A what if arrow is an arrow that you shoot to see if an opportunity had been presented, could you have made the shot count. I like to carry at least one arrow in my quiver to use for this purpose. I take the shot before I leave my stand or blind. This arrow is setup just like my hunting arrows.
Last week there was a coyote that came into my shooting lane and presented me with a shot but her coat was not in very good shape so I let her walk. Later in the same day I had a couple of squirrels that stayed just out of range. Had they come within range I was going to take a shot.
On this particular day I had one "what if arrow" and three blunts to practice with before getting out of the treestand. The practice shot for the coyote was perfect at 15 yards! The first practice shot for the squirrel rattled as it went over the 2" diameter target log that was 20 yards away. The second arrow nicked the bottom of the log and the third arrow center punched the log.
I left the woods that day with a trophy. Here is a picture of the stick that I used as my coyote target.
(http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc168/Gatekeeper100/DSCN1035.jpg)
(http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc168/Gatekeeper100/DSCN1034.jpg)
about half of my arrows are for what ifs love taking 70 yard shots at the buffalo at the 3d range i always wondered why they put that target right in front of a stone ledge :archer:
I always take that shot. I have as much fun shooting as hunting. :goldtooth:
Always! ...ditto HATCHCHASER!!!
yep I usually let a judo fly in the direction I'm going to walk out. :campfire:
My friend and I call them over the River Arrow at the 3-D shoots.
Mine is more of a how come arrow. How come I can hit that little flower at twice the distance with thehow come arrow, and miss the animal completly at 1/2 with my others
I done that several times. Gives me confidence for the next time I'm in that spot.
I usually shoot an arrow from the stand after I am settled in, I shoot downwind as I do not expect anything to come from that way. I do not understand about the coyote though,, the only good coyote is a dead coyote. It now has been proven that they are very detrimental to our deer herds. I kill them every op. even pups if I find a den. Shawn
I shoot a what if arrow before i get down alot. I took my 8yr old the last day of doe season and he wanted to climb up in my wooden stand so i took my selfbow and he took his recuve and a bunch of blunts. After about 1hr he started to get wrestless and i told him to pretend there was a deer on the logging road about 15yds from us and he picked out a clump of grass and let her fly. If he'd been shootin at a deer it would be in the freezer! He wanted to climb down and get his arrows and come back up in the tree, i had more fun letting him shoot out of that stand than i did hunting from it...
He's a blast! Sorry, i had to share->
I take them.This year I shot a single maple leaf @ 30 yards where a 6 pointer had been standing for about 5 minutes perfectly broadside.But you know that maple leaf didnt have a chance to move without wind, the buck would have been a different story had I shot.Those what if shots do make you smile though.
06 season big herd bull standing broadside at 45 yards for 2-3 minutes, no wind and level ground.
After he left I ranged a deadfall at 45 and dropped a broadhead right beside the knot I was aiming at. That season I had similar standoffs with smaller bulls (5 and 6 points) four more times, I hunt solo with a longbow and thats part of the package.
That's one of the best thing about bow hunting, you can shoot your way out of the woods. Don't try this with a gun or some one might try to lock you up in the nut house.
Mike
I also take what if shots. I agree with Shawn 100% on the yotes. They need to be thinned everywhere.I would never let one go.RC
Always carry one or two blunts or judos. Always good to make sure those shooting lanes are clear from the stand.
Had a young 5 pt dead in my sights broadside and looking the other way at 15 yards while still hunting hogs this fall. I only had one buck tag left so I let him walk. You're darn right I pulled a what-if judo out and hit within 1 1/2 inches of a blade of grass where he'd just been standing. Hard to beat the fun of a judo point.
QuoteOriginally posted by Shawn Leonard:
I do not understand about the coyote though,, the only good coyote is a dead coyote. It now has been proven that they are very detrimental to our deer herds. I kill them every op. even pups if I find a den. Shawn
Hi Shawn.
I have heard that before and the same thing has been said about the decline in the quail and rabbits in our area but the studies done by the Missouri Conservation Department has shown that the decline in quail and rabbits was due to loss of habitat no predation.
For the longest time birds of prey, bobcats, coyotes and turkey were being blamed for the decline of the quail population. At the same time the quail showed a decline there was another bird (sorry I forget it's name) that was showing a population decline. This bird is a little predator and has completely opposite needs then quail except that the bird relies on the same type of habitat that quail and rabbits need.
I have not seen an over populated coyote problem in my area. I know of two coyotes that frequent our property but they don't seem to cause any problems. I don't have a problem with shooting a coyote but I would like to have a reason for doing it. The reason for killing the coyote could be nuisance issue, over populated, sick animal or because I want to use its pelt but I don't have it in me to kill just because I have the power to kill. If I see signs that the coyotes are having a grave impact on the deer herd in my area then I will intervene but my trail cameras show that all the does that use our farm had one or two fawns with them and from what I have seen they lived up to the point where they lost there spots.
Alternative step that can be taken to protect the fawns is to create thick escape areas where the fawns can hide and control the age structure of the herd so that the majority of the fawns are born at one time to increase the survival rate from predation. This is something that QDMA suggest doing. Here is a link to an article from QDMA. This was a 10-year study done on whitetail deer and predation from coyotes.
http://www.qdma.com/articles/details.asp?id=59
If you can pass on any information that you have that would great.
Thanks for your input.
Tom
I wasn't sure what this would be about when I opened it. "What if arrow?" What if you see Sasquatch? :D
I agree with the coyote thought. I'd have tried to kill it. I'll guarantee you that's why we have so few deer in my neighborhood. They are eating most of the fawns in spring! Only good coyote is a dead one!!!!!!! I just have a hard time hitting them.
I carry a blunt but hardly ever shoot it from my stands unless I'm leaving early. Mostly it's for loosening up after a morning sit or going out for the afternoon. Also "What if" I see a Grouse.
You should have shot the wild dog!!
Gatekeeper:
Good info about the coyotes. We have them in our area as well (who doesn't) and like you, I have never seen any evidence suggesting that they are a detriment to our local deer herd. If anything, I have always believed that having coyotes around serves to strengthen the health of the deer population. If that Darwin guy was correct, I'm assuming that they are not culling the healthiest deer in the herd. Now coyotes and pheasants, THAT's another subject- #hdh%@*%!!! But I still wouldn't kill a coyote just for the sake of killing it. That's not how I roll...
GK, our ENCON department came up with the same junk for years and I mean for 20 years. Mow they are finally admitting that the coyotes have been very detrimental to our deer herds all along. They have excavated dens and have found hundreds of deer skulls in them as well as house cats and dogs. One den in Green County NY had trail cameras placed in it from May until early August 23 fawns, 5 house cats and 1 dog was bought in by the coyotes in that brief time, sorry I need no reason other than that. I believe about the quail and loss of habitat, because like the DEC guys now say" why eat rabbit and quail when ya can eat venison". Shawn
I don't want to stray from the ? to much...Shawn is right on.Ted watched 7 of them little SOB's take down a full grown whitetail doe 2 years ago.As she was yarded in 3 feet of snow in the northeast corner of Wa.state.Ripped her to peaces.....while she was still alive.Ranchers run sheep in the Cascade Mountians in the spring.The DNR lets them graze the sheep...According to the ranchers.Whom I guess I believe these guy's cause there in the mountains all spring.Of 2,000 bread yews in a flock they will or should drop 2,000 plus lambs.The loss of lambs,runs sometimes pending on how hard the winter was on the song dogs...as many as 400 of the 2,000 plus lambs become lambs chops...for yotes.I guess they are a little easier to catch then the fawns.But years when they don't run the sheep in an area....fawns and elk calf counts are down,cause they become deer and elk chops....Should have never statred feeding the little son of guns.... one yote shooting mother if I get the chance...bd
I will occasionally put a little davey brackens trail maker on my arrow and shoot it into my shooting lane that offers the best shot opprotunity. Its worked on several counts for me stopping a deer rite were I want them and also gives me a little bit of confidence in my skills..
2 coyotes = 6 = 10 and so on. Thats one reason i take a what if arrow.
Labs4me
I think we have the same point of view on the culling effect.
Shawn
Well... I don't know if junk is the right word.
I have tried to find some information on the Green County study but I haven't been successful. Do you know where I can find this study or and article about it. I would like to read it to see what you are talking about and maybe better inform myself on this issue.
What does ENCON stand for? When I do a search using ENCON I don't find anything pertaining to wildlife.
If you are interested here are some more studies done on the whitetail predation by coyotes issue.
http://texnat.tamu.edu/symposia/coyote/p20.htm
http://www.northamericanwhitetail.com/deermanagement/wt_102predators
http://www.hunterspec.com/Updateable/update_display.cfm?pageID=1796&categoryID=12
Every arrow in my quiver seems to be a "what if" arrow. :knothead: But all kidding aside, I always carry a judo or two for those types of shots.
I think the coyote discussion has been covered,but maybe it needs it's own thread? I always carry an arrow in my bowquiver just in case I want to shoot it at something,whatever it might be.It's good practice.
And I've shot a squirrel or two also while in the woods. I also shoot at small things near the spot where I expect a buck to show,when I ready to leave my stand.
I was able to kill an antelope because of this habit. I was in a windmill stand,and real early in the morning a blue grouse walked by at about twenty yards.
I took a shot at it,but my lower bow limb hit the stand just enough to make me miss,i took a couple of feathers off the grouse.
Later,when the antelope were coming,I knew I had to shoot from my knees,and had to be way on the edge of the stand.
A buck came to drink,and I put a snuffer right behind the shoulder,and the arrow hung up in the off shoulder blade. The blade punched through the bone,then stopped.
I still have the shoulder blade and the grouse feather.
If not for the shot at the grouse,I would have missed the buck.It scored 69 something.
That's why I have a what if arrow. :campfire:
Hi Dirty Bill
Thanks for your concern about the coyote issue. I know that it has gotten off course from the original thread that I started but I don't mind. That is the way conversations go sometimes. I am finding the conversation to be educational.
Lately I have been carrying practice broadheads in my pack to use for my "what if" shots. I replace the razor sharp broadheads with my practice broadheads when I am going to take a what if shot.
I was ready to draw on a squirrel yesterday but I needed him to step out from behind some brush. Then at the last second another squirrel came into the mix and they started chasing each other around and out of my comfortable shooting range. Afterwards I shot at the place I was anticipating the squirrel to be and hit the mark perfectly. When I got out of the tree I paced the distance off and it was a 30 yard down hill shoot. This made me feel pretty good.
Good shot on the antelope congratulations. I don't know anything about scoring antelope. Is 69 consider above average?
Tom
I have a quiver full of those.. I See Deer and Elk shots alot and have a ton-o-fun doin it. I spend more time Stumpin than huntin..
i took 2 what if shots today lol...I take as many as it takes to hit my mark. Sometimes i have an empty quiver come last light but its all practice and practice makes perfect.
yip i always take a "what if arrow" i use exactly the same type of arrow i intend to hunt with, take a few shots then stick on a new sharp broadhead and off i go.
if im in a hide i will shoot an arrow if things are slow just to make sure everything is good.