Post by: Brian Halbleib on October 08, 2006, 02:02:00 AM
http://real-hunters.com/full.swf
-Brian
www.bowyersjournal.com (http://www.bowyersjournal.com)
Post by: Al Kidner on October 08, 2006, 02:39:00 AM
How on earth does this happen? There not hunters, but crims, each and everyone of them.
Pure slobs. The sad part is, they feel the need to wear camo as well.
Just plain fools.
!["[dntthnk]"]("graemlins/dntthnk.gif" "\"\"")
Post by: Hot Hap on October 08, 2006, 03:10:00 AM
Post by: just_a_hunter on October 08, 2006, 03:11:00 AM
Todd
Post by: Danny Rowan on October 08, 2006, 04:02:00 AM
Danny
Post by: Stalker58 on October 08, 2006, 07:43:00 AM
Thank you for sharing that video.
It's appauling how far people will go to get a "Trophy".
I have and never will support"High Fence hunting".
Which is realy NOT hunting at all.
Post by: Brian McIntyre on October 08, 2006, 07:55:00 AM
____________________________________________
I have no doubt that hell will burn hotter for some!
!["[dead]"]("graemlins/dead.gif" "\"\"")
Post by: bentpole on October 08, 2006, 08:17:00 AM
Post by: BAK on October 08, 2006, 08:20:00 AM
Post by: bentpole on October 08, 2006, 08:20:00 AM
Post by: Walter Mauney on October 08, 2006, 08:26:00 AM
Post by: paleFace on October 08, 2006, 08:47:00 AM
Post by: robertson on October 08, 2006, 08:51:00 AM
can t find any words to discribe my feeling about things like that
Post by: Whip on October 08, 2006, 09:39:00 AM
For those that weren't able to view the whole thing, there are two quotes in it that I think are worth repeating.
Author Jim Posewitz - "Tolerance of the lowest ethical standards for the sake of unity simply demeans us all"
Theodore Roosevelt - "The rich, who are content to buy what they have not the skill to get by their own exertions, these are the real enemies of the game."
How many times have we heard the arguement that we need to stick together as hunters and not allow anti hunters to divide us? I say Bull....
We need to fight the game farm industry with everything we have and eliminate farces like this from being associated in any way with our sport.
Post by: Killdeer on October 08, 2006, 10:09:00 AM
Killdeer
Post by: AZStickman on October 08, 2006, 10:14:00 AM
I'm at a loss for words....... Terry
Post by: Jimbob on October 08, 2006, 10:31:00 AM
Post by: vermonster13 on October 08, 2006, 10:39:00 AM
Post by: adeeden on October 08, 2006, 11:11:00 AM
Post by: byers wolfe on October 08, 2006, 01:05:00 PM
Post by: John Scifres on October 08, 2006, 01:11:00 PM
Houston killed that deer eventually and had his livestock kill on his website prior to Bellar's disgrace. He's a bigger idiot than I ever imagined. He testified in the trial.
Post by: bayoulongbowman on October 08, 2006, 03:22:00 PM
Post by: shootrmn on October 08, 2006, 06:36:00 PM
Post by: Todd Weldon on October 08, 2006, 10:37:00 PM
And he even bleated like he was trying to get that buck to stop for a shot. If that wasn't so sickening it would be halarious.
I'm officially down with Jimmy H and anyone else involved in this.....
Todd
Post by: vermonster13 on October 08, 2006, 10:48:00 PM
Post by: MI_Bowhunter on October 09, 2006, 09:50:00 AM
There was an HBO special several years ago about poaching in the US, America Undercover. It showed similar kinds of events. Some showed shooters getting ready and pulling the trigger as the animals were released from cages.
It's sickening. These people probably brag about the "great hunt" they had. These guys should be thrown in to a cage match and see how they fare.
Post by: John Scifres on October 09, 2006, 10:10:00 AM
(http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/attachment.php?s=5d91f3f1bc375556d594f493d830e9ff&attachmentid=56771&stc=1&d=1104968252) His 17 year old son also killed a deer. If you take your kids canned hunting, you won't have to can your kids. Or something like that :(
Dunn testified at the trial.
Post by: Mockingbird on October 09, 2006, 10:12:00 AM
All,
If the link below doesn't work, copy and paste it into your browser window. This video has do do with "high-fence" killing of deer. Proponents call it high-fence "hunting", but this is NOT hunting! It has NOTHING to do with ethical hunting and fair chase, which gives the animal opportunity to detect and evade the hunter, something they are VERY good at. An ethical hunter seeks game on its own territory, where it has plenty of escape routes, the opportunity to get your scent, hear you, or see you, and escape, which happens often. These deer learn from their experiences, and become progressively wiser and harder to hunt, a challenge that real hunters enjoy. High-fence killing traps the deer in an enclosure it cannot usually escape, and its murderer virtually shoots at will, sometimes paying tens of thousands of dollars to do so. Sometimes, the trapped deer are also drugged or sick, making them even easier prey. Sometimes, by whatever means, some of the sick deer do escape, to spread disease through the healthy herds in the wild.
High-fence killing is an abominable practice, and decent, fair hunters get tarred with the same brush as these monsters. Please contact your Congressmen and senators, both state and federal, and urge them to bring these places down. Even if you don't hunt, real conservationist groups like the National Wildlife Foundation or the Isaac Walton League certainly have to be against this practice. Find and join any one of these groups that suits you and works against this awful thing, and add your voice to theirs. Thank you.
http://real-hunters.com/full.swf
Post by: vermonster13 on October 09, 2006, 10:13:00 AM
Post by: Tom Leemans on October 09, 2006, 12:09:00 PM
Greed is a horrible horrible thing. I believe it is the origin of all of the deadly sins. It's a shame that a simple, well intentioned record keeping body such as Boone & Crockett and Pope & Young had to become the standard by which these greedy people had to measure themselves against other greedy people with, when it was supposed to be used to record the animal. Those without strong morals or wills have become trophy junkies. Anything to get their fix. They justify it in their own minds by "killing it themselves".
Shoot a "Monster/Book/Record" animal = fame & $$$. Two things the greedy people love most. The topic of eliminating record books and such has been kicked around before and beaten to death. I'd love if it were illegal to profit from the taking of a wild animal but how are you going to enforce that? Hell, I've even bought the videos, mainly just to look at the nice deer. I could care less about the kill. I guess I'm just an enabler. :rolleyes: Land prices in the midwest have been rising at an alarming rate because there's big money to be made in hunting trophy animals. I hate to tell Joe Schmoe that he can't earn a living but maybe it's time we (the hunting public and wildlife enforcement) actually bite the bullet and do what we all know needs to be done to stop this crap.
Post by: vermonster13 on October 09, 2006, 03:02:00 PM
http://www.trophyclassdeer.com/genetics.htm
Post by: Tom Leemans on October 09, 2006, 03:40:00 PM
I'm sorry folks but the days of naturally occurring mega deer (sorry, couldn't think of a proper word for it) will be polluted for a good long while, thanks to trophy management programs. I liken this to organized sports and steroids. We're on they way to where nothing will be pure anymore.
I'm afraid it's time to close the record books folks. The world is far to obsessed with records anyway. None of these deer belong in a record book for their racks, any more than Mark MacGuire (sp?) or Barry Bonds does for hitting all those home runs. The record books were never started with this in mind and, quite frankly, lose much of their credibilty when these deer are included. When stud animals from northern climates are bred with a south texas doe, directly or indirectly, you just ruined the reason for the Pope and Young record book as far as I'm concerned.
I suppose you could argue that it's no different than breeding dogs for profit and that you can't draw a line on deer hunting because then you'd have to draw a line on dog breeding and horse breeding, etc. Well I'm sorry folks but yes you can draw a line. It's time for all of the wildlife departments countrywide to grow a set and draw that line.
I don't know how sharp the ol' fella still is but I'd like to know what Glen St.Charles thinks of this. I bet I have a good idea already.
Post by: eagle24 on October 09, 2006, 03:44:00 PM
Post by: Tom Leemans on October 09, 2006, 04:11:00 PM
Post by: DTS on October 09, 2006, 04:34:00 PM
Post by: BMOELLER on October 09, 2006, 07:18:00 PM
PITIFUL!!!
Post by: vermonster13 on October 09, 2006, 10:48:00 PM
I am all for big tent when those in the tent are actually hunting. This isn't even close.
Post by: wapiti on October 09, 2006, 10:48:00 PM
Post by: Tom Leemans on October 10, 2006, 08:22:00 AM
Quote
Originally posted by vermonster13:So true and when this happens, it needs to be responded to by all the good folks in that tent. These losers aren't welcome in the tent and the public needs to know how we feel.
I am all for big tent when those in the tent are actually hunting. This isn't even close.
Post by: Texasrecurve on October 10, 2006, 10:57:00 PM
Post by: DTS on October 11, 2006, 11:40:00 AM
Post by: jindydiver on October 11, 2006, 06:37:00 PM
http://cgi.jconline.com/cgi-bin/resend/printPage.pl?storypath=/lafayettejc/columns/200501100local_sports1105333358.shtml
Quote
In case you have been under a rock for the last year, Bellar and his farm manager, Hinds Tom Jones, were arrested in 2004 by federal authorities on multiple counts of game violations at "Bellar's Place," a high-fence deer hunting operation near Peru. At this writing, Bellar is having his day in court.From here
The reason we bring this item back to the forefront is because hunters across the state should understand what Bellar and his friends think is acceptable and normal in such operations as they pursue legislation to help these types of "farms." The more this situation continues the more I believe it is the single most important issue currently facing Hoosier hunters and outdoors enthusiasts.
The trial has featured testimony from country music superstar Ronnie Dunn of the duo Brooks and Dunn. The singer told jurors that he and his son went to the farm and shot two deer despite never purchasing an Indiana hunting license.
Upon cross-examination by Bellar's lawyers, Dunn was asked if he was aware that he had committed illegal acts during the "hunt" and inquired if he were receiving immunity for his testimony.
Dunn said he was told the farm was a private facility and required no state licenses. He also said he had received no assurances of immunity.
Fox Sports Net South TV host Joey Mines told the jury about filming a promotional video for deer bait at Bellar's Place. Mines said Jones later called him and asked that the video not be used because Bellar was concerned about the baiting seen on the tape.
The episode did later air.
One of Bellar's attorneys asked Mines if he has investigated the possibility that it was illegal to hunt with bait in Indiana. The TV host admitted that he had not.
An undercover DNR officer testified about a hunt in which he took part during the investigation. For $12,500 the officer was allowed to hunt two bucks that were pre-identified from a videotape catalog of deer on the farm. The deer were placed inside a six-acre pen for the "hunt."
Another witness, Tennessee homebuilder Greg Bridgers, told the 15-member jury that he paid $3,000 to hunt at Bellar's Place. Bridgers told the jury that during the visit he observed an obviously ill buck lying in a small fenced area. After Bridgers inquired about the price for the buck, Jones spoke to Bellar. Bellar said through Jones that Bridgers could shoot the deer for an additional $15,000.
Bridger tried to negotiate a lower price but eventually agreed to pay the $15,000. Accompanied by Jones and a video camera operator, Bridger shot the deer.
"(Jones) had to literally push the deer to get it up off the ground," Bridgers said, according to a story in the Fort Wayne Journal-Gazette. "That's how sick the deer was."
After the deer was shot the men re-enacted the scene to make it appear "as if it was a real hunt out in the wild."
Do I need to continue?
By the way, the legal strategy being used here appears to be the old "discredit the prosecution witnesses" tactic. That might work with your run-of-the-mill drug dealer testifying against a former buddy but when an enormously popular singer says that he was told he didn't need a license, the jury is going to sit up and listen.
Aside from the small but vocal minority who doesn't see anything wrong with this type of "business," one thing is clear: the affairs at Bellar's Place should infuriate any person who even remotely considers themselves an ethical hunter.
Regardless of which side of the debate you find yourself, it is hard for anyone to justify Bellar's methods of operation. While some people believe current state laws unfair to deer farmers, there is no justification for simply ignoring rules with which you do not agree.
If the pro-canned hunt folks are looking for a spokesman, I'd suggest they find another point man because I believe Bellar is going to be busy for the next 3-5 years.
http://www.fws.gov/arsnew/regmap.cfm?arskey=14636
Quote
Russell G. Bellar, owner of Bellar's Place, Inc., a 1,200 acre deer farm near Peru, Ind., pleaded guilty in federal court in South Bend, Indiana, to two felony violations of the Lacey Act, including conspiracy, and one felony violation of a federal food and drug law, on Jan. 12. As part of the plea agreement, Bellar will pay a $5,000 fine, $120,000 restitution for investigative costs, and a $450,000 payment in lieu of the forfeiture of assets listed in the 38-count indictment. Bellar has also agreed to assist the government in its on-going investigation. Bellar may also face a prison sentence of up to two years. Sentencing for possible prison time will not take place until this spring.
Bellar, 57, and farm manager Hinds Thomas Jones, 36, were charged July 15, 2004, with 38 counts of illegally selling and transporting wildlife across state boundaries; facilitating the illegal killing and transportation of wildlife; knowingly providing false information to federal agents; and, illegally introducing chemicals into food-producing wildlife for interstate transfer. Jones pleaded guilty January 3 to conspiracy to violating the Lacey Act, a federal wildlife protection law.
Bellar pleaded guilty to three of the charges today, a day after the government had rested its case and before a jury began its deliberations. More than 50 witnesses testified against Bellar during the seven-day trial, including personalities Jimmy Houston, host of the television show ?Jimmy Houston Outdoors,? country musician Ronnie Dunn and Fox Sports Net South television host Joey Mines.
Evidence presented during the trial established Bellar conducted at least 51 illegal deer hunts on his property since January 2001. Bellar's customers -- many of whom were from outside Indiana, were unlicensed, used illegal weapons or bait -- paid between $4,000 and $20,000 to select and shoot a white-tailed buck in the enclosed preserve. The deer were often drugged prior to being placed into small pens where they were killed. Once killed, the deer's antlers, hides and drug-contaminated meat were illegally transported, often across state boundaries. Although Bellar's Place, Inc., was licensed by the State of Indiana as a game breeding facility, the license did not allow the sale of deer for hunting. To sell a specific deer for hunting is illegal in Indiana. Interstate transportation of wildlife-- including hides or parts--obtained in violation of state law violates the Lacey Act. The practice of killing animals within an enclosed space for the purpose of obtaining a trophy is known as ?canned hunting.? Currently, there are no federal laws prohibiting canned hunts in the United States.
Bellar's guilty plea is the result of a joint investigation into illegal deer hunting by special agents of the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service and law enforcement agents of the Indiana Department of Natural Resources. The U.S. Food and Drug Administration ? Office of Criminal Investigations also assisted the investigation. The Northern District of Indiana U.S. Attorney's Office, represented by Assistant U.S. Attorney Donald J. Schmid, presented the case in federal court.
Post by: waknstak IL on October 16, 2006, 03:02:00 PM
Post by: EDW on October 17, 2006, 06:53:00 AM
Post by: JC on October 18, 2006, 09:11:00 AM
I have hunted bugscuffle in TX, as well as one or two other operations that do have high fences. On more than one occasion, I was skunked, sometimes only to return home to familiar public grounds and quickly take an animal. The greatest stalk of my life was for 6 hours on bugscuffle....it truly was a terrific hunting experience that was not diminished at all by the fact that there was a fence that I never saw once I drove through the gate. There are some reputable high fence operations, villifying all of them becuase of prostitution by some, is short sighted in my opinion.
Post by: painthorse on October 18, 2006, 08:47:00 PM
I have never understood the need to kill just to prove you are a hunter.I guess I'm a simple man.I do not need to kill to prove I'm a hunter.Mr. Lamb said it best."BEING THERE WAS GOOD ENOUGH".
Hunt safe
Scott
Post by: Shakes.602 on November 03, 2006, 04:24:00 PM
Post by: redant 60/65 on November 03, 2006, 06:54:00 PM
Post by: Stone Knife on November 03, 2006, 07:24:00 PM
Post by: WLThomas IV on November 03, 2006, 08:12:00 PM
However, I do agree that we should be careful of pointing the finger at all high fence operations. If it's big enough that the animal doesn't even know there's a fence, I reckon it's fair chase. Also, don't just jump on the compound shooters. I seem to remember us having a few skeletons in our own closet; something about somebody shooting a carribou with a rifle and writing a story about the "fair-chase bow kill"??? Incidentally, I have never hunted behind high fences and I don't shoot compounds.
Post by: Leland on November 04, 2006, 02:12:00 PM
Post by: Doug S on November 04, 2006, 07:03:00 PM
We stop chasing antlers and it's all back to just hunting.
BTW I know of a traditional hunter who shot a deer in a pen (24 acres) while others chased it around.
Post by: WLThomas IV on November 04, 2006, 10:47:00 PM
Post by: waya on November 08, 2006, 09:35:00 PM
Post by: Bob Sherman on November 10, 2006, 12:51:00 PM
Yes, it is but we bring it on ourselves by trying to say they aren't hunters. Instead we need to stand up and voice opposition. he public sees them as hunters and always will.
The "Big Tent Theory" is crap used by fools like those in the video to keep doing what they do through fear. It is ignoring activities such as these that will ultimately doom hunting, not voicing opposision. If you ignore, you condone!
Post by: LBR on November 21, 2006, 05:26:00 PM
I think it's obvious why anyone hunts in an enclosure--be it 2 acres or 2,000 acres. You know, without a shadow of a doubt, the animal you want is there, and will be there for as long as you care to chase it or until you kill it.
I've heard of places that are so big you don't see the fence except when you go in and when you leave, and don't doubt it can be a challenge, but again--where do you draw the line? 10 acres? 100 acres? 100 acres plus 10 square feet?
Something else to consider--I don't think the non-hunting public cares about the difference in 10 acres and 10,000 acres--perception gets turned off when they hear the word "fence" or "enclosure". From that point on, you are shooting an animal in a cage, period. Definately not good for our image.
I've never hunted in an enclosure, and don't have any plans to. I just don't think I'd be happy even if I killed the biggest animal in it. I have traveled quite a bit to hunt, as far as Canada for moose. The closest thing I saw to a live moose was fresh tracks and scats, but it was one of the best, if not the absolute best hunt I've had in my life. I think it was Charlie Lamb that said it best--just being there was good enough.
I can only see one correct answer, if you have any real concern over the general public's perception of hunters and hunting--don't hunt in an enclosure.
That's my two bits anyhow.
Chad
Post by: NightHawk on November 23, 2006, 10:15:00 PM
The Indiana Bowhunters Ass supported the closure of the canned hunt facilities, along with other sportsmen groups. Some sportsmen groups opposed the proposed closure of the canned hunting facilities (The Beaglers alliance as one such group)
The director of the IDNR decided to close down the canned hunting facilities. Rodney Bruce an owner of one of the canned hunting facilities filed a law suite against the IDNR. At the urging of the Indiana Bowhunters Ass and the Indiana Deer Hunters Ass the IDNR accepted a proposal that will allow the canned hunt operations to operate for another 12 years.
I believe that within that time frame the canned hunt operators hope to sway the legislature to legalize thier operations. The canned hunting operators believe it is a property rights issue. The Amish make big money breeding deer and selling them to the canned hunting operations
I used to belong to the Indiana Bowhunters Assoc., but I have not renewed my membership because of the stance the organization took on the canned hunting issue. I felt the organization betrayed the membership, when the board decided to urge the IDNR to accept the 12 year proposal. I feel that the IBA boardshould have consulted the membership before making such an important decision.
If you seen someone being raped would you tell the rapist that what he's doing is wrong and unethical, but he can keep doing it for 12 years, then he has to quit?? That scenario is extreme but also makes a point.
It's time Indiana had a sportsmen group that represents bowhunters and stands up for ethics instead of playing politics
This is my opinon
Post by: Texasrecurve on November 24, 2006, 11:09:00 PM
TR
Post by: sabas silva on November 25, 2006, 08:16:00 AM
So the battle must continue to preserve what we love to do, and for those that follow.
Post by: Voodoofire1 on November 25, 2006, 09:26:00 AM
It's past time Dean,but so long as the almighty buck rules the roost ethics are but an afterthought, and I'm afraid as long as these hunting operations, and their greedy supporters continue to grease the anals of our politicians with their sizable donations, we will lose,and continue to lose for years to come, why?.. because we will never have the resourses to compete with the likes of these lowlifes, I live in Indiana too,and this trend of "money talks" was started long ago, and it has become "status quo" for many, and they have gotten very good at using mis-direction to shed the heat of their actions,kinda reminds me of the lawyers commercial on tv where he says" my most important case is always my next one" ,Well what about the one you have now! this state has millions of people, Each and every one supposed to be equal under the law,and each one a supposed voice, but when you throw a little money into the equasion it sure doesn't turn out that way.
Texasrecurve, I disagree,I believe hunting will be here forever, but it will be like europe where the only the privilidged few can afford to participate.
When money talks fellas,.... hunting walks.....a very thin line,...The right to feed your family on one side as god intended, and the "privilige" to harvest some big antlers on the other as man intends, which will win? I don't know ,but I see where the money is,and I hope my childrens children are filthy stinkin rich so they can afford to hunt. When you look at the big picture it doesn't look so good,does it? just my opinions fellas.......Steve
Post by: vealboss on November 26, 2006, 01:42:00 AM
Post by: Jason in Bama on November 26, 2006, 07:13:00 PM
Post by: Billy on December 18, 2006, 10:07:00 PM
The guy I use for processing is right outside the boundary fence of this operation. The hunters who come in there (slug,M/L,wheelie) ALL think he should be under the prison.
Some say boundary fences would be ok others, like most of us,are tee-totally against any fence. But, ALL are against the things on this video.
What is needed is a HUNTERS' Association with a spine ! As well as, WE hunters to stand and demand rules and regs apply to everyone. Without regard to weapon or season.
Just my ranting, Thanx for allowing me to vent.
Post by: Orion on December 19, 2006, 11:18:00 AM
Post by: FreedomRules3 on December 21, 2006, 11:38:00 PM
Post by: J Osborne on December 26, 2006, 04:01:00 AM
Post by: J Osborne on December 26, 2006, 06:13:00 AM
Why are people willing to turn a blind eye? Am I missing something?
Post by: no on January 05, 2007, 02:38:00 PM
Post by: The Ursus on January 05, 2007, 04:34:00 PM
Post by: mike laychur on January 06, 2007, 05:49:00 PM
Post by: Old Ways on January 08, 2007, 12:53:00 PM
I don't think the majority of people even know what hunting is anymore. They sit in a high-rise blind over bait on a high fence ranch and shoot the deer they picked out of a photo album while someone films it all so they can look like the big hunter. Throw one of these fools out in the real woods and see how they fare.
To me hunting is a way of life. It takes care of the meat dishes that in part feed my family. It is not about big horns (although they are necessary to meet the requirements of the Michigan hunting tag). Hunting the "best" animal is actually counter productive. Nature doesn't work that way.
The woods are where we go to escape the modern world. It is all that is left and it is getting smaller each day. One of the reasons I returned to traditional hunting was because it is simple. It is an age old art that "fits" into the forest. In the interest of keeping the natural world natural I would like to see some changes. No more baiting, no shooting pens, no contests where the biggest rack wins, no more ATV or ORV use, no more trail markers, no more left in place blinds or tree stands, heck, I even wish ther was no more firearms. I know, I'm a dreamer.
Post by: Baim on January 30, 2007, 04:36:00 PM
Post by: DesertDude on January 30, 2007, 05:53:00 PM
PS: This is NOT the freedom I served 28 years in the Navy to protect
Post by: Bowchef on February 02, 2007, 02:14:00 PM
Post by: FreedomRules3 on February 05, 2007, 09:07:00 AM
Quote
Originally posted by J Osborne:Funny I posted it up on several forums I follow. On One in particular I was actually called an anti hunter and I should mind my own business. the guy got so whacky they locked the post :knothead:
I went to other sites to see if people had seen or talked about this and most site this topic is closed and removed.
Why are people willing to turn a blind eye? Am I missing something?
of course he never even bothered to watch it . I figured he owned a high fence operation :banghead:
Post by: Nakohe on February 18, 2007, 08:33:00 AM
I just personally made the choice to not hunt High fence again, no matter how big.
I hope everyone in that operation in Indiana gets what is coming to them. They are not true hunters, and certainly not sportsmen. I for one am writning my reps and sens and asking for legislation against so called canned hunts.
I just hope there are some low fence or public areas left for my grandkids and their children.
Post by: T.A.C. on February 19, 2007, 08:23:00 PM
Post by: rbbhunt on May 02, 2007, 06:05:00 PM
Post by: Budog56 on May 02, 2007, 09:51:00 PM
Post by: traditional_archer on May 03, 2007, 01:04:00 PM
I started to hunt with Trad Gear just to level the field between hunter and hunted. It got to the point that I didn't feel good about other methods of hunting, ie: modern firearm and compound bows. I see so much more of the outdoors and a lot more critters hunting the way I do.
I guess that the simpler things in life are all that I need.
Post by: Shell on May 07, 2007, 09:41:00 AM
Who are the real animals here?
Actually, I should'nt even use the same categoric name to associate such inhumane beasts.
Post by: bow'narrow on May 08, 2007, 09:24:00 PM