Trad Gang
Main Boards => Trad History/Collecting => Topic started by: 4runr on January 03, 2008, 07:01:00 PM
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I just "won" this old bow on the auction site, and I have a few questions.
Alot of the finish is worn off the riser and the edges of the limbs, and I can't really afford to have it professionally re-finished. I'm good with wood and have done some finishing work on furniture I build, so I'm familiar with things of this sort. How do I proceed with this project.
Also the bow has gold lettering just below the grip, and it's like this;
2/M/2/R
52"
50#
What year is this bow? It doesn't seem to follow the "usual" way of serializing I've seen before.
Thanks for your expert help.
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A picture would help, but I did see a really ragged out 1962 K-Mag sell on there a week or so ago. Sorry to say it, but I was surprised it went as high as it did. If the glass is grey, the wood appears to be Brazilian rosewood, and the coin is pewter with maybe a little black paint hanging on, it's most likely a 1962. I know several have had luck with Minwax wipe on or spray poly. It all depends on what your intended use for the bow is. CKruse
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I looked in completed auctions and that's the one I was remembering. It's a 62 for sure. If you do some searching around, you can find advice on refinishing. I hope it's a shooter! :D CKruse
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I know I overpaid for it, but sometimes we do that for the things we want. It's got green glass, and I'm not sure on the coin, maybe pewter. I want to use it for 3-d and maybe an early season whitetail hunt. If it's not a shooter, I'll hang it on the wall to look at.
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Kenny, I didn't mean to bang on you at all. Sorry if I offended. The finish over the gray glass has probably yellowed to the point where it appears green. I'm certain under that dead finish is "bark gray" glass. The yellowing is very common of this model. They do have some of the most beautiful Brazilian rosewood, and the risers were done in both I beam and one-piece construction. I really like the narrow throated grip on the 61-62 K-Mags. Good luck, CKruse
(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b120/cdkruse/62kmag.jpg)
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No offense taken whatsoever. Thanks for all the help. Yep, you are correct, the finish on the glass has yellowed to where it looks green. I like it even more now. Some of the Rosewood still looks good, so I'll be excited to see what the whole thing looks like sanded and refinished.
How do I get the yellowed old finish off the glass?
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If thats the 62 maggie off peebay,it may be an uncut diamond is all.It did look like she could use a little nip & tuck here and there.But those 1962's are by far one of the best of the best for my money.The Mag and the Kodiak both shoot great.And the gray ??? fiberglass with the dark brazilian rosewood risers look just super.But if I were going to do the home restoration on it.I would for sure try and get as much of the original finish off as possible.Like Cam mentioned that stuff is really yellowed over the years (no UV blocker) and will make almost a green tone to the gray glass.The original finish has also oxidizied on the rosewood and makeing it look very light in color compaired to actuly fresh cut or sanded rosewood.Once you put new finish on old rose it comes back even better looking then before.I would most likely sand all of the old finish off with some 150 grit sand paper by hand and then finish up with 220-250.You can sand alot on the riser wood but not on the fiberglass and especialy NOT on the edges of the limbs.Just sand enough to remove the old finish starting near the riser and working toward the limb tips.Once you got the flats clean,now just gently sand the edges to remove the old finish.You will see and hear the difference once you have the old finish off.The fiberglass itself is very smooth once sanded.It's like glass.But for sure the more of the old finish you can get off the better the new job will look.Now wait a minute those darn original silk screens are right in the middle of what otherwise looks like a beautiful job huh??? Al has replacements for those mags.No they are not those funky water slide decals,but dry transfers printed the same as the original silk screens.PM me and I will set ya up with Alan.Pending on how nice of job ya want.I would replace them.....but thats up to you and adds to the cost.OK now you got the whole bow striped clean of the original finish...New finish can be done several ways.One you can buy a rattle can of those spray on type poly's..but it's super thin and ai'nt to tough.. minwax.. But for about 6.00 you can buy a bottle of Birchwood & Casey Gun Stock Tru Oil.It works great on wood and fiberglass and can be applied with an old rag or even your bare hand.You can put on another coat of finish every day until you get the level of finish you want.Should come out looken sweet.But first and formost,you will want to remove the coin to avoid damage while sanding around it.I take a flat head bolt,just a bit smaller in diameter then the coin??? Warm the bolt up to not red hot but to hot to touch.Set the warm bolt on the coin for about 2-3 minutes.Then stick a stick of hot melt onto the coin and let it harden up makeing sure the hot melt don't melt over onto the wood at all (it will pull some wood off)and no need to heat the hot melt as the coin is hot from the bolt heat.As the coin cools 20 minutes or more.Just give the hot melt a pull and the coin will be stuck to the hot melt (all bear coins were glued in with hot melt originaly and sometimes the heat from the bolt will make them pop right out).Now warm the coin up until it slips into a paper towel,wipe off the hot melt while to coin is still warm.Bam your set...let me know and I will tell ya how to put her back together later... Ya I know I drug that one out..I gotta lay off the coffee .. bowdoc
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This site is awesome! Here we have one of the best giving us step by step instructions.
You the man Don!
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That was real generous sharing of knowledge there BD.
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Thanks guy's I'am truly humbled by your kind words.....I love the pic Cam loaded of the 1962 mag... Now thats a bow ........ bd
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Dang, Christmas is still goin on. Thank You Sir. I spent a couple days with Doc Springer last summer at ETAR, and he was tellin me about the time you all had in Qubec, bear hunting. He was tellin me about The Bow Doc, and how gooda fella he was. Now I get to experience the goodness first hand. I'm startin on it tonight!!
Thanks BD!
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The coin is out. Sanding has begun!
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How goes the battle???????? bd
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Well, I got started sanding last night, and so far so good. The youngun had soccer this mornin and my wife's workin, so after Dad duty, I'll get goin again. Give a report and pics later.
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BD, now I know why you like doin this stuff. To take what I started out with, and just part way through the sanding process, I can already see a beautiful bow under all that yellowed finish. The Rosewood riser is an I-beam type, and not real figured, but even the straight grain is sweeeeeeeet. I'm taking pics of the progress,but don't have time to post yet. Gotta get back to sandin.
Later!
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So here's what I started with;
(http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f143/4runr/2cad_1.jpg)
(http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f143/4runr/3895_1.jpg)
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After a little elbow grease and sand paper;
(http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f143/4runr/SA400177.jpg)
(http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f143/4runr/SA400178.jpg)
(http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f143/4runr/SA400182.jpg)
In the last pic you can see the gray glass under that nasty yellow/green finish.
I'm gettin excited to see it under the new finish. I still have alot of work to do. The guys that do this professionally earn their money!
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Your doing fine.Keep up the good work......You could if you are careful use a small viberating palm sander only on the riser.That would really help get the old finish out of the wood pours.Then before you start the new finish..blow the wood as clean as you can with an air compresser.Talk soon..bd
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Rough sanding is about complete. Tomorrow I start the finish sanding. The Rosewood riser is gonna look outstanding!! Can't wait to get er done. PMing you Doc about Al's decals and a couple other things.
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C'MON your not done yet? I wanna see it done dang nabit! Hey whats the knife for? LOL Looking great buddy . :thumbsup: ><>
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I happen to like that knife....ALOT... It's shavin sharp too!!
I think that knife looks good with that bow. I hope they'll be huntin buddys of mine for years to come!!
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Well did you sharpen it? ya do know that has a lifetime replacement guarantee .LOL<><
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It came out of the sheath that way!
Can't beat that kind of gaurantee!
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4runr, let me know if you need a set of decals for your '62 Kodiak Magnum. They're cheap @ $10 a set (upper & lower)and will make the refinish job 'pop'.
Contact me at [email protected] for info on the decals.
Al (Als Decals)
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4runr Al's the man...............bd
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4runr, (nice name - I drive an '01) You will need to apply the decals after you have a couple of coats of clear on the limbs, but before the final coats.
The surface in the decal areas should be nice and smooth (no ripples) and sanded with 1000 to 2000 grit wet/dry sandpaper for best results.
Al (Als Decals)
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Bowdoc,
What do you do about the serial number and specs. that are written on the riser or limb? Just sand them off and rewrite them as close to original as possible before applying the final coats? This thread has gotten me fired up about trying to refinish a bow myself!
Chuck
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Sent you an email Al. Thanks.
Chuck, that's what I was told. Do yourself a favor, don't use old True Oil. I put the first coat on last night and ended up with a mess. Wallyworld has it for lessn 5 bucks. Got a new bottle and gonna start again. :bigsmyl:
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Wheres the pics?????? Ya know kenny I have a 65 Kodiak that needs a face lift.LOL<><
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Oh man I should have been thinking...but I was thinking you did not have any tru oil is how I forgot the mention never use old tru oil.As the dring agent has evaperated once the bottle has been opened.....Gets kinda sticky huh???? Yes I rewrite them..with gold ink I get at an art store.But there are some pretty goog gold lettering pens at walmart.They have a little bigger tip then I like but they work great for lettering bows.Put all the script back on to bow before at least the least two coats...Keep me posted boy's..........bowdoc
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Ha ha Frank! You better see how this turns out first!
I was gonna ask about that, Bowdoc, thanks. I got er about ready to TO again.
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Got er all sanded and a coat of NEW True Oil on her tonight. Got decals on the way and a rug and plate ordered. One little glitch in this whole thing is a small crack just where the shelf cut out is. It's vertical just above the hand when the bow is gripped. About at the edge of where you can see the I-beam joint. She may just be a wall hanger. Sure is purty with the new finish on. I'll get some pics when I get time. This work crap keeps gettin in the way!
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I would put some LT or super glue into that crack,After all your hard work you can't settle for no wall hanger.Can you send me a pic of the crack.bd
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Here are some pics of the crack. It's not open enough to get super glue in it.
(http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f143/4runr/SA400235.jpg)
It goes about 1/2 inch forward into the shelf, and about 5/8" down toward the I-beam.
(http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f143/4runr/SA400238.jpg)
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That thing is screaming loc tite me,Kenny loc tite me.............. Super glue or loc tite will save that bows life pending you can get the glue into the crack. Keep me posted..bd
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I have a question. Now please be nice cuz I don't know nuttin bout this stuff . But seems Kenny is having a tough time getting Ca glue in where it needs to be. So what if he opened the crack just a little with something to get her open just far enough to slip some glue in? <><
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If I were Kenny,I'd go to Riteaide or Walgreens maybe Walmart any drug store.Get a syringe or two with fine needle.I'd fill one with super glue??? Then kinda probe the crack tell I found a spot I could poke the needle in just barely.Then inject a little super glue.Really thin super glue is best and will draw itself right into the crack.One thought about wedgeing that,rosewood is brittle..bowdoc
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Just so happens I picked up a little injector bottle at our local huge hardware store. I'm going to sharpen it to a needle point and see ifn I can get it into the crsck thata way. I thought about taking something and opening it up, but was afraid of what doc said, brittle wood opening too far :scared: :scared: :scared:
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Atta boy 4runr,bouts now is where I would say next time we should start from square one actuly.Had I have been reading along,but maybe the crack got posted after we got going? I usely always inject everything first.That seals them up before sanding.......bowdoc
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You didn't miss anything doc. I didn't see the crack or post about it till I was finishing sanding.
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Kenny your not done yet? :bigsmyl: <><
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Too many irons in the fire Frank!
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I know the feeling all to well.LOL<><
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coolest thread ever \\ :D /
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How's it going today???? I can send you a syringe if yours don't work....Pending it's legal in your state......Keep me posted,bowdoc
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I got some SG in it bd. I'm continueing on with the process. I got my side plate and rest in the mail yesterday. I just need to put some more coats of True oil on it.
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YEAH BABY! NOW WERE GETTING SOMEWHERE! WE NEED MORE PICS KENNY MORE PICS.<><
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Gentaly sanding inbetween coats????????? bd
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Kenny, You're killin us man!! We NEED pictures!!! From what I've seen of your work in the past, she's gonna be a real beauty!!
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just read the thread, really cool. Lets see some more pics!
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She was gentaly sanded again, and another coat of TO smooooothed on. (I'm beginnin to like the smell of True Oil) :scared:
(http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f143/4runr/SA400186b.jpg)
(http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f143/4runr/SA400179b.jpg)
(http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f143/4runr/SA400180b.jpg)
(http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f143/4runr/SA400183b.jpg)
A few more coats of finish, then the accessories go back on. The decals should be here any day now. I'm gettin a little excited, kinda like before the deer season opens.
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I think I need to do a How-To on takin pics, they're bad!! It looks way better in person.
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I think the jeweler has started to cut that diamond...very nice...inspires me to gather stuff to try my hand at a few after trapping season ends...great work and thanks Bowdoc for sharing your expertise and thank you for sharing the progress with us Kenny...DD
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LOOKING GOOD BRO! When your done ya gotta snap a few pics outside. She looks great.<><
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WOW!! Really starting to look GOOD! I agree with Frank, take some pictures outside when you're finished...
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Oh ya,your doing a beautiful job......It may be best to put the coin in now.The T.O. (I love the smell too) can make the wood swell up just a tiny bit.Makeing it diffecult to get the coin back in!!! She's looken good....nice work,bd
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Thanks guys. I was wondering about that, Bowdoc.
First chance I get to see daylight at home will be Saturday.
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4runr, how are you applying your TO? fingers, cloth, or brush?
Your bow is looking great by the way, I have a few I'd like to do, but again, like you said "to many things in the fire".
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2.35 an hr. huh, heck ya! I'll get a raise :scared:
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You will want to put a small spot of TO not to much bigger then the transfers,let it set until it's just a barely stickie.Then center the transfer,rub it off the paper backing and onto the limb.I would let it set over night to make sure everything is dry.Then gently rub the first 1 or 2 coats over the screens,let that dry.Then go over the whole bow.Keep us posted....bd
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Thank you T.J. Kenny that 1.35 an hr offer still stands,you da man...I am glad to be of service to my bro's and sisters on Tradgang....Anytime I can be of service,I feel truely humble.....Our next work along should be straightening recurves......whatda think???? Again and as always thanks guy's for the kind words........your twin brother,bowdoc
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Congrats Kenny. Now wheres the PICS?<><
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So I guess I gotta find a Bear with a twisted limb :bigsmyl: :thumbsup:
Frank, you'll need to be a little patient my friend. I have to work a little overtime this week cause I'm takin Friday off to go to K-zoo. I still have one coat of TO to add to it then the rest and sideplate to install. T. J. is comin down Sunday afternoon to take pics. We should have them posted by Sun. evening.
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Cant wait to see it Kenny, looks like you have done a jam up job so far!!
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I had to break down and get a new computer this morning as the old one finaly died.Now we can get back on track.Lucky that was not a super K.The finish on those are hard as a rock.Keep us posted,bowdoc
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Whoa is me, ain't it awful? Sounds like we're all in the same boat ('cept for 'doc who has to feed the family doing this stuff) - just trying to make ends meet supporting our passion without incurring a divorce or the wrath of the bill collectors. I wouldn’t have it any other way.
Kenny, we're all peeing our pants out here. Don't rush it though.
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You fellas are sniffing way too much Acetone! :scared:
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Wow sounds like fun to me.bowdoc
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OK, here's some good pics taken by my friend TJ!
(http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f143/4runr/DSCF1228.jpg)
(http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f143/4runr/DSCF1223.jpg)
(http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f143/4runr/DSCF1234.jpg)
(http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f143/4runr/DSCF1238.jpg)
(http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f143/4runr/DSCF1246.jpg)
(http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f143/4runr/DSCF1248.jpg)
(http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f143/4runr/DSCF1255.jpg)
(http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f143/4runr/DSCF1261.jpg)
and does she ever shoot.
I was at Kalamazoo all day Fri and Sat, shot lots of very new expensive bows, NONE, I mean not a one, shot any sweeter or quieter than my little "Gray Lady" that name just now came to me!
This bow is not perfect in that it has a few little sags in the finish and she has a few other little flaws, but I am as proud and happy to have her as could be.
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That bow is an incredible shooter and dead gorgeous! It wasn't hard to make her look good. It just happened naturally. I had a blast this afternoon. You have a great bow there Kenny!
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WOW Kenny, that turned out GREAT!!
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Now thats what we are talking about! ya done a fantastic job bro. ENJOY!<><
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Really really nice job,looks like that ones good for another 40 years or so.Great job Kenny,bowdoc
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Thank you Sir.
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BEAUTIFUL! What a great job Kenny.
Al (Als Decals)
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Great job Kenny!!! I have followed this from the beginning.Really neat that so many are willing to share their craft.I'm working on my 62 Mag right now so I know how much work you put into your bow Kenny. With the amount of hours I have in mine I could have made a BBO composite or a selfwood bow! Again, GREAT JOB!
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Great job. I do have a few questions on the re-finish job. I bought a Shakespeare Wonderbow at a yard sale for a quarter, $.25 cents. No cracks, good straight limbs and a very good shooter. Shot a fox with it the year I bought it. But the finish coat is flaking off. After reading this post I thought that this would be a good bow to try and refinish and pass it on to one of the grandkids. Whats the sequence of use on the grits of sandpaper. How do you apply the finish? and Do you do anything to the final finish coat. Thanks for your thoughts.
Jon
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Hi Jon,thats a great deal right there and a really neat thing to do for the grandson and the bow..Pending if you want to strip the whole bow right done to bare glass and wood ? Thats best done by sanding..I would never recommend the use of any type paint or paint & epoxy stripers.They are what they say they are,and will strip the glue from the edges of the laminations...problems?? maybe maybe not,but not worth testing.It will strip the resin from the fiberglass as well if left on to long!!so it's best to do the work by hand,I think.You and the grandson will enjoy the bow for another 40 years if well taken care of..So whatda ya say??? want to get it looken abouts new or just fixed up a little??? It will only take us a few days working together to do a really nice job?? and besides for reasons I ai'nt gonna get into,I'am kinda stuck at the computer for now.So what do you think??? keep me posted,bowdoc
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Wow Jon
Jump on that offer from Bowdoc, it can't get any better than that.I found a beater kid's Locksely bow (I know a cheapy, but it has a fiddleback maple riser) I am redoing from the great advice here.
Don how goes the waiting?
Kurt
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OUTSTANDING :thumbsup:
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I will take you up on it for sure but won't be back in Michigan until April.
Remember our troops!
Thanks
Jon
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Dang, look what I started! :scared: :bigsmyl: :campfire:
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Whenever your ready.I will make time to do what ever I can to help you along...or any of the other tradgangsters I can help.I would be happy to do so...See how things get started Kenny ??? Pretty cool huh....Ya gotta love it man???? Thanks guy's for all your support,bowdoc
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BD, learned another little trick from my brother who just completed re-furbishing a 1925-29 Savage 22cal pump. He puts the last couple coats of True Oil on with 0000 steel wool, doing small areas at a time then wiping with a paper towel. Gets a smooth finish with less shine. He said I can get the bumps and sags out of my Bear that way.
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Oh yeah the old steel wool trick,You may want to use a scotch bite pad on your bows,well on a 1962 it would not matter.Because the bow is gray anywho,But the steel wool will leave a grayish tone on lighter colored and some clear fiberglass.Here's another that work well with gun stock finishes...Those spounge paint brush deals.You know there made of spounge rather then bristles??? those work well with B&C tru oil and defthine both,with no run,or sags.You could also gently wet sand the sag out with some 600 grit wet dry,and then go over them again,ie like you mentioned or with the spounge brush..Keep me posted bowdoc
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Kenny, you rolled a seven on this one. Good work, and I apologize for the early discouraging words. The string is a beautiful finishing touch. Congratulations, CKruse
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No apology needed, and I certainly accept your kind words.
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To the top for Bakes, Trap
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TTT for Cinghali.
I'm so sorry I just butchered your name.
Cinghiale.
That's better!