Hey all,
I'd like to pick up some of the broadheads with the 3:1 ratio to use for hog hunting. I have never killed a hog before and need advice on the best gear to use. I know the most important thing is to have a very sharp head and put it in the armpit and high of the hog. If possible try and get a quartering away shot.
Now that that's said, what head would you recommend I put in my quiver? I will be shooting a 48 pound Dave Johnson longbow or a 47 pound vintage Bear Grizzly. I will be using aluminum or carbon arrows in the 500 spine or 2016 size. No weights or other inserts, just standard weight heads as they come from the maker.
In the new 3-Rivers catalog I saw the re-introduction of those HUNTER HEADS and they looked like a good head to use, but what do I know?
If you were going on a hog hunt and wanted to use 3:1 ratio head, which one would you choose?
If you feel these heads are not the best choice for me, feel free to add your recommendation on other heads.
Feel free to PM with any advice, help or knowledge sharing. I can use all of it I can get.
Thanks all.
Nalajr
Really any quality head you would use for deer will work for hogs. I have taken them with 200 grain VPA 3 blade, 200 grain VPA 2 blade and Magnus Stinger with the bleeders. I am heading back to GA in FEB and will have the 2 blade VPA in the quiver.
Not sure what you mean by armpit and high but you will find better kills if you hit low and as forward (tight) to the shoulder as you can get on hogs.
any quality head you would use for deer or bear would work well for you. If you are set on the 3:1 ratio or similar....I only have experience with Grizzly Kodiak (200gr) and Ribtek (190) heads for hogs, deer and bear.
I had full length penetration on a wild boar a couple years ago that turned to run at the last moment just as I released...instead of hitting behind shoulder I hit right rear ham and it disappeared inside of him going forward towards the left front shoulder. Never found that arrow in the hog, in the pluff mud or anywhere.
Most recent is bear hunt in June in Saskatchewan...shot a very large black bear at 10 yards high in shoulder and the arrow penetrated through muscle and bone and exited low behind the left armpit with fletching up top and broadhead sticking out low of my 30 inch arrow. Arrow broke off 1/4 of way from head so did not recover head but did remainder of arrow. Bear was 50-65 yards in the bush stone cold dead.
both of these were out of 50 and 55 pound bows respectively.
I would think the broadheads already mentioned by previous person and myself...plus Tuffhead all in 2-blade configurations would serve you well with your 45# bow weight in designs that are near that 3:1 ratio you seek.
Biggest thing is shot placement and being able to put a very good edge on whichever head you choose.
Not sure why you are saying high on the hog...don't want to shoot over the spine, and high on a hog from a tree stand will be too high for sure as hogs are much rounder than deer and you will high higher than you think. Also, not sure why you think you need to get a quartering away shot when broadside is just as good. You need to check out the hog shot placement thread stickied at the top and see for yourself.
Also, if you do decide to use ribtec heads, make sure you use enough glue to fill in between those ribs on those furrels as thick shields and those perpendicular ribs on those ribtec furrels don't go well together, you need a slick furrel. Trust me, I found out the hard way.
I would recommend Grizzly all the way... either the 3 blade Instincts or the single bevel 2 blades are bad to the bone....and beyond....
I was a big woodsman fan for years until i got some hog hunting under my belt and folded a couple of those heads up.... Grizzly broadheads wont do that.
Funny, I've never folded any woodsmans, but have a grizzly. And I've killed a lot of hogs. How many you killed Kirk?
Nothing against any other head, but they ALL will fold if given the right scenario ......I have a lot of heads I've folded 'goofing off' and testing them....but I pyramid my Wensels tips a bit and I've yet to fold one....not ONE. But I'm sure I might some day, but its certainly not a common occurrence. I could also show pics and name names of other heads that I've destroyed but I wont cause as I said, they all can be destroyed.
Here's a few animals I've killed with them.
(http://tradgang.com/tg/images8/solana2013hog2.jpg)
(http://tradgang.com/tg/images8/sccade100a.jpg)
(http://tradgang.com/tg/images7/Solana2013hog.jpg)
(http://tradgang.com/tg/images7/mowawk35.jpg)
(http://tradgang.com/tg/images6/xg2.jpg)
(http://www.tradgang.com/upload/terry/okeeterry4az.jpg)
(http://tradgang.com/tg/images5/tgbuff2.jpg)
(http://tradgang.com/tg/images5/buff3.jpg)
Oh, and I should add that that's also no reflection on Grizzly, they make a great head, but I've also bent and chipped a lot of other well made heads. Like stated above, any can fail due to the right conditions. I'm also glad Grizzly is making a 3 blade head now.
Thanks all.
Cool hat there Terry in a few of those pics. I think I saw Phyllis Diller wearing something like that a few times. :cool:
Anyway, I have some of the 3 blade Woodsman heads at 125gr., should I pyramid the tips on them or sharpen them when I sharpen the edges?
Thanks
Nalajr
When I talk about the "arm pit" and "HIGH" on the hog, this is what I am referring to:
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af240/Nalapombu/hog-hunting-information-about-hogs-01_2.jpg) (http://s1011.photobucket.com/user/Nalapombu/media/hog-hunting-information-about-hogs-01_2.jpg.html)
I really am a fan of the Tuffhead or the Woodsman elite (VPA). I have taken hogs with both. I think with the lighter bow weight you would benefit from a true 3:1 broadhead for a hog. Tuffheads are not the cheapest, but really are scary sharp out of the package and are a true 3:1 advantage. I am shooting Vintage Archery Meathead out of longbow, VPA out of a curve.
Tuffhead Boar
(http://i1139.photobucket.com/albums/n559/jeffbschulz/longbowphotos003-4.jpg) (http://s1139.photobucket.com/user/jeffbschulz/media/longbowphotos003-4.jpg.html)
Woodsman's are very hard to beat. I've used them on hog, deer, elk and a variety of other critters.
They work great.
Mike
I don't understand why everyone is so crazy about the little heads? I head down in a little over a weeks time, and have 12 tree sharks, 18 snuffer 160s and 3 VPA 175 2 blades (just for the off chance I run into a monster.
I think for the most part if your shooting over 50 lbs a bigger head is wayyy better for 95 percent of the pigs a guy will shoot.
I don't understand why everyone is so crazy about the little heads? I head down in a little over a weeks, have 12 tree sharks, 18 snuffer 160s and 3 VPA 175 2 blades (just for the off chance I run into a monster.
I think for the most part if your shooting over 50 lbs a bigger head is wayyy better for 95 percent of the pigs a guy will shoot.
Nala,
Shot the original Hunters Heads on hogs for some years in HI with success. Watched TG member Bill Carlsen 'torture test' the originals when they first came out by shooting them into cinder blocks. They stuck into the block without curling, breaking or bending. Tough heads - can't speak about the new issue.
Good hunting!
Todd
I would have to agree with Adam, although if you run into one of the monsters, maximizing your penetration can help. It just isn't very likely that you will run into that situation. I almost never use 3:1 heads, but shoot a little more energetic setups.
QuoteOriginally posted by gehrke145:
I don't understand why everyone is so crazy about the little heads? I head down in a little over a weeks time, and have 12 tree sharks, 18 snuffer 160s and 3 VPA 175 2 blades (just for the off chance I run into a monster.
I think for the most part if your shooting over 50 lbs a bigger head is way better for 95 percent of the pigs a guy will shoot.
The OP is shooting 48 pounds with a Hill style longow. Penetration is why one would shoot a narrow 3:1 head with that set up. A wider head, given all other varibales being the same, will not penetrate as easily. Pentration is one key element in increasing your success at recovery of the animal.
Oh, I am not disputing that improved penetration can improve recovery. All I am saying is that it is the rare hog that causes you to worry about penetration so much. Nothing wrong with maximizing your setup for penetration, especially with lower poundage bows. I just wouldn't let it stop me from chasing pigs or anything, lol.
Just make sure your arrows are well tuned and your heads are razor sharp and you won't have anything to worry about. I've killed big hogs with 125 grn 2 blades and small hogs with 200 grn 3 blades, Cheap heads, and expensive heads. And every combo inbetween. They will all kill if you do your part!
They aint made out of steel. RC
Same here, I totally understand getting good penetration. That said its a pig. Sure the true monsters can slow down arrows some but there still soft in the arm pit.
I'm not sure how many bow hogs I've taken, but it's over 100 (I know some guys have killed way more and have more knowledge on this). I can tell you that only two of them were in the range where it was even worth talking about, being able to slow down an arrow. (Slow down not stop)
I've killed about a dozen with 50 lbs recurves and 400 grain total weight arrows with heads in the 1.5 inch cut range and never had a issue.
My current setup is 53lbs at 29 inches and 500 grain total weight carbons with the widest broadheads I can buy. They are hard enough to track crawling around in pig tunnels with good blood let alone an inch wide cut.
190 ribtek or 200 ace...
I also don't think you should put down a head to promote your favorite. I've destroyed a few also just like most here that hunt and shoot a lot.
What is you draw length?
While I agree with that sentiment, if nobody mentions the hen their are potential problems, then nobody will know about them. I can think of a few high dollar broadhead that this applies to.
Grizzlies.
QuoteOriginally posted by pdk25:
While I agree with that sentiment, if nobody mentions the hen their are potential problems, then nobody will know about them. I can think of a few high dollar broadhead that this applies to.
I was referring to the odd failure that ALL broadheads succumb to on occasion, rare occasion. Not referring to a *rash* of problems like a lot of us know about certian heads. And the Wensels are NOT in that *rash* category so those are the type of comments I was referring to. No need in giving them a bad rap when they certainly don't deserve it.
Agreed
:thumbsup:
I often hunt for the big old boars.. They are a completely different critter, imo..
Most of the time I find shots taken from ground level give better penetration than shots from trees..
They can be tough as hell..
The smaller eater pigs are as easy to penetrate as a deer...
QuoteOriginally posted by Jabar:
QuoteOriginally posted by pdk25:
While I agree with that sentiment, if nobody mentions the hen their are potential problems, then nobody will know about them. I can think of a few high dollar broadhead that this applies to.
I was referring to the odd failure that ALL broadheads succumb to on occasion, rare occasion. Not referring to a *rash* of problems like a lot of us know about certian heads. And the Wensels are NOT in that *rash* category so those are the type of comments I was referring to. No need in giving them a bad rap when they certainly don't deserve it. [/b]
I apologize if it seemed like i was giving woodsman heads a bad rap but i wasn't. I shot them for years with excellent arrow flight and no penetration issues at all until shooting large hogs. With a 55# bow I had several of those heads fold up.... its real... it happened. I think the Grizzly heads are much tougher because of the solid fin....
I still love woodsman broadheads & i got a bunch of them too. I just wont use them on pigs or elk again.
My hog experience is pretty limited, but I've taken a few. I'm not a good enuf shot to find the soft spot from much distance and learned last year just how tough the shield can be. The hog pictured below was taken with a 200 gr Grizzly Instinct 3 blade on a Surewood Fir shaft from a 50 lb Toelke Whip. He made it about 60 yds with an ok bloodtrail, but no exit. This year I'll likely be shooting Grizzly Kodiak 235 gr SB 2 blades. I really want 2 holes, and the Kodiaks have performed very well for me on deer.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v450/Fletcher610/20150312_204204.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/Fletcher610/media/20150312_204204.jpg.html)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v450/Fletcher610/20150312_213009%203.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/Fletcher610/media/20150312_213009%203.jpg.html)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v450/Fletcher610/20150313_132316.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/Fletcher610/media/20150313_132316.jpg.html)
Terry, you shootin the original 125 woodsman on an adapter?
Yes....from bunnies to bison.
Thought you were a Delta man, lol...
I am 90% 0f the time. :goldtooth:
Somehow I missed it....nice hog fletcher!!!
I have a dozen 3 Blade Instincs ordered.
love the wensel woodsman - tough 'n' durable, easy to sharpen to a razor edge by literally anyone with a decent flat file, and they fly real nice out of most any trad bow.
i kilt a hog with this one and terry found the arrow a year later. notice how the bugs ate the vanes of the fletching and how the fletch taped bases were still stuck firmly to the shaft. that head cleaned right up and was put back into service.
(http://i.imgur.com/zFLh4Dy.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/U0VCnU6.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/VJ1ouXF.jpg)
Somehow I manage to find a lot of other folks arrows. Not sure how that happens.
And that was a dandy hog Rob!!!
I'll take that non-answer as a zero. :rolleyes:
In my opinion you can't go wrong with the Ace Standard. I would recommend any of the Ace heads. They are a great broadhead at real good price.
I don't understand how some broadheads are advertised as 1:3 ratio, but cleary are not... For instance, the Woodsman: "Follows a 3:1 ratio, 3-blade design. approx 2 5/8" x 1 1/8" "
My maths is good enough to know that thAT IS NOT 1:3. It seems that Toughhead are the only ones with a 1:3 ratio, "The TuffHead™ is 3 3/16 inches long by 1 1/16 inches". However these are a little heavy for me.
Are there anymore broadheads that weigh around 125gr, are 1:3 and only 2 blades?
Thanks
Alex
QuoteOriginally posted by alex321:
I don't understand how some broadheads are advertised as 1:3 ratio, but cleary are not... For instance, the Woodsman: "Follows a 3:1 ratio, 3-blade design. approx 2 5/8" x 1 1/8" "...
yes, the "1:3" term is a loose one, and sometimes it's Very loose.
a true 1:3 broadhead can - in some instances and by the nature of that design ratio - be not as strong or durable as one that's a 1:2.4 ratio. flat delta needle nose 2 blades are, by their 1:3 nature, not as strong as a convex head of the same ratio. however, the flat delta will have less windplane area than a wider convex shape.
by its thickness and temper, a true and robust 1:3 broadhead is clearly the howard hill ...
(http://www.gnwtc.com/vbhb036a.JPG)
... but that alone may not make it a perfect head for all hunting situations.
there aren't that many true 1:3 (width:length) heads around, but it's not that exact, precise ratio that's important - this is one of those instances where close enuf is good enuf.
We've had quite a few poor blood trails from two blade heads(3:1 or otherwise, same for single bevel)
I'm always happy to see guys shooting Woodsmans or Snuffers(since I'll be the guy crawling through a jungle or swamp, all night sometimes:)
If a broadhead will put ONE more drop on the ground it's enough for me to recommend it.
Please, please, shoot them quartering away,too(any size pig, any draw weight bow)just aim for the offside leg.
My personal recovery rate on hogs went way up when I started shooting Woodsmans, plus they're a breeze to sharpen.
AMEN tarponnut, individuals that haven't killed many have one thing to say, and those that have killed many, run leases or outfit have other things to say. I always like to hear the later as those folks are in the know and I agree with them.
FWIW, one of the worst bloodtrails that I have ever had was on a well hit TX hog that I had a complete pass through using a sharp Big Jim big 3 broadhead using my 82# morrison ILF. The hog was found around 150 yards away, but not soon enough to save the meat. There are no guarantees what will happen on a big nasty boar. I understand someones concern, especially when shooting low weight/energy setups. For the vast majority of hogs, the type of broadhead that you use won't matter for penetration reasons. I have shot plenty of them that I have not had an exit wound, or passthrough. I am pretty sure that I would rather have a big entrance wound where the arrow gets stopped on the offside rather than 2 small holes, but some may argue. A larger entrance hole may be less likely to plug up, but that will not always be the case. Simmons heads and 3 blades usually will do a fine job, but really if you are persistant in your tracking and put a good hit on them, just about any head will do. I don't know that there is much reason to get your blood pressure up on the issue, or be kinda snarky to other posters.
for hogs - or really most any critters up to and including 2000# bison - it's SO hard to beat a good 'n' sharp proper 3 blade. just make mine an original glue-on wensel. barry and gene done it right, from the get-go. :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
Rob...you need to come down and hunt....you and Joe Tilford need to meet....maybe we can work out a 'Wild Things' weekend.
soon as the new t/d sparrowhawk arrives .... :D
ok....when does it arrive...we might need to make plans for March. ...no kidding...Joe and I have been talking
ok, i need to kill a hog ... or two. ;)
Have i understood this correctly? you mean 3-1 , three bladed Snuffer and 1 shot ,Right?? LOL
Terry,
March is booked at WT, I just sent Andrew an email to book me for Apr 12-16, those are the first open spots...dont wanna wait til it gets too hot.
That would be a Triple bonus if you & Rob could swing those dates!
OK...let me see what's up and when spring break is....
I have never shot a hog, but then I have never went hog hunting yet. I have been blessed with several 200lb + whitetail. I used snuffers for years with excellent results. I have used woodsmans for years with excellent results. I am presently using 175 Grizzly Instincts. I like the looks and the size of the solid head, and can get them scary sharp in short order. I haven't put one into an animal yet, so I can't brag on them. But one thing for sure, it looks like if you put all of the great things about these three heads together, I have found a real monster.
Kenny, I think you'll like the 175 Instincts. (http://i324.photobucket.com/albums/k359/crittergetter76/Mobile%20Uploads/2015-04/EF159E25-7F0B-4696-B70C-C5275158A1BF_zpskalrjhpr.jpg) (http://s324.photobucket.com/user/crittergetter76/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2015-04/EF159E25-7F0B-4696-B70C-C5275158A1BF_zpskalrjhpr.jpg.html) (http://i324.photobucket.com/albums/k359/crittergetter76/Mobile%20Uploads/2015-04/2BDBF8DF-9EEA-408A-8386-0A1BCF334FB6_zpsjyeljuhf.jpg) (http://s324.photobucket.com/user/crittergetter76/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2015-04/2BDBF8DF-9EEA-408A-8386-0A1BCF334FB6_zpsjyeljuhf.jpg.html)
I think I will be in love.........Good job Randy
If have to go with the Grizzly instinct on a wood arrow. I love them