Trad Gang
Main Boards => Trad History/Collecting => Topic started by: TRAP on March 30, 2008, 05:00:00 PM
-
Let's make this a fun project.
Recently I purchased a classic '57 Kodiak from a fellow Tradganger and vintage bow connoiseur. We'll call him Bjorn.
The overall bow is in pretty good shape but a few things have fallen by the wayside over time. One tip is original the other is Purpleheart and something else (Maybe Bubinga). The original leather grip has been replaced by a very nice section of bicycle innertube. Functional-yes but kinda blah. The back is decent but shows some signs of stress (what doesnt after 51 years) with a few places where the glass has popped away or splintered.
Think of this bow as the old rusty truck you saw while hunting rabbits on someone's back forty with trees growing up through the hood. I know when you saw it you thought "man I'd like to fix that baby up and drive it through town"
Here's what I had invisioned but will welcome other suggestions.
-Replace tip overlays with antler tips or fiberglass
-Snakeskin backing, not sure what kind(it seems I read somewhere that backing it would prevent further splintering)
-Tanned beavertail grip
-a new finish
-new string with Mink balls.
-need help with strike plate and rest (something cool)
My first order of business is to take a few "before" pics and remove the tip overlays that are currently on the bow.
Anybody have advice on how to remove the existing tip overlays without damaging the underlying glass?
I'm sure I'll devalue the bow as a collector piece but probably not anymore than the guy that put the rubber tube on it. One thing I'm sure of is, it will still smoke an arrow and shoot right where I'm looking (sometimes) just like it does now. I already have a really nice 57 and wanted this one as a project bow. Some of you purists may want to turn your head while this thread is current.
Pics will follow. Now how about those tips.
Trap
-
here's what the current shelf looks like Jim, but it doesnt have to stay the same shape. We're having fun with this one.
(http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa277/DUCK_TRAP/57Kodiak014.jpg)
and here's a few more pics to show what we are dealing with
(http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa277/DUCK_TRAP/57Kodiak013.jpg)
The fancy grip. Probably put on there by a Pig Hunter. (Just kidding Bjorn)
(http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa277/DUCK_TRAP/57Kodiak012.jpg) (http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa277/DUCK_TRAP/57Kodiak011.jpg)
Matching tips
(http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa277/DUCK_TRAP/57Kodiak009.jpg)
51 years of Stress
-
The original tip should split away from the limb glass pretty easy-that is if it wasn't re-installed with crazy glue, and I don't recall.
Try sliding a thin blade between the tip overlays and the limb glass. Put the limb in a vise and start at the extreme tip end-should just pop off.
Someone might also have a matching tip from a donor bow? I had some spares at one time, but not anymore. I do have some antler if you need it. Sounds like a fun project you got, when ya gonna start?
-
Thanks Bjorn for the tips (no pun intended) and the offer. I have quite a few white-tail racks laying around here and assumed I'd make tips out of those. Hope I can get them thin enough to follow the contour of the limb when clamped.
I'll probably start it tommorrow afternoon. I'll try to take some pics along the way.
Daryl
-
As for the tips.I would use a drum sander or belt sander and just grind those tips both off.Takeing note to be careful if you have not done this operation before leave about the last layer and hand sand it down to bare fiberglass.One thing on the razor blade trick...like Bj said if someone shot a litte super glue under the tip overlay,and then you put presure on it with razor blade,or pocket knife blade...not all the time but if the S-G has been used,that overlay will pull fiberglass off right at the string nocs on the backing.danger danger.The sander works great super fast,just be careful.I know antler looks great on bow tips...But antler will keep shrinking,it's kinda funny that way as it really never stops ageing....But knife makers use it,by getting the handle on the knife and soak the antler with super glue to fill the pours and stop the ageing process.So if you like antler just give it a couple coating of S-G and it should be OK..I personaly really like the look of black fiberglass with hardrock maple tip overlays..ever seen one of the factory 1955 1956 or 1957 Kodiaks with black paper and hardrock maple tip overlays? They look pretty sharp..Nice grip...bowdoc
-
That's all the stress there is in the limbs?! It's very easy to make that little bit disappear and keep the glass down.
-
Thanks for the advice Don. With that in mind, would I be better off to add a thin layer of fiberglass between the limb glass and antler. I'd still give the antler several coats of S-G.
Kinda jumping the gun, but do I need to do anything to the back of the bow before I start the skin backing. I've always used titebond II for snakeskins in the past. Will that be sufficient to lock everything down for good?
gotta order some snakeskins this morning. What do you think fellas? Prairie rattlesnake, diamondback or timber rattler? I cant find any bullsnake and copperheads are too expensive.
Trap
-
Ye Jeremy, it's not bad at all. I'd feel pretty comfortable about shooting it like it is forever but thought the snakes would be the bombproof alternative and look good.
If you want to share the method you're talking about jump in here, we're just having a little fun and learninbg as we go.
Trap
-
I actually hit all those little splinter with LT before I do much work on the bow..Once glued down that will help keep dust out of them.As I work along sanding the old finish off,I will kinda inject them again and again.Until I figure I pretty much got them all..some cases the peskie little things will kinda keep pokeing up...Thats the tension side of the bow and kinda hard sometimes to get them to stay glued down...But then again sometimes they won't ever pop up..The 1956 K I just did for my granson for his B-day...I did add the snake-skins...There were just to many splinters..so I coated very thin coat of LT down both limbs twice...then sanded it almost all off,but nice and smooth.Tring to remove as much as possible for best bonding....then the skins with tite bond 2.....His is only 40# but the splinters have not popped through the skins as yet...Bill Bonner former Black Widow bowyer would put 3 coats of marine epoxy over the fiberglass and call her good........bowdoc
-
Okay you refinishing Gurus I hit a snag.
I've been prepping this bow for a new finish. Not concerned about the back because it's going to have a set of creepy crawling predators on it, but as I'm sanding the belly I'm getting to a point where I have islands of old finish and fiberglass all in the same area. Kinda looks like a topo map.
My question is, do I keep sanding to remove all of the old finish and take a chance of thinning surrounding glass in the process or call it good and start applying the finish.
I guess the old glass was not real flat and smooth like glass today.
Any :help: would be appreciated
Trap
-
Yes I would just get it clean as possible,maybe even kinda use the edge of the sandpaper to remove the old finish from the low spots..But sanding the glass down to much can knock those early models out of tiller fast..So the less sanding is better..Keep me posted,bowdoc
-
Thanks Doc, Trap
-
Hey Trap,I do add a thin peace of brown fiberglass under the antler.I actually add the thin fiberglass under almost all tip overlays.It can not hurt anything and will only add strength to the limb tips....bowdoc
-
(http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa277/DUCK_TRAP/antlertips012.jpg)
(http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa277/DUCK_TRAP/antlertips014.jpg)
Here's what I ended up with for tips. I'm concerned my antler is too thick so I may have to sand most of the texture off of the top.
I glued them up yesterday which brings up a question. When using Gel type Super Glue. How long do you need to leave it clamped before you can start working with it. Recently I glued on some tips and left them for three days. I'm sure that was overkill. LOL I'm kinda impatient, not a great trait for refinishing.
Daryl
-
Daryl, can't wait to see this one finished :bigsmyl:
-
LOL me neither, that's why I'm so impatient. About 5 minutes after I start sanding I'm ready to start shooting the finished product. Something magical about stringing up the finished bow for the first time. Drives me crazy.
I tried my hand at building selfbows for a few years and my lack of patience prevented me from ever making really good bows :knothead:
Oh well, It's all good.
Trap
-
I let that gel dry for 24 hrs.One thought I had was under the lams,there is not much air to alow the super glue to dry.So I figure 24 hrs is pretty good.If you start sanding and it's a little tacky around the edges,I would let it set another 4-6 hrs..Is'nt bow refinishing fun?????????????? ya gotta love em...Let's see them snake skins??? and do you soak your skins in water before glueing them down ???? bowdoc
-
Love the way you are setting up the tips Trap!
-
Thanks Bjorn, antler tips are a Pain in the *%*%^$ Arse. Too many uneven surfaces for clamping. I know quit whining Right?
I ordered some decals from Al for this and a couple other projects and his wife Helen sent me an email saying he was in the Hospital with pneumonia. Let's keep him in our thoughts and prayers until we hear something from him.
Hopefully the snakeskins will arrive tommorrow and I can get this show on the road.
Bjorn, when are you leaving to go chase rooters around?
Trap
-
I am leaving Monday morning. Al was supposed to be hunting this week-end! Boy am I glad I stopped in here.
-
Progress as promised...
(http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa277/DUCK_TRAP/antlertips022.jpg)
(http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa277/DUCK_TRAP/antlertips030.jpg)
-
Looking good,That will be a nice 57 when you get done....Wow that answers where's Al been.Man I hope he's OK....bowdoc
-
Al's decals for sure..makes em look sweet...bowdoc
-
Trap, lookin good man!
You might consider putting a set on the front of the bow. I've see a few actual Bears that had the decals positioned on the front (Shooter side). Looks good and really, considering stress cracks on the back at the fadeouts, it would have been the more logical position to put them in the first place.
If you choose to put them on the skins, the light yellow may not show up well so you might consider white or dark brown instead (but then what are you going to use on the bottom)? Hmmmm, decisions, decisions.
Thanks for your kind get well wishes. It's appreciated. I'm feeling much better.
Al
-
Ye this is a '57 and the decals were both on the belly side of the bow originally. Okay, decals it is....Trap
-
Trap, I agree with Al. I refinished and snakeskin backed a 62 Kodiak Mag and put a set of Al's decals on the front[or belly] of the limbs.Looks good. The picture of Glenn St. Charles on the dust cover of "Bows on the Little Delta" shows Glenn with a 57' Kodiak that has both decals on the belly of the bow!I've seen a picture of Fred Bear shooting a snakeskin backed static recurve too!
Looking forward to seeing your finished bow Trap! Those are good looking Diamondbacks.Their going to look great on your 57'. Kendall.
-
Hey, you skinners. There's a guy on freebey that's been selling several sets of skins. don't know if the price is right, but I guess it's what the mkt. will bear.
Al
-
I knew I heard Carly singing...
Keep peeking in to check, looking great Daryl,
BTW, VERY nice work on the rests...love the color choice. :thumbsup:
-
WOW!!! Great job Trap!
-
Here's a pic of the bow with a Great Northern quiver full of Whispering Wind footed arrows attached. I didnt plan it this way but they compliment the bow nicely I think.
(http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa277/DUCK_TRAP/57withQuiver032.jpg)
Trap
-
Very nice.....bowdoc
-
Where do I get my order in Trap? A very good job and story that was fun to follow.
Too bad there are no pigs in Missouri!
-
Thanks guys, I've been shooting it all afternoon. LOL we have a few too many pigs. You fellas can have them all.
Trap
-
Beautiful job, man and, and I must say, a very creative strike plate. You're a real craftsman and an out-of-the-box thinker, Trap.
Thanks for sharing.
Al
-
now that is making a silk purse out of a sow's ear.... very cool.
-
that baby came out just plain beautiful! great job!
-
Waiter, I'll have what he's having!
-
Holy Sh t Trap.. That bow is sweet!!!