"The Push - A Traditional Archery Film" is officially launched.
This has been a long and fun road getting the project to this point. Please enjoy.
https://vimeo.com/165492595
YouTube link (use the gear symbol in the video screen to change to HD)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1E1vKkSSoNs&feature=youtu.be
Congrats! I will check it out when I have the time. Looking forward to it!
AWESOME video! Very well done!
Good job, it will definitely help a lot of folks. I'll give the fixed crawl a try myself. Thanks for the effort!
Thank you for doing this. I'm going to try it!
Tedd
I'm not sure I understand how to get exact duplicate placement of the hand on the string? It looks like your tab just touches the low brass nockset and the fingers by default always go the same place because the tab makes that happen?
...fingers always fall the same place on the tab...tab touches nockset?
(I never used a tab or shoot 3 under so I'm not sure how that forgive my ignorance on that)
Thanks guys for the replies. Glad you enjoyed the film.
Tedd. Once you find your crawl distance you desire, place the brass nock on the string. Or start with the brass nock on the string and move it up or down as you are finding your distance.
Tab or glove, just simply address the string and slide it up naturally against the brass nock at your fixed crawl position. It will be repeatable shot to shot naturally. Don't over think the micro-adjustment process of your fingers against the string. Just naturally slide up to the brass nock at your crawl and you should be fine, tab or glove.
Tedd, also PM me if you have any further questions or we can start another thread over in the Shooters Form Forum as well.
I am going out right now to try it out, Thanks for opening my EYES.
I can't wait to bid on the St Judes Auction!!!
I tried to duplicate from the video ,WOW I shot better than I have in a long time. Thanks
Bravo!
Well done. Whether or not I'll try the crawl, I couldn't say. I feel pretty confident with what I do now.
But the video was very entertaining to watch, and you did a phenomenal job of clearly articulating the points you were trying to make.
Nice work!
Im half way into it you have done a great job it has to be the best how to shoot dvd out there Thanks Shane
Excellent, Excellent, Excellent video!
I started experimenting with stringwalking and the fixed crawl last year. I am shooting better than I ever have in my 40+ years of seriously shooting a bow.
For those that don't want to consciously put the tip of the arrow on a spot, but prefer to pick a spot instead and focus on hitting it, most will find using a fixed 25 or so yard crawl will increase your accuracy shooting that way also due to your gaps being smaller.
Another thing I have found with the fixed crawl is you can cant your bow and shoot a fixed crawl. I like canting my bow and I have found within hunting ranges I can do that very successfully.
Thanks for your effort and time in making this video. It will help both beginner and experienced archers alike...
Awesome video. Thanks for taking the time and energy to provide this instruction. Looks like a solid way to increase repeatability. As a fairly new trad shooter this was nice to see. You explain different trad shooting concepts clearly and I am sure this will help us newer shooters understand the different options out there.
what can hi said more ,only hop that some compound
back to traditional with this aiming method
Dom
Great informative movie.
Out of curiosity, how many guys on here use the fixed crawl for hunting?
This is the first time I've been exposed to it.
Well done a great video a ton of information I have been a string walker on and off since 1973 and fixed crawl for the last 3 years!
Muley - sweet!!! That's awesome
Traditional Bow Review: 5:10
Traditional Equipment- Gloves, Tabs, Arrows: 28:05
Aiming Methods: 40:00
Setting up a Fixed Crawl: 01:05:36
Bare Shaft Tuning: 01:28:00
Bowhunting Setups: 01:37:47
Traditional Archery- Miscellaneous Info: 01:56:50
Blooper Reel: 02:08:40
:thumbsup: Just might give this a try. Thanks for posting :thumbsup:
Thanks for the video. That is more information in one place thanI have ever seen.
I can't wait to try it
Tim
thats very interesting- warrants a try- just one question- how does your finger placement on the string- effect the tiller of the bow- there always seem to be so much concern about tiller with split versus 3 under- this is a lot more exaggerated now!
Fujimo, it does impact tiller and preloads the lower limb more than the top at full draw.
Typically when bareshafting it requires a higher than normal nocking point that will help bring the tiller impact back to normal.
some bows however play really nicely with the fixed crawl within the standard nock height range. Just gotta try and see how the bows react. Don't be alarmed if you have to bring a certain bow to 0.75" high for nock height.
Good luck, it's a blast playing down the string!!!
so should one set the string anchor, say at the middle of the bow( perpendicular to the shelf) then adjust the arrow nock accordingly to get the correct POA?
Excellent video. Wish I would have had all of this information when I started out. Very informative and professionally done.
Fujimo, I think I follow what you're asking, but I would say no. Typically when setting up a non-ILF bow for a fixed crawl (read that, a bow without tiller adjustment) I start the arrow nock set at 3/8" high.
Then I find my 25 yard fixed crawl.
When I am ready, I start bare shafting from that set up. If my bare shaft has me adjusting my nock height, I'm also following those adjustments with my 25 yard crawl nock set. It's a little bit of an iterative process.
But if you're shooting with a tab it's a lot simpler. Simply count the stitches once you find your crawl distance. Then simply crawl to that spot (without the crawl brass nock applied) when bare shafting. If the bare shaft has you adjusting your nock height, then move the nock set, place the tab against the arrow nock, make the crawl to your 25 yard stitch, shoot the shot.
Once your bare shaft is flying good, and your nock height is set, then I apply the brass fixed crawl nock.
that sounds good mate- gives one a starting point
cheers
wayne
awesome video by the way- had to kinda hop through it- but later tonight i will have some private time to watch it - and really absorb
thanks again
so here another question- say i build a glass bow- figure out the crawl nock point- then retiller the bow for even limb timing- now that will probably move the crawl nock position, but then i can adjust that accordingly , and re-adjust the tiller if need be and so on until the tiller, the POA and the weight all marry at the right point.
did i phrase that ok?
Wayne,
Hypothetically, one could do that. But that seems like a ton of work to get evenly timed limbs through a custom tiller end bow. If you end up wanting to shoot different weight or length arrows out of that bow sometime, then the crawl will then have to change, putting the bow out of timing again.
I've string walked on a high volume of different types on non-ILF bows, and have not found a time where the timing was so far off that I would be concerned with the bows integrity, accuracy, or noise level.
I've found that simply adjusting the nock height higher will get the limbs close in timing.
But I would be curious to hear your results of laminating and finishing a negative tillered one-piece bow!!
To be honest with you, even my ILF bows that I am string walking or shooting with a fixed crawl are set and shoot best at even tiller (read that, tillered for 3 under on a standard laminated bow). If a certain set of ILF limbs tend to play nicer with a negative tiller, the most I've ever had to go negative is 1/8" negative tiller, max.
The tiller on a standard laminated bow is something I've never paid attention to to be honest. Tillered for 3 under or split finger (even or slightly positive respectively) it really doesn't matter. The nock height adjustment that your bare shaft directs you to adjust is sufficient enough to get your bow shooting phenomenal and quiet.
Hope that helps.
Matt
good thoughts- thanks Matt.
there are a few guys over on the bench- that have developed a simple yet effective system for tillering all bows for equal limb timing- i know it is an old concept- but i can attest to the fact that their system works. i have a bamboo backed osage /yew trilam- #50 at my draw- that shoots a 535 grain arrow at an average 174 fps.
as i understand it the equal limb timing really assists with a smooth draw, limited hand shock, super and i mean SUPER quiet- and really improved predictability in the shot. now we all know this works- but just shooting a bow that has specifically been built and tillered with full focus on the balanced timing, has truly made me a convert.
i am not a fps chaser- and i cant say this for sure- but surely when there is no excess energy lost due to vibration (hand shock and noise) surely that would equate to more energy imparted to the projectile?
so the short answer is yes- i think i would like to try this shooting system, and also like to try it on a bow with tiller balanced specifically to suit this sytem- just to feed the demon- nothing else :D
however i wont be doing anything- until i have shot and learnt the system, and have paid my dues- not trying to re-invent the wheel here- or be a smarta$$. just getting my head around it all.
great effort- and thanks for bringing this to us
cheers
wayne
Excellent work on the film. Very well presented and explained everything clearly. Will try a few things out from it, thanks for going to the effort to make this. You're going to help a lot of people.
Very well put together instructional video!!!!
Bisch
Thanks for making this video, very well done. My two big advancements in my traditional shooting were:
1. Learning and putting proper form into practice. I did this after just shooting and ingraining bad habits for about 3 years.
2. Going to a fixed crawl about 3 years ago. This took me from being happy to hit the kill zone, to being able to hit a specific part of the kill zone.
I shoot a 25yard fixed crawl from 2 different MOABs, and a Tiburon. I shoot canted. I had a pretty hard time trying to manage my gaps and now my gaps to 30 yards are between 6 to 8 inches, it also made my gaps seem flatter since I am taking advantage of the flattest parts of the arrow trajectory within my hunting distance.
Now everyone is different so it may not work for everyone but I was never happy with my accuracy shooting instinctive, I had a hard time managing gaps while gapping and I also didn't like thinking about yardage, but my accuracy was good with gapping. The fixed crawl gave me the accuracy I was looking for without having to deal with yardage or large gaps.
If you wanna try it just go out one day and give it a whirl. Slide your tab or glove about 3/4 in down the string and see how you like it. If not no problem, if you do you can tune to the crawl.
I love it for all hunting purposes it is very quick and intuitive.
Good deal JR!!!
My findings have been the same as yours.
Aiming and taking advantage of manageable gaps was a very liberating experience in transitioning to knowing without a shadow of a doubt where your arrow would impact.
Glad you enjoyed the film.
Bravo for the film very well done .
:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
Nicely done, although I will admit to not watching the whole thing. Life is a bit busy and my computer is so slow, I cannot watch the video without constant buffering interruptions. grrrr
Thank you for putting it out there.
Nicely made video, but I have one concern. He talks about using this method in competitions as well as in the wood. Rules in 3D competitions dictate that string walking or face-walking is prohibited when shooting in instinct or longbow class. Something to keep in mind...
Thanks everyone for the great feedback.
Trond, you are correct, some classes in competition require your finger to touch the arrow nock. Definitely check the rules of the organizations / classes you intend to compete in for sure.
Shoot straight!
You should be very proud of your video. I've been shooting since the early 70's and worked in a pro-shop for some time. I've never seen an instructional archery video that was done as well as yours. Congratulations and thanks.
A very good friend of mine was a string walker back when we both did a lot of competitive NFAA-style round shooting in the late 70's and 80's. There were two string walkers I knew at the time. No one in the barebow classes could touch these two guys and I personally saw my good friend shoot perfect animal rounds frequently, and very high-scoring spot rounds. These two guys rivaled some of the best sight/release shooters.
I had to chuckle a bit when you were discussing the three-point anchor with the nock touching the nose as it took me back in time seeing my friend with a bloody spot from the nock set rubbing his nose by the end of every shoot!
Well done!
will the fixed nock point change:
if you switch to a different spined arrow. like if you go to a 500 from a 600, or vice versa.
if change the weight of the arrow?
very good video, thanks for putting in the time and energy.
Flint and Friend- thanks for the kind words!
Buckeye- Yes, any change to your arrow length, weight, etc will change the trajectory of your arrows flight. Any change in trajectory will change your impact point. But it's as simple as coming up or down the string to accommodate.
I actually just did this last night at our club. I had a slight adjustment to my arrow recipe I made getting ready for turkey hunting on Saturday. Before I hit the course in our league night I stood at 25 yards and shot from my fixed crawl nock point. I was impacting low. So I loosened the brass nock, moved it a touch up the string and reshot. I had to iterate that process once more and found my 25 yard fixed crawl for my new arrow recipe. I then quickly shot from 5/10/15/20 yards to quickly map my new trajectory which didn't change much, then hit the course and noticed no change in accuracy.
The fixed crawl distance down the string is moveable and transferable to any arrow recipe changes you want to make.
Great job on the video! Watched a hour and a half last night and will finish tonight. Lots of playing around to do now..
I tried the fixed crawl on a couple of my bows briefly the other day. The one thing I noticed on my Blacktail take down was excessive limb noise at the shot. I stopped trying it because it seemed like it wasn't good for the bow! I also noticed a slight bit more noise on my Centaur, but not nearly as much as with the Blacktail...
Pro - With the Blacktail, did you by chance run a higher nock point for your arrow?
You can raise the nock point 1/8 to 1/4" from where you have it set now. That will help bring your limbs back in time with each other and reduce the noise.
That's where I would start. Raise the nock point, then find your crawl down the string for the distance you want to shoot, then go for it.
I'd be interested to hear if that helps settle your blacktail down.
Well done video - thanks.
What kind of tab do you recommend? I have always shot split but would like to give this a try.
If merely one element is absorbed and productively implemented, then I am most pleased.
Often times, one may have listened to a recommendation a hundred times, yet this one time it finally registers...
MW, it's all a personal preference. I shoot 90 degree tabs as discussed in the film. The Fred Eichler is my personal favorite, but there are so many good tabs and other finger protection out there it's hard to make a recommendation. Just gotta try some out.
Unbelievable.
This is exactly what I have needed....I am just discovering the difference this makes and am excited past belief....
Still sorting it all out...but now I KNOW where my arrow is going to hit when I let that shot go...
This is the nicest video presentation I have seen in a LONG time...is it for sale on DVD?
Russ, glad you liked it. It's liberating isn't it?!?!
This is not for sale. Free for public viewing.
Shoot straight!
Matt
Matt, Great Video ! Best video i seen in a long time. I always turned my nose up at string walking. I saw Jimmy Blackmon video on string walking and said, what the heck i'll give it a try. I love string walking now. I can compete with the compound shooters now. Thanks for sharing your 25 yard crawl. I have a wf 19 also with border limbs that i'am going to set up, this season for hunting. Thanks Again !
I have tried to share trad archery with friends and thier enthusiasm is lacking but this might resonate with some of them who are strictly rifle guys. This method is similar to mapping bullet trajectory and creating dope charts.
Watched it last night. Awesome video! Thank you
Matt,
What an undertaking this must have been! Fantastic film, and what a great presentation on material that is often confusing.
I don't know if my personal path will intersect with your method or not, but I'd gladly share a camp with you anytime. Anyone who advocates for methods of quick and clean kills is a friend of mine!
Thank you for all the time and effort you put into this video!
Thom
To your credit, you nailed it. Such a boatload of great information so thoughtfully organized, and you know how disagreeable and opinionated some folks can be about these archery matters. Great work. You should be very proud. This video will be referenced for years to come.
Super job....Most complete traditional video I have seen..
Really enjoyed the video. I've never understood the whole split vision thing until I heard the way you described it. Turns out that's pretty much how I've shot for 23 years. Conscious of the arrow point relative to the target, but never "judged" distance. Giving the fixed crawl a try. I find it difficult to put my arrow tip smack on my point of impact. So used to holding below. Also shooting a new bow and haven't found the right arrow for it yet. Think this technique could work if I can get past consciously aiming.
This is one of the best instructional's which I have ever seen. Well done. It must have taken many hours to film. I started yesterday to see if it will help my accuracy on my shots, especially those over 20yards, as up to 20yards I am actually doing very well instinctive. After an afternoon of shooting I decided that it will make a huge difference on my confidence over twenty yards.
I also have an issue with higher noise level, so I will have to work on that. I will try the higher nocking point and see if it makes a difference.
Thank you for putting it out there for us!!!
Regards Willem
Willem, I too am very anal about bow noise levels. Quiet kills in my opinion.
Some bows have no noticeable increase in noise level applying a fixed crawl, others take a bit of tinkering.
But typically, increasing the nocking point height and playing with string silencer position is enough to get the rig whisper quiet again.
Glad everyone is enjoying the film. It was really fun to put together!
Shoot straight!
Matt
Do you ever shoot regular 3under? Does your tab interfere with the crawl nock you placed? Hope that makes sense. Basically I want to be able to shoot the 25yd point on and if need be move up to the string for say a 40yd point on
Brandon
Brandon, interestingly I use the Fred Eichler split finger tab. There is just enough space between my fixed crawl nocking point and the arrow nock for the index finger and index finger portion of my tab to fit nicely. My middle and ring finger are below the fixed crawl nock.
Some guys will use serving material in place of the fixed crawl brass nock to help lessen the effects of "shooting over" the fixed crawl.
It can be done and I've done it. No major noticeable downfalls. If you are shooting a 3 under tab, then there might be some awkward feeling bump under the tab.
I typically set up my fixed crawl close to hunting season. During hunting I don't shoot at deer over 30 yards. For all off-season shooting I dedicated string walk all my bows without the fixed crawl nock on the strings.
Hope that helps,
Matt
Cool. Thank you. I have been messing around with the fixed crawl and I think I am gonna like it. Thanks for your efforts to educate. Pretty cool video!
I will have to say I have several videos including a few of the masters of the bare bow DVD's and they are great but I never was intrigued enough to try anything other than shooting 3 under with a nock above and below my arrow. You made me want to at least try something new. I don't have 25 yards in my back yard to set the 25 yard fixed crawl but I played around at 20 yards and I am not sure if I will end up doing the fixed crawl looking at the arrow point or not. I played around looking at the arrow point and also just moving my tab down the string and shooting what I guess you would call instinctive. What I found was that by tying another nock point 3/4" below my bottom nock the arrow is right under my eye and just focusing on where I want to hit the target I can see down my arrow without really trying to look at the arrow and boy did I shoot great that way. I will go to the range and give the fixed crawl a try. If nothing else I will start shooting with that nock 3/4 inches below my bottom nock and shoot "instinctive" that way. Either way I have already improved my shooting. Thanks for answering my PM. I was going to have a local guy make me a custom limb bolt but after looking at the video again I am wondering if you have the contact for the machinist that made your limb bolt that you had on the Bob Lee? If so I would like to call him and have him make me a couple exactly like the one in your video.
Nicely done
Very well done Matt and all involved...maybe an old dog can learn new tricks. Going to give it a whirl. Enjoyed the bloopers at the end good looking boys you got there, we definitely need to get more youth excited to keep our tradition alive.
Thanks,John
Thanks roadkill!
John, thanks for the compliments. Those boys are the apple of my eye. The other day my wife had the younger one (Jude) in the back yard pulling weeds. She lost track of him after she noticed he wasn't around helping. She caught movement down in the lower yard and Jude had ran in the house and grabbed his bow and quiver. He was in mid-stalk of a Robin and barely missed by an inch she said... Just like daddy ;)
AZ - sent ou a PM on the limb bolt / weight.
Matt sounds like 10 year old granson!
Matt sounds like 10 year old granson!
Matt, this is really, really good stuff!
My compliments not only the considerable effort but the tremendous quality of production as well.
I returned to traditional archery last year after shooting a compound for 30 years and had heard the term "fixed crawl" but had zero idea what it was.
I can't imagine it being explained more fully or more easily understood and intend to give it a try TODAY!
Again thanks for your efforts and for sharing this with us.
Thanks Basstar! Glad you enjoyed it! Let me know how the results are after giving it a whirl.
Shoot Straight,
Matt
Matt, what is the tab you're using that you call your hunting tag?
The tab I'm currently using has the elastic band around my finger and I am liking the idea of the style with the finger hole in the tab.
Thanks
Basstar,
That's a Fred Eichler tab from 3 rivers. I really like it.
I discuss tabs a little bit in the arrows, gloves and tabs section.
Thanks for taking the time to make your video, very well done and very informative. I am going to give the fixed crawl a try.
Rick
You certainly have opened a lot of eyes to this method, nice job and well made video!
QuoteOriginally posted by cpnhgnlngct:
Basstar,
That's a Fred Eichler tab from 3 rivers. I really like it.
I discuss tabs a little bit in the arrows, gloves and tabs section.
Thanks again, Matt.
Matt. I'm new to trad, relatively speaking. Started split, then tried 3 under and then moved down like a fixed crawl although I knew nothing about that method. Thought I had hit on something revolutionary and posted on the other site, only to find out what it was and that it isn't a new shooting technique at all. Just not as publicized as the others. Those who used it advocated it wholeheartedly, but only for hunting scenarios, mainly deer. I continued shooting this way but not with a point on. My groups got a lot better. Just saw mention of your video and watched, being particularly interested in the fixed crawl segment. Your explanation convinced me to give it a try. I just got a new Bob Lee Exotic and after adjusting brace hgt., etc. worked on establishing a point on at 25 yds. All I can say is, WOW! If I could post pics, I'd post one of two shots I took yesterday morning cold, no warmup. Two X rings at 23 yds. I'm sold. I have a feeling there will be a lot more trad shooters employing the fixed crawl if they watch your video. I'm trying to convince my bud to give it a try and he says he will. Told him he wouldn't regret it. Thanks. :thumbsup:
Highlow... Thanks for the note. I'm very happy you gave it a try and are seeing the instant benefits!
Happy Memorial Day!
I have now tried this off and on for several days. I am hitting targets with certainty like never before.
The bow is way out of tune...it sounds like the arrow is slapping the riser...is this the nock point issue I've read about?
I'll try raising the nock point and see what happens....anyone else done this yet?
Russ,
Raising the nock point will drastically help.
What bow are you shooting??
Glad you're peppering the targets!
Very nice video and lots of information. Pretty long though to watch in one setting.
Honestly I am sort of amazed at the number of folks who have never heard of "string walking". Some of the old NFAA shooters used string walking for years.
I did like your mapping and marking the tab instead of the way they did it back in the old days. Back then they counted the number of servings down the string which takes longer than using marks on your tab.
For me at 71, been shooting too long one over and two under instinctive to change now, but my compliments on your video. A job very well done. :thumbsup:
Matt,
I shoot a 59 @ 28 Firefly takedown longbow, 62 inches long.
It's normally very quiet but now it sounds like I'm hittin a board with a hammer....
What do you think...move it up about a quarter inch...or is that too much?
I tried this after watching the video and i have never been able to group the arrows so good thanks for the instruction
I did just shoot the top off of a dandylion flower yesterday...at 20 yards...using your method.
I'm totally sold. Just need to tune the bow back now...
What a great video! Great job explaining things!
Thanks guys for the great feedback!
Russ, yes, that would be a good starting point, up 1/4". You might find that's too far, but I'd start there.
Matt, outstanding video!
I gave 3-under a shot (pun intended) a year ago and brushed it off as unworkable. But your excellent explanation and demonstration of what stringwalking and a fixed crawl are, and how to do them, has me wanting to try it again. How cool would it be to hold dead-nuts on a deer and not worry about shooting high or low?! Whether or not it gels with me, I'd like to say thanks for all your hard work and offering an easy-to-understand primer for all new trad archers.
Thanks again!
Bravo, excellent job on the presentation of a lot of great information, not only for the shooters new to traditional archery.
Have you had any trouble with high fliers using the fixed crawl? Shooting off the shelf ILF tuned fixed crawl rigs I would occasionally get a shot that went high, like 8". Since following Rusty's advice switched to a springy the fliers went away. Run a nock height 5/8-3/4 depending on bow. Again terrific job on the video educating the masses.
Love the video ! The thing I love about trad
Thanks guys!
Katman, no I've never noticed a high flier shooting off the shelf. I'd be interested in hearing the set ups you experienced that with. But yes, rusty is the man!! He exposed me and so many others to this great method!
Very well thought out video that offers lots of solid information. I tried a fixed crawl many years ago and killed the only deer I shot at cleanly. My issue is getting the arrow under my eye. With my present anchor, the nock is off to the side of my face, so the "point on" isn't accurate left/right. I always felt that this would be a fantastic method for hunting whitetails. Thanks for the great video.
Knobby, thanks for the kinds words!
I read this post a few months ago and have had "The Push" queued in my Youtube feed since. I finally got around to watching it this weekend.
This is, hands down, the best traditional archery video I have ever seen. GREAT work.
Prior to watching it, I had no interest in tinkering with my shooting style. I'm happy with my skill level. Still, I played with the fixed crawl this weekend and think it has some real merit. It will take some time to get used to, but I can see myself becoming a fixed crawl shooter....
If you haven't yet watched it, do it. Now.
Thanks Dennis for the words! Shoot straight!!