I am not impressed thus far with this bow as far as speed goes. It is a smooth shooter. Not real fast like others say. I shot some GT5575s with 125gr tips out of this 64"ACS-CX, 52#@28" and it chrono'd at 170fps. I don't think this is slow by any standards...just not fast. It seems like when I had the 60# limbs on it it wasn't any faster either. I am using the chrono at the local archery shop so I know it is right on.
What did the arrows weigh? How far are you drawing?
Just curious, what is the total weight of your arrows?...Mike
I am drawing at 28"...had the guys at the shop check. The arrows at GT5575s at 29.5" long with 125gr tips. The heavier tips made the arrows fish tail...? So, I went down in weight and got much better flight...which I don't like either! I have not weighted the arrows. But I know they aren't over 500gr.
Depends on how many grains per lb.and your actual draw length. Speed is a + but not the most important thing.
I agree Crooked Stic. But I am just surprised at the difference in performance numbers. I read how some of 180fps up to 190+fps. Then with a 28" draw and arrows that are about 9gr per inch I get 170fps...?
That arrow would weigh right around 400 grains +/-, which would put you a bit under 8 grains per pound. 170 does seem like a very low number for that bow at least with the ones I've checked.
But then again I've got a draw lenth that is pushing 30" so that will add more fps right there... And I'm shooting 14 strand TS1+ strings too, so that will add a few more fps...
I believe the new CX's are being supplied with a 14 strand Rod Jenkins string, so the string can't be the problem.
That arrow cannot be much over 400 gr. With that bow weight and your draw, 170 fps is below average...or should I say, I would have expected more (185-190 fps?)
Maybe try another chrono. They do mess up from time to time and vary between each other as far as fps. Heck, with a 26" draw I'd be happy with 170.
Blackys review in TBM had the ACS-CX at 193 with fingers and 9GPP. That would be 468 gr. arrow for your 52# bow.
They get a 12 strand Dynaflight '97 string.
I'd cross-check on another chrony and/or compare with another bow on the same chrony.
Chad
One thing to watch out for with chrons is that you have to have straight arrow flight to intersect the shadow detector with the point of the arrow. If it's going sideways at all, you will start it on one end with the point and shut it off midshaft on the other. It will give you crazy numbers.
Mike
Redant 60/65 just bought 2 A&H 64" 54@28 and 60@28 both shooting 480gr arrow, he draws 27+ they went through at 193 and 198 time and time again......They are both over 200 at my 29+ draw. he just received a new chrono....Mark
Hey Snag, don't know what your problem could be, could be a bad chrono reading. My ACS 41@28 shooting a 362 grn. easton arrow consistantly reads 203 fps all day. I had my friend shoot it and at his 30in. draw got 207, 209, 207. I pull right on 28" and have my brace height set at 7 1/4. I'd check the chronograph. I don't know what my new 43lb. one shoots. I'll chrono it this weekend. Rich B.
I just chronographed my 62" 60#@27 A&H ACS CX w/ 525 grain arrows at 202 - 210 fps and my 58" 59#@27 Centaur Double carbon w/ same arrow at 204-216. So, youre numbers are low. Recheck chrono.
I am surprised that the GT5575 fly better for you with the lighter head. I use those with 175gr BH's and another 30gr weight inserts for a 30" arrow with my 66#@29" draw Acadian Woods. See what speed you get going down to GT3555's.
Snag,
I would check the chrono because you have to be getting some serious power out of that 52# bow to have to shoot 55/75 GT's out of it with only a 125gr point.
Comber.
I agree with Comber, That shaft should need more weight up front for a #52 bow. If it is shooting well with 125s you are putting out some awesome power.
I weighed the arrows w/ 125 gr. tips they are 550gr. The chrono is working perfect. Tested it again...same results.
What I don't understand is when I put more weight up front the arrow flight gets worse. With 5575s you should be able to shoot with a lot more weight than only 125gr. I lowered the brace height, as Larry recommended, to 7". Nock height is 5/8". I need to bring nock height up though.
What do the 55/75 weigh per inch? I wouldn't think you could get an arrow that heavy with only a 125 gr. field point.
Mark
Yeah, their scales must be off! Without the tips that works out to over 14gr per inch. Can't be!
I have never had a bow that was so difficult to set up and tune with arrows. It is cut 3/16" past center w/ a plate that brings it back to center. So, it should be able to shoot a wide range of spines well. I'm about ready to put the carbons away and bring out aluminum or wood. Anyone want a kingwood riser ACS-CX with 2 sets of limbs?
Wait til you get the Morrison limbs for that new riser of yours. It is WAY easier to shoot and set up. Well, it was for me, anyway!
Mark
Mine really likes Axis 400s.
But hey if you want to give it away, I'll PM you my address. :bigsmyl:
QuoteOriginally posted by snag:
... I am using the chrono at the local archery shop so I know it is right on.
Does the shop regularly calibrate it? Anybody know how you calibrate a chrono?
I'd try a similar draw weight bow through the same chrono using the exact same arrow.
If that bow also seems a little slow, it could show a chrono issue.
We tested one of my bows indoors last winter,got some waybad fast #s,put a worklite up over it and then it read the same believable #s as the other one we shot outdoors...........
I owned an Adcock ACS/CX, 53#@28" that consistantly shot 185-190 fps w/ 5575s, I draw 28". Don't recall the arrow weight but I remember using the brass weight behind the insert along w/ 125gr tip. I'm guessing the weight was close to 500 gr.
It was a quick bow but a fussy one as to spine & arrow selection.
I've got an ACS CX that is 64" 53# @ 30". Shoots a 340 black max with 225 gr insert and head that weighs 566 gr. It shoots 'em 180-183 fps every time. 7 1/4" brace height and 5/8" nock set. But, I have another one that is 64" 58# @ 30 shooting a 300 axis that weighs 590 and it only does about 185-187. I had a friend who had one that was 57# @ 27" and it shot a 490 gr arrow at 170 fps. He wasn't impressed either so he sold it. The only thing we could figure was with his shorter draw, he wasn't getting the full power stroke that the limbs are capable of. I havn't had any trouble with tuning either of my bows except that they took a stiffer spined arrow than I would have guessed. I'm sorry your having so much trouble.
Cade
One thing you might try on the chrono is to screw some steel blunts into the arrows. I find it is much easier to get consistent readings.
That arrow should be right at 425 grains, maybe 10 grains more. Thats what my 30.25" 3555s weigh with 125 grains up front. At 9 gr/lb, I'm getting about 185 out of my homemade RD longbow, that's about 50# at almost 29. Would think you'd get better than 170. Good luck.
My 52# ACS-CX had to have a carbon express 350 (that's right a 350) heritage cut to 29" with nothing but a 125gr point up front. Chronoed in the high 190's. Anything weaker than that and it would not fly straight.
I have never shot any longbow or recurve in that weight that needed any stiffer than a 150 or a gold tip 35/55 before or since.
Thanks for the info. guys. I think I will cut these 29.5" down to 29" and try it again. It can't be my draw length cause I checked that at 28".
What string silencers are you using?
They are very light weight llama hair silencers. I really like them. They have made this bow very quiet w/out adding much weight to the string. I am going to put them on all my bows. This morning I went back to square one. I worked on the nock point and arrived at 7/8". I then cut down those shafts 1/4" at a time and went from 29.5" to 29". They were flying slightly weak with 125gr. I still can't figure out how some of you guys get the tip weight up to +200gr without them showing way weak. I think I can maybe go up to 150gr. with fletched arrows. I also worked on my grip and found one that the bow likes! That really changed the arrow flight instantly. Maybe because I have shot a recurve for so long this has been a hard change for me...? I seem to be learning...some are just slower learners than others. Thank you for all your help. I do appreciate it. Without you guys to sound off on and get ideas and recommendations from this would really be a lot harder.
With these changes I will chrono it again. I am going to go to a different archery shop and try their chrono machine to compare.
The ACS/CX experience I had was a little over 3 years ago, shortly after OL came out with the "CX" version. The bow I owned shot GTs okay but not the best arrow flight no matter how I weighted them. The best arrow flight came from a barrel tapered sitka spruce arrow. I got to rummaging around the shop and by golly I found one these arrows that I shot w/ the acs. This shaft is spined about 73#s, cut to 29.5" b.o.p., with a 125gr point. The weight is 566gr. The velocity wasn't quite as high with those arrows but arrow flight was about perfect, the best arrow flight I got out of that bow.
I have only one of these barrel tapered arrows left and have no real use for it. If you'd like to try it PM me your address and I'll throw it in a tube and mail it to you. Doug
Thanks for the offer Doug. I have some 70-74# spruce shafts I will try.
I cut some off these GTs and got them down to 29". I also remembered that I had put some weight tubes and screw in weights in these arrows! Took them out and just put 125gr tips on and with setting up the bow I got much better arrow flight. I don't know their weight now. Probably around 420gr., which equates to a little more than 8gr per inch. The chrono with the lighter arrows was 185fps. Gained 15fps. But more importantly is the arrow flight and the consistancy!
I'd bet part of your speed gain was in the good flight! Glad ya got er goin right! :thumbsup:
I noticed several posts remarking their best flight from these bows came using wood shafts. Bob Burton of Whispering Wind Arrows talked about this awhile back, saying bows that are cut way past center have more arrow flight issues with the small diameter carbon shafts. Wondering if building out that arrow rest would give better results with the CX when shooting carbons? This would move the center of the carbon shaft out to the left, more closely matching how the wood shafts line up with the side plate in the original position.
I built out my rest and shoot axis 400/500's w/100gr brass insert upfront and 125 point, total weight is 465. It has improved the flight tremendously. My ACS CX is 47#@28", I have not run it through a chrono yet, but to the eye it out shoots my 54# Silvertip recurve.
What is a good way of building out the rest? I use velcro or seal skin now for the side and the shelf. Should I just put 2 layers on the side?
What I've done with my other bows is take a short piece of new leather shoe string and split it in half length ways. If I use an old leather shoe string I don't split it, as the stretching usually thins it down to the thickness I'm looking for. I put a little barge cement on the short length (1/2" or less) of leather string, lift the side plate and insert it in the vertical position so that it lines up with the deepest part of the throat of the grip. I repeat this with the shelf rug, putting the short piece of string at a 90 degree angle to the arrow shelf, again in line with the deepest part of the grip. I usually wrap some dental floss around the riser several times to keep everything tight and in place until the barge cement dries. It's always worked great.
How about some double-side adhesive tape and then putting velcro over that? I have some tape that is about an 1/8" in thickness. I don't know if it will hold the velcro on though.
You need to build it out in one spot, not the entire plate, I slid a matchstick behind the velcro plate that came on the bow, that's all it took.
I did not read all the post but those numbers are wrong. I have a 45# Bear K-Mag and at 9gpp drawing to 28"s it does 176fps, so I am sure the chrono was screwy. Shawn
Thanks Limbow I'll try that before I go to replacing the velcro.
Have someone else shoot it thru the chrony. People can vary a lot in the release. If you creep that drops speed a lot too.
Also do you have tight nocks, this can slap off 10 Fps easy,
Draw the cx to anchor, and have someone mark the arrow at the front of the bow,then measure it.or mark the arrow at 28" and have someone witness where you are drawing it to.
Pete
For a 550 grain arrow and 170 fps from a 52# bow, those are exceptional numbers from that bow. You are getting over 35 pounds of ke and really good momentum as well. That comes out to 10.57 grains/lb.
One more little factor,while chronying some bows last spring.One of the guy's at my shop was getting 7-9 ft.per.sec.faster from the same bow and same arrow length then the rest of us.Video tape showed us he just had a super clean release real smooth..I thought that may play a little into well 7-9 ft per maybe pending on how clean the shooter gets off the string.We tested the same bow same arrow same length draw with a machanical release and it was about 10-12 ft per sec.faster..... Maybe???????????? bd
If you are wanting to chrono a bow at 28" you must actually make a mark on the shelf of the bow directly above the throat of the bow. This is the only spot bow to bow that will be consistant because the back of a bow will very in distance from the throat, bow to bow. For instance you may have a bow where the back is 2" from the thoat of the bow so if you draw an arrow that is marked 28" from the inside of the nock, then on that particular bow you will actually only be drawing it to 27 3/4". This is where many people do not standardize and they short draw some bows and over draw others. The standard for depth of shelf as far as measuring is concerned is 1 3/4". To do this correctly you make a mark on the shelf directly above the throat of the bow. If you want to measure the bow at 28" then you mark the arrow at 26 1/4" from the inside of the nock. You then draw the arrow back until the mark lines up with mark on the bow directly above the throat. Now you are comparing apples to apples as far as draw length is concerned. Many mis-accurate readings are done because people just do not know any better.
Thanks, Jim Neaves
Jim I'm slow so explain to me what the throat is? Like a pic maybe? I like pics.LOL <><
Yes, Jim makes a good point about the throat of grip and 26-1/4" measurement. I believe the ACS-CX is only 1-1/2" out from the throat to the back of the shelf. So the 1-3/4" out from the throat is actually 1/4" before getting to the shelf.
Frank, the throat is the deepest part of the grip.
Most ACS-CX's drawn 28" should be doing around 190-195 fps at 9 gpp, and 180-185 fps at 10 gpp.... regardless of the bow poundage.
Snag, be patient and build that sideplate out so that the right side of the shaft is lined up with the center-line of the string. Work on getting the best bareshaft flight you can and your patience will be rewarded with one of the best shooting bows available.
Piney,,,Is the distance you mention do-able on any spine configuration? I notice my Beman MFX Classic 500 showing a little weak out of my 52#@25" CX,,, don't wanna cut if I can get away with buliding out the side plate to compensate. Sorry for the hijack snag,,, glad your tune is gettin better though.
When it comes to bows that are cut PAST center (like the ACS) I usually only go out as far as the right side of the shaft (for RH shooter). But there are many bows that are only cut TO center and the shaft obviously sits out further from the string center. Doesn't matter though, just need to adjust length or point weight and they tune fine. Don't forget.... lowering the brace height makes the shaft act stiffer and raising the brace makes the shaft act weaker, doesn't take much if you're already real close.
Pinelander, I question why you would purposely take an arrow out of centerline to the string. Why not center the arrow on the string if the bow window is cut to do that? I do and with the correct spine get absolute perfect arrow flight. If you go to the right side then you have to use an arrow that is less spine so that it flexes around the window. Sorry but that does not make any sense to me. Could you explain.
Thanks Steve and Happy New Year everyone