More so than many recent years, Michigan's winter has been absolutely brutal this year. Snow, rain, freezing rain, sub-zero temps/wind chills, high winds- repeat! Such has been our weather for the past couple of months. Due to this repeating cycle of snow and freezing rain, what was formerly cut-over cash crop fields is now nothing but a series if giant ice rinks making it impossible for the local deer to get to the remaining spillage from the '07 harvest.
For the first time in many years, I am actually considering putting out some cracked corn every couple of days to assist the local deer herd in making it through the next few weeks. 50# bags of cracked corn are selling for about $6. So for roughly $100, I figure I can feed each of about 25 deer (the local herd), about a pound of cracked-corn a day for the next month. Again, under normal circumstances I would not consider engaging in a supplemental feeding program. But even by Michigan standards, this has been an unusually harsh winter.
Would you feed 'em???
Deer are generally more than capable of taking care of themselves. Natures "survival of the fittest" so to speak. But I feed deer myself when the mood strikes and have no problem doing it.
If you want to, do it. It sure isn't going to hurt anything.
With a little luck, you might even find a shed or two in the corn pile.
I would only feed the deer special deer feed from purina or antler king use the winter suppliments, I would also do this in a few different off the ground feeders. If the feed is on the ground you have a higher rate a disease transmition due to urine and droppings on the feed. In reference to the corn I would only use whole kernal corn that is labeled deer corn it has been washed and super dried to stop the growth of bacteria in the wharehouse, also corn is only a filler and holds no nutritional value other than a great form of carbs wich is good in the cold weather because alot is burned to stay warm and digest natural foods during extreme cold so a mixture would be a good idea. I know this is a more expensive way to go but it is what should be done if you do not want to hurt your deer and benifit them.
As above...deer sometimes cannot just change feed and it can actually harm them. Do some research on what you feed them.
I am actually a bit worried about our deer and turkey herds. We have broken our snowfall records already and still have a bunch of winter left, it has been cold, deep snow and ice over the ground, keeping pawing for ground food at a minimum.
Nature will have its way.
ChuckC
It is illegal to do so here. Lt's of factors play into subsidizing the deer with a human food source.
Feeding congregates deer, which in turn can increase disease transmission. It's a political hot potato in this state and illegal in about half of it, the southern half in which we now have CWD and which has been impacted most severely by the weather this year. Personally, I'm averse to anything that further domesticates a wild animal.
I saw 30 deer last night in a field that I never see deer in. They are searching and scratching. We have fed dried corn all year and continue to replenish when we can get to our feeder.
Another alterative that would not help this year, but for the future. Try to plant winter food plots such as Imperial winter green and a good smmuer through winter choice is Mossy Oak Biomaxx we have roughly 15 to 20 acres in different locations on my dad and uncles property we have also selective cut the entire 400 acres with the help of a friend of mine who is a biologist from Ohio this winter we had as many as 15 to 30 bucks in 1 evening out even in the cold and snow. So there are alternatives to suppliment feeding if you want to put the sweat and blood into it, in the long run it will pay dividens for your deer and property. Also try to kill every coyote in the world like we have that also helps.
The major limiting factor in the nortern tier is the carrying capacity of the habitat during the harshest conditions of winter. During the mild winter with ample feed the deer herds will flourish with large fawn crops in the spring. A deers NATURAL feed in the winter is woody browse with grass and whatever they can scratch up. When the population has been high with mild winters they still eat the woody browse along with the crop residue that can be found. In my area the high numbers have started to decimate the natural browse and the deer suffer in a winter like this because they can't find enough of natural food OR crop residue. I will feed the turkeys, but won't go out of the way to feed the deer. Nature seems to be the only control of over population. chickenman
Thoughts on corn....A buddy of mine told me once he always checks to see what deer have been feeding on when he field dress's an animal. Our deer here have lots of natural food, mast crops and such. But they eat lots of crops also. He said he has never seen a deer that didn't have corn in their stomachs or digestive tracts. I've since been checking myself and I've found the same things to be true. Even when they are exposed to food plots, soybeans, whatever.
Not a good idea unless ya know for sure a die-off is gonna happen due to starvation. Why risk spreading disease, which may end up killing more deer. It is illegal in NY. Shawn
Its bad,, I live on the edge of town and My neighbors have alway had a few corn cobs stuck to the tree for the squirels and such,,a few nice bird feeders for all of our winter birds,, Its really cool to look out and see so much going on all day long,, but,,, the deer have moved in,, they eat out of the bird feeders, pick all of the corn off of the tree, and will do this in plain daylight,, up to 12 of them at a time. It's nice to see but they are struggling around my part of the woods. We have way more snow fall than normal, and with all of the freezing rain and ice its locked alot of their food up. I noticed the neighbors put three small spots out to keep the fighting down between the deer and they come in every evening and about three hours before the evening and I'm not here during the day but I bet ya they are out there at first light and many times at 4:00 am when I leave for work,,I'd say put it out but not on the ground,,follow our batting rules and add a bail of clover cut from this past summer to help digestion. Just my 2 cents,,J
Feeding concentrates deer and they have found excessive grazing in the areas where feeding is occuring. I know its hard to accept, but dieoffs like this actually help the herd in the long run. Expect very few fawns and old bucks to survive and plan accordingly.
If you are in touch with your area, and know there is adequate browse, and good thermal cover, then I wouldn`t worry too much just yet. If they have poor browsing and less than good cover, it might not be a bad idea to get as close to bedding areas and scatter some corn out.
The deer are adapted to survive most conditions as long as they have some browse and cover.
Hopefully the weather will moderate when it is supposed to. A winter that hangs on is what is tough on deer, because the increased dalyight increases their metabolism, and their energy needs increase.
Overbrowsed cover, and a late spring are a deers` worst enemy.
a lot of us feed corn after the season in missouri. we use those plastic 55 gallon drums cut in half on a makeshift stand.
the deer get some, the turkeys get some, the birds get some.....i'm sure most anything that walks by gets some.
Over the course of a 3 month period (at the most), i doubt there will be a disease issue. We haven't had a disease through our part of the country in a long time.
i quit feeding in early-mid march. some side benefits are that you typically get a shed or two by the feeders. some guys put chicken wire up that will knock off an antler if it is ready to come off.
just my 2 cents but I wouldn't worry too much about it. i'm sure if we didn't feed, the deer would be just fine as well!
Labs4me,
This may be a stupid suggestion because I have no idea if you have access to it, but down here in Texas we feed cottonseed to our livestock during the winter. It's cheap but is an excellent feed. High in protein and fat. And I even use it on my deer stands because deer love it...way more than corn. Corn is nothing more than a fat source and will suffice in getting the deer by but cottonseed is way better for them. Down here in Texas we can get it for roughly $.09/lb. So do the math...you could buy a truck load for pretty cheap. One truck load would be all you need.
Brett
Monty, Corn is not a good alternative to natural browse at this point in the witner. Deer will change their metabolism in the winter to adjust to the browse as opposed to grains they were eating in the summer and fall. A high energy food like corn fed to a deer who has not had corn or other high energy foods for two months, can KILL THEM. If you know these deer have not been without corn, then it is feasible to supplement them with it. I would'nt do it in your part of the state. I expect they have adequate browse and fat reserves for one more month. If you were to give them corn now after the metabolic change, you will see severe diarhea from the deer splattered out on the snow and possibly even see sick deer lying around. Their guts just cant take that kind of change at this point in the winter. You can actually do more harm than good.
Wildlife and habitat management is my buisiness, I hear this question a lot. Be careful with this, and as has already been said, Deer do quite well on their own.
Deer are a ruminentary organisms and rely on 3 sets of bacteria to help digest their foods. In the spring, the bacteria is designed for breaking down young shoots and new growth that is high in glucose. In the summer and fall the bacteria changes to help digest food with more complex carbs like the corn, acorns, and apples. In the winter the bacteria changes once more to help extract nutrients from nutrient poor foods like bark.
To this end it is not beneficial in the big picture, to feed the deer. It causes a switch in their bacteria populations that help them survive back to a summer/fall populations. A pound of corn a day is not enough to feed a deer. When the supplemental feeding gets cost prohibitive the deer with have problems converting back to natural browse and begin starving.
I used to do this until I did more reading and truly learned their biology. It was cool to see them in the backyard, but I was doing more harm then good. The natural selection process will make the herd stronger over time.
Glenn
It takes a deer awhile for there stomachs to fully turn to browse and get the proper nutrtion at the begining of the the fall. You would have to started feeding the deer before they got into trouble. It will take their stomachs awhile to switch from browse to corn and get nutrition from it. These deer will eat and gorge themselves on the corn. They will not eat their browse because there stomachs will be full. But, they will be getting no nutrition from the corn at first. If the deer are really in as bad of shape as you say they are, then they will actually start to die even with full bellies of corn .It's best to find natural browse , cut it and spread it around at this point. If you decide to feed next year, start early and continue straight through the winter. But starting now, with a deer herd in so much trouble could be disasterous. Good luck, I hope your deer herd pulls through.
Whatever you choose too feed make sure you make small pile's away from each other,so the deer dont fight over the food...
I can't add to (or emphasize enough) what Sticks only and Dimeit have said.
If you're feeding them lots of corn, their digestive systems will adapt to it and they won't be able to process natural winter browse. You can't possibly feed them enough corn throughout the winter to survive, so they will die.
We have had a feeder across our pond for at least five years. It spreads out cracked corn twice a day. Here is what I have observed. Deer come to it almost everyday. As the winter lengthens the total number of deer seems to increase. When they come to the feeder they often stay only for 15 or 20 minutes and almost always browse on natural vegetation around the feeder as much as they eat the corn at the feeder. One thing for sure is that they do not use our supplemental feeding as a primary food source....they just do not spend enough time to clean up everything on the ground. Occasionally the deer will come in from two or more family groups at one tiem when the weather is really bad and that is when they seem to get competitive and push each other around. But that happens only several times during the entire winter and only when the weather is just plain awful. Each year out F&G dept. sends out emails to dissuade people from feeding the deer along with a long list of reasons not to do it. So far Laura and I have seen no adverse affects of our "program". I am also sure if we did not feed them that they would be quite alright on their own because, as I said, from what we see our feeder seems to be a pit stop for them as they browse thru the area.
You would better off to find a Cedar tree and drop it with an axe or gather up some limbs and bring them to the area want feed. That's their winter food anyway.
i've been feeding the deer in my area since december. move the feed bag every few days, about 50 yards. there is about 2 to 3 feet of snow around and in the last month they have stopped coming. the temp have averaged-30 c without the windchill. they are tough to withstand this climate.
Just because you see no adverse effects, Bill, doesn't mean their aren't any. It's natural to want to feed critters during a bad winter....but it may be the worse thing we can do. It does make them congregate during deep snows and that can be much worse than no feeding at all.
Much good information has already been given above.
Killinstuff makes a good point. Though in your part of the state Monty, you would be best served to find aspen, birch or maple, cedars are hard to find in your area. Clear cutting a small area, maybe 5-10 trees, will provide excellent browse while allowing regeneration in the spring. If you have small stands of aspen (popple as they are sometimes called, clearcutting them is a fantastic option. If you have multiple groups like this, I would suggest doing a cutting of 10 or so trees spread out over the winter each year. This will provide regenerating browse and feed the deer in the winter off the buds of the trees you drop. This also makes some fantastic rabbit cover.
The very best way to help Deer out as far as feeding goes is, if you have any Acorn trees in your Hunting area, get some 10-6-4 fertilizer, maybe a 100# bag a year, drill a series of holes into the ground all around the drip area of the tree canopy. By doing it this way you will be benifiting the Acron trees and the Deer and all the other creatures in the woods. It is LEGAL in all States because you are not actually baiting. You are simply helping the trees to produce more acorns which in turn will increas the yearly mast on the ground. Also any woody plants nearby also benfit from this program.
If you have a Hunting partner or a Hunting group you can all work togewther and share the expense of the fertilizer, even make it a Family thing where the whole family gets envolved, can't think of a better way to spend a sunny spring day....ONE SHOT... :) :) :) :D :D :D
Illegal here in IL also. The logic is that when you start feeding deer like they were cattle or something, things like CWD become more prevalent, due to high interaction among the animals. Now, how they explain a whole bunch of healthy deer eating alfalfa in the same field together, all the time, is beyond me.
My two cents... Let Mother Nature Handle it. The Strong will Survive.
Ill just suggest, if you start, dont stop till more brows grows. Deer are rudmen and once they get the bacteria built up in there gut to ferment corn, they will need it to help them make it through the rest of the year. If you start then stop, it can mess up their stomach and cause problems.
I feed 1500# of soybeans every winter as part of my QDM. It works great. The beans have a much higher percentage of protein than corn and the deer do much better on it. It took a little while to get them switched over from corn as deer are not used to eating beans out of the pod (thats' my guess?) but I'm seeing above average birth weights and larger yearlings and a more healthy hurd overall. When I started managing my farm, I had a deer management expert come stay on my place and evaluate my deer hurd. He is the one who clued me in on the Soybeans. I use them from broadcast feeders and station them between my food plots and bedding areas so the deer don't have to travel too far during harsh weather. Just my 2 cents. DAVE
Can I come over Big'n? :bigsmyl:
You'd could buy 10 tons of cottonseed for less than $2000 and would be just as good as soybeans. It's good stuff!
The other thing with Michigan is with the millions of pounds of bait those deer ate in October, November and December, they were like a plump Christmas goose when things started to get a little cold.
WOW!! I have learned alot from this post,, With almost no thought I would drop corn too,, but learning about there stomachs and what they go through during the winter it makes sense to drop some tree tops,, Thanks for all the great post fellas,,J and I'm still watching this one,,
I'll second what Bill Carlson stated. I feed the critters year round. Every morning and every evening I throw out a 2 gallon bucket of whole corn, sunflowers, and 10% sweet feed. I don't possibly throw out enough to entirely feed the 15 or 20 deer that make it through each day. This is a big woods area and no crops anywhere for many miles. They are eating natural browse for the main part of their diet and coming up to my place to get a snack. I've seen no adverse effects in the 12 years I've been doing so.
Maybe I should post a disclaimer at the bottom like a Jenny Craig commercial.
"Results not typical".
Steertalker, what percentage of protein do you get from cottonseed? I've never even heard of it. You got me thinkin though.DAVE
Those of you that are contentious of the feeding of corn must also look at the programs you are installing. Since most of you say you are feeding them corn everyday and have had no ill effects for all these years are fine. What you are doing is not the same as suddenly making a huge change in diet. Since you have been feeding them all winter, their ability to use the corn is still there. When you make a huge change, and start feeding corn to an animal that is converted to browse is where the problems will start. Stopping a corn feeding program mid-winter in an area with adequate browse will show minimal problems. While starting one in the middle of winter is asking for above stated problems.
anyone just put out a round bale of hay and see what happens ??? corn for fat, soy for protien...you can mix the two and grind them good. Put them in an above the ground feeder.
thats jmo
G
Labs4me
I am interested in your decision after all this info?
Absolutely great thread. I have learned a lot. I have never hunted north of the mason-dixon much, but for the two years that I bowhunted PA I was absolutely amazed by what I saw in apple orchards. When the apples came in to season, the deer would absolutely gorge themselves on the things. The sign looked like cattle had been in there. I have never seen so many deer droppings in my life and most of it was loose.
Their systems couldn't handle the overload, but they liked the apples too much to quit. I imagine that is the same thing that happens with corn that is suddenly introduced to their diet. If it happens in the winter under stressful circumstances, the impact could be quite devastating.
Geno, pasture hay, the stuff most people would feed to horses is another food deer have problems with. Alfalfa, clover, treefoils in hay is good deer feed but most fields have a very small % of that.
Good thread guys! I feed approx. 7000# +/- of soybeans right in the pod,in 6 or 8 food plots,thats after they eat em all summer! Looked yesterday and they are bout cleaned out. Come on spring!
CJ,, or John,, would it be ok to feed them clover bails right now? if I'm not mistaken (and I could be) I beleive you can buy clover bails, I baught some years ago when I picking up some bait for a late season hunt and the guy there said they needed it to help their digestion,,J
If you can get them to eat a bale of hay would initially show what kind of shape they are in. It seems deer in good physical shape (not on the verge of starvation) will not eat baled hay here in this part of Michigan. They use to use it quite extensively in supplemental feeding programs up north. Again, good points have been made in staying with a pasture mix of hay and not something too hot like pure alfalfa or clover. So, the moral of this story is if you put out hay bales and the deer wont use, they are in no danger whatsoever. Though there were a number cases in the past when sportsmans club in the UP where getting worried about the deer in the yards. They started seeing starving deer. They went and bought a semi load of pasture hay. Gave it to the deer and they ate it. Their confusion came when the deer continued to die. The necropsies showed these deer to be dead with bellies full of hay. Two theories on what occoured. 1) These deer where too far gone to save. 2) Their conversion was too long intact to use the hay. Most of the time when deer are starting to starve here in Michigan you will see the size of the browse ingested increasing. Instead of just eating buds and tips of shoots and limbs. You will start to notice these browse limbs to be as large as you finger. That is the sure sign of deer in trouble. Fat reserves in the area where Labs4me lives are more than adequate to carry these deer through the winter. Very minimal if any natural die off in that area.
Soybeans!!!!
For those of you that do food plots. This is really the magic bean. The afformentioned posts regarding them are right on. I do recomend you plant at least three acres here in Michigan to have any sustainability of the beans. Deer will eat the plants all summer while growing at the times when the bucks need protein the most. The plants themselves while green produce protein levels of 25-35% depending on the variety. Hard beans will produce 30-40% protein. Opposed to natural bowse with a level of less than 12%. 16% protein will allow a buck to grow the best possible set of antlers he can, given age class and genetics. Sending the deer into spring with high fat reserves and extra protein to use on antlers and give unborn fawns the upper hand fromthe start. In my seminars I tell people Corn is like Ice cream to deer, they love it. But, you dont feed your kids ice cream every day just because they like it. Corn is high in carbohydrates and good energy for them, along with increasing fat reserves. Nutritionally it is minimal. Anyone who hunts the midwest corn belt konws the place to find the deer in the fall is around the corn fields. Corn has its advantages but, as we have pointed out in certain circumstances it can be detrimental.
my 50 acres has over 400 acres of corn around it and 60 of soybeans. The 50 acres I am on has apple, cherry, hawthorn, oak and hickory trees on it. The few herds that hangout here have more food than they can eat. When I field dress a deer I always hold my nose and cut open the stomach to see what they are eating. Everytime it is just packed with corn. I have watched them pass up apples from my McCoun tree (very sweet apples) and go for corn. Out here they plant two rows of sweet corn arround their animal grade corn.