knows what else life will bring in between, but will update this thread as we get more work done…
Thanks again for dropping in and for all the encouragement…
Jonathan
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It's looking great!
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looking good
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Looking good so far. Your friend is giving you good advise!
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Nice !
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Thanks guys... Will continue to update as we get work done... Me net says we'll start on the limbs next time around...
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February 10, 2016
Well, I started gathering some more supplies… we’ve had a few days off due to conflicts in schedule as mentioned before… I’ve needed to order some clear glass… and I’ve been pretty hesitant about ordering because of the clear glass issues that many have been having with streaks and whatnot…
After doing some research I’d gotten wind that Rosewood had been having some pretty good glass so I rolled the dice… Monte had given me the info I needed of 2” wide and .040 thick… Well when I called I had a brain fart and couldn’t remember what thickness of glass I was needing… sensing my panic the fellow (I can’t remember his name) from Rosewood was so kind and said, “that’s vital, why don’t you just call back when sure.” That was service out of the way as he’d already left the shop to go to the office to complete the order.
A quick text to Monte reminded me of the thickness needed at .040 and proceeded to call back and got the order completed… He said the glass should be at your house on Friday… and it arrived right on time Friday…
(http://i.imgur.com/XuNL8EQ.jpg?1)
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Monte and I had hoped to get together this past weekend to get some limb wedges ground and other preliminaries for getting the limb together, but previous commitments kept us from getting together and getting any work done…
Monte is in the middle of building a knife that he is donating to the PBS for its upcoming banquet in FL… He also has another surprise that he is working on that will be donated as well… PBS’ers going to FL will want to keep an eye out for the unique “Man Cave” item that will be available… I’ll try and post some pics of it once the banquet is over…
If all goes according to plan and the weather works out we’ll get some more work done this coming Saturday…
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Looks like they are coming around nicely.
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Very classy.
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Saturday, February 20, 2016
Monte and I were able to get together again, so early on Saturday morning I started the trek north to Monte’s place. I arrived around 9 o’clock and we headed to the workshop… we had an eventful day planned… I was a bit skeptical as I was going to be doing much more of the work as Monte was trying to finish up the knife he is donating to the PBS Banquet coming up…
First order of business was to cut and grind some more micarta for the limb wedges/fadeouts… We had one piece that was already ground but wasn’t enough to make two wedges/fadeouts with… it was only 16” long and we needed 18” as that’s what Monte’s “recipe” for his limbs calls for… so to the bandsaw I go and cut them just over 3/8” thick…
(http://i.imgur.com/R6PoWBx.jpg)
and then to the drum sander to square it all up once again…
(http://i.imgur.com/lDy8CYL.jpg)
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Having my two pieces all squared up, we got out the jigs that are used to grind the fadeouts… We had two different ones… The first jig did one side and it was a real gradual taper…
(http://i.imgur.com/OzBcnfc.jpg)
The next jig finished out the limb wedge/fadeout…
(http://i.imgur.com/YtlSLSH.jpg)
And after some work on the profile/template grinder and away I went…
And the final result… thin… thin… thin… very fine fadeouts…
(http://i.imgur.com/etI4jlk.jpg)
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If you remember I’m using some veneers that I’d gotten locally, so we needed some more woods for the core… after limited discussion and deferring to Monte’s experience it was determined that we’d use the good old hardrock maple… Monte had procured a maple board some time back and had it stored away for future use… One hint he did share with me during the day was when you’re out looking for wood and you find a good piece, if you can afford it… “won’t keep you from eating” LOL… buy it and put it back if you are going to build several bows as they usually don’t have what you want or in the quality you want if you have to go get it then…
Here’s the board Monte had purchased from the local Menard’s…
(http://i.imgur.com/W51uszk.jpg)
We set to cutting it down into two 36” pieces… one it was cut to length I took it to the bandsaw and ripped a two in section out and took it to the drum sander to clean up the edge…
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Once that was done again, with Monte’s tutoring he showed me how to lay out the board so the laminations were kept the same direction in the same way… Monte showed how to do that… I’m going to do my best to explain it, but not sure I will be able to the way he did…
On our board we put a small arrow that gave us a reference to return the board to the vice the same way each time… it was a bit confusing at first as Monte is predominately right handed and I favor going at many thing as a lefty… so it was a bit trying to get everything all “kosher”… Anyway, Monte’s theory is that you want all the limb tips to come from the same end of the board and therefore the limb butts will also come from the other end of the board… if I remember correctly he said that way if there was any variance in the lumber that it would be placed at the same place in the limb…
Needing 4 core pieces, Monte set the square so I could mark a line that I would then bandsaw along… giving me plenty of “cheating” room due to my inexperience with his saw, etc…
(http://i.imgur.com/dW0Q1Xs.jpg)
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I’d cut a lamination of core wood… take the main board again which is marked so I can return to the vise the same way every time and go to the drum sander and clean up the section that was just cut… back to the vise… mark another line… and cut…
(http://i.imgur.com/roIrBxO.jpg)
Repeating this process until all four laminations were cut… Oooopppppssssss… I forgot one step… as I cut a lamination off Monte would have me number it… starting with the first being 1… the second being 2 and so on till all four were numbered… again this helps us keep which goes where and with what…
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Now, while I was cutting and grinding away, Monte was busy getting the specially made brass sleeves for the limb bolts to attach into… Monte takes a brass rod and having access to a full metal shop at work is able to thread the brass rod both on the outside which screws into the riser and is held in with smooth-on epoxy… once they are threaded on the outside he has a device that he can place them in and then drill and tap the inside where the limb bolts will then screw into… once they are done, he chamfers them as well… very concise… very clean…
Here’s a couple of pics showing Monte installing them in my wife’s riser…
(http://i.imgur.com/gdFjLYi.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/h8wKVjz.jpg)
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I meant to take a close up of the pieces, but forgot, so I’ve tried to take blow them up… they are a bit grainy but maybe it will show enough details to figure it out…
(http://i.imgur.com/W5l2nEA.jpg)
And here they are placed in the riser…
(http://i.imgur.com/7APbwoW.jpg)
Once those were in place in both risers we went back to the drum sander and began sanding down the laminations… Monte had several years ago built a what I call a taper sled… it is built to grind a .001” per inch along the length of the lamination… It has sand paper along the top of it where the lamination lie so as to keep them from shifting or slipping as they run through the drum sander…
(http://i.imgur.com/J7XXltQ.jpg)
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After numerous passes, (there was quite a bit of waste) as Monte had given me plenty of room to make mistakes, the four laminations were ground to .020” at the tips… which according to Monte’s formula’s (he keeps a little black book with all the details of each limb built and results) with the veneers, laminations and glass should make a 58” bow that comes in at 55@27”... At least that’s the plan…
Thanks again for following along… may be a bit again before we’re able to get together due to previous commitments, but from what I could gather, we’ll be gluing up a limb next time we get together… I took the risers back home with me and will begin sanding on them a little at a time getting them closer to the final product…
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Great Build along. Thanks for taking the time.
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March 4, 2017
Well, It’s been a little over a year since we last visited this project… The spring//summer brought lots of activity from our two households… I take care of several of our church member’s, other senior’s and a couple of single moms yards… last year I was cutting eleven different yards plus my own and a full time plus job on top of that… there wasn’t any time to get together to work on “our” project.
Fall came and went… without even going to the woods… it’s was a very weird fall to say the least…
Anyway, we’re back and were able to get together on a Saturday morning following an appointment I had earlier in the morning…
When we left off last time, just about everything was done up and ready to glue a limb up… We had cut and ground the maple cores… cut the curly maple veneers… the limb butt wedges were ground and it was all laying on the bench right where we had left it…
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Our goal for the day was to get everything together and get a limb in the oven before the day was done…
When we left off last time, we had not cut the glass yet… it was still in the 72” lengths that it had come in… so Monte commenced to cutting it off… I was amused by his technique of dust collecting as it reminded me of mine… gotta make do with what you have… He is used to working by himself… LOL
(http://i.imgur.com/DiNo9ZW.jpg)
Monte uses a tile saw blade in a hacksaw frame to cut the fiberglass as it saves regular blades from wearing out so quickly…
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Once the fiberglass is cut… Monte makes sure to keep the pieces of glass in order and marks them as such… In other words… from one piece of glass, when it is cut in two… those two pieces are marked as either the back of the belly of the bow… He was taught and feels it keeps continuity within the limb… Here’s a pic showing the glass marked…
(http://i.imgur.com/ytZBzXM.jpg)
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We next took the veneers and laid them out on the bench side by side
(http://i.imgur.com/3CvTgDe.jpg)
This was done to figure out which way we want them to run and we decided to put a real heavy dark grain toward the butt of the limb so those were all laid out correctly… Monte also showed me how to orient the veneers and the core wood so that they work together in helping stay straight… I may not be saying that right, but what he does is if there is any grain run out on the veneer or core the back will run to one side… and the belly to the other side… as he was describing it and showing it to me it reminded me of my high school woods class… where when we glued up a series of boards to make a table top that you alternated the grain like this…
(http://i.imgur.com/2cTKRHu.jpg)
I’ve tried to do a little editing here to show the grain and how it’s running…
(http://i.imgur.com/aP9o81E.jpg)
What we did was take veneer A and flip it upside down on top of veneer B so the grain run out is running in opposite directions… and we did the same with the core wood as well…
I hope that I explained that clearly enough…
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So the next step of the process is to cut off the ends of the core wood… Monte has a small bandsaw with a really fine tooth count on it… helps keep the wood from splintering and splitting out…
(http://i.imgur.com/zb9jzTv.jpg)
Monte has for the last several years placed a tip wedge in his limbs… I believe this is due to using the modern low stretch strings… gives strength and stability to the limb tips…
(http://i.imgur.com/S61JJVo.jpg)
While we were working on the tip wedges… Monte put the materials, veneers, and core wood in the hot box for a short time as it had been sitting for close to a year as to drive any moisture it might have accumulated while sitting in the workshop…
Again, he has a form that allows him to grind them to shape and has a fine feathered edge on it… He did the first to show me how… and went to the house to grab something and said here… you do the next one while I’m gone…
(http://i.imgur.com/yw6Cxb4.jpg)
Well… I got started and all was going well and then it slipped… shoot… I think I butchered it up… sure enough… well at least I was smart enough to stop and wait… Monte got back and thought it would not be a problem once the tips were shaped so we went with them anyway… and sure enough they did work just fine… Whew… avoided a mishap…
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We (well Monte did) cleaned all the veneers, core, glass with acetone to remove any finger prints, any oils, etc. off the material… He also cleaned his bench off with acetone as the material would be laying on it... to remove anything that might cause adhesion issues down the road…
(http://i.imgur.com/934nIUg.jpg)
Once everything is all clean and oil free… We ran blue painters tape down the back of the glass to keep glue of the back of the bow and to enable us to mark the center line... We used blue painters tape as we weren’t sure as to how long it would be before we would get together to get more work… that ended up being an issue later on as it was much more difficult to see the lines after marking out the limb profile when grinding it out… Monte as a little trick he uses in laying down the masking tape… He used a piece of flat bamboo with a piece of leather to smooth down the tape and remove any splinters from the fiberglass...
The next step for the day was to prep the form… All of the metal parts were covered with aluminum foil as to keep the epoxy off of it… and the form is also covered in seran wrap again to keep epoxy from getting on it and buggering it up…
(http://i.imgur.com/fYLHZCV.jpg)
He also has a metal strip that he uses to help distribute the pressure and covers with it with Seran wrap as well... honestly I’m not sure how a fellow would go about doing that by himself… as it wasn’t easy with four hands… let along two…
(http://i.imgur.com/KLuTqBe.jpg)
The fire hose gets two layers of seran wrap on it... again it was interesting trying to keep that stuff from sticking to itself…
(http://i.imgur.com/3axswe1.jpg)
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The smooth on gets weighed out... And mixed accordingly ... And now time for the glue up... Powder free Gloves to keep it off of you... Monte figures he'd rather have too much epoxy ready than have to weigh more out at the end when you have run out...
(http://i.imgur.com/RJtlcDt.jpg)
Epoxy is run down each section getting good coverage but not too much to squeeze out everywhere and waste...
(http://i.imgur.com/ZtoBjr4.jpg)
Once all the pieces are glued up and stacked in the proper order…
(http://i.imgur.com/NPxmWW8.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/Vf0oooI.jpg)
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He puts on the metal piece and then strings it down... for this he uses an old piece of fast flight serving…
(http://i.imgur.com/36TulK7.jpg)
Then the air hose is put in and puts the top of the form on and attaches all the pieces…
(http://i.imgur.com/WPxxeCj.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/t0OC8Yh.jpg)
If you look closely you can see a tongue depressor in the form… The form is marked with where the tip wedge is supposed to be located and the tongue depressor allow you to push it to its proper place…
(http://i.imgur.com/S0k1ktR.jpg)
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Once it is all together the hose gets filled up to 60# of pressure... But he does it in increments... By that I mean he puts 20# or so in… lets it sit for a bit while cleaning up… after a few minutes he puts in a bit more air say maybe up to 40# and lets it sit a bit more… and then on to the full 60#... Monte’s reasoning is that it lets air bubbles work their way out rather than being trapped if airing up to the full amount… If I remember right he had issues with air bubbles getting trapped when he went to a bigger air compressor that would allow him to fill all at once… When he started building bows he was using a smaller compressor that took more time to fill… and didn’t have the issues with the air bubbles being trapped…
Here you can see the air bubbles that have worked their way out…
(http://i.imgur.com/bvGTHDJ.jpg)
Into the oven she goes and cooks about four hours... At around 160-165 degrees… Monte's hot box has a 3 ft baseboard heater element for its heat source...
(http://i.imgur.com/O25bsMA.jpg)
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Looking good!!!
I think you may be setting a record for the longest build along yet. LOL
But I bet it will be worth the wait!!! :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
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You've got that right Brad... it's taking a while, but will definitely be worth it...
Jonathan
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All right... finally got some more written up and will post up to where we are at the present this evening if all goes according to plan...
So, Monte’s hotbox only holds one limb at a time… so during the week he gathered all the pieces for limb number two up and laid up the other limb while I was at home…
When I got there on Saturday, March 18th he had both limbs out of the form and ready to work on…
(http://i.imgur.com/FVa0zkV.jpg)
The first step was to take them to the profile grinder that we have used numerous times in our build… the phenolic we have came in 1.75” in and the veneers, core and glass were 2” so there was some rough grinding to get them down to where they were workable… my first task was to get one side down and square… where there was no rocking on the table on both limbs and then I proceeded to knock the excess off the other side to get it close…
(http://i.imgur.com/7RasKN3.jpg)
And to clean up the butt end of the limb…
(http://i.imgur.com/6i4gsoU.jpg)
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Then we took them to the drum sander and proceeded to knock the other edge down and square… let me tell you that was interesting for someone that hadn’t done that before… they would get to vibrating… Monte had a little fun with that…
We then marked a center line on the tape so that we have something to work from… Monte has really neat little jig that allows him to mark that out… I’d forgotten to take a picture, but remembered he’d posted a pic of it before… so here’s a pic of his jig… again… jigs make all the difference in the world with precision, etc.
(http://i.imgur.com/Ejjx6nS.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/WkaEAdM.jpg)
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We proceeded to layout the limb with the profile templates… the templates have holes along the center line so they can be easily lined up on the center line of the limbs… the tape was then marked with a sharpie marker… to show the profile… earlier I mentioned a difficulty that ensued with the blue tape… the purple sharpie showed up in the light… but when we went to the belt sander to grind the limbs down to the profile we were having a difficult time seeing the line and I was holding extra light while Monte was grinding so we have a lack of pictures through some of this process…
(http://i.imgur.com/y92xOCK.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/3pRbrIg.jpg)
When we got them finally ground down to profile… we proceeded to drill the limb bolt hole… yet again another jig that Monte had developed… it had two small v’s in each end that you line up with the center line and clamp down and proceed to drill the limb bolt hole in the butt of each limb…
(http://i.imgur.com/xUZgL1V.jpg)
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Once everything was drilled and ready… it was time for the unveiling… removing the tape to see what we have below… I was more than pleased…
Monte made me laugh out loud… as he said when peeling the tape off…
“It’s like seeing your lady naked for the first time!”
(http://i.imgur.com/5by2E0a.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/LP8eQXT.jpg)
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And a shot of the limb profile at the tips… where they are marked for the location of the string grooves…
(http://i.imgur.com/h2aeupS.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/D1MJxEe.jpg)
Once we got to this point we dug out yet another jig that Monte developed that allows him to file the string grooves at the same angle… the jig is clamped to the limb tip and you run the file along the hardened part of the jig that keeps it from wearing out…
(http://i.imgur.com/sfMFd7U.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/HBp9jR0.jpg)
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I failed to take anymore pics of our time together this day… but once the string grooves were roughed in we proceeded to bolt up the limbs to determine which was going to be top and which bottom and get an idea of what kind of weight we’re going to end up with…
Monte has a cable that brings the bow to brace and we proceeded to measure the tiller and found we needed to flip the limbs from top to bottom and bottom to top to get the proper tiller… Once that was done and rechecked we dropped the scale from the ceiling and got out the yard stick and pulled the bow to 28”… We were shooting for 55# at 28”…
Bummer… of all bummers… we came up light… I think we were like 47# at 28”… I only draw 27” so they were/are going to be lighter than I usually shoot…
So we got to mulling… maybe we can take them down for the wife’s limbs… Monte thought we could probably get them down to around 40# at 28”… so we called it quits for the day and I headed back south and hoping that my wife would be able to draw that kind of weight…
I have an older Howatt bow that is 38# at 28” and she was struggling to draw it back… so we scrap that idea and decide that we’ll finish those limbs out at a later time and will be what I’m calling “my old man” limbs… limbs that will allow me to shoot this bow way down the line…
So that’s the plan for that set of limbs…
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Monte has been playing with building heavier limbs for his 76er risers to bowfish with… So he decided he was going to build a set and while he was at it… procuring materials, grinding lams, getting glass, grinding out the limb tip wedges and limb butts/fadeouts… and he glued up two more limbs during the week… and even put the limb tips on…
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Saturday, March 25, 2017
So I get to Monte’s on this Saturday morning… again he had worked the previous week after the first set of limbs came out light… he went back to the formula and added material hoping to get us at the desired weight we were shooting for… He had roughed the limbs out and cut the string grooves and determined which limb was top and bottom again for tiller reasons… and bummer of all bummers… it still came out light… we are now at 51# at 27”… We’re not real sure what’s causing the discrepancy in the numbers from Monte’s formulas through the years… the only thing we can figure it might be is the highly figured veneers are causing the differences… but who knows for sure…
All I know is that the guys that do this for a living don’t get paid enough… this can be aggravating, but is the way it works and you have to roll with the punches… So we’re going with these and hope to get 48 or 49# at 27” when finished out…
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Monte had already put the limb tips on as well… I’m using .050 black glass, .050 brown micarta, and .050 black glass… Now again Monte through the years of struggling with limb tips and keeping everything from “running” or “walking” out on him developed a really nifty set of jigs that keeps all the material lined up and in place and keeps it all in place…
Here’s a couple of pics that show the jigs on the limb tips…
(http://i.imgur.com/H0z0JsL.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/ge8rMZj.jpg)
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Now here’s where Monte does a little different from some bowyers I’ve read about… he uses smooth on epoxy for the limb tips as he feels it make them stronger and has never had a limb tip “pop” off while using it… And another picture after the jigs are removed here’s the rough tip…
(http://i.imgur.com/XVODTtN.jpg)
So I got to do a little work on them with the grinder… grinding them down close to shape… And proceeded to file “roughed” in string grooves through the tip overlays…
At this point we took the limbs and got out the jig we used for drilling the limb bolts and locator pin in the limb bolt… lined the jig up on the center line again and proceeded to drill the limb locator pin holes which are like most bowyers different in lengths from the limb bolt to keep from mixing top and bottom limbs… Here’s another pic of the jig…
(http://i.imgur.com/rErmMkm.jpg)
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When we got limb tips in working order… We then took the limbs to a “false” form that Monte built with his limb profile that he clamps the limb to… to give a secure working platform to start the shaping of the limb tips…
(http://i.imgur.com/XHmtgHA.jpg)
Now here’s where I begged off… Monte broke out the dremel tool with a sanding wheel to start shaping the tips… I was freaking out as I just knew if I tried to do this I’d really jack the limbs up getting into the glass and making a mess and have to start all over from scratch… So Monte obliged and began the shaping of both limb tips… and I realize I didn’t get a pic before we decided to add overlays on the belly of the limb tips as well… again, we’re using .050 black glass… which really makes for a nice contrast with the curly maple limbs…
Here’s a pic of the jigs applied for the overlays on the belly of the limbs…
(http://i.imgur.com/hP637Js.jpg)
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We also spend some time beginning to shape the limbs to the profile of the riser and bevel them to flow with the contours… again I begged off not wanting to mess this up and let Monte start the process which will take time and patience…
Here’s a shot of what we are working toward… These are from a set of limbs Monte made for a Bear TD riser he built… the same combo of material we’re using on my limb tips…
Limb tips…
(http://i.imgur.com/Bmneygj.jpg)
And overlays on the belly of Monte’s limbs… mine will be black glass…
(http://i.imgur.com/pDtAT9c.jpg)
And now we wait for the next time we can get together…
Thanks for following along… slowly but surely it’s coming together…
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Man.....,Monte has more jigs than bass pro!!!
:laughing: :laughing:
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Nice work! And a lot of jigs is good!!
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Jigs are a good thing to have. I liked the jig for filing string grooves :)
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Ok… been a while since last report, but lots more has come together since the last report… When I left Monte’s last time I left the limbs and riser with him… He proceeded to finish out the limb tips and cutting the string grooves on the belly of the bow…
I wasn’t there when he did that work… but the way he explained to me was that he strings the bow and marks the lines with a sharpie and then takes a dremel tool and roughs the outline of where the string loop would run… very carefully… just hearing about that made me nervous as any work with a dremel tool can get away from you in a hurry…
The next time we got together we began taking the limbs and making them match to the flow of the riser… I didn’t take the time to take pictures unfortunately, and I’ll do my best to explain how we went about doing that…
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Monte had given me free license to shape the riser the way I wanted it to look… and it created some extra work on this end… We attached the limbs to the riser and scribed a line where the riser contour met the limbs… once that was done we took the limbs off the bow and went back to the profile template grinder and began tapering the butt of the limbs to match the riser… Monte had a word of caution here and said to be careful about getting to much of an angle on the limb butts… his reasoning was that if the angle got to shallow that the glass next to the riser if it gets hit, dinged or dropped will be more likely to splinter or even separate… not that I’m planning to test that theory…
Once we got closer to the profile we were shooting for… Monte has a small sanding drum that you run in a drill press that is pneumatic… coolest little thing I’ve seen… you actually use a little pump to put air in this sanding drum and it “flows” better while shaping than the hard drums do…
We spent a good part of the time together that day just getting the limbs and riser to match the way we wanted… When we got to that point, Monte sent me home with sand paper and a pat on the back saying have fun…
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Well, the bow just sat through a good part of the spring with turkey season going in full swing and then bowfishing taking us up through Memorial Day weekend… On Memorial Day it rained here in southern Indiana and I just spend several hours sanding on the bow… I started out with 150 grit… went to 220 grit… then to 300 grit… going over the bow with each of them… looking and feeling for any rough spots, file marks or tool marks… especially paying attention to the string grooves, smaller, tighter places…
One little tidbit of advice Monte shared that was a tremendous help to me was to take the bow outside in the sunlight… the natural sunlight shows a lot more imperfections, etc. I found this to be true for me especially compared to florescent lighting… my eyes aren’t just what they used to be even with cheaters… in fact I found myself taking my contacts out (near sighted) or leaving them out which allows me to see much better without any correction…
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I sanded for several hours hoping to have it ready to go when I was able to next visit Monte’s… which I was able to do the Friday of Cloverdale shoot… The wife and I went to Cloverdale Shoot, the 30th Anniversary for the day and piddled around and shot a little, bought some stuff and piddled around for the biggest part of the day… I’d texted Monte if he would be home from work when we came back through that I’d like for him to check the bow and see how much more sanding needed done… We set up a time and we stopped by… He looked it over and said… looks like it’s ready to be sprayed… The sweetest words that I’ve heard in a long time… HA!
Monte sprayed the first coat the next day, which was my wedding anniversary and I was off gallivanting with the wife, and not helping him… Monte sent a picture and I was so excited to see this coming together…
(http://i.imgur.com/YHYMMWG.jpg)
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I then twisted up a string out of 450+… that’s been my favorite material for several years… have it stretched out, served up and even some wool silencers installed just waiting to get used…
And here’s the final product…
Some inside pics first…
(http://i.imgur.com/OH4awcD.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/w3t0uXO.jpg?1)
(http://i.imgur.com/qpnvoxX.jpg?1)
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And then some outside pics…
(http://i.imgur.com/rc8WPj4.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/6x0uQq3.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/ri9lFzn.jpg)
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And a couple final pics…
(http://i.imgur.com/uAbInDw.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/iWd4FjV.jpg)
Hope you enjoyed… sorry it took so long to finish up… I’ll post pics of the wife’s bow when it’s finished… We put hers on hold wanting to get mine finished up for sure to hunt with this fall…
Till next time… Hunt hard! Hunt safe!
Jonathan
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:clapper:
I was recently thinking about this build and wondering what had come of it. Now I see!!! Looks like you and Monte teamed up to make a beautiful bow. Nicely done.
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Yea that's a very beautiful bow!
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NICE
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Nice! You had a good teacher.
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I like that a LOT! very well done
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Great job!!
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Thanks guys... It was a lot of fun...
Jonathan
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Nice