Hi,
I am considering building a recurve bow and I wondered if anyone has used the products offered by Bingham Projects. It looks like they have a lot of kits, instuctions, etc that could make a first-time build a bit easier, but I would like to know if they actually are useful.
Thanks
Binghams is very good for the beginning bowyer. I would also get ahold of Kenny McKenzie. He is really helpful and has very good laminations etc. He is a sponsor here. Bob
The first glass bow I built was with the help of the Beginner's Recurve kit from Bingham's. The blue prints and written/dvd instructions made it easy to be successful my first time out. If your brand new to bow building, I'd highly suggest going the route of their kit.
You can acquire all the info you need without a kit and can make/get all the materials from other sources, however if you want to get straight to the building start with their kit. Nothing teaches better than experience.
You'll undoubtedly expand from there assuming the bow building bug is as contagious for you as it was for me.
RW
Thanks for the feedback!
About 30 yrs ago Bingham Projects offered bow kits in a 90% finished state - which was great. All one had to do with the final sanding and finishing work and then polyurethane the bows! I made 2 of them and they were some of the strongest, fastest high quality bows around. Since then they stopped offering bows in that type of kit form, which was very disappointing to many of us who didn't want to get into building heat boxes, laminating out own bows, etc. But I know from my prior experience their products are excellent quality and such!
Great products and service. Just finished my first td recurve, a Bingham Kit, on 11/01/2011, and took my first trad whitetail doe with it on 11/11/2011. Full size blueprints, instruction booklet, and dvd. Great for the beginner. When I had questions I called, and Mr. Bingham himself took care of my questions.
(http://i777.photobucket.com/albums/yy51/blueeaglebum/2011-11-11_17-41-25_243.jpg)
Sweet! Nice job on the bow and the deer. You guys are getting me excited to get into this.
I've been thinking about this same exact thing for awhile now. I think I'm ready to make the leap from 1 pc. all wood bows, or bamboo backed bows and try one with glass over the limbs.
Binghams seems like the perfect place to start, then when I get my feet wet with the first one I'll have a better understanding of what materials I need to get for the next one. There's no doubt that I can build a bow from a kit, the part that throws me is how to choose the right thickness lams in order to hit my target wt. at the desired length of bow I intend to build.........that's the confusing part of it all.
Semo,
There is a poundage chart in Bingham's catalog, and if you want to build a different length than is listed call Elmont and ask. After you build a couple bows, calculating stack height is pretty easy.
Binghams is a good place to start and how I and a lot of others started. If you buy their kits and follow their plans, you will be within a couple pounds of your desired weight. Now when you start venturing into your own designs, it really is some trial and error figuring out the right stack thickness. (I just glued up a new design for me this weekend and it turned out about 10 lb light.) If you do end up heavy, you can drop weight by thinning the width of the limbs a bit. But if your under weight, well....finish the bow and give it to someone who needs a lighter bow. Take notes on every bow you make - they come in handy on future bows.
Binghams is where many many bowyers start. I've always been happy with goods and services they offer.
However, if you want a more personal place to do business, contact kennym here on trad gang. He has bows plans, lams,glass, riser blocks and smooth-on plus he will take the time to make sure your bow comes out just where you want it. I haven't ordered a whole lot from him, but I consider him a friend to do business with, not just an account. jmo. Mike
I cant find KennyM, what is he listed under?
kennyscustomarchery.com
i think that's the site. excellent product and service!
binghams is excellent too and has a wide variety of products and plans. they also offer instructional video's which i found very helpful. can't go wrong either way
I have made several one piece 60" bows basically from Bingham's plans and they shoot well and are quiet and fast.
I made my one and only glass bow with Binghams. It was a straight limb longbow. Broke before I got it strung. It was totally my fault. Binghams was very helpful with info if I needed it and had everything I needed to do the job...except the tallent. I can build selfbows all day long but I'm personally not geared for making glass bows.
I think I will get a kit and have a good project for the Christmas break. It's getting cold outside anyway (15 degrees this morning), so I can head to the basement shop.
Does Kenny by any chance offer bow kits already laminated and 90% of the shaping already done?
I am looking to do a bow but don't want to have to go thru building a bow press and heat box, etc as I don't really have access to a good working wood shop and tools...
scoobie doo,
i don't know if kenny offers that option. if he did though i'm sure it would be first rate.
if thats what you're looking for try 7 lakes longbows. they have great bow blanks that are all ready to go and just need final shaping and sanding.
good luck, mike
Well, I got my Bingham kit, studied the plans, and started to build the press. This is going to be fun.
Binghams has great kits to get your forms built and all the hardware you need to start but when it comes to laminates and getting your bow woods go to Kenny he gets you top quality wood laminates and usually cheaper than anyone else. I have used kenny for at least 2 years now
@StoneAK: thanks for that info. I checked out his web site. I will keep that in mind for future bows. I just hope that I can pull off this first one and learn enough to be comfortable doing more.
:smileystooges: oops!!! I'm havin' troubles here postin' pics. :archer2:
I have been working on the press. It's for a 60" recureve, alternate riser pattern.
(http://i841.photobucket.com/albums/zz335/wookiewebster/Archery/Recurve1/IMAG0074-1.jpg)
I saw the pic of your form before it was removed. I would add more screws to it, I like to have a lot of screws in my forms since the Tightbond II I used to glue the plywood together breaks loose above 150 degrees..so i really put plenty of drywall screws in each side of form. which Binghams design is the form for? I built a 58" one piece form.
Word of advice having gone down the exact road you're on with a 60 inch recurve kit Binghams. Make sure you do a full on dry run. I followed the kit's dimensions to the letter and when it was all said and done I couldn't get the upper form locked in once the material for the bow was in place. I did do a dry run, but neglected to lay the hose in and but the upper form in place, so I ended up with an epoxy nightmare and on the fly drilling, reworking of the form. The bow actually turned out, shoots well, and the lesson learned was invaluable. All things being equal, I would have preferred to just do it right the first time though :)
@RW - thanks for that good info. I was actually just thinking the same thing while I was testing the hose on Sat. I put it in place and pressurized it, and noticed that the spacing seems too narrow near the metal bars. I still need to cut out and shape the riser, but I will FOR SURE do a dry run before the final glue-up.
wookiewebster-
If you don't mind, could you tell me what tools you need? I've been wanting to buy a Bingham Kit for awhile now but I don't have any saws, sanders, or rasp. It would just be nice to know what tools I should buy before I buy a kit. Good luck and I'll keep my eye on this thread! HAVE FUN! :campfire:
QuoteOriginally posted by snakebit40:
wookiewebster-
If you don't mind, could you tell me what tools you need? I've been wanting to buy a Bingham Kit for awhile now but I don't have any saws, sanders, or rasp. It would just be nice to know what tools I should buy before I buy a kit.
OK, I will tell you that although I have some experience from doing some framing, finish work, A/V cabinets, and speaker enclosures, I don't consider myself an expert in woodworking. So, this is just my opinion as a DIY-er.
I think there are several ways that things can be done, tool-wise. In Bingham's build video, the bow-builders use a bandsaw and a drill-press mounted sanding drum a lot. They rough-cut the shape with the bandsaw, then use the sanding drum to fine tune the edge right up to the pattern lines and square it up. I think a good jigsaw would also work for cutting. Also, an Oscillating Spindle Sander works for the sanding. Another option for finishing and squaring the edge would be to use a router and a Flush/Trim Pattern Router Bit. MLCS woodworking had a few of those. You just need to get a bit that covers the full 2" edge, and transfer the patterns to some paneling.
Also, 4x8 sheets have to be cut into sections and glued together. So, a table saw or circular saw and clamps are useful.
So far, I have used a table-saw, bandsaw, spindle sander, and drill to make the press. It looks like more bandsaw, rasping, and sanding ahead. I would like to know if anyone uses any dremel attachments for these builds.
Thanks wookiewebster! I want to build my own bow ssssoooo bad. Keep us posted on your progress!
I use a dremel to cut my initial string nocks in (tile bit I believe). I stop way short of finished and then file and sand. A steady hand is required but it sure is fast.
An update: I spent some time over the holiday break working on this project. There are some time-consuming steps. I am learning a lot. I decided that I will put all my pictures and a write-up of this build experience in a blog. I will post the link later in case anyone is curious.
Here is my first string-up test after intial shaping of the limbs. It looks funny as just a block with limbs. The pull weight is way beyond 70lbs.
(http://i841.photobucket.com/albums/zz335/wookiewebster/Archery/Recurve1/IMAG0109-1.jpg)
..and here is my progress after a lot of riser shaping:
(http://i841.photobucket.com/albums/zz335/wookiewebster/Archery/Recurve1/IMAG0116-1.jpg)
(http://i841.photobucket.com/albums/zz335/wookiewebster/Archery/Recurve1/IMAG0117-1.jpg)
..and here is where I am currently. I am still slowly lowering the weight, which was way too high, and tweaking for any limb twist. It takes more time and effort than I thought it would. I am going slowly since I don't want my first bow to totally suck, but I can already tell that I will do better on #2.
(http://i841.photobucket.com/albums/zz335/wookiewebster/Archery/Recurve1/IMAG0119-1.jpg)
:campfire:
Looking good, was that riser material bought from Bingham? Bue--.
QuoteOriginally posted by Buemaker:
Looking good, was that riser material bought from Bingham? Bue--.
Yes, this was part of my starter "kit". It is called New Desert Camo and they call it their Coreflex/Superaction riser material
Looking Great!Keep us posted!
Looking very nice. It does take a while, however, it is well worth the time and effort in the end. Keep it going!!!
Up for the Bingham question, and I want to see your progress wookiewebster :readit: Can't wait to see more!
Looks really good. I love the look of that riser.
Howdy y'all!
Well, I finally stopped sanding and got some finishing done on my first bow build. Here are some pictures of the final product.
I know it isn't perfect, and I can do better on the next one, based on what I learned this time. I will put some of my conclusions at the bottom.
Stats: 60" long recurve, 50# @ 28" draw (my draw is 30")
I am calling this bow "The Moab", because the riser pattern is called Desert Camo and I tried to shape it to resemble the wind-swept formations of Southern Utah.
(http://i841.photobucket.com/albums/zz335/wookiewebster/Archery/Recurve1/IMAG0133-1.jpg)
(http://i841.photobucket.com/albums/zz335/wookiewebster/Archery/Recurve1/IMAG0135-1.jpg)
(http://i841.photobucket.com/albums/zz335/wookiewebster/Archery/Recurve1/IMAG0132-1.jpg)
(http://i841.photobucket.com/albums/zz335/wookiewebster/Archery/Recurve1/IMAG0131-1.jpg)
(http://i841.photobucket.com/albums/zz335/wookiewebster/Archery/Recurve1/IMAG0130-1.jpg)
(http://i841.photobucket.com/albums/zz335/wookiewebster/Archery/Recurve1/IMAG0141-1.jpg)
A few conclusions and opinions about this kit and build process:
- 1st time builders should order a lighter weight kit. I am 6'4", 250 lbs, and have a 30" draw, so I am not afraid of a heavy pull. So, I ordered a 50# kit, thinking that if I had to sand more than normal, etc. and if it reduced the pull to the 40# range, I would still be good. Instead, the bow came out of the press at well over 70# and I spent way too much time figuring out how to reduce it to the 50# range. The Bingham instructions state specifically NOT to remove wood from sides of the limbs to reduce weight, but after hours of sanding on the glass (carefully counting, etc), the draw weight just would not drop enough. Eventually, fearing that I would remove too much glass and ruin the bow, I finally had to resort to sliming the limbs just to get the limbs down to a manageable weight. If I did it again, I would order a 35#-40# kit for my first build. :banghead:
- Maybe go with the thinner limb profile. I like the looks of the wide-limbs bows, so I ordered a 2" kit. With wider limbs, any mistake is amplified as limb twist or other tiller issues. I think that going with the thinner limb would make the build go easier for the first try.
- Might want to stick with the basic riser shape. I like the looks of what Bingham calls the 'alternate' riser design. So I ordered both design patterns with my kit and intended to build the alternate design. I did build it and I still like the way it looks, but I think that the basic design, where the glass goes tip-to-tip across the back of the bow, is simpler and requires less time to complete. Luckily, you can use the same press for both shapes, which is very convenient. I think I will build the regular shaped bow next.
- Tools. The oscillating spindle sander that I bought for this project was money well spent. I used it a lot and it was invaluable in some steps. It made shaping and precision sanding much easier than if I had to do it some other way, especially when working with thin sections like the fade-outs. Still, there is no getting around the need for good old-fashioned hand tools like rasps, files, and sand paper. The bandsaw was also used a lot for cutting out parts for the bow vise, patterns, and riser shapes.
- Finish. I know that some people who work with wood just love the super shiny high-gloss type finish. I see it on fancy wood gun stocks and other nice wood items. To try out a couple products, I used Minwax Wipe-On Poly finish on a bow I am refinishing (Bear Bearcat) and I used Birchwood Casey Tru-Oil on this project. Both produced a very glossy finish, as the pictures show. However, I think that I like more of a satin finish when I compare this with some other bows and gun stocks that I have. The high-gloss shows every single finger print that has touched the bow and reflects light right into my eyes at certain angles. I need to try another bow with some other finishes, but I don't think I will do high-gloss again. If I were to hunt with this bow, I would certainly switch to something less shiny. The high-gloss is nice for a wall-hanger, show-off bow perhaps.
- Precision. I need to be more precise next time. Things like perfect center marks on the limbs and perfect alignment of the string notches on the tips are far more important than I realized. All those little things add up to prevent issues like limb twist, which takes time to deal with. Also, the upper surface of the lower bow form is critical, and has to be done right. If it is not flat and square, the bow will come out with issues, especially with the wider limbs.
- Bow Oven. I think I will re-do the EZ-Bake bow oven's design. Having the bulbs in the lid is a weakness because when the lid is moved at all there is always worry that bumping it too hard will break the filament in these pricey 200 watt bulbs. I think I will move the bulbs to a bottom-mount, on boards. This will let the heat rise naturally, creating more even heating, and I can open the lid without being so slow and careful. I also had to throw a couple blankets over the oven to get the heat high enough. I see people have made ovens out of foam that I think would also hold heat better.
From here, I think I will for sure try another bow, to improve my skills. Also, I wonder what it would take to build a longer recurve bow, say 64"? Would I just extend the riser by 2" top and bottom, or do I extend the limb length, or both? If anyone has a pattern for a longer bow, I would like to look at it.
I put a lot more pictures on a blog here: Recurve build #1 (http://wookieswords.blogspot.com/2011/12/first-recurve-bow-build.html)
-Wookie
Way to go!
nice looking bow, good work.
Very nice bow! Wild riser.
You did a great job, now you got me wanting a kit all over again and just after I finally manged to put the idea out of my head.
I can give you a little tip on the Tru oil if you like. Use 0000 steel wool to buff down the shine to a suitable level, then to remove the ultra tiny marks left by the steel wool use a good furniture polish and a soft rag. It will still look like a professional finish without the super glossy shine. I've done this on several gun stocks and a couple bows and the results are amazing.
Don't worry if you buff it down too much cause you can always go back over it with another coat or two, then rebuff it back down to where you want it.
Thanks for the comments, all.
FYI. I am in the middle of another bow, different style, same bow press. I will post some pictures when it gets done. I am putting a lot of pictures on my blog (http://www.blogger.com/blogger.g?blogID=3280306276103492024#editor/target=post;postID=718848580532158252) , if you want a sneak-peek. I am doing a lot better on the second one, so far.
Very nice looking bow! Thanks for sharing the tips! Building a glass bow is on my list of things to do.
I have also used Bingham for my first bows. As a new bowyer, I had alot of question. Elmont and his crew never hesitated once to give up the info. I had Elmont on the phone for 45 min. once, he never tried to push me off the line. I still use his forms for r/d bows, but now in the process working with Kenny buying his r/d prints. Being that I don't know any bowyers, I get all my info from you guys. Haven't been let down yet.