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Main Boards => The Bowyer's Bench => Topic started by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on October 22, 2015, 01:01:00 PM

Title: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on October 22, 2015, 01:01:00 PM: Hey guys,
I am starting to think about working on my first takedown. Kenny gave me a limb template way back and told me the basic specs for it.
I started to design the riser with a 12 degree pad. Here is where I am at right now. What do you guys think? I need some honest opinions on the design. Does it look good? Think I need to change the look? I want this thing to be the best I have ever built and it will take me some time to build it. But I am excited! The end deal will be 62 inches and going to shoot for 55# @28 inches.

(http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/x344/bowhntineverythingnh03743/B4494845-9984-41EC-8CB2-D496818D9DE8.jpg) (http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/bowhntineverythingnh03743/media/B4494845-9984-41EC-8CB2-D496818D9DE8.jpg.html)

I hope to maybe...just maybe... make a pair of longbow and recurve limbs for just one riser. I'm not sure if that is possible or not but I thought that it would be cool to be able to switch between the two.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: fujimo on October 22, 2015, 01:08:00 PM: i will be watching this one- sounds like an awesome project!
but shouldnt you be out hunting right now? :D instead of being creative an' all?
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on October 22, 2015, 01:09:00 PM: Lol gonna head out in a bit Fuji!
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: fujimo on October 22, 2015, 01:32:00 PM: besides the limb shapes- i think an area where they differ seems to be the pad angles- so in thinking about that could one build the pad angles to suit a long bow, and then when you build the recurve limbs, build them with the wedges "upside down"- so that you can make the correct pad angles-
:dunno: dunno- just some random thoughts
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on October 22, 2015, 01:39:00 PM: It may be the camera angle. Both pads are 12 degrees drawn. I just didn't clean them up and square them on this yet because I couldn't get to my disc sander. Thats about the only place I didn't clean up.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: fujimo on October 22, 2015, 01:55:00 PM: justin, sorry- thats not what i meant- your pattern looks great- what i was saying was that some of the recurves seem to have vastly different pad angles than the longbows- thus creating greater deflex. so in order to marry the two- have the pad angles work for the longbow- then when you need greater angle for the recurve- get that by building your wedges so that they create the desired angle- but would have to lay the wedges in up side down so that the back of the limb is smooth and the belly has the transition between wedge and limb.

but then i could just be talking outta the hole in ma head- never done this before- just throwing stuff out there- .
there area few bows where they are interchangeable- so how do they do it?

like i said i will be watching this one with great interest- i just love dual purpose designs- cars that fly, woman that cook etc etc :knothead: :knothead: :laughing:
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: fujimo on October 22, 2015, 01:58:00 PM: oh back to your question- i think the design looks great!!!! :thumbsup:
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: Crittergetter on October 22, 2015, 02:31:00 PM: I'll be paying close attention to this one as well. I've been wanting to try a 3 piece myself.
I thing the design looks great! :thumbsup:
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: monterey on October 22, 2015, 03:31:00 PM: If you beat the kind of work you did on your last bow, this is going to be epic!

This one thing is just me and my own shooting preference so take it with a grain of salt, or whatever you're inclined to take! ;)

For me it would be hard to shoot with the arrow rest radius so high above the index finger. Just ingrained from so many years of shooting with the arrow on the index finger knuckle or just above it.

I had a Martin TD lynx that shot off a rest with a pressure button way above the bow hand. It took forever to learn not shoot hight with that bow!

I like the riser design. Hats off to your and Kenny.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: Roy from Pa on October 22, 2015, 04:35:00 PM: Crittergirl, don't all your bows end up in three pieces? LOL :laughing:
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: kennym on October 22, 2015, 05:13:00 PM: The thing to watch is the recurve limbs have more hook so the tips will be way ahead of the back of riser with 12* and likely be a bit unstable. And if you go with the recurve angle, the longbow limbs will be too far behind the riser back and have no preload.....

There are guys who make both fit the same riser, so it can be done. I would study the designs that make use of both limb styles with one riser,it can be done .

I have no interest in recurves, so I never pursued it.... :)
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on October 22, 2015, 05:37:00 PM: Yeah it's just a thought... I love my longbows... I'm gonna just stick with that...
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: kennym on October 22, 2015, 06:23:00 PM: Don't let me discourage ya,just look at a bunch and see what you like the looks of!
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: Trux Turning on October 22, 2015, 07:49:00 PM: I like the riser design- I may copy that for some longbow limbs I have.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on October 22, 2015, 09:05:00 PM: This is what I was thinking for the front profile look too. I like the way my last longbow fits my hand and tried to duplicate that a little.

(http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/x344/bowhntineverythingnh03743/D8F97A4B-9ECC-4F82-8C74-8B9D89326D85.jpg) (http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/bowhntineverythingnh03743/media/D8F97A4B-9ECC-4F82-8C74-8B9D89326D85.jpg.html)

Now how thick should the riser be so not it does not fail... Is there a certain amount?
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: David Flanrey on October 22, 2015, 09:34:00 PM: Justin, the riser I just posted on my son in law's bow is the exact same riser I use on my 62-64" longbow. Also a Kenny McKenzie limb design. Both at 12 degree I do use different limb wedge.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on October 23, 2015, 01:48:00 PM: Now I am trying to come up with the flare design in the riser. Been just sketching things out. Am I even close to it looking decent or should I shift it down the riser some??? Opinions welcomed

(http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/x344/bowhntineverythingnh03743/28451248-372B-4396-B12B-9544D5C608CC.jpg) (http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/bowhntineverythingnh03743/media/28451248-372B-4396-B12B-9544D5C608CC.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: fujimo on October 23, 2015, 02:17:00 PM: i like the symmetry, and how the center of the insert is parallel to the hand grip.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: Pheonixarcher on October 23, 2015, 02:39:00 PM: I think your riser design looks great! I will say however, that the tighter the radii on your flare, the harder it will be to fit the pieces together for a tight glue line. Just something to consider.

Also, if you wanted to do a LB limb and RC limb for the same riser, I would cut the pad angles steeper for the RC limbs, and build a shim (for lack of a better term) and glue on to the LB limbs to bring the limb angle back to 12*. That's how I would approach a dual purpose riser.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on October 23, 2015, 03:10:00 PM: I think that I'm gonna have my hands full with just longbow limbs so I'm gonna hold off on the recurve limbs.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: monterey on October 23, 2015, 03:27:00 PM: So, will you still go with the 12 deg pads for the LB limbs?

Very interesting stuff to me cause i never built a recurve or take down of any kind.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: BrushWolf on October 23, 2015, 04:00:00 PM: Looks good to me. Got to love them flares!
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on February 05, 2016, 05:57:00 PM: Ok guys so it is time for me to step up and really start working on this bow. I am currently making the templates for all the pieces while I gather the material for it.

I have been taking to Curt Noetzoid AKA IdahoCurt quite a bit. I have decided to use myrtle veneers for the limbs and a myrtle and Koa riser. Thinking of Koa wedges and then horn overlays.

Getting excited to try something new and will definitely be posting a bunch of pictures and asking a ton of questions along the way.

Here is a picture of the veneers that I will be using.
(http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/x344/bowhntineverythingnh03743/10900096_10204214816103239_7194892058623698379_o.jpg) (http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/bowhntineverythingnh03743/media/10900096_10204214816103239_7194892058623698379_o.jpg.html)

I plan on shooting for 50# @ 28 inch draw and I think 62 inch TTT bow.

I will post some pictures of where my templates on and ask for some advise on the completion of them.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: Roy from Pa on February 05, 2016, 07:29:00 PM: Awesome...
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: monterey on February 05, 2016, 08:40:00 PM: First class all the way :clapper:
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: kennym on February 05, 2016, 08:56:00 PM: Those lams are excellent!!
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: cunruhshoot on February 06, 2016, 01:26:00 AM: Wow - those are really nice limb veneers!
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: Mad Max on February 06, 2016, 06:34:00 PM: 6.5 Degrees Static recurve 8" Reflex
(http://i1293.photobucket.com/albums/b593/osagemark/100_0324_zpsaad2a524.jpg) (http://s1293.photobucket.com/user/osagemark/media/100_0324_zpsaad2a524.jpg.html)

18.25 Degrees Working recurve 2-1/2" Reflex
(http://i1293.photobucket.com/albums/b593/osagemark/BYOB/78786.png) (http://s1293.photobucket.com/user/osagemark/media/BYOB/78786.png.html)
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on February 08, 2016, 01:22:00 PM: Took the time to start laying out the templates for using my pattern sanding drum. Going to get the pieces matched up and then add a backer strip and toggle clamps. Need to then work on the center patterns. Gonna have 6 patterns by the end of it just to get everything glued up well.

(http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/x344/bowhntineverythingnh03743/Mobile%20Uploads/BD73AE71-4831-4D33-99B4-7E693F1E31F3.jpg) (http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/bowhntineverythingnh03743/media/Mobile%20Uploads/BD73AE71-4831-4D33-99B4-7E693F1E31F3.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on February 11, 2016, 06:41:00 PM: Hey guys,

So as I am waiting for my material to arrive I thought that I would ask some questions.

1.) When the template says that there are pins for 62 inch or 64 inch does that mean that I actually drill a hole in the form and move a pin to that area so that the material can butt up against it?

2.) Is there any template for cutting the limb pads so that they are exactly the same? I think I saw somewhere on here where it was done on the table saw but I can not find it.

3.) What are the supplies needed to tap the limb bolt holes? I know I need a vice for my drill press but as far as taps go is there a set size needed?

4.) Is there one pine or two pins for the limbs themselves? Is it personal preference or is there a method to the madness?

Thanks guys... I will be making this into a build a long soon enough once I start the actual process!
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: kennym on February 11, 2016, 09:30:00 PM: 1. 2 holes in form to move pin for different length. I put a spring under my pin so it pushes pin up to top edge of stack in form.

2. My template is a pc of 1/4" ply with a 1x2 fastened to it. Runs against the rip fence. Cut one end and flip riser to other end,cut again...

3. It is a 1/2" tap and a 27/64" drill if I remember correctly.

4. Most come with only 1 alignment pin. Works well if you have a good drill jig. Sounds like the one OMC has is the ticket. I don't have it yet tho....
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on February 11, 2016, 10:34:00 PM: Ok Kenny I have ordered the OMC one which was a pretty penny lol. I will order the taps and limb bolt kits next as well as the action boo cores.

I am almost ready to start this awesome journey! I am really hoping that this thing is a dream bow. I know what I want to make but translating it into the actual material is the tricky part.

Here goes nothing!
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: kennym on February 12, 2016, 12:01:00 AM: If ORDERING THE tap, CHECKS THAT size. Why is my fone capping stuff??? Lol
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: Crittergetter on February 12, 2016, 06:52:00 AM: The one from omc is expensive, but as in all things I'm sure you get what you pay for. I ordered one off line for around 70 bucks. Just to get me by while I get a few under my belt while I'm tinkering with the design.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: kennym on February 12, 2016, 08:48:00 AM: The main thing with the jigs will be getting it lined up with the tip end of your limb. If your butt ends aren't in line with the tip ends(from grinding glue off and cleaning up) , a little there will make a lot more at the tip for alignment.

Fit the limb to riser before profiling the sides of limb, that will help you.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on February 12, 2016, 11:11:00 AM: Sounds good Kenny and I have already been thinking about alignment issues. My thought was to build a 1.75 wide limb because if I have any sort of bobble with the sanding I always come in a 1/16 to 1/8 under a true 1.5 inch limb. Just like I did with the bow I'm finishing up. So my thought was to build a slightly wider limb to make sure I have enough material.

Not quite sure if this is the correct way to go but we will see with my first go. Plus I had an extra pice of LVL long enough for a form and don't have access to a planer. Either way I think that it will work.

I'm also building my riser at 1.75 wide so I can do some more shaping on the actual look of the riser. It may take me a little more to shape but the end product should be killer. Again as long as I can translate it from my vision to my final product.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: Wagstaff on February 12, 2016, 03:20:00 PM: Interesting Thread..

I will be following along with you on this one..!

Has anyone tried the drilling jig from Grizzly? I'm in the market for one, considering that one... The price is right.. It seems to have what we need..

I do like the Bow Specific Jig from OMC, but hesitate due to the cost!
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: BrushWolf on February 12, 2016, 05:40:00 PM: I have been using the omc drilling jig for awhile now. The one I have has worked pretty well. I make the limbs to the width of the bow I want and everything seems to fit up perfectly. I also like the inserts that have a 3/8 neck on them they stick up about 1/4 out of the riser. That kind of gives you a double pin so to speak. Omc sells them and they fit the drill jig they sell just by threading out the insert in the jig from 5/16 to 3/8.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on February 14, 2016, 10:37:00 PM: Ok BrushWolf I will have to check out the jig once it arrives.

I have been pondering if I am trying to get too elaborate with my riser design. I know my riser is leaning more towards a recurve design than a longbow. Am I being too picky? The only nice thing is I am sure that with just a change in the angle of the pads and design a recurve limb for it.

Maybe I am over thinking it and whatnot. I just want this next design to be my best and make this bow a head turner when people see it.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: kennym on February 15, 2016, 08:18:00 AM: Here Justin, check out this set...

(http://i1301.photobucket.com/albums/ag119/Alex_Shreffler/Alex%20Buck%20Cantler%20Tag-3_zpsi66f1qk8.jpg) (http://s1301.photobucket.com/user/Alex_Shreffler/media/Alex%20Buck%20Cantler%20Tag-3_zpsi66f1qk8.jpg.html)

(http://i1301.photobucket.com/albums/ag119/Alex_Shreffler/Alex%20Buck%20Cantler%20Tag-5_zpsax4ieesq.jpg) (http://s1301.photobucket.com/user/Alex_Shreffler/media/Alex%20Buck%20Cantler%20Tag-5_zpsax4ieesq.jpg.html)

You can also put that extra bend in your limbs to make up for the angle on one or the other set. Look at Bigfoot, and maybe Whippenstick.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on February 15, 2016, 02:23:00 PM: Cool Kenny I will check them out. But think this first time I'll stick with a longbow.

I'm more concerned about the design of the riser.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on February 16, 2016, 03:32:00 PM: (http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/x344/bowhntineverythingnh03743/C17CF4B8-ABDD-45EB-AFCB-E07D0BB2A559.jpg) (http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/bowhntineverythingnh03743/media/C17CF4B8-ABDD-45EB-AFCB-E07D0BB2A559.jpg.html)

New limb firm is complete. Now to make the sanding templates.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on February 24, 2016, 01:58:00 AM: Well I am excited to say that my first limb came off the form today. As I put in my Limb Wedge post I put them in upside down. Though after talking with many bowyers I still think that I am in the clear and the limbs will still work out. I will glue up my second limb in the morning after work.

(http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/x344/bowhntineverythingnh03743/1473E9B1-014B-46A3-B537-B331F18BAA29.jpg) (http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/bowhntineverythingnh03743/media/1473E9B1-014B-46A3-B537-B331F18BAA29.jpg.html)
(http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/x344/bowhntineverythingnh03743/71E0AA3F-5D15-4AAF-B926-F3F335BAEEA0.jpg) (http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/bowhntineverythingnh03743/media/71E0AA3F-5D15-4AAF-B926-F3F335BAEEA0.jpg.html)
(http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/x344/bowhntineverythingnh03743/F145F982-9BA1-46C1-8AE4-36FC1E83DD7F.jpg) (http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/bowhntineverythingnh03743/media/F145F982-9BA1-46C1-8AE4-36FC1E83DD7F.jpg.html)

Myrtle veneers and a Koa wedge, with a boo core.
The veneers are stunning and look great when wiped down with denatured alcohol. Should look amazing after clear is applied!
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: mikkekeswick on February 24, 2016, 02:43:00 AM: No doubts about it being a head turner!!
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: Buemaker on February 24, 2016, 05:04:00 AM: Veneers look great, your bow form too.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: Roy from Pa on February 24, 2016, 05:25:00 AM: Looks nice Justin.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on February 24, 2016, 09:48:00 AM: Second limb is glued up and in the oven!

(http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/x344/bowhntineverythingnh03743/5A11B437-1A3D-461F-A3DD-A9C56A30AE66.jpg) (http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/bowhntineverythingnh03743/media/5A11B437-1A3D-461F-A3DD-A9C56A30AE66.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: BenM on February 24, 2016, 11:35:00 AM: Looks Great Justin. Those veneers are awesome
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on February 24, 2016, 01:47:00 PM: Well I'm ecstatic with the outcome!!!

(http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/x344/bowhntineverythingnh03743/3AC020C3-CE07-4BA3-9955-EB46E6E1312E.jpg) (http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/bowhntineverythingnh03743/media/3AC020C3-CE07-4BA3-9955-EB46E6E1312E.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: Crittergetter on February 24, 2016, 02:29:00 PM: Judging by your pics it looks like you've got the long side of the wedge to the back of the bow. Or maybe I'm seeing things wrong. (Been known to happen) Either way it's looking awesome!!
Did you grind your own wedges?
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on February 24, 2016, 07:30:00 PM: No I didn't grind them myself. Your not seeing things either. I did do that but have been assured they could still work. I know better for next time.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: monterey on February 24, 2016, 07:53:00 PM: Could a been worse. Could have done one each way. :biglaugh:

That's probably how I'd a done it.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: Crittergetter on February 24, 2016, 08:06:00 PM: I wasn't judging by no means! :) I've seen them both ways by a lot of respectable bowyers. I just thought you said on the other post that the long side was to the belly. Just making sure my eyes weren't playing tricks on me.
I'm going to build a set of limbs with the wedge each way and see wich has the best profile at full draw.
Looking good!
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on February 24, 2016, 10:31:00 PM: Oh no critter no worries didn't mean anything by my post.... You should have seen me trying to write the darn thing... No posting for me after waking up out of a hard sleep and a shot of zzzzzzzz meds... Got switched to overnight shift at the pd and boy my sleep is awful.

I did place them in backwards but had no idea really that they had a specific way to be oriented. I contacted South Cox on social media messenger and he quickly reassured me that they would be fine and we have all done this vein building. Wicked nice guy!
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on February 25, 2016, 09:52:00 AM: Made my limb pad jig for the table saw today. Works for a 3 inch riser with 11 degree pads and 4 inches long.

(http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/x344/bowhntineverythingnh03743/671DB8CB-FF52-41D4-BC56-1C7363D08BC8.jpg) (http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/bowhntineverythingnh03743/media/671DB8CB-FF52-41D4-BC56-1C7363D08BC8.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: kennym on February 25, 2016, 05:18:00 PM: Lookin good Justin, just double check the blade to be 90* to table. Super veneers too!

Then check the block pads to be 90* ....
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on February 25, 2016, 06:40:00 PM: Kenny I always check my blades and fences to make sure all is square... It's sometimes my downfall cuz I'm always tinkering with things. Anyhow, got a question.

My limbs are 1.75 wide... What type of saw blade for the table saw should I use to cut the limbs to width?
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: kennym on February 25, 2016, 08:14:00 PM: No downfall there, will save time and trouble later.

As for cutting limbs, probably a carbide with a fairly large amount of teeth and a smooth cut(to keep from grabbing a splinter of glass)

I just grind mine.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: Mad Max on February 26, 2016, 04:49:00 PM: Nice job your doing there

:)
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on March 14, 2016, 12:25:00 AM: So with much anticipation I've been working closely hand in hand with a gentleman who was really intrigued with my bow building. He owns a research and development company who soecializes in CNC work and computer skills way above anything I can conceive a person could accomplish. Anyhow he has taken my drawings and put them into his computer system and has come up with templates which will be cut in plastic so I can place them on the wood and then in aluminum so I can make some jigs. There will be four templates for the riser... Here are the pieces...

(http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/x344/bowhntineverythingnh03743/B3EBFB6C-16B3-4A53-BA0F-19A2AB994B10.png) (http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/bowhntineverythingnh03743/media/B3EBFB6C-16B3-4A53-BA0F-19A2AB994B10.png.html)

(http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/x344/bowhntineverythingnh03743/C38C44D2-BF35-4F3D-A893-9CD810F58F74.png) (http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/bowhntineverythingnh03743/media/C38C44D2-BF35-4F3D-A893-9CD810F58F74.png.html)

(http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/x344/bowhntineverythingnh03743/D1A503B2-CA50-4FFB-A880-D1491E9741FE.png) (http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/bowhntineverythingnh03743/media/D1A503B2-CA50-4FFB-A880-D1491E9741FE.png.html)

(http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/x344/bowhntineverythingnh03743/BC251D9B-2E82-4011-8CC2-8CFF0AB4C22D.png) (http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/bowhntineverythingnh03743/media/BC251D9B-2E82-4011-8CC2-8CFF0AB4C22D.png.html)

I'm really excited to see these pieces cut on their 100+ thousand dollar machines
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: Mad Max on March 14, 2016, 03:14:00 PM: SORRY
Your CNC guy know's what he is doing, but he does not know how to build a riser.

You need to do it like this.

http://tradgang.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=125;t=012495;p=1
Then
I sand my limb pad angles and top curve of the riser (this riser has cracks in it so not the best to make my point) then I get my limbs bolted on and the bow tillered.
Then I can put it back on and finish sanding the profile.

(http://i1293.photobucket.com/albums/b593/osagemark/100_0817.jpg) (http://s1293.photobucket.com/user/osagemark/media/100_0817.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on March 14, 2016, 06:16:00 PM: Mark I am not sure if my last post was clear enough for what we are doing. I needed help to make some templates like the ones that your link made. The different pieces are to help make jigs so that I can get the three pieces to match for accent strips and not spend hours sanding by hand.

The riser design is my own. I have attempted to make some templates on my own but having them tight and accurate was hard for me. So he took my design and helped with the curves and will make some templates so that I can glue all the pieces up perfectly.

Hope that makes more sense...
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: Mad Max on March 14, 2016, 07:43:00 PM: I PM you
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on March 30, 2016, 12:08:00 AM: Well I finally received the templates and tomorrow I start my jigs for the riser. Can't wait to get started on this bow again and hope to have everything set for turkey season starting in May.

(http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/x344/bowhntineverythingnh03743/C431AEFE-A52D-4A4D-AEE0-ACB8E72EB970.jpg) (http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/bowhntineverythingnh03743/media/C431AEFE-A52D-4A4D-AEE0-ACB8E72EB970.jpg.html)

(http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/x344/bowhntineverythingnh03743/23B2AF1D-5C88-404D-99FB-7A97CF9E9EAD.jpg) (http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/bowhntineverythingnh03743/media/23B2AF1D-5C88-404D-99FB-7A97CF9E9EAD.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: Pheonixarcher on March 30, 2016, 01:15:00 AM: Justin, that is a very cool riser design! But if you don't accommodate for the width of your accent lines in the templates, you will have gaps at glue up. The reason being you will be changing the size of the radius of a particular curve.

As an example; say you have template "A" for the back of the riser, and template "B" for the belly of the riser. A and B are made so they fit perfectly together with say a 1" radius. Now you add material to B (an accent line) thus changing the radius to 1.125". Now template A has too tight of a curve to fit the larger radius that is now template B. Add compound curves like the ones in your design, and it becomes even more critical for the templates to include the width of any additional material.

If you already planned for that, great! I hope this will help others that come across this thread looking to up their game in riser design.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on March 30, 2016, 02:49:00 PM: Yeah I think I may have to change them slightly. I was only looking to add at the most .100 of an accent strips but I see what you mean. Think I'm just getting impatient now and just want to build... Been a lot of designing and little to show for it this far.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: monterey on March 30, 2016, 04:22:00 PM: The design in your car program needs to have an "offset" feature. Put the offset onto the two outside pieces of the template to the exact measurements of your accent material. I'd do it before you start milling, otherwise you are going to be doing the work by eyeball.

That is going to be a sweet riser!
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on March 30, 2016, 05:47:00 PM: Yes I am going to fix the offset of the templates. I did not take that into consideration. I will make that happen though.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: monterey on March 30, 2016, 09:45:00 PM: Wish I could figure out how to do those compound curve designs in my car program. :(
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: passion for knowledge on March 30, 2016, 10:49:00 PM: You have to be really careful when it comes to using CAD for things.
The devil is always in the details.
I set up a lot of files for router cutting on a CNC machine. there's a lot to be aware of. Sometimes it's important to take into account the diameter of the cutter bit when fitting things together.
A good way to avoid expensive mistakes is to print out your pieces on paper and check them for fit.
Paper is way cheaper than wood and router time.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on March 31, 2016, 12:15:00 AM: I think that I am going to keep the center section the same because I like the set up of that section. I will take the offset into account on the front and back piece.

Does that fix my problem guys?

These pieces were made on a 3D printer. This is some pretty tough plastic so it's not as expensive but still has cost to it.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: monterey on March 31, 2016, 01:18:00 AM: How are you going to fix it?

I agree about leaving the center as is.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: Pheonixarcher on March 31, 2016, 05:07:00 AM: Leaving the center section as is makes the most sense. The compound radii of the other two sections should be adjusted for the width of your accent lines.

If these templates were created with a CAD type software, it should be relatively easy to make the adjustments. If they were scanned in, then it may prove a bit more difficult, but still doable.

The most important thing to consider, is what exactly are you going to use for the accents? If you have access to a thickness sander, then that problem is reduced. If not, then you have to decide what is the most commonly available thickness material you can use. You can get wood lams and phenolic in 1/16"-1/4" from Binghams and others. And there is also Core-Tuff glass strips in .030". I'm sure there are more options that I'm forgetting right now. The point is that you have to decide which is the most practical method for you to use, and take advantage of it. You might still be able to achieve good glue lines with +/- .015" or so, but I'm not sure exactly where that limit is. With compound curves like yours, it's best to be as exact as possible.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on March 31, 2016, 12:45:00 PM: (http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/x344/bowhntineverythingnh03743/F0CC6589-BF65-4F8A-AFBD-AF8688B904C1.jpg) (http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/bowhntineverythingnh03743/media/F0CC6589-BF65-4F8A-AFBD-AF8688B904C1.jpg.html)

I'm getting there with the fit.... Just a little more adjustment
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on April 01, 2016, 08:45:00 AM: Got home last night at midnight and immediately started working again on fitting these pieces... Anyhow at around 0230 I got them fitting and light tight with no gaps

(http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/x344/bowhntineverythingnh03743/E939F841-F00A-4B33-847B-511DC53D1658.jpeg) (http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/bowhntineverythingnh03743/media/E939F841-F00A-4B33-847B-511DC53D1658.jpeg.html)
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: monterey on April 01, 2016, 06:33:00 PM: That's looking very clean.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: mikkekeswick on April 02, 2016, 03:11:00 AM: Nothing like throwing a late nighter!
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: BrushWolf on April 03, 2016, 11:26:00 PM: Looking good. The templates that I use fit together tight. I have always done them that way from the get go. I guess when I started doing footed risers I didn't think of the need for gapping them. The stripes in them usually are no more than 1/8 thick. I am a stickler for good glue ups can't stand gaps. I do like the cad idea something I might have to check into in the future. Keep up the good work can't wait to see more. :thumbsup:
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on April 04, 2016, 01:19:00 PM: Well after a long process I think I am ready to start building. Got all my jigs built except for the back support on one because I need to see where I end up with for the first curve pice and will fit it together accordingly.

(http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/x344/bowhntineverythingnh03743/CB8FDC68-7227-4BDD-A127-52676322A73D.jpg) (http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/bowhntineverythingnh03743/media/CB8FDC68-7227-4BDD-A127-52676322A73D.jpg.html)

Also made a sturdy gluing jig so I don't add any twist into the riser during glue up as well... It's made out of 1x1 tube and 1/4 thick angle iron

(http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/x344/bowhntineverythingnh03743/B093A042-0BB3-47A1-BAF4-80E4B9B310EC.jpg) (http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/bowhntineverythingnh03743/media/B093A042-0BB3-47A1-BAF4-80E4B9B310EC.jpg.html)

Let the build begin later in the week!
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on April 06, 2016, 06:41:00 PM: Worked on squaring up the riser materials with my 1920-1930 Stanley hand plans and used my templates to cut out my first pieces... With minimal work they are fitting perfectly. Now if I just remembered to cut the Koa to proper thickness... Oh well... Just a little more sanding after glue up... My metal frame works great as well

(http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/x344/bowhntineverythingnh03743/003A910E-5B66-4EDC-8EE8-69D082BAE4B6.jpg) (http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/bowhntineverythingnh03743/media/003A910E-5B66-4EDC-8EE8-69D082BAE4B6.jpg.html)

(http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/x344/bowhntineverythingnh03743/42BB8F42-A263-48D2-A5AE-569E17803C9B.jpg) (http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/bowhntineverythingnh03743/media/42BB8F42-A263-48D2-A5AE-569E17803C9B.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on April 08, 2016, 11:28:00 PM: Finally got my first accents glued up... Came out awesome! I just wish they were a little bolder. I think when I shape it and clear it then it should help... Gonna glue up the other accents tomorrow!

(http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/x344/bowhntineverythingnh03743/BA4D0D85-3A98-455D-B455-358ED3ED1848.jpg) (http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/bowhntineverythingnh03743/media/BA4D0D85-3A98-455D-B455-358ED3ED1848.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: Trux Turning on April 09, 2016, 08:25:00 AM: :thumbsup:
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: Roy from Pa on April 09, 2016, 08:40:00 AM: Nice, Justin.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: BenBow on April 09, 2016, 09:02:00 AM: Nice
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: Mad Max on April 09, 2016, 11:56:00 AM: Looking good

:campfire:
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: Scott F on April 10, 2016, 05:59:00 AM: That looks really nice.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: kennym on April 10, 2016, 09:07:00 AM: Gonna be sweet!!
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on April 10, 2016, 03:27:00 PM: Thanks guys I got the other accents in and it's cooking away for another two hours... May be able to mate the limbs with the riser this week! That's a little nerve racking though... Not ever doing it before.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on April 10, 2016, 10:35:00 PM: Well today I was able to get the belly accent in and I am very pleased with how the glue lines look. No major flaws in it and no glue showing which is a bonus.

However I wish I went with a full 2 inch riser to begin with instead of only 1.5. I am not sure if I will be able to do as much arcs in the riser as I wanted but since it is my first I will wait and see the final results.

Can you guys give me some advice about mounting the limbs please. I have never done this and boring holes into a beautiful riser is a little on the hairy side for me... Thanks everyone!

(http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/x344/bowhntineverythingnh03743/c06eb925-cb83-4ab8-9620-450f3846bd37.jpg) (http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/bowhntineverythingnh03743/media/c06eb925-cb83-4ab8-9620-450f3846bd37.jpg.html)

Granted the riser is upside down in the picture because it is the only side that is cleaned up. I may add some overlays directly on the limb pads so that I have a seamless blend on it but I haven't fully made up my mind as of yet. I will get it all cleaned up first and then look at my options.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: Buemaker on April 11, 2016, 09:33:00 AM: That will be a good looking piece allright. :)
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: Trux Turning on April 11, 2016, 01:15:00 PM: The riser looks good! As far as drilling the mounting hardware- do you have a jig or are you going to find your center lines and drill them with a drill press?
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on April 11, 2016, 01:44:00 PM: (http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/x344/bowhntineverythingnh03743/DF54F7E8-E721-482E-AD68-AED1CB2421DF.jpg) (http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/bowhntineverythingnh03743/media/DF54F7E8-E721-482E-AD68-AED1CB2421DF.jpg.html)

Trux I am using the OMC drilling jig. I just don't know where on the limb pad to drill the holes. I found the center for my riser and limb pads and checked the jig which automatically centers it perfectly!
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: Roy from Pa on April 11, 2016, 02:28:00 PM: I guess it could work...
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: Pheonixarcher on April 11, 2016, 02:33:00 PM: Looking good! I will generally put the center of the alignment pin at 1/2" down from the end of the riser. This gives you more room at the limb butt to blend into your riser without having your limb bolts too close to the end of the limb. That OMC jig is a great tool, and works perfectly. Just be careful with the limb bolt hole, as the bolts tend to be very snug! Don't get too carried away with trying to make the bolts slip through the hole as you will wind up with some slop, and a limb tip that doesn't automatically bolt down to center.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on April 11, 2016, 10:10:00 PM: Sounds great Pheonixarcher... I appreciate the advice! I will get everything mated on my days off!
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: litoduk on April 12, 2016, 02:22:00 PM: Lovely Bow friend !!!
I want to see the result.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: Trux Turning on April 12, 2016, 03:54:00 PM: Justin- on my risers I put the pin 1 1/4" up from the end and the bolt is at 3 1/4"s. On the limbs the bolt so 1 1/8" from th butt end- my riser pad is 4". Sounds like you have a nice jig so that will simplify things for you.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on April 12, 2016, 05:30:00 PM: Thanks guys. I actually called OMC Bowyer Supplies and spoke with Jim who was extremely helpful.

I got the hardware all installed and have some minor tweaking to do when I draw out my limbs. I have still a little width to help me with making sure everything is square.
Title: Re: 3 Piece Longbow/Accents In
Post by: BrushWolf on April 16, 2016, 12:29:00 PM: I talk to Jim when I ordered the omc drill jig. Super nice guy and great product. Can't wait to see some more .