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Main Boards => Hunting Knives and Crafters => Topic started by: DANA HOLMAN on February 09, 2009, 09:22:00 AM

Title: charcoal heating
Post by: DANA HOLMAN on February 09, 2009, 09:22:00 AM

hey guys
can anyone tell me what the steps are for charcoal heating a blade, i bought a small weber charcoal grill, do i put the blade in the coals or on top? this is the only forge i have for now.
thanks for any information

Title: Re: charcoal heating
Post by: kbaknife on February 09, 2009, 10:07:00 AM

What is it that you are trying to accomplish when you say "heating a blade"?

Title: Re: charcoal heating
Post by: Steve Nuckels on February 09, 2009, 10:09:00 AM

Dana, I'm a beginner at this, here is my "Redneck" forge a few blocks an old hair dryer and "Cowboy" charcoal.  The cowboy charcoal is natural with little or no additives for a cleaner burn.

I get the charcoal stoked up and put the steel deep into the fire, I try to keep the steel on edge for even heat.

Today I will shop for a propane tourch and some fire bricks for a small fire brick forge.  I also have a scrap oxy. bottle for a better home made forge.

Hope this helps!

  (http://i442.photobucket.com/albums/qq143/Tillerboy_bucket/1stKnife7-08017.jpg)

Title: Re: charcoal heating
Post by: Steve Nuckels on February 09, 2009, 10:15:00 AM

My first knife using stock removal using the "Redneck" forge.

I also have some files in the fire to anneal, my mistake was laying them on one side and one file warped, I beleive from the uneven heating.  I later annealed the warped file by laying it on the convex side and "fixed" it.

Again I'm just starting out!  The pros like Karl will give you the facts!

Steve


  (http://i442.photobucket.com/albums/qq143/Tillerboy_bucket/1stKnife7-08019.jpg)

Title: Re: charcoal heating
Post by: DANA HOLMAN on February 09, 2009, 10:57:00 AM

THANKS GUYS
I THINK I CAN DO IT FROM HERE. THIS EXPLAINES IT VERY GOOD.
KBAKNIFE, IT WAS TO HARDING THE BLADE, JUST WASN'T SURE ABOUT ON EDGE OR FLAT
THANKS AGAIN

Title: Re: charcoal heating
Post by: kbaknife on February 09, 2009, 11:07:00 AM

Dana, do you understand that simply getting a "blade" hot is not what makes it hard?

Title: Re: charcoal heating
Post by: Jeremy on February 09, 2009, 11:20:00 AM

Proper fire maintenance with charcoal is an art in itself as far as I'm concerned.  Simply mounding it and thrusting the blade in may get you by with some steels, but most blacksmiths I've seen form a chamber in the mound when doing knife work.  Your steel doesn't end up contacting it much at all and the heat the blade is exposed to is concentrated and very even.  Properly done, it controls the atmoshpere in the chamber and helps reduce scaling.

There's a reason my first forge was a one brick miniforge that cost me under $10 and took all of 5 minutes to make!

Title: Re: charcoal heating
Post by: DANA HOLMAN on February 09, 2009, 11:48:00 AM

I'M NEW AT THIS, BUT FROM WHAT I UNDERSTAND, IS HEAT THE BLADE TO NONMAGNETIC ABOUT 1400 -1500 DEGREES. THEN QUENCE THE BLADE IN VEG OIL, THEN IN THE OVEN FOR ABOUT 1 HR.
IS THIS RIGHT?
I DO THANK YOU FOR ALL YOU HELP

Title: Re: charcoal heating
Post by: Jeremy on February 09, 2009, 11:55:00 AM

Dana, you have to heat the blade up to its critical temperature, which depending on the steel is either just above the the temp where it becomes nonmagnetic or significantly above where it becomes nonmagnetic.

It's a good idea to always confirm you've hardened the steel after quenching.  If a sharp file won't cut it you're good to go.  If it does, you need to figure out what you're doing wrong and try again.

Title: Re: charcoal heating
Post by: DANA HOLMAN on February 09, 2009, 12:13:00 PM

THANKS JEREMY
I'M USING O1 TOOL STEEL, I HAVE READ AND BEEN TOLD THIS IS THE WAY. LET ME KNOW
THANKS

Title: Re: charcoal heating
Post by: Mark N on February 11, 2009, 10:41:00 PM

FYI: I just purchaseda few fireplace bricks for $1.69ea at Fleet Farm. Admiral Steel has lots of info on heat treating at their site, as well as lots of other technical info.  I also purchased a propane torch with 4' hose for $29, also at Fleet farm, and an adapter to fit it to a 20#propane tank, about $16 at the hardware store. Making a small enclosure out of bricks; one on bottom, 2 on narrow edge, forming a "V" on top of the base, and one on top, the torch turned a piece of 1070 bright red in about 3 minutes. Maybe less. No hair dryer needed.

Title: Re: charcoal heating
Post by: DANA HOLMAN on February 12, 2009, 08:24:00 AM

THANKS MARK
I'M HAVING A HARD TIME FINDING THE BRICK HERE IN DALLAS, BUT I HAVE NOT GIVING UP I WILL FIND ONE
THANKS FOR THE INFO.

Title: Re: charcoal heating
Post by: Phoenix 1967 on February 12, 2009, 01:03:00 PM

If you place a piece of iron pipe in the fire, capped off on one end, you'll create a heating chamber for the knife. moundin charcoal over it will help keep the heat inside, and just before you put the blade in, add some wood chips. the chips will catch fire, consuming the oxygen in the chamber. Place the blade spine down in the chamber. This should hive you an even heat, with no oxygen producing scale. Just a tip that saves a lit of finish work  :cool:

Title: Re: charcoal heating
Post by: Jeremy on February 12, 2009, 01:20:00 PM

Quote

Originally posted by Phoenix 1967:
If you place a piece of iron pipe in the fire, capped off on one end, you'll create a heating chamber for the knife.

Good tip!  I forgot that one - been using gas instead  :)

Title: Re: charcoal heating
Post by: Phoenix 1967 on February 12, 2009, 10:11:00 PM

I can't take credit for it, I learned it from Tai Goo