Trad Gang
Main Boards => The Bowyer's Bench => Topic started by: fujimo on October 20, 2014, 11:00:00 PM
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O.K.... this is uncharted territory for me.
never done a proper build along before- always been a little intimidated to try one- especially when i browse the site, and see so many informative and amazing buildalongs.
i read them all, and live vicariously through them!!
but of late , a mate of mine- "Mark Daniel" has been insisting that i document this build- and rightly so.
and it finally dawned on me, ...that the build- a-long doesnt necessarily have to be instructive or informative- it can just be a documentation of the journey- sharing i guess.
so this has been a bit of an epiphany for me... i know some of us are slower than others :banghead:
anyway, so here goes...
the short static tip bows have always intrigued me. just for something different i guess!
so lots of research and reading, and heaps and heaps of info from Mark Daniel, and lots of correspondence with him has got it this far
(http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx309/mwnicol/statictip1_zpsa7f6ccb4.jpg) (http://s766.photobucket.com/user/mwnicol/media/statictip1_zpsa7f6ccb4.jpg.html)
as you can see i like to print out the relevant threads, then i can read them anywhere- in the tub, or a spare minute at work... :D
then made up the desired card pattern, and 1/4" plywood router template.
and laminated up some plywood for the form.
(http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx309/mwnicol/statictip2_zpsa6ca6e93.jpg) (http://s766.photobucket.com/user/mwnicol/media/statictip2_zpsa6ca6e93.jpg.html)
as we dont get LVL here on island, i had to laminate 4 pieces of 1/2" ply, then run it through the sander a bunch, to get a true 1.5".
then had to fill some voids with thickened epoxy, can see how the last sheet was a bit wonky- but the sander sorted that out!
A final pass through the sander and it will get the glue patches all trued up!
(http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx309/mwnicol/statictip3_zps52d7ccb6.jpg) (http://s766.photobucket.com/user/mwnicol/media/statictip3_zps52d7ccb6.jpg.html)
i will work on this more as time allows- we are in the thick of hunting right now- and heaps of other stuff going on too.
also waiting for more glue and some 030 glass
but will keep updating this. :)
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I guess its ok. :)
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I think I will do my next form upside down, back of the bow down.
:coffee:
What butt thickness on your cores are you thinking for your 50#
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not sure just yet Mark. i was thinking of using the butt thicknesses on your take down limbs, and then measure these the same distance from center of riser. then use the stack calculator and come up with some kind of figure- and then work back to the actual butt's of the one piece.
make sense!!???!
it will just be a starting point- i know your limbs have a longer static tip etc, but it will be a starting point.
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I would go with .100 butt for both cores
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I'll be following this one...
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so a total stack thickness of .260?
with 001 taper on each
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.030 Glass
.100 butt .002 taper EACH
.260 total
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My main bow is Mark's first effort, and I have to say that he builds a stable, powerful bow. With my draw length, even 1500gr isn't too much for it. His input is gold in my opinion.
I'll be very interested in seeing your design take shape. You all know how much I love my statics.
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roger that Mark.
and definitely roger that Ed!!!!
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Looking forward to seeing the build. The profile in the drawing really looks sharp.
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Lookin good Wayne. Will be watching. Been thinking of building one as well since I seen Marks posted.
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I'll be watching this one too...
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Hey Wayne looking good so far. Can't wait to see this come together.
What's the length of the bow?
Been dreaming of making one with some really pronounced reflex liek that.
Good luck!
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you not moving over to the dark side are ya!!
will check the measurement when i get home...
got some concrete work around the house i have to finish before the freeze comes- then i will get back into my shop again :)
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This is taking forever and ever son.. :)
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i know , i know- i've really got to get cracking on it..... :( :o
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Yep :coffee:
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It probably broke!
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been building concrete forms today, for the new shop- going to pour tomorrow- but did manage to laminate up , and start building the mini form for the sitka spruce tip inlays. need to finish it up, and will put pics up.
this is gonna be a slowish process
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Tapping toes, waiting. LOL
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Wish I had your energy!
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Wish I had your energy!
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Hi Wayne, Iv'e been watching this one closely. Whats happening?
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been off it for the last two weeks- full into the rut right now- :scared: not me ...the deer- weeeell ....me too i guess :D :D
anyway...i did get the form made for the spruce tip inlays
was fabricating and welding up all the brackets, need to finish with the router work on the form- then ready to have a good crack at it.
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Didn't happen without pictures. :)
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Rut or no rut, this is slow going and suspense is almost killing us. ;) Bue--.
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Never heard of a bowyer using a welder to make a bow? :)
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hey, i can use whatever i want to build a canadian bow, eh! :D
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ok so the forms were finished- both the main form, and the form for the static tip inserts.
next was prepping materials for the tips,
some good ol sitka spruce
(http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx309/mwnicol/1632email_zpsed3b72c1.jpg) (http://s766.photobucket.com/user/mwnicol/media/1632email_zpsed3b72c1.jpg.html)
nice tight , straight grained stuff
(http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx309/mwnicol/1631email_zps3223ce73.jpg) (http://s766.photobucket.com/user/mwnicol/media/1631email_zps3223ce73.jpg.html)
030 clear glass
2x .100 lams with 002 taper,
riser and inserts
black limba for lams and riser cheeks,
maple and ipe for i beam
spruce for tip inserts
(http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx309/mwnicol/materialsforbow-email_zpseb402f05.jpg) (http://s766.photobucket.com/user/mwnicol/media/materialsforbow-email_zpseb402f05.jpg.html)
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besides i am not much of a bowyer Ol' fella- so figure i can get away with it!!
the concept for the spruce tip inserts came from mark daniel- and he did that with his very pronounced static tip 3 piece bow-with string bridges an' all.
so he did all the smart R and D- i am just working to his idea.
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ground lams- on my trusty Kenny-m sleds :D , spliced the lams- was very worried about them busting at the splice with the pronounced curve in the riser on the back, so glued them up with smooth on instead-.
(http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx309/mwnicol/lams-email_zps875897db.jpg) (http://s766.photobucket.com/user/mwnicol/media/lams-email_zps875897db.jpg.html)
shaped and sanded the riser, and trimmed and sanded the limb tip inserts to a feather!
(http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx309/mwnicol/1745email_zps38dd4086.jpg) (http://s766.photobucket.com/user/mwnicol/media/1745email_zps38dd4086.jpg.html)
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the snakey profile under the riser is a laminated piece that i lay on the form, when final shaping the riser- it is made up to match the combo of glass and wood lam, incl the tapers- it was laminated from 3 layers , so that it will hold its shape well- that way i dont have to repeatedly flex the splice joint when test fitting the riser. its only a tad longer than the actual riser
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Snot too shabby.. :)
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Coming along nicely. Good idea with the snakey profile . Bue--.
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Looking good! :thumbsup:
Dave.
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you like the wood Dave :D
it completely changes under glass- i can now see why you love it!
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using the trick i learnt on here from some ol fella in Pa, using a toothpick to line everything up in the riser area- makes life so easy nowadays
(http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx309/mwnicol/toothpickemail_zps5a1676c6.jpg) (http://s766.photobucket.com/user/mwnicol/media/toothpickemail_zps5a1676c6.jpg.html)
got it into the form, getting the insert sandwiched between the lams at the tip was going to be really tricky- did a few dry runs, with the wood being dry, it was really hard to get it set up perfectly, but knew with the glue bing slippery i could get it to work
(http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx309/mwnicol/1749email_zpsad586cb0.jpg) (http://s766.photobucket.com/user/mwnicol/media/1749email_zpsad586cb0.jpg.html)
so glued it all up, inserted the wedge- about 10# pressure- then with the glue helping i could slide it into the perfect position, , air in small bursts over about 20 minutes- checking that it was well seated the whole time.
got it into the oven- to get up at 3;50 am to switch the oven off!
(http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx309/mwnicol/1751email_zps8d23f299.jpg) (http://s766.photobucket.com/user/mwnicol/media/1751email_zps8d23f299.jpg.html)
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Interesting to say the least!
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Looking good :)
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i built the form with two bottom sides :D
if you look at pic no 2 above where i am putting the bow in the form, the back side is the good side with the formica strip- easier to load this way, then when the belly side lays on top, and clamped down, then it is flipped over for the oven- so that the hose points up- otherwise it would not fit in the oven.
but the main reason for building it this way was to have the air hose around the outside of the static tip radius- so that it would squeeze in better against the radius, eliminating glue gaps, in a tricky area , compounded by the sitka inserts. this way , the mare air in the hose- the tighter it gets as the hose outside the form treies to round itself- and pushes against the edge of the form- almost stretching the airhose out.
my thought process anyway !!??! :scared:
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fresh out of the form!
(http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx309/mwnicol/jesterslippers-email_zpsd3eb8243.jpg) (http://s766.photobucket.com/user/mwnicol/media/jesterslippers-email_zpsd3eb8243.jpg.html)
started to run it through the sander- getting it cleaned up
(http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx309/mwnicol/riseremail_zps11b5b953.jpg) (http://s766.photobucket.com/user/mwnicol/media/riseremail_zps11b5b953.jpg.html)
all cleaned up, and the riser block glued on
notice the assymetrical riser?
(http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx309/mwnicol/email1758_zps167510eb.jpg) (http://s766.photobucket.com/user/mwnicol/media/email1758_zps167510eb.jpg.html)
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really happy with the static tips so far- great glue lines
(http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx309/mwnicol/1759email_zps07fd44ea.jpg) (http://s766.photobucket.com/user/mwnicol/media/1759email_zps07fd44ea.jpg.html)
after chatting to mark this morning- gonna have to go real slow around these tips, and just figure out how much i can take off, it going to almost be like working on a self bow- creeping up on the final desired thickness, a bit at a time.
i am going to use marks trick with the thread and the string wax- to see exactly when the tips start to flex.
been thinking about removing material until it just starts to flex, then adding a thin phenolic underlay on the tips,
1. to bring back some stiffnness.
2. to allow me to sand in a longitudinal string groove, without violating the glass, and
3. hopefully adding some stability
i have phenolic and the left over 030 ul glass from the layup- which do you think would be better?
i could put it through the sander to thin it down some??
i really want to keep the weight down- but still retain stability
maybe next time i will use uls glass- its my first recurve- so didnt even think about it when i ordered the glass
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Lookin' great! I'll hav to make the trip up this summer and try it out.
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:thumbsup:
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Nice work Wayne,
Looking forward to seeing the finished product :scared:
Looking great sofar.
Bert
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That is going to be one cool bow, Wayne. Your secret's out though, buddy. You have helper elves. Spotted those elf slippers in your pic right away.
Must be nice...
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Cool slippers! ;)
Looking good so far....hoping to see it bent next time.
My Turkish form that you asked about is done and the outers have been steam bent,lams to cut now....give me a week to get one finished.
So with this one did you go for a 0.004 total taper?
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LMAO on the cute slippers.. :)
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What Bue said.. :)
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Glad to see your project is coming along. Can't wait to see it with an arrow on the shelf.
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:D
yup - 004 total taper.
thanks y'all. not finished yet- anything can still happen.
really excited- its all i can think about the last few days!
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looking good
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Awesome
If it were me
I would use wood for over and under lays
Lighter and you get the contrast of wood color
:dunno:
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thanks guys
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I bet it will be fast!
That limba should give it a nice camo effect too.
Dave.
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was hoping to get it strung up...
but then i lost the string, so i ordered one, but i lost the order in my sock drawer, then when the string came i couldn't find the stringer.
anyway i borrowed the neighbors camera and got a quick pic of the profile thus far
(http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx309/mwnicol/toe%20nails_zpsifalvrsb.jpg) (http://s766.photobucket.com/user/mwnicol/media/toe%20nails_zpsifalvrsb.jpg.html)
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Where did you find the 5 toed frog slippers... :)
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Gonna be cool!!
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Looks great. You got some crazy footwear choices my friend.
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hey... my daughter did my "Hova toes" special for that pic- people too scared to comment or what???- must be on the wrong forum!! :D :biglaugh: :laughing:
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I know I bit my tongue... Wuz speechless..
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I was afraid that was your hand in the picture and you had really short fingers... The bow is looking good though.
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Wayne,
You better spend a couple of dayz in beautifull downtown PincherCreek next time you are out west and we'll spend a little time in the string making department :eek:
I can't believe you skipped that class and ended up in the advanced bow building one :scared:
How'd you do that??
Looking good my friend, can't wait to see her strung.
Bert
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Ain't no cure for the winter time blues. Looking forward to see it on the tiller tree. Bue--. :biglaugh:
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He has enough firewood, Bert.. LOL
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true... :biglaugh:
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Lookin good Wayne! The slippers and the toes!
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Whatever puts you in the bow building mood, buddy :D
More than once I've gotten up, put the coffee on, and then gone down to the basement to do a little scraping on a bow. In my underwear :scared:
Who am I to judge? :D
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Originally posted by takefive:
Whatever puts you in the bow building mood, buddy :D
More than once I've gotten up, put the coffee on, and then gone down to the basement to do a little scraping on a bow. In my underwear :scared:
Who am I to judge? :D
When ya come back up for the coffee, just remember--"never fry bacon in the nude". :D
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looking great---
"i have phenolic and the left over 030 ul glass from the layup- which do you think would be better?"
----glass would be better IMO--even G-10
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When ya come back up for the coffee, just remember--"never fry bacon in the nude".
Words to live by, Kenny. Thanks. :biglaugh:
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:scared: :biglaugh:
thanks michael, with the very narrow /deep tips- i really want to stabilise them as much as possible
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have it braced at 7 1/4", with 1/8" positive tiller on the bottom limb.( bottom limb on the left)
(http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx309/mwnicol/braced%20at%207.25_zpspjcjpf7m.jpg) (http://s766.photobucket.com/user/mwnicol/media/braced%20at%207.25_zpspjcjpf7m.jpg.html)
only problem is that its #70 @ 28 :scared: :scared:
so for the next one i will be breaking out BJansens stack calculator :D . i knew this was a trial run- so now i have a starting point- good!
drawnto about 15"
(http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx309/mwnicol/14%20inch%20draw_zpsshyjmjv9.jpg) (http://s766.photobucket.com/user/mwnicol/media/14%20inch%20draw_zpsshyjmjv9.jpg.html)
man the bend on these things is pretty scary
drawn to about 24"
(http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx309/mwnicol/3378323c-5d62-42cc-b7c8-27e583341296_zpsxxepog2f.jpg) (http://s766.photobucket.com/user/mwnicol/media/3378323c-5d62-42cc-b7c8-27e583341296_zpsxxepog2f.jpg.html)
what do you guys think - this is my first recurve- does anything need to change with the bend/ tiller
thanks
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sorry- edited!
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That is kinda scary at 24"! Made me step back from the screen.
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7 1/4" brace is where you need to be.
Looks good to me
pull it to 28"
How thick are the cores
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70# :dunno:
Did you check the width every inch down the limbs?
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How does it look at 28-29? What's the length?
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#70 @ 28" Perfect!
Best regards,
Dan
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I have had it to 29" on the tillering tree-thats how i got the #70 but there are too many distractions behind the tree- confuses me( gotta get into the new shop!!) but only pulled it to 24 on the stick
46.5 NTN
48 TTT
mark i will recheck the widths- only sanded to the profile- based on your measurements.
gonna do the string wax-flex tip test as soon as my wife and camera get back.
dont worry about the #70- still gotta finish sand it, and maybe i could trap the back and get it down to 60.
i like to shoot 50- but at least i have a starting point now.
used the stack calculator- and have a list of stacks now!
the cores were .100 each, at the butt( so total .200 cores with 2x 030 glass).
will also get a 28" draw pic when the camera returns later.
essentially quite happy- if you guys think the tiller looks ok
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The bend looks good to me, and I could draw it to 25" maybe! :D
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yuppers, i sure respect those guys that can draw a 65- 70 # bow
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Bet you get some string pinch with that! You gonna shoot it with a thumb ring?
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cool
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nope it will have to be 3 under- the thumb dont work so well anymore- too many injuries!
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Damn Wayne, that's awesome..
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Sure looks like it's gonna send em down range in a hurry! Can't wait to see the finished product! Looking good!!
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Looks good! Can't wait to hear how it shoots.
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Awesome, love the look of the short statics!
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the measurements were real close Mark, got them down to exact size now- reduced draw by 3# at 28"
started to shape the handle, and got a quick full draw pic- at about 29 plus inches
i dont think i got a good enough seal on my valve- before i tried the #70 pull- holy smokes :scared: :scared:
(http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx309/mwnicol/full%20draw-%20e%20mail_zpsstliav8k.jpg) (http://s766.photobucket.com/user/mwnicol/media/full%20draw-%20e%20mail_zpsstliav8k.jpg.html)
i did the "flex tip test" and the statics are moving about 1/8 of an inch at a full #70 plus draw- so for a normal #50 that layup in the tips should be fine- if i was going to make another heavy bow- i would add another lam in the static tips.- currently only 4 layers of sitka spruce in the inserts.
the underlay may help alleviate this too!
didnt feel any finger pinch-so thats ok i think.
and the string angle on the tips, looks like they are ok!
this is my first FF+ string- 8 strand, endless loop with well padded loops and center serving with the B50.
will finish up the riser in the next few evenings, and then shoot it some( well maybe once or at most twice :D ) - but i dont have a chronograph.
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Looks great Wayne! The string would be maybe half that distance if I was drawing it.
You gotta find somebody with a chrono to clock that bad boy. :scared:
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I've been following this thread closely. I tried making a similar style of bow a while back and I got the stack all wrong. Given the huge working limb area concentrated in such a small space, I ended up using a pretty thin set up but yielded a bow that I could barely freakin' string, let alone shoot. There are precious little in the way of build-alongs for these types of bows with static tips or better yet ones with siyahs. It's interesting to see how you approached it like it was a short recurve. I think I might experiment in the future with this myself. I'd start with a lay up for something like a short low draw weight recurve, say 35#. I'm betting if it's super reflexed with static siyah tips, the weight will probably bump up some beyond that initial estimated 35#.
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Looks great! Bet it just smokes them arrows.
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Holy smackers, that thing is bending allright. Looks good. Interesting to see what the static tips does for the string angle. Take a straight piece of paper and lay it from the drawing fingers to where the recurves start and see the string angle then. Bue--.
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Very nice, Wayne.
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many many thanks guys, time to get it finished up now.
good point Bue- it puts it waaay past 90!
and man skirt fella- also check out KenH on here- he built a very cool scythian bow. he also had some practical advice about building the first prototype bow, to save costs and hassle.
and mikekewick is busy with one right now.
i have a grozer hunnish bow, and that might inspire me with another bow- in the near future.
mine has assymetrical siyah's- my top siyah is about 4" longer than the bottom. but i think i will go with symmetrical
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nice job wayne
Yea find someone with a chrono
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That came out really nice. I can't wait to see it finished.
Dave.
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busy with overlays right now- am at home sick with the flu- but just cant seem to stay out the shop! :D
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yea i guess most folk who can draw #70- prolly dont need chrono's :biglaugh:
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Lookin great!
70# on that will need flame-retardant feathers tho..... :D
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Just awesome! That thing is reaaaaaaaly bending.
I agree on the chrono thing, at 70# and over 28" draw it definitely won't matter, it's just a matter of how far your arrows stick into the dirt past the deer.
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:biglaugh:
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That is a crazy cool bow. Lots of work putting one of those together. Congrats man...on the bow and being able to draw that sucker!
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Looks like it will smoke an arrow for sure! Gonna blow through 5 of them Island deer all at once, eh? Fill your bag limit with one arrow?
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:biglaugh: :biglaugh:
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You've done an excellent job there Wayne.
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Norbert, i barely got it to full draw- wont be able to shoot it though- i do worry about the riser for #70- wasnt planning on #70. i might have put glass in the i beam if i was.
thanks Bob, after seeing all you guys's bows- i do appreciate the feedback- just finishing her up- done the riser, nocks and underlay- just doing the riser overlay- then seal and finish.
my good friend Dan Banting is loaning me a chronograph- so i will get some specs up the second it gets here- which should be about 2 to 3 weeks- with our mail on island here!
edit: what i really like about this bow- is that it weighs just under 15 oz- no string or finish yet - but its absolutely featherlight- i really like that.
i think i might build a #25 kids bow for my daughter off the form some day soon!
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Lady at the post office said 6 to 8 business days.
dgb
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ok mate- ill start the clock :D
a lot of the post people in the outside world, dont realize that we only get post twice a week here, and if the weather is bad- the ferry doesnt run- we can go without post and provisions for quite a while at times- which suites me- normally- but right now i am hoping she is correct :)
thanks heaps Dan :thumbsup:
will look after it- till you come and fetch it :D
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so its all finished up- just waiting for Dans chrono to arrive- then i will test it
(http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx309/mwnicol/finished%20strung_zpsxmbsan3j.jpg) (http://s766.photobucket.com/user/mwnicol/media/finished%20strung_zpsxmbsan3j.jpg.html)
i have learnt a lot from making this bow- which included a lot of very kind help from mark daniel.
1.the tip inserts were a challenge- but the fitting came out great in the end.
2.i really REALLY like "black limba" wood now- thanks wood carver- and i used the plainest pieces for this bow- as it was an experiment- but it is still beautiful wood- nice natural camo!
3.i might have used thinner phenolic in the nocks- might have been more refined
4. could also have used thinner phenolic in the static tip underlays- for weight reasons- but the heavier phenolic really allowed me to get a nice substantial belly string groove- which really helps with the string alignment at rest.
5. i dont like phenolic in the riser overlays- should have used wood, and two layers of it- not just the plain black phenolic
phenolic underlays
(http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx309/mwnicol/finished%20tip%20belly_zpspd4c7vnl.jpg) (http://s766.photobucket.com/user/mwnicol/media/finished%20tip%20belly_zpspd4c7vnl.jpg.html)
(http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx309/mwnicol/finished%20underlay_zpstmcmrsrn.jpg) (http://s766.photobucket.com/user/mwnicol/media/finished%20underlay_zpstmcmrsrn.jpg.html)
like i said, i really like black limba now- it looks kinda boring , until you glass it
(http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx309/mwnicol/finished%20belly_zps27ppdett.jpg) (http://s766.photobucket.com/user/mwnicol/media/finished%20belly_zps27ppdett.jpg.html)
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the nocks, black and tan phenolic with sitka blacktail deer antler
(http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx309/mwnicol/finished%20tip_zpsmc77ebu1.jpg) (http://s766.photobucket.com/user/mwnicol/media/finished%20tip_zpsmc77ebu1.jpg.html)
the single riser overlay??!! :dunno:
(http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx309/mwnicol/finished%20riser_zps16h0uoxl.jpg) (http://s766.photobucket.com/user/mwnicol/media/finished%20riser_zps16h0uoxl.jpg.html)
the black limba riser with the maple and ipe I beam
(http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx309/mwnicol/finished%20riser%20belly%20side_zpsjergcefy.jpg) (http://s766.photobucket.com/user/mwnicol/media/finished%20riser%20belly%20side_zpsjergcefy.jpg.html)
thanks guys for the patience- and will post as soon as i have chrono results.
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That is one cool bow, awesome!
-Jay
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That really came out nice! If that's the plain limba, I can't wait to see what the nice stuff is like. :thumbsup:
Dave.
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Turned out great - nice work.
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Fantastic bow, Wayne! That's some pretty wood and you did a beautiful job with it.
Put me down for one in the 40-45# range, please. :)
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That really came out nice!
I like how the phenolic came out in the underlays. The layered effect looks sweet.
Overall great work
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Looking good. :) Bue--.
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I guess it's ok...
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Looks great! Turned out real nice.
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Awesome Wayne :clapper:
I like the wood combo. :)
How far from center is the arrow shelf?
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I have been watching this from the start. Great build along. Super cool bow. Thanks for sharing with us Fujimo.
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Sweet bow Wayne, can't wait to see the chrono results.
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thanks all- much appreciated- its been quite a lengthy journey. mark- i built the i shelf a 1/4" shy of center
cheers all
many many thanks :bigsmyl:
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It was ok, I suppose.. :)
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Hey Roy
:rolleyes:
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:bigsmyl: :laughing:
I'm just messing wif Fuji-O...
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:clapper: :clapper:
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ok the chrono arrived- very nice little unit. many thanks Dan (http://yoursmiles.org/tsmile/rulez/t2011.gif) (http://yoursmiles.org/t-rulez.php)
got some kind of chrono results, and i say some kind- cos i cant get to full #70 draw :scared:
i think i am getting to about #60 maybe #65.
anyway with a mismatched 530gn arrow- 200.9 fps - thats 8.15gn per#
out of my 50# 64" kenny M, with the same arrow
170.7
171.8
170.4
so @ 530gn thats 10.6 gn per #
so how much of a difference would tip wedges and a powerlam help with the kenny m- just curious?
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You some kind of speed freak, boy? LOL
Make yourself a boo, yew, osage tri lam and you will be a happy boy.. :)
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:bigsmyl:
never been one for testing my bows- but was very interesting to see!!
i understand that the tip wedges and the power lam will help with my very long draw- so curious to see how it would effect the speed on the kenny m.
one day when i'm big i will try and tiller one of those tri-lam musheeens!! :notworthy: :notworthy:
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Well ifin ya need help making one of them tri-lam thing ah ma jigs, just ask. I've made a few of them now. They average 180 to 190 fps..... They would blow the finish right off a Kennym bow... :) :wavey:
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Very pretty looking curve! :thumbsup:
Good shootin to ya!
Steve
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Beautiful bow, looks like a real pleasure to use.
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Wow, 200 fps is smokin'!
You're almost there, too, Roy. Just a little tweakin'. :biglaugh:
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Originally posted by Roy from Pa:
Well ifin ya need help making one of them tri-lam thing ah ma jigs, just ask. I've made a few of them now. They average 180 to 190 fps..... They would blow the finish right off a Kennym bow... :) :wavey:
They will blow yer fingers off too sometimes? :laughing:
Wayne, the p/l & t/w will make 2-3 fps and a little better string angle best I can tell.
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Came out looking nice! Impressive numbers on the chrono too, nice job
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thanks kenny- i have a really long draw- and i dont notice your design stacking- but maybe it would just be an improvement- reason to build another :D
thanks guys :bigsmyl: -well i was talking to Mark Daniel the other day- and he feels that i could get even more speed from it- by reducing the tip weight more. lose the phenolic underlays- go to a lighter mass wood underlay - and radically trap the back, in the static areas only.
and that was the plan, if it had come out at about #50, as i had planned- but at the #70 draw weight, the tips were just starting to flex- so hence the phenolic, and the lack of trapping.
but the next one planned for a #50 will have those changes.
sure is fun to play around with the chronograph, but i have never been one to focus too much on the speed- but it is neat to see- i do like that my kenny m is shooting a solid 170+ with hunting weight arrows :thumbsup:
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Unstrung
(http://i1212.photobucket.com/albums/cc450/Benjaminklein/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_0084.jpg) (http://s1212.photobucket.com/user/Benjaminklein/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_0084.jpg.html)
Strung
(http://i1212.photobucket.com/albums/cc450/Benjaminklein/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_0085.jpg) (http://s1212.photobucket.com/user/Benjaminklein/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_0085.jpg.html)
About 14" of tip movement to brace, this bow is no joke.
70#@29" sounds about right. I measured 60# right at 26".
Anyway you can see the testing has already begun, shot the first few arrows through her today and it's definately got some cast!
Can't wait to do ALOT more shooting with this bow, and turkey season is right around the corner. Can't imagine a better bow to shoot from a hunting blind.
In case you haven't figured it out, Wayne decided what this overweight bow needed was someone who wasn't going to draw her so dang far! So without warning this baby arrived at my door with instruction to "shoot the crap out of it" and give some honest feedback. Couldn't be more stoked.
Hopefully more testing and pics to come.
Currently plotting how to determine the expected gains in speed with decreasing tip mass .... That is without actually having to figure out HOW to reduce tip mass ...
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Great bow! Mark's first prototype ended up here, cause it needed a longer draw to bring out its beastly side (which it did!) Easiest way to get thin tips is laminated 'boo, I think.
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(Quote from Pat B on the other forum)
It's in the bowyer's bible 1
On my bows I leave the tips thick(ending up with 1/2" or just under) but narrow them to 3/8" or less. Wood thickness is 8 times stronger than wood width so you can eliminate lots of physical weight by keeping them narrow but deep. Pat
My tip belly is 1/2" wide taper to 3/16" at the nock
My tip backs is 1/8"ish wide for most of the tip
My tip thickness is around 1/2". my tips are much longer than that Recurve from Fujimo
phenolic and fiber glass are heavyer than wood
so I use sitka spruce as much as possible
This tip is not completely finished, the last 2" will be tapered more.
(http://i1293.photobucket.com/albums/b593/osagemark/sixty%20four%20static%20recurve/100_0448_zps51652110.jpg) (http://s1293.photobucket.com/user/osagemark/media/sixty%20four%20static%20recurve/100_0448_zps51652110.jpg.html)
Not having string groves AT the nock you can make it narrow
My string loop is 2" long and there is a hint of a string groove half way between the nock and the bridge
(http://i1293.photobucket.com/albums/b593/osagemark/forsale/100_0504_zpsc284d8a1.jpg) (http://s1293.photobucket.com/user/osagemark/media/forsale/100_0504_zpsc284d8a1.jpg.html)
ALL OF THAT TOGETHER MAKES A DIFFERENCE
Because of my shoulder, My goal is to make a low poundage bow that is fast.
A 25# @ 28" bow shooting 170/180 FPS with 10 grains per pound.
I can hunt :)
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My need for speed has become an obsession.
I'am making a one piece now with more reflex than my others. Center shot makes it better too.
Just how fast is the fastest Traditional bow???????????????????????????
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Ben, i got a lot of info from Mark while i was building this bow, the main difference between what he did on his first bows and what i did was- he put his spruce on as overlays, and i put mine in the core- kinda like a tip wedge- on steroids :D i considered trapping the back of the tips very aggressively like Mark did, but my real concern was then i would be narrowing the back glass too much- and would lose structural integrity. where as with the overlays, the spruce could be trapped hard- and there would still be significant back glass remaining.
just my interpretation!
as i said, the phenolic could go a bit thinner if needed- that was the only phenolic i had- in hindsight- i should have put it through the thickness sander, and thinned it down a bit- but it does make for more material for the longitudinal string groove along the belly.
maybe the way to go is like mark did, the asian way- with a more positive nock tip, and no side nocks, and bigger loops on the string. i wonder what that would do to the performance- because one would have a slightly lower brace height for the same braced profile- with the string sitting down the statics a little ways
my fear with the tips getting too narrow was twisting and stability- i only used plain ul glass- no bi-axial or even uls. just what i had.
cheers
wayne
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is your draw more like 26" , if so you could trap the entire bow to drop a smidge of weight if you needed too.
or you could just cut it lengthwise down the center- make two kids bows, and send one to Roy :laughing: :laughing:
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:biglaugh: :biglaugh: :biglaugh: :biglaugh: :biglaugh:
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I see I need to make a road trip with a can of whoop A$$... :)
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(http://yoursmiles.org/tsmile/fear/t3609.gif) (http://yoursmiles.org/t-fear.php)
:campfire:
watch out bob, yer in the poo now- fer laughing!
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you get up here ol fella, an we will go an catch some real fish- none of that puddling yunz do. :)
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WOW!
Guess I missed this one.
Very cool looking bow....those shorties do have a scary bend to em..sheesh..lol
Really like the woods too.
:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: