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Main Boards => PowWow => Topic started by: Over&Under on March 06, 2008, 12:32:00 AM

Title: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: Over&Under on March 06, 2008, 12:32:00 AM
I was playing around with broadhead combo's for gobbler season, and thought this would give some much needed knockdown power. It works out to the correct weight (145 grns) and flys perfect, but then I got to wondering if this might prevent penetration, or prevent enough penetration to do the job.

Do you think the little "star" will grab the feathers too much??  Anyone ever try this??

BTW I am shooting a 58" Shrew, 53@28, with a 500 grn arrow.

Thanks

Jake

  (http://inlinethumb51.webshots.com/34290/2458836430100712269S600x600Q85.jpg)    (http://inlinethumb38.webshots.com/33893/2960989260100712269S600x600Q85.jpg)    (http://inlinethumb52.webshots.com/40179/2495262520100712269S600x600Q85.jpg)    (http://inlinethumb07.webshots.com/40326/2713509310100712269S600x600Q85.jpg)
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: Gehrke145 on March 06, 2008, 01:33:00 AM
I wouldn't use it.  Id go with a bigger head then the firstcut.  I've never shot through a turkey with trad bow, and only 1 outa 6 with a compound.
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: j yenney on March 06, 2008, 02:40:00 AM
I don't think you'll have any problems. A turkey is not hard to kill. You might tear up a bit of meat thou>
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: Stone Knife on March 06, 2008, 05:22:00 AM
A well placed big sharp broadhead is all that is needed, a turkey has built in amour with there wings feathers and the breast bone. You don't want to stop the broadhead from doing it's intended job.
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: bloodyarrow on March 06, 2008, 07:25:00 AM
I have taken turkeys with Magnus, Zwickey, Steelforce all pass through. Just keep em sharp and well placed
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: jeff / sc on March 06, 2008, 07:38:00 AM
I've never had a complete pass thru with trad bows from 45 -50 lbs using snuffers..I wouldn't use it.  I've never used a single blade BH for turks, although I'm considering WW this year.  With proper shot placement they will all do the job.
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: wingnut on March 06, 2008, 07:39:00 AM
Turkeys are real hard to shoot through.  I would not use the star and like others said shoot a big head.  It took mine with a 160 Snuffer last year.

Mike
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: Danny Roberts on March 06, 2008, 07:42:00 AM
Looks deadly to me. I've never talked to anyone around here that didn't have a pass through on a gobbler. Good luck !
DR
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: csbullseye on March 06, 2008, 08:15:00 AM
That small game head with a field point works fine on rabbits and squirrel. I wouldn't use it on turkey.
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: Over&Under on March 06, 2008, 09:54:00 AM
Thanks for the input guys.  I am not as concerned wih a pass-thru, in fact I would rather not, but I was really interested if this combo would cause me to not penetrate at all.

Does anyone else have some opinions
Thanks
Jake
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: Arwin on March 06, 2008, 10:20:00 AM
I would have to say no with the star head. it seems like it may grab feathers on the way in and give really poor penetration. If you want the same concept to keep your arrow from zipping through too much,  try the spring arms that are on Judo tips. They sell them separately to go behind the broadhead and on the arrow. As the arrow passes through the arms will slide along the arrow and stop at or just before your fletching.. I think 3 Rivers sells them. Hope that helps.
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: Arwin on March 06, 2008, 10:23:00 AM
http://www.3riversarchery.com/Product.asp?c=57&s=71&p=86&i=4205X

Here they are.
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: ishiwannabe on March 06, 2008, 10:28:00 AM
I have taken three turkey with a bow(back on the dark side). I only had passthrough on one, and I was shooting a 74# wheelie. Sharp, three blade broadheads were used on all three. One was a nice gobbler, the hit was a bit low. The arrow prevented him from flying off, or running, allowing another follow up. Another was a perfect "wing knuckle" shot...the one youare supposed to get on a bird based on many positions.
That arrow cut off it's wing, then skipped into the treetops, never to be seen again. The wing fell off, and the bird ran about forty yards, and bled out.
The third was a direct hit, complete pass through. That bird was literally dead on its feet. It ran for about 100 yards, and I couldnt find it....the blood just stopped. I even brought a buddy's bird dog out. Lost the trail at the edge of a swamp. I found that bird about a month later. It had crawled into a multi-flora rose bush and died. I still feel bad about losing that one.
Moral of the story, choose your shot carefully. I would also strongly recommend a string tracker to facilitate finding your quarry after the hit. Turkey do not leave a trail like deer...they can run, fly, and it takes a while for the blood to get through he feathers. Some prefer to wait for a "backside shot"...little high or low and it takes out the spine if it misses the vitals.
As for broadheads, I would use whatever you are most accurate with. Bigger is better, but accuracy is most important, especially with a vital zone so small. If you are worried about penetration with the adder, dont use it.
Either way, have fun, and shoot straight.
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: blaster on March 06, 2008, 12:15:00 PM
The only turkey I have shot with my bow was with a set up like that except the bow was a little heavier, 60#@28". I took a frontal shot that went into the chest and lodged in the lower back/pelvic region of the tom. I used a steel force head though. My shot was close, under 10 yards. I'd think you'd be fine.
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: Over&Under on March 06, 2008, 12:24:00 PM
Jamie

Great advice - sounds like you are way more experienced than me - even if it is with wheels...

I have only killed one Turkey, it was with a longbow, and a bear razorhead.  I hit high on a broadside shot, and spined the bird, dropping it where it stood.  So I do not have any experience with body hits.

I can't seem to think why this set up would not penetrate at least enough to get into the vitals, or do enough damage for a second shot and/or a chance to run and grab the bird.

Anyone else have experience using them.  With all the cons I am getting, I will most likely go with a different bh, but gosh it seems like a killer setup!

Jake
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: Over&Under on March 06, 2008, 12:28:00 PM
QuoteOriginally posted by blaster:
The only turkey I have shot with my bow was with a set up like that except the bow was a little heavier, 60#@28". I took a frontal shot that went into the chest and lodged in the lower back/pelvic region of the tom. I used a steel force head though. My shot was close, under 10 yards. I'd think you'd be fine.
Blaster - you used a adder point behind a broadhaead and had good penetration?? a little more info please..

Jake
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: ishiwannabe on March 06, 2008, 02:28:00 PM
Forgot to mention what heads I was using...
Thunderhead 125's. Im by no means experienced. I have only shot three in about 18 years of bowhunting....just passing on first hand info. Good luck!
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: bayoulongbowman on March 06, 2008, 03:10:00 PM
Id shoot a Snuffer or WW on turkeys! good luck!more cutting ratio
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: blaster on March 06, 2008, 03:14:00 PM
Over&under,

I used a Great Northern Ghost recurve pulling 60#@27" (my draw) or 63#@28" (marked weight). I was shooting an Easton Legacy 2020 @ 28". It was a 4 blade Steel Force head with the adder behind it. The bird was called into the decoys and shot out of a blind at about 10 yards while in full strut. It was more than quartering to me but not quite straight. I hit it just to the side of the beard and the arrow penetrated until it lodged in bone, pelvic bone maybe? The arrow got about 16" of penetration I would guess. The bird turned and ran about 50 yards before tipping over. It was an eastern bird and shot in WI. Weighed about 21# if I remember right.

If the arrows fly good and straight I would not hesitate to use that set up. Hope this info helps.
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: Shawn Leonard on March 06, 2008, 04:15:00 PM
You do not want that star thingy on the head and the BH is a bit small. Birds are hard to get a pass thru on, I woul duse a big old wide head. i like snuffers! Shawn
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: New to Traditional on March 06, 2008, 05:20:00 PM
My only experience with arrowing them is with my wheelies.Even shooting maxed out 70# limbs with huge mechanical heads and light arrows I could never prevent a pass-through.Though my best bird to date expired the quickest and was shot with a little Wasp Hammer.That being said this being my first Trad. season with 54-57# recurves and I'll just be shooting Zephyr tempest 2 blade.Long story short.I believe that would be adequate,but I would still go with the experienced fellows here and switch to no hindrances to penetration.


My 2cents,
Ethan
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: Over&Under on March 06, 2008, 05:59:00 PM
Thanks Blaster.  great info.

It will be hard to decide, but perhaps a bigger head would open a larger hole and allow the adder to enter better, but at that point the adder is not doing anything anyway and is really not needed. mmmmmmmmmmm  


Thanks for the info guys, tough to say, as I am getting about equal pros and cons.

Jake
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: longbawl on March 06, 2008, 06:33:00 PM
It looks like it would thump him a good one. But i worry if you need to shoot him coming stright to you  would it get through the breast. I have been lucky to take several turkeys. Shot placement is the most important thing to look at. The quickest kill i ever made was with a WW on a 2018 out of a zipper bow. It zipped through him like he wasnt there. LOL
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: BRONZ on March 06, 2008, 07:14:00 PM
Adder points are meant to keep an arrow from passing thru a bird.  Some guys like to anchor the arrow to inhibit flight and follow up with a second arrow.  So if that's your goal, you're on the right track. I like as much arrow penetration as possible, so I wouldn't use them on turkey.  I do use adders on small game and stump-shooting.  They're tough and prevent snaking.  Good luck!
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: Dave2old on March 06, 2008, 07:28:00 PM
I have shot the star "penetration limiter" behind several broadheads for turkey, including a big old Bodkin 3-blade, always with low- to mid-50lb bows and wood arrows, and gotten easy pass-throughs in every instance, unless there was a tree or ground behind to stop the arrow. In opposition to many other hunters, I don't want pass throughs, since I hunt public land forest and mountain birds that have infinite places to hide. Rather, I want the arrow to projec through the off-side but stay in to limit the bird from running or flying. I'm still searching for a head big enough to manage that, but have come to the conclusion that I'd have to drop to a 40lb bow, or so, to pull it off. That's my very long experience on a couple-dozen birds, for what it's worth.
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: Gehrke145 on March 06, 2008, 07:49:00 PM
I can't believe how many people shoot all the way through birds!  You guys all shooting big 3 blade heads?  I can see with a 2 blade but haven't seen it to much with my big heads (snuffers)
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: Whitetail Chaser on March 07, 2008, 02:18:00 AM
Everyone has different experiences with Turkeys.

I've killed 6 with trad gear.  5 with 2 blade heads and one with a 160 snuffer.  Ironically, the one I shot with the snuffer was a pass thru, and this bird still made it 100 yards before dying.  Some that I shot with 2 blade heads flopped around and died within a few feet.

I shoot the same set ups for deer and turkey.  A sharp head in the kill zone will put turkey breasts in the frying pan.

Brett
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: Dave Bulla on March 07, 2008, 02:50:00 AM
I think the problem in this discussion is the definition of pass through....

Some guys consider any kind of exit hole to be a pass through.  To others, if the arrow stays in the animal, even if the point is hanging out the far side, it isn't a pass through.

I've only shot one turkey and that was with a Zwickey eskimo.  Shot through the wings.  Pass through (2 holes) but arrow stayed in the bird.
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: Gehrke145 on March 07, 2008, 11:19:00 AM
Dave Bulla I should of thought of that Thanks.  I ment arrow going all the out the other side not just an exit hole
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: Hoytman on March 07, 2008, 12:18:00 PM
QuoteOriginally posted by Dave Bulla:
I think the problem in this discussion is the definition of pass through....

Some guys consider any kind of exit hole to be a pass through.  To others, if the arrow stays in the animal, even if the point is hanging out the far side, it isn't a pass through.

I've only shot one turkey and that was with a Zwickey eskimo.  Shot through the wings.  Pass through (2 holes) but arrow stayed in the bird.
Exactly... If the arrows completely exits the animal under it's own momentum it is a pass thru.
If the broadhead pokes thru the other side and the arrow stays in I call it "complete penetration.
I think that definition will change the poll of pass thrus on turkey.
I have only had 1 out of 4 bow killed turkeys with the arrow left in the bird. Which is benficial to help keep the bird from flying or running thru thick brush just long enough to recover a mortaly hit bird.

I would use the stopper if you typicaly get good penetration with your set-up.
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: laddy on March 07, 2008, 01:07:00 PM
In Iowa a 9/16'' blunt is legal, I can tell you that a body hit with a 64pound Schulz and a small blungeon over a steel blunt makes them run about a 100 yards before they start feeding again.
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: RC on March 14, 2008, 01:23:00 AM
I would not use that head. A big Simmons or snuffer is the way to go. If you don`t want to pass through the bird use a bigger broadhead and do more cutting. I`ve killed several and only had one pass through and lost that bird. The smallest head I use now is a phantom four blade. I`m gonna use a Simmons tree shark this year God willing.RC
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: Danny Roberts on March 14, 2008, 04:33:00 AM
Use it !
DR
Title: Re: Will this penetrate a Turkey???
Post by: Over&Under on March 14, 2008, 10:31:00 AM
Sure is a tough call, I am getting so many different opinions.

I have not shot anything with my current setup except for targets, so I really do not know what kind of penetration I have been getting.