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Main Boards => Trad History/Collecting => Topic started by: johnnyrazorhead on January 31, 2012, 12:24:00 PM

Title: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: johnnyrazorhead on January 31, 2012, 12:24:00 PM
Picked this bow up a little while ago and wanted to share it with everyone here.I know how much we all like these old Bear bows.I initially thought it was a one-of-a-kind bow but have since come to learn that there are a couple at least very similar to it in existence.One is in the Pope & Young Museum another Tradganger told me,and the other is in a private collection.Haven't personally seen either of them other than some pictures of the one in the museum.The other I was told has no coin,standard green tip overlays and black and white riser overlays.I do not believe it is marked EXP.
 Anyhow,here is what I believe to be an experimental 1961 Kodiak Magnum with white glass.Although it sports a pewter coin,it more closely resembles a '61 Magnum than a '62 in my opinion.It has the purple-heart I-beam like many '61 K'Mags I've seen.Bow once belonged to a former Bear employee who has since passed away.Neat little bow in great shape.
 (http://i475.photobucket.com/albums/rr118/johnnyrazorhead/CopyofKevinsGrumleyandEXPMag012.jpg)
 (http://i475.photobucket.com/albums/rr118/johnnyrazorhead/KevinsGrumleyandEXPMag019.jpg)
 (http://i475.photobucket.com/albums/rr118/johnnyrazorhead/KevinsGrumleyandEXPMag013.jpg)
 (http://i475.photobucket.com/albums/rr118/johnnyrazorhead/KevinsGrumleyandEXPMag015.jpg)
 (http://i475.photobucket.com/albums/rr118/johnnyrazorhead/KevinsGrumleyandEXPMag016.jpg)
 (http://i475.photobucket.com/albums/rr118/johnnyrazorhead/KevinsGrumleyandEXPMag018.jpg)
 (http://i475.photobucket.com/albums/rr118/johnnyrazorhead/KevinsGrumleyandEXPMag017.jpg)
 (http://i475.photobucket.com/albums/rr118/johnnyrazorhead/KevinsGrumleyandEXPMag014.jpg)
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: Big Bird on January 31, 2012, 12:32:00 PM
It looks more like a 61 to me,great find.
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: OldSkoolArcher on January 31, 2012, 12:45:00 PM
John, Awesome Bow!! Gotta love the unique ones.

I have a '61 K-Mag 29# with purpleheart but standard glass. Would be interesting to see them side-by-side. My 29# seems alot thinner and lighter overall than standard K-Mags.
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: Jack Shanks on January 31, 2012, 12:53:00 PM
John,

 The 27# is rare in itself.
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: johnnyrazorhead on January 31, 2012, 01:06:00 PM
Yes it is a tiny bow.It did belong to a female employee at Bear so hence the light weight.I will be getting a '63 or '64 Tamerlane that belonged to her too.It's 63" but I forget the weight although I know it's light.I am looking forward to shooting it to help improve my form.
 I won't be shooting this one.
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: Mike Shaw on January 31, 2012, 01:16:00 PM
John, Holy cow!! that is a cool bow for sure! I know of only one other Mag with white glass and I'm still saving my money for it.    :banghead:  
Thanks for sharing and when you get tired of caring for that cool bow, you know where I live!    :p
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: zepnut on January 31, 2012, 01:50:00 PM
Nice bow John.  Seen one other Ko. Mag with white glass. Let it slip through my fingers.  :knothead:
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: yellow bow on January 31, 2012, 05:15:00 PM
Cool bow.    :cool:
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: 4runr on January 31, 2012, 05:57:00 PM
Very cool!
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: d. ward on February 01, 2012, 08:13:00 AM
holy smokes Johnnyboy thats a dandy right there for sure bd
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: d. ward on February 01, 2012, 08:35:00 AM
bye the way John I have a list somewhere with all the different combo's of 1961 Kodiaks and Kodiak Magnums.Will I be able to add another combo to the list with the pics of your new find ? believe it or not the 1961 Kodiaks and Kodiak Mags had more combo's of wood and glass color then any other bow.
Want to do a list of the different combo's of 1961's ? my first by far and what I believe to be one of the most beautiful bows ever built.The 1961 Kodiak with figured bubinga side slabs deep purple(hey thats a great name for a rock band) purple heart I beam with black coated pewter coin.Thats the gem of gems IMHO.What say yee ? bd
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: johnnyrazorhead on February 01, 2012, 10:22:00 AM
Bowdoc- I do agree those '61 Kodiaks with Deep Purple(Rock on!)purple-heart sight windows are a thing of beauty,but the ones with nicely figured walnut side slabs and purple-heart sight window,along with a pewter coin,are pretty easy on the eyes too.Makes a nice companion to the white glass Magnum don't you think?
 Bowdoc-don't forget I still need your shirt/jacket measurements!
   (http://i475.photobucket.com/albums/rr118/johnnyrazorhead/1961KodiakandKodiakMagnum001.jpg)
   (http://i475.photobucket.com/albums/rr118/johnnyrazorhead/1961KodiakandKodiakMagnum004.jpg)
   (http://i475.photobucket.com/albums/rr118/johnnyrazorhead/1961KodiakandKodiakMagnum003.jpg)
   (http://i475.photobucket.com/albums/rr118/johnnyrazorhead/1961KodiakandKodiakMagnum002.jpg)
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: Missaukee on February 01, 2012, 03:31:00 PM
This is at the P & Y Museum. I believe it must be a Bubinga handle? or tropical walnut as in Johns bows (Can the walnut handle 78# (I don't think)). I don't remember if it had silkscreens (I am thinking it didn't or I would have taken a pic). I am also not sure if it was I-beam.
  (http://i958.photobucket.com/albums/ae64/Missaukee/1961%20Kodiak%20Magnum%20EXP/100_4632-1.jpg)
  (http://i958.photobucket.com/albums/ae64/Missaukee/1961%20Kodiak%20Magnum%20EXP/100_4586-1.jpg)
  (http://i958.photobucket.com/albums/ae64/Missaukee/1961%20Kodiak%20Magnum%20EXP/100_4584-1.jpg)
  (http://i958.photobucket.com/albums/ae64/Missaukee/1961%20Kodiak%20Magnum%20EXP/100_4585-1.jpg)
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: johnnyrazorhead on February 02, 2012, 06:31:00 PM
Don,
 Great pictures of the twin to my bow,although it's at the other end of the weight spectrum.What a little beast.Hard to believe you had taken pictures of that particular bow at the P&Y Museum and then mine shows up.Great little bows although I don't care for the white glass as much as the green glass the production bows had.Thanks for posting the pics.
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: bowhawk archer on February 02, 2012, 07:41:00 PM
Sweet looking bow John.
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: sticknstring+ on February 03, 2012, 12:23:00 AM
Sweet EXP
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: johnnyrazorhead on February 03, 2012, 12:53:00 AM
sticknstring+
 I recently drooled over the thread showcasing all those wonderful Bill Stewart bows you have and noticed the little '62 Kodiak Magnum has the same writing style on it as this white glass Magnum.The "exp" is identical as are the length and weight specs.Wonder who wrote those on the bows.The group of bows you have is remarkeable.It would have been great to be working in the Bear R&D dept. back then wouldn't it?
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: Missaukee on February 03, 2012, 02:23:00 PM
I just wish I had taken the bow outside to get better pictures!
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: sticknstring+ on February 03, 2012, 04:20:00 PM
Bahaha ! John you just took the words right out of my mouthI took a comparison pic last night as soon as I saw your post. They are definitely the same person. I was wondering  (daydreaming) if it could be Bill Stewarts penmanship himself. I have a few different things from his shop that he had written on that I'll check out. I love your collection and am really happy you found that beautiful EXP Magnum!
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: sticknstring+ on February 03, 2012, 04:27:00 PM
P.S. Heck yes! That R&D department was doing the same thing as the car companies of the sixties... Making  Badazz Hot Rods!
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: johnnyrazorhead on February 03, 2012, 08:16:00 PM
sticknstring+(Greg)- I wondered too if Bill Stewart wrote those specs on the bows as well.Hard to say.I talked to a gentleman that worked in the R&D Dept. and although he is very talented himself he spoke very highly of some other bowyers he worked with at the time.one of them inparticular was Owen Jeffrey.I will have to see if he worked with Bill Stewart as well.He may know who wrote the specs on the bows.
 Thanks for the kudos on the collection and the K'Mag,but it has taken me years to find half the unique Bear bows that came out of Bear that you found in one fell swoop.That must have been an amazing feeling to open each of those boxes and anticipate what each one held.Yes,the R&D Dept.was really at the top of their game back then.If I ever make it out to Oregon,I'm stoppin' over!!

 Missaukee-Yes,some outdoor pics of that little Magnum would have been great.Maybe next time.Still some great photos and thanks again for including them with this thread.
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: Hobow on February 04, 2012, 09:08:00 AM
Awesome bow John!  Are one off/unique bows the focus of your collection or are you just getting lucky with these gems?  

Thank you for sharing!
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: johnnyrazorhead on February 04, 2012, 09:46:00 AM
Hobow-That's a good question.I,like alot of other collectors,really enjoy collecting nice,clean examples of some of Bear's classic production bows,either to shoot or to simply enjoy.But over the years I have come to aquire a few what I like to call "oddball" bows.Bows maybe not necessarily experimental or prototypes but not the run of the mill Bear bow.For example,I have a couple of real heavyweight Kodiaks,one being a 123# 1959 Kodiak.I doubt it was an experiment but Bear simply filling an order for someone that wanted an extremely heavy bow.It's unique in appearance due to it's massive proportions and wedge sight window.I have seen or owned several Kodiaks with this wedge sight window so that's not really a one-of-a-kind feature,but 123# '59 Kodiaks are quite uncommon.On the other hand I do have some rather unique experimental and protype bows that I have been fortunate to come across,like this white glass Kodiak Magnum.I have posted pictures of some of the other unique Bear bows in my collection on this forum in the past for others to enjoy as I do.After seeing all those wonderful Bill Stewart bows that sticknstring+ showed us all,it really stirred my interest even more in the brainstorming that was coming out of Grayling back then.Fred had some very talented people working for him at the time and it shows in these bows.
 So,to answer your question(finally)I would say the answer to both of your questions is "yes".Lately my focus has been on these one off/unique bows that I have shown and I have gotten lucky in aquiring a couple lately.But they have always been some of my favorite bows in my collection as well as in others.I'm waiting for sticknstring+(Greg) to send me all of his Bill Stewart bows now to keep my lucky streak going.C'mon Greg,you don't want to break my streak now,do you? LOL
 When I get some time I am going to try to post all of my oddball bows in one thread,like sticknstring+ did,just to make it easier to view them all for anyone interested.  :wavey:
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: oldbohntr on February 04, 2012, 11:25:00 AM
That EXP magnum in the Museum was my bow.  It's one of three EXP magnums that I picked up from one family in the early 90s.  I still have one and will post some pics of it later in the day.
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: johnnyrazorhead on February 04, 2012, 11:48:00 AM
Tom,
 Sounds like a nice catch of bows.Wish I had known about that other one in the museum beforehand,I would have a nice set of bookends.
  Tom,you have a PM.
   John
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: oldbohntr on February 04, 2012, 02:53:00 PM
Well, it’s interesting that the museum still has my black/white tag on the bow after all these years.    None of the three was in very good shape.   All were a bit different, glass colors, overlays, etc.   But all had nice small tips, like the ’59-60 Kodiak Deluxe, and it’s interesting that the ’61 magnum came out with the wider tips that we saw in the other  sixties Bears.  The deceased Bear employee whose family I got them from,  apparently used his stuff pretty hard.   He was a huge man, the Bear camo clothes and boots that I also got were big enough for at least two of me!    And he had apparently drawn all these experimental mags quite a long distance…all were badly checked with finish in generally poor condition.   I never liked the Magnum bow model very much anyway, so I wasn’t overly concerned with keeping more than one.    But, I would never turn down an EXP Bear, regardless of model or condition.   I let the museum have the best one, and traded away the second best, so my remaining one is pretty rough.    
Actually I’m going to list another EXP model on the classifieds later today.  It’s kind of interesting too.  

 (http://i1214.photobucket.com/albums/cc483/oldbohntr/Bearmagexp1.jpg)

 (http://i1214.photobucket.com/albums/cc483/oldbohntr/Bearmagexp2.jpg)

 (http://i1214.photobucket.com/albums/cc483/oldbohntr/Bearmagexp3.jpg)

 (http://i1214.photobucket.com/albums/cc483/oldbohntr/Bearmagexp4.jpg)

 (http://i1214.photobucket.com/albums/cc483/oldbohntr/Bearmagexp5.jpg)

 (http://i1214.photobucket.com/albums/cc483/oldbohntr/Bearmagexp6.jpg)
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: Hobow on February 04, 2012, 03:24:00 PM
John, I think that would be a great idea.  I love seeing all bows but low production or one off unique models are the best.  I am lucky to live in the NW which has a rich archery history of it's own, but when it comes to Bear Archery you Michigan guys have it made.

Sticknstring+, your thread of  Bill Stewart bows is amazing and I kick myself because I heard after the fact that it was on display at the Traditional Archers of Oregon banquet a couple of years back and I wasn't able to attend...  

Oldbohntr, The grip on that brown glass Magnum is interesting, I love the thin limbs and early style tips.

Thank you all for sharing!
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: sticknstring+ on February 04, 2012, 04:22:00 PM
John that would be great if you could get some inside info from Mr. Jeffrey! As far as the feeling that day opening those boxes awesome is a good start! I thought I would pick 2-3 out if the lot and be pretty happy. Ah ya right... Every bow was/is  in near perfect condition, virtually untouched and no fading. I couldn't choose, and after a couple of hours and finding the EXP for a serial numbers and the R&D/Bill Stewart writing on the boxes ( and a quick google search that almost gave me a heart attack!) I realized I had to  keep them together and made a deal to buy them all. Long story short I really didn't know exactly what each box held for awhile. The fun was really drawn out as I dove into the history of the recurve and learned about the legends of my sport and what a key role Bill Stewart played. 
  If your ever anywhere close to this coast please do stop bye!! 
  As far as your lucky streak goes I was thinking almost the same thing... except I thought maybe your proto/EXP's could come this way (back to the rest of there Stewart/Bear family) and revitalize my lucky streak! Lol
I would love to see you post your collection  pics together in a single thread!

Oldbohntr  can't wait to see your pics! Do you know any of the back story on how the family acquired the EXP Magnums?
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: oldbohntr on February 04, 2012, 08:31:00 PM
Yes.
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: CavScoutArcher on February 04, 2012, 10:16:00 PM
Purdy........awesome find and a great addition to any collection!
Title: Re: Not one of a kind but close
Post by: sticknstring+ on February 05, 2012, 03:07:00 AM
Quote
Originally posted by oldbohntr:
Yes.
Wow! That's so interesting and helpful.  I'll add that to the other info I've gathered about the some of the other EXP's that got away from Mr. Stewarts stash. Thanks for sharing