These are the first dozen I have purchased. I love the weight and feel of these so far. I am shooting these out of a 55#@28" Blacktail RH recurve D97 string. I started with bareshafting these at 31" with 150gr. tips. They flew 1"-2" right or weak at 20yds. Can I fletch these at this point? Will that stiffen them enough to pull them into the bullseye? Or should I take another 1/4 off to pull it in a bit more?
I am thinking about fletching 6 for this tip weight and then bareshafting the other 6 with 50gr. inserts and 150gr tips. Thinking of getting the length down a bit. Most all the arrows I shoot at 29.5"-29". Just seems like a long arrow at 31". But it sure shoots well.
Shortening the shaft or decreasing the point weight will stiffen the shaft. I always tune my arrows so the bare shafts fly perfect.
Snag,I shoot 55#@32"and my 250s bareshafted perfect with 250 grs. up front. Of course my arrows are full length. So you oughta be real close. I believe that I would try to get it a little closer. You might be able to get rid of another 1/4 to 1/2. God Bless. DAVE
Big'n:
Just curious, you shooting a recurve, D-shaped Long Bow, or R/D Long Bow? I've been throwing Heritage 250's w/ 225 up front on 56#@32".
BobW
snag,
I am no expert by no means, but I do know this.... Carbon responds to length adjustments faster than adding or subtracting weight. Especially when you start getting them shorter than 29". They can get stiff quick once you are under 29". If you fool around and get them too stiff it is almost impossible to soften the spine by adding weight. You can, but you usually have to add another 100-150 grains and by that time you may have an arrow that is too heavy. JMHO.
nocams
I think maybe i would fletch 6 of them up and shoot 3 w/broadheads & 3 w/field tips. Fine tune from there.
Ya want them t obareshaft a tad weak, so if ya like a long shaft that is fine, if ya want that 29.5" shaft I would do like above and go to around 225 up front. If ya don't want all that heavy of an arrow and want to stay around 9gpp, I would get the 150s and cut them to 29"s and shoot 175 grains up front, I am sure you would be on the money with the 150s. The 250s are a bit too stiff for most 55# bows unless ya leave them long or have lots of weight up front. I have shot them and tested them fo rthe past two years and now shoot nothing else but some wood sometimes. Shawn
Bob, I'm shooting the 250s out of a Black Widow Longbow (Ref.-Def.) that is cut to center. They flew perfect with 225 up front but as Shawn said above I like mine just a shade weak, so when I add a wrap and fletchings it balances out perfect. Probably doesn't matter either way but I'm a little anal about stuff like that. DAVE
With the 150gr. tips they weigh in at 545gr. at 31". I've got some screw-in weights that I think I will try after cutting one of these down to 30"-29.5".
If they are acting weak. Try building out your strike plate first, before doing any cutting.
I thought I would cut one down to 30" and see if it would bring it in enough. If it would stiffen it too much I would add more weight. That one inch brought it right in. I think I will shoot them at 30" because of the great arrow flight. I could cut them down another .5" and add weight...but they fly so well now I don't want to mess with them anymore...?
Guess I just can't leave things alone! I got some 100gr inserts. I will cut one of them down to 29.5" maybe 29" and see with 125gr tips if they fly as well as without at 30"...?
I'm shooting 30 in. 250s with an 50 gr brass insert 145 gr tip wrapped and 4in 4 fletch. These are out of 58 @ 29. they fly perfect bare shaft @ 30 yards. 602 finish weight.
where do you find the adcock site???
I would also cut a small amount off and try to bareshaft at 30 yards. I found that the shafts do a little more moving around at 30 yards.
I may not agree with the size shaft you picked. I think the 250`s are to heavy for 55 lbs. They may fly straight at 20 yards but after much more than that they will drop to much. My 250`s came in at 560 grains each. I like about 500 grains for my 55 lb. recurve and R/D longbow.
I cut some down to 29.5" w/ 100gr inserts and 145gr. tips. The finished arrow comes in at 610gr. or 11gpp for the 55# recurve. The FOC is 15%. They fly great. I can only shot out to 20yds in my backyard or I would try your idea M60gunner. But I am really impressed with their flight and how they hit with authority! I think these will make good elk/deer arrows. At 20yds they don't seem to drop much more than lighter arrows I have shot. I am sure out to 30yds that would be different. I did leave the other 1/2 doz. at 30" w/ 150gr. tips for target arrows.
These carbons were so much easier to tune than another brand I tried. I don't know if the CEs are just heavier or they respond better...?
I'm shooting:
Bh : 125 grain glueon WWs with 75 grain adaptors
Fieldpoints: 200 grain ezpull screwins
both with a 100 grain brass insert
so I'm shooting about 300 grains up front.
I haven't measured the shafts but I think they are around 29" maybe 29.5 (these are the CX terminators, not the heritage)
I also wrapped them BEFORE bareshafting (as OL recommends)
Hickstick:
What weight are you pulling at your draw? What kind of bow do you shoot?
Snag, I had the same favorable results tuning C.E. 250s compared to the marathon tuning session I went through attempting to tune the "other" traditional carbon arrow. No adaptors to screw around with. I just cut a few 250s to my desired length and then played around with a few different field tip weights until I had the shaft indicating slightly under-spined. From there, three, 5.5" maxis stiffened it up to perfection. DONE!
Got to love that Labs! Wish I had tried these first...I wouldn't have pulled out so much hair!
monty...good question...
its a custom 3piece recurve. and I'm pulling just about 56 pounds @ my 27.75 draw...
the first set I bought where the cheap, post season clearance arrows from wally world...so they were already cut shorter than 29", and i had to strip the vanes and pull the inserts. HAD to up the point weight to decrease the spine...
the most recent where raw shafts I bought of flea bay, so I bare shafted those with the same point weight (actually tried 200 & 250, before deciding to just stick with the same heads I already made up.)
I no some are going to say my arrows are to stiff. I tried 150s an 3555s buy the time i got them to shoot my 150 heads they were to short.I am shooting a RER 50@28 i draw 27 3/4 My arrows are 250s 30 1/4 with 50gr goldtip weights an standered inserts.That gives me 61gr inserts and 145 gr tips. They bare shaft great a little nock hight.I fletched them with 4 fletch low profile shields RW. And they shoot great at 15yds i shot a whitetail with a 4 blade simmons land shark. The arrow went through the deer an went 10 more yds and buried in a maple tree.I have found my arrow.
Went to the range at lunch. I tried shooting through paper also. The 29.5" 250s w/ the 245gr. up front shot a tad weak. The 30" w/ the 150gr tips shot bullet holes. This was at 6ft though. So, I think I will go down from 145gr. tips with the 100gr. inserts to 125gr. tips. I believe it was you Shawn that suggested that to begin with. Real happy with my groupings though. A little more fine tuning and think I'm there! Hope they fly as well out of the 56#@28" Morrison Cheyenne that should arrive soon.
I agree totally with Labs. I don't have the option of cutting my arrows(32" Draw Length) but even if I did. I believe that I would cut the arrow to my desired length. Then start playing with point weight. The 50 &100 gr. inserts really make fine tuning carbons a peice of cake. DAVE
I had two C.E. 150s and two 250s cut to my (not Shaquille O'Neal's) desired length- 29.25". I then had a 50 grain point insert and a 100 grain point insert installed in each. For around $5, 3-Rivers sells a field point test kit with the following points: 2-100 grain, 2-125 grain, 2-145 grain, 2-175 grain, and 2-200 grain, & 2-250 grain points.
Because Widows tend to shoot hard (typically requiring a little extra spine), I had an hunch that a C.E. 250 with a 100 grain insert and a broadhead in the 145-200 grain range would put me in the ball park.
Not surprisingly, a 125 grain point showed stiff, as did a 145 grain point. 175 grain point was still indicating slightly stiff- too stiff anyway to allow for the addition of fletching. A 200 grain point resulted in a slightly weak shaft. As a shaft transforms from being too stiff to too weak, you know you're getting close. After a quick fletching job using my trusty fletch tape, using my 5.5" nanners to viagra things up a bit, I ended up with a perfectly tuned arrow in about an hour.
Shooting 53#s, my 29.25" maxi fletched C.E. 250s require a 100 grain brass insert and a 200 grain field point or broadhead. Using a 75 grain steel broadhead adaptor, this will allow me to choose between various 125 grain broadheads including the Wensel Woodsman, Zwickey Eskimo, Magnus Snuffer or two-blade, etc.,etc. LOTS of options!
Incidently this arrow weighs in at +/- 630 grains- about 11.9 gr/inch without requiring weight tubes, weight adaptors or the blessings of a Shaman warrior.
If I get all the info I need, I can usually get people very close. results may vary some, but I am usually close. Shawn
Thanks guys! Thanks Shawn. I do appreciate kicking this around. It has been helpful and will provide an easier and clearer path to take next time.
just measured my shafts this am on my way thru the garage. the precut-fletched CX's I bought at wally world were 28.5" since I decided to use the same point weight on the raw shafts I cut them to the same lenght. (I had said in an earlier post that I thought they were 29.5...but now that I think about it after measuring, it makes sense since I adapted a 'sort of' draw check by having the back of the bhead touch my finger, at 29.5 I'd have to have a mightly long finger for a short italian guy... :)
these shafts are all CX terminators 45/60.
Can you use the Gold Tip weights with the standard aluminum inserts that come with the Carbon Express arrows, or do you need special inserts?
Yes, they are threaded to fit the standard CE inserts...I tried them before I got the 100gr. inserts.
Just a side note on these shafts...I went to the archery shop today and shot for awhile. Properly tuned arrows have made me a better shot! I had several groupings touching each other in or just outside of the bullseye. Because you can tell where the arrow will go when released it gave me the confidence to hold on the target better. Great satisfaction seeing that arrow hit the bullseye. I was surprising some wheel guys next to me I think!
I second that snag. I started trad in 99 and always tried making my own woodies (either from purchased raw shafts, martha stewarts, hand planed ash, or shoots.) The problem I had was consistency....I'd basically end up with a quiver full of disparate arrows. It was my foremost concern leading me to carbons in 07. since then I'm way more confident in my shooting (and I shoot more often because of it...I was always discouraged at loosing or breaking arrows when practicing.)
Just finished tuning some Heritage 250's to a 60lb at 30" Tomahawk longbow. They ended up at 31.25" with a 50 grain insert and 125 grain head. These bareshafted just a tiny bit weak and fly great fletched up.Total weight is 572 grains.
I have a bunch of woodies that are going to make good stumpin' arrows...or bunny arrows or a grouse or two.
I am extremely impressed with the force these CE w/ weighted inserts hit the target with! They are going all the way down to the fletching at times! I am feeling really good about using these on elk and deer.
I have found that you can change the dynamic spine a little by twisting up or down your string a little. It changes the last point the the string leaves the bow, thereby changing the parallelex. I would do this before I cut off any arrow length,If I were that close.
Just finished up mine.
29 1/4" with 200 up front was dead on, 225 were a little weak. I figure I'll have a good choice of heads this way(100 gr inserts & 100 or 125 heads). Total arrow weight 558 gr.
Oh yea, 58# @ my draw of 27".
That's a good point Rybo. Having a good choice of heads is a plus. Even though I do love my Simmon Interceptor 160gr. heads. I will have to go down in bhd. weight.
Snag,
I shoot 250's cut to 28" with 50 gr weight internal and shoot Treeshark mounted up on 42 gr aluminum long adaptor. Finished arrow is 605 grains with 250 up front. Flies great out of my 54lb at my draw Griffin longbow and my 56lb Morrison Cheyenne. Some days it seems that I cannot miss with this arrow, it just goes where I want it, almost effortless. And YES, it hits with authority ! My son complains pulling arrows, and some he cannot pull when I miss outside the vitals where the foam is more dense. Remember, I said I shoot pretty good some days !
nocams :knothead: