Trad Gang
Main Boards => Trad History/Collecting => Topic started by: PAPALAPIN on August 28, 2010, 10:11:00 PM
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What is the cost of a one of a kind 1966 protype of the '67 Super Kodiak
(http://i1019.photobucket.com/albums/af320/PAPALAPIN/th_COSTOFAPROTOTYPE.jpg)61# Browning Cobra II & Green Stripe Custom Takedown with 70# green tip limbs (http://s1019.photobucket.com/albums/af320/PAPALAPIN/?action=view¤t=COSTOFAPROTOTYPE.jpg)
What do you get for that?
(http://i1019.photobucket.com/albums/af320/PAPALAPIN/th_66PrototypeA.jpg) (http://s1019.photobucket.com/albums/af320/PAPALAPIN/?action=view¤t=66PrototypeA.jpg)
1966 Kodiak with all Phenolic riser, no caps, and standard '66 Brown glass
(http://i1019.photobucket.com/albums/af320/PAPALAPIN/th_BEAR66PROTOTYPEVII.jpg) (http://s1019.photobucket.com/albums/af320/PAPALAPIN/?action=view¤t=BEAR66PROTOTYPEVII.jpg)
This is a historic event...not because of the one of a kind bow...but because I finally got to figure out PhotoBucket. By the grace of God and a computer genius son, I finally did it.
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Congratulations Jack! Figuring out PhotoBucket is a son of a gun! Oh, nice bow too! LOL
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Yeah...figuring out photBucket surpasses getting the bow.
The good news is that I have finally figured out PhotoBucket.
The bad news is that I have finally figured out PhotoBucket.
Only time will tell what kind of monster I have unleashed.
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Looks like two milestones passed. Congrats on both!
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Jack -
Nice going on both counts.
Welcome to the 21st century and the world of digital images in your posts. All the gyrations with loading images on Photobucket then copying and pasting the link in a post can be confusing, especially the first few hundred times. :rolleyes:
Glad the Kodiak prompted you to go through the pain of figuring out photobucket.
Guess the first questions would be... Is the bow built on the same form as the 1966 Kodiak? And do you have have a 66 Kodiak of the same length to make an exact comparison?
In one of the images the previous owner posted of your Phenolic Riser 66, it looked like there was a black lamination between the maple core lamination and black phenolic. Or was that just the light in the photograph?
During the 1990s, I remember seeing an early phenolic riser Bear, that was made before the Super Kodiak. The riser was brown phenolic if I remember correctly. I don't remember now which year form that bow was built on. Will have to call the owner and have him refresh my memory on that bow.
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The story behind the discovery
Dyebow had a Dale Dye bow for sale. (Uh, can you figure how he came up with his online name)
He was contacted by a guy that had just won a '66 Kodiak with factory camo on e8ay. He asked Dyebow if he would take it in trade for his Dale Dye. The guy had just won it and had not yet made shipping arrangements. Dyebow agreed to that trade so the guy had the seller ship it straight to Dyebow. He never even saw it.
When the bow came in, Dyebow decided that he did not like the factory camo so he decided to strip it. He was removing the paint wit MinWax paint remover. He started removing th pain in one spot expecting to see the standard wood, but came up with solid black. He figured it was a black undercoat that just would not come off. He continued on that spot for a while but was getting no where. He removed more paint on the riser until he came up wit this.
(http://i1019.photobucket.com/albums/af320/PAPALAPIN/66PrototypeE.jpg)
About now was when he realized that he had something other than a standard '66 Kodiak Camo bow.
Eventually the situation found its way to this Forum under the following URL (worth a read to catch up)
http://tradgang.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=14;t=004102
somewher in there I made a commet that I would swap him for any two of my Bear bows, with the exception of two, and any Bear collector would probably make him that same offer. I was just trying to emphasize the rareity of what he had. I had no thoughts of ending up with the bow. I also stated that I would like to see more pictures and hear the story of how he came by it, figuring he would post it on the discussion thread.
Next thing I know, I got an e-mail from him with additional pictures, and the story I told above. He also stated that he was interested in knowing what two bows I would be eilling to swap for.
I sent him many pictures of bows I though would interest him from the group pictired here.
(http://i1019.photobucket.com/albums/af320/PAPALAPIN/HALFMYBOWS.jpg)
This is about 1/2 my collection and some of the bow pics I sent him are on other racks.
Dyebow (aka TOM) and I talked and traded e-mails for a couple of days and had pretty much settled on my Greenstripe takedown with 70# limbs, plus cash from him...well, that was before he got flooded with e-mail offers from other collectors here for swaps and out right purchases. I finally stepped up and offered an even swap for my takedown. He said that was acceptable but wanted to wait a couple of hours to think about it. I made him a three minute offer to throw in a 61# Browning Cabra I to seal the deal right now. He accepted that. Tom would have made a great horse trader. Tom is a great guy amd was great to deal with. I could have gotten a lot better trade if all the other collectors would have stayed out of it, but that's what gave tom his negatiating room.
I think we both left the trade happy campers. I hope he jumps in hers and corrects any misstatements I may have made.
I will post more pictures of the bow later.
Tom, thanks for trading to me.
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Jack,
I believe you may have misunderstood me on the phone, I didn't say prototypes had a "P"... for the serial number...
I mentioned that many of the Experimental Bear bows have "EXP" written on them.
I'm guessing all you heard was the "P" and that you were so excited about this bow, that you were on overload when we talked. That's understandable.
Your serial number is 6L2236
That is a 100% typical serial number for a 60" 1966 Kodiak
For 1966, the serial number means...
The "6" means 1966
The "L" means 60" Kodiak
The 2236 is the number of the bow in the sequential numbering of the 60" 1966 Kodiaks
The serial numbering pattern changed many times through the production of the Kodiaks from 1950 through 1966. It is going to take several pages in the book to explain all the changes for all the years for all the Bear bows.
I have a 60" 1966 Kodiak with the serial number 6L3156, which logically was made 1,120 after your 6L2236 bow was made.
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Jack -
In trying to classify bows in a consistent and understandable manner, I try to identify each bow by using the year of the form the bow was built on.
A good example is the
1957 White Glass Kodiak
It is the identical bow to the 1957 brown glass Kodiak, it just has white glass.
Your bow was made on a 1966 Kodiak form and has a 1966 Kodiak serial number. Accurately it would be correctly called a
1966 Kodiak Phenolic Riser.
There actually was at least one Prototype / Experimental of the Super Kodiak that was made.
It has a completely different riser than a 1966 Kodiak. And although it has a different riser than the 67-1/2 Super Kodiak, it is noticeably similar to the 67-1/2 Super Kodiak.
I'm not trying to take anything away from your bow, it is just plain cool in its own right.
I'm just trying to get all of us to speak a common and understandable language by making reference to bows made on the same form, as being the same year bows, which in fact they are.
Hope I haven't over explained this to the point of confusion.
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Jack,
Congrats on getting the bow. Very Cool.
I guess Bear Workers in 1966 were feeling creative....
(http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b14/COVEJEEPSXJ/64inKodiak002.jpg)
(http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b14/COVEJEEPSXJ/64inKodiak003.jpg)
(http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b14/COVEJEEPSXJ/64inKodiak005.jpg)
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Nice'un Old School
Wade
As soon as I can I will get some good pics with my '65. '66 Kodiaks, and my '68 Super K. I don't have a '67 Black Knight...well I guess I have a 66 Black Knight now.
The history of these bows are so interesting. The one you pictured that was Bowdoc's. the one above from Old School, and below is a picture of what is supposed to be the "Red Kodiak". but I don't think that is what it is.
(http://i1019.photobucket.com/albums/af320/PAPALAPIN/RedKodiak1.jpg)
The bow I have was in circulation for 44 years and no one had a clue what was under the paint until Tom discovered it. How many '66 Camo Kodiaks might be hiding a semilar treasure. I'll bet everyone that has one and has seen these posts is getting out the Acetone.
Doc told me that there were some '64 Kodiaks that had rosewood risers, and Bear painted them and sold them as Camo model just to not release them to the public as rosewood models. I have a 45# '64 Kodiak so withing 5 minutes of getting off the phone with him I had removed the arrow plate off and was rubbing in Acetone. My heart raced as the first thing that came up was black. Whoaaaa..a '64 Phenolic Kodiak? No, a layer of black under coating. A little more rubbing revealed Bubinga. I had to know, and now I have another arrow plate orderd to cover the spot.
In any case, they are what they are. A one of a kind, or run of the mill...I never met a recurve I din't like.
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OldSkoolArcher -
For you 64" 1966 Kodiak
The "6" means 1966 just like Jack's bow
The "S" means 64" Kodiak
All of the 64" 1966 Kodiaks that I remember seeing and have recorded also starts with a 6S serial number.
On your bow, I am uncertain exactly what the "8II" designates. It may mean 811 or something entirely different.
You need to remember that anyone could write any thing on any bow at any time when the bow is made or later. That's why I have never accepted serial numbers as an absolute.
The #1 absolute in determining the year of any Bear bow is the form it was built on.
Once the bow is built, that can not be changed and is forever the DNA of a bow...
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Wade Thanks.
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:bigsmyl: I know why Tom wanted a green stripe!
And you are right jack he is a very nice guy .
Huntnfool
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They don't come much better
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Jack, Nice Looking Collection. Especially like those bow racks!
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Thanks Larry.
I have room to ad a nice dark '63 Kodiak Magnum Dogled if you know of one needing a home.
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Jack,
Congrats on the trade. On the pic of your collection, which bow is so important you have it covered?
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DC
That is a '63 60" Dogleg, in mint condition, with the most irredescent bubing I have ever seen on a bow. In th sunlight it shimmers with reflection.
It is the only one I keep covered to protect the luster.
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Congratulations, Jack. I wondered who would end up with that bow. I'm glad it got a good home..
Wade- you referred to the prototype Super K. Mr. Bear is shown in several photos shooting a phenolic Super that is considerably different than the final production models. It lacks the counter balancing cut in on the bottom limb and the bottom of the riser overlay is quite wide- similar to the later T/D in that area. Do you know anything about that bow? It is also featured on the cover of the first edition of The Archer's Bible.
Jack- congrats again- I didn't intend to hijack the thread. GY
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Not a problem Grant...it all falls under the topic.
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Grant - Sorry to report that I don't know anything about the whereabouts of the prototype Super Kodiak with the all phenolic riser that Fred is shown shooting. I've never seen it in person. Have only seen the photographs of it. It is a cool bow for sure and it is very noticeably different looking than the production 1967 Super Kodiak. Was really hoping that you might have that bow and could post some photographs of it for us. Who does have it?
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UH...maybe they disposed of it by camo painting it and selling it as a 66 camo Kodiak?
Man, can you imagine someone having "THAT" bow all these years and not knowing it...
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Jack - The prototype 1967 Super Kodiak that Fred is pictured with is a lot dif1ferent than a 1966 Kodiak. Of course, Fred was shooting it, and it was left handed. Doubt that it got sold as a camo bow, considering Fred's normal handy work on the risers. Hopefully it has survived and maybe someday it will actually surface and we can get a better look at it. You just never know what will pop up next.
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Yeah Wade, I understand that Fred had a habit of giving thos bows to special friends and business associates. No telling who got it, and where it ended up...but we can still dream.
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Jack and Wade- When Bill Krenz was a VP for Bear in the 90s, he found a barrel in the warehouse containing several of Fred's old bows which he cleaned up and displayed in his office. He told me that he asked Frank Scott why they weren't in the museum and Mr. Scott told him, "Oh no...Fred didn't want his bows on display because of his alterations to the grips and shelves" of his personal bows. The catalogue cover '59 that Mr. Bear is holding standing by the big brown bear was one of these bows, I believe. That '67 prototype was in a lot of ads and photos at the time but I've never seen another like it. I have a few of those pics, courtesy of Bill that I'll share but I can't transfer them to photobucket for posting here. I would be a neat bow to have- or even check out closely, for sure. Wade, you'll probably find it one of these days and then we can learn more about it. GY
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I expect that Fred had a brand new bow every year.
Musta been a tough job, but somebody had to do it.
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Jack,
What have you decided to do with this bow?
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Wow Jack! Great trade !!! I would love too see what the serial number says under that paint....hmm EXP maybe? Congrats on adding that sweetheart to your wonderful collection! Greg
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Congratulations, Jack! That is a great find. And I've learned a lot just by reading this thread.
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Philip
Personally I would not remove the rest of the Camo, As it is it tells the story of this bow in that it sat hidden under camo paint for 44 years until Tom decided to see what was under the paint.
It amazes me that someone could shoot this bow for that long and not realize there is a differennce between this now and a standard '66. The big difference in hand weight should have tipped them off to something. Common sense should say that the layer of camo paint would not add that much weight.
When I acquired it, I dubbed it the "Troy Kodiak" after Tom Troy who discovered this jewel under the camo paint. I hope Philip honors that name and continues to refer to as the Troy Kodiak.
I would do something to add some kind of finish where Tom reubbed a bit too much, but I would not remove any more of the camo. However, philip is now the new custodian of this piece of Bear history so I guess it is his call.
Take care of her Philip. It belongs in the collection of "Vintage Bears".
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Very cool stuff guys
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Originally posted by PAPALAPIN:
Philip
Personally I would not remove the rest of the Camo, As it is it tells the story of this bow in that it sat hidden under camo paint for 44 years until Tom decided to see what was under the paint.
It amazes me that someone could shoot this bow for that long and not realize there is a differennce between this now and a standard '66. The big difference in hand weight should have tipped them off to something. Common sense should say that the layer of camo paint would not add that much weight.
When I acquired it, I dubbed it the "Troy Kodiak" after Tom Troy who discovered this jewel under the camo paint. I hope Philip honors that name and continues to refer to as the Troy Kodiak.
I would do something to add some kind of finish where Tom reubbed a bit too much, but I would not remove any more of the camo. However, philip is now the new custodian of this piece of Bear history so I guess it is his call.
Take care of her Philip. It belongs in the collection of "Vintage Bears".
Thanks very much Jack. I'm on the fence about the camo finish with this bow.
I am thinking about bringing the bow to it's ORIGINAL condition.
It's original condition was NOT camo! The camo came later. I'll explain.
After thorough inspection, the bow has evidence of being finely sanded and varnished at Bear Archery just like a production model. It was clearly an R+D bow.
Ofcoarse I could be wrong on this.
It is my theory that this bow was initially going to be a 67 Kodiak and Bear Archery decided to not make one at all for 1967.
The decision was made to wait and introduce the ALL NEW 67 1/2 Super Kodiak with the black phenolic riser.
This is my opinion of this bow.
Once all decisions were made at Bear Archery, this bow was sent back to the factory area with instructions to camouflage it, weigh it and serialize and send it off to bear dealers as a 1966 Kodiak.
I could be wrong but I am confident that's how this bow came to be.
The bow has found a home on the wall sitting between a 1966 Kodiak and a 67 1/2 Super Kodiak.
It's like the missing link has been found........philip
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Your Call, Phil...you are the new custodiam. Personally, if I had a vote, I'd leave it like it is. You might want to get the opinions of serious collectors here to make up your mind.
Your "opinion" of how this bow came to be camopflaged might be right on. Bear had a habit of puting camo paint on some bows whenb they had "Something to hide", They routinely camoed blimished baws that were functionally solid. May have just had a discoloration or some slight defect that prevented them from being sold as a first line bow. When they got an order for a camo model, and had none ready to go, they would take a first run bow and camo it for the sale. I think the old catalogs adveetise the camo available at about a $10 extra charge. Great marketing idea instead of selling blemished bows at a discount. I am sure they did not want to sell these prototype bows as a one of a kinds so they camo painted them and passed them on.
The only one I know of that was sold without camo was the illusive "Red Kodiak" which I sawsold on **** years back by the original owner that bought it from Papa Bear. He wanted a new Kodiak in exactly 50# and there was none in the sales stock ready to go. Papa Bear said "Hold on a minute, I think I have something" He went in the back and came out with a Bow box containing the "Red Kodiak"
Anyway, that's the story the owner posted in the e8ay description. I bid on that bow but it got too hight for me and as I recall it went for about a grand. Anyone that has other info on the "Red Kodiak" or other prototypes should jump in and sher it here.
I'd also like to know theres opinions as to wehether Phil should strip it or leave it. Keep in mind that if he strips it, he can't put it back, and in stripping he may mess up the under finish and have to do a full refinish, then it is not original
Just my thoughts.
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Actually Phil, I passed it on to you because I felt you would take appropriate care of it. If I had thought you would strip it, it would still be on my wall. I felt it would get more exposure on your wall rather than ine because no one ever seel mine, I don't make Dnton Hill or other trad gettoghers, and you are a more promanent collector than I am.
However, you are the new custodian.
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This is JMO I would remove the camo and show the bow as it was meant to be. Just as Philip has stated the camo was put on to hide the fact that Bear was going to make a 67 model year and bailed at the last minute.
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Good morning my crazy Bear Collector friends.
Thank you all for commenting about the bow.
Really was very thoughtful of Jack to let me have it.
"To do or not to do", That is the question.
I'm not gonna do anything to the bow at this time. I'm gonna think about it a while.
Leave it alone with %20 of the camouflage gone already or remove the rest of the Camouflage and expose what Fred Bear and Bear Archery had in mind to do in 1967.
Initially, I personally would have not removed so much camo to take a peek. Perhaps behind the strike plate. It's OK though. Everything happens for a reason. This bow wanted to be SEEN and get a breath of fresh air.
Either way, the bow is what it is, camo or no camo. I like it very much and it's becoming one of my favorites in the collection.
Thanks for all your input.......Philip
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Jack.
I went back in this topic to look at the pics you have posted earlier and if you click on the picture it brings you to your Photobucket album. I don't know if that should be like that. Check it out. Does'nt seem right to me.
Anyway, here is what she looks like still.
(Jacks pics) I copied them because my camera sucks.
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/BEAR66PROTOTYPEVII-1.jpg)
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/66PrototypeD.jpg)
I think she is gonna look great between these bows. That's another proto 66 Kodiak in the middle. We can clearly see the direction Fred was taking with his bow designs.
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/1967.jpg)
Pretty extensive removal of the camo paint just to "take a peek" would'nt you say.
This is how I recieved the bow.
If the camo on this bow was not so extensively removed, I would'nt even consider it.
Regarding the HISTORY of the bow.
History cannot be changed........ only told.
This bow has been ALTERED before Jack and I recieved it. Extensively I might add.
I am not the most knowledgable or have a large collection as others but with respect,
You would be hard pressed to find a more passionate individual regarding Bear's history.
This bow and I'm sure there are others like it out there........ "is what it is".
This cannot be changed.
Someone also mentioned VALUE. The value is in it's beauty. Bows are only wood, glue and glass. But the sum total is magnificent!
That's what I value. Just me.......
Naturally, it should always be described as ONCE being painted over by Bear Archery to hide it's experimental construction. If I do bring it's ORIGINAL appearance back, I think it would be way cool to display it with a Bear Archery tag stating it's "Camo" past. Maybe a picture on the tag in it's "camo" days.
I so appreciate how you guy's continue to keep Fred Bear and his magical bows alive and well.
Someday and hopefully far from now, we'll be gone and a NEW bunch of collectors will have these "talks" and be as passionate about these VERY BOWS..........Philip
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holy crap Phil I know that one well beleave me I shot the snot out of that bow praticeing to arrow a fat bear in Quebec while hunting with Tommy using that bow and writeing an article about yes you guessed it hunting with vintage-bears.I will say this about that bow.It shoots every bit as good as it looks and the person I got that bow from told me it was a salemans sample and never really hit the market.Geezus I thought I never see that one again.........I love you man thanks for the trip down old bow menory lane Phil bd
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OK Don. Strip it or leave it alone.
JIM...It was not on the block. I did not so much sell it as transfer custody of it. Phil and I were actually talking about my Bear B riser and this one came into the conversation. My interest was not so much in making a "winfall profit" on it as much as it was to see that it was in good hands, but I did recoup my investment on it. Again, if I had thought Phil was gonna strip it, it would still be on my wall.
Just for the record. After my investment and shippin'/insurance to Phil, I am up about $38 on it.
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Often Historians have to lose something to gain information. If you want to learn about ancient cultures, you have to disturb burial sites. I don't own a factory camo bow, but I would like to, and I would not strip. However, by stripping this bow a very cool, possibly one of a kind bow was discovered. The info has been gained, other than what model it might be called. One could say that stripping all the factory camo bows could reveal a lot more. But, the only point would be if it were to be documented in a book. I don't see that happening, as many collectors are reluctant to share knowledge and end up taking it to their grave. I am not referring to Al Reader of course, as he was very generous with knowledge.
In the end, I see it as a bow that has had its factory camo ruined. I believe if I owned it I would strip it. I don't see any significance in the camo other than the fact that it was there, we know that. The significance is what was under the camo, that is the true spirit of the bow. I would however object to lowering the shelf, I think that should only be done to bows with holes or other damage! Good Luck with your decision.
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I don't post hear a lot but I do read almost every topic. Tough decesion to make leave the camo or see whats under it.
Glad it's not my decesion and congrats on your piece of history.
doug77
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Originally posted by Missaukee:
Often Historians have to lose something to gain information. If you want to learn about ancient cultures, you have to disturb burial sites. I don't own a factory camo bow, but I would like to, and I would not strip. However, by stripping this bow a very cool, possibly one of a kind bow was discovered. The info has been gained, other than what model it might be called. One could say that stripping all the factory camo bows could reveal a lot more. But, the only point would be if it were to be documented in a book. I don't see that happening, as many collectors are reluctant to share knowledge and end up taking it to their grave. I am not referring to Al Reader of course, as he was very generous with knowledge.
In the end, I see it as a bow that has had its factory camo ruined. I believe if I owned it I would strip it. I don't see any significance in the camo other than the fact that it was there, we know that. The significance is what was under the camo, that is the true spirit of the bow. I would however object to lowering the shelf, I think that should only be done to bows with holes or other damage! Good Luck with your decision.
Well said.....
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Don't be offended Jim, I was not implying that was your intention. Just stating that my intention was nothing financial, more of wanting to get it placed right. May have made a mistake for my purposes.
You and I do share a common opinion of what should be done with this one. Matter of fact, you kanda made me see the light. As I recall, when Tom first posted it it my initial reaction was to remove all of the camo. Comments by you and others changed my opinion.
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I certainly do appreciate all of the input (Pos/Neg) about the bow, even though Papalapin has made his public statement (twice) that he made a mistake.
I am not offended and it's forgotten in my mind.
I wish you ALL a Happy and Blessed Easter......Philip
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I actually made that statement once. But I also said "You da man now> Your call.
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Donnie "BD",
The 66 proto pictured does not belong to me.
My dear friend is the current owner.
It is pictured between my 66 and 67.
I posted it for referance to show where the black beauty will reside......Philip
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/1967.jpg)
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Point of clarification.
I tend to state things in such a way that people misunderstand my meaning, such as Jims misunderstanding my statement above.
I have no "Ill Will" toward Philip in any way. Just a strong difference in opinion.
Philip and I never really discussed the fate of the bow, which maybe we should have. If we had agreed that the bow would not be stripped, and then he changed his mind and went against our agreemnet, that would be a different story...but that is not the case. He is now the proud owner and custodian of this piece of history, so it is his decision as to what to do with it. I strongly hope he leaves it as is. If my statements sound rather strong about it "would still be hanging on my rack" it's becasue I fell strongly about what should be done with it. If I just said "I think it should stay as it is" then it would not dramatize how strongly I feel about the situation. That's all there is to it.
I had the honor of it hanging on my wall for a time and I really enjoyed having it...never shot it though.
I also hope that Philip will bring it to Denton Hill so others can see and enjoy it. I know I will never get to go there so at least maybe the bow will now.
One of my points is that if it is stripped, it can never be put back to the way it is now, and it can always be stripped later. But, once it's done, it's done.
I still love ya, brother...just hope you make the right decision. Remember...you are entitled to your own opinion, no matter how "WRONG" you are. In the long run, the only opinion that matters to me is "Mine"...LOL
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1. That is not "Left over 1966 brown glass" That is the color of the Kodiaks that year and this bow was made in '66. I KNOW Bear had black glass in stock that year, and other colors for that matter. Nothing "left over" about that color
2. That bow is not "Scarce". It is an only one of a kind. A mega collectible bow.
Bottem line here is that Philip is now the sole decision maker on this issue. If he does strip it I will have something to yank hs chain about.
I guess none of us should get our panties in a wad over it, although it probably seems that I have, but not really
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This bow could have a coat of finish placed over the factory camo. The bow with all its history is then protected and it can be shot as well. I did this with my last 66' camo, used a satin after fixing a few checks. It turned out great and it drills sweet arrows on target. The camo will help with hunting!
Taking the camo off? Why not just have a bow built like what you would like to remake this bow into. I know a guy that can make it for you.
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Steve
I think you totally missed the point.
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If in doubt....leave it alone. Another one might turn up and it can be stripped down.
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I think I have done Phil a disservice here.
While I have an opinion on what should be done with this unique piece of traditional history, it is his bow now and it is completely his call on what should be done with it. I lost my vote on it when I sold it to him.
Phil, I appologize for, and retract, my comments above. You have my blessing to handle it as you see fit.
Left alone, it will be a great example of Bear history. Stripped down it will be a beautiful additionto your collection.
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Come on, I wanna see what's under that green paint.
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Well stated...X2
Originally posted by Missaukee:
Often Historians have to lose something to gain information. If you want to learn about ancient cultures, you have to disturb burial sites. I don't own a factory camo bow, but I would like to, and I would not strip. However, by stripping this bow a very cool, possibly one of a kind bow was discovered. The info has been gained, other than what model it might be called. One could say that stripping all the factory camo bows could reveal a lot more. But, the only point would be if it were to be documented in a book. I don't see that happening, as many collectors are reluctant to share knowledge and end up taking it to their grave. I am not referring to Al Reader of course, as he was very generous with knowledge.
In the end, I see it as a bow that has had its factory camo ruined. I believe if I owned it I would strip it. I don't see any significance in the camo other than the fact that it was there, we know that. The significance is what was under the camo, that is the true spirit of the bow. I would however object to lowering the shelf, I think that should only be done to bows with holes or other damage! Good Luck with your decision.
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Leave it as you found it...there is no way you can ever bring it back to it's original state!
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She's looking better each day :thumbsup: .....Philip
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Hey Phil
It's your bow...it's your call
Either way it is still what it is...just don't shave off two pounds
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Update:
The process has begun.
The ruined camo paint has been completely removed. The bow has been protected well all these years and is like new. No holes, dents or dings. Nothing. Like new.
It will recieve a fresh coat of varnish and original plate and rug rest installed.
I will hunt with it a little this season and then retire it to the collection....Philip
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I would also lieve or is it leave it as I found it if it were not such a beautiful diamond in the rough under that nasty old camo paint bear charged and extra $5.00 the nerve of those guys.
Lets just say a fairly good old time diamond cutter could get all the camo off and bam out pops a beautiful much rares now then before kodiak.Mine was camo for 46 years too and I finaly decided last year to remove some factory camo paint and see what I had.Mine loves being naked bd
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you gotta love it you just gotta sometimes things are not what they appear to be.Here is a couple of former camo kids of mine bd (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/camo004.jpg) (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/camo003.jpg)
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Coming along.......
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........ little behind schedule Phil but she's looking new bd (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/16015.jpg)
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Thanks Donnie.
Can you post some more pics? >>>------->
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ok but I gotta show them all bd (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/rare008.jpg) (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/rare011.jpg) (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/rare004.jpg)
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Thanks Donnie.
The bow looks amazing! Can't wait to shoot it..........Philip
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That thing is just plain "neat". I wish I had a better word for it, but what a special bow!
I was back and forth on the camo removal, but I think the right choice was made. I am curious though, what did the decals and writing say on it?
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that is a really rare bow right right there bd
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Now that is one cool-looking RARE BIRD!
(http://images.imagelinky.com/1312985392.jpg) (http://images.imagelinky.com/1312985392.jpg)
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Donnie.
Sent PM.......Philip
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Bowdoc, that looks awesome! man... :eek:
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And now for the rest of the story . . . . What was the Serial #?
Incredible - ebony and ivory livin in harmony! And a very interesting thread.
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B E A U T I F U L ! ! !
Great job Doc.
I would have left it natural, but that's Phils call.
I think he made the right one.
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my goodness that little gem looked good about 3:15 this morning wow I may have trouble letting that one come home bd (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/phil001.jpg)
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whoops Lb I did not read your post until I posted the pic(little early still).......actualy its a 1967 1/2 Bear Kodiak and one mighty fine looking bow bd
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Hey Donnie,
Don't tease me! Can you snap a picture of medallion side and tips?..........PLEASE!!!!!!!
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So is this a "prototype" of the 67 1/2 or a phenolic riser 67 1/2 Kodiak? In other words, is it very scarce or one-of-a-kind, or have I just misread this entire thread :D ?
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Originally posted by vintage-bears:
Originally posted by PAPALAPIN:
Philip
Personally I would not remove the rest of the Camo, As it is it tells the story of this bow in that it sat hidden under camo paint for 44 years until Tom decided to see what was under the paint.
It amazes me that someone could shoot this bow for that long and not realize there is a differennce between this now and a standard '66. The big difference in hand weight should have tipped them off to something. Common sense should say that the layer of camo paint would not add that much weight.
When I acquired it, I dubbed it the "Troy Kodiak" after Tom Troy who discovered this jewel under the camo paint. I hope Philip honors that name and continues to refer to as the Troy Kodiak.
I would do something to add some kind of finish where Tom reubbed a bit too much, but I would not remove any more of the camo. However, philip is now the new custodian of this piece of Bear history so I guess it is his call.
Take care of her Philip. It belongs in the collection of "Vintage Bears".
Thanks very much Jack. I'm on the fence about the camo finish with this bow.
I am thinking about bringing the bow to it's ORIGINAL condition.
It's original condition was NOT camo! The camo came later. I'll explain.
After thorough inspection, the bow has evidence of being finely sanded and varnished at Bear Archery just like a production model. It was clearly an R+D bow.
Ofcoarse I could be wrong on this.
It is my theory that this bow was initially going to be a 67 Kodiak and Bear Archery decided to not make one at all for 1967.
The decision was made to wait and introduce the ALL NEW 67 1/2 Super Kodiak with the black phenolic riser.
This is my opinion of this bow.
Once all decisions were made at Bear Archery, this bow was sent back to the factory area with instructions to camouflage it, weigh it and serialize and send it off to bear dealers as a 1966 Kodiak.
I could be wrong but I am confident that's how this bow came to be.
The bow has found a home on the wall sitting between a 1966 Kodiak and a 67 1/2 Super Kodiak.
It's like the missing link has been found........philip [/b]
There are a couple prototypes out there for the 66 model year Kodiak that I know of. Each and every one is unique and very special. If you go back on this topic you will see some neet photos of them. This particular Kodiak is the only KNOWN solid phenolic example.
Scarce? YES.
One of a kind? Who knows.
This bows hidden identity lasted nearly 45 years.
It was time!
It's more amazing than I imagined it to be.
Thanks Fred.......Philip
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OMG I don't know Phil the more work I get into her the better she looks.I had so much wet sanding yesterday that I missed the spray schedule last night so I'll keep you posted in a couple hours.........hiho hiho its off to spray bows I go......yeah right bd
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Doc, now I know why you have a bedroom full of bows. Linda sold your bed because you surely don't sleep, so why have it. You are bow-a-holic work-a-holic.
Denny
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Originally posted by the real bowdoc:
OMG I don't know Phil the more work I get into her the better she looks.I had so much wet sanding yesterday that I missed the spray schedule last night so I'll keep you posted in a couple hours.........hiho hiho its off to spray bows I go......yeah right bd
That's OK Donnie. No rush.
I was so happy to see the pictures you posted.
When you get a chance, can you weigh the bow for me?
She was labeled #57. Wonder if the weight held up these past 45 years.......Philip
You are the MASTER Donnie.
PS: Thanks so much for being there for all of us!
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oh hell yeah this is worth getting up early for........bd (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/kodi003.jpg) (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/kodi005.jpg)
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Donnie, the bow looks beautiful!
The contrast is really something else.......philip
PS: Feel free to shoot it.....Enjoy!
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It would have been criminal to not remove the rest of the camo paint on this bow. It would have been just another 66 camo Kodiak.
What a very special Kodiak she is. Her beauty and significance would have never been known or seen. I am still confident that she was tabbed to be a 1967 Kodiak.
Any chance to scale it yet Don? Wonder where she's at.
And I sent you a PM Don regarding bear T/D sockets.
Thanks Donnie.......Philip
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hey Phil I am getting more like 55# on my scale fact is just a shade over 55# but not 56# ? I got a ton of chit going down today but I'll check back at lunch time and see what you think mark it 55# or 57# ? gees'zus that bow is so beautiful man oh man am I ever happy to have had a chance to see it in person.That would have been a down right shame to have left it butt ugly factory camo guys sorry but its true.Phil I also beleave those bows were ment to be 1967 Kodiaks but bear had to make some changes bd
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Today was the first time I clicked on this thread and I started on page 1 and didn't post this until reading bd's post from yesterday. With that being said, I was on Jack's side for the first 5 pages or so, then with all of the info started to ride the fence. Then I seen what bd had done and I jumped as far as I could to Phil's side,lol. That bow is a beauty. I had a factory camo Grizzly that I traded, for a fly rod of all things, that I now wish I would of had a lil bit of paint taken off just to see the wood underneath. The only reason that I got rid of it was because I didn't really like the camo paint, but I didn't know that there was a finished bow underneath the camo paint. Oh well, live and learn right? Congrats on an AWESOME bow to everyone involved in finding this bow from start to finish. BTW I did read the whole thread and I am not trying to start anything with saying "Jack's side and Phil's side", I realize that in the end everyone is on the same side here. Thanks for listening to the rambling, Mike.
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NICE!!!
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Phil what you thinking on that draw weight ? mark it 55#.I only have to reletter it and she's ready to head home ???? I have 14 jobs to letter this AM and will check back at lunch time bd
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Hi Donnie.
Is the bow coming in at 55#?
If so. YES. It should be recorded what weight she is at. I put together a little "booklet tag" that I will attach to the bow.
It has some detail info as well as pics of it's camo past.
This bow is not only a rare missing link that will find it's place between my 66 and 67 1/2 Super Kodiak, being 55# and 60" is amazing as every other bow in my collection is the same.
For me, it was a great "by chance" find.
Thanks Don..............Philip
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hey Phil I screwed up well not real bad but just the same really pee'd me off.Would you be so kind as to post the serial number for me ? I know its 60" 55# but I can not find the ser.# in my book ? bd
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Hi Donnie. I need advice on painting the sockets and yokes on a green stripe riser.....I appreciate your advice Brother.......Philip
6L2236
60"
I am still shakin my head how that bow came in at 55#..........LUV IT!
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/camo66.jpg)
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/camo66-2jpg.jpg)
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thanks my brother.....were you thinking something like this on the sockets or high gloss black ? bd (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/brs001.jpg) (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/brs003.jpg) (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/80sb005.jpg) (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/80sb006.jpg) (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/brs001-1.jpg) (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/brs002.jpg) (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/brs003-1.jpg)
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Donnie.
They look amazing.
The krinkle finish is very nice.
Can you advise me on how to do it?
Thank You Don..........Philip
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look at thread the good looking 1970's 1980's TD's bd
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Phil everything did not go so good on the proto finish.I have 2 small spots right near the fadeout (please see pics) that the finish did not stick cleanly to yesterday.I'll have to wet sand and respray the bow to make sure those get coverd.The problem is it takes 48 hours for the finish to cure but I'll be gone next week for 10 days to 2 weeks to take my grandkids hunting...I could wet sand it out now and hope those spots come out but I'am pretty certin they will not come out.And I know you would not be happy with me....I know I sure would not be.
I guess my question to you is do you want to take the chance now and me try and finish it or could you hold out for about 2 weeks to enjoy this little gem ? bd (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/66001-1.jpg) (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/66002.jpg) (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/66003.jpg) (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/66005.jpg) (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/66010.jpg) (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/66011.jpg)
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Originally posted by the real bowdoc:
Phil everything did not go so good on the proto finish.I have 2 small spots right near the fadeout (please see pics) that the finish did not stick cleanly to yesterday.I'll have to wet sand and respray the bow to make sure those get coverd.The problem is it takes 48 hours for the finish to cure but I'll be gone next week for 10 days to 2 weeks to take my grandkids hunting...I could wet sand it out now and hope those spots come out but I'am pretty certin they will not come out.And I know you would not be happy with me....I know I sure would not be.
I guess my question to you is do you want to take the chance now and me try and finish it or could you hold out for about 2 weeks to enjoy this little gem ? bd (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/66001-1.jpg) (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/66002.jpg) (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/66003.jpg) (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/66005.jpg) (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/66010.jpg) (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/66011.jpg)
Donnie,
Go hunting with your family. The bow can wait.
In fact,
I would love to see you kneeling next to an animal (dead animal that is) with that 66/67 BLACK BEAUTY in your hand! Take the bow and have fun with it before sending it back.
Luv ya Brother >>>---------->
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Philip,
You have some great looking bows! That "new" Black Beauty will fit right in with the others!!
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Originally posted by vintage-bears:
Originally posted by the real bowdoc:
Phil everything did not go so good on the proto finish.I have 2 small spots right near the fadeout (please see pics) that the finish did not stick cleanly to yesterday.I'll have to wet sand and respray the bow to make sure those get coverd.The problem is it takes 48 hours for the finish to cure but I'll be gone next week for 10 days to 2 weeks to take my grandkids hunting...I could wet sand it out now and hope those spots come out but I'am pretty certin they will not come out.And I know you would not be happy with me....I know I sure would not be.
I guess my question to you is do you want to take the chance now and me try and finish it or could you hold out for about 2 weeks to enjoy this little gem ? bd (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/66001-1.jpg) (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/66002.jpg) (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/66003.jpg) (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/66005.jpg) (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/66010.jpg) (http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii175/bowdocsarchery/66011.jpg)
Donnie,
Go hunting with your family. The bow can wait.
In fact,
I would love to see you kneeling next to an animal (dead animal that is) with that 66/67 BLACK BEAUTY in your hand! Take the bow and have fun with it before sending it back.
Luv ya Brother >>>----------> [/b]
Hey Donnie,
glad your back home! Hope you had a terrific hunt. I love the grip work you did on those T/D risers. Real nice! :clapper:
Is the black beauty coming East soon?
Would love to take her in the woods this fall.
:archer2: .......Philip
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Phil I am almost caught up and working hard on getting this little gem finished off hand polished and headed your way this week talk soon bro bd
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Donnie,
I can't wait to string her up, mount a quiver take a few shots and learn where she points and get in my treestand!
..........Philip
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Phil some chit went haywire here this week and I am running a bit behind as always.But should be finished up next week bd
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Originally posted by the real bowdoc:
Phil some chit went haywire here this week and I am running a bit behind as always.But should be finished up next week bd
BD;
Thanksgiving approaching my brother! :pray:
PS: can you put the razorheads in the box with the bow?
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/proto2.jpg)
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/proto.jpg)
The bow wants to take her place among her siblings.
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/1967.jpg)
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Phil
Good things are worth waiting for.
I'm confident that the prototype has found the home it was meant for.
You made the right decision to have Bowdoc refinish it.
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Great thread! I just read the whole thing from start to finish, and feel like I have just taken an advanced level course on Bear history!
What a piece of history and what a gem this bow turned out to be!
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It is quite a bow and quite the topic.
I had alot of fun with it. :pray:
..........Philip
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Any news on this baby
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Glad you ended up with it.
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Was going to start a new thread but thought this would be better suited here.Recently picked up this nice '65 Kodiak.Very nice condition except for two small holes on the coin side most likely from a quiver.Would like to possibly have them filled if someone thought they could do a nice job on them.Bow is a little light in weight too at only 38# but would still make a nice practice bow.Looks similar to one of the bows shown by Papalapin on page 1 of this thread.Oh how I despise holes in bows.Plus it's got a + stamped above the serial number.Will probably just get rid of this one or trade it for one without the holes and crosses. :bigsmyl:
(http://i475.photobucket.com/albums/rr118/johnnyrazorhead/65Kodiakprototypeand63TypeIIIMagnum004.jpg)
(http://i475.photobucket.com/albums/rr118/johnnyrazorhead/65Kodiakprototypeand63TypeIIIMagnum005.jpg)
(http://i475.photobucket.com/albums/rr118/johnnyrazorhead/65Kodiakprototypeand63TypeIIIMagnum003.jpg)
(http://i475.photobucket.com/albums/rr118/johnnyrazorhead/65Kodiakprototypeand63TypeIIIMagnum001.jpg)
(http://i475.photobucket.com/albums/rr118/johnnyrazorhead/65Kodiakprototypeand63TypeIIIMagnum002.jpg)
(http://i475.photobucket.com/albums/rr118/johnnyrazorhead/65Kodiakprototypeand63TypeIIIMagnum006.jpg)
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Super cool find John. Very unique.
I await for my prototype still............
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Gulp. VERY Nice!!! The oddballs are my favorite!
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That is a unique one for sure. Nice lines......
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Philip,are you still waiting for yours?
Maybe Don has fallen in love with it! :pray:
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Hi Felix.
Yes I am still waiting.
I figure Don has alot going on and not able to get to the post office. I wish he would call me.
My hands are tied.........Philip
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Originally posted by cacciatore:
Philip,are you still waiting for yours?
Maybe Don has fallen in love with it! :pray:
I received a call from Bowdoc's wife yesterday.
The bow is on it's way home and Don is working hard on getting caught up and bows finished.
I asked her if she was feeling better and she told me she is slowly coming along.
Our prayers are with you Don and Linda and thank you.
.......Philip
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With news of the bow coming home, I wanted to revisit the amazing story and images of this once cleverly hidden gem.
This is the photo history of this 1966 Kodiak.
Born in 1966 pulling 57#.
Here she is when found by Tom Troy. I spoke with Tom several times and he told me he was simply looking for a vintage-bear Kodiak that he could hunt with. This basic camo Kodiak fit the bill.......
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/bear66exp10.jpg)
More to follow........Philip
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Then Tom removed a little camo paint and took notice of a black base beneath the paint.
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/66PrototypeE.jpg)
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Tom did some more paint removal and brown glass started to appear........
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/bear66exp1.jpg)
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Then some more paint removal.......
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/66PrototypeD.jpg)
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Now it dawns on him that the riser does not have the famous Bear trim stripe in the riser......Hmmmmm, Very Interesting.....
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/66PrototypeB.jpg)
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Realizing this is quite different from other 66' Kodiaks, he inquires about it here on TG......
The bow is then traded to another TG member.
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/BEAR66PROTOTYPEVII.jpg)
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Absolutely an amazing treasure Philip! I bet the factory put that camo on it because they didn't care for the "look"!
Glad you ended up with her. It will fit right in with your great collection!
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I had been following the thread about it at the time and was talking with it's new owner about a Take Down handle.
In our conversation I had asked about it and we soon made a deal for this bow.
I knew it was special and I suspected it to be an EXP bow.
I had been on the fence about removing the rest of the camo paint. It was a hard decision....Believe me!
The purist in me said leave it be.
20% of the paint had already been removed was my other thought.
I know there are fellow collectors who felt that I should leave it be and I completely understand them. Then there are other collectors who say to remove the rest of the paint.
I slept on it for awhile.
This decision was hard!!!!!!
Seeing so much of the paint already removed and the solid black riser with the brown glass so exposed, I decided to remove the rest of the camo.
She looks beautiful.
I had bowdoc put a fresh coat of varnish and rewrite the factory serial #.
Here she is reborn, now pulling 55#.
......actually bowdoc weighed it and it's somewhere between 55 and 56#.
Not bad for a 46 year old "over the counter" Bear.
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/rare004.jpg)
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/rare008.jpg)
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Thanks so much Tony.
She really is pretty and I hope some of the folks that opposed it's refinish are still my friends.........
Except the "wannabe collector historian".......he's hysterical !
It really was a hard decision.
Your collection is pretty impressive too!
I constantly go back and look at your newly found 62' Kodiak........Amazing Brazilian right there.
My wife thinks that I like brazilian for the wrong reason.........LOL
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Hopefully we will shoot her Saturday at Whittingham......
.........Philip
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I hope it arrives by this weekend. I would love to see that bow in person.
You could always tell your wife that "brazilian is beautiful"......and be thinking about the rosewood and the "other" brazilian!
Like you, I can wait to get my "renewed" bow back in my hands!
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Philip, enjoy that bow and I'm glad to hear if finding it's way home.
Hopefully mine is close to coming back to Iowa.
doug77
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The bow arrived today.
Don, if your reading this.....I salute you!
I cannot thank you enough!
Get to NY this fall.
You will be placed in my best treestands overlooking some old apple trees.
I will gut, drag and butcher the buck you kill!
I will serve you some great Italian food and you will be in charge of the TV remote control.
You will get the master bedroom and my good towels for your daily shower.
pics to follow.
............Philip
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Philip
Gorgeous Looking!! Can't wait to see the pictures. It's amazing the work bd is capable of doing and how he brings these old classics back to show room quality. A VERY unique piece!!
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Yes, Philip, we are eager to see those photos, of both the bow and its shooting exploits!
Ray
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Philip
I'm glad to hear it's arrived. Looking forward to the pictures.
Tom
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(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/6712.jpg)
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/6711.jpg)
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/67kodiak1.jpg)
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/67kodiak5.jpg)
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/67.jpg)
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(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/67kodiak6.jpg)
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/678.jpg)
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/679.jpg)
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/677.jpg)
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/6714.jpg)
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(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/6713.jpg)
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/rare008.jpg)
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/rare004.jpg)
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/67kodiak4.jpg)
Hidden under camo paint for 45+ years.
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/bear66exp1.jpg)
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Very nice!!! Congratulations Philip, that's a rare beauty !
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Very nice!!! Congratulations Philip, that's a rare beauty !
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The Real bowdoc might be way behind, but the outcome will be worth the wait. Man Phillip, thats a nail drivin beauty. And ready for many more years of fun. Thanks for sharing.
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Phil,
That is a beauty.As the saying goes,"good things come to those who wait".That bow is a good thing.
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Philip,I am sooo glad you get your special 66/67!
It is a beauty indeed.
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Thanks guy's.
Their no fun if you can't share them.
I can't seem to put this bow down. The all black riser is unbelievable and with the brown glass it looks amazing.
I gotta put the bow on a scale. I bet it weighs a lb or more than a standard 66' Kodiak. You gotta feel this thing!
I am more confident then ever that this bow was a test for the upcoming 1967 Super Kodiak. Obviously Fred Bear wanted some more refinements for it, "trim stripes" being first on the list.
Fred was'nt about to throw away a perfectly good bow.
So being built on the 66' Kodiak form allowed this bow to be simply camo covered and sold as such.
I wonder what's still out there under factory camo?
And yes,Bowdoc outdid himself.........Bravo Donnie!
Thanks again fella's...............Philip
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That is cool...the way is was before Bears decision was made to move on... Absolutely gorgeous. Great job Philip and Bowdoc!
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Very Nice Philip
Always appreciate your insight and personal perspective on Bear Archery. What a unique beauty that one is. I'm glad you exposed it. The history is there in the before and after pictures and the story it tells us. Doc did a beautiful job of bringing it out!!!
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Phil
Glad I passed it on to you. I know it will get more exposure in your collection than it did in mine.
I was one of those that felt you should leaqve the camo on, but you made the right decision. It is beautiful.
I want to remind everyone that this gem was descovered by Tom Troy. He bought it off E8AY as a camo model '66 Kodiak. If he had not decided to see what was under the paint, it may never have been discovered.
Goes to show you that we have no idea of what other hidden gems are still ot there just waiting to be discovered.
Glad you got her Phil.
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Philip In your comparison pics with the lefty it looks like there is a difference in the length of the handle section between the two. Do they seem to have been built on the same or different forms?
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Originally posted by Larry m:
Very Nice Philip
Always appreciate your insight and personal perspective on Bear Archery. What a unique beauty that one is. I'm glad you exposed it. The history is there in the before and after pictures and the story it tells us. Doc did a beautiful job of bringing it out!!!
Thanks very much Larry. Once again, your bow looks amazing!
........Philip
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Originally posted by sticknstring+:
Philip In your comparison pics with the lefty it looks like there is a difference in the length of the handle section between the two. Do they seem to have been built on the same or different forms?
Greg,
The lh super k riser is a bit longer. Im sure all will be.
I'm gonna do some more comparisons with other super kodiaks and take some more pics.
The limbs and recurve appear to be the same when side by side.
Thanks again everyone.........Philip
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The bow looks even better in person. Thanks Phil for showing it to me at Whittingham. By the way, what did Jim say about the Takedown you refinished?
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Thanks Vinny. I had such a good time with you and the gang.
Was a real pleasure to meet you all. Jim was impressed with the handle and happy to hold it once again.
The swap meet was a lot of fun too. I picked up a 62 polar for my daughter. She loves it!!!!
Thanks also to Mike Shaw and his lovely wife. Great people.
And Mike makes some of the nicest arrows you will find.
.......Philip
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This unique and very special bow has been on a nationwide journey it seems and has been an honor
of mine to possess even if only for a little while.
This bow deserves to be seen and not tucked away.
A trade was made and now Johnnyrazorhead "John Kabisa" has her in his amazing Collection.
The bow has come full circle and now she's back home in Michigan.
As for the trade, let's just say it was "A" mazing!
Pictures as soon as I can.
.....Philip
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As I wrote in my previous post.
John Kabisa and I had made a trade for the 66/67 Prototype Kodiak.
I made a decision to pass it on to a collector who not only appreciates the bows and their history but shares these wonderful weapons of Fred Bear with others to see in their displays.
John was kind enough to trade this very special signed Fred Bear take down.
Thank you John.
Serial # A-1945
Signed by PapaBear 1982 with
50# original white tip limbs.
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/signed1945shelf.jpg)
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/signed1945coin.jpg)
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/signed1945sig.jpg)
(http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt247/87philip/Atwins3.jpg)
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Phil,
I'm :bigsmyl: for you for enjoying that very special A-riser,and I'm very :notworthy:
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Very nice handle Phillip! Yes John, I know all to well ;o)
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Hey John,
How about that bow in which it's "historical value" has been erased according to some person?
Let's see that altered "Mona Lisa" among your other magnificent specimens.
TG is boring without you!
.....Philip
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Phil,
I'm not sure what bow you are referring to. Is it one I own or one I may have owned at one time. I'm drawing a blank right now, but that's normal for me after working all the hours I've been working lately. My mind is on overdrive on top of lack of sleep. Help me out here.If it's a bow I still have I would love to post up some pics as I agree,things have gotten a little stale lately here in the collecting world.
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I have a factory camo 1967 Super Kodiak-definitley black handle underneath-doesn't look or feel like any overlays on back of handle though.
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check under the strike plate Kelly.
.......Philip