[ September 20, 2013, 08:59 AM: Message edited by: Rob DiStefano ]
Posted by KPaul (Member # 8976) on January 07, 2011 01:16 PM:
Ben: HH bug bit me also.Have a new Redman 68",53#@28.Can't stop shooting
it.Have'nt touched my other bows.Wondering too about a wesley special
in the future. good luck.my spouse does'nt know about the Redman
.....YET Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 07, 2011 01:22 PM:
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 07, 2011 01:24 PM:
Sorry fellas, I just had to laugh! Jason told me yesterday my new Tembo
was finished and to look for it early next week. This will give me an
all Howard Hill line up with the exception of my Maddog recurve.
Its been a while coming but, "I've Gone to the Hills!" Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on January 07, 2011 01:29 PM:
It bit me too. Got a Wesley about a month ago and see a Big 5 in my near
future. Just a little heavier than 56@28. I have started making POC
arrows again like crazy. I shoot during the day and even again at night
in the basement. Every day!!!
Posted by Cookus (Member # 17834) on January 07, 2011 01:41 PM:
The HH bug has bitten me as well! It all started when I bought a
Wesley Special off of Mike "GRAPES" Vines. After shooting it for the
first time, my Black Widows have gathered dust ever since. With the
right arrow, these things hit right where you're looking! I gave in to
this new malady when I snagged the HH Black Bear off of the classifieds
this morning! Thank God the wife gave an enthusiatic blessing to
proceed! Which bow and what kind of riser wood did you order
Ben? I really liked the ebony riser on the bow you unveiled to us on
Christmas! Sharp!
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 07, 2011 02:18 PM:
Better to beg for forgiveness than to ask for permission!
Since I have some ammunition,let me see here. How about..................
Posted by RC (Member # 162) on January 07, 2011 02:37 PM:
You gotta love it!!! I`ve said this many times, A Hill bow may not be
the fastest,easiest to master or short and easy to move around in a
blind in but they are the most enjoyable killers to shoot.RC
Posted by KPaul (Member # 8976) on January 07, 2011 03:16 PM:
Got this itch for a wesley special with ebony handle.First will have to explain the Redman that I'm shootin now! Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on January 07, 2011 03:27 PM:
KPaul that's easy, "every man has to have a back up bow" Wives have back up pocketbooks don't they?
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 07, 2011 03:29 PM:
Didn't take long did it Ben ! good stuff !
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 07, 2011 03:34 PM:
I just got off the phone with Craig and he's doing the final spray on my "Robin Hood" special.
I've got to get on the ball and sell some bows!...lol
I'm not sure the word "pumped" rises to the level that correctly reflects my mood...lol
God bless, Mudd
Posted by Overspined (Member # 12800) on January 07, 2011 03:40 PM:
I got BIT, I have 2 reman lb's, a Wesley, and a cheetah T/D! Also a Northern Mist classic....HELP!
Posted by Overspined (Member # 12800) on January 07, 2011 03:41 PM:
Anyone want to trade a 68" for a 66"? I need to move up a couple "
Posted by Bill Turner (Member # 2264) on January 07, 2011 04:05 PM:
KPaul you've got good taste. I have a TD "RedMan" with an extra lam of
yew, 64", 53@28 with Ebony riser and tips. It is something special. My
"Wesley Special" is 66", 50@28, carbon backed lambo, with ebony riser,
and elk horn tips and riser overlay. Oh yea, it also has a black ostrich
stitched grip. Hard to beat the clean look of ebony on a Hill bow.
Posted by Rooselk (Member # 1588) on January 07, 2011 04:08 PM:
My HH bite is still itching. That's because I still have another month to go until I'll be able to place my orded.
Kpual, I also plan to order a 68" Redman. I'd love to see pics of your bow if you have any.
Posted by pavan (Member # 21538) on January 07, 2011 04:19 PM:
i saw a fleeting post about a yew Pete George at the Footed Shaft and
jumped all over it. i guess the appropriate word is "shocked", man what
a bow. My wife said "You better get it before someone who does not know
what it is gets it." Can i pick 'em or what.
Posted by smilinicon (Member # 15249) on January 07, 2011 04:23 PM:
I have a 68" Redman and a 70" Wesley Special. I have to say the Wesley
is my favorite. I own many different types of bows and the Hill's are my
favorite. Light as a feather...
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 07, 2011 04:38 PM:
Overspined what are the draw weights of your 66"ers?
God bless,Mudd
[ January 08, 2011, 08:09 AM: Message edited by: Rob DiStefano ]
Posted by TRAD900 (Member # 20553) on January 07, 2011 04:42 PM:
I think I paid for Craig's house with all the Hill's I own.I have over 200 bows,most of them Hill's.
Posted by GingivitisKahn (Member # 13331) on January 07, 2011 04:52 PM:
Congrats! We assume you will have the decency to post copious pictures once you have the new Hill. Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on January 07, 2011 04:57 PM:
I don't want to talk about it.
200 Hills! Man! Can you take a photo of them all?
I'll just say that those bow stringers I mentioned aren't coming over here all by themselves...
And,
I reckon I hinted at it to my wife, but when she finds out... well,
she'll let me know that merely hinting and talking hypotheticals isn't
the same as actually asking. Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on January 07, 2011 04:58 PM:
Oh, and congratulations, LongbowBen! Too much fun!
Posted by Frank V (Member # 3547) on January 07, 2011 05:28 PM:
Longbowben, You are going to love it. They are nice & smooth, forgiving, easy to carry, & just plain pretty. Frank
Posted by Jack Denbow (Member # 9517) on January 07, 2011 06:42 PM:
And I thought I was the only one with a HH itch. I have been resisting
scratching but I think I am weakening. You guys are sure making it hard. Jack
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 07, 2011 08:36 PM:
Jack, go ahead...you'll be cool...your friends will like you...you'll fit in...you'll be in the in crowd!
No pressure here!! Posted by Jerry Jeffer (Member # 8182) on January 07, 2011 08:48 PM:
200!!!!! My goodness man!!!! I guess you looked at the menu and said "I'll take one of every thing".
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 07, 2011 09:14 PM:
Pavan that was almost the Holy Grail there man! A Pete George for
$175...you need to buy a lottery ticket ASAP LOL!!! Congrats on a GREAT
find!
Spanky
Posted by pavan (Member # 21538) on January 07, 2011 10:01 PM:
Maybe I should go back to being a professional poker player and leave the music thing.
Posted by straitera (Member # 13875) on January 07, 2011 10:05 PM:
Hill shooters coming out of the woodwork. Hope you all enjoy as much as I
have all these years. Get used to longer bows w/straight grip &
shame on you.
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 07, 2011 10:48 PM:
This bow has ebony rizer all the way to the back lambs for the old
school look and ebony tips.Im stoked.This will be my 2nd, Wow 200 bows
Trad900 my wife would kill me.Craig said 4-5 weeks Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on January 07, 2011 11:27 PM:
longbowben-
I don't know if I missed it, but what limb material did you get?
Congratulation, Darren
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 07, 2011 11:30 PM:
5 layers of Bamboo with clear glass.Ebony tips and old school ebony handle.
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 07, 2011 11:37 PM:
And all your falt Ben Maher. Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 08, 2011 12:03 AM:
This is my first Wesley special. And
i cant wait for the new one.I couldnt believe how easy it was to shoot a
D bow with a straight grip.And all this talk about hand shock is I must be holding it right.
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 08, 2011 06:12 AM:
I will have to get some pictures to go with this post but I just picked
up from the P.O. a "new-to-me" sweet shooting Big 5 66' 51@28.
Ah ha! I found some online but I'll take some of my own later.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by KPaul (Member # 8976) on January 08, 2011 07:54 AM:
I keep thinking...ebony,ebony,ebony.I like it longbowben. Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 08, 2011 07:58 AM:
Ben...I'll gladly take the blame mate ! I reckon you'll find the longer length all the sweeter and ebony and 'boo under clear glass is about as good as it gets .
Posted by Cookus (Member # 17834) on January 08, 2011 08:44 AM:
Nice looking Big 5 Mudd! How many Hills are you currently providing room and board for?
Posted by Overspined (Member # 12800) on January 08, 2011 09:04 AM:
I shoot a league in winter, some technohunt. I shot my personal best
yesterday and was within many wheelie bow shooters' scores! A 202. I
didn't miss a target. 68" 45# redman. I did get antler tips and ebony
riser. I like the darker risers but have seen some w snakewood too that r
cool! I am finding that I shoot lighter and longer bows about 50 and
less easier and more accurately. I can handle more, but not for long
Posted by Kevin L. (Member # 4270) on January 08, 2011 09:29 AM:
I know all about it. My favorite at the moment is a 66" Wesley drawing
58@28. In fact, most of my bows are within a pound or two of that draw.
Nothing feels like bamboo, whether in a bow limb or a fly rod.
I
think every one who buys, sells or trades bows has the one that they
wish they had back. Mine was a 68" 58@28 Wesley with clear glass, an
ebony riser, dished grip and no tip overlays. That one ended up going to
a new home when money was tight way back in the mid '90s and I still
miss it.
Right now, the stable is down to the Wesley, a Cheetah
and 10 or 11 other assorted longbows, all similar in profile to a Hill.
Add in a couple of '50s style recurves and my project next week is to
make some racks for bows and flintlocks.
Good choice
Kevin
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 08, 2011 09:33 AM:
Any pictures Kevin?
Posted by HARL (Member # 689) on January 08, 2011 09:37 AM:
I always love these threads !!! I am not sure how many fellas I have
warned about trying out a Hill bow.Believe me I found out years ago
about the Hill Bug !!!!!!!
Posted by RRock (Member # 7541) on January 08, 2011 09:39 AM:
Well, that dose it. I've got a couple weeks left here before the season
is out and I'm gonna finish it with my HH Big 5. 55@28" 68". Really like
shooting that bow.
Posted by Jack Denbow (Member # 9517) on January 08, 2011 11:38 AM:
Why did I look at this thread again? Dern you guys. Ebony, ebony, ebony,
now I am going to have to look at the website. I think I am going to
get a whipping. Jack
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 08, 2011 11:58 AM:
African Blackwood makes a great contrasting riser wood against lighter
colored limb cores. Here is my "Owl" that is Osage/African Blackwood.
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 08, 2011 12:02 PM:
Outstanding looking bow.
Posted by Rooselk (Member # 1588) on January 08, 2011 12:08 PM:
Beautiful.
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 08, 2011 12:17 PM:
Here's a couple more Ebony ones for you guys! It looks really nice with clear glass, but I prefer black glass with mine!
The
Hill bug bit me several years ago but he was nothing compared to the
latest one that got me - the Sunset Hill Bug....a vicious little critter
whose bite causes severe anxiety, hair loss, nail biting, and a rapid
loss of available funds! Thank goodness the treatments aren't TOO expensive LOL!
Spanky
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 08, 2011 01:24 PM:
Spanky the 2nd picture up is the handle i am getting That looks sweet.
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 08, 2011 01:25 PM:
And thanks everyone for the pictures.Lets see more Posted by smilinicon (Member # 15249) on January 08, 2011 05:42 PM:
those ebony risers are very nice.
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on January 09, 2011 06:37 PM:
another ebony riser/gray glass. Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 09, 2011 06:58 PM:
quote:Originally posted by David Mitchell: another ebony riser/gray glass.
Every time I've seen this bow I've drooled.
I can't imagine trying to hunt with it unless out in a white sand desert or a full on blanket of snow..lol
Thanks for showing it off again.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Cookus (Member # 17834) on January 09, 2011 07:13 PM:
That's a beautiful bow David! Must resist this ebony temptation...
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 09, 2011 07:14 PM:
Mudd, my new Tembo is going to shock you if you like that one! I won't
tell ya what it looks like yet, except that David and I share the same
taste. Should be here this week some time. Posted by BEN (Member # 5553) on January 09, 2011 08:02 PM:
So...are you ready to sell the GOOD MOAB now! LOL!
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 09, 2011 08:29 PM:
Good try but that bow has sentimental value and i want my son to have it.
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 09, 2011 10:51 PM:
Aww,sell the bow and give Hayden the arrow. It did all the work anyhow! Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 09, 2011 10:55 PM:
Hey spanky,whats the wood in the last riser? Is that verawood?
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on January 10, 2011 08:32 AM:
Mudd, is there no gray tree bark in your area? Posted by KPaul (Member # 8976) on January 10, 2011 08:54 AM:
That last ebony bow has sent me over the edge! Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 10, 2011 09:28 AM:
The gray tree bark in my neck of the woods appears much darker than the gray of your bow.(which I love to look at btw)
Under the following conditions, yours should work great!
God bless,Mudd
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 10, 2011 10:33 AM:
Mike that is a really nice piece of Myrtle. Here's a couple more views.
Nate did a beautiful job on "White Dragon" and it has been become my
favorite bow of all time!
Spanky
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 10, 2011 11:42 AM:
Some very nice bows.I told the wife that i ordered the bow and now im safe.Untill i find another one. Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 10, 2011 11:53 AM:
Your never safe after this bug bites ya LOL!
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 10, 2011 01:09 PM:
Thanks Spanky. Sure is a purty riser.
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 10, 2011 01:10 PM:
quote:Originally posted by longbowben: I told the wife that i ordered the bow and now im safe.
There goes my leverage. Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on January 10, 2011 01:45 PM:
Actually, Mudd, the limbs on my bow are not as light as they appear in
the picture. I should take a better shot of it sometime, but if I do I'm
afraid somebody who may know where I live will break in a steal it it's
so purty....That's my story and I'm stickin' to it. Posted by RC (Member # 162) on January 10, 2011 02:07 PM:
Love those Hill bows. Spanky You have got some fine ones and I like the
Sunset Hill for sure.I love my Mohawk but I`m starting to want a Hill
bow bad. I`ve been thinking about building one.RC
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 10, 2011 04:29 PM:
Sounds good RC! Wish I had the tools, talent, and time to build one
myself but I'll just stick with Nate...I couldn't improve it if I tried!
Keep the Mohawk Bud, but get the Hill you want and keep it this time!!
Spanky
Posted by Cookus (Member # 17834) on January 10, 2011 07:15 PM:
I'm counting the days until my "new to me" Black Bear gets here! Not
ebony, but black none the less! I've got the 2018 XX75s by the door to
give a proper welcoming!
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 10, 2011 07:40 PM:
Cookus, be sure to post some shooting pics of that Black Bear. Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 10, 2011 10:49 PM:
Cookus that is a sweet bow i was drooling.When it shows up pics in
action. Love the bent limb pictures.Leartherneck just had to tell her
when the time was right.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 11, 2011 06:33 AM:
i can't take it any more!!!
you guyz are KILLING ME!!!
rang up jason yesterday, custom big 5 on order ..............
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 11, 2011 06:35 AM:
Rob, I always said you were a man of class and distinction ... But c'mon man ... specs ? Don't leave us hanging ...
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 11, 2011 08:05 AM:
big 5, 68", 52# @ 28" but tillered to my 29.5" (should be 55# to me),
string follow limbset, heat tempered ("carmalized") boo under clear
glass, paduak riser and tip overlays, locator handle under a black laced
leather grip. eta, 4 weeks and counting.
i also have a david
miller ol' tom on order (eta, months and months and months away), 69",
but with all the other same spex as the big 5.
all that's left is a sunset hill, and nate and i will get together on that come the summer, eh nate?
this will complete my 'howard hill trifecta' - ekin hill, miller hill, steen hill. who said life ain't fun .... sometimes! Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 11, 2011 08:15 AM:
Rob, Sounds beautiful ... I love the caramelized 'boo
I am
sure you will love the Miller ... mine is about as sweet as it gets .
Certainly no barn burner but just seems to put the arrows where I am
looking with uncanny accuracy. Dave is great guy to deal with.
I
am have this ongoing conversation with .. my Girlfriend , my accountant
and Nate Steen ... I'll try and get that done sooner rather than later !
Look foward to pics ...
I'm waiting on ... a Belcher Union Jack ..my 2nd but this time in a t/d a Hill "Robin Hood" ... and
as of about five minutes ago I decided to ring Jason and Craig and get
them to make me a new 66" T/d for this March's hunting trip to new
Zealand... but what woods ? Maybe Honey locust or elm .. maybe
caramalized 'boo ? I'll decide in the next few hours and give 'em a call
.. that is if every phone line in Australia ain't cut with all this
flooding !
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 11, 2011 08:25 AM:
oooo, dat's ALL good stuff, ben!
what's yer draw length?
which t/d sleeve - large or small?
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 11, 2011 08:35 AM:
I'm just on 27" ... short for my 5' 10"
...but I'm left handed
which means although I have a short draw length I am inherently a better
shot and better looking than those right handed people who draw over
28" ......
I have come to prefer the large t/d sleeve . May not feel as good but I shoot them just a tad better .
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 11, 2011 08:44 AM:
we'll forgive you for such a short draw length, mate.
i was gonna order out a t/d sleeve but that would mean a straight grip with no locator ... love me locator. Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 11, 2011 08:45 AM:
Hypothetical question here, If someone whos only shot ref/def longbows
wanted to buy a D-bow(HH),what recommendations would you all give to
that person to make the transition smoother? Just hypothetical of
course.
Rob, shot you a PM.
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 11, 2011 08:49 AM:
Rob looks like that bug bit you good.And Ben what TD sleeve is in the bow i got off you?And i agree about us lefty's Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 11, 2011 08:50 AM:
Here's a teaser!!!...lol
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 11, 2011 08:51 AM:
Leatherneck ... I'd just ensure that you have some low stretch
strings , at least 9gns per pound [ i prefer 11 ] and just stick with it
for a couple of weeks . You'll be surprised how accurate they are ,
how much nicer people in the street are to you and how much cooler
you'll look in the safari suit with a back quiver !
Get one in a moderate weight and if you don't like it , you could probably sell it in the classifieds pretty quick .
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 11, 2011 08:52 AM:
Ben , it was the large sleeve .
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 11, 2011 08:56 AM:
Thanks wasn't sure what size but it is very comfortable.
Posted by smilinicon (Member # 15249) on January 11, 2011 09:00 AM:
I go back and forth between R/D longbow (Kohannah Fury), straight grip (HH Redman) and dished (HH Wesley) with no issues.
The R/D LB 'feels' a bit easier to pull and smoother to shoot.
The dished grip feels a bit better to me on the HH's.
I
wish I really liked one type more than the other, but I can't bring
myself to give up any of the bows. The 62" R/D will be for pop-up blind
use and the Hill's are just in my blood now.
Cary
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 11, 2011 09:32 AM:
imho, there are many things to consider about 'longbows'.
for
the most part and for all their outward simplicity, longbows are far
more difficult to design and properly build than one of those 'wired
wheel' type 'bows'.
just like acoustic flat top guitars, longbows
are ALL unique in one way or another. even within the same brand and
model. things crafted from copious amounts of organic material (wood!)
are just that way,
there are significant differences between 'hill-style', 'mild r/d' and 'aggressive r/d' longbows. significant. the differences are manifested mostly in overall performance and the 'feel of the shot'.
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 11, 2011 09:35 AM:
Thanks Ben. I was just asking for a friends,cousins, brothers,nephew that wanted to know. Posted by OPRick (Member # 5480) on January 11, 2011 09:39 AM:
What a great thread! My son (he's 32)and I have been discussing
getting HH bows. I will definetely tell him to look at this abundance
of information and endorsements.
Rick
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 11, 2011 10:03 AM:
Rob, you and Ben don't need to be talking to Nate as he now has two more
to build for me, and I don't want to wait any longer than necessary! I don't know but it seems to me like the Hill bugs are multiplying...might be an epidemic on the way!
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 11, 2011 10:13 AM:
this is a good bug for a trad bowhunter to have! Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on January 11, 2011 11:06 AM:
Ben Maher, it is really amazing how few people realize what you have so
accurately and cogently stated--that left handed shooters are indeed the
best looking dudes out there.....the other thing about being better
shooters I shall leave untouched in the case of yours truly here. Man do
you ever have the fever. Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 11, 2011 11:14 AM:
Its a good thing i got mine ordered before everyone got all fired up.For
the next few months we will get to see lots of new HH bows I cant wait to see all of them.
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 11, 2011 11:37 AM:
quote:Originally posted by longbowben:
Its a good thing i got mine ordered before everyone got all fired
up.For the next few months we will get to see lots of new HH bows I cant wait to see all of them.
Just talked to Craig and he said that since you already have one then he's putting you at the bottom of the list. Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 11, 2011 11:42 AM:
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 11, 2011 12:52 PM:
leatherneck, that's funny right there but, ole Ben would have a coniption waiting! We'd never get a bit of peace! Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on January 11, 2011 03:36 PM:
This HH thing is really catching,before all these new threads I didn't
give these bows much thought,since then the desire is fired! Love Bens
pictures of downunder,but as it is I HATE WAITING FOR BOWS to be
built.My Motto is:"I would much rather be shooting a bow than waiting
for it" I noticed most bowyers have bows in stock,now the decision.I
truly believe its all Mudds fault !LOL
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on January 11, 2011 04:02 PM:
Go Rob! Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 11, 2011 04:18 PM:
Steve, Craig has a few in stock bows listed on his website. Might give it a looksee to see if he has one in your specs. Posted by KPaul (Member # 8976) on January 11, 2011 04:24 PM:
bought my Redman(68",53@28) from the stock bows on the website and love
it!I have unstrung my other bows.Planning on a wes special with
....Ebony! Can't decide on the color glass yet.
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 11, 2011 04:29 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Wannabe1: leatherneck, that's funny right there but, ole Ben would have a coniption waiting! We'd never get a bit of peace!
\
You got that right! And you all dont have to live beside him.
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on January 11, 2011 05:01 PM:
Steve, the neat thing about ordering from Hill is the wait is so short you hardly have time to get antsy. Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 11, 2011 05:04 PM:
That is a fact! I ordered my Tembo on the 15th of Dec. and it's supposed to be here tomorrow or the next day. Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 11, 2011 05:47 PM:
I am really getting...I don't know...
I know that my "Robin Hood" is sitting there finished and ready to ship.
I am waiting on two checks to arrive this week so I can finish paying for it.
It
is so tempting to just go ahead, write and send my check knowing the
other two should be here before mine gets there but should something go
wrong I'd be in trouble.
I'm gonna find my birth certificate and try putting "patience" in my name...lol
Thanks for letting me vent a little frustration.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on January 11, 2011 05:51 PM:
Just got off the phone with Craig and ordered my second HH. Big 5,
string follow with carmalized bamboo. 68" 63#@28 and best of all its a
lefty. I had to get another one before i wore my Wesley out. This is gonna be fun!
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on January 11, 2011 06:32 PM:
Hey Gang-
I've been playing with my new Hill for a couple of
weeks now, and find it hard to put down. I find myself wanting to hold
the bow while watching T.V. This is my first time getting the gloss
finish, it really makes the grain in the wood pop.
Darren
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 11, 2011 06:35 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Blueridge:
Just got off the phone with Craig and ordered my second HH. Big 5,
string follow with carmalized bamboo. 68" 63#@28 and best of all its a
lefty. I had to get another one before i wore my Wesley out. This is gonna be fun!
craig tell you what the tempered boo color would be?
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on January 11, 2011 06:47 PM:
originally posted by Rob: craig tell you what the tempered boo color would be?
Craig told me he buys the bamboo already carmelized; Would it be different shades from the same supplier?
Darren
Posted by Cookus (Member # 17834) on January 11, 2011 06:55 PM:
Head up Mudd! Things will work out. You're old enough to do what's
right... Read Matthew 6:34 Brother! That Robin Hood will be in
Sherwood Forest, Missouri in no time!
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 11, 2011 06:58 PM:
quote:Originally posted by tradlongbow: originally posted by Rob: craig tell you what the tempered boo color would be?
Craig told me he buys the bamboo already carmelized; Would it be different shades from the same supplier?
Darren
"carmalizing"
means heat tempering. when i heat temper bamboo with a propane torch,
it will turn from light tan/green to amber to orange to chocolate,
depending on how long the flame lingers. the heat will make the bamboo
resin rise to the surface and form a 'varnish' coat that changes the
molecular structure of the bamboo - makes it incredibly hard, tough and
durable.
i spoke with jason about my ordered big 5's tempered boo
limbs, they'll be an amber color under clear glass - the edges will
also be ambered.
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 11, 2011 07:01 PM:
No worries Cookus!
I know to take every thought captive.
Thanks for the reminder!
God bless,Mudd
Posted by pauljr (Member # 7809) on January 11, 2011 07:06 PM:
I have a 60lb big five a old friend gifted me with but i just cannot shoot the dang thing. I envy those of you who can.
Posted by pavan (Member # 21538) on January 11, 2011 07:14 PM:
Mudd - If you need a little help and those checks don't show up soon
enough let me know. Would hate to see that bow get away from you at
this stage.
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on January 11, 2011 07:19 PM:
Rob, no he did not. Glad you brought that up. I would like it to be a
honey/ amber color and assumed that's what it would be, clear glass of
course. Jason an I had talked about this a week or so ago. Will give him
another call. Thanks
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 11, 2011 07:22 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Blueridge:
Rob, no he did not. Glad you brought that up. I would like it to be a
honey/ amber color and assumed that's what it would be, clear glass of
course. Jason an I had talked about this a week or so ago. Will give him
another call. Thanks
tell jason you want the same as me - amber faces and edges! dark amber is best on 'boo! hope that's what we both get .....
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on January 11, 2011 07:35 PM:
Rob, no he did not. Glad you brought that up. I would like it to be a
honey/ amber color and assumed that's what it would be, clear glass of
course. Jason an I had talked about this a week or so ago. Will give him
another call. Thanks
Posted by Rick Butler (Member # 7393) on January 11, 2011 07:35 PM:
Dang it! I was hopin' that maybe by some chance, or twist of fate Craig
might show up at Kzoo, but the way you guys are ordering bows he's not
gonna get out of his shop til next fall. Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on January 11, 2011 07:42 PM:
Rob , sounds about right. Thanks you're a big help
Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on January 11, 2011 07:49 PM:
Tw,thanks for the heads up.Just can't make up the mind ,an age thing.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 11, 2011 07:49 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Blueridge: Rob , sounds about right. Thanks you're a big help
lemme know what the ekin fellers tell ya .... thanx.
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on January 11, 2011 08:16 PM:
Rob , sounds about right. Thanks you're a big help
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on January 11, 2011 08:21 PM:
I spoke to Jason last week, he told me since, I posted the pics of my
bow, he's been getting a lot of calls about the caremlized bamboo. And I
just got off the phone with Craig, he told me that the orders are
coming in as well for the Carmelized Bamboo Hills.
This year is going to be good for Ekins, with the Robin Hood bow and guys wanting new bows with the carmelized limbs.
Darren
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on January 11, 2011 08:24 PM:
Not sure why my posts are double???
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 11, 2011 08:29 PM:
I have gone on a different tangent and ordered a Hill I have not had
before ... and believe me I have had or have orederd for customers just
about every wood combo going ...
Be interesting to see how this one pans out !
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 11, 2011 08:34 PM:
darren's big 5 w/caramelized boo ...
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 11, 2011 08:39 PM:
Drool!
That's another awesome looking Hill you've posted there Rob.
God bless,Mudd
PS: Thank you Pavan for your offer of help and thank you also Rob!
My
"Robin Hood" isn't at any risk of being lost though. I am way ahead of
my payment schedule with Craig, it's just me that was whining...lol
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 11, 2011 08:43 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Ben Maher:
I have gone on a different tangent and ordered a Hill I have not had
before ... and believe me I have had or have orederd for customers just
about every wood combo going ...
Be interesting to see how this one pans out !
spit it out man! what did you order?????
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 11, 2011 08:44 PM:
I wanted a Tembo as I haven't had one yet. Plus, it will be one to stay
as I'm dedicating it to my son when he gets old enough to shoot it. All
he talks about is shooting bows with his Papa!
Can't say more or I'll be giving away the excitement of getting it. Posted by Cookus (Member # 17834) on January 11, 2011 08:48 PM:
Is anyone adding inlays to their new bows? Craig does some super work!
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on January 11, 2011 08:54 PM:
Darren that's a great looking bow, what is the riser wood ? CocoBolo?
That's what I got on my Wesley and ordered dark Shedua on my B5.
Posted by Kevin L. (Member # 4270) on January 11, 2011 09:09 PM:
Man, you guys are re-infecting me with the bug
I
want a new one, but my best friend and I are trying to get the $$$
together to open a fly shop, so it'll have to wait. I decided if we get
it up and running, I'll celebrate the 1 year mark with a new bow.
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on January 11, 2011 09:19 PM:
Mine's nearly ready for the glue-up!
Posted by frank bullitt (Member # 17387) on January 11, 2011 09:36 PM:
Oh my Lord, did I read right, pg. 5, Rob has ordered a new Big 5?...Sweet!
This post reminds me of the commercial of the boys, bragging about their broken bones and injuries!
A toast to all, who Keep Howard's Spirit and Love of this Sport Alive!
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 11, 2011 09:44 PM:
Frank, I am now 99% a Howard Hill only fan. I do have one recurve from
Maddog Archery that I can't let go as it is #1 of his new 60" recurve
model.
Went through an enormous amount of different bows just to
find that I love and shoot Hills the best. Nothing like a good ole
American Classic to sooth the savage beast!
'Course this is only one mans opinion. Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 11, 2011 10:08 PM:
Let's see, Ben probably has either a "Cougar" or a "Ruffed Grouse" coming....what say ye Mate?
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on January 11, 2011 10:09 PM:
Nah, it's two men's opinion at least. Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 11, 2011 10:15 PM:
I am thinking that I might have to get myself a Half breed later in the year.
Inner lams of bamboo and outer lams of yew under black glass with some nice dark riser wood. 68" and around 48-50@28.
I'm sure dreaming is ok!!..lol
God bless,Mudd
PS: Hi My name is Mudd and I'm a "Hillbowahaolic"!!
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 11, 2011 10:19 PM:
Roy, you would cover the beauty of Yew with black glass?! Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on January 11, 2011 10:38 PM:
Blueridge-
Yes, That's Cocobola. It looks great under the high gloss finish.
Darren
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on January 11, 2011 10:39 PM:
Rob just heard from Craig. "dark amber/honey colored, very nice
looking!". Leaving for Tanzania in a week should be ready when I get
back.
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 11, 2011 10:41 PM:
Yeah, I think you're right TW.
That would be just... well.. wrong huh?...lol
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 11, 2011 11:02 PM:
Spanky... I have had the Ruffed Grouse and Cougar ...
Rob ... You'll really like it
Its got blue glass and foam core ...... heheheh
I ain't telling ya nuthin !
But there is an insect in my office ... its buzzin around ... is it a bee ? No .. i think it may be a W#%^&
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 11, 2011 11:05 PM:
I don't think I have ever even seen a pic of a Wasp there Ben! Make sure you post a few when she gets down under! Conrats!
Spanky
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 11, 2011 11:18 PM:
Neither have I Ken thats why i jumped in the deep end and went for
something new . If i brought another Redman , Halfbreed or Wesley home
my girl would leave me ... hang on a minute , if thats the case ... where did I put Craig's number ... a new Redman t/d would be nice ..... Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 11, 2011 11:27 PM:
Ben, I too would like to see the Wasp. Have yet to see one of those.
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 11, 2011 11:30 PM:
This bug is real bad.And i thought i had a problem.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 12, 2011 05:56 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Ben Maher: ... Its got blue glass and foam core ...... heheheh ...
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on January 12, 2011 10:25 AM:
Mudd, black glass over yew limbs! Might as well spray paint the Mona Lisa! Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 12, 2011 10:59 AM:
Don't be too hard on our ol buddy Mudd there David. Some of the old
masters built some mighty fine yew bows with colored glass - it's faster
than clear you know, and I think it looks cool!
Like my Mate Ben, i've got a secret surprise coming too but I ain't tellin nothin!
Hey Ben, post up some pics of that Miller for Mudd will ya? Spanky Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on January 12, 2011 12:06 PM:
Classy looker there Spanky! I like it.
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on January 12, 2011 01:08 PM:
Spanky-
I like that brown glass. Is the riser Myrtle?
Darren
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 12, 2011 03:08 PM:
Lads , my Miller Ol' Tom is brown glass over Yew limbs and looks fantatstic , much like Spanky's bow up top.
I like coloured glass .
Mudd...it would look sweeet !!!!!!!
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 12, 2011 03:18 PM:
hey ben, what's the spex on yer ol' tom?
and is it a string follow?
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 12, 2011 03:20 PM:
"Show-Me!" Ben....lol
I am from Missouri you know...lol
God bless,Mudd
Posted by pavan (Member # 21538) on January 12, 2011 03:34 PM:
Spanky, how many of those Schulz jobs would you own right now if they
were still being made? I have two and that Pete George yew/brown glass,
I am curious to compare it to my son's Timberline yew/clear glass. I
have a hard time convincing people how hard those old bows shoot.
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 12, 2011 03:36 PM:
I have to concede that Spanky's bow looks pretty sharp. I meant no
disrespect toward Roy or anyones personal choice. I myself would not
cover Yew as I like to see the color change as it ages but, again,
Spanky's bow looks very nice! Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 12, 2011 03:42 PM:
TW don't worry about anything you said to me.
It's all good!!
I can take a good ribbing any time and even someone questioning my judgment.
Shoot there are lots of times I question it myself...lol
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 12, 2011 03:51 PM:
Thanks Mudd, I appreciate that!
Spanky, who built that bow? I did a search for American Longbow but, came up with nothing that resembled the one you have above.
Posted by pavan (Member # 21538) on January 12, 2011 04:16 PM:
With half breeds and colored glass, i think they look nice with the yew in the middle and the bamboo on the outside.
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 12, 2011 05:22 PM:
Allright lads here she is ...
Rob,
she is 66" 53# @ 27 " and string follow . Perhaps the sweetest bow in
my stable . Now I love clear glass over pretty woods as much as the next
guy but grew up with black and brown glass on my bows ... they just
look deadly in my opinion . The Myrtle Dave uses is the best I have seen
. As for clear glass on my 'curves ... no way !
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 12, 2011 05:33 PM:
oooooooo. so that's what i have to look forward to in about 3-4 months.
cool beans. man, that myrtle is stunning - what we luthiers call
'quilt flame', real purty.
you switched from boo to yew for the cores?
how's the string follow feel on release and shoot for ya?
bottom line - congrats ben! Posted by RC (Member # 162) on January 12, 2011 06:10 PM:
You guys got it bad....Glad I`m reformed and hav`nt even looked at the hill pics ya`ll posted......RC
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on January 12, 2011 06:31 PM:
Ben-
How's that book from Dave Miller?
Darren
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 12, 2011 06:48 PM:
Its a good 'booklet' much the same as John Schulz "Hitting them like Howard Hill "
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 12, 2011 07:35 PM:
Pavan, if I had the money I would own every model that John built...AND
Pete George!! These old bows are some hard hitters and shoot really
well.
That is a John Shultz bow called "The Favorite". Yew limb
cores, brown glass, Myrtle riser with a string follow profile...a really
sweet shooter! American Longbow Company was the name of his business
and one of his sons Steve is trying to bring it back.
Thanks for
the complements on the Shultz bow guys, but she belongs to another great
guy now! That and the Pete George I had were the bows I had to sell
last year to fund my sons adoption. I miss them dearly, but they
couldn't have been sacrificed for a greater cause!
I have some really, really cool stuff coming this year so stay tuned!
Spanky
Posted by Ray_G (Member # 15164) on January 12, 2011 10:56 PM:
Spanky,
I got to handle one of them (roughed out) last Saturday. A blessed man you are! Family and bows.
Ray
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 12, 2011 11:13 PM:
Sweet looking bow you got there Ben!!!
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 12, 2011 11:16 PM:
Thank you Ben!! That's a slick looking bow.
God bless,Mudd
PS: I guess I need to get some pictures of my Osage Royale by Chuck Jones. It's another sweet shooting Hill style bow.
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 12, 2011 11:31 PM:
Thanks Ray! I would have to say your pretty lucky yourself as you get to
see and handle those works of art before I do! You'll have to get Nate
to fill you in on what we've come up with now...you ain't seen nothin
yet Bud!
Spanky
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 13, 2011 12:37 AM:
Pics Mudd ! We need Pics ! Always wanted to see one of those back fromback when he advertsied in the old days of TBM .
Spanky, c'mon mate give us a hint !
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 13, 2011 01:07 AM:
Can't do it Ben ...i've been sworn to secrecy! I will say though that you've never seen Sunset Hills like these before mate hehehe! Yes Mudd, we must have pics!
Spanky
Posted by Michigan Mark (Member # 28096) on January 13, 2011 01:20 AM:
Bug nothin its an outbreak.
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on January 13, 2011 08:11 AM:
Horrible epidemic
. And here I was happy with the rack full of Hills and Northern Mist
and Fred Anderson bows I possess (or that possess me). Now you guys go
and talk about Nate's bows and show these Hills like I don't have (yet).
Have you no shame??? Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 13, 2011 08:24 AM:
I hope you enjoy seeing this simple beauty.
My Osage Royale by Chuck Jones 66" 52@28.
Thanks for looking.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 13, 2011 08:25 AM:
there are SO many good american flat longbow bowyers out there in longbow-land. way cool! Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 13, 2011 10:13 AM:
That is a cool looking bow Mudd! Imagine what it's gonna look like after it ages a bit!
Congrats, Spanky
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 13, 2011 10:26 AM:
Hey David, let me go ahead and send ya over the edge Bud!
I just ain't right!
Spanky Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 13, 2011 10:34 AM:
Spankyneal i think i could help you and take some of those leftys off your hands. Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on January 13, 2011 10:35 AM:
Aaaaaaaaaaaaaagh! Now that just can't be right to do a guy like that. I
even see a lefty Nate Steen bow there--o, the torment! Posted by Jack Denbow (Member # 9517) on January 13, 2011 12:45 PM:
Dern you guys, you all ain't right. I am trying to resist till Denton
Hill to fondle and shoot some Hill's before ordering but you all are
making it tough to wait. I already have a list started of bows to order.
Help. Jack
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 13, 2011 12:52 PM:
This is like being a kid in a candy store! You guys are killing me with
these beauties. Love all the pics as they provide great wood combo ideas
for future bows! Posted by blueslfb (Member # 12165) on January 13, 2011 01:51 PM:
no no no - no talk of buying, selling, trading - that's strictly for the classifieds.
[ January 13, 2011, 02:17 PM: Message edited by: Rob DiStefano ]
Posted by sunset hill (Member # 2674) on January 13, 2011 02:03 PM:
You guys are killin' me....this thread has been fun to watch!
Spanky, if you leak one word, no more rep. status for you!
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 13, 2011 02:05 PM:
blueslfb That is just sad.
I am sorry that your plan didn't work out for you.
God bless,Mudd
[ January 13, 2011, 02:17 PM: Message edited by: Rob DiStefano ]
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 13, 2011 02:18 PM:
Ooooh snap!
Yes oh bowyerson, I'll be good hehehe!
Don't
worry guys the first one that Ray fondled will be here shortly with
pics to follow as always! This is the best Hill thread we've had in a
long time - I love it!
Spanky
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 13, 2011 02:25 PM:
Oooops!
Posted by pavan (Member # 21538) on January 13, 2011 04:17 PM:
There is a town near here that had a choice, a university or the state
insane asylum, they chose the insane asylum. When anyone would exhibit
traits of OCD everyone would say "they should take you to Cherokee".
Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder, OCD, is an anxiety disorder and is
characterized by recurrent, unwanted thoughts (obsessions) and/or
repetitive behaviors. Apparently, it is addictive. I almost,
almost put in an order for every Hill model available at one time.
Something for the kids to fight over after my wife kills me.
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 13, 2011 04:39 PM:
Sorry Rob!
I wasn't thinking... just responded with a knee jerk reaction.
I'll watch it closer from now on.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 13, 2011 05:15 PM:
nah, no problem at all, roy. Posted by Oliverstacy (Member # 13039) on January 13, 2011 06:34 PM:
Can you still get the grey glass? That is cool!
Josh
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 13, 2011 06:56 PM:
Yes the gray glass is still available! I think it would look really cool on the back with a white belly!
Spanky
Posted by Kelly (Member # 1777) on January 13, 2011 08:15 PM:
Was talking to Nate the other day and he told me........! Guess, I can't say either or he'll take away my "friend" status.
Just think you'll all be "impressed"! Posted by Overspined (Member # 12800) on January 14, 2011 12:44 AM:
I have tried to get a variety. They are so stable and fun to shoot. They just fit me!
1) wesley w/ extra veneer of bacote on back for camo...its a real shooter 2)T/D
cheetah matched to the wesley...same arrows for elk! or backpack trips
with an elk inlay and extra cocobolo center lam w/ cocobolo riser 3)Redman...all yew..new in November w/ elk tips and black riser! Love it. 4)Redman for the wife 5)An
excellent Northern Mist Classic 68". I LOVE this bow too!!!
Unbelievably quiet and fast...hard to beat light stained curly maple
veneers. If you love HH bows, try one. 6)hill style Black Rhino for the little one 7)Red Bear longbow for the little bigger one 8)XXX Got caught up in a big lay-off at work...so when I get rehired somewhere we will see!
Yup, I am infected. Why do I check the classifieds????
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on January 14, 2011 01:54 AM:
I wonder if Ben dropped the string inside in that photo?
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 14, 2011 04:35 AM:
Mate, are you suggesting that my target panic , whilst at full draw inside the house , might bet the better of me ? ... No, better not answer that... Any word on your delivery date for the new addition?
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on January 14, 2011 04:46 AM:
Just yesterday, I missed a shrub elephant at thirty metres, and then
found myself having to try really hard not to drop the string as I drew
and held on various spots out on the oval.
Craig told me it was nearly ready for glue-up a few days ago.
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 14, 2011 04:57 AM:
Holding and not dropping the string is an ongoing battle for me ... it's my great white whale ...
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 14, 2011 10:35 AM:
a big5 craig built for me a few years back ...
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on January 14, 2011 10:38 AM:
Nice Rob, what is the riser wood ? I changed mine at the last minute to Padauk.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 14, 2011 10:42 AM:
that was cocobolo.
the new big5 is paduak, just for something different.
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 14, 2011 10:59 AM:
Very nice.Im glad the wait isnt that long i might go crazy.Rob is that
locator grip comfortable?I have locator grips on my MOAB and thier great
i just wasnt sure because thier is lots more wood in the handle.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 14, 2011 11:11 AM:
wouldn't have a hill-style without a locator. i have a moab. there is a
big difference 'tween that handle shape and a hill w/locator.
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 14, 2011 11:20 AM:
I haven't shot the locator grip but, I do like the dished over the
straight. My "Owl" is straight and my "Redman" is dished. The new
"Tembo" will have a dished grip also. Hopefully it will be here today!
Posted by magnus (Member # 17483) on January 14, 2011 11:22 AM:
I'm so bitten by the HH but unfortunately I can't scratch it. I want one soooo bad! Thanks for sharing all the great pics!
Keeping the Faith! Magnus
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 14, 2011 11:23 AM:
Wannabe1 are you going to be ok or is it time to play sick and wait for the USPS man. Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 14, 2011 11:31 AM:
I am playing sick waiting for the USPS man! Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 14, 2011 11:37 AM:
more hill-style eye candy ...
my used-to-be ol' big5
st.
charles pac yew t/d and busted bunny during a texas hunt (yep, them was
woodies i was huntin' with, and ace broadheads) ... i loved that pac
yew but at 64" it was too durn short, i need a good 68" hill-style
longbow ...
a nice hill wesley that came and went ...
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 14, 2011 11:40 AM:
Rob, you don't know how bad I wanted that Wesley! I just didn't have the
funds at the time. I wish Jay would make that Pac Yew in 68-70". I'd
place an order in a heart beat.
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 14, 2011 11:45 AM:
Definitely eye candy.And i hope you are going to be all right Wannabe1.I
will be looking for pictures when i get home from work tonight lets
have some action photos Posted by magnus (Member # 17483) on January 14, 2011 11:45 AM:
Rob what did you not like about the 64"? I tend to favor shorter bows.
50-52" on my curves. Love my 68" R/D long bow too. Just prefer shorter.
Keeping the Faith! Magnus
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 14, 2011 11:49 AM:
I don't know about Rob but, I found mine to be not as stable when
shooting like a 68" on up bow. It shot pretty good but, I couldn't get
consistent with it so, I let it go.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 14, 2011 11:49 AM:
the pac-yew longbow is currently only available in one length - 64".
even though it's got some backset/reflex in the limbs, it's not good for
my 29+" draw length. might get away with 28", but would be perfect for
27". it is an amazing longbow in both draw and release. i'm just
emailed jay to see if he'd build me a t/d classic at 68". i ain't
holding my breath, though.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 14, 2011 11:51 AM:
i'm with tw - for hill type longbows, the design predicates the absolute
need for a longer overall bow length, to better work with such a short
riser and long limbs. far more so if there's no backset, and they're
straight, or worse yet with bellyset (string follow).
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 14, 2011 11:51 AM:
I too pull 29". Rob, let me know what Jay says. Maybe enough of us long draws can get him to build a new form.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 14, 2011 11:52 AM:
i'll report back here on this thread ....
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 14, 2011 12:48 PM:
I just received these teasers from Craig.
The real hard truth is that I brow beat him into getting these to me..lol Sorry Craig!
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 14, 2011 12:55 PM:
That's a real beauty Roy. I'm looking forward to your shooting report. Congratulations! Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 14, 2011 01:23 PM:
Lookin good Roy! That Texas Ebony looks real nice with the Yew! I bet your really chompin at the bit now huh!
Congrats,
Spanky
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 14, 2011 02:35 PM:
Roy, it looks okay I suppose ... i know that when mine gets here in a
few weeks it will look better though...because it'll be left handed!
Only
kiddin'... they look fantastic. I can't wait for mine . For a kid who
went to sleep every nite with Images of Errol Flynn loosing Grey goose
justice running through his head , and daydreamed of Sherwood adventures
it'll be just the ticket methinks. Thanks for posting the pics Mudd.
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 14, 2011 04:25 PM:
If you haven't seen my new bow yet, follow the link below.
Mudd that's a beauty. I think I like the Royal better though. Then again what do I know.
Keeping the Faith! Magnus
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 14, 2011 07:03 PM:
There will be more pictures posted once I get it here to "Sherwood" in L.A., MO...lol
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on January 14, 2011 07:34 PM:
Mudd,That is one nice looking bow !This will definately go with your green outfit!LOL, Roy what are the stats on your new bow?
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 14, 2011 07:52 PM:
Nice bow Mudd! You guys have gotten me in big trouble. I have a HH
coming and a Mohawk coming to test drive. I sure hope I don't like them
both!
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 14, 2011 08:24 PM:
quote:Originally posted by leatherneck:
Nice bow Mudd! You guys have gotten me in big trouble. I have a HH
coming and a Mohawk coming to test drive. I sure hope I don't like them
both!
two very different longbows - don't compare them, love them each for what they are, as the superb individuals they be.
GET THEM BOTH!
read that again! Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 14, 2011 08:37 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano:
quote:Originally posted by leatherneck:
Nice bow Mudd! You guys have gotten me in big trouble. I have a HH
coming and a Mohawk coming to test drive. I sure hope I don't like them
both!
two very different longbows - don't compare them, love them each for what they are, as the superb individuals they be.
GET THEM BOTH!
read that again!
Thanks for the kind words. Now pay heed to what Rob says....lol He's right on the money with his assessment.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 14, 2011 08:42 PM:
Rob/Roy are both correctomundo! I had a 68" Mohawk that I got on a trade
from Papa Bear(Larry) and I regret to this day ever letting that thing
slip from my hands. It was one smooth shooting longbow! Posted by Rooselk (Member # 1588) on January 14, 2011 09:49 PM:
I really love the pics of the HH bows you guys have been posting. But I
especially appreciate finally seeing a pic of a Hill bow with a myrtle
riser. I'm going to be ordering a Hill bow soon and have considered
having it made with woods native to the Pacific Northwest where I live. I
thought of myrtle for the riser but wasn't sure how it would look with
yew limbs.
Posted by RC (Member # 162) on January 14, 2011 10:55 PM:
Ya`ll did it!!!I`m working out a trade for one now.I`ll have a "Hawk" and "Hill" in the house...Life is good.Thank You Lord.RC
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 14, 2011 10:59 PM:
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 14, 2011 11:07 PM:
Wow, now there's a big surprise RC...like we didn't know that was gonna happen! Hope it's a good one for ya!
Spanky
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 14, 2011 11:15 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano:
quote:Originally posted by leatherneck:
Nice bow Mudd! You guys have gotten me in big trouble. I have a HH
coming and a Mohawk coming to test drive. I sure hope I don't like them
both!
two very different longbows - don't compare them, love them each for what they are, as the superb individuals they be.
GET THEM BOTH!
read that again!
No,No.
Our chat Rob didn't fall on deaf ears. I understand they are completely
different. I wanted to try them both and Vince was more than willing to
ship me one out. I'm gonna have a fun week next week. Maybe an
expensive one to boot.
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on January 15, 2011 12:00 AM:
I agree, everyone that like longbows should have a hill and a mohawk. Darren
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on January 15, 2011 12:48 PM:
OK, I just gotta ask this question--I own five Hill bows--four made by
Craig and one by John Schulz. The Schulz made bow is right on the
weight marked, the other four are all 4# heavier than marked weight on
my scale and others I have checked them on. All my other bows (about
14) all weigh essentially as marked on my scale. A buddy got a new Hill
3 weeks ago and it was the same way when he checked it on his
scale--right about 4# heavier than marked. What gives? Anyone else
found this to be the case? It has not created a problem for me but
could for some people if they are ordering right at their max shooting
weight. I love all my Hills and would order again (and am sorely
tempted because of this thread but I would seriously consider ordering 4# lighter than what I was shooting for I think.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 15, 2011 12:59 PM:
it's all a question about the scales used and how carefully you take a weight reading on yer bow.
i
use an easton digital scale. it's extremely accurate. is use the
"clothes pin on the shaft" to check the draw length weight. the shaft is
a 32" 5/16" woodie, marked at 26" to 31" in 1/2" increments, from the
depth of the nock's throat.
when the clothes pin hits the riser i
let down. the scaled weight is retained on the easton scale. i do this
three times, just to make sure.
imo, analog spring scales just aren't as accurate as digital scales. ymmv.
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on January 15, 2011 01:07 PM:
I realize that Rob, but my spring scale says my other bows are on target weight...my Hills are 4# above. Why just the Hills?
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 15, 2011 01:58 PM:
quote:Originally posted by David Mitchell: I realize that Rob, but my spring scale says my other bows are on target weight...my Hills are 4# above. Why just the Hills?
what
i said - spring scales just aren't as accurate as digital scales. easy
to calibrate digital ... not gonna happen with analog. if three
bowyers each had analog spring scales, they might get three different
readings on the same bow. it happens far more than we think. then
there's the marketing fudge factor - the bow is marked 55# and shoots a
fast arrow, but on a digital scale it reads 59# .... hmmmmmmmmm.
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 15, 2011 02:59 PM:
I agree with Rob...it's probably just the difference between Craigs
scale and others. However I will interject one more thought pertaining
to bows in general. When bows are made from natural materials, and built
to a formula, weight differences will occur due to variations in the
material. Sometimes the weight can be brought in line while maintaining
proper tiller, and sometimes not. That's why one bow can have 10lbs
shaved off after it's built and the next can only have 2-3. At least
that's how I see it.
Spanky
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 15, 2011 03:05 PM:
true, spanky, but if i ask for a 60# @ 29" bow, i better not get one
tillered at 64# or 56#. a good bowyer will be able to get within 2# of
the target draw length weight, most at less than a pound. more bowyers
are starting to use really good digital scales like the easton (not
cheap at around $140). like i said, there is a bunch of fudging going
on with draw/holding weights recorded on too many stick bows.
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 15, 2011 03:20 PM:
Dave, that is my experience with Craig's bow too .
Posted by Orion (Member # 2759) on January 15, 2011 03:55 PM:
My experience as well, Dave. Have owned several Hills over the years.
Most have been 2-3# heavy. One was right on. This is on a spring scale
on which almost all my other bows, (more than 50 over the years) have
come out at weight. Of course, some of those were off a tad, too.
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 15, 2011 04:45 PM:
I'm in BIG trouble guys. I just got a Halfbreed in the mail for a test
drive. Now mind you Jason sent this bow out on Thur. and I got it
already. Thats fast. Anyhow, it's time to pick out some woods. I
found the Hill to be an exceptional shooter. A little thump, but an
exceptional shooter. I'm very pleased with this bow. The bow is gorgeous
at that! It doesn't have exactly all that I want so this one will be
going back. But, I'll be calling my order in on Monday. Thanks for everyones help.
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 15, 2011 04:49 PM:
Ooooh Yaaaah! You done gone and got bit! We'll be looking forward to pics of the new addition soon!
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 15, 2011 04:51 PM:
Anyhow, it's time to pick out some woods
Well... I'd suggest yew , or perhaps maybe yew or if you are feeling adventurous what about yew ?
Seriously
, then caramalised 'boo looks crazy good as does juniper, yew or Elm
over bamboo cores . If you straight woods and no 'boo I'd recommend
wither yew or elm .
Myself, I'm partial to yew ... Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 15, 2011 04:55 PM:
i'm partial to nothing but 'boo. maybe the caramalized flavor, too - gotta see how my b5 turns out. Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 15, 2011 04:59 PM:
I gotta brag on my "Owl" because she shoots very nice. Osage is by far
my favorite bow wood. Don't know why I just didn't go for the Crocodile
when I ordered it. Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 15, 2011 05:25 PM:
for woods, it's gotta be osage or yew for me, in that order.
but man, the smoooothness of grass limbs is *SO* good!!!
unless
the cane or 'boo is stained, it's pretty plain jane looking. but heat
tempering ("caramelizing") really takes the grass coloring to a whole
new level.
i know that first hand from flaming raw bamboo
tubes. it can go from near very light tan or just cut green, to amber
or orange or dark chocolate, and at the same time the properties are
changed into a completely different substance that's incredibly durable
and *stiff*.
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on January 15, 2011 05:27 PM:
My favourite is yew (my second, better-fitting, Redman is in the works),
followed by normal yellow bamboo, and someday perhaps an osage
Crocodile will make its way here. Another fellow in town just got a
Crocodile, so I am looking forward to seeing that. My preference is for
clear glass, and for some reason, I prefer my Hills to be the ones made
out of all the same timber in the limbs, rather than mixtures.
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 15, 2011 05:36 PM:
Ben said I prefer my Hills to be the ones made out of all the same timber in the limbs, rather than mixtures.
Great minds think alike ! Me too!
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on January 15, 2011 05:37 PM:
OK, Ben amd Orion, didn't think I would be only one who experienced this little discrepancy.
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 15, 2011 05:40 PM:
I too am partial to yew!
I can say it hasn't always been that way though.
There was a time when it was all "grass" but in my opinion yew is.... well it's yew!
God bless,Mudd Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on January 15, 2011 05:46 PM:
My mate Tony, who now owns my previous Redman, weighed that bow and
found it to be spot-on. He also weighed other bows to make sure of the
readings. They all seemed good.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 15, 2011 05:54 PM:
it would be great if there was an easy way to standardize weight scale calibration. until then, YMMV! Posted by Rooselk (Member # 1588) on January 15, 2011 05:55 PM:
Yew for me as well. I already have a Blacktail recurve and a Blacktail
longbow with yew limbs and I see no reason to be switching woods when I
order my Hill.
That said, I'm finding it a little troubling to
read here that if I order a 54# @ 27" Hill bow I might actually receive a
58# @ 27" bow. Sorry, but that just won't cut it.
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 15, 2011 06:01 PM:
Rooselk, it is my experience that the bows will come in at weight or
heavier , never lighter. I have had many Hills that came in bang on as
requested poundage wise.
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 15, 2011 06:13 PM:
So far this is what I want. 66" 54@27 Wesley Special. Limbs- I'm leaning toward caramelized boo limbs(I too prefer the amber color). Riser-locator
grip with ??? Not sure of the handle wood. What do you all think Texas
Ebony will look like with the amber limbs? Suggestions ?
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 15, 2011 06:17 PM:
Hey Mike, if ya go caramelized then anything with brown, black or red
would be my choice (Cocobolo, TX Ebony, Ebony, Macassar, Bocote, etc.)
If ya go with the amber then Osage...yeah baby!!
Spanky
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 15, 2011 06:22 PM:
the big 5 i just ordered has caramelized 'boo under clear glass and paduak riser and tip overlays, laced black grip.
paduak Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on January 15, 2011 07:15 PM:
Hey Gang,
The bug got me, BIG! I couldn't resist ordering a 68" 55# at 28" Dual Shelf Robin Hood Bow. Note the Serial number of #50 of 50.
(That does not mean Craig has sold out, I just asked if I could have the last one in the series. He said, Yes!)
I
have always wanted a Dual Shelf Bow. My friend, Leo Markert, has told
me I need to develop the left side as well as the right side.
So, here she is!
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 15, 2011 07:19 PM:
gorgeous! congrats!
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 15, 2011 07:24 PM:
Aw! Matt!! You just had to post this one huh?
You dawg!!!!
Not really, congratulations buddy!!
Now tell me how she feels... nothing dirty... just talk to me man!!
I wish you lived a lot closer.
God bless,Mudd
PS: I think we will need some action shots from both sides.
Posted by Cookus (Member # 17834) on January 15, 2011 07:25 PM:
That's a beautiful bow Raging Water! Have you ever shot "lefty" before?
Posted by droz il (Member # 24230) on January 15, 2011 07:31 PM:
Nice, I like the dual shelf. The wait is over for me. My itch has been
scratched also. Robin Hood #11, LH 68" 45@28 showed up today. Dale
Posted by Rooselk (Member # 1588) on January 15, 2011 08:17 PM:
Now THAT is one absolutely gorgeous bow! Congrats. Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 15, 2011 08:38 PM:
Very cool Matt. I like the dual shelf idea. Makes it more marketable if you decide to pass it along! Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on January 15, 2011 09:28 PM:
I bet Ole Robin Hood could shoot lefty and righty. That is what gave me the idea (Plus, Leo's encouragement).
Craig was willing to do it. Thanks, Craig Ekin! Great Fellow!
Plus, since it is #50 of 50 with a Dual Shelf, I thought that would be kind of unique, too.
I hope to get some action shots with my right handed arrows and my left handed arrows. Which end goes on first?
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on January 16, 2011 07:41 PM:
This thread went on forever. How come whenever I make a post the thread dies?
Matt
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 16, 2011 07:48 PM:
Aaaah, it ain't dead Matt. Just resting a spell!
I've had nothing but non stop rain so haven't been able to get out and
shoot the Tembo yet. Shooting results too follow soon. Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 16, 2011 07:49 PM:
Matt you said you got the last one!!...lol
Number 50 of 50.
Watch you mail buddy.
God bless, Mudd
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 16, 2011 07:52 PM:
i predict - heck, i know! - this thread will be resurrected more than a
few times as the bows start arriving into our sweaty little hands .... Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 16, 2011 08:02 PM:
This is my baby hanging 20 ft in the crisp 20 deg air this evening waiting for a doe they went around me. Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on January 16, 2011 08:15 PM:
Rob your right!,I thought I had it all together as to my likes and
dislikes in bows ,now these Hill style bows are calling me with the
allure,passions and intrigue like I've never felt,almost a primial
feeling,hard to explain!
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 16, 2011 08:22 PM:
Steve, "Hill style bows are calling me with the allure,passions and
intrigue like I've never felt,almost a primial feeling,hard to explain!"
I have tried to explain it to some folks but never seemed to get it right.
I
can tell you it's just as much of how the bow makes me feel about
myself when I have it in my hand and especially when I'm out in the
woods as it is how the bow feels in my hand.
It sure doesn't hurt that they're just beautiful to behold.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 16, 2011 08:45 PM:
Well I guess I can add a little more heat to the fire. Here's my lite Sunset Hill.
Can you say caramalized Bamboo!!! What a sweet shooter it is too!
Spanky
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 16, 2011 09:18 PM:
Spanky,that sure is sweet!!!
Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on January 16, 2011 09:24 PM:
Spanky,don't ever bring that bow to Canada,you won't leave with it !LOL Simply beautiful.
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 16, 2011 09:35 PM:
Hey Ken .. that is a dandy ! what are the specs ? how do you mean lite ? ### ?
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 16, 2011 09:49 PM:
Ben this one is 67" and 47@27. I usually shoot around 55-58lbs so it's a
little lighter than I'm used too, but man it draws smooth as silk!
Hey Steve, that would be a heck of a fight Bud!
My new Natural should be here in a few more weeks so I'll have even more fuel to add to this fire...it's gonna be a beauty!!!
Thanks for the compliments guy's...glad you enjoyed the pics!
Spanky
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on January 16, 2011 10:32 PM:
Spanky- what riser wood is on that bow?
Darren
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 16, 2011 10:35 PM:
Darren that is stained Myrtle.
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 16, 2011 11:20 PM:
Here some strung profiles of the new Tembo.
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 16, 2011 11:27 PM:
Looks good TW! I think for all around shootability, the Tembo is my favorite model from Craig.
Spanky
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 16, 2011 11:33 PM:
I kept hearing the same thing. Everyone that I've read that has owned
one, has had nothing but good to say about this model. That's what
prompted me to make it my next bow. It pulls very smoothly!
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on January 17, 2011 12:01 AM:
TW-
I really like the gray glass, That's only the second Hill
that I've seen with gray glass. Have you compared the Tembo to a Big
Five? I was wondering if there was any differences. Does anyone know how
many lams Dave Miller or Nate uses? I might make my next Hill a stringfollow Tembo with a Myrtle riser.
Darren
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 17, 2011 12:07 AM:
The first Hill bow I ever had was a Big5. It shot great and like an
idiot, I let it go. Haven't shot the Tembo yet so, cannot compare. Been
non stop rain for two days now. Maybe tomorrow. Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 17, 2011 12:11 AM:
Nate uses three lams of Bamboo, and so does David in the "Old Tom". Now if you want a heavyweight that might change!
Spanky
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on January 17, 2011 12:42 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Mudd: Matt you said you got the last one!!...lol
Number 50 of 50.
God bless, Mudd
Roy,
Just to make it perfectly clear, there are still more Robin Hood bows that Craig can make. I just asked for the number 50 of 50.
So, if anyone has a "Lucky" number, and it hasn't been taken, Craig will get it for you.
I wonder? How many, of the 50, Craig has orders for? Anybody know?
Matt
Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on January 17, 2011 12:54 AM:
Hey Fellas all these bows your so graciously showing is so well
appreciated,I never realized there were so many options.Life sure is a
learning pcocess. Spanky,I'm to old to fight any more,heck I even try
to stay out of heated arguments! LOL.Thru heavy manipulation,bartering
and some sutle begging I might win!I know one thing if you ever made it
to Canada we'd sure have some fun shootin!
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 17, 2011 06:51 AM:
TEMBO!!! - definitely a bow in my future ...
68", r/h,
50#@28" but tillered and drawn to 29", sleeve t/d, string follow,
caramelized boo, coco riser, coco tip overlays, shelf wood cut to 1/16",
locator handle, black laced grip.
did my 2010 tax return get here yet? Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on January 17, 2011 07:16 AM:
Hang-on, Rob, I thought you were dubious about string-follow longbows?
My new Redman will be string-follow; I'm looking forward to finding-out what it's like first-hand.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 17, 2011 07:25 AM:
back in the 50's and 60's i had a gaggle of self and composite wood
longbows, all with string follow. they were good shooters out to around
15-20 yards and then they ran outta gas. the feel in the draw and
release was/is quite different than a backset or dead straight longbow,
just a treat. but performance-wise they were dogs, which ushered in my
glass/wood era for longbows and recurves.
i've only messed with
a few string follow longbows since those dayze, last was a bamboo
backed osage. close, but still no cigar. i've heard much differently
about the craig's hills, and that the induced string follow ("belly
set") is just enuf to make the draw and release sweet, but without
sacrificing that much of the performance. if that be true, bring 'em
on! the big 5 i just ordered has that belly set, i'll see ...
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on January 17, 2011 07:32 AM:
My shooting usually runs out of gas past fifteen or twenty yards!
Yep, it'll be fun to see what they're about, eh.
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 17, 2011 07:52 AM:
I'm in the same boat as you Steve so I guess we would have to thumb
wrestle for it....BUT IT WOULD STILL BE A HECK OF A FIGHT MAN....come
on, work with me here Bud!
I'd
love to come to Canada someday and hunt some of the great species of
game you guys have, and yes we would have great fun shooting our Hill
bows....maybe someday!
The modern string follow Hill is the only way to fly IMHO! Can't speak for Craig's, but Nate's are the bomb!!!
Spanky
Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on January 17, 2011 08:04 AM:
Hey Spanks sounds real good,I invited a couple of young fellas from
Arkansas to hunt Elk with me last year .It blew there mind,Canada is one
big Purty country.real curious about these string follows as thats what
I learned on in 1960.I just love the simplicity and subtlness of these
bows yet still capable of delivering a devastating blow,Kinda reminds me
of my wife!
Posted by 3Under (Member # 1713) on January 17, 2011 08:10 AM:
Hope you "guys" are happy - you've pulled me down with the rest of ya (or up!).
Got
a Northern Mist Shelton coming,tempered bamboo(like peanut
butter),green glass on belly 'n back, Maccassar(sp?)ebony riser/grip.
66",54 Lbs.@ 28", TD. Should get it by April 2nd or 3rd.
It'll be my 2nd Shelton! Love my first one-a one piece with clear glass Bocote risor 'n trim with same spec's.
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 17, 2011 08:14 AM:
Green glass and Macassar...that will be a looker for sure!!! We will definately require pics when it arrives!
Congrats
Oh yeah, sorry about bringing ya down with us, but that's what we Hillaholics do you know!
WOW
guy's check it out, we almost got 300 posts talking about slow,
outdated, shocky bows that are too long to hunt with.....amazing!
Spanky
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on January 17, 2011 09:05 AM:
Yeah, Spanky, the trouble is that those of us who already knew about
what a hoot they are will be having to wait longer now to get 'em
because of all the guys who have been infected with the desire here.
What have we done??? Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 17, 2011 09:08 AM:
quote:Originally posted by David Mitchell: ... What have we done???
boosted howard hill archery's profits, for one thing.
i sure wish they'd have become trad gang sponsors ....
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 17, 2011 09:09 AM:
I think all you "old" Hill owners need to step aside and call Craig.
Tell him that you wish to put all the 1st time buyers to the head of the
list. Feel free to use my name! I'll tell you all what,I'll just call him for ya and let him know. Thanks guys this is a real nice gesture! What? Did I say something wrong? I got alot of ugly cyber looks. Posted by chupa (Member # 17556) on January 17, 2011 09:10 AM:
Congrats 3under, you picked a great bow made by a real expert bowyer.
If you're new to Hill bows you may want to try to put a few in the hand
before Steve shapes your grip. Some fellas prefer to have the grip a
tad rounded where the palm rests against the bow instead of the standard
"sharper" feel. If you can't find some to handle I can always mail you two of my bows so you can see the difference. Let me know.
NOTE: Ya'll
are gonna let the cat out of the bag bigtime here....next thing you
know the wait time for a "string follow"(deflexed) Hill style bow will
be a year or two or more......but I have an idea. We'll
get all those bowyers to flip those undesireable "backset" forms upside
down so they can be prepared for the next traditional supply and demand
crisis.
Rick
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on January 17, 2011 09:41 AM:
Craig is gluing up my Big 5 this week. Got my Wesley about a month ago
and had to have another one. Sold 2 of my older Widows . Rob I think my
Big 5 turned out to be like yours; string follow, Padauk riser,
caramelized boo , 68" and 61-63# @28". didn't mean to copy it just
turned out that way. It is a lefty though . I think number three will be a Redman
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on January 17, 2011 10:10 AM:
Number 3!! Gets a grip on you doesn't it???
Posted by 3Under (Member # 1713) on January 17, 2011 10:45 AM:
Chupa, This will be my 2nd Shelton. My first one was the result of
the 1st Trad/Prim Expo in Wheeling WV. I went to Denton Hill this past
July and shot a bunch of Steve's bows. So I guess Steve Turay is also
partially guity too along with David M (as in Michell). I didn't expect preachers would be guilty of conributing to temptation of his brethern!
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on January 17, 2011 10:47 AM:
I just can't put that Wesley down! I shoot everyday since I got it.
outside ,inside at night. Real interested in the string follow and how
it will shoot. Craig does a fine job and I am impressed with his work.
My plan is to trim down my dozen or so stickbows to 3 Hills and 3
Widows. That should be enough.
Posted by chupa (Member # 17556) on January 17, 2011 10:49 AM:
quote:Originally posted by 3Under: So I guess Steve Turay is also partially guity too along with David M. I didn't expect preachers would be guilty of conributing to temptation of his brethern!
That's funny... Posted by Hatrick (Member # 2066) on January 17, 2011 11:04 AM:
I've been following this thread for a while now with great interest.
Most of the talk as been Howard Hill, Nate Steen, and David Miller but
like 3Under, I have a NM Shelton on the way with the same 66" 54#@28"
specs. I had shot one at Baltimore back in the spring and loved it. Man
that bow was fun to shoot.
Mine has been on order for a while
now. I spoke to Steve just a couple of days ago and I expect to see it
here pretty soon. Right now he's gearing up for Kalamazoo. Kingwood
riser, black glass on the back, bamboo core, clear glass with English
yew on the belly, antler tips, straight grip with beaver tail leather (I
supplied the leather).
Working on some new sitka spruce woodies right now in anticipation of going back "old school" a bit.
Posted by Dick in Seattle (Member # 8663) on January 17, 2011 11:27 AM:
One of my plans is to use my reflexed form to build a forward riser
pattern... voila! Instant string follow! I'm suddenly way behind so
who knows when I'll get to that. Maybe in the spring for my birthday.
Heck of a note when your delivery time for your own bows is longer than
for the ones you order!
I took Bamboozle, my newest (extreme
string follow and shoot off the hand) to a 3D Saturday. Both of us had
a great time. I'm really pleased with this one.
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 17, 2011 12:24 PM:
I guess you might say "Another one bites the dust". Just ordered my 1st
Hill bow. No use revealing the rest cause I dont have pics to back it
up. So you all will have to wait for a minute. BTW- Anybody got a couch I can sleep on. Posted by Dirty Bob (Member # 28711) on January 17, 2011 12:35 PM:
I Just joined trad gang,and ordering my first HH bow tmmrrw. Looking forward to being part of the gang.
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 17, 2011 12:43 PM:
Looks like you better get the cabin fire going.And Rob our friend just
bought your old Wesley Special bow that you sold in December.He also
joined tradgang last night. His name is Dirty Bob .
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 17, 2011 12:53 PM:
Dirty Bob
Welcome!
God bless,Mudd Posted by chupa (Member # 17556) on January 17, 2011 01:15 PM:
Hi Dirty Bob In all your excitement ya forgot to tell us all the bow spec's you're ordering from Craig.
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 17, 2011 02:03 PM:
Yes, do tell the little secret!
Congratulations and welcome to the Howard Hill fan club! Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on January 17, 2011 02:13 PM:
Man, good thing I don't want to order a new Hill...I'd have to wait lots
longer than I'm used to for it with all this ordering going on--not
that there's anything wrong with that!
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 17, 2011 02:56 PM:
I think with as much money as members of this site have thrown his way
lately, Craig should become a Sponsor here! 'Course they've been in
business long enough to not need to but, it sure would be nice. Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 17, 2011 03:44 PM:
God bless,Mudd Posted by GregD (Member # 5018) on January 17, 2011 07:26 PM:
Have any of you guys seen carmalized bamboo when it did not work? It
looks like irregular shaped bleached out spots on the limb. You may want
to discuss with the bowyer what is going to happen if one limb comes
out carmelized and the other looks bleached. Voice of experience
talking.
Posted by Cookus (Member # 17834) on January 17, 2011 07:27 PM:
I called Howard Hill Archery about an hour ago to order some
accessories... There's approximately 28 of the Robin Hood Special
Editions spoken for! The fellow on the phone said they were very
busy...
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on January 17, 2011 11:55 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano:
back in the 50's and 60's i had a gaggle of self and composite wood
longbows, all with string follow. they were good shooters out to around
15-20 yards and then they ran outta gas. the feel in the draw and
release was/is quite different than a backset or dead straight longbow,
just a treat. but performance-wise they were dogs
Rob, I edited some of your quote trying to pin down the key point about String Follow.
I
was only able to shoot 6 arrows out of my new 68" 55# at 28 HH Robin
Hood. I was impressed by the cast and speed at 15 yards. The weather
here has dried up so I will go out Tuesday and see the cast from 20
yards.
Then, I will try it against an R/D bow. I will see about
the cast and speed difference at 25 yards. (no chrono, just getting a
feel)
My first impression of my HH Robin Hood with String Follow
was impressive. You and I agree that speed is not the ticket but, I have
to admit, at first blush, my 55# Robin Hood was pretty fast.
More later.....
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 18, 2011 06:14 AM:
matt, i'm hopeful that both of our wood/glass composite string follow
hills will not only have that good feel on draw and release, but also
won't lose much cast at hunting distances.
there could be,
should be, some serious difference 'tween the all wood longbow string
follow dogs of my youth and these fancy schmancy, high tech, space age,
modern composite hill string follow longbows produced here in the 21st
century.
hope to hear about your testing today!
Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on January 18, 2011 09:13 AM:
Matt,I'm very curious about your testing.I learned to shoot with an old
string follow longbow and still remember how pleasant it was.Your
findings will probably be my decision.I would love to have a bow that
was reminisant of the past,and like Rob said with some of todays
performances. Iam really leaning towards a HH Cheetah with Yew
instead of Bamboo as cores ,66",around 56#,cocobola riser, clear glass
and slight string follow,and seriouly thinking of a double shelf like
Matts Robin Hood.I've got a bad fealing Craigs wait time has drastically
increased !LOL Ah well.
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on January 18, 2011 09:32 AM:
GregD, no worries there about the carmelizing of bamboo. It is done
before the bow is glued up with the raw 'boo and the bowyer will be
careful to match the limbs to each other. The fact is that bamboo is
not going to have uniform color throughout the entire limb due to the
nature of the grain in what is actually a grass rather than wood. I
have a Dave Wallace longbow that has stained bamboo which is gorgeous
but the stain takes a bit differently in different places on the limb.
That is part of what makes the limb so pretty--it's not all one color
but like many of the exotic woods used in bows there is
variation......Dave
Posted by chupa (Member # 17556) on January 18, 2011 09:32 AM:
Hey Leatherneck...I just noticed your reply that you ordered a Hill.
Congrats. If ya did find a couch and are now rested up can you tell us
the spec's?
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 18, 2011 09:46 AM:
quote:Originally posted by David Mitchell:
GregD, no worries there about the carmelizing of bamboo. It is done
before the bow is glued up with the raw 'boo and the bowyer will be
careful to match the limbs to each other. The fact is that bamboo is
not going to have uniform color throughout the entire limb due to the
nature of the grain in what is actually a grass rather than wood. I
have a Dave Wallace longbow that has stained bamboo which is gorgeous
but the stain takes a bit differently in different places on the limb.
That is part of what makes the limb so pretty--it's not all one color
but like many of the exotic woods used in bows there is
variation......Dave
i
LOVE the looks of my mohawk's stained cane limbs, where the ground
nodes are darkened and show nicely against the 'straw' colored 'boo ...
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on January 18, 2011 10:30 AM:
Rob,
I love the "Dirty" Bamboo look myself. I had a Great Plains with real dirty boo limbs. It was cool looking.
Matt
Posted by John Nail (Member # 220) on January 18, 2011 10:41 AM:
It's gratifying to see so many people who understand that longbows
should be LONG. I've had several HH bows over the years, including a
70lb one that Howard made for my dad. I am romancin' one of Greg Coffee's "American" LBs. Man, that design is sweeet and 68" Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 18, 2011 11:22 AM:
John lets see that hill that Howard built. Posted by chupa (Member # 17556) on January 18, 2011 11:59 AM:
quote:Originally posted by longbowben: John lets see that hill that Howard built.
Yes Yes please x2 Posted by GregD (Member # 5018) on January 18, 2011 07:02 PM:
David and Rob, I also would have assumed the bowyer would be careful to
match the limbs and not use material that didn't take the carmelization.
I am also not talking about variation in the color or visible nodes,
I'm talking about irregular shaped areas that are a stark white as if
the area had been bleached. The explanation I recieved was it's a
natural material and anything can happen. I'm only bringing it up to you
guys because if I had any idea that could happen I would have asked
about it before the bow was built. Good Luck, Greg
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 18, 2011 07:10 PM:
most all bamboo can be "caramelized" - a fancy word for "heat
tempering", which i've read is what howard did because it heats up the
internal boo/cane resins and changes the molecular structure of the
bamboo, making it stiffer, stronger, more durable and more resistant to
breaking and taking a set.
i've heat tempered green bamboo with
a propane torch. this is a fast way to "cure" it and make it lots
stronger. as the resin bubbles up and smokes, the outer boo skin
changes color from light green to light tan. longer it's heated, the
darker the coloring gets - amber, amber/orange, malt, dark chocolate. i
love the smell of hot bamboo in the morning. Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 18, 2011 07:19 PM:
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 18, 2011 07:22 PM:
mudd's in da hood! Posted by Cookus (Member # 17834) on January 18, 2011 07:29 PM:
Nice shooting Mudd! Was it worth all of those sleepless nights?... YES! Sherwood Forest is now in Missouri boys!
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 18, 2011 07:31 PM:
Cookus, where's the pics of that Black Bear?
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 18, 2011 07:33 PM:
Mudd ... glad its arrived mate . Looks sweet ! Are you gonna cough up a review for us ?
I sent that package today to you .
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on January 18, 2011 07:39 PM:
After I bought my Hill with the carmelized limbs, I spoke to Jason at
Howard Hill Archery about their supply of carm. bamboo and he told me
that the carmelized bamboo is done before he receives it.
Darren
Posted by Cookus (Member # 17834) on January 18, 2011 07:50 PM:
The Black Bear arrived in WV last week TW and I shot it all weekend!
It's headed for Craig's shop in the morning to get 2 inlays (Black bears
of course!) and a black laced wrap. The bow was in pristine condition
but I wanted to "spruce her up a bit" before her debut here on Trad
Gang! I think the riser is a nice, orangish cocobolo, but Craig's
going to identify it for me. The contrasting black limbs and orange
riser are beautiful!
Posted by Rooselk (Member # 1588) on January 18, 2011 08:06 PM:
Mudd, if you don't mind me asking, what are the woods of the bow on the
left in the first pic? The limbs look like yew. But what about the
riser?
Posted by Rooselk (Member # 1588) on January 18, 2011 08:08 PM:
Oops! Just saw the hat inlay. Must be the Robin Hood.
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 18, 2011 08:09 PM:
Cookus, she sounds like she's gonna be right down PURDY! Can't wait to see the outcome. Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 18, 2011 08:44 PM:
Bocote or is it bacote,
I'm not sure of the spelling.
The truth is I think it's beautiful no matter how you spell it..lol
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Rooselk (Member # 1588) on January 18, 2011 08:47 PM:
Thanks. And you're right about it being beautiful. Congrats on the bow. Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on January 18, 2011 10:16 PM:
Mudd,
Nice to see your Robin Hood bow. Pretty awesome.
I got the hat so I will post some action pictures later this weekend.
Matt
Posted by Rick Butler (Member # 7393) on January 18, 2011 10:22 PM:
Mudd are you gonna make a hat for everyone that gets a Robin Hood bow? lol, Gotta admit that'd be kind of cool! Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 18, 2011 10:56 PM:
Very nice Mudd. Posted by Dirty Bob (Member # 28711) on January 19, 2011 07:58 AM:
Hey ben, Maybe you can shame me into the woods with my new bow next year!
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 19, 2011 08:04 AM:
Im not that dumb again. Posted by mississippidave (Member # 23066) on January 19, 2011 05:27 PM:
I love my Wesley Special 66", 50@26. Quiet as a mouse
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 19, 2011 05:34 PM:
who's still waiting on a delivery from craig, david, nate, etc?
i be waitin' on ...
big 5 from craig ol' tom from david
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 19, 2011 05:38 PM:
I just go off the phone w/Jason about an hour ago. He said they are real busy. I let him know it was thanks to these posts!
I had an arrow question for him and in spite of the shop hustle and
bustle, he spent time to answer my questions. Great people! Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on January 19, 2011 05:41 PM:
Rob,I confess a new "Red Cheetah" from Craig.
Posted by Kelly (Member # 1777) on January 19, 2011 05:55 PM:
A Hill Big Five and Miller Split Bamboo are in the mail as I type this.
Both are recent purchases(used) for me and should arrive by weeks end,
or sooner.
As far as Sunset Hill's I've owned one since 2005-one
of the very first bows Nate made for others. Nate has had it for a
couple years now because he was not very happy with the way it turned
out-too much string follow after several months of shoting because it
had no belly glass, just bamboo. So he is making me a new one that
should arrive sometime in the future.
Furthermore, it is going to be something "NEW" from Sunset Hill! Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on January 19, 2011 06:04 PM:
Rob, a Redman from Craig...
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on January 19, 2011 06:05 PM:
This thread is a feeding frenzy for us Hill sharks!
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 19, 2011 06:12 PM:
been thinking about a redman too, ben. mmmm, nice!
be interesting to see how much customer traffic is going to howard hill archery via way of this forum and thread ... Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 19, 2011 06:14 PM:
Well, if I had to hazard a guess from my conversation with Jason, I'd say a lot. But, that's just my thoughts.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 19, 2011 06:18 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Wannabe1: Well, if I had to hazard a guess from my conversation with Jason, I'd say a lot. But, that's just my thoughts.
that's what i'm thinking, too .....
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on January 19, 2011 06:21 PM:
Waiting on a Big 5
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 19, 2011 06:40 PM:
Mmm
I am waiting on My Robin Hood # 13 My T/d Rhino My Belcher T/d Union Jack [ all yew My Belcher 1 Union Jack Maple
all these are string Follow 66" 52# /-54 # @ 27 "
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on January 19, 2011 07:18 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano: who's still waiting on a delivery from craig, david, nate, etc?
i be waitin' on ...
big 5 from craig ol' tom from david
Rob, Which Nate?
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on January 19, 2011 07:22 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano:
matt, i'm hopeful that both of our wood/glass composite string follow
hills will not only have that good feel on draw and release, but also
won't lose much cast at hunting distances.
there could be,
should be, some serious difference 'tween the all wood longbow string
follow dogs of my youth and these fancy schmancy, high tech, space age,
modern composite hill string follow longbows produced here in the 21st
century.
hope to hear about your testing today!
Rob, I shot my new HH Robin Hood String Follow today from 17 yards and 22 yards.
As you mentioned, past 20 yards the arrows started to run out of gas. However, I was just tickled with the 17 yard performance.
Boy, that Robin Hood feels really good!
Also,
I shot 16 arrows lefty today. Very pleased with the way it turned out.
See my Dual Shelf Robin Hood Post Page 3 for Pictures.
Matt
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 19, 2011 07:23 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Raging Water:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano: who's still waiting on a delivery from craig, david, nate, etc?
i be waitin' on ...
big 5 from craig ol' tom from david
Rob, Which Nate?
nate steen (sunset hill) - what other nate?
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 19, 2011 07:24 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Raging Water:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano:
matt, i'm hopeful that both of our wood/glass composite string follow
hills will not only have that good feel on draw and release, but also
won't lose much cast at hunting distances.
there could be,
should be, some serious difference 'tween the all wood longbow string
follow dogs of my youth and these fancy schmancy, high tech, space age,
modern composite hill string follow longbows produced here in the 21st
century.
hope to hear about your testing today!
Rob, I shot my new HH Robin Hood String Follow today from 17 yards and 22 yards.
As you mentioned, past 20 yards the arrows started to run out of gas. However, I was just tickled with the 17 yard performance.
Boy, that Robin Hood feels really good!
Also,
I shot 16 arrows lefty today. Very pleased with the way it turned out.
See my Dual Shelf Robin Hood Post Page 3 for Pictures.
Matt
good 'nuff!
what arrow weights?
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 19, 2011 07:28 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano:
be interesting to see how much customer traffic is going to howard hill archery via way of this forum and thread ...
Well,along with checking out longbowbens bow and this thread I have a new Wesley Special on the way.
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on January 19, 2011 07:28 PM:
Awww? Man, I knew you were going to ask that!
Don't ask me about FOC. But the wood arrows were 532 gr. The bow is 55# at 28" so 9.67 GPP.
I did shoot some lighter carbon arrows (I guess 430 - 450 Gr) They flew real well at 22 yards.
Matt
Posted by Cookus (Member # 17834) on January 19, 2011 07:47 PM:
I sent my Black Bear in this morning (add a laced wrap and inlays /
modify dished grip to a locator)and Craig confirmed via email the
turn-around time for my bow was 4-5 weeks. The boys are REALLY busy
but as TW stated they're taking the time to talk with all of us... I
appreciate that and their cordial customer service . I will shoot the Wesley in the meantime! Life is GREAT!
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 19, 2011 08:07 PM:
I'm waiting on:
1. Sunset Hill Natural (no belly glass) 65" 58@26.5 which should be here shortly.
2. Two other Sunset Hills on order for later in the year.
Posted by RC (Member # 162) on January 19, 2011 08:11 PM:
Spanky, I got a birthday coming up and you got wwaaayyy to many Hills...RC
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 19, 2011 08:33 PM:
That's not possible RC...you can never have too many Hills!!
Spanky
Posted by sunset hill (Member # 2674) on January 19, 2011 09:07 PM:
Now, now Kelly....no tempting! no leaking.....lol
Spanky, why
don't you tell the guys how 'slow' and out of gas your Sunset is? This
cracks me up......( it is my humble opinion that a well designed String
follow bow shouldn't run out of gas...there are other factors to be
considered when designing a string follow bow. If the bow is 2 - 3 feet
per second slower than a conventional longbow, it wouldn't run out of
gas until you shoot somewhere arond 50 yards...)
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 19, 2011 09:14 PM:
quote:If
the bow is 2 - 3 feet per second slower than a conventional longbow, it
wouldn't run out of gas until you shoot somewhere arond 50 yards...)
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 19, 2011 09:27 PM:
quote:Originally posted by sunset hill: Now, now Kelly....no tempting! no leaking.....lol
Spanky,
why don't you tell the guys how 'slow' and out of gas your Sunset is?
This cracks me up......( it is my humble opinion that a well designed
String follow bow shouldn't run out of gas...there are other factors to
be considered when designing a string follow bow. If the bow is 2 - 3
feet per second slower than a conventional longbow, it wouldn't run out
of gas until you shoot somewhere arond 50 yards...)
are there any issues with holding weight (and/or perhaps draw length) for string follow longbows?
is
there a threshold of sorts with a string follow longbow where to get
decent performance/efficiency you need at least some specified holding
weight?
iow, with a pair of string follow longbows that are as
identical as possible but of different holding weights @ 28", say 45#
and 60#, each using 28" 10gpp arrows, find that the heavier bow has a more than compared higher percentage of efficient performance (call that cast, arrow speed, lowered trajectory, etc) than the lighter bow?
i
know the heavier bow will perform better, but will that performance be
proportionally better because string follow longbows "work better" at
higher holding weights?
i ask this question to better understand if string follow longbows are worth having for lighter holding weight longbows.
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 19, 2011 09:28 PM:
quote:Originally posted by SpankyNeal: That's not possible RC...you can never have too many Hills!!
Spanky
I gotta say.. he's gotcha there RC...lol
God bless,Mudd
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 19, 2011 09:41 PM:
It's funny, Nate and I were discussing this just the other day on the
phone. Guys, after shooting "White Dragon" now for a few months I have
proven to myself that what Nate says is right on! I've also had this
same conversation with Steve Turay a couple of years ago, and he said
basically the same thing. I have no experience with Craig's version of
string follow, but after owning several straight and reflexed Hills,
Kramers, Mists, Shultz's, and string follow Shultz's, Miller's, and
Mists I can tell you that a good string follow design will be right
there with, if not faster, than the other profiles...the Dragon is
faster for it's weight than all of them! It's 58@26.5" which is my short
stubby draw and with a 600gr arrow there is NO drop out to a measured
25yrds which I shoot at my local indoor 3D range. After shooting all of
these different bows for some time now, I can see no disadvantages at
all to a properly designed string follow bow. Add in the advantages of
low shock, increased stability, and quiet release and you have the best
Hill design ever IMHO!
Rob, I think that bow length in proper
proportion to draw length is maybe more critical with string follow than
it is with the other profiles. You can get away with a 68" reflex
profile for a 26" draw, but the string follow may suffer a little for
that draw at that length. The string follow however will feel just as
smooth at the shorter length as the longer bow does!
Spanky Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 19, 2011 09:45 PM:
Rob, i began using my string follows specifically for FITA and IFAA
field rounds ... i felt that they performed a bit better and 'easier'
when taking those 70 yarders etc on a four arrow end .
So yeah ... I'm sold on them , especially at the lighter weights .
Posted by sunset hill (Member # 2674) on January 19, 2011 09:51 PM:
Rob,
I don't own a chrono, never saw the need. However, many
customers of mine have stated over the years that they are really
surprised how fast my bows are, from 45 - 80 pounds. They are ordering
bows that are comparable with the weights they were currently shooting
and are comparing arrow speeds with bows that are reflexed or straight.
Most customers are shooting arrows at least as stiff or in many, many
cases they are shooting arrows stiffer than they are used to in their
other 'hill style' bows. I think that if the bow is tillered and timed
properly, it will shoot well regardless of the weight.
To clarify
my previous statement (not to put anyone down, especially other bowyers
of whom I send many customers) I believe that Hill's bowmaking
principles have been lost on many people. Hill also was constantly
tinkering with his bows to make them better while still keeping their
original form and function. A good string follow bow shouldn't follow
the lead of a backset bow...they are different bows and should have
different design attributes, while still conforming to Hill's original
principles. This means that a good string follow bow can shoot very
comparable with a straight or slightly backset bow for speed, but be
much better in terms of shootability. These are my thoughts on the
subject based on years of research and bowmaking and aren't in any way
meant to demean anyone's bows or bowmaking abilities. I for one am over
the top excited to see such an interest in Straight End longbows, and
the renaissance of their popularity. I have limited bowmaking time
available and therefore send many potential customers to Miller, Ekin,
and Turay who in the past few years have enjoyed the resurgence in
string follow design, carmelized bamboo, and visible-fadeout risers.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 19, 2011 09:52 PM:
spanky sez ...
quote:Rob,
I think that bow length in proper proportion to draw length is maybe
more critical with string follow than it is with the other profiles. You
can get away with a 68" reflex profile for a 26" draw, but the string
follow may suffer a little for that draw at that length.
i don't understand - a 68" hill style and 26" draw is a mistake no matter what the limb set, or lack thereof.
if
the bow length is apropos to the draw length for a 45# string follow
and a 60# string follow - let's say a 68" bow and 28" or 29" draw length
- which bow will be the better performer with a 10gpp arrow. do you
see where i'm going with this?
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 19, 2011 09:56 PM:
The reason I said that is because alot of guys like the bow longer than
Hills formula, i.e 70" bow and 28" draw, and that's a mistake with
string follow bows! I do have a 47@27 Sunset Hill as well and it seems
just as fast at the same gpp as the heavier one. I don't use a chrono
but I can pick either one up and hit spot on with it at range with no
adjustments so they must be real close!
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 19, 2011 09:57 PM:
quote:Originally posted by sunset hill: Rob,
I
don't own a chrono, never saw the need. However, many customers of
mine have stated over the years that they are really surprised how fast
my bows are, from 45 - 80 pounds. They are ordering bows that are
comparable with the weights they were currently shooting and are
comparing arrow speeds with bows that are reflexed or straight. Most
customers are shooting arrows at least as stiff or in many, many cases
they are shooting arrows stiffer than they are used to in their other
'hill style' bows. I think that if the bow is tillered and timed
properly, it will shoot well regardless of the weight.
To clarify
my previous statement (not to put anyone down, especially other bowyers
of whom I send many customers) I believe that Hill's bowmaking
principles have been lost on many people. Hill also was constantly
tinkering with his bows to make them better while still keeping their
original form and function. A good string follow bow shouldn't follow
the lead of a backset bow...they are different bows and should have
different design attributes, while still conforming to Hill's original
principles. This means that a good string follow bow can shoot very
comparable with a straight or slightly backset bow for speed, but be
much better in terms of shootability. These are my thoughts on the
subject based on years of research and bowmaking and aren't in any way
meant to demean anyone's bows or bowmaking abilities. I for one am over
the top excited to see such an interest in Straight End longbows, and
the renaissance of their popularity. I have limited bowmaking time
available and therefore send many potential customers to Miller, Ekin,
and Turay who in the past few years have enjoyed the resurgence in
string follow design, carmelized bamboo, and visible-fadeout risers.
i hear ya, thanx.
now
to my question previously posed .. lemme cut to the chase, is it worth
getting a string follow longbow of 45#, or will that light holding
weight proportionally be that noticeable less efficient than the same
bow at 60#?
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 19, 2011 10:01 PM:
I think we were posting at the same time Rob LOL!
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 19, 2011 10:02 PM:
quote:Originally posted by SpankyNeal:
The reason I said that is because alot of guys like the bow longer than
Hills formula and that's a mistake with string follow bows! I do have a
47@27 Sunset Hill as well and it seems just as fast at the same gpp as
the heavier one. I don't use a chrono but I can pick either one up and
hit spot on with it at range with no adjustments so they must be real
close!
what
is howard hill's bow length formula? i read him saying the arrow
length (draw length, i'll assume) corresponds to the bow length. the
formula being a 6' longbow for a 28" arrow, and each 1/2" more or less
in arrow length is multiplied x 2 and added or subtracted from that 72"
bow. does that pan out with a modern wood/glass hill, sunset, miller,
schulz, etc?
Posted by Sixby (Member # 14586) on January 19, 2011 10:03 PM:
Excuse the ignorance here but its how we learn. What is a visible
=fadeout riser? you can see the fadeout in any riser if you look close
enough. Its a term I am un-familar with Thanks and God bless you, Steve
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 19, 2011 10:05 PM:
Take the last digit of your draw length and add it to 60"...if 30" draw or over add to 70". So a 29" draw would be a 69" bow.
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 19, 2011 10:06 PM:
A visible fadeout riser is where the riser is not covered by the belly
lams but is exposed under the clear glass if that makes sense. You can
see it on the Robin Hood bow pics and on my light Sunset Hill pics.
Posted by sunset hill (Member # 2674) on January 19, 2011 10:09 PM:
Rob,
because of the different shooting characteristics of the
different Hill style bowmakers' longbows, you would have to compare bows
within the bowmaker's offerings. In my bows, if you shoot a 480 gr
arrow out of a 48# bow, you will get similar arrow speed and feel as a
600 gr arrow out of a 60#r. Obviously, you will get better penetration
with the heavier arrow. Craig Ambros aka Fishone just got a 47#r from
me, maybe his imput can help.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 19, 2011 10:09 PM:
quote:Originally posted by SpankyNeal: Take the last digit of your draw length and add it to 60"...if 30" draw or over add to 70". So a 29" draw would be a 69" bow.
where did that formula originate?
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 19, 2011 10:10 PM:
quote:Originally posted by sunset hill: Rob,
because
of the different shooting characteristics of the different Hill style
bowmakers' longbows, you would have to compare bows within the
bowmaker's offerings. In my bows, if you shoot a 480 gr arrow out of a
48# bow, you will get similar arrow speed and feel as a 600 gr arrow out
of a 60#r. Obviously, you will get better penetration with the heavier
arrow. Craig Ambros aka Fishone just got a 47#r from me, maybe his
imput can help.
now that's what i needed to hear. thanx.
Posted by sunset hill (Member # 2674) on January 19, 2011 10:11 PM:
Spanky and Rob...
subtract one digit from the bow length in
comparison to the draw length...ie. 28" draw..67" bow 27"draw = 66"
bow. However, as my customers know, there are many other factors
included in determining bowlength...hand size among them....
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 19, 2011 10:12 PM:
quote:Originally posted by sunset hill: Rob,
because
of the different shooting characteristics of the different Hill style
bowmakers' longbows, you would have to compare bows within the
bowmaker's offerings. In my bows, if you shoot a 480 gr arrow out of a
48# bow, you will get similar arrow speed and feel as a 600 gr arrow out
of a 60#r. Obviously, you will get better penetration with the heavier
arrow. Craig Ambros aka Fishone just got a 47#r from me, maybe his
imput can help.
69" sunset hill for a 29" draw length?
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 19, 2011 10:14 PM:
quote:Originally posted by sunset hill: Spanky and Rob...
subtract
one digit from the bow length in comparison to the draw length...ie.
28" draw..67" bow 27"draw = 66" bow. However, as my customers know,
there are many other factors included in determining bowlength...hand
size among them....
oh. so for a 29" draw it's a 68" longbow?
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 19, 2011 10:15 PM:
Nate is that for string follow only? I have heard the other formula for a long time from many Hill sources.
Posted by sunset hill (Member # 2674) on January 19, 2011 10:17 PM:
Rob, one of the many confusions concerning Hill's preferences for
bowlength is centered on his size comparisons. He had very large hands,
which contorts dimensions in photos and personal accounts, which is one
factor in bowsizing. Hill also determined his drawlength differently
than what we do today. His bow was customized to him, for what worked
for him. If we take the dimensions of bows he preferred and re-size
them to fit an average size man, a comparable bow will be much
different. However, the "standard 68"r" has been a standard for so many
years that guys don't even know where it came from let alone if that
size is correct for them...
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on January 19, 2011 10:22 PM:
Sixby, here is a picture of one of Nate's bows with the visible fade out.... Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 19, 2011 10:24 PM:
Looks like David's got something on his mind....another bow perhaps? Hummmmh! Posted by sunset hill (Member # 2674) on January 19, 2011 10:25 PM:
Spanky,
the formula did change somewhat over the years due to the
advances in bow construction...also Schulz refined that formula in the
late 80's with his string follow bows...
Rob, one of the most
critical, if not the most, elements of a proper Hill style bow is limb
tiller/bend at full draw. Compare Hill's limb bend on his personal
laminated bows with Schulz's personal bows and they are identical. This
was very important to Schulz in bowmaking. I try for this same bend in
my bows and Schulz has confirmed this to me. You are an interesting
case....you very well might need a shorter bow than you have always
thought in order to get that proper limb bend. But, as I've said, there
are many factors in deciding how to build the bow to fit you...not just
bowlength, not just grip profile, etc.
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 19, 2011 10:27 PM:
I've been reading along and find this to be most educating. Thank you guys for sharing this info. Posted by sunset hill (Member # 2674) on January 19, 2011 10:28 PM:
David, since I built that bow many years ago, I've developed the
technique to have a radius ended fadout under a flat lam of glass. In
my mind it is much better looking.
Posted by sunset hill (Member # 2674) on January 19, 2011 10:31 PM:
All this talking....you guys are keeping me out of the bowshop! lol.lol.
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 19, 2011 10:45 PM:
Wow this got deep today.My heads spinning.
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 19, 2011 10:49 PM:
quote:Originally posted by sunset hill: All this talking....you guys are keeping me out of the bowshop! lol.lol.
Uh oh, that's not good news for me! Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 19, 2011 11:02 PM:
Ok someone post a string follow bow so some new people can see what you
are talking about.I didnt understand untill i saw the pictures myself
.Thanks
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 19, 2011 11:06 PM:
The limbs bend slightly towards the belly (shooters) side of the bow when unbraced.
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 19, 2011 11:09 PM:
Thanks SpankyNeal.This is a very good topic i just might have to give one a try.Just dont tell my wife what im thinking.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 20, 2011 06:24 AM:
quote:Originally posted by sunset hill:
... Rob, one of the most critical, if not the most, elements of a
proper Hill style bow is limb tiller/bend at full draw. Compare Hill's
limb bend on his personal laminated bows with Schulz's personal bows and
they are identical. This was very important to Schulz in bowmaking. I
try for this same bend in my bows and Schulz has confirmed this to me.
You are an interesting case....you very well might need a shorter bow
than you have always thought in order to get that proper limb bend.
But, as I've said, there are many factors in deciding how to build the
bow to fit you...not just bowlength, not just grip profile, etc.
interesting. your comments are new to me and go against typical hill style dogmatic thinking and trends.
i don't have a clue to understanding how hand size fits into the bow length equation.
so,
make me a believer - build me a sunset hill. pm or email me and let's
get me into your bow building lineup so i can expect to get it somewhere
in 2012, before the world falls apart.
you have a pm .......
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on January 20, 2011 07:01 AM:
Here is a shot of a Hill string follow (on the right) and a Northern
Mist (on the left). Steve puts a bit more string follow on his bow than
Craig does.
Posted by droz il (Member # 24230) on January 20, 2011 07:42 AM:
Really enjoying this topic. Great information. Thanks to all involved.
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 20, 2011 08:04 AM:
I love the eye candy David!! Those are wonderful to behold but I'm betting that they are even more awesome to "be-holding"...lol
Thanks
to everyone for the pictures!! Please don't be bashful folks, keep them
coming it's out-of-season here and the ground has 8 inches of fresh
snow on it this morning so I'm not going anywhere in my little two wheel
drive Ranger.
God bless,Mudd
PS: Since my wife is staying
with our daughter and granddaughter I think I'll start looking around
in here to see if there's enough space for a short indoor range...lol
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 20, 2011 08:11 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Mudd:
... PS: Since my wife is staying with our daughter and granddaughter I
think I'll start looking around in here to see if there's enough space
for a short indoor range...lol
there's
always room to shoot indoors, even in a tiny room. i did that for
years while working on form at 15 feet ... just use a GOOD backstop! Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on January 20, 2011 08:39 AM:
Rob-
I agree about shooing inside; years ago I was working a job
almost everyday and lived in a townhouse with a beautiful view of a lake
but no back yard to shoot in. So I would shoot from the livingroom
through the hall to the frontdoor, and for a treestand I would shoot
from the second floor down the stairway into the dining area. When I
sold the place, I had to repair the holes in the steel front door. It
was fun and I could shoot everyday.
Darren
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 20, 2011 10:58 AM:
String follow,not string follow, big hand/small hand,+1"/-1", you guys
really confused me. I'm sure glad Jason at HH told me what I needed so I
didn't have to figure all this out. Thanks goodness for bowyers.
Pretty interesting reading though.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 20, 2011 11:32 AM:
mike, i gotta thoroughly agree with ya. all this stuff is interesting
to me, but we all know that ANY stick 'n' string will kill kritters if
we allow them to do so. we all gotta keep that foremost in mind.
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 20, 2011 11:57 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano:
mike, i gotta thoroughly agree with ya. all this stuff is interesting
to me, but we all know that ANY stick 'n' string will kill kritters if
we allow them to do so. we all gotta keep that foremost in mind.
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 20, 2011 01:22 PM:
I hope I say this right! My understanding is that hand size determines
the depth of the grip. The deeper the grip the farther away the limb
apex is from your anchor, so the farther the limbs must bend. If you
measure draw length to the far side of the shelf, a deeper grip gives
you a longer draw requiring the bow length and tiller to be adjusted to
maintain the proper arc of the limbs. The position of your wrist never
changes, but the draw length measurement will based upon the depth of
the grip.
Now that i've totally confused all of you i'm gonna take a nap!
Spanky
Posted by Greg Skinner (Member # 2665) on January 20, 2011 04:47 PM:
Spanky,before you take your nap could you answer a question for me. Am I
to understand that a person with a small hand would then use a shorter
bow length than someone with a larger hand? You may have stated it
somewhere previously, but what is the length of your "White Dragon" bow?
This has been an extremely interesting thread. Just when I
thought I knew everything there was to know about Hill bows along comes a
thread like this!
My hands are small and my draw length is about
the same as yours - 26 3/4, so I like the 66" length for my Hills, but
then I've never tried a shorter length.
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 20, 2011 05:52 PM:
Like Nate said there is more to it than that, but in general my
impression has been yes. "White Dragon" is 66" long and that is what
Nate recommended for my draw and hand size which I guess is about
average. It's riser depth is right at 2" and it fits perfectly! I've had
a Hill Redman and a NM Classic that both had much smaller risers and
they both felt and performed like a longer bow even though they were
also 66" in length (slower and felt like the limbs were not loading up
enough...just like a 68" bow feels to me). I know that is not a
definitive test but it makes sense to me. Steve Turay told me that with
his reverse handle bow the Whisper, you could nock off two inches of bow
length and have it still feel and perform the same as the longer bow
because the reverse handle moves the limbs at the handle 2" closer to
the anchor point. Bow length coupled with proper tiller for your draw
are critical in a Hill bow....too long and you lose performance, too
short and stability and smoothness suffer. So when you pick a Hill bow
it's imperative to talk to the bowyer and provide him with an EXACT draw
length measurement and tracing of your hand so the bow can be properly
built and tillered for you! There is so much difference in a Hill that
has been truly custom made for you and one that was not that it's like
the difference in night and day!
Spanky
Posted by pavan (Member # 21538) on January 20, 2011 06:59 PM:
I have been thinking about getting a 70" Hill blank and taking a run to
see if I could get it to function at my 26.5" draw. I would maybe need
to reverse trap a very whip ended bow, tempting.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 20, 2011 07:07 PM:
quote:Originally posted by pavan:
I have been thinking about getting a 70" Hill blank and taking a run to
see if I could get it to function at my 26.5" draw. I would maybe need
to reverse trap a very whip ended bow, tempting.
i would think 70" is overkill for a draw length under 27"? 66" sounds mo' bettah to me ... ?
Posted by Oliverstacy (Member # 13039) on January 20, 2011 07:56 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Wannabe1: I've been reading along and find this to be most educating. Thank you guys for sharing this info.
I have been doing the same today on this!
Very...Very interesting indeed!
Josh
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on January 20, 2011 08:12 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano:
quote:Originally posted by pavan:
I have been thinking about getting a 70" Hill blank and taking a run to
see if I could get it to function at my 26.5" draw. I would maybe need
to reverse trap a very whip ended bow, tempting.
i would think 70" is overkill for a draw length under 27"? 66" sounds mo' bettah to me ... ?
Is
there any ROT on how to match a certain draw length to bow length. I
have read this lately in various posts....I have a 29" draw...does that
mean I cannot enjoy a 66" hill bow?
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 20, 2011 08:18 PM:
Alot depends on which bowyers Hill bow you are shooting as they are very
different! I would try one first to see how it feels, but I think you
would be happier overall with a 67-68". We're all different as well so
it might work just fine for you.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 20, 2011 08:24 PM:
for a hill longbow, and my 29" draw, anything less than 68" is an issue
for me. ask me why i have a 66" longbow on the classifieds now ....
yeah,
i'm curious to see how nate can make less than 68" fit a 29" draw. i
know rik hinton's sunset hill is 66" and his draw length is the same as
mine, 29". i hope nate can educate me in that way, too.
Posted by sunset hill (Member # 2674) on January 20, 2011 08:27 PM:
To follow up with Spanky's thread....
grip depth and grip length
factor into limb tiller and repeatable hand position/bowhand 'heeling'.
To keep the handle length as short as possible, you need to know the
grip length. You need to also to be able to make the working limbs as
long as possible while keeping the limb arc correct. Factors like this
are what make a truly custom bow...not just what kind of wood and glass
color you want. Most bowyers work off a standard riser length for a
particular bow length. They use standard grip sizes, built for the
'standard' shooter. However, we all know that all of us are different.
No wonder that guys will shoot brand A well and brand B they can't hit
the barn door with. In shooting both bows, it happened to work out that
brand A happened to be sized and tillered for their unique
characteristics, not that brand B was a bad bow. The 'standard' 68"
longbow with a 16"+- handle has been around so long because it fits most
people generically and most bowyers that build for a living must make
bows to fit the masses or they go broke. But are we all the same? No.
The sum of all the small things in a bow will add up to make a very
custom bow that is built to fit that one person. To do this you must in
a sense throw out the book on standardization. A bow that is built
like the old self bows, tweaking and fitting to the shooter becomes a
bow that doesn't get left on the bowrack very much because it's always
in use. I try to take the old Hill bowmaking principles and use these to
fit the bow to the particular individual's needs. Why did Hill's
longbows work for him? They fit him and his needs. Schulz was taught
personally by Hill yet didn't shoot the same length bows as Hill. He's
about 7" shorter with shorter arms, so his bows were sized to fit him
and his needs. Yet both bowyers built bows based on the same design
principles. Photos of them both shooting reveal that each's bows had
same limb bend, proportionate handles, etc. That's customization.
That's what I'm talking about.
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 20, 2011 08:29 PM:
What he said! Posted by sunset hill (Member # 2674) on January 20, 2011 08:35 PM:
Rob,
a guy with small hands, shooting a tab, needs a smaller
handle, and grips a smaller area of bowstring, no matter what length his
draw is...a guy like me with big hands, using a double layer leather
glove will need a larger handle and grip a larger area of string, again
no matter what his draw is. Rik has small hands, and shoots
barefingered....both very important factors in sizing his bow...however
he did want a takedown sleeve, so it's non adjusting size had to be
taken into account. But then again Rik doesn't really draw 29" when he
shoots...he creeps forward as he settles into the shot and actually
shoots about 27". He uses 29" bop arrows so he doesn't feel the head
hit his finger as he overdraws to get back tension....
I'm starting to reveal secrets that only my customers know about...stuff I've learned the hard way....
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on January 20, 2011 08:38 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano:
for a hill longbow, and my 29" draw, anything less than 68" is an issue
for me. ask me why i have a 66" longbow on the classifieds now ....
yeah,
i'm curious to see how nate can make less than 68" fit a 29" draw. i
know rik hinton's sunset hill is 66" and his draw length is the same as
mine, 29". i hope nate can educate me in that way, too.
Rob, please clarify "anything less than 68" is an issue for me"
Is
it in your accuracy or overall feeling...many here have alluded to this
"issue" in one way or another but it is still too vague for me.. I
also think understanding the issue will lead me to make a better
decision.
Posted by highcountry (Member # 5024) on January 20, 2011 08:39 PM:
We went down to the BIG city last weekend. I stopped by my "crack
house". The shop owner has a policy, you can't shoot a bow without
purchase prior. My policy is just the other side of the coin. Test
drive prior to purchase. I would of most likely bought a HH if I could
of shot them 1st. He had a Badger I really liked the looks of. Have you
guys ever had a archery shop with the same policy? Buy before you can
shoot it?
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 20, 2011 08:42 PM:
hey nate, am i on your list yet?
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 20, 2011 08:44 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Macatawa:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano:
for a hill longbow, and my 29" draw, anything less than 68" is an issue
for me. ask me why i have a 66" longbow on the classifieds now ....
yeah,
i'm curious to see how nate can make less than 68" fit a 29" draw. i
know rik hinton's sunset hill is 66" and his draw length is the same as
mine, 29". i hope nate can educate me in that way, too.
Rob, please clarify "anything less than 68" is an issue for me"
Is
it in your accuracy or overall feeling...many here have alluded to this
"issue" in one way or another but it is still too vague for me.. I
also think understanding the issue will lead me to make a better
decision.
for
me, with too short a bow, there are issues of stack, loss of
smoothness, instability, and a missing 'feel' on release. with some
longbows, even 68" will be close but no cigar.
all this isn't rocket science, it's closer to human evolution.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 20, 2011 08:45 PM:
quote:Originally posted by highcountry:
We went down to the BIG city last weekend. I stopped by my "crack
house". The shop owner has a policy, you can't shoot a bow without
purchase prior. My policy is just the other side of the coin. Test
drive prior to purchase. I would of most likely bought a HH if I could
of shot them 1st. He had a Badger I really liked the looks of. Have you
guys ever had a archery shop with the same policy? Buy before you can
shoot it?
without a doubt, a vendor to avoid like the plague.
Posted by sunset hill (Member # 2674) on January 20, 2011 08:46 PM:
Now I'm leaving...going home to work in the bowshop...
Last night I worked on the computer too much and didn't get any 'real' work done...lol.
This
has been a great thread guys, I didn't mean to horn in. Keep it active
and remember that information like this is teaching a multitude of
longbow shooters what it is that makes true Hill style longbows really
work. Better built Hill style longbows are being made today than ever
before, and guys are asking more of the bowyers...
Honestly, a
few years ago had any of you ever asked a bowyer for a string follow
longbow? or carmelized bamboo? Honest questions and true answers will
help promote our beloved Hill style longbows in a great way....
Posted by sunset hill (Member # 2674) on January 20, 2011 08:48 PM:
Yes, Rob, you're on my list, but now I'm backed up too long again. I need to shut my mouth.....
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 20, 2011 08:55 PM:
quote:Originally posted by sunset hill: Yes, Rob, you're on my list, but now I'm backed up too long again. I need to shut my mouth.....
i'm in no hurry. you keep talking. talk is cheap and sometimes good. Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 20, 2011 09:00 PM:
Boy, I'm sure glad I got my list in before all this started! Posted by Canyon (Member # 499) on January 20, 2011 09:43 PM:
Nate, I want on the list too. Did ya get my email??
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on January 20, 2011 10:24 PM:
Macatawa, my experience with a 29" draw and a 66" Hill mirrors Rob's, in
that I found that I was a bit hit-and-miss with my accuracy. That's why
I sold it to a friend with a shorter draw, who absolutely loves the
bow, and am replacing it with a similar bow that is longer.
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 20, 2011 10:30 PM:
Wow i have a 64" wesley and i draw a true 28 1/2 and it feels fine to
me.But i ordered a 66 inch this time just thought i would give a longer
bow a try.
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on January 20, 2011 11:00 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Ben Kleinig:
Macatawa, my experience with a 29" draw and a 66" Hill mirrors Rob's,
in that I found that I was a bit hit-and-miss with my accuracy. That's
why I sold it to a friend with a shorter draw, who absolutely loves the
bow, and am replacing it with a similar bow that is longer.
So, you will go with a 68"er?
Posted by chupa (Member # 17556) on January 21, 2011 01:31 AM:
Macatawa, I have a 68" 60#@28 Hill Cheetah that is a straight
profiled bow that I'd be glad to send you to try for yourself. I see
you're from Michigan so it would be cheap to mail or if you live
somewhere near me maybe just personally deliver. My feeling is if you're a 29" draw 68" is best at a minimum like Ben suggests too.
Posted by chupa (Member # 17556) on January 21, 2011 01:48 AM:
quote:Originally posted by David Mitchell:
Here is a shot of a Hill string follow (on the right) and a Northern
Mist (on the left). Steve puts a bit more string follow on his bow than
Craig does.
This
photo is cool. I think the amount of string follow is merely one aspect
of how sweet a bow feels and behaves. I believe a key factor in the
"sweetness" of the "s-follow" design is the limb with radius feels and
behaves much better than one that is straight from the fades to the tip.
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on January 21, 2011 02:16 AM:
Rick, Interesting on the "string follow" thing. I thought that was a down-side of these bows. Apparently it can be a plus??
Thanks for the offer! I will not be back to the states until mid-june sometime. Will look you up when I get back..
Take care...Tony
Posted by chupa (Member # 17556) on January 21, 2011 02:19 AM:
Sounds good Tony.
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on January 21, 2011 03:21 AM:
Nope, a 70" bow. I already have a 70" Wesley Special, and really enjoy that length.
Posted by MikeM (Member # 5117) on January 21, 2011 06:01 AM:
I also have a 29" draw. Started with a 66" Hill years ago. Didn't like
anything about how it felt and I am sure that affected how I shot it so I
got rid of it. It was awhile before I shot a Hill again but when I did I
got a 68" on Craig's recommendation. It was much better than the first.
Subsequently I tried a 70"er. That was the best so I got rid of the 68"
and now all my Hill bows are 70".
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 21, 2011 06:15 AM:
yes, i agree ... i haven't found a "hill style" longbow less than 68"
ntn that felt "right" on the draw, hold and release for a true 29" draw
(to the front of the shelf). depending on the design and build,
sometimes 68" and sometimes 70". all depends on the parameters and
TILLERING.
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on January 21, 2011 06:53 AM:
That's good info...wisdom in a multitude of counsel for sure...saved me from a disappointment.
I waded into this with the preconceived idea that I "needed" a 66"er. You all have educated me well!
Thanks a bunch!! Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on January 21, 2011 08:12 AM:
Looks like Nate and Craig are doing quite well as a result of this thread. 446 posts about Hill style bows--gotta love it.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 21, 2011 08:22 AM:
not to mention there are other current hill threads.
interesting that pretty much none of the bowyers involved are trad gang sponsors.
nothing like free word-of-mouth advertising, eh?
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on January 21, 2011 09:33 AM:
Thanks guys this has been a great read , very interesting . No signal
where I'm going for 2 weeks but Craig said my Big 5 will be on it's way
just as I get back. This topic could be it's own category.
Posted by Davesea (Member # 24686) on January 21, 2011 10:47 AM:
According to Howard Hill Himself he would never use a bow shorter than 69" with his 28" draw.
I saw a nice quote in one of the trad gang signatures...
"Fear the man with one bow"
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on January 21, 2011 12:01 PM:
Thanks guys this has been a great read , very interesting . No signal
where I'm going for 2 weeks but Craig said my Big 5 will be on it's way
just as I get back. This topic could be it's own category.
Posted by 3Under (Member # 1713) on January 21, 2011 08:01 PM:
Don't stop now!!
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 21, 2011 08:03 PM:
it'll pick up when the bows start rolling in ....
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 21, 2011 08:22 PM:
Rob said...
quote:it'll pick up when the bows start rolling in ....
mine are getting posted Monday ..... Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 21, 2011 08:34 PM:
Re the number of posts ... Ain't a sponsor in site for nearly any of the bowyers who get mentioned which is a great pity.
Perhaps if Hill style bow enthusiasts had there own forum here on TG we could get some on board ...
On such a T'Gang Hill users forum we could talk discuss ... *Plaid *Why we are cooler than everyone else ... *Why
we are considered 'the kids who sit up the back of the bus ' and what
our bad boy image means to us and the women who want us ... *How
we ain't overly interested in the words letters 'fps' or carbon but
very intersted in the words like 'back quiver' , stability , Redman and
hog hunting ... and elevated rests *That long is better ... And that by definition 'short longbows' are for nancy boys
I can think of a few guys who could admin the forum ... lol
In
all seriousness I'd always prefer to give my $$$ to sponsors so if we
can do anything to get them here i think it would be of great benefit to
everyone .
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on January 21, 2011 09:10 PM:
Ben Maher: Too funny! You have the madness, but I agree, and so therefore must also be mad!
Posted by RC (Member # 162) on January 21, 2011 09:10 PM:
BIG FIVE in the house. Worked a deal with Thomas aka Hogdancer and got a
fine Big Five. I did`nt get home till after dark so I strung her up and
shot her in the house. About 15 yards and I was wearing out a golf ball
size spot. HAPPY. It has action boo limbs with an extra lam of yew
in the middle under clear glass with a Texas Ebony Riser. I will post
pics tomorrow.Life is good,Thank you Lord.
Ben, I did sit in the back of the bus...and my Grandson thinks I`m cool and....RC
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 21, 2011 09:29 PM:
Alright RC!! I look forward to seeing pics.
Give a few more details like length, draw weight, ect.
Inquiring minds want to know...lol
God bless,Mudd
Posted by RC (Member # 162) on January 21, 2011 09:36 PM:
Mudd, Its 66" long and 52@27. Shoots the samw arrows I was shooting from
my Mohawk like bullets. I put a big Magnus I on and it shot
perfectly.Gold tip trad 35/55 with 250 grains in the nose.Kinda cool.
The Mohawk at my draw is bout 5 pounds less but with the Hill not cut as
deep they shoot fine. Kinda good cause I bought 24 from a TG member a
while back.RC
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 21, 2011 10:38 PM:
Cant wait to see it .Congrats Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 21, 2011 10:44 PM:
Thnx for arrows heads up RC ! Looking foward to seeing you bow with some hogs pics ...
Posted by droz il (Member # 24230) on January 21, 2011 10:49 PM:
Congrats, can't wait for the pics.
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 21, 2011 11:00 PM:
Sounds like a purty one RC...can't wait to see it! Posted by chupa (Member # 17556) on January 21, 2011 11:58 PM:
way to go RC!! post it up when u can.
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on January 22, 2011 01:14 AM:
Last night I took out my copy of Hitting them like Howard Hill by John
Schulz, in chapter 5 page 34 Mr. Schulz says that his favorite hunting
bow is 68" long, and his draw was 26". I beleive it is a preference
what length one uses but i prefer my bows to be 68" or 70" long.
Darren
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on January 22, 2011 05:44 AM:
Darren, According to what Schultz has for a preference, I can't
imagine that even a 68"er will be good for me as I draw 29"+ depending
on what bow I am shooting.
Does it seem logical then for me to order a 70"er? I think Rob shoots 68" and we both have the same draw.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 22, 2011 05:52 AM:
with me and hill style longbows, depends on the individual bow. it's
mostly in the tillering. typically, 68" lengths are fine for me. a few
weren't and should have been 70". when in doubt, i'd go 70" for a 29"
draw. the big 5 i just ordered is 68", the miller tom is 70". got both
bases covered.
after all, it's only money and time .... Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on January 22, 2011 06:01 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano:
yes, i agree ... i haven't found a "hill style" longbow less than 68"
ntn that felt "right" on the draw, hold and release for a true 29" draw
(to the front of the shelf). depending on the design and build,
sometimes 68" and sometimes 70". all depends on the parameters and
TILLERING.
Rob,
based on the parameters you suggested for me in your PM, and
considering my 29" (heavy sometimes) draw, should I be thinking of a
minimum 70" in the Tembo or the Wesley Special?
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 22, 2011 06:13 AM:
fwiw - after the 68" big5 and 70" ol tom arrive, and now that i'm a bonafide member of nate's loooong sunset hill list
, my next longbow will be a 70" t/d tembo. i had a 68" tembo years
ago and really liked it lots, and a t/d sleeve will be practical for my
yearly flyaway hunts.
stay tuned later this year, the classifieds will have some longbows peppered here and there. Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 22, 2011 08:20 AM:
....considering my 29" (heavy sometimes) draw, should I be thinking of a minimum 70" in the Tembo or the Wesley Special? ...
Go
by the selected bowyers recommendations. Based on my experience I would
say that 70" would be fine with bows from Craig or Steve Turay as they
use much longer risers, thus have shorter working limbs, than bows from
Nate, or David Miller. The bowyer should steer you right based upon what
you want out of the bow!
Spanky
Posted by chupa (Member # 17556) on January 22, 2011 08:57 AM:
Tony, I think the answer you are looking for is a bow that is tillered
with the limbs whip ended will present them selves with a steep string
angle at full draw giving it a feeling of stacking. A person with your
longer draw length would be better served with a limb tillered with much
less movement in the tips. More of a crescent look at full draw.
Rick
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on January 22, 2011 09:06 AM:
Spanky, I'll do just that when I get home. I have learned tons of
important stuff in the past two days that might just rekindle my love
for the longbow as it was in the days I embraced the tradition.
And, of course it really does not matter the cost if I can manage to capture that "perfect" one..
I
have owned and shot so many different bows in my life but have always
felt a kinship with the one Howard shot....crazy I know, but true
indeed!
The only other bow I consider truly priceless was one
that my friend OL Adcock made for me years ago. Not because it was a
good shooter (it truly was a blast to shoot) but because it was made by a
good friend.
I am happy to have had the chance to meet you all
here. Will follow you guys around like a puppy 'till I can truly shoot
'em like Howard.
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on January 22, 2011 10:30 AM:
Macatawa- For your draw I would go with the 70", you could shoot the 68" but the 70" will be perfect.
Someone told me this one time about long limbs:
They
said, If two kids are on a see-saw, and one of the kids is fat, it
would be much easier to pickup the fat kid with a longer see-saw then a
short see-saw.
Howard Hill talks about longer limbs on his bows
in Hunting the Hardway. His book has lots of useful information; it
covers the bow design, his style of shooting and hunting. I've had my
copy for almost 20years and I still go through it and reference what
Hill actual said.
Darren
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 22, 2011 11:27 AM:
I'm on here looking for the pictures of RC's new-to-him Hill bow.
Has anyone seen it yet?
I
hope he isn't waiting until later today until after he's killed a
couple of hogs and a few deer long with a mess of squirrels before he
posts pictures...lol
God bless,Mudd
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 22, 2011 11:32 AM:
Im looking to, RC play nice and show us some pictures.Those poor hogs are running for their lives this morning. Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 22, 2011 11:33 AM:
I pull 29" and my Owl and Tembo both shoot just fine. My 70" Redman now,
she's as smooth as butter! A little lighter in weight but on the pull, I
can feel the difference.
Posted by newtotrad (Member # 16871) on January 22, 2011 11:36 AM:
I have to say that this forum is awesome and the wealth of
information/insight has helped me immensely over the two years since my
forage into traditional archery. This thread is no exception.
I
am in the market for my first Hill Style longbow and have been on the
fence for a while largely due to deciding bow length. I have decided on
a Tembo and want it built with stringfollow. I am 5'8" with small
hands and a 26" draw and find myself going back and forth between a 64"
length or a 66". Any suggestions?
Craig.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 22, 2011 11:37 AM:
much as we'd like to see them a bunch shorter like their mild r/d
cousins, without a doubt longer is better with hill style longbows.
short risers + long limbs = overall goodyness.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 22, 2011 11:38 AM:
quote:Originally posted by newtotrad:
I have to say that this forum is awesome and the wealth of
information/insight has helped me immensely over the two years since my
forage into traditional archery. This thread is no exception.
I
am in the market for my first Hill Style longbow and have been on the
fence for a while largely due to deciding bow length. I have decided on
a Tembo and want it built with stringfollow. I am 5'8" with small
hands and a 26" draw and find myself going back and forth between a 64"
length or a 66". Any suggestions?
Craig.
my advice is if yer ridin' the length fence, always opt longer for the safer bet.
Posted by newtotrad (Member # 16871) on January 22, 2011 11:52 AM:
Rob, Thank you for the advice. I think leaning to a longer length is probably the best.
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on January 22, 2011 01:26 PM:
newotrad-
John Schulz has a 26" draw and prefered a 68" bow in his book Hitting them like Howard Hill.
Darren
Posted by GMASIUK (Member # 12175) on January 22, 2011 01:29 PM:
I have owned both 68" and 70" Hills, draw 30" and perfer the 68" over
the 70". The 68" just feels more crisp on release to me. But this is
really splitting hairs. Either way you can't go wrong. I have owned at
least eight Hills in one model or another and all one piece / locator
grips. With that said, my most recent Hill is the Cheetha in a take down
with the small sleeve that I really like the best so far. And I'm more
of a recurve shooter so that says something for the t/d straight grip.
Good luck and have fun with whatever you decide, most likely you buy
more than one anyways LOL
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on January 22, 2011 03:09 PM:
newtotrad, I agree totally with Rob's advice Posted by Cyclic-Rivers (Member # 21222) on January 22, 2011 03:13 PM:
I took the Flu Shot, I'm good for HH bugs this year.
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 22, 2011 04:08 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Cyclic-Rivers: I took the Flu Shot, I'm good for HH bugs this year.
Not me im full blown sick Posted by newtotrad (Member # 16871) on January 22, 2011 05:35 PM:
Thanks for all the input guys.
Posted by Blake Dustin Adams (Member # 11826) on January 22, 2011 06:16 PM:
Sixby if you want to start making this style let me know I'm really
starting to want one with Osage and Yew limbs with a Walnut or Black
Locust riser.
You guys are going to ruin my bank account. I'm
going to have to stop overpaying my monthly due on my truck so I can
have money to buy more bows.
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 22, 2011 06:41 PM:
Well, we finally got a break in the rain and 'ole Mr. Sunshine decided
to peak in on us. So, the obvious thing to do was take a break from the
arrow building and go shoot my "Owl".
I LOVE THE BEND OF A STRAIGHT LIMB "D" BOW! Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 22, 2011 06:45 PM:
nice form, tw - good arm extensions and everything is lined up parallel with the shaft. now where's yer bow cant?
and yeah, the bent "D" limbs and the back quiver are "traditional bowhunting". Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 22, 2011 07:04 PM:
Rob it's just the angle. The bow is canted but, not real exaggerated. If
you look closely at the lower limb, you will see it's actually outside
of my left leg. Thanks for the compliment, coming from you, that means a
lot. Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 22, 2011 07:07 PM:
Thats what im talking about.Nice picture Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 22, 2011 07:30 PM:
Not to tie this thread in with the carbon arrow thread but, those are AD
Trad Lites with approx. 190gr up front and, they were flying straight
and hitting pretty darn hard. I had to change the point weight when I
first started but, it worked like a charm! Posted by RC (Member # 162) on January 22, 2011 07:33 PM:
How bout my new to me Big Five...One hard shooting rascal.RC
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 22, 2011 07:36 PM:
I knew you where out playing, any pigs too show us?
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on January 22, 2011 07:39 PM:
Good to see some photos, lads!
Posted by RC (Member # 162) on January 22, 2011 07:46 PM:
No pigs. thats the swamp behind my house where I go stumping.Going on a two day hunt tomorrow for pork and treerats.RC
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 22, 2011 07:46 PM:
Nice looking Big 5 RC...congrats!
Spanky
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 22, 2011 07:51 PM:
Great looking bow RC! Look forward to some bacon pics when you return. Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 22, 2011 08:05 PM:
Yes great looking bow. Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on January 22, 2011 08:15 PM:
RC Dandy!!!
Could use some specs and a little more on your impression...how does it compare with your other bows?
Geez
- I think this Hill bug is terminal - you all can run outside for
therapy....I gotta sit here and drool for four more months before I can
touch a bow.
Posted by Cookus (Member # 17834) on January 22, 2011 08:41 PM:
Nice looking bow RC! I'm sure tomorrow will be awesome! Take your
camera and post some pictures! By the way, are you shooting 2016's out
of her?
Posted by RC (Member # 162) on January 22, 2011 09:02 PM:
Thanks Guys. It is a fine bow. First time I`ve had one with a staight
grip. It feels good but I think I would rather have a slight locator.
Regardless it shoots where I`m looking. Its 55@28 and 66" long. I`m
shooting goldtip trads 35/55 With 250 grains up front. Not as heavy as I
like for this kinda bow. I`m gonna get some wood arrows of some sort I
think. Its been a while since I`ve hunted with wood but I`m kinda
wanting to. I got some Ace 200 grain heads on the way I want to put
through a big boar.I`ve found two Big Mature pigs and I`m gonna be after
them .RC
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 22, 2011 10:52 PM:
RC you done good buddy!! Awesome looking bow!
Pictures of yours
made me get an indoor range set up. Actually I set up two one I can only
get 4-5 yards and the other is 9 yards.
I'm used to shooting a lot at 33 yards so this is a challenge.
"Keeper Kat" is as sweet at short distances as she is outside...lol
Thanks for sharing RC.
I look forward to seeing the pig(s) that get introduced to your new bow.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on January 22, 2011 11:13 PM:
Good luck, RC!
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 23, 2011 12:27 AM:
Great looking bows fellows!
Posted by stik&string (Member # 18418) on January 23, 2011 12:57 AM:
Thanks to everyone for the vast amount of information shared in this
thread. That "Hill Bug" has biten me pretty badly, and now I feel I can
make a more educated choice.
Posted by newtotrad (Member # 16871) on January 23, 2011 01:00 AM:
I'll second what stik&string just stated.
Posted by RC (Member # 162) on January 23, 2011 01:17 AM:
I hear Big Jim is gonna work up a Hill style bow in a little while.I`ve done got dibs on the first one..RC
Posted by tg2nd (Member # 16218) on January 23, 2011 02:54 AM:
My drawlength is 25", heigth is 5'10", Glove Size is "S". My
Hill/Hill-Style bows are 62" to 65" with riserlengths of 13" to 14". The
shorter ones work better for me.
Posted by Bent Rig (Member # 11592) on January 23, 2011 10:08 AM:
why isn't any of this stated in the catolog or online - how to fit the
correct bow to one specific DL for maxiumum performence ? It seems to me
that there are an awful lot of people whom didn't know these facts and
bought the wrong length bows . Even , I presume that they called and
talked to a bowyer when they made their orders , unless they just made
what the customer wanted without advising otherwise . So for example , I
pull 27.50"to 28" - by what I have read on hear I would want a
69"(thats what Howard used) bow - what would be the nock to nock length
on that bow - 67" ? Help !
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 23, 2011 10:18 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Bent Rig: why
isn't any of this stated in the catolog or online - how to fit the
correct bow to one specific DL for maxiumum performence ?
good question. some bowyers/companies offer guidelines for draw length versus bow length, some don't.
It seems to me that there are an awful lot of people whom didn't know these facts and bought the wrong length bows .
absolutely
true, but less so from a private bowyer who more than likely would
contact the buyer should the spex show a 29" draw for a 66" hill style
longbow
Even , I presume that they called and talked to a
bowyer when they made their orders , unless they just made what the
customer wanted without advising otherwise . So for example , I pull
27.50"to 28" - by what I have read on hear I would want a 69"(thats what
Howard used) bow - what would be the nock to nock length on that bow -
67" ? Help !
firstly, bow lengths should be as ntn. that
would be an amo given. second, some archers have no problem with a 29"
draw and a 66" hill longbow. all hill longbows are not alike, not all
have the same limb widths, core depths and tillering. without trying an
example of a bowyer, yer playing money and time games. when in doubt,
ALWAYS go longer. i have a 29" draw and a 68" craig hill longbow works
just fine. i've got a miller ol' tom on order and that WILL be 70" ntn.
hope this helps.
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 23, 2011 10:29 AM:
Guys the facts are that alot of Hill bows today are built to a formula
for the masses! Riser length, limb tapers, and tiller all have to be
adjusted to an archers EXACT draw, hand width, and grip depth and not
just to bow length in order to get the proper arc in the limbs for EACH
archer! You absolutly will not fit to the same length bow from one
bowyer to the next and get optimum performance from each. A 68-69" bow
might work fine for you from one bowyer, but from the next it either
stacks or is too slow and thumpy! As I stated previously, the difference
in a Hill bow that has truly been fit to you and one that has not, is
like the difference between night and day...there is NO comparison! As
for the stuff printed in older writings from Hill and Schultz, they
didn't write everything they knew and they continued to refine there
bows after those texts were written. The later information was passed
only to a select few people especially from John who was very
tight-mouthed about his designs. In his later years as John refined his
designs and started to incorporate different profiles, he actually shot
bows much shorter and lighter than he did early on! I say all this to
remind us all that designs and materials continue to evolve making your
bowyer the only true source of accurate up to date information for what
you need now!
Spanky
Posted by rollin (Member # 18513) on January 23, 2011 10:31 AM:
Ive only shot recurves and with my DL=27.5" will I lose some DL going to a bow like this?
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 23, 2011 10:33 AM:
If you shoot with proper Hill form you may lose up to an inch of draw,
depending upon how straight your bow arm is with the recurve.
Spanky
Posted by rollin (Member # 18513) on January 23, 2011 10:41 AM:
Thought I had read that somewhere.Thanks.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 23, 2011 10:53 AM:
i could care less about hill, schulz and 'hill form'. i don't want
'hill form', i don't like 'hill form' at all. i like MY form.
MY
form is all that matters and that means having an american flat longbow
that WORKS. for me. not you. or hill. or schulz.
the bold
truth is that longer limbs and good tillering make for a good american
flat longbow. can it be better than that? i think so, if the bowyer
does take into consideration unique qualities of the archer.
the rest is, well, subjective rhetoric and diatribe. imho.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 23, 2011 11:13 AM:
as a personal observation over the last 55 years of messing with archery
and bowhunting, guys that start off with too short and too heavy a
holding weight stick bow ALWAYS increase their draw length when they up
the bow length and lower the holding weight.
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 23, 2011 11:38 AM:
Bent Rig-If you contact Jason or Craig at HH they will walk you right
through the process. Nobody asked me what the size of my hand was or
anything like that. I gave Jason my draw length(27 to 27.5)and the
weight I wanted(54#'s) and he made the recommendation for me(64 to
66"bow). Never owning a Hill bow before I took his advice and ordered a
66" Wesley Special 54@27. These guys know how to build a bow and know
whats best for the customer. As far as all this technical stuff guys
are talking about it is very interesting to me. It has taught me alot
about bows in general. But I buy a bow to hunt with and thats it. So my
opinion is if MY Hill bow shoots where I want it too and it's
comfortable to me then thats all that matters. If I want to use a stay
puff marshmallow grip and it works then thats what I'll use. Point
is,this is all good stuff here and teaches people what COULD go into
choosing a bow. As for me,I let the bowyer tell me what size I need and
they haven't failed me yet. This is all my opinion of course.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 23, 2011 11:46 AM:
the additional things i request when ordering out a craig hill longbow, any model ...
* narrow throat locator handle, non-tear drop cross section
* shelf plate wood cut no more than 1/16" proud of the limb centerline
* tiller to 30" (1" past my draw length)
* thinned limb tip overlays
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 23, 2011 11:48 AM:
I did also pick my grip and limb tips.
Hey Rob, are you tryiong to get my specs from me to ruin my surprise?
I'm still not telling what I ordered.
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on January 23, 2011 12:11 PM:
Rob, I agree with you,
"the bold truth is that longer limbs and
good tillering make for a good american flat longbow. can it be better
than that? i think so, if the bowyer does take into consideration unique
qualities of the archer."
Like I pointed out in John Schulz is book Hitting them like Howard Hill, Mr. Schulz's favorite bow was 68" for his 26" draw.
For
almost the last 20years, I shot bows that where 66", 68", 69" and 70"
at my 28"draw very well, but I tend to prefer the longer lengths 68"
thru 70.
Darren
Posted by Bent Rig (Member # 11592) on January 23, 2011 12:35 PM:
Thanks Guys , just trying to get as much info as possible so when the
time comes I'm ready with all my spec's and questions for the bowyer
when called upon . I don't have a problem with longer . Posted by Kelly (Member # 1777) on January 23, 2011 12:37 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano:
as a personal observation over the last 55 years of messing with
archery and bowhunting, guys that start off with too short and too heavy
a holding weight stick bow ALWAYS increase their draw length when they
up the bow length and lower the holding weight.
Amen!
Just
an FYI learned from experience my first entrance into the "longbow"
world came about in 1994 after 30 years shooting recurves. Was shooting a
66" 68# Gamemaster Jet at that time and had been shooting recurves of
that weight, or thereabouts for over 20 years.
So, because of
all the R/D trend at that time I tried a 70# 60" Pronghorn longbow.
Never ever did get to a similar accrucay with that bow as my recurves
because it stacked(was way too short) for my nearly 29" draw. Many said
you can not shoot a longbow the same way you shoot a recurve-one had to
shoot quickly, not delibertly like with a recurve. Well, I tried it that
way and it was worse for me.
As the years progressed I could
never get it out of my mind that the "longbow" had beaten me. Sure every
other year or so I'd try another one-whatever was the latest, greatest
since sliced bread model but the results were always the same.
Fast
forward to 2010 and the "longbow" bug and my personal defeat with it
are still forefront in my memory so decided to give it one last try.
Always loved the simplicity of a "stick and string", wood arrows in a
back quiver and just wondering through hill and dale ala "Witchery of
Archery" style.
So what will be different with this foray into
the "longbow" world this time you might ask? Well, I'm treating this
venture like I've nver shot a bow before and starting with a 64", 30# @
26" Howard Hill Big Five to learn the correct ways of the "longbow"! As I
progress into this adventure there will be a Miller all bamboo and a
Sunset Hill(new model) waiting to fulfill my dreams. Yep, even after 49
years of shooting the bow one can still have dreams.
Posted by Kelly (Member # 1777) on January 23, 2011 12:55 PM:
Here is my Hill Big Five, 64" 30# @ 26".
Here is my Miller all bamboo, 66" 50# @ 28".
My Sunset Hill, a project in waiting but will get you a picture as soon as I receive it, will be 66" and around 42# @ 28".
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 23, 2011 01:07 PM:
real longbows. just gorgeous. Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 23, 2011 01:21 PM:
Nice Kelly, real nice!
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 23, 2011 01:28 PM:
Rob, I will say this, I went ahead and stayed with the locator grip. And maybe a couple other suggestions you made.
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 23, 2011 01:29 PM:
Very nice Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 23, 2011 01:30 PM:
Great looking bows Kelly! I like the looks of the Miller. Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 23, 2011 01:33 PM:
Lookin good Kelly!
Posted by pavan (Member # 21538) on January 23, 2011 02:29 PM:
I need to clarify the statement about John's favorite bow from the early
70s. The 68" 'Big Enough', although it was his favorite length at that
time, later he shot 66" and when he went to his string follow and all
wood designs he was shooting 64". he maintained his 261/4" draw. I have
shot bows from 96 down to less than 40 pounds and I also shoot a little
over 26" draw on all of them. I tried 27" for a while with an 89
pounder and 72 pound bow, I was advised by Schulz that I was over
drawing and went back to cutting my broadheads to 263/4" to the back of
the blade. I pull the blade to my finger when I shoot, giving me about a
261/4" draw. I have seen a bunch of guys over bowed with heavy
longbows that would jam their bow arm, collapse in the shoulders and
loose draw length; if you start out light and maintain that bent bow arm
and shoulder control while going up in bow weight, your shooting and
your shoulder will be better off. Two of my favorite bows is a
68"Halfbreed blank tillered to a whip end for my short draw and the
Timberline myrtle handled yew that I just picked up which is also 68".
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 23, 2011 03:31 PM:
I may have to give the locator grip a try.
On the other hand, we all know the old saying "If it ain't broke....."..lol
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 23, 2011 03:42 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Mudd: I may have to give the locator grip a try.
On the other hand, we all know the old saying "If it ain't broke....."..lol
God bless,Mudd
it's all subjective personal preference, as with most things in life. no such thing as a better or best grip, bow, arrow, etc.
hey, are we havin' fun ............ yet?! Posted by chupa (Member # 17556) on January 23, 2011 03:47 PM:
Pavan that is a great reply. I like how you mentioned you whip end
shaped your blank to enhance your personal draw length. Of course
Schulz enjoyed the freedom to experiment and for one reason he chose a
certain length and limb arc vs another. He didn't necessarily choose
one length bow at his draw length to be the one and only perfect bow,
but he did know how to achieve what was the best ntn length for the way
he wanted to tiller a particular bow. The difference in the limb arc
does not need to be a large amount different to produce fine results. Target
style (lighter arrows) vs hunting weight arrows perform better with
differently a shaped limb arc, but when you tiller a bow a certain way
you must change the length nock to nock to maximze efficiency and
overall feel. It is my opinion through this great thread we are all
enjoying the one critically important piece of information for having a
bow that is the correct length and shape is "what weight is my
preferred choice of arrow".
Some like EFOC others like lighter arrows etc. That's where the journey begins....
Posted by pavan (Member # 21538) on January 23, 2011 03:54 PM:
On my yew Hill, I have given it a locator that is a copy, although
deeper, of the grip off my 50s 72" Bear Kodiak. I tweaked it until I
need to do nothing with my bow hand to shoot. When the grip is right,
it's right. I have another one that is due for tweaking when the time
comes for refinishing. I am wondering how difficult it would get, when
ordering, to really get fussy on particular subtleties of shape to the
locator grip. Quite often when someone loves or hates a bow, it starts
and ends with the grip.
Posted by Cookus (Member # 17834) on January 23, 2011 07:17 PM:
Okay... We've waited patiently. We need details of the Big 5's escapades in the swamp today RC!
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on January 23, 2011 09:26 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano:
as a personal observation over the last 55 years of messing with
archery and bowhunting, guys that start off with too short and too heavy
a holding weight stick bow ALWAYS increase their draw length when they
up the bow length and lower the holding weight.
Yes..this
is the truth. When I shot the "all to short" bear recurves for too
many years, I trained myself to pull against the stacking. It was all we
had...did not know there were actually bows with longer limbs. Years
later, when I found there were actually more comfortable (appropriate)
bows to shoot, I found myself drawing a full 32"...no kidding.
Took a couple years with good bows to rectify this problem..now shooting 29" pretty consistently.
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on January 23, 2011 09:42 PM:
quote:Originally posted by SpankyNeal:
Guys the facts are that alot of Hill bows today are built to a formula
for the masses! Riser length, limb tapers, and tiller all have to be
adjusted to an archers EXACT draw, hand width, and grip depth and not
just to bow length in order to get the proper arc in the limbs for EACH
archer! ......
Spanky
Dang..if this is true, then I best not ever consider buying a used bow in the classifieds...
Bummer!! Posted by RC (Member # 162) on January 23, 2011 10:17 PM:
I would`nt hesitate to buy a hill bow in the classifieds or any bow I
wanted and could afford for that matter.A lot of "proper" fitting can go
into a bow but truth is one thats the correct length for your draw or
close will shoot plenty good.RC
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 23, 2011 10:21 PM:
X2 what RC said.....!!
God bless,Mudd
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on January 23, 2011 10:25 PM:
I'll ditto that RC.
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on January 23, 2011 10:27 PM:
Thanks RC...that is good to know. I was counting on a "good deal"
Rob
suggested that I talk with the bowyer - give him parameters and have
one made for me. I'll prolly do that up front 'till I feel more at ease
to pick-up a good used one tho..
It does seem there are a few experienced Hill boys here that don't agree on this issue.. not surprising.
I am at the beginning of my learning curve here. Just beginning to weigh these considerations.
Thanks again..
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 24, 2011 10:01 AM:
quote:Originally posted by SpankyNeal:
Guys the facts are that alot of Hill bows today are built to a formula
for the masses! Riser length, limb tapers, and tiller all have to be
adjusted to an archers EXACT draw, hand width, and grip depth and not
just to bow length in order to get the proper arc in the limbs for EACH
archer! You absolutly will not fit to the same length bow from one
bowyer to the next and get optimum performance from each. A 68-69" bow
might work fine for you from one bowyer, but from the next it either
stacks or is too slow and thumpy! As I stated previously, the difference
in a Hill bow that has truly been fit to you and one that has not, is
like the difference between night and day...there is NO comparison! As
for the stuff printed in older writings from Hill and Schultz, they
didn't write everything they knew and they continued to refine there
bows after those texts were written. The later information was passed
only to a select few people especially from John who was very
tight-mouthed about his designs. In his later years as John refined his
designs and started to incorporate different profiles, he actually shot
bows much shorter and lighter than he did early on! I say all this to
remind us all that designs and materials continue to evolve making your
bowyer the only true source of accurate up to date information for what
you need now!
Spanky
i
don't believe that at all. not in my experience after getting a glut
of craig built hills, and a few by other far lesser known bowyers.
the real problem is that a LOT of hill style longbow archers don't know what they're ordering or what to specifically request.
there
COULD BE some esoteric nuances that a 'bow-tique bowyer' could offer
over a more 'mass produced' bow such as what craig offers. in fairness,
craig is NOT a mass producing production line bow company, he WILL
listen to you and in most cases he'll accommodate your longbow needs and
requirements. this is true for the very vast majority of bowyers. you
just need to know what to order. for you. not for me.
so what's really left?
overall
bow design, materials, craftsmanship, tillering, finishing. pick a
bowyer and get yer feet wet. we've all been there and it's all a crap
shoot of sorts. just look at the classifieds.
lets also put all
of the bow design, bow materials, length vs width, "what's best for me",
yadda yadda yadda stuff in perspective - if you think that these
"slight nuances" are gonna be deal makers or breakers for you to bring
home the bacon, yer definitely nuttier than me, and i'm a bona fide nut
case when it comes to longbows.
the arrow is still the god of archery - NOT the bow.
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on January 24, 2011 10:13 AM:
Rob said: "and i'm a bona fide nut case when it comes to longbows."
Rob...I
figured....HA! That's the real reason I bend your ear. Maybe I am too
picky...yeah, I am but it is the "nuances" that I like....and that is
why I can take your "nutcase" list to craig and get what I want.
Rob, buddy...don't forget to take your meds.. Posted by Buckwheaties (Member # 10410) on January 24, 2011 11:52 AM:
All of these "nuances" have got me wondering?? I have a Robin Hood "in
the mail" to me. I talked to Craig b4 I ordered it. I told him that I
have a 27" draw and a tight fitting work glove size hand. (a tight
medium/ a little loose large) He suggested a 66" or 68" bow. Ok I
ordered it @ 66" with a slightly smaller dished grip. I am under the
impression that shooting a Hill is different than shooting most other
longbows, so if that's the case, won't "I just learn to shoot it the way
it is?" Like, get use to it and learn to like it? How can someone
decide what's right for them without shooting alot of other Hill style
bows to figure out the "nuances?" I hope my info to Craig was enough to
get me in the ball park? Oh, one other question.. Can I turn a dished
grip into a locator grip if I want to or is the dished design wrong to
allow it?
Posted by WESTBROOK (Member # 8854) on January 24, 2011 11:57 AM:
What a great thread this has been! Lots of great info and Purdy bows!
Rob,
I think you'll be pleased with the string follow bows. You'll find its
not same as a bow that has "taken set". It'll be a sweet shooter and
still push an arrow with the best of them, I know mine dont run out of
gas at 20 yds!
Macatawa, you'll be fine with a 68" bow.
A Hill bow, handfull of woodies and walk in the woods...Its good for what ales ya!
Eric
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 24, 2011 01:22 PM:
Rob, I guess I don't understand exactly what I said that you don't agree
with, but I did not mean that Craig or anyone else for that matter,
were mass producing bows! The more nitpicky the bowyer is about your
various measurements, shooting style etc. and the more you are as well,
the better the bow is going to work for you. If you go to a trad expo
and pick a bow off the shelf that is tillered for a 28" draw, that bow
was designed for a generic, average person with a 28" draw....will it
work for you maybe, maybe not! The nuances are not a make or break deal,
they simply can turn a good experience into a great experience!
As
for used bows, unless the bow is tillered very close to my 26.5" draw I
don't buy it...works fine with other bows, but not Hills.
Spanky
Posted by sunset hill (Member # 2674) on January 24, 2011 02:51 PM:
Rob, I'm going to politely disagree with you, no hard feelings...
Back
when Hill wrote his books, he was writing to the masses, and still
using mostly unfiberglassed bows. He preferred longer bows and they fit
him because of his size and draw and the durability of a longer
unfiberglassed bow. His bow formula with reflex worked for a longer
bow. He taught bowyers how to build his style of bows with these specs
in mind. At that time, he preferred those specs......
fast
forward to the 70's...John Schulz was building bows how he was taught,
long and with much reflex, and his preferred bow was 68" for a 26"
draw...but his bows at that time were heavily reflexed and the longer
length kept them stable yet very fast shooters...but in the back of his
mind, he remembers Hill tutelage about string follow bows, and he
gradually changed his bowmaking to follow Hill's personal instruction.
Schulz's personal bows became much shorter...the bow in his video is
only 64", because he was departing from the radical reflex bows to a
softer string follow style as per Hill's instruction. His bowmaking was
modified to take advantage of Hill's preferences in bowdesign and
modern materials like good fiberglass and his later bows built for Hill
himself used this thinking....
fast forward to the 90's...Schulz
is now only making all bamboo/wood bows following Hill's early bowmaking
principles, but allowing for current technology and making short bows
sized to the individual shooter. He shot bows as short as 62"...
I'm
stating this to say that as time has progressed, the Hill style bows
design as made by Hill and Schulz (his ace student) also progressed. If
we make a static statement concerning Hill's or Schulz's bow
preferences, we need to look at the time period and bow design that
statement refers to, or we are in the wrong context of the statement.
Rob,
You have stated numerous times that you have had a gaggle of Hill
style longbows. I don't know how many you have now, but I wonder how
many you've sold because they weren't 'right' for you....not in
cosmetics, but in shooting characteristics. You've had a chance to
specify how you like the bow to be made, and yet they still might not
fit you. I've seen a photo of your bowform...in my opinion it is very
much a target/recurve form. That is not a bad thing at all. It is YOUR
form. However, I've seen way too many guys with a target/recurve form
not be able to shoot a Hill style bow well, not because of the bow, but
the style of shooting wasn't conducive. The Hill style bow has it's own
nuances in shooting and it's more critical of those nuances than
recurves or r/d bows are. Maybe the reason you've not found the holy
grail of Hill style longbows is that your shooting style is more
conducive to a r/d bow or recurve...that statement is not meant in a
demeaning or derogatory way, nor does it reflect on your joy of holding
and shooting a hill style longbow... it's just food for thought.
Discussions like this help newbie Hill style longbow shooter think about
their choices and what fits best for them.
Posted by tg2nd (Member # 16218) on January 24, 2011 03:33 PM:
I know a bowyer who has learned from Schulz. If he's in the right mood
he tells you the true storys about riser length, bow length, etc. But
only if he's in the right mood! I think that's the point with a lot of
people. There are not "secrets", but little, tiny details. These details
can make a huge difference in a bow.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 24, 2011 03:44 PM:
quote:Originally posted by SpankyNeal:
Rob, I guess I don't understand exactly what I said that you don't
agree with, but I did not mean that Craig or anyone else for that
matter, were mass producing bows! The more nitpicky the bowyer is about
your various measurements, shooting style etc. and the more you are as
well, the better the bow is going to work for you. If you go to a trad
expo and pick a bow off the shelf that is tillered for a 28" draw, that
bow was designed for a generic, average person with a 28" draw....will
it work for you maybe, maybe not! The nuances are not a make or break
deal, they simply can turn a good experience into a great experience!
As
for used bows, unless the bow is tillered very close to my 26.5" draw I
don't buy it...works fine with other bows, but not Hills.
Spanky
basically, your initial statement ...
quote:Originally posted by SpankyNeal: Guys the facts are that alot of Hill bows today are built to a formula for the masses! ...
as
i've stated, most bowyers will make at least some accommodations to
their designs, but in most cases, you gotta know what you want and know
what to ask about.
the rest are all about the nuances - short or
medium or long riser, every aspect of limb design, tillering, shelf
design, handle and grip, and ad naseum.
let me repeat - the bow
is not nearly as important as the arrow. when a bow "fits" you well,
then yes, that can and typically will enhance accurate consistency. but
it is NOT a panacea for criticality.
to those who think the
bow is THAT critical, you are officially absolved of your worry and
pain. go forth with a friendly longbow and your best arrows and kill
something good for suppers.
put this all into proper
perspective. we are traditional bowhunters and our weapons range from a
simple rasped and scraped stick of wood to a laminated
carbon/wood/glass/foam/whatever thing that has little resemblance to
that primordial stick.
it DOES matter, but not that much.
really. trust me on this. getting a longbow that puts you in the
ballpark for feel and performance isn't as difficult as some would have
you believe. really. we all can have a tendency at times to obsess
over minutiae.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 24, 2011 03:58 PM:
quote:Originally posted by sunset hill: Rob, I'm going to politely disagree with you, no hard feelings...
no, not at all, sir! it's fine and good to disagree and debate.
i'll be blunt yet again. i don't care at all about how howard hill made or shot his longbows.
i
care about the looks of an american flat longbow, the long, narrow and
thickish limbs, the short riser and well bent limbs. this is mostly
about aesthetics and not cast performance because most any decent r/d
"longbow" will outperform the best "hill style" longbow, pound for pound
of holding weight with the same arrow.
to those who wish to
emulate howard or john or any other howard-like disciple, cool. have at
it. i will tell you this - you are better off working on your own
form, as it applies to your physique than someone else's if you wish to
excel at trad bowhunting.
and for the record, nate, i do NOT have a "target/recurve form". you want to discuss the nuances of that, pm me.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 24, 2011 04:19 PM:
quote:Originally posted by tg2nd:
I know a bowyer who has learned from Schulz. If he's in the right mood
he tells you the true storys about riser length, bow length, etc. But
only if he's in the right mood! I think that's the point with a lot of
people. There are not "secrets", but little, tiny details. These details
can make a huge difference in a bow.
no no no, those differences MIGHT make some kinda difference in a bow. maybe.
there
are *SO* many variables in a piece of wood 'n' glass that to think a
human can clone that precise goodness from bow to bow is like believing
in the tooth fairy. i'm a luthier, i equate bow building with acoustic
quitar making - if someone knew how to clone either *perfectly*, every
time, they would be ... GOD.
however,
a good bowyer should be able to make your bow journey easier in many
ways, and deliver a bow to you that, for the very most part, will make
you a happy archer and hunter.
Posted by tg2nd (Member # 16218) on January 24, 2011 04:41 PM:
Perhaps i believe in the tooth fairy?? (brought me some money as a child) Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 24, 2011 04:42 PM:
quote:Originally posted by tg2nd: Perhaps i believe in the tooth fairy?? (brought me some money as a child)
yeah, and ya know what pt barnum said? Posted by tg2nd (Member # 16218) on January 24, 2011 04:54 PM:
Sorry, but I don't know pt barnum or what he said. Hope you tell me.
Posted by mysticguido (Member # 4426) on January 24, 2011 05:01 PM:
PT Branum said "A Sucker born every minute"
Posted by pavan (Member # 21538) on January 24, 2011 05:11 PM:
My first hill longbows were made by Schulz, then Schulz went on to make
his own trimmer line. The next Hill bows I got were not made by Craig
or Schulz. One made by Meggs was quite different than either one, not a
bad bow. One day I made a tiller board and took a 66" Schulz and
traced it at different draw lengths. When comparing the two i noticed
quite a difference in how they bent. The Meggs bent much more at the
handle, so I changed it to match the Schulz and then went a little
further. I flight shot the bow many times before I did this. In the
end I reduced the poundage of the bow by 8 pounds and it did not slow
down at all. It shot the same arrow, with same authority, the same
distance. I had another longer much heavier Hill, not built by Craig, I
was tempted to try something with that one, but the tips were nearly as
thick as the rest of the limb. But I did flight shoot it. it would
not shoot as stiff a spine as the 64 pound Schulz, which was 25 pounds
lighter nor would it shoot any arrow as far. I sold it to someone that
thought he had to have. Todays hills are more like those first hills,
with a gentler reflex than the Meggs i had or the other ones. I say all
this to point out that a little change here and there in the Hill style
bows that I have seen over the years can make a substantial difference.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 24, 2011 05:19 PM:
quote:Originally posted by pavan: ...I
say all this to point out that a little change here and there in the
Hill style bows that I have seen over the years can make a substantial
difference.
and i do believe you and that you are correct, sir.
however,
i consider that a "substantial difference" be put into the grander
scheme of things, to whit, is it so large a difference as to be night
and day, or at the other end is it a subtle difference? and to who - me
or you or ... ? what does all of this really mean to the average trad
bowhunter?
iow, each of us are 'experiments of one' when it comes
to subjective stuff like longbows. and each of us has likes and
dislikes, and some of these qualities are poles apart.
in the
end, all that matters is bow that is a joy to the eyes, feels good in
the hand, pulls sweetly, releases gently, and helps your good arrow to
hit the mark and bring home the game.
it's not rocket science, nor does it ever need be.
all the rest is curious interest.
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 24, 2011 05:40 PM:
Rob stated ...
quote:in
the end, all that matters is bow that is a joy to the eyes, feels good
in the hand, pulls sweetly, releases gently, and helps your good arrow
to hit the mark and bring home the game
Sums it up nicely !
Posted by pavan (Member # 21538) on January 24, 2011 05:58 PM:
I should have added that I think that the bows available from Craig Ekin
are quite simply great bows. It must be pointed out as well that this
little tillering trick works for a 26" draw, the same bow had less than a
two pound per inch build up out to 27 inches and only two pounds from
27 to 28 inches. The difference in this case was substantial, because
the bows performance remained the same and the person that is now
shooting it could not handle it at 50 pounds, but she can shoot it all
day at 42. The person who has that bow now won't let anyone touch it,
and i bet it would stack past 27 inches. i was in a hurry my wife left
the interior lights on in my Suv and needed a jump.
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on January 24, 2011 07:43 PM:
Feed me!! This is ALL good!!
Interesting historical perspective blended with a lot of personal experience and preference..
Someone once said: "too many cooks spoil the soup" but that is not the case here..not at all.
Posted by sunset hill (Member # 2674) on January 24, 2011 07:50 PM:
Rob,
I agree with you, this longbow shooting should be a simple,
enjoyable process. It's not rocket science. That said, there are
reasons why some bows shoot better for some people than other bows. It
is these reasons that we discuss openly on this forum, so that people
can learn information that has been held 'secret' for so long. Maybe
someone is learning something that will help them purchase a bow that
will fit them and their shooting style.
These simple longbows are
great in that they are so simple. However, they are not just a 'pull
'er back and let 'er fly' thing. If that is the approach one wants to
take, then that is their perogative, and one of the joys of this sport.
However, there are so many small things that can be adjusted, from limb
tiller to handle size, to bow length, etc. that make the bow shoot as
well as possible for that individual....very much the same as a ILF
recurve bow can be adjusted in limb tiller, handle length, bow length,
etc. to make it shoot as well as possible.
Why do we as archers
accept that a tournament or other style recurve or R/D bow has umpteen
ways to get it shooting and feeling perfect while a Hill style longbow
must always feel thumpy, slow, and 'get used to it or sell it'? These
"simple" straight end longbows can be made to perform splendidly....and
all this 'forum chatter' helps further that end.
Nate
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 24, 2011 08:32 PM:
nate, i couldn't agree more with you, sir.
there are those who
will ask for a bow built by model, length and draw weight, with no other
input. and they may be happy hunters with said bow, and kill tons of
game for decades. or too soon, as the newness wears off, the bow
becomes a dog to them, and it ends up in the classifieds. either way,
more input to and from the bowyer is always a good thing. there is
always the element of luck with a new bow, no matter who the bowyer or
what the parameters. less chances are taken when you can work with a knowledgeable bowyer.
and,
imo, a specific type of stick bow (i.e., hill straight or backset or
string follow, or mild r/d or aggressive r/d, etc) does not dictate a
specific shooting form be required, in order to reach its maximum
potential.
however, if specific stick bow
parameters are employed, as they apply to the archer in question, there
is far greater a chance the resulting bow will be a better shooter.
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on January 24, 2011 10:19 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano:
.....however,
if specific stick bow parameters are employed, as they apply to the
archer in question, there is far greater a chance the resulting bow will
be a better shooter.
I
am by nature, a lot like Rob I think. Can be happy with something good
but, if it can be better, even a little bit, I am interested.
Years
ago my job was to eliminate process variation in aircraft fuel systems
manufacturing. That in itself has nothing to do with trad archery but
the mindset applies to all of life, imo.
"If it ain't broke,
don't fix it" is a good place to start but in my own insanity, I can't
help but to tweak it a bit, especially if it doesn't cost more and the
end result translates to my own personal view of perfection...in this
case...perfect simplicity and historic beauty.
So, as Rob
suggested, I will feed the knowledgeable bowyer with as much info as he
"employs the specific stik bow parameters" to ensure that there is a
better chance that my first of many will be a good shooter.
Not rocket science here...just good sense, imo
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 25, 2011 12:30 AM:
This thread needs to get back to the basics i think people try to make
this too difficult.I can give a bow to leatherneck and he can pound a
bullseye with most bows very quickly from recurve to a hill.This is a
picture of Dirty Bob first day shooting and shooting great all ready
with his new to him Wesley Special. Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 25, 2011 12:31 AM:
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 25, 2011 12:32 AM:
Welcome to the gang Dirty Bob Posted by tg2nd (Member # 16218) on January 25, 2011 12:36 AM:
Rob, thanks for not telling me.
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 25, 2011 12:37 AM:
And welcome to the Hill clan!
Ben, those of us that have been shooting them for a while get bored with the usual stuff, so we get picky!
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 25, 2011 12:48 AM:
I just wanted to get back on track.There are lots of hill bows being
built right now and i cant wait to see them all.What one person thinks
is right is wrong to another we are all individuals and like things
different from others.I would love to see your collection of hill style
bows.Do you live close to pelee island if so i will be their in july
23-30.
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 25, 2011 01:03 AM:
Onya Dirty Bob ! nice lookin stic mate !
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on January 25, 2011 03:03 AM:
Nice bow, Dirty Bob!
Posted by GingivitisKahn (Member # 13331) on January 25, 2011 06:54 AM:
Man, that's a nice looking bow!
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 25, 2011 07:05 AM:
yeah, enuf of this esoteric stuff.
another big 5 i had a few years back ...
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 25, 2011 07:11 AM:
ah yes. an abbott! with really loooong fadeouts ...
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 25, 2011 08:08 AM:
Rob, Dirty Bobs bow should look familiar to you.
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 25, 2011 09:26 AM:
quote:Originally posted by WESTBROOK: What a great thread this has been! Lots of great info and Purdy bows!
Now that is a postcard pic if I ever saw one.
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 25, 2011 09:41 AM:
You know something just ain't right when three guys come home from work
and are shooting Hills in the dark at midnight!! In teen weather to
boot!!! Or should I say it was all tooooo right. I just could not wait
to try Dirty Bobs new to him Wesley. It's 68" 50@28. Some may say this
bow is too long for my 27" draw but I think the target will disagree.
Man this bow was smooth! I didn't want to put it down. Dirty Bob was
starting to give me dirty looks after about a dozen arrows.
And did it ever fit into my hand. Rob I'm loving that locator and I'm glad thats what my bow will have.
Dirty
Bob shot this bow quite impressive. First day with it and he was
smashing bulls at 10 yards. Now mind you he hasn't shot a trad bow since
he was a kid. You would have thought he's been shooting for a year or
so.
Bunnies at GORH better look out!!!!!
Congrats Bob on an awesome bow. You did good.
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 25, 2011 10:37 AM:
And i was left out to just drink beer because im a lefty.If that bow
would have been 5 lb heaver i think leatherneck might have stolen that
bow.Keep your eyes out Dirty Bob Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 25, 2011 10:40 AM:
I might steal it anyhow!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 25, 2011 05:13 PM:
We had another decent day of no rain today so, I took the "Redman" out
to work on my form a little. Rob had noticed that I was leaning into my
shots so, I wanted to practice and try and break that habit. I had a
shoulder injury when I was deployed and I think that is what's causing
me to lean in a little. The "Redman" is easier to practice with as it is
only 45# @ my 29" draw. I shot at about 10yds just keep it simple. Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 25, 2011 05:23 PM:
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 25, 2011 05:23 PM:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by leatherneck: [QB] [QUOTE]Originally posted by Rob DiStefano: [qb] hmmm, i think this was an adirondack? really loooong fadeouts ...
Thats a sweet looki ng bow Rob.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 25, 2011 05:29 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Wannabe1:
We had another decent day of no rain today so, I took the "Redman" out
to work on my form a little. Rob had noticed that I was leaning into my
shots so, I wanted to practice and try and break that habit. I had a
shoulder injury when I was deployed and I think that is what's causing
me to lean in a little. The "Redman" is easier to practice with as it is
only 45# @ my 29" draw. I shot at about 10yds just keep it simple.
real good "inline" form, tw.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 25, 2011 05:33 PM:
quote:Originally posted by longbowben:
real nice form, ben.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 25, 2011 05:34 PM:
quote:Originally posted by WESTBROOK: What a great thread this has been! Lots of great info and Purdy bows!
just a real purty winter's day picture!
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 25, 2011 06:53 PM:
Nice form TW... i have the problem of leaning into my shots. A
combination of being blind in one eye , a previously crushed shoulder
and too much # as a youngster. I remedied it with reinforcing proper
head position ... draw to my anchor...not move my anchor to my hand ! Ain't nuthin better than seeing a well drawn Redman ! Good stuff ...
Great pics fella's !
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 25, 2011 06:58 PM:
Rob/Ben, thanks for the comments. Ben, I think I might have been doing
the same. I mean, moving my anchor to my hand. I also noticed that I am
utilizing my back muscles more when I practiced today. Rob brought that
point up on a PM to me a few days ago.
Posted by Molson (Member # 1802) on January 25, 2011 08:00 PM:
You guys are not helping the bow disease with all this Hill bow talk.
Now I find myself reading Hunting the Hard Way and Hitting 'Em Like
Howard Hill again. It looks like Craig has a stock bow that's just
about perfect. Hmmm... Posted by chubber (Member # 10506) on January 25, 2011 08:15 PM:
Rob,that adirondack looks alot like an abbott with those long fades.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 25, 2011 08:21 PM:
quote:Originally posted by chubber: Rob,that adirondack looks alot like an abbott with those long fades.
yup, i agree, that's an abbott. thanx!
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 25, 2011 08:22 PM:
Molson...just do it ! Then you can sit up the back of the bus with the rest of us bad boys! Which bow are looking at ?
Posted by Molson (Member # 1802) on January 25, 2011 08:46 PM:
I'm looking at that 66" 55@26 Halfbreed with the Ebony Riser and black
glass. Of course the 66" 55@27 Halfbreed with Chechen Riser and clear
glass wouldn't be bad either!
Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on January 25, 2011 08:54 PM:
All this talk and no help from Rob and Mudd FORCED me to order a bow
from HH,I made a new model a RED CHEETAH, 66", 56# @28",Basically a Hill
Cheetah but instesd of Bamboo I got Yew cores with slight string follow
.There is something about Yew.
Posted by Orion (Member # 2759) on January 25, 2011 08:56 PM:
Wannabe: Nothing wrong with leaning into the shot a little. Take a
look at pix of Howard Hill shooting. He leaned in. Straight up stance
is more of a target stance. Will lengthen your draw length, but there's
nothing particularly magical about it. Do what works for you. Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 25, 2011 09:03 PM:
Jerry, it's funny you should say that as I was just looking at one of my
HH catalogs, and there is a 3 step draw sequence that Howard goes
through. In the sequence, he looks like he is leaning a lot into the
shot.
With that being said, I am not utilizing the full weight of
my bow at my 29" draw, if I'm not pulling it to 29". It's something I
am working to fix.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 25, 2011 09:09 PM:
i've read that howard leaned into the bow because he knowingly shot too
short an arrow. he even wrote about that. looking at his height, his
overall physique, the length of his arms and width of his shoulders, he
could/should have been shooting 29" at the minimum, maybe more.
leaning in shortens the draw length and makes it harder to use the back muscles.
not
leaning into the bow is not a 'straight up target stance'. none of
this has anything to do with 'target archery'. i played the target game
for over 20 years - that and bowhunting are two different animals.
but it is very true - do whatever works best for you as long as you have consistent good accuracy.
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 25, 2011 09:10 PM:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Molson: I'm looking at that 66"
55@26 Halfbreed with the Ebony Riser and black glass. Of course the 66"
55@27 Halfbreed with Chechen Riser and clear glass wouldn't be bad
either! [/QUOTE
I'm here to tell you,this bow is
gorgeous!!!(66" 55@27) Jason sent it to me to try out cause I wanted to
try a Hill bow. The yew on this bow was stunning. It just did not have
the specs I wanted or it would not have gone back. I only shot about a
dozen arrows through it and sent it back. Then I called in my order. You
wont go wrong with this bow if it's one you want.
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 25, 2011 09:14 PM:
Rob, your advice is good and it worked for me. By focusing more on my
form, I was able to utilize the back muscles better and my draw seemed
smoother. Don't know if that makes sense but, that's what it felt like
to me.
Before, I think I was using the arm muscles more, and this
was affecting my shoulder problem. Using the back muscles, made it
easier to get to my full draw length.
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 25, 2011 09:20 PM:
Maybe for the Shooters forum or off topic but as we are on the here ,
there is a BIG difference between leaning the body into a shot and
leaning the head forward to meet the anchor... there is a bunch of Hill
pics showing him NOT overtly leaning forward ...
I don't buy the
'upright is target form' argument ... I swing draw and if i need to lean
into a shot it is done from the waist , that way everything stays
aligned and lets me , albeit unconsciously, still use my back muscles.
Steve, that bow sounds gorgeous !
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 25, 2011 09:26 PM:
More imortantly...my bows got shipped today !
Robin Hood #13 will
be making his Australian debut here on Tradgang at some stage over the
coming weeks. To ensure he isn't lonely, he is bringing a friend with
similiar specs ... T/D Mr Rhino ... As a welcoming committee , there are a bunch of newly fletched douglas fir, tapered cedars and 2016's waiting their arrival ...
First stop on the Aussie tour will be my favourite stumping/roving mountain ... Question is ... do i make myself one of Mudd's hats ?
Stay Tuned
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on January 25, 2011 11:47 PM:
My Robin Hood Dual Shelf Bow.
1st picture is Righty and 2nd is Lefty. Oh, the Hat was made by Roy "Mudd" Williams. I am officially one of his Merry Men.
Matt "Little John Raging Water" Hamilton
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 25, 2011 11:55 PM:
Nice form, how is the lefty shooting going?
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on January 25, 2011 11:57 PM:
I only shot 3 arrows lefty today and 6 righty. No time, man, no time.
I really hope to get some serious left handed practice in this weekend.
Interesting comment. Shooting lefty really makes me think about form and focus.
I think it is really going to help my right side the most.
Matt
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on January 26, 2011 12:15 AM:
Oooh, Ben, you lucky fellow! I'm looking forward to seeing the photos! And yes, I think you do need a hat!
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 26, 2011 11:03 AM:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Ben Maher: [QB] More imortantly...my bows got shipped today !
You lucky dog!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 26, 2011 11:10 AM:
Just looked back on a pic from earlier in the year and I lean a little
in my shots. My back elbow could stand to be a touch lower but I'm
bending at the waste. I would also have to take into consideration that
I'm just drawing for a photo and not a shot so I'm kinda looking at the
ground. I dont know,seems to work for me.Critique?
Posted by Tommy D (Member # 1874) on January 26, 2011 11:47 AM:
I got the HH bug a few years ago, finally ordered a 70" Wesley Special back in Dec. of '07.
I shot it "ok" but I shoot my selfbow better, so it has spent the last 2+ years hanging on the bow rack.
Nice bows, just never quite got the hang of 'em.
Posted by stik&string (Member # 18418) on January 26, 2011 01:08 PM:
I am officially asking permission to blame you guys when my wife
questions what is in the "big box" that will arrive in a few weeks. Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 26, 2011 01:13 PM:
Ya, I'm thinking they may need to start a forum for the "Wives of Hill
Fans". That way they have a place to console each other and plot against
us! Posted by Molson (Member # 1802) on January 26, 2011 01:24 PM:
quote:Originally posted by leatherneck:
Just looked back on a pic from earlier in the year and I lean a little
in my shots. My back elbow could stand to be a touch lower but I'm
bending at the waste. I would also have to take into consideration that
I'm just drawing for a photo and not a shot so I'm kinda looking at the
ground. I dont know,seems to work for me.Critique?
I
never had problems shooting, and then for some dumb reason, I started
worrying about my elbow being a little high to the point I gave myself a
nice case of TP. As long as it's not up and out, and you're pulling
with back tension, don't worry about it. It might just be the way you
shoot do to your body.
I will offer this Critique.... If you're killing things and you're happy, just shoot the bow! Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 26, 2011 02:04 PM:
Howards form was terrible according to others...nuff said!
Posted by pavan (Member # 21538) on January 26, 2011 02:34 PM:
Hill form is doing all the same wrong things that Hill did and reducing
down to match the individuals size and strength. That quartering, goose
necking, stick the butt out thing is not part of the form. Actually
Hill said that Swineheart was a better size for shooting longbows than
he was. Hill perhaps reduced his draw some intentionally, sometimes he
even drew less than 27", unintentionally. As stated, Hill thought a 27"
arrow was the best length arrow. Good thing his bow forgave him, for
all that bad form. Those bad form things did seem to work, for him and
me.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 26, 2011 02:47 PM:
it's been said oodles of times before and worth re-iterating - as long as you can consistently hit what yer aiming at, yer shooting form is just fine, whatever it is. Posted by Kapellmeister (Member # 22999) on January 26, 2011 02:50 PM:
This bug is really contagious!
(I
just ordered an in-stock 68" Half Breed 55#@28" backset / yew on back
& belly / bamboo core lams / walnut riser w/ laced elk hide) Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 26, 2011 02:54 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Kapellmeister: This bug is really contagious!
(I
just ordered an in-stock 68" Half Breed 55#@28" backset / yew on back
& belly / bamboo core lams / walnut riser w/ laced elk hide)
oooooooo, dat sounds nice!
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 26, 2011 03:13 PM:
Pics when it arrives please! Posted by Orion (Member # 2759) on January 26, 2011 03:36 PM:
Rob D. "it's been said oodles of times before and worth re-iterating -
as long as you can consistently hit what yer aiming at, yer shooting
form is just fine, whatever it is."
Rob: That's the point I was
trying to make. When I commented on leaning in, I was thinking more a
slight tilt of the head than the body, but advice is the same
regardless. If it works, don't worry about it.
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on January 26, 2011 04:40 PM:
kapellmeister-
We need pics when it arrives?
Darren
Posted by pavan (Member # 21538) on January 26, 2011 04:58 PM:
Someone tried to sell me an old Tembo a while back that had a four pin
sight on it, the side bracket kind. I was pretty certain those filled
holes would drive me crazy, after i threw the sight away. Some things
are anathema. While I don't care how anyone shoots their Hills, except
one with a sight on it just brings a sarcastic devil out of me. An
expert, with three whole years of compound experience, he never even
tried to shoot it without the sights, nor could he get it back.
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 26, 2011 06:30 PM:
quote:Someone tried to sell me an old Tembo a while back that had a four pin sight on it
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 26, 2011 06:40 PM:
quote:Originally posted by pavan: Someone tried to sell me an old Tembo a while back that had a four pin sight on it, the side bracket kind. ...
that's like a harley with training wheels. Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 26, 2011 07:02 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Ben Maher:
quote:Someone tried to sell me an old Tembo a while back that had a four pin sight on it
That's deformation of character right there! Posted by pavan (Member # 21538) on January 26, 2011 07:14 PM:
The worst part was he wanted $20 more than he paid for it because of the cost of the sight.
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on January 26, 2011 07:17 PM:
Now that part right there is real funny! Not that the whole story isn't.
Posted by K.S.TRAPPER (Member # 6950) on January 26, 2011 07:28 PM:
Are Hill bows a sponser??
If so can you tell me what there sponser name is so I can look them up
Tracy
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 26, 2011 07:32 PM:
i've sent emails to craig and talked with jason about supporting trad gang ... have never gotten an answer back.
maybe they're all just too busy filling out trad gang member orders.
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 26, 2011 08:18 PM:
Dan Toelke of Montana bows is a sponsor and he makes a very fine Hill
style longbow. The fit and finish is as fine as I have ever seen and ,
although slightly reflexed his bows have minmal thump at the shot ... I
mean really minimal.. Quick and quiet too !
Dan also has a great turnaround time much akin to Craig at Howard Hill.
Posted by Kapellmeister (Member # 22999) on January 26, 2011 08:25 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Wannabe1: Pics when it arrives please!
Will do! Should be next week... can't wait! Posted by Kapellmeister (Member # 22999) on January 26, 2011 08:27 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano: i've sent emails to craig and talked with jason about supporting trad gang ... have never gotten an answer back.
maybe they're all just too busy filling out trad gang member orders.
FWIW,
right after I placed my order with Craig today I emailed him and
mentioned all the good press he's getting here and that my order was
heavily influenced by that as well... and encouraged him to become a
sponsor. We'll see...
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 26, 2011 08:28 PM:
I had a Half Breed last year I let go of. It had a Bubinga riser with ebony limb tips. One smooth shooting bow!
Look forward to your thoughts on it.
Posted by far rider (Member # 14108) on January 26, 2011 08:31 PM:
Bit me a while ago, so I can relate for sure. Just love the simplicity.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 26, 2011 08:52 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Kapellmeister:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano: i've sent emails to craig and talked with jason about supporting trad gang ... have never gotten an answer back.
maybe they're all just too busy filling out trad gang member orders.
FWIW,
right after I placed my order with Craig today I emailed him and
mentioned all the good press he's getting here and that my order was
heavily influenced by that as well... and encouraged him to become a
sponsor. We'll see...
real kind of you to do that, gene - thanx! Posted by Cookus (Member # 17834) on January 26, 2011 09:28 PM:
I mentioned the site as well last week when I ordered some strings...
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on January 26, 2011 09:34 PM:
I am sending Craig the link to this thread.
I am going to push him to be a sponsor or I will quit buying Howard Hill Bows.
Nah, he'll never believe that!
Matt
Posted by stik&string (Member # 18418) on January 27, 2011 12:10 AM:
I also mentioned that if it wasn't for this site I would not have placed my order today.
Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on January 27, 2011 12:12 AM:
I also placed my order last week because of our site.
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 27, 2011 12:49 AM:
I have mentioned tradgang to Craig at least once and have sent him some different links from here for his reading pleasure..lol
God bless,Mudd
PS: The truth be know I wouldn't have ordered the "Robin Hood" if it weren't for some things I read on here.
Posted by Buckwheaties (Member # 10410) on January 27, 2011 01:28 AM:
I talked to Craig this morning concerning my Robin Hood bow and after
discussing our business, I told him about the 40+ pages on Trad Gang
concerning his bows and how so many people loved them. I mentioned that
alot of the orders he was receiving were from member on here. I tried to
see if he was getting more work than his small business could handle?,
and that maybe he didn't need any more advertising? but seeing as that
wasn't really any of my business, he didn't comment one way or the
other.
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on January 27, 2011 03:38 AM:
While waiting on more juicy pics of the corporate addiction, I have a question.
It
is common knowledge that bamboo is the most suitable material for limbs
(core/backing) but what is the true net benefit (or deficit) of any of
the exotic woods when they are sandwiched between glass? Does it really
matter that much?
I truly love the look of Yew in a longbow like
the "Robin Hood" Hill bow. Someone posted about ordering a "half
breed" of Yew outer lams with two lams of boo for the core...I think
that would be a beaut but wonder about performance.
Lately I have
been polling a few of you and it seems that, generally speaking, you
cannot see much if any difference between your Hills.
Still leaning toward a Tembo or Big 5 but mostly because, in my ignorance I feel the bamboo is much better performance wise.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 27, 2011 06:55 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Macatawa: While waiting on more juicy pics of the corporate addiction, I have a question.
It
is common knowledge that bamboo is the most suitable material for limbs
(core/backing) but what is the true net benefit (or deficit) of any of
the exotic woods when they are sandwiched between glass? Does it really
matter that much?
I truly love the look of Yew in a longbow like
the "Robin Hood" Hill bow. Someone posted about ordering a "half
breed" of Yew outer lams with two lams of boo for the core...I think
that would be a beaut but wonder about performance.
Lately I have
been polling a few of you and it seems that, generally speaking, you
cannot see much if any difference between your Hills.
Still leaning toward a Tembo or Big 5 but mostly because, in my ignorance I feel the bamboo is much better performance wise.
i
love the typically smooooooth feel of all bamboo/cane limbs on the
draw. in the long run, imo a bow is also about the design and crafting
execution, and lesser about the limb materials, and almost nothing about
the riser materials.
my next immediate longbow will be a craig
tembo t/d ... i vow that the fun will never ever end until i've been
dusted and sprinkled. Posted by GingivitisKahn (Member # 13331) on January 27, 2011 07:08 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Wannabe1: I had a Half Breed last year I let go of. It had a Bubinga riser with ebony limb tips. One smooth shooting bow!
Look forward to your thoughts on it.
Sounds beautiful. I'll bet it was hard to part with. Did you at least trade for another Hill?
For no good reason, here's an older pic of my Halfbreed... Posted by K.S.TRAPPER (Member # 6950) on January 27, 2011 07:16 AM:
Thanks Ben for the info I will check it out
I
love the Hill style bows and it's to bad it Sounds like Craig doesn't
want to join Tradgang at all. This thread has gone on a long time and
helped his business I'm sure.
Has anybody added up how many bows
have been ordered because of several threads about his bows. That might
help him change his mind
Tracy
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 27, 2011 07:25 AM:
i just found an email from craig, that he sent very late last night. i
think we're starting a dialogue about howard hill archery becoming a
trad gang sponsor. we'll see ...
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on January 27, 2011 08:39 AM:
It's funny, I spoke to Jason last week at Howard Hill Archery and told
him about the thread. I also told him about the interest in my new bow
with the carmelized limbs.
Rob- Could Howard Hill Archery
have a meeting place on the site. Somewhere that us Hill enthusists can
sit by the camp fire and share hunting stories,and videos, about with
our Hill bows.
Darren
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 27, 2011 10:44 AM:
perhaps a 'hill style longbows' forum?
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 27, 2011 11:34 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano: perhaps a 'hill style longbows' forum?
I
like the idea but would want to be sure we didn't come off as being
elitists just because of the style of bows we choose to shoot.
We aren't any better or worse than any others who choose to shoot bows other than "hill style" bows.
Just thinking out loud.(so to speak)
God bless,Mudd
Posted by WESTBROOK (Member # 8854) on January 27, 2011 11:53 AM:
quote:perhaps a 'hill style longbows' forum?
Now your talkin!
and ditto what Mudd said.
Eric
Posted by WESTBROOK (Member # 8854) on January 27, 2011 11:57 AM:
I'm gonna talk with Steve Turay at Kzoo this weekend and lean on him a little about being a sponsor.
Eric
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 27, 2011 12:08 PM:
Jim, I didn't trade it off. I sold it for some personal reasons. It was
hard to let go of as it was a perfect specimen of a Hill bow. 69", 45# @
29" and a real pleasure to shoot. I'll have another some day maybe. I've posted this pic several times but, here it is again. Me shooting the Half Breed.
Posted by Molson (Member # 1802) on January 27, 2011 12:29 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano: perhaps a 'hill style longbows' forum?
Yeah but then you miss the spontaneity of a 40 page Hill thread showing up on Pow Wow for all to enjoy!
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 27, 2011 12:34 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Molson:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano: perhaps a 'hill style longbows' forum?
Yeah but then you miss the spontaneity of a 40 page Hill thread showing up on Pow Wow for all to enjoy!
that
is so true. however, it would be nice to collate and save these kinda
threads for posterity at the least, and reference at the best ... ?
if so, a read-only 'hill style longbows' thread archive forum might be more viable ... ?
or perhaps, an 'American Flat Longbow' forum?
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 27, 2011 12:43 PM:
Sounds like a good idea.
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 27, 2011 01:13 PM:
I have suggested the idea before but agree that American flat bow
archive forum would be better, more inclusive and I agree with the ever
wise Mudd
Amercian Flatbow Archive forum ... heck yeah ! Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on January 27, 2011 05:21 PM:
Oh, yeah....I agree with that idea too.
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 27, 2011 05:26 PM:
Sounds like a winner!
Posted by Cookus (Member # 17834) on January 27, 2011 06:03 PM:
I like the idea of an "American Flat Longbow" forum! I also agree with
Mudd's logic on this issue. You've assembled the troops Rob... So how
soon do we charge? Posted by mysticguido (Member # 4426) on January 27, 2011 06:09 PM:
Welcome to the campfire Sal! It's gettin bigger all the time!
Spanky
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 27, 2011 06:57 PM:
From Rob...
quote:
i just found an email from craig, that he sent very late last night. i
think we're starting a dialogue about howard hill archery becoming a
trad gang sponsor. we'll see
... Cool !
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on January 27, 2011 09:49 PM:
I like the idea of an Amreican Flat Bow forum. Good Idea!
Matt
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on January 27, 2011 09:51 PM:
On second thought. I'd like to pay tribute to Howard Hill.
So, I vote for Hill "Style" Longbow Forum
Matt
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on January 27, 2011 09:59 PM:
I think the idea of an archive is a great idea. I do agree with Mudd's comment as well.
Personally,
if this thread was not found within the general "mix" of the PowWow, I
would have never seen it and surely would have missed this opportunity.
You guys have taken me back many years - to where it all began.
I am almost as excited about shooting a Hill as I am about returning
to America.
I think all of the TG'ers are great but somehow I feel at home with you guys.. Really looking forward to meeting many of you.
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on January 27, 2011 10:05 PM:
Rob, you are the Trad Techie...I have a question: Is it possible to have
a thread accessed (not just "read only") from two different forums?
Can you mirror this one to be alive in two places?
That would be too cool!
Posted by Swiftspeed10 (Member # 23592) on January 27, 2011 10:11 PM:
I wish I was taller so I could shoot a huge 70" longbow hehe.
Posted by droz il (Member # 24230) on January 27, 2011 10:51 PM:
I would also like to have a Hill Style or American flatbow forum. Dale
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 27, 2011 11:06 PM:
Posted by pavan (Member # 21538) on January 27, 2011 11:32 PM:
How about a Howard Hill forum and all bows are welcome.
Posted by Claymore (Member # 17440) on January 28, 2011 01:59 AM:
Howard Hill Cougar. Paduk Riser Honey Locust and Bamboo limbs.
Posted by SteveL (Member # 587) on January 28, 2011 02:01 AM:
Count me in on an American Flatbow or Hill Style Fourm. I never have as
much fun shooting a bow as I do when I pick up my Hills or Northern
Mists. Pure playful joy I say.
Posted by Claymore (Member # 17440) on January 28, 2011 02:13 AM:
[ January 28, 2011, 05:39 AM: Message edited by: Rob DiStefano ]
Posted by Claymore (Member # 17440) on January 28, 2011 02:17 AM:
It's real pretty. You Will just have to take my word for it.
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on January 28, 2011 02:56 AM:
Here you go; too many [IMG] thingies.
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 28, 2011 03:40 AM:
Northern Ben , which one is that ? A new one ?
Posted by Claymore (Member # 17440) on January 28, 2011 03:49 AM:
Cocobolo riser Wesley. Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on January 28, 2011 04:35 AM:
No, no, Southern Ben! It's Claymore's! My new one is still in the works, I s'pose.
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on January 28, 2011 04:35 AM:
Nice bows, too, Claymore!
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 28, 2011 05:05 AM:
Right ,,, a bit slow I am ! Yep..sweet sticks Claymore !
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 28, 2011 05:15 AM:
something old but new headed my way ...
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 28, 2011 05:19 AM:
Black glass Big Five ... Can you say "classic " ? It just symbolizes what i consider to be a ' longbow'.. Specs Rob ? Looks like an older one .....
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 28, 2011 05:26 AM:
And if ya'll get Craig here at Tradgang ... tell him I'll order me a new t/d Redman just to celebrate it ... And if that is the case ... after nearly 700 posts on this thread alone ..... perhaps a group order special edition ?
My vote would be a Redman String Follow Ebony Riser ...
What say you fellow Hillsters ?
Is this extortion by Longbow purchase power ? Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 28, 2011 05:37 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Ben Maher: Black glass Big Five ... Can you say "classic " ? It just symbolizes what i consider to be a ' longbow'.. Specs Rob ? Looks like an older one .....
yep,
and old one - 68", 50# @ 29", handle reworked from the old
wedge/teardrop to rounded, bow refinished after adding a lace-up elk
hide grip and arrow shelf plate.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 28, 2011 05:41 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Macatawa:
Rob, you are the Trad Techie...I have a question: Is it possible to
have a thread accessed (not just "read only") from two different forums?
Can you mirror this one to be alive in two places?
That would be too cool!
it
would be cool, but not possible since a true mirrored thread would need
simultaneous updating and this, or any other forum software, couldn't
do that.
Posted by cacciatore (Member # 17855) on January 28, 2011 05:48 AM:
It looks that HH is the most popular brand here!
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on January 28, 2011 06:34 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano: [/qb]
it
would be cool, but not possible since a true mirrored thread would need
simultaneous updating and this, or any other forum software, couldn't
do that. [/QB][/QUOTE]
Oh...too bad! Well, I haven't been here
long enough to have a vote - y'all do your thing and don't forget to
leave some directions. This is the first thread I look for and sometimes
the only one..
My wife thinks I am nuts. Staring at pictures of what she thinks is the same bow...over 'n over. I agree with her...LOL Posted by Claymore (Member # 17440) on January 28, 2011 07:08 AM:
Thanks Rob and Ben for the help.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 28, 2011 07:11 AM:
lovely bow there, clyde - my paduak risered big 5 due to ship next week.
Posted by Claymore (Member # 17440) on January 28, 2011 07:22 AM:
Can't wait to see it myself.
Posted by Kevin L. (Member # 4270) on January 28, 2011 07:30 AM:
Nice Cougar!! I've never tried honey locust in a bow before. How does it
compare to the other wood/bamboo combo limbs from Craig?
Posted by Roger G (Member # 14600) on January 28, 2011 07:31 AM:
This Houard Hill site has been around for some time, and is excellent http://www.howardhillshooters.com/ Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 28, 2011 08:02 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Roger G: This Houard Hill site has been around for some time, andd is excellent http://www.howardhillshooters.com/
that's trad gang member dick wightman's site, which mirrors to his www.howardhilllongbowmen.com
- one of the best hill sites on the web, and dick is one of the biggest
hill fans around, not to mention a fine bowyer of hill style longbows
for his own muse and pleasure. Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 28, 2011 08:07 AM:
Rob and claymore beautiful bows.Claymore could we see the limb pictures?
Posted by sorefingers (Member # 24600) on January 28, 2011 08:18 AM:
I have had some D bows but never owned or shot a HH yet. Must be
something to them guess I will have to check it out. Never know I may
get bit too
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 28, 2011 08:23 AM:
quote:Originally posted by sorefingers:
I have had some D bows but never owned or shot a HH yet. Must be
something to them guess I will have to check it out. Never know I may
get bit too
imo,
there is a significant difference 'tween r/d "D" and "hill style D"
longbows. this has been covered already in a topic that compares mohawk
and howard hill longbows ...
hh and mohawk Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 28, 2011 08:35 AM:
I have been doing a little bow trading....again!!..lol
Two more are headed my way. Both are the 70", my longest yet.
Wesley Special 70" and 50 @28, the other is a "Cheetah" 70" and 50@28.
These are samples...lol I'll get some pictures up when they arrive.
Hi my name is Mudd and I'm a "Bowaholic"!!
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 28, 2011 08:38 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Mudd: ... the other is a "Cheetah" 70" and 50@28. ...
AHAH! it was you that snagged mike's cheetah!
i got his big 5! heheheheh!
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on January 28, 2011 08:47 AM:
Gluttons!! Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 28, 2011 08:52 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Macatawa: Gluttons!!
guilty as charged! Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 28, 2011 09:08 AM:
Claymore- Nice looking bow you have there.
Rob, I like the shelf on that old one. I almost ordered my Wes with the Paduak as well but......
Mudd-Thats a pretty deep looking locator on that bow. Me likes!!!
Posted by Claymore (Member # 17440) on January 28, 2011 09:32 AM:
Nice Cougar!! I've never tried honey locust in a bow before. How does
it compare to the other wood/bamboo combo limbs from Craig?
Kevin
my Cougar has 3 lambs of Bamboo between the outer lambs of Honey
Locust. It is very smooth. Probably not quite as smooth a my Wesley.
Bamboo is going to be hard to beat.
Posted by Claymore (Member # 17440) on January 28, 2011 09:34 AM:
longbowman I will post some pics of the Honey Locust for you tonight.
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 28, 2011 09:53 AM:
Thanks. Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 28, 2011 10:00 AM:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Rob DiStefano: [qb] Originally posted by Macatawa: Gluttons!! [Razz]
guilty as charged! [Big Grin] ____________________________________________________ Dang it, You got me too!!
God bless, Mudd
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 28, 2011 10:12 AM:
back to the thoughts of a 'hill style' forum ...
in the
long run, there'd be little benefit to such a category as the content
would be more sizzle than beef, for a number of reasons.
what???
well,
in perusing this thread there's about 20% of content that's worthy of
archiving - pics of bows, analysis of design and different bowyers, good
input from lots of members - the rest is pretty much 'fluff', which is
great banter but not stuff worthy of a meaningful archive.
the
powwow is the main campfire, where everyone is drawn to and eventually
gets to see and participate in all threads of relevant meaning.
whenever a new topic forum splinters off, the activity there dwindles
and, more importantly, new member input is missing 'cause the topic is
not in the mainstream view (powwow).
if such a forum were
archival read-only, that would require a snapshot of the powwow hill
topic be taken and loaded to the new forum. since this thread is now in
it's 47th page and is going on a month old, when will it end ... if
ever?
perhaps when this thread begins to peter out a few months from now (???) it will be archival worthy.
your thoughts?
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 28, 2011 10:39 AM:
I totally agree Rob. It is in the mainstream while on PowWow. I think if
it's moved it will dwindle down. It's been fun surfing on here and
going back and forth to other threads. Not to mention lets see how far
it actually goes. Does it really matter if we move it? It seems to be
working just fine where it is.IMO.
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 28, 2011 10:47 AM:
quote:Originally posted by leatherneck:
I totally agree Rob. It is in the mainstream while on PowWow. I think
if it's moved it will dwindle down. It's been fun surfing on here and
going back and forth to other threads. Not to mention lets see how far
it actually goes. Does it really matter if we move it? It seems to be
working just fine where it is.IMO.
I know it's cliche" but it's so true, "If it ain't broke, don't try to fix it!"
God bless,Mudd
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on January 28, 2011 10:52 AM:
Claymore- I like the bows, especially the one with the cocobola riser, love cocobola.
Mudd- The bows look good, what riser material is in the 2nd bow picture?
Rob-
One of the reasons that I mentioned the Hill forum, was to have a place
where you can go for only information on the Hill style longbows. It
would be a place for the experienced and the unexperienced Hill shooter,
it would be a place to post pics of Hill bows, and pics of gatherings
of Hill hunters. It would be a Hill archive.
The thread would also provide the link/web-address to Dick's site the www.howardhilllongbowmen.com
because Dick's site is already established with lots of useful
information for the Hill enthusist. The website is loaded with
information about Howard Hill and Hill's bows, it's a Hill history book
and a Hill manuel.
Darren
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on January 28, 2011 11:40 AM:
quote:Originally posted by leatherneck:
I totally agree Rob. It is in the mainstream while on PowWow. I think
if it's moved it will dwindle down. It's been fun surfing on here and
going back and forth to other threads. Not to mention lets see how far
it actually goes. Does it really matter if we move it? It seems to be
working just fine where it is.IMO.
I have reversed my view and I agree with this point.
Not to knock other styles of bows but "Hill Style" bows are about as Traditional as it gets.
Matt
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 28, 2011 11:47 AM:
With all the bows to come this thread is going to go for a while,Im 1 to 2 weeks away. Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 28, 2011 11:51 AM:
I may be called "wishy-washy" but tradlongbow makes a great argument for
something that is worth at least looking into further. (IMHO)
I
can be convinced(maybe) and if that becomes true then my opinion and
about 2 bucks will get you a cup of coffee in some places...lol
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Ric O'Shay (Member # 1892) on January 28, 2011 12:03 PM:
48 pages and going strong! So, let me brag a little about my Wesley
Special, which is sorta "special". It has five laminations of laminated
bamboo or "lamboo" and is carbon backed. Lamboo is not a cataloged item
and you have to ask Craig about it. He glues up his bamboo lams, cures
it, and then cuts new laminations from the edge side. Add in the carbon
and you get a totally different feel and performance level. Neat, huh?
Anyway, here are some pics:
And it has Water buffalo horn tip overlays.
And it makes for very thin laminations, very quick recovery, very fast too.
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 28, 2011 12:12 PM:
Ooooh, man that is one sweet looking Hill! Very nice. Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 28, 2011 12:13 PM:
Man! Wowshers!!
Danny that is an awesome looking Hill!!
I
hope that you and I get to shoot together sometime in hopes that i
could talk you into just letting me handle it. I would be asking too
much to fling an arrow from something of that caliber.
Thanks for sharing.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on January 28, 2011 12:20 PM:
Danny-
One of the first things that I noticed when I saw the side
view of the limbs were how much thinner they are then the typical Hill
bow. Craig must use much thinner laminations with the carbon and lamboo
together. I really like the profile of the limb tips as well. Is that an
Ebony riser?
Darren
Posted by Ric O'Shay (Member # 1892) on January 28, 2011 12:22 PM:
Mudd - It is an awesome shooting bow, and I'd be honored and happy to have you shoot any bow that I might have in the stable.
Darren - Yes, that is ebony. Here is a pic with a scale. You can tell that each lam is right at a 32nd of an inch.
Danny
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 28, 2011 12:24 PM:
What a looker, congrats on a great bow.
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 28, 2011 05:32 PM:
That is a sweet bow indeed.
Posted by Claymore (Member # 17440) on January 28, 2011 05:35 PM:
Honey Locust
[ January 28, 2011, 05:49 PM: Message edited by: Rob DiStefano ]
Posted by Claymore (Member # 17440) on January 28, 2011 06:54 PM:
Posted by RC (Member # 162) on January 28, 2011 07:19 PM:
Ric O`shay, My Big Five is made out of the lamboo you have in your Wesley. A Fine bow.RC
Posted by Ric O'Shay (Member # 1892) on January 28, 2011 07:21 PM:
RC - Yes sir, that lamboo makes one (in this case two) fine bows!
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on January 28, 2011 07:23 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Raging Water:
quote:Originally posted by leatherneck:
I totally agree Rob. It is in the mainstream while on PowWow. I think
if it's moved it will dwindle down. It's been fun surfing on here and
going back and forth to other threads. Not to mention lets see how far
it actually goes. Does it really matter if we move it? It seems to be
working just fine where it is.IMO.
I have reversed my view and I agree with this point.
Not to knock other styls of bows but "Hill Style" bows are about as Traditional as it gets.
Matt
Yea
Matt, the fact is that this growing group of "Mudds Merry Men" (MMM) is
the most gracious gathering. Never is there any negative comment about
any other style of bow. Actually, never any negative...period! Posted by Molson (Member # 1802) on January 28, 2011 09:56 PM:
Well we're on our way back from Kzoo. Made the mistake of stopping at
the Northern Mist booth and shooting the Sheldon and the Classic.
Ordered me a 68" Classic and ordered my son one too! Those Northern
Mists are mighty fine shooters!
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 28, 2011 10:10 PM:
Molson, look forward to pics of the Classic. I've often wondered how
they shot. Almost got one year before last but, backed out at the last
minute.
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 28, 2011 10:34 PM:
Thats one fine looking bow Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 28, 2011 10:44 PM:
Here's a few pics of a NM Classic that I had with Macassar and Myrtle.
Beautiful bow and a nice shooter, unfortunately the grip turned out to
be too small and I couldn't shoot it well so it moved on. Steve builds a
very nice bow for sure.
Spanky
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on January 28, 2011 10:58 PM:
Here are three Hills. I love them.
My Standing Bear 68" 80# at 28"
My Black Badger
My Black Badger Riser with Silver Cross Inlay
My 66" 85# at 28 Half Breed
Posted by Okie man (Member # 7214) on January 28, 2011 10:58 PM:
I came down with a bad case of the HH bamboo flu about 6 years ago. It
is a pesky virus that attacks the brain. I was having delusions of
grandeur that made me believe if I shot a Hill style bow that someday I
could shoot like Mr. Hill. The symptoms subsided somewhat or the virus
morphed when I shot a JD Berry Vixen. It is Mr. Berry's version of a
Hill style bow and it has yew limb cores. I bought it used and have sold
my Hills. Now I have the JDB yew flu. This has been a bad flu season.
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 28, 2011 11:04 PM:
Dang it! I need to get one of those plastic covers for my key board.
Slobbers and electronics don't mix all that well..lol
Thanks for sharing.... I think!
God bless,Mudd
PS: photos like these gives a "bowaholic the shakes too!
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on January 29, 2011 04:06 AM:
Mudd said: PS: photos like these gives a "bowaholic the shakes too!
Calling all hands!! Keep a sharp eye on Mudd, I think he just fell off the wagon again.
Poor fella. Posted by JEFF B (Member # 7842) on January 29, 2011 05:15 AM:
man you guys aint right in the head to many Bows LOL!!!
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on January 29, 2011 08:56 AM:
quote:Originally posted by RC: Ric O`shay, My Big Five is made out of the lamboo you have in your Wesley. A Fine bow.RC
RC, is that "lamboo" the same stuff most bowyers use in their limbs? The pic looks like the strips are much wider.
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 29, 2011 09:53 AM:
quote:Originally posted by SpankyNeal:
Here's a few pics of a NM Classic that I had with Macassar and Myrtle.
Beautiful bow and a nice shooter, unfortunately the grip turned out to
be too small and I couldn't shoot it well so it moved on. Steve builds a
very nice bow for sure.
Spanky
Spanky-Next time you want to get rid of a beautiful bow like that,please call me first!!!!
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on January 29, 2011 01:42 PM:
There is another Hill Trhead gowing. I think it says "Hill style bows... why all the sudden?".
The post largely centers on performance bows and that kind of stuff. This was my last post on that thread.....
I have a 64" 83# at 28" one PC Mild R/D Pronghorn. I have a 66" 85# at 28" Howard Hill Half Breed.
The R/D Pronghorn is definately faster and hits the target like a mule. But, my Half Breed groups are tighter.
Maybe
its the arrow, maybe its the length, maybe its the grip, WHATEVER? The
end result is, I still grab my HH first. Don't know why. Just do.
Matt
Posted by Molson (Member # 1802) on January 29, 2011 06:01 PM:
Wow that Myrtle is nice! All these bows look great. I just went for the
classic black glass with American Elm limbs and a Shedua riser. Got
the green glass on my son's bow.
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 29, 2011 07:38 PM:
Man I love green glass on one side or the other. Ever since I saw a Hill
Centennial the first time I knew I had to have one with green
glass...awesome!
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on January 29, 2011 10:00 PM:
I realized that I was spending way too much time discussing why I like Hill Style bows.
I
stopped typing. I grabbed my HH 85# Half Breed, HH 55# Dual Shelf Robin
Hood, 83# Mild RD Pronghorn, and my D Shaped 74# BamaBow.
I spent the next two hours shooting all four bows and had a great time. I must have shot well over 200 arrows.
I
spent most of my time going from the 85# HH to the 55# Hill. The
Pronghorn is faster and amazingly I was more accurate with my BamaBow
(that bow and I get along real well).
But, at the end of the day, the Hill’s were still my favorites.
BTW, after shooting at least 60 arrows thru my 85# HH Half Breed, I was amazed at how easy it was to draw the 55# HH Robin Hood.
Less typing, more shooting!
Matt
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on January 29, 2011 10:02 PM:
Oh, and the Dual Shelf String Follow HH Robin Hood is making it easy for me to learn to shoot lefty.
At 55# at 28", I am overbowed shooting lefty. I know that. But, give me a couple of weeks and it will be easy.
Matt
Posted by SteveL (Member # 587) on January 29, 2011 10:39 PM:
My Hills are like my dachshunds to me. I love the rascals but don't
necessarily recommend them. I think compared to some newer designs,
especially the mild and more radical f/d bows, a true hill type can be
more difficult to master. But once you have it, you have it and there is
no turning back it seems.
I go through periods where I hear the
siren song of a sexy recurve or a snappy radical reflex deflex bow and
hang the Hill on the wall. It never lasts long though and all of a
sudden I'm back with my straight end bows. I'm not sure it's rational
but the pleasure and fun I get out of good ol straight end bow is in a
whole nother ball park.
Here are a couple of pics of my favorite
and most shot bow of all. It's a 69" 53@28 clear glass belly and back,
Howard Hill Big 5. Just put a new handle wrap on her too.
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on January 29, 2011 10:47 PM:
Nice bow, Steve!
Posted by SteveL (Member # 587) on January 29, 2011 10:50 PM:
Thanks! Ben
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 29, 2011 10:53 PM:
Steve, that is a good looking bow. Looks like you've been taking real good care of her. Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 29, 2011 11:12 PM:
Real nice Steve! Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on January 30, 2011 01:30 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Raging Water: Oh, and the Dual Shelf String Follow HH Robin Hood is making it easy for me to learn to shoot lefty.
At 55# at 28", I am overbowed shooting lefty. I know that. But, give me a couple of weeks and it will be easy.
Matt
Matt,
I have read you several times as you mention shooting "lefty". I have
never considered doing that - maybe because I never had a bow that would
accomodate that effort.
Seems a difficult challenge to me...do you just want to be a switch-hitter?
Posted by tg2nd (Member # 16218) on January 30, 2011 02:40 AM:
50 pages! Unbelievable! Go on!!!!!
Posted by pavan (Member # 21538) on January 30, 2011 04:04 AM:
Dem dare d style bows is funny lookin'.
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on January 30, 2011 04:14 AM:
Steve, I like you "Big 5"
The grip is dang near straight - maybe a hint of locator. Did you order that special?
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 30, 2011 06:09 AM:
maca - it's good to work the opposing muscles for 'balance', so a few times a week i'll pull a bow lefty (i'm a righty).
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 30, 2011 09:58 AM:
Maca-That looks like the dished grip on Steves bow. But I could be wrong.
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on January 30, 2011 10:28 AM:
Rob...
Thanks! You are an endless source of info...perfect timing for me..I appreciate it.
--------------------------------- Leather...
Yeah that is what I thought when I first looked at it but it seemed
straight up to a point about an inch below the shelf. I am just so
curious about every detail of these bows...thanks!
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 30, 2011 10:38 AM:
Actually the bow I test drove had a dish and I had to look real close to
tell the difference from the straight. Thats why I ordered the locator
grip. Keep in mind I'm used to a R/D bow grip so Hill owners might see
the difference easier than I did. But it did not appear that much
different.
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on January 30, 2011 10:57 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Macatawa:
quote:Originally posted by Raging Water: Oh, and the Dual Shelf String Follow HH Robin Hood is making it easy for me to learn to shoot lefty.
At 55# at 28", I am overbowed shooting lefty. I know that. But, give me a couple of weeks and it will be easy.
Matt
Matt,
I have read you several times as you mention shooting "lefty". I have
never considered doing that - maybe because I never had a bow that would
accomodate that effort.
Seems a difficult challenge to me...do you just want to be a switch-hitter?
Well,
Like Rob says it develops both sides of your muscle groups. I did it
because, my friend Leo Markert, said I woud improve my overall shooting
and you never know if you'll need that skill.
I am so right
handed that my right arm is made of steel compared to my left.
Interestingly, it was not my left "string arm" that was "getting tired"
it was my right arm from holding the bow up and out. That suprised me.
In
the end, it don't want to be so unbalanced in muscle strength. I can
draw 90# righty so I better be able to work up to around 75# lefty (some
day).
Matt
Posted by Kevin L. (Member # 4270) on January 30, 2011 03:06 PM:
OK, we got some good weather today, so I went out and took some pics. L-R: 1. HH Wesley Special, 66" 55@27, cocobolo riser and overlays. Dished grip. 2.
HH Cheetah 66" 58@28, extra lam of bamboo so 3 bamboo and two
juniper,cocobolo riser and tips, glossy finish. Slight locator grip. 3.
Appalachian Archery Middle Mountain longbow by Dave Guthrie, 68" 60@28,
elm limbs and walnut riser and overlays (I think). Locator grip. 4.
Another Appy Middle Mountain, 66' 57@26, 4 lams of juniper and cocobolo
riser and overlays. Locator grip. This was my first trad bow and has
been over the river and through the woods more than once. I should get
it refinished sometime soon. 5. Bighorn Tamarack #36 by Ron
Maulding, 68" 57@28, 4 lams of tamarack with a maple riser. Brown
'glass, no tip overlays. Locator grip.
The Wesley is the smoothest but the Appy that I started this trail with is still my favorite.
Kevin
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 30, 2011 03:53 PM:
Those are some beauties Kevin!
Spanky
Posted by Cookus (Member # 17834) on January 30, 2011 05:28 PM:
Those are some beauties Kevin! I took my Wesley (52# @ 26... I shoot
28") for a walk this afternoon in the snow and worked on form. I'm
currently playing with some 2018's with 225 grain field points and I
think I've got a winner! My best shooting partner (the Mrs. of
course!) was unable to attend or take pictures since we're expecting in
April. The other 4 kids turned their back on their Maddog pups as well
as dad for the excitement of sled riding! What a great Sunday
afternoon spent after church!
Posted by Kevin L. (Member # 4270) on January 30, 2011 06:14 PM:
Thanks guys, I'm really partial to that style.
Kenny, where in WV are ya from? I'm originally from Wayne Co. and have family over in the Huntington area.
Kevin
Posted by Cookus (Member # 17834) on January 30, 2011 07:18 PM:
I'm from Martinsburg in the eastern panhandle... Just north of you down
I-81. The smallmouth fishing in your neck of the woods is awesome!
Ever try to rig one of your Hills to blast gar on the James River or
Stuarts Draft?
Posted by Kevin L. (Member # 4270) on January 30, 2011 08:14 PM:
Nope, never did. I'm pretty partial to chasing those little Brookies up
on the Blue Ridge with a bamboo rod. But I have been known to take a
canoe and a box of poppers chasing those smallies between my place and
yours.
Let me know if you get down this way, we'll shoot some.
Kevin
Posted by Cookus (Member # 17834) on January 30, 2011 08:28 PM:
Sounds good Kevin! On the same note fellas, who bowfishes with their
Hills? C'mon don't be shy to show us your setups! It's almost the
season (we're praying!!!)... Hero shots will do!
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 30, 2011 09:08 PM:
I didn't want to start another thread but, I would like to know what broad heads folks are shooting from their Hills? Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on January 30, 2011 09:11 PM:
160 Glue on snuffers
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 30, 2011 09:17 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Wannabe1: I didn't want to start another thread but, I would like to know what broad heads folks are shooting from their Hills?
honestly,
as long as it's a coc broadhead, it really doesn't matter, there are
dozens of great broadheads out there in varying weights from 100 to well
over 250 grains each.
same thing for the shaft material - try one type, try 'em all.
bet
if howard was alive right now, and in his hey-day top physical
condition, he'd have a ball with all the tackle he could be playing with
...
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 30, 2011 09:22 PM:
I wish I could afford to try them all!
I like 2 blade heads as they are easier to remove from the back
quiver. I am going to use the Stos head and was looking to see how many
used that head. Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 30, 2011 09:34 PM:
I like a head that has the back edge cut at an angle like the Tusker or
Abowyer for singles and just about any of the double edge heads as they
seem to come out of the quiver better. It could just be the way I draw
the arrows out as I'm sure there are many other folks that have no
problems, but I sometimes have a problem with Grizzly's and the STOS
trying to dig into the leather.
Spanky
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on January 30, 2011 09:35 PM:
TW, I have had good results with 160gn Stos, Ace, Ribtek and Tuskers...
easy to get out of a back quiver too !
I have a bunch of three blades i'll use for turkeys this coming March ....
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 30, 2011 09:39 PM:
I have some 175gr Terminators but, they are difficult to pull out of my
back quiver. I'm not willing to give up hunting with a back quiver just
to use them.
Posted by Cyclic-Rivers (Member # 21222) on January 30, 2011 09:55 PM:
sigh
Posted by RC (Member # 162) on January 30, 2011 10:08 PM:
Zwickey no mercy, woodsmans and Mag I`s for me.
Posted by far rider (Member # 14108) on January 30, 2011 10:35 PM:
love that last one far rider, ebony is gorgeous on bows.
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on January 31, 2011 01:45 AM:
Don't have a hill yet (dang it!!)
I have, however, hunted with my other longbows in the past....
Most
recently one I build myself, before that a Dwyer, and prior to that a
non-acs bow built by OL Adcock. The 68" Dwyer was the closest to a Hill
that I have ever come but not a Hill for sure..
Used Snuffers and most recently - Ace 125s I will continue using ACE with my new Hill bow when I get back...
Posted by GingivitisKahn (Member # 13331) on January 31, 2011 06:59 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Cookus:
Sounds good Kevin! On the same note fellas, who bowfishes with their
Hills? C'mon don't be shy to show us your setups! It's almost the
season (we're praying!!!)... Hero shots will do!
I
didn't set out to bowfish with mine but did some impromptu carp hunting
last year. The turkeys refused to play along but I found a bunch of
carp in a flooded creek so I spent a couple of hours plinking them with a
couple of Ace Hex Head tipped arrows.
Didn't have any bowfishing
gear so I just had to take shots where I was pretty sure I'd get my
arrow back. Anyway, here's a pic or two...
I'd like to do more this year with a proper setup.
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 31, 2011 11:00 AM:
I used a gadget attachment(3 Rivers) so I could use my longbow with a reel set up for bow fishing.
Nice fish Jim.
Thanks for sharing.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 31, 2011 01:05 PM:
a new/old arrival, big 5, 68", 46#@28" - shoots SO nice!
Posted by Kevin L. (Member # 4270) on January 31, 2011 01:11 PM:
Nice one Rob. I like the look of all of the lams on the back of the riser.
Kevin
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on January 31, 2011 01:19 PM:
Rob one word comes to mind..."Sweet!"
Thanks for sharing it with us.
God bless,mudd
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on January 31, 2011 01:22 PM:
Very nice Rob!
Posted by RC (Member # 162) on January 31, 2011 01:40 PM:
Cocobola Riser?
What cedar spine do you fellas recommend with a 26 1/2" draw and 52 pounds.28.5 arrow and 125 grain head?RC
Posted by mysticguido (Member # 4426) on January 31, 2011 01:50 PM:
55-60 should be good..
Posted by pavan (Member # 21538) on January 31, 2011 01:55 PM:
That is about what my yew/myrtle is. I shoot 27" 40-45 with 125s and
45-47 tapers with 160s. My yew is fairly fast and my sight window is
3/16". I would not be surprised if the same spines would apply at 28.5".
I think it is always better with Hills to error on the light side.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 31, 2011 03:13 PM:
limbs are back set. the glass is not black, but an extremely dark
chocolate. the bow is labeled 46#@28", but my easton digital scale
reads 48#.4@28" and 52#.1@29" (typical overweight for hills). real nice
shooter with 585gr woodies, will be better still with a new string.
the handle was reshaped oval, but with a very rounded belly side.
perfect in every way 'cept wish it was a t/d.
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 31, 2011 03:18 PM:
I really like that dark chocolate color for the glass. Wonder if that was a different brown than what he uses now?
Posted by Dick in Seattle (Member # 8663) on January 31, 2011 04:19 PM:
Don't know what Craig is using now, but I got some brown from Kenny last
year when I made Sweet Georgia Brown. It's lighter than the brown on
my older Big Five. I like it better. It was gorgeous and I ordered
some more I have tucked away. Kenny posted a notice that's he's not
shipping for a bit, has to recover from some surgery, but I'm sure he'll
be back up and going in as soon as he can.
CPT, that brown looks similar to the brown that was on my Wesley. Pretty close in shade. Very nice looking bow you built. Posted by GingivitisKahn (Member # 13331) on January 31, 2011 05:34 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Mudd: I used a gadget attachment(3 Rivers) so I could use my longbow with a reel set up for bow fishing.
Nice fish Jim.
Thanks for sharing.
God bless,Mudd
Thanks sir - I'll look into it because as it turns out... bow fishing is kind of fun. Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on January 31, 2011 06:05 PM:
Dandy!
I like dark chocolate.
I will look for this girl in the classifieds! You gotta sell it Rob, you know you do! Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 31, 2011 06:32 PM:
just a very classic craig hill longbow.
you can see the slight
limb backset, and see how the handle's 'teardrop' nose was significantly
ground off and rounded to make a wonderfully comfy, hand fitting grip.
mike did a craftsman's job on the handle rework and the stitched elk
hide grip and shelf plate.
the handle looks dished because mike
rolled the top and bottom of the leather, which adds about a 1/32" bulge
that's easy to see, but gives the straight handle that dished look.
best hill grip i've had yet, and it's not a locator! wow!!
i had
asked jason about the new hill riser cross sections, how i hated that
damn tear drop and he assured me none are no longer 'pointy'. i asked
him to round it off even more. we'll see by late next week.
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 31, 2011 06:35 PM:
There's a 66" Scirocco on the Classifieds right now.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 31, 2011 06:51 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Wannabe1: There's a 66" Scirocco on the Classifieds right now.
need a 27" draw or less for that puppy.
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on January 31, 2011 08:24 PM:
Hey, I shoot 27". Hmmmmmm Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on January 31, 2011 08:26 PM:
Leatherneck, only 50 of them bad boys made. That would be one for the collection. Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on January 31, 2011 08:28 PM:
quote:Originally posted by leatherneck: Hey, I shoot 27". Hmmmmmm
dang, if i had a 27" draw i'd be on that like flies on u-know-what! Posted by Cookus (Member # 17834) on January 31, 2011 08:47 PM:
I wish that Scirocco on the Classifieds was just a l..i..t..tle heavier
draw! Somebodies going to get a classic and nice shootin' bow there!
Posted by Kapellmeister (Member # 22999) on February 01, 2011 02:02 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano: i
had asked jason about the new hill riser cross sections, how i hated
that damn tear drop and he assured me none are no longer 'pointy'. i
asked him to round it off even more.
I
just got my new Half Breed from Craig yesterday and was shooting it for
the first time this morning! (I'll take some photos and post them
soon.) At 55# it's the heaviest bow I have at this point and I seem to
be able to shoot it well. But....
I think I'm understanding what
you're talking about here... the only thing I'm not crazy about is that
the grip really digs into my palm... is that the "point" you were
referring to? I do wish it were rounded off more. (It was an "in
stock" bow.) Before I call him, do you think he could modify it?
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 01, 2011 02:14 PM:
Kapellmeister there is a quick fix that you can try before having to
give up your bow while it's off getting the handle re-worked(which BTW
can be done)
I had a similar problem with what I called a "tomahawk" grip, it was just too sharp to be comfortable.
I took a piece of leather, shrived the edge and put it under the handle wrap. Problem solved!
It may not work for you but it sure did for me.
Good luck!
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Kapellmeister (Member # 22999) on February 01, 2011 02:17 PM:
Thanks, Mudd! That's a good idea to start. (I was thinking maybe a padded glove... (?)
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 01, 2011 02:30 PM:
It's too easy to lose or forget a glove....lol
If you shave the sides of the leather you put underneath the only way anyone will know its there is if you tell them..lol
But you can tell the difference immediately.
Now let me in on another little secret.
I
traded the bow that I fixed the grip on and later on down the road I
traded for another Big % that had that same identical style grip. That
didn't bother me because I knew I had a fix for it that was easy to do.
Well
before I got around to fixing it I started shooting the bow a little
and for whatever reason the grip didn't bother me in the least. In fact,
I love it!! Go figure!!...lol
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 01, 2011 02:42 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Kapellmeister:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano: i
had asked jason about the new hill riser cross sections, how i hated
that damn tear drop and he assured me none are no longer 'pointy'. i
asked him to round it off even more.
I
just got my new Half Breed from Craig yesterday and was shooting it for
the first time this morning! (I'll take some photos and post them
soon.) At 55# it's the heaviest bow I have at this point and I seem to
be able to shoot it well. But....
I think I'm understanding what
you're talking about here... the only thing I'm not crazy about is that
the grip really digs into my palm... is that the "point" you were
referring to? I do wish it were rounded off more. (It was an "in
stock" bow.) Before I call him, do you think he could modify it?
that's
the teardrop cross section hill handle. yuk. craig should be able to
round it off. i've done it to every keeper hill bow i have/had. if you
go back to the page before this one, and look at the used big5 i just
got, you can see that a good portion of the depth of the handle was
removed by mike (the previous owner), and rounded off. this does a
buncha wonderful things (for me) - makes the belly side of the grip nice
'n' rounded, decreases the handle depth for a narrower 'throat', thus
greatly reduces torque during release.
i asked jason to round
off the handle considerably on the forthcoming new big5 ... i don't have
my hopes up, and one reason for having a lace-on grip instead of full
glue-on. Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on February 01, 2011 04:57 PM:
I love the tear drop grip. The key is to grip the bow like a
suitcase--that is, rotate your hand around just a bit to the left (if
you're a right handed shooter) and let the center of the grip be just
off the knuckle at the base of your thumb and the back of the grip be
right under your finger joints as if you were carrying a suitcase or
bucket of water. Really helps prevent torque and gives a good repeatable
grip. I always have Craig give me a rather pointy tear drop. Didn't
like it when I first encountered it, but after learning the proper grip
on a straight limbed longbow, I don't want them any other way. I know
other guys on here feel the same way--obviously Rob will disagree. Posted by Kapellmeister (Member # 22999) on February 01, 2011 05:15 PM:
After shooting it some more today (with my cold weather hunting mitten on), I will concede that the teardrop grip does
lend itself to consistent positioning in the hand. I just don't think
it's comfortable... it just concentrates the pressure into a smaller
area of the hand. I can't help but wonder if that's the reason
why so many people complain about the recoil from these bows... because
the recoil is concentrated in that "thinner" swath of the palm.
Well,
before I even think about making any changes, I think I'll just bear
with it for a while and see how I adjust. I'm not giving up on it
though, that's fer sure! Maybe it'll be like it was for me switching
from a glove to a tab... it didn't feel as good at first but after using
it for a while, I like it much better.
Posted by Kevin L. (Member # 4270) on February 01, 2011 05:41 PM:
I had a SUnset Hill with that teardrop cross-section to the grip and
really didn't like it. I gave it to a buddy of mine and he thinks it's
the best grip ever made.
Give it a while and see if it grows on ya.
Kevin
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 01, 2011 06:01 PM:
when it comes to handle shapes, and if yer a seasoned trad longbow
archer, first impressions are usually correct and the main reason for
either modding the wood or chucking it over to the classifieds.
Posted by RC (Member # 162) on February 01, 2011 07:01 PM:
I like the Straight grip with the teardrop. Puts my hand in the right
place everytime. But I would never modify my style to fit a bow. Took to
long to make it happen without thought.RC
Posted by Kapellmeister (Member # 22999) on February 01, 2011 07:03 PM:
I hear ya, Rob... I'm definitely not a seasoned trad shooter but I have
shot a self bow for a few years. I was kind of expecting the Hill
straight grip to be more like the self bow's. Well, we'll see...
I appreciate everyone's input! Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on February 01, 2011 09:39 PM:
RC, Rob, Is the "pointy" only more noticeable on the straight riser?
I will order a locator with a "fat" grip....my hands are way too big.
These are good things to know before I place an order...thanks!
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on February 01, 2011 11:21 PM:
Gene,
My 68" 85# at 28" Half Breed has the same "pointed" grip. I
got some tennis racquet grip tape and used that to soften and round the
grip. Since then, I have taken that off and I now really enjoy the
"pointed" grip. It just took some getting used to. Now, it is my
favorite grip.
Matt
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on February 01, 2011 11:28 PM:
The teardrop is also my favorite! The pointy edge does help me repeat my hold alot better than a rounded one.
All
the dished and locators I have seen were not pointy at all. I think
that it gets rounded some during the shaping of those two styles.
Spanky
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on February 01, 2011 11:42 PM:
Rob that's a beautiful bow!
Posted by Overspined (Member # 12800) on February 01, 2011 11:48 PM:
I like the teardrop straight grips too, easy positioning and comfy when
you get used to it, or if your hand is shaped for it. Too pointy and I
say "uncle".
Posted by Overspined (Member # 12800) on February 01, 2011 11:49 PM:
that doesn't look all that pointy from the pic though.
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on February 02, 2011 04:34 AM:
G'day lads,
I got a beaut surprise when I got home from work this
afternoon, as I had no idea it was finished or on its way! The sight of
the long box, that we know and love, really made my day. I rang Craig a
day shy of four weeks ago today.
It is a string-follow 70"
Redman, with locator grip, bubinga riser and tillered for three-under
shooting. It is 60# at 28", although I draw 29". I didn't choose the tip
overlay option, as I quite like the plain Jane tips. The string it
wears was made a few weeks ago, and is fourteen strands of TS+, padded
to twenty at the loops.
The Douglas fir I ordered from Surewood
Shafts arrived just today, so before I shoot it I will have a few busy
days of making arrows. I suppose I could be tempted to shoot some arrows
that will be too stiff for it...
Here's "Sunburnt Redman":
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on February 02, 2011 04:37 AM:
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on February 02, 2011 04:40 AM:
I need to mow my lawn, eh. It's a weekly event at this time of the year,
at four to six inches per week. This bow, with our strong Aussie
dollar, is the lowest-cost new bow I've ever bought; Hills really are
good value, and a lot of bang for your buck.
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on February 02, 2011 04:55 AM:
Absolutely stunning Ben !
What a beutiful looking bow ! I am jealous as all get out ! I bet you have a ripper time with "Sunburnt "...termite mounds and hogs watch out ! Great stuff mate ...
Looking forward to your opinions on string follow .
I'm still waiting for mine to clear customs ....
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 02, 2011 05:51 AM:
WOW, what a beauty, ben! congrats on the new edition!
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 02, 2011 05:59 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Macatawa: RC, Rob, Is
the "pointy" only more noticeable on the straight riser? I will order a
locator with a "fat" grip....my hands are way too big.
These are good things to know before I place an order...thanks!
i've had lots of hill straights and a few dishes - all had the damn wedge-in-yer-palm.
i
ask that the new big5 get that wedge taken off and severely rounded,
along with a locator. it's due in next week, so will report back here
with words and images. i doubt it'll be much different from the
teardrop.
on the big5 i just got from mike, he took of 3/4" from the handle depth in order to round off the teardrop wedge. it's the best straight hill handle i've ever held.
those
deep, wedged handles offer noticeable torque for me on the release and
that wedge edge knifes into the small spot of the hand (the left fleshy
part of the upper thumb base) that hasta take the brunt of the holding
weight.
Posted by Bowana (Member # 8021) on February 02, 2011 09:10 AM:
Very nice Ben!
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 02, 2011 09:36 AM:
Aw Ben!! That looks so sweeet!!
Thank you!! I needed a bow fix this morning and yours filled the bill for me.
I really appreciate you sharing with us.
God bless,Mudd
PS: I really enjoy seeing your green grass and warm sunshine!! Everything is one color here right now... white!
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on February 02, 2011 10:19 AM:
Ben, Gorgeous! Love that color... I am also waiting for a report..
Posted by Rooselk (Member # 1588) on February 02, 2011 10:21 AM:
Beautiful! Yew and bubinga make a stunning combo.
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on February 02, 2011 10:29 AM:
Very nice congrats. Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 02, 2011 11:14 AM:
some questions please, ben ...
that handle looks rounded and not wedged, true?
why so many strands of ts+?
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 02, 2011 11:19 AM:
Congrats Ben. That is a beautiful bow and I like how the colors blend well! Look forward to a shooting report. Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on February 02, 2011 11:49 AM:
Super nice combo mate...congrats!
Spanky
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on February 02, 2011 01:31 PM:
Ben-
The bow looks great! When the box arrives at the house, I
love that feeling too. It was so funny the other day when Mudd mentioned
that his friend worked at the airport and was looking out for the box,
because I do the samething, I even call up the Post Office and tell them
that I'll pick it up. If I wait for it to be delivered it won't arrive
until 2:00pm.
Darren
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 02, 2011 02:08 PM:
For you Lefties, there's a HH Big5 on the Classifieds right now. 70", 63# @ 28".
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on February 02, 2011 02:12 PM:
You know, the only other HH bow I have a real hankering for is the HH
Sirocco. I know there is one on the classifieds (too light).
I just can find one in 65# plus weight.
Matt
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on February 02, 2011 04:10 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano: some questions please, ben ...
that handle looks rounded and not wedged, true?
why so many strands of ts+?
G'day Rob,
The
handle is certainly bigger than my previous two Hills, and the
description of being rounded certainly fits. I'm a fairly flexible
fellow when it comes to bow handles, and I'm sure that I'll get used to
it. It fills my hand more. But I really did like the grip on my Wesley
Special, which seemed a bit more narrow.
As for the string, I
made it some weeks ago riding on the back of a scare I had with some
Black Widow limbs. I am actually thinking of scrapping the string before
I even shoot it, and padding the loops to eighteen instead of twenty,
so that they sit in the nocks a little better, and also making the top
loop smaller, because I worry about it jarring off completely just by
looking at the angle and how close the string sits to the edge. Heck, I
might even go down to twelve strands for the actual string, new
territory for me! The existing string might end-up becoming a string
keeper!
Cheers,
Ben
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on February 02, 2011 04:15 PM:
So as not to damage the limb tips, and keeping in mind my longish draw
and the weight of the bow and that there are no limb tip overlays, what
are people padding the loops to for such a bow as this, with low-stretch
string material?
Posted by tg2nd (Member # 16218) on February 02, 2011 04:43 PM:
My HH "Cougar",64", stringfollow, no tip overlays, 62#@25" has an 8 strand BCY 452X string, loops padded with 8 strands B50. My
Schulz "Trophy Hunter", 69" reflex (72#@28") 61#@25", no tip overlays
has also 8 strands BCY 452X, loops padded with 8 strands B50.
Posted by tg2nd (Member # 16218) on February 02, 2011 04:50 PM:
all my bows have this string material. I make 8 strand strings padded
with 8 strands B50 for bows from 45# to 60# and 10 strand strings padded
with 6 strands B50 for bows from 60# to 75#
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 02, 2011 04:50 PM:
"Cheetah" 70" and 50@28
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on February 02, 2011 04:59 PM:
Ha! That's snow! At first glance, I thought you'd held it up against the sky, with big tropical thunderstorm clouds building up!
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on February 02, 2011 07:03 PM:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Ben Kleinig: [QB] I need to mow my lawn, eh. It's a weekly event at this time of the year, at four to six inches per week.
It's freezing here with snow blowing sideways. Thanks for the green grass Ben.
Posted by droz il (Member # 24230) on February 02, 2011 10:26 PM:
Congrats on the new bow Ben. It's a beauty.
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 03, 2011 07:59 PM:
I'm looking forward to the shooting results from Mudd and Ben's bows. I
keep looking at that Redman thinking how much more unique it looks
compared to mine.
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on February 03, 2011 08:57 PM:
Yeah, me too TW.
I know Mudd is a bit sidetracked now but will fill us in when he gets the chance.
Ben is probably still makin' his arrows..
Yesterday
I read through this thread from page one to the end. Incredibly
informative. I think it'll give birth to a new wave of Hill'ers.
I am one of those for sure
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 03, 2011 09:42 PM:
Thanks Tony for covering for me.
Things are pretty bad here right now.
One of my favorite hunting dogs had to be put down after being hit by a car.
I'll get back on track soon and give you guys in depth report on the new-to-me Cheetah.
The preliminary report is all good!
Smooth, accurate and a pleasure to shoot.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 03, 2011 09:49 PM:
Roy, sorry to hear about your dog! I had no idea. Obviously there are some things that are more important. Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on February 03, 2011 10:02 PM:
No problem Roy! I know it is a tough time for you.
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on February 03, 2011 10:40 PM:
Roy,
So sorry to hear about your beloved friend. My heart goes out to you.
Matt
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on February 03, 2011 11:19 PM:
Roy, Hope your ok mate . My dogs are my family sO I have a hint at what your going through .
My thoughts are with you bro !
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on February 04, 2011 12:00 AM:
Should have asked this question seperately from my post above brother...sorry about that!
My
question was: My experience with the shorter R/D longbows and some
recurves is the draw weight will increase approximately 4# per inch of
draw. That being said, how does that compare to these 70" bows?
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on February 04, 2011 06:03 AM:
Sad for ya, Roy.
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on February 04, 2011 07:11 AM:
Mudd- Our thoughts are with you.
Darren
Posted by Kevin L. (Member # 4270) on February 04, 2011 08:14 AM:
Sorry to hear about your buddy Roy. They do become one of the family, don't they?
Kevin
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on February 04, 2011 09:53 AM:
Sorry for your loss Roy!
Spanky
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 04, 2011 09:59 AM:
Thank you everyone! I appreciate you kind thoughts and prayers.
Now let's get back on the track of these beautiful bows.
I got an e-mail this morning with a tracking number.
You'll be impressed when I post pictures. (Of course it has to arrive 1st...lol)
God bless,Mudd
Posted by ny state land (Member # 10790) on February 04, 2011 10:57 AM:
I just sent HH archery a MO for an in stock Half Breed! 68" is a little
longer than i am used to but i am hoping it will provide some stability.
I talked to Jason and he is going to dish the grip for me and i should
get the bow next week. All i need now are my turkey feathers from
stringstretcher to some in and my footed fir shafts from Great Basin
will be in my quiver and the set up will be complete! Will post pics
when all is here! thanks for wearing me down and i am sure HH archery
has appreciated this thread. Roy sorry to hear about your pet i have
been there and know it can be a tough one.
Posted by canopyboy (Member # 24537) on February 04, 2011 11:03 AM:
First, my congrats to longbowben for starting a thread that is already
at 57 pages. I'll have to go read 30-40 pages I missed since it
started.
Second, my HH Owl blank is throwing arrows now. 68",
55# at 29". I added antler tip overlays, twisted up a string, cut the
shelf and have been slowly shaping the grip. I think I have it where I
want it now. Time to finish it. Problem is that the grain in coco
riser is so darned purdy I can't bring myself to cover it up with a
wrap. Anyone just leave their handle bare? Or maybe texture the wood a
bit?
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on February 04, 2011 11:27 AM:
Stacy, way to go man! I have been lookin at those in stock bows too. I
think the half breed is beautiful...love the yew. Kinda torn between
the half breed and the Tembo...we'll see. It's all fun!
Will be lookin for the pics...
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on February 04, 2011 12:09 PM:
David,
I love the look of a HH bow with no grip wrap. I have seen a very few pics here on TG.
Go for it. Be unique! Plus, you can always add the wrap later.
Matt
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on February 04, 2011 12:12 PM:
Tony,
My first HH bow was a stock Half Breed. I was hooked after that. Now, I have 4 of the dang things!
It is like an addiction. I need serious intervention!
Matt
Posted by stik&string (Member # 18418) on February 04, 2011 12:55 PM:
My "stock" Half Breed should be at my house when I return from the Super
Bowl. I ordered the 66" 55 @ 26 Half Breed and it has 5 lams (3 bamboo,
2 yew) instead of the usual 4. Can't wait to get home and shoot it,
hopefully I can be satisfied with just 1 for a while.
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on February 04, 2011 01:08 PM:
I love the Yew and Bamboo on my 68" 85# at 28" Half Breed.
Smooth draw, hard hitting, quiet and fast, what more can you ask for?
Matt
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 04, 2011 01:10 PM:
quote:Smooth draw, hard hitting, quiet and fast, what more can you ask for?
Winning number to the lottery so, I could buy one! Posted by pavan (Member # 21538) on February 04, 2011 02:52 PM:
Many are waiting for the winning lottery number. save your money I just bought the winning ticket. Just
kidding, I hope the obsession for beautiful bows comes after the family
and future financial needs. With food and energy prices running up
because of business practices of those we have no control over, it could
make future purchases more difficult for many. Perhaps getting bows
while things are still affordable may be good timing. Until I am too
old and feeble to manage the longbows I have, the wall of bows will
remain unchanged. Unless of course I actually did buy that lucky ticket,
how many hundreds of millions to one are those odds? I think I would
have a better chance at catching a solid gold meteor next spring out
turkey hunting.
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 04, 2011 03:21 PM:
Not to worry, family always comes first around here! I'm happy with what I've got. That comment was just a jab at fun. Posted by pavan (Member # 21538) on February 04, 2011 04:10 PM:
While I know the wanting can be quite often better than the having, I
was tempting myself with buying one model of every Hill style bow
available from three different makers at one time with the same specs.
Just crazy on my part. I got over it and I am feeling better now. But, I
know of a Frederickson guitar that is for sale, they are only asking
$21000 and looks better than one I almost bought that was $45000. Just
crazy, but I got over it and I am feeling better now.
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 04, 2011 06:54 PM:
Hey folks, my HH Redman has some (checking/crazing?) going on, on the
back of the limbs. Should I be worried? If not, I was thinking of saving
some money and having the limbs snake skinned 'cause I don't like the
looks of what's going on. Any thoughts on what might be causing it? I
tried to get as good a pic as possible without the flash messing up the
image. Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 04, 2011 07:04 PM:
finish checking at best, glass chrysling at worst. looks more like it's in the finish.
Posted by mysticguido (Member # 4426) on February 04, 2011 07:08 PM:
send a pm to either/both the real bowdoc & whip and ask them..
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 04, 2011 07:13 PM:
I sent one to Craig but, he hasn't responded as of yet. Just wondering if anyone else has had this and should I be worried?
Posted by Brad @ Work (Member # 4928) on February 04, 2011 07:16 PM:
Wannabe, Looks like finish checking to me. My Big 5's got the same thing on it. I wouldn't worry about. Brad
Posted by pavan (Member # 21538) on February 04, 2011 07:25 PM:
i have a Schulz that I have refinished three times since the 70s for the
same thing. The finish lasts for a five or six years of hard shooting.
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 04, 2011 07:26 PM:
Ok, thanks Brad. That's what I was hoping for.
Any thoughts on what this bow would look like with skins on it to cover that up? Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on February 04, 2011 07:47 PM:
I heard those wondeful words from Craig today. "Your bow shipped out yesterday"!!! Wont be long now.
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on February 04, 2011 07:57 PM:
I know what you mean Mike. Nate emailed me today to say that my Natural
was next to be finished so it should be in my hands in a couple of
weeks...and so the anticipation builds!
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on February 04, 2011 08:20 PM:
I have a feeling that there is going to be 2 bows in this box.
Longbowben and myself live beside each other and he ordered his before
mine. I told Jason if they got done at the same time save a buck and
ship them together. Sooooooooo you will porbably see 2 new ones here in a
day or two.
Uh Oh, wonder whos house they are going to go to? I better keep an eye on Bens mailbox looking for that yellow slip. Dont you guys tell him our bows are done. Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on February 04, 2011 10:38 PM:
Looks like we better go to the post office in the morning!!!!!
Posted by ny state land (Member # 10790) on February 05, 2011 08:42 AM:
Does anyone know what the handle wood is on the Redman on the HH longbow page?
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on February 05, 2011 08:51 AM:
Didn'T come in today Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on February 05, 2011 09:07 AM:
Stacy...my guess would be Texas Ebony. It's a nice piece of wood for sure. You have a bow comin' right?
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on February 05, 2011 09:09 AM:
quote:Originally posted by longbowben: Looks like we better go to the post office in the morning!!!!!
You guys were not supposed to tell.lol
Posted by straitera (Member # 13875) on February 05, 2011 02:55 PM:
59 pages? You peaked some interest Ben. Had to check in to see what's
going on. & Guess you know what's coming below? Sorry.., couldn't
help it.
Continue gentlemen.
Posted by RC (Member # 162) on February 05, 2011 04:19 PM:
Rained in today but planning a two day hunt next weekend with Marty
/Apex at Fort stewart . He lives kinda close too so we`ll have a blast.
Should be about 12-15 trad archers there.RC
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on February 05, 2011 04:33 PM:
Don't forget your camera RC as you never know, one of you might actually kill something! Lookin forward to the pics bud!
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 05, 2011 04:38 PM:
Hey TW.... I'm home on a food break from the UBM in JC.
You'll never guess what I found there...lol I didn't have may camera then but when I go back it'll be in my pocket.
You are gonna drool when you see pictures....lol
Normally when you talk about diamonds the ladies just love it.. I bet Killie will like these diamonds as will you!
Try
to picture in your mind a 66" "Cheetah" 55@28 dished grip, limb tip
overlays and back with some very pretty diamondback rattler skins(buzz
worm skins)..lol I read that one somewhere and loved how it sounded.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by ny state land (Member # 10790) on February 05, 2011 04:41 PM:
Tony, yes, should be the middle of next week. That "Texas Ebony
really does it for me" Got me all ready thinking about building one with
it!
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 05, 2011 05:22 PM:
Roy, you done gone and got me excited! I got an email back from Craig
and he stated it looked like it was just in the finish. He told me
nothing to worry about and just shoot it. Sounds good to me but, I'm
still thinking on skinning it to cover up the finish blemishes.
Posted by GingivitisKahn (Member # 13331) on February 05, 2011 06:05 PM:
My son snapped this pic of me posing with the HH Halfbreed this (very rainy) morning. Last day of this deer season for me.
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on February 05, 2011 06:13 PM:
Now that is a classic bowhunter photo! I know I've worn brand-name
break-up pattern clothing with my Hill, but that was before I truly
listened to what my Hill was trying to whisper to me.
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 05, 2011 08:05 PM:
Here's is my latest quarry.
No! I did not buy it.. well, the truth is I didn't bring it home but I did make a down payment on it...lol
Here you go TW!
Howard Hill "Cheetah" w skins, 66" and 55@28.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on February 05, 2011 08:17 PM:
Somebody needs to put Roy on a 12-step before he loses control! Nice Cheetah bud!
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 05, 2011 08:33 PM:
Oooooooh, that is too cool looking! I wonder how they would do the skins
on my Redman? It doesn't have limb tip overlays to skin up too.
Roy, that is a keeper for sure. Good luck with her and we look forward to a full report once she's home. Posted by GingivitisKahn (Member # 13331) on February 05, 2011 08:37 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Ben Kleinig:
Now that is a classic bowhunter photo! I know I've worn brand-name
break-up pattern clothing with my Hill, but that was before I truly
listened to what my Hill was trying to whisper to me.
Lol thanks - I was *very* glad for the wool. It's my buddy.
Posted by Cookus (Member # 17834) on February 05, 2011 09:15 PM:
Beautiful Cheetah Mudd! No better camo than snake skins IMHO!
Posted by Macatawa (Member # 137) on February 05, 2011 09:39 PM:
That's a pretty bow Roy! I can't wait to see your collection face-to-face!
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 05, 2011 09:48 PM:
quote:Originally posted by SpankyNeal: Somebody needs to put Roy on a 12-step before he loses control! Nice Cheetah bud!
Unfortunately Spanky I think that ship has sailed!...lol
I'm a hopeless "bowaholic" and loving it!..lol
God bless,Mudd
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on February 06, 2011 09:01 AM:
Hey Mudd we're all on that boat right there with ya man! I've got two
Sunset Hills at home now, one on the way, and two more ordered...we're a
hopeless bunch for sure! Posted by RC (Member # 162) on February 06, 2011 10:49 AM:
Us Hill addicts should plan a hunt. I know some prime public ground "all
I hunt" that would support a big group. Primitive camping , near good
fishing,small game , deer and pork. Lots of stumping ground and NO SNOW.
Sorry Ben and Ben no goats but ya`ll welcome to come.RC
Posted by straitera (Member # 13875) on February 06, 2011 11:01 AM:
Dang good idea RC! Sure would like to get together w/a group of
likeminded hunters. TG has them. This year if I go anywhere it will be
after elk in KY or Oregon. Hope to post a thread soon as the KY draw
results are in. Guess it wouldn't hurt to start early. RC, think you
& Marty might want to chase some elk? How about you other folks?
BTW, we have agreat spot in Texas w/2 different kinds of goats, deer,
& hogs plus small game.
Posted by straitera (Member # 13875) on February 06, 2011 11:19 AM:
Gingivitiskahn, that's me dude! Can't picture a more perfect walk in the woods rain included. Your pic set me off! Excellent!
Badaz bow Muddster! What's up? You trying to stack up more Hills than me? Stay out of the kid's college fund.
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on February 06, 2011 11:43 AM:
I'm there with ya RC...sounds like a great time!
Posted by Rooselk (Member # 1588) on February 06, 2011 12:48 PM:
Here's a pic of my "Hill-type" bow. It's a 68" (58# @ 27") Skookum longbow built by Fred Anderson.
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 06, 2011 01:19 PM:
If I remember correctly, the Skookum was a very popular longbow. Long risers.
Rich, Do you have a pic of it strung? I love to see the profiles of these bows.
Looks like it would be a good one for an elk hunt. So you shoot it much?
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 06, 2011 01:32 PM:
I like your idea RC!
Tony, question? What's with the new handle? or maybe a better question, why did you ditch your handle?
Should I follow suit?...lol J/K
God bless,Mudd
Posted by pavan (Member # 21538) on February 06, 2011 01:48 PM:
In Iowa there is no place left anywhere near here, where I can set up my
wall tent, and in the morning load my longbow, walk out and go hunting.
It would be grand if there was a place where longbow shooters could
camp and hunt and have the type of adventures like Hill went on, without
getting run over by the modern crowds. I wanted to put up a longbow
only park in Iowa, where longbow shooters could camp and hunt for free,
at least three hundred acres. With today's land prices and the touchy
economy it is not going let that happen any time soon.
Posted by Rooselk (Member # 1588) on February 06, 2011 02:26 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Tony Van Dort: If I remember correctly, the Skookum was a very popular longbow. Long risers.
Rich, Do you have a pic of it strung? I love to see the profiles of these bows.
Looks like it would be a good one for an elk hunt. So you shoot it much?
I
don't have a pic of the bow strung. But I'll take one later today and
post it. I picked up this bow a few years ago in the TG classifieds and
then sent it to Real BowDoc to be restored. I am just now beginning to shoot it. It took me quite awhile because I had to work up to that draw weight.
You're
right about the bow being a good one for elk hunting. That has been my
intent all along. That bow needs to be in the elk woods.
Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on February 06, 2011 02:33 PM:
Pavan,If Saskatchewan ever offers non-resident deer hunting in the
south,I'll invite the whole darn Gang to come up .So much country,great
hunting,EVEN hogs and no competition.
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on February 06, 2011 02:36 PM:
Rooselk that is a very pretty bow.Man im having problems knowing my bow should be here tomorrow morning And MUDD you better start your 12 step program you are hopeless at this point!!!!!!!!! Posted by Rooselk (Member # 1588) on February 06, 2011 03:35 PM:
As requested, here's a pic of my Skookum strung:
Posted by WESTBROOK (Member # 8854) on February 06, 2011 03:50 PM:
I like RC's idea! I realy dont mind snow cuz that means no snakes!
Eric
Posted by Rooselk (Member # 1588) on February 06, 2011 04:01 PM:
I also like Stratera's idea of an Oregon TG elk hunt with Hill bows. If
this idea turns into a serious proposal I'll certainly be interested.
Posted by bicster (Member # 15907) on February 06, 2011 04:02 PM:
Georgia sounds fun to me RC. What time of year?
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 06, 2011 04:17 PM:
Roos, that is a good looking bow! I too like the idea of a Hill style
elk hunt. If something comes of it and my work situation will allow for
it, I'd be interested. You guys keep me in the loop please. Posted by Sam McMichael (Member # 17671) on February 06, 2011 04:31 PM:
O.K. All this talk and all these pics are about to get me in trouble -
again. I have admired (read: "coveted") either a Redman or Halfbreed, or
both, for some time now. I am getting weak and may just be forced to
cave in and order one. I have read the warranty on Hill bows, but I sure
wish the guarntee included a good divorce lawyer, 'cause at the rate
I'm going I may need one. My wife just does not understand that 5 Hills
don't make a collection, they only make a fair beginning of one.
Posted by pavan (Member # 21538) on February 06, 2011 04:38 PM:
Sam you don't have a Redman or a Halfbreed? Sounds like there is a need
for some consoling, if your wife won't allow it. I could offer you one
of mine but my wife is only allowing me to give away recurves these
days.
Posted by Joe Subler (Member # 8721) on February 06, 2011 05:46 PM:
Good idea RC--hog hunting with Hill style bows!!
Joe
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on February 06, 2011 05:54 PM:
I wonder if this thread will hit 1000 posts?
I get my HH Elephant Bow back from Craig this coming week. I will post some pictures.
Matt
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 06, 2011 06:01 PM:
Never heard of this bow company but, his bows look exactly like a Hill.
MOKELUMNE RIVER LONGBOWS
Can't put the link in here but, do a search and it will give you the link to the website.
Posted by RC (Member # 162) on February 06, 2011 06:45 PM:
Ga. has excellent public land to hunt. If I were a fella that did`nt
have a lot of hunting opportunities I would come down late september or
October. Good deer hunting and pigs.License run for a year so you could
plan a hunt and come back next year for the price of gas.Lot of Northern
fellas want to hunt in Jan and feb to escape the cold but it is the
worst time here for hunting.If you guys want to put something together I
will help with the where.RC
Posted by RC (Member # 162) on February 06, 2011 06:47 PM:
The "before" pic. He was a bit slow off the log...RC
Posted by Kevin L. (Member # 4270) on February 06, 2011 06:51 PM:
I tell ya RC, right now a hog hunt sounds good. I'll keep an eye out and
see how it goes. That's a hunt I've always wanted to do.
Kevin
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 06, 2011 06:52 PM:
Good shooting RC!
That one looks like he could make a the main entree all by his lonesome...lol
Thanks for sharing RC.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Cookus (Member # 17834) on February 06, 2011 09:28 PM:
That's a BIG squirrel RC! I too like the sounds of a HH hunt in Gawgia!
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 06, 2011 09:31 PM:
RC, A Hill hunt sounds to me like a great idea! Same for Buddy's OR
elk hunt. Any kind of hunt anywhere as a group would be awesome!
Maybe it could become an annual event - who knows.
This group
here is like being around a campfire with friends and family. Don't get
me wrong, the rest of the gang is awesome as well. You guys took the
time to pull me back into my first love of archery - the Hill-style
longbow. You're a great bunch! Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 06, 2011 09:47 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Rooselk: As requested, here's a pic of my Skookum strung:
Rich, Thanks
for posting the pic! That "Skookum" is a handsome some feller indeed!
I see we are the same age! - just weeks apart. 1953 was a good
year...LOL
Posted by Rooselk (Member # 1588) on February 06, 2011 10:28 PM:
Glad you liked the pic. The elk didn't. When I went outside to take the
pic there were several roosey cows in the backyard. Wish I could have
got the pic with them in the background. But it wasn't to be. They
hopped the fence and went to the cow pasture next door.
And,
yes, 1953 was a very good year. It marked the 75th anniversary of the
publication of The Witchery of Archery by Maurice Thompson and the 30th
anniversary of the publication of Saxon Pope's classic book, Hunting
with the Bow & Arrow. In addition, Howard Hill's book, Hunting the
Hard Way, was first published in 1953.
Posted by GingivitisKahn (Member # 13331) on February 07, 2011 07:51 AM:
quote:Originally posted by straitera: Gingivitiskahn, that's me dude! Can't picture a more perfect walk in the woods rain included. Your pic set me off! Excellent!
Thanks much! I've got to credit my son ( Squirrelbane here ) for the photography. The kid's got an eye. Posted by RC (Member # 162) on February 07, 2011 11:00 AM:
This mornings outing...RC
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 07, 2011 11:12 AM:
RC, your skill amazes me...you are a natural with that bow!
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 07, 2011 11:23 AM:
I'd sure hate to get within your range if I was a critter that was on your list RC.
I could take a few lessons from you for sure.
Thanks again for sharing with us via your camera.
God bless, Mudd
Posted by JohnHV (Member # 10248) on February 07, 2011 03:24 PM:
A question for all you HH longbowmen.
I've never had the pleasure of shooting a HH, but I own and shoot a 65" BamaBow straight-limbed LB.
For those of you who have shot both, how does shooting a HH compare with the BamaBow?
Posted by RC (Member # 162) on February 07, 2011 03:35 PM:
Never shot a Bama bow but if its straight limb its got to be close.RC
Posted by JohnHV (Member # 10248) on February 07, 2011 03:52 PM:
Thanks RC.
Always enjoy your posts.
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 07, 2011 03:53 PM:
I have two Bamas, one 64" and one 68". I like them both and shoot them right along beside my Hills.
God bless, Mudd
Posted by JohnHV (Member # 10248) on February 07, 2011 04:15 PM:
Thanks Mudd.
Thought that was the case, but there is no substitute for actual experience.
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on February 07, 2011 05:28 PM:
Guess what came in the mail this morning:)
I'm at work so you all will have to wait.
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 07, 2011 05:49 PM:
quote:Originally posted by leatherneck: Guess what came in the mail this morning:)
I'm at work so you'll all have to wait.
God bless,Mudd Posted by JCJ (Member # 14106) on February 07, 2011 08:02 PM:
I just received a 68" 45# @ 28" David Miller "Old Tom" today. It is a
used bow built in March 2010. It shoots well and is crafted nicely.
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on February 07, 2011 08:06 PM:
You forgot something Jay...PICS, we need pics man! Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 07, 2011 08:21 PM:
Ya, what gives?! PICS MAN! Posted by JCJ (Member # 14106) on February 07, 2011 08:35 PM:
My first David Miller bow. I have had several other Howard Hill and Hill
style bows by top builders. This is a nice bow. Here are photo's: Trad Gang Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 07, 2011 08:40 PM:
I really liked that bow the first time I saw it! That Myrtle riser is
the bomb. My next Tembo is going to have a Myrtle riser. I hope to find
some here in Oregon and have it sent it to make the riser out of. If I
remember correctly, Myrtle wood is only found in a few places in the
world and Oregon is one of them.
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 07, 2011 08:43 PM:
That's a beauty!!
You done good!
Enjoy it and can I call dibs?...lol
God bless, Mudd
Posted by JCJ (Member # 14106) on February 07, 2011 09:42 PM:
Mudd gets first dibs if I sell!
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on February 07, 2011 10:35 PM:
My bow is done just waiting on strings.Craig is having problems getting strings Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on February 07, 2011 10:36 PM:
And leathernecks bow looks great!!!!! Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on February 07, 2011 10:42 PM:
But you all need to wait until tomorrow for pics. Sorry, I need to take them outside.
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 07, 2011 11:08 PM:
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on February 07, 2011 11:49 PM:
quote:Originally posted by JohnHV: A question for all you HH longbowmen.
I've never had the pleasure of shooting a HH, but I own and shoot a 65" BamaBow straight-limbed LB.
For those of you who have shot both, how does shooting a HH compare with the BamaBow?
I
have a 65" 74# at 28" Bama Bow. I love it, too. It shoots great. I am
very accurate with my Bama Bow. I highly recommend Nate Steele's bows.
But, (Just like Mudd) I will also take out one of my Hills and shoot them side by side.
The Hill has a cool factor. So, I gotta shoot a Hill whenever I can.
Matt
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on February 08, 2011 10:05 AM:
Heres a couple teasers. Other pics on my post. Dont want to duplicate too much and hog up server space. 66" 54@27 HH Wesley Special. Bacote riser,carmelized bamboo limbs,horn tips,locator grip. My first Hill bow and I love it!
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 08, 2011 10:14 AM:
Mike...love that riser! Beautiful bow!! I'll go have a look on your post.
Congrats man! Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on February 08, 2011 11:30 AM:
I've just been humbled and taught a valuable lesson by my Wesley. It
said "Treat me like a kid,I'll shoot like a kid. Treat me like a man and
I'll shoot like a man". I started off with a couple different
arrows to see what it liked. Around 575grains. 2-3" left on the average.
Tried different arrows and the same outcome. Went up a little in weight
and not much difference. So I said,I'll teach you. I loaded up a 160
grain snuffer(+ 15 grain lead),125 grain steel BH insert,and a 50 grain
brass insert. 665 grain GT with(350 up front) Went out to the target and
said"Now take that"! My bows response was-a bullseye!!! Next shot-1"
right. 3rd shot-bullseye. Dropped back to 25 yards to see how much
drop-2" drop but centered. I have some tinkering to do yet but looks
like this one loves heavy arrows.
Posted by WESTBROOK (Member # 8854) on February 08, 2011 12:00 PM:
Yep, they sure do like heavy arrows!
For those that are familiar
with Dave Millers bows, have any of you shot his model called the
"Expedition"? It has a concave/convex limb..meaning that the bamboo is
not ground into flat laminations but is left in its curved profile and
laminated.
I talked with Dave at K'zoo alittle about it. He told
me that some older Hill bows were made that way. According to Dave it
makes for a stiffer/lighter limb, similar in theory to the Adcock limb.
Just wondering if any one has tried one..
Eric
Posted by ny state land (Member # 10790) on February 08, 2011 12:33 PM:
quote:Originally posted by longbowben: My bow is done just waiting on strings.Craig is having problems getting strings
Mine also! Let me know if you here that they ship!
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on February 08, 2011 11:53 PM:
I just had him send the bow out today without a string leatherneck had a
spare.He said he would send the other two strings when they show
up.Thanks leatherneck
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 09, 2011 12:04 AM:
My new-to-me HH Wesley Special got here today.
It's 70", 50@28.
Sweet is just about as perfect a word I can think of to describe how it feels and shoots.
I came so close to ruining a couple of nocks with my 1st 3 arrows.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on February 09, 2011 03:29 AM:
Sweet bow, Roy!
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 09, 2011 05:38 AM:
Roy. I really like that one! It's long enough and not too heavy...purrrrrrfect I get first dibbs!
Looks to me that she likes you too much tho..hah.. the story of my life.
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on February 09, 2011 08:43 AM:
Mudd- Sweet addition to your collection!
Posted by WESTBROOK (Member # 8854) on February 09, 2011 11:30 AM:
Beaut of a Bow Roy
You my friend have got it BAD!!
Eric
Posted by OPRick (Member # 5480) on February 09, 2011 12:15 PM:
Well, after 64 pages of entries I just had to get my .02 cents worth.
Last week I called Marty Thompson (Apex Predator - a TRADGANG Sponsor)
and ordered a Cumberland (68" 48@28 Purple Heart/Satinwood riser with
bamboo cores and lams under clear glass). But with all this great
information, I can now address my needs, trust his judgement and get a
better fitting Hill-style bow that specifically suites me. Thanks to
everyone who contributed. This has been an absolutely informative
thread and has made me a more informed consumer and hopefully a
satisified customer which every bowyer wants. Rick
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 09, 2011 12:24 PM:
OPRick, Marty is a great guy to deal with. He'll take care of you and
that Cumberland model has already proved itself on deer and hogs. Make
sure to post up some pics when she arrives! Posted by Kevin L. (Member # 4270) on February 09, 2011 01:49 PM:
Roy, beautiful Wesley. Ain't nothing that feels like bamboo.
OPRick, sounds like a winner. Be sure to post up some pics when it gets to ya.
Kevin
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on February 09, 2011 03:13 PM:
Wow, never heard of a bowyer having to hold up delivery due to no
strings. Somehow I just figured they made their own. I would just have
it shipped and make my own! Strings aren't hard to come by.
Posted by droz il (Member # 24230) on February 09, 2011 03:42 PM:
Another beauty Roy, CONGRATS.
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 09, 2011 04:11 PM:
Roy, that's another great bow to add to the collection! Congrats.
I got a new to me, HH quiver today. It is the 22" softer model. All I need now is a HH armguard to complete my setup.
Posted by RC (Member # 162) on February 09, 2011 06:32 PM:
Nice quiver , I`ve been wanting one myself. May have to order one. Fine longbow Brother Mudd!!
OPRick, You`ll be very happy with the longbow Marty builds for you. It will be flawless and shoot good as it looks. RC
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 09, 2011 06:49 PM:
RC let's see your Super "D" bother.
Thanks for all the kind words.
I Need to thank TommyD for letting have his Wesley.
It is so sweet Tommy just as you said.
God bless,Mudd
PS: I think there's been another added to the ranks. Is that correct Montauks ?
Posted by Tique (Member # 2782) on February 09, 2011 08:08 PM:
Nice bow Mudd; hope my Tempo looks as good. Now I gotta look at HH back quivers?? Lucky my wife doesn't look at this site.
Posted by Tommy D (Member # 1874) on February 09, 2011 08:42 PM:
Glad it's working for you Mudd.
Dont blame me for the busted nocks, that's on you. Posted by Montauks (Member # 1215) on February 10, 2011 08:30 AM:
quote: PS: I think there's been another added to the ranks. Is that correct Montauks ?
Yep
that's right, I had a Big 5 a few years ago and sold it, now once again
thanks to Mudd I have another Big 5, 68" 50@28 BTW you won't find
another person better than Mudd to deal with, one in a million, thanks
Mudd
Gene
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 10, 2011 08:49 AM:
oh how the hills will be moving as the natives are quite restless ... Posted by Kevin L. (Member # 4270) on February 10, 2011 08:57 AM:
Yeah Rob, it's too bad us Hill folks are scattered all over. It would be
nice to have a get together and swap meet, save the brotherhood a lot
of postage.
Posted by Montauks (Member # 1215) on February 10, 2011 08:58 AM:
Yeah Rob, quite restless, time to make some arras for this bow!
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 10, 2011 09:16 AM:
gene, the minute there's a break in the weather i gotta get out to
mahwah and stump - got a hog hunt coming up in april and wanna work the
hill big5 into it if i can.
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 10, 2011 09:24 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Montauks: [QUOTE] PS: ... BTW you won't find another person better than Mudd to deal with, one in a million, thanks Mudd
Gene
I
think so too! The Muddster has a heart of gold......and millions of
bows to boot! Methinks he will always be at the hub of the hill feeding
frenzies. Posted by Montauks (Member # 1215) on February 10, 2011 09:41 AM:
quote:
gene, the minute there's a break in the weather i gotta get out to
mahwah and stump - got a hog hunt coming up in april and wanna work the
hill big5 into it if i can.
Sounds good to me Rob I'm still in the Twp.
quote:The Muddster has a heart of gold.
Yes he does, he sent me the Big 5 just to try out and use with no worries Posted by mysticguido (Member # 4426) on February 10, 2011 09:49 AM:
WOW, 65 Pages and still going. It looks like the BTH (Brotherhood of the Hills) is growing nicely..
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on February 10, 2011 10:06 AM:
My new Big 5 should be here in a day or two, minus the string [no big
deal, i can use the string from my Wesley] can't wait to see how the
string follow shoots.
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on February 10, 2011 11:46 AM:
Wow this is the first time getting a bow 66" and i cant believe that it
is 58lbs,This thing feels like a bow much lighter the other HH bow that
is 64" and it pulls tight.Ok you guys made a believer out of me on
longer is better.So here are a few pictures of my new baby. Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on February 10, 2011 11:49 AM:
I will post more pictures when someone is here to take some action
pictures.Im in love!!!!!!!!!And my wife seen the look in my eyes,that's
alright i can sleep in the hunting room!
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 10, 2011 11:53 AM:
Sweet looking bow Ben.
Is that white sand you're standing in?
I'd truly love to be standing on a beach of white sand about now.
I just came in from doing some more shoveling and it's a balmy -6 outside, the windchill is way below that.
I'll continue doing my shooting at short range here in the house.
God bless,Mudd
PS: Congratulations on the new bow Ben.
Posted by stik&string (Member # 18418) on February 10, 2011 11:54 AM:
quote:that's alright i can sleep in the hunting room!
I Know that feeling Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 10, 2011 12:09 PM:
Congrats Ben! Look forward to more action pics. Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 10, 2011 12:23 PM:
Ben you lucky dawg...she's gorgeous! Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on February 10, 2011 12:42 PM:
No not sand SNOW and im tired of it.Thanks everyone she likes 30 1/2 inch 5575 with 285 up front.
Posted by ny state land (Member # 10790) on February 10, 2011 01:47 PM:
Man that was super fast shipping and a real beauty! I just called HH and
they said mine is shipping today and i should get it Monday!
Posted by droz il (Member # 24230) on February 10, 2011 01:58 PM:
Nice bow Ben, congrats.
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 10, 2011 02:01 PM:
Ben I really can see better than to think that is sand but I figured I might gets us both thinking warm thoughts...lol
I am always, each and every time struck by the simple beauty of these bows.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Kevin L. (Member # 4270) on February 10, 2011 02:22 PM:
Beautiful bow Ben. My first Hill was a Wesley with ebony riser and black
'glass. Things got tight and I ended up selling it. I'd love to find
that one again.
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on February 10, 2011 03:25 PM:
Nice Mate ! Ebony and 'boo under clear glass is hard to beat .
Wait til ya get a 68" ... then you'll be unable to miss.
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on February 10, 2011 04:13 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Ben Maher: Nice Mate ! Ebony and 'boo under clear glass is hard to beat .
Wait til ya get a 68" ... then you'll be unable to miss.
I
just told him that same thing this morning. I think my next one I'll
try a 68". He got a sweet looking bow. Too bad it's shelf is on the
wrong side. Posted by canopyboy (Member # 24537) on February 10, 2011 04:57 PM:
Ok, I picked up my Owl blank in person back in January. It was cool
meeting Craig and Jason, but they were so busy with y'all's orders that I
didn't want to steal much of their time. Just glad I got my order in
when I did. The blank was ready in less than 2 weeks.
I liked
the idea of the blank for several reasons, the most important of which
was that I could play with the handle design until it was perfect before
finishing.
Well, I'll post some pictures when it's all done, but
here are some of the current progress. Reading all 60 some-odd pages
the last couple days makes me want to post something. I've got the
spray equipment out for the wife's new bathroom cabinets, so it only
made sense to get a couple bows sprayed at the same time.
The Owl
is 68", 55# @ 29", Coco riser. I ended up with essentially a locator
grip, but shaped to my hand including some slight indents for the
fingers. I love the riser wood so much, it seems a shame to wrap it.
So I'll keep shooting it without the wrap for now. When summer comes
and the hand starts to sweat I may have to rethink though.
Here it is strung and sanded, awaiting the finish: Here is the lower (I think) tip. I applied my own antler overlays just for giggles:
And the handle, sorry for the poor cell phone pic quality:
And
finally the whole bow being sprayed. (It's the one in the background,
the only way I could get the whole bow in the pick. Plus my daughter's
handle looks cool....): Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on February 10, 2011 04:59 PM:
canopyboy-Sure looks like it was done by a pure professional. Awesome looking bow!
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 10, 2011 05:01 PM:
That is way cool! Can't wait to see the whole bow finished. Was it hard applying the antler limb tips?
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on February 10, 2011 05:07 PM:
Real beauties guys! I had a Tembo and a Wesley with Ebony and black
glass, and they were sweet! I love that combination, but after seeing
Ben's I think it looks great with clear as well...excellent choice Ben,
and a great job on that owl blank too canopyboy! Posted by Kevin L. (Member # 4270) on February 10, 2011 05:10 PM:
Nice job on the Owl Canopyboy Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 10, 2011 05:28 PM:
I concur, you did an outstanding job on your Owl Hill.
I wish I had the guts to get a blank and finish it but it would be a very expensive lottery ticket...lol
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 10, 2011 10:10 PM:
hill bucket list item #3 - tembo t/d bow blank. Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 10, 2011 10:14 PM:
I'm actually contemplating a bow blank myself. I sent Craig an email and
got some answers to a couple of questions that I had. Got to get a
couple of things squared away first though. Posted by stik&string (Member # 18418) on February 10, 2011 10:50 PM:
I just want to take a moment to again thank everyone that has
contributed to this thread. The info found in these pages led me to buy
my first Hill bow, a in-stock Half Breed. I got it a few days ago but
today was the first time I could shoot it. To say that I am hooked is an
understatment. I shot the thing for a few hours until my back was
screaming for mercy. I have bows that may be quicker and but none that
are "cooler" or more accurate. The only problem is now I have to order
one a little closer to my specs .
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on February 10, 2011 10:53 PM:
Giddyyuuuppp! Good stuff Stik&string ...
Posted by canopyboy (Member # 24537) on February 10, 2011 10:54 PM:
wannabe1 - antler tips were easy. I roughed 'em out, flattened the
bottom, and used epoxy to adhere. Then ground, shaped, and sanded to
the final shape.
Yeah, and I can't wait to see the whole thing finished myself. Needs a few more coats though.
I
learned that if you're not in it for the fun of doing it yourself, it's
not worth it simply to save the money. There's a lot of work still
involved to get a bow blank finished out the rest of the way. That
said, I'd have a hard time not finishing the next one myself too. Dual
shelf sounds fun....
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 10, 2011 10:57 PM:
I'd definitely be in it for the fun. I have others to shoot while
working on it so, I'd take my time and do it right. I don't have
sprayers so, what would be a good way to put the finish on?
Posted by canopyboy (Member # 24537) on February 10, 2011 10:58 PM:
You know, reading through all 60+ pages in a row was interesting. Some memorable quotes in there too.
But
the best part was having the proof for my wife that things could get a
lot worse than they are here.... I've only bought two bows so far.
(Well, three if you count one for my youngest daughter.) Some of y'all
have a serious problem.
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 10, 2011 10:59 PM:
stik&string: we need pics of your Half Breed! Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on February 10, 2011 10:59 PM:
Well, let me just say this. Before my Hill bow I shot(and still do) a
high end bow. I will add this about speed if it's your thing. The same
draw weight,arrow,etc.,and with the naked eye I believe my Hill is
faster. So to say that speed is a flaw in a Hill bow is beyond me.
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on February 10, 2011 11:01 PM:
Holy cow,I was the 1000 post on this thread. Rob,wheres my gold watch? OK, I settle for one of your HH bows. Posted by canopyboy (Member # 24537) on February 10, 2011 11:01 PM:
I've brushed other bows. Depends on the finish you're applying. If you
want to get rid of brush marks (often the right finish with the right
amount of the right thinner makes for no marks) you can always do a
final wet sand and wax. I think there's a thread or two on the subject
if you search the bowyer's bench forum.
Posted by canopyboy (Member # 24537) on February 10, 2011 11:04 PM:
Congrats leatherneck.... That's an honor right there.
Of course, I just now figured out how to tell what post I'm on. Guess I had 998 and 1002.
Posted by stik&string (Member # 18418) on February 10, 2011 11:06 PM:
Wannabe: Pics will be coming when it is not -30 outside
Leatherneck:
I just reread my post and I didn't want the speed thing to sound that
way, I really don't care about the speed and it is an unfair comparsion
on my part. My Hill is 55 @ 26 and most of my other bows are 75-100 so
of course the Hill will be slower.
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on February 10, 2011 11:24 PM:
quote:Originally posted by stik&string: Wannabe: Pics will be coming when it is not -30 outside
Leatherneck:
I just reread my post and I didn't want the speed thing to sound that
way, I really don't care about the speed and it is an unfair comparsion
on my part. My Hill is 55 @ 26 and most of my other bows are 75-100 so
of course the Hill will be slower.
No
brother, my comment was not from your post. Sorry if it seemed that
way. I was more or less just making a statement in reference to the
non-believers.
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on February 10, 2011 11:26 PM:
Holy cow!!! 75-100-You just made my shoulder hurt.lol
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 11, 2011 08:54 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Wannabe1:
I'd definitely be in it for the fun. I have others to shoot while
working on it so, I'd take my time and do it right. I don't have
sprayers so, what would be a good way to put the finish on?
i
doubt one could beat a min-wax wipe-on polyu finish. i would always
suggest gloss instead of satin - the gloss formula is just better and
the last coat can be wooled down to a satin or matte finish if need be.
the wipe on formula is self leveling, leaving a very smooth, glass-like
finish.
with oily woods such as cocobolo, they need to be sealed
and prepped before any finish can be applied. i use water thin cya,
spread *quickly* with a folded cotton pad (wearing a surgical glove!). a
few coats of that, with 0000 wooling in between should suffice before
moving on to whatever clear coats.
another good finish is the
'massey' - slow set epoxy diluted with acetone. a weak slurry is mixed
up and wiped on with a cotton pad, 0000 wooled between coats.
but
still, imo, very hard to beat good ol' min-wax gloss wipe-on polyu -
yes, ONLY the resin based clear, and NOT the water based stuff.
Posted by Molson (Member # 1802) on February 11, 2011 09:08 AM:
I think this might have been answered but I can't find it...
On
the Hill site it mentions the 115 fps plus bow weight as the average
speed. This would suggest that overall performance goes up with bow
weight without regard to the arrow weight ratio. I don't see how that
can be correct unless there actually is a design flaw that shows itself
in the lower weights. Now I don't think that's the case, but I am
curious as to how Craig came up with that statement. Is it based on a
specific weight arrow shot from different weight bows? That would make
perfect sense. Does anybody know?
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 11, 2011 09:14 AM:
Ding! Ding! Ding!
If I counted correctly leatherneck made post number 1,000...Wow!!!!!
Great thread!!!
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 11, 2011 09:14 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Molson: I think this might have been answered but I can't find it...
On
the Hill site it mentions the 115 fps plus bow weight as the average
speed. This would suggest that overall performance goes up with bow
weight without regard to the arrow weight ratio. I don't see how that
can be correct unless there actually is a design flaw that shows itself
in the lower weights. Now I don't think that's the case, but I am
curious as to how Craig came up with that statement. Is it based on a
specific weight arrow shot from different weight bows? That would make
perfect sense. Does anybody know?
one would assume and hope it's based on a constant gpp, such as a base of 10.
Posted by Molson (Member # 1802) on February 11, 2011 09:30 AM:
Rob if that's the case, then the problem is you are actually losing
ratio performance at lower weights. I would hope a 500 grain arrow from a
50# bow shoots more or less about that same as a 600 grain arrow from a
60# bow.
If it was based on a constant arrow weight, like 600
grains shot from 50#, 60#, 70# then I could see the 115 fps plus bow
weight as being accurate and there wouldn't be any issue.
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on February 11, 2011 09:39 AM:
Be carefull...you guys are gonna throw us back into that "does the bow fit you properly" thing with a question like that!
Too
many variables so that's why it's an average. I've personally seen a
Wesley get that speed with 7.5gpp, and a carbon Wesley get it with 9gpp
so the materials used in the bow, and the fit to you, do matter in that
respect.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 11, 2011 09:47 AM:
there
are a lotta factors to consider, particularly between human and
mechanical bow 'speed tests'. actually, i could really care less. no
hill style longbow is ever gonna be a speed demon, nor close to even a
good mild r/d longbow. they is what they is. and that's a very good
thing, imo.
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 11, 2011 09:49 AM:
Simplicity, simplicity, simplicity.....
If it goes beyond this then we must be talking about something else....lol
God bless,Mudd
PS:
There is another bow that reminds me of a miniaturized Hill. I owned
and wish I had another Martin "The Stick". It was so cute and deadly!
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on February 11, 2011 09:52 AM:
Hill bucket list- Tembo with stringfollow.
The new Big Five
50# bow with carmelized limbs that I received in January is really sweat
shooting; I can't get over how much more faster this bow is then my 55#
Hill bow.
Darren
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 11, 2011 09:53 AM:
anyone have a t/d sleeve craig hill longbow???
looking to get the length of the separated limbset, versus the connected length.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 11, 2011 09:57 AM:
quote:Originally posted by tradlongbow: ...
The
new Big Five 50# bow with carmelized limbs that I received in January
is really sweat shooting; I can't get over how much more faster this bow
is then my 55# Hill bow.
Darren
ok,
for comparison purposes - for each bow of those 2 bows ... length,
holding wt, limbset (back, straight, string follow) ... please?
Posted by pavan (Member # 21538) on February 11, 2011 10:42 AM:
Darren, I have read on here that the caramelized bamboo can be quicker.
I was told that same thing from Schulz regarding proper heat tempering.
I have been part of longbow shooters gathering around a set of
chronographs, comparing bows. It can be a rather painful thing to
witness. They don't all shoot the same predictable speeds. I myself am
guilty of giving bows away and getting out the file and sand paper
because of it. Rob says that even a mild r/d will be quicker, the last
bow I gave away was a 68" Ballenger custom job unlike the 7 Lakes bows
of today. It is a magnificent bow, it was quicker than a heavier Hill
bow, shooting the same arrows at the same draw by a good margin and in
many ways even more forgiving. It was nearly identical to a yew Hill
style bow I have of the same weight, which was also faster than the
heavier bow. All of these bows bows were tested with both B50 and fast
flight strings. I felt bad about the whole thing, the heavier Hill was a
gift from me, until the comparisons were made, the fellow I gave the
bow to, thought he had the most devastating deer killing tool he had
ever had.
Posted by Molson (Member # 1802) on February 11, 2011 10:46 AM:
I'm all about simplicity and don't mean to turn it into any technical
talk. There's far more to a good hunting bow than just its speed. I'm
really just curious as to how Craig came up with that. It had to come
from somewhere and I figured one of you guys had asked him before.
There's
no doubt two bows, even though they are "the same", can be quite
different. My 60# Osage Bushbow does not shoot as fast as the 56#
Hickory Bushbow I had. I still like the Osage better.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 11, 2011 11:03 AM:
heat tempering bamboo/cane ("caramelizing") always increases stiffness, compression and durability.
as
an example, if 2 tembos were built to the precise same spex, but one
had the boo heat tempered to the point of changing the pith color (and
molecular composition), the heat tempered limbed bow will be higher in
draw weight.
Posted by Montauks (Member # 1215) on February 11, 2011 11:14 AM:
For what it's worth i'm pretty sure all the bamboo in hill bows is
"Tempered" is caramelizing just taking it further or a different
process?
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 11, 2011 11:20 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Montauks:
For what it's worth i'm pretty sure all the bamboo in hill bows is
"Tempered" is caramelizing just taking it further or a different
process?
yes.
Posted by canopyboy (Member # 24537) on February 11, 2011 11:27 AM:
I read a great scientific paper on heat treating bamboo. Titled "Bamboo
in the Laboratory" by Wolfram Schott. I'm an engineer and this helped
me put my hands around all the anecdotal evidence out there. Google it,
it should still be available as a .pdf.
The stuff was centered
on fly rods, but it really came down to drying out the bamboo if I
remember. Air drying gets rid of most of the free water, or water
within the cells. But there is also water tied up in the cellular walls
and tissues themselves that don't really leave until heated to higher
temperatures. And when the water leaves these trapped areas, it doesn't
come back even in a humid environment. This is where the real effect
of heat treating is seen.
I think that it is also the same
mechanism for heat treating other woods as well. The trick is to get
drive it to the optimum point before the tissues actually start to break
down (then it's a little too dark.)
Posted by canopyboy (Member # 24537) on February 11, 2011 11:28 AM:
Carmelizing is the same process as tempering. It just heats it a little
further, darkening the wood and driving out more of the trapped
moisture.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 11, 2011 11:31 AM:
i 'heat temper' bamboo to the point of 'caramelizing' - this bubbles the
resin, changes the molecular structure, and can color the boo from
light tan to chocolate brown, depending on how much heat and how long.
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on February 11, 2011 11:40 AM:
pavan, that's the problem I have seen before with speed comparisons. A
guy may be perfectly happy with a bow until he gets a number in his
mind! Then can't get over that number. I read a comment by Dick
Robertson a few years ago--he had made a self bow and was really
shooting it well and planned to hunt with it that fall....until he
decided to shoot it through a chrony. He was surprised and disappointed
in the "performance" and hung the bow up for a while until he thought
it over. He decided not to let a number stop him from using the bow he
had previously been completely happy with. I think there is something
there we need to think about. I am a little concerned with the
increasing interest in speed in traditonal circles. Just my thoughts. Posted by Montauks (Member # 1215) on February 11, 2011 12:18 PM:
Dave I think I found it HERE probably more than anyone would want to know..lol
Posted by canopyboy (Member # 24537) on February 11, 2011 12:24 PM:
I'm never sure of the rules for posting links, so I generally don't. But yeah, you found it.
If you don't want to try to digest 29 pages of technical mumbo-jumbo, aim for the conclusions on page 20.
Posted by WESTBROOK (Member # 8854) on February 11, 2011 12:42 PM:
Rob said it best
quote:what does all that mean? probably squat.
If speed is your game you should probably back up to square 1 and pick a different style of bow.
Other than that, enjoy them for what they are.
Eric
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on February 11, 2011 01:00 PM:
All you need is enough to give sufficient penetration, with a hunting
weight arrow, to cleanly harvest your intended quary...anything more
than that is just extra dirt on your arrows!
Posted by Montauks (Member # 1215) on February 11, 2011 01:13 PM:
Don't get me wrong i'm not interested in speed numbers i was just
curious as to what "tempered bamboo" means I think if we were all
obsessed about speed pertaining to an arrow we would be shooting the
compound arrow launching devices
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 11, 2011 01:20 PM:
I like to watch the flight of my arrow! Posted by canopyboy (Member # 24537) on February 11, 2011 01:24 PM:
The refresh rate on my eyes is a bit slow. About the only time I really
get to watch the flight of the arrow is when I throw it....
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 11, 2011 01:30 PM:
My Tembo was fast enough yesterday that this one didn't get out of the way! 15yds and all most got my first Robin Hood.
Posted by Montauks (Member # 1215) on February 11, 2011 01:31 PM:
quote: I like to watch the flight of my arrow!
Me too especially in archery golf, point the arra high and let er fly!
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on February 11, 2011 04:38 PM:
Rob Said ...
quote:anyone have a t/d sleeve craig hill longbow???
looking to get the length of the separated limbset, versus the connected length.
Not sure how you mean Rob But I'll measure mine up this arvo for you .
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 11, 2011 04:41 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Ben Maher: Rob Said ...
quote:anyone have a t/d sleeve craig hill longbow???
looking to get the length of the separated limbset, versus the connected length.
Not sure how you mean Rob But I'll measure mine up this arvo for you .
thanx
ben - need to know bow length, then separate the limbs and measure each
limb from end to end. need to get a feel for how long it is broken
down for air travel.
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on February 11, 2011 04:44 PM:
Rob, longbowben has one. I know the bow length is 64". When he gets home
from work I'm sure he'll see this and measure it for you.
Posted by MikeM (Member # 5117) on February 11, 2011 05:09 PM:
Rob I have 70" Hill take-downs. The upper limb includes the sleeve and is 39" the lower limb slips into the sleeve and is 35"
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on February 11, 2011 06:54 PM:
Rob-
To answer your question, both bows are 68" long with a
28"draw,cocobola risers, one is 55# and the other is 50#'s. The
difference is 5#'s and without using a chronograph the carmelized seems
to be quicker as the arrow doesn't drop until I'm further away from the
target. I usually buy my shafts between 340-360grain, but I haven't
grain weighed these shafts yet.
I was just noticing a difference
with the new bow that I'm very pleased with. The carmelized limbs seem a
little stiffer almost like how carbon on the limbs of a bow feels. On
another thread I asked Leatherneck what he thaught of his new bow with
carmelized limbs, since he doesn't have another Hill to compare it with
he couldn't make a comparison, but he did say that he is very happy with
the bow.
My next bow will be a Tembo stringfollow with a carmelized limbs.
Darren
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on February 11, 2011 07:03 PM:
Rob-
About 12years ago I had a bow made with the takedown sleeve
and it was great for traveling. However, Whenever I drew the string back
to anchor, you would hear the metal sleeves clicking. I tried
everything from oil to wax, but it didn't help. I really like the hinge
system much better that Vince uses on his Mohawks. I would check with
Craig and see if he can use the hinge on a Hill, it might be a better
way to go. You can always buy one and send it to him.
Darren
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 11, 2011 07:04 PM:
quote:Originally posted by MikeM: Rob I have 70" Hill take-downs. The upper limb includes the sleeve and is 39" the lower limb slips into the sleeve and is 35"
good scoop, thanx mike.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 11, 2011 07:12 PM:
quote:Originally posted by tradlongbow: Rob-
About
12years ago I had a bow made with the takedown sleeve and it was great
for traveling. However, Whenever I drew the string back to anchor, you
would hear the metal sleeves clicking. I tried everything from oil to
wax, but it didn't help. I really like the hinge system much better that
Vince uses on his Mohawks. I would check with Craig and see if he can
use the hinge on a Hill, it might be a better way to go. You can always
buy one and send it to him.
Darren
yeah, all my 'hawks are connexion t/d's - what a great system.
i had a pac yes sleeve t/d, worked just fine, perfect fit - not loose or tight - but i do know sleeves can be a problem times.
i don't think i'd like the look of connexion hill, and the riser would need to be modified to accept the long hinge plates.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 11, 2011 07:13 PM:
quote:Originally posted by tradlongbow: Rob-
To
answer your question, both bows are 68" long with a 28"draw,cocobola
risers, one is 55# and the other is 50#'s. The difference is 5#'s and
without using a chronograph the carmelized seems to be quicker as the
arrow doesn't drop until I'm further away from the target. I usually buy
my shafts between 340-360grain, but I haven't grain weighed these
shafts yet.
I was just noticing a difference with the new bow
that I'm very pleased with. The carmelized limbs seem a little stiffer
almost like how carbon on the limbs of a bow feels. On another thread I
asked Leatherneck what he thaught of his new bow with carmelized limbs,
since he doesn't have another Hill to compare it with he couldn't make a
comparison, but he did say that he is very happy with the bow.
My next bow will be a Tembo stringfollow with a carmelized limbs.
Darren
ok, which weight bow has the caramelized limbs?
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on February 11, 2011 07:25 PM:
Rob-
The new bow with the carmelized limbs is 50#. That's why I'm so impressed with it.
Darren
Posted by RC (Member # 162) on February 11, 2011 07:26 PM:
I got some cedars for my Big 5 yesterday. The 2016`s shoot good ,the
carbons shoot good....but the cedar wins out. I have not hunted with a
wood arrow in several years but Its kinda drawing me. Gonna hunt Lord
Willing tomorrow with the carbons I been shooting but some cedars and no
mercy heads are gonna get tuned up.
To be longbows that jar
out your teeth and ain`t suited for hunting just nostalgic this shore
has been a long thread.....I ain`t a good speller by the way.RC
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 11, 2011 07:31 PM:
quote:Originally posted by tradlongbow: Rob-
The new bow with the carmelized limbs is 50#. That's why I'm so impressed with it.
Darren
the
new big 5 w/caramelized string follow limbs is due in next week (?),
68", 50#@28" - but knowing that almost all hills are heavier than
labeled, at my 29" it'll probably read closer to 55# on my digital
scale.
real interested to see these limbs, for both the ambered boo and limbset.
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on February 11, 2011 07:32 PM:
Wood Arrows and Hill Bows just go together, nuff said.
Matt
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 11, 2011 07:34 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Raging Water: Wood Arrows and Hill Bows just go together, nuff said.
Matt
+1 Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 11, 2011 07:44 PM:
This may be true but, I gotta say something about my AD Trad Lites! They seem to shoot better than my wood shafts. Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on February 11, 2011 08:40 PM:
Wannabe1-
I tried the AD lites many years ago when they first
came out; they shot good, and I liked them but as I remember they were
too expensive for me. How much do they go for these days?
Darren
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on February 11, 2011 08:45 PM:
I still reckon Ben Maher owes us some pictures.
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 11, 2011 08:54 PM:
Darren, I'm still shooting the same dozen I got 5yrs ago. Just busted
the nock on one yesterday with dang near my first robin hood. I got them
cut to length, nocks and inserts installed and fletched. Not sure what
they'd go for these days.
Posted by stik&string (Member # 18418) on February 11, 2011 09:38 PM:
quote: To be longbows that jar out your teeth and ain`t suited for hunting just nostalgic this shore has been a long thread
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on February 11, 2011 10:36 PM:
Rob my 64" takedown has a bottom piece is 32" and the top is 36" .
Posted by WESTBROOK (Member # 8854) on February 12, 2011 12:09 AM:
Here ya go Rob, a Hill style with a connection hinge, dont even know its there.
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 12, 2011 01:15 AM:
quote:Originally posted by WESTBROOK: Here ya go Rob, a Hill style with a connection hinge, dont even know its there.
I
have been diggin' for info and pics on the connection. Rob posted a
pic of one done that was not too beautiful, you could see the hinge
poking out a bit which messed up the leather and I would think feel that
thing every time you grabbed ahold of the grip...hence he mentions is
concerns there...same as mine till I see your post...nice installation!
I really like the concept of the :hinge" simple, solid. I hate the
sleeves.
Maybe Rob will post that pic for us all to compare.
I
ordered a bow from Craig a couple days ago and asked him if he ever did
the hinge...response was "tried it once...didn't like how it turned out
so I am sticking to the sleeve"
Westbrook, who did your hinge? I
hope to find a competent bowyer to retro-fit my incoming bow. I would
PM you about this but maybe everyone here interested in t/d systems can
learn as well...if there is anything to learn.
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 12, 2011 01:24 AM:
Awesome news on your order Tony!!
Tell me about it.
Inquiring minds want to know...lol
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 12, 2011 01:51 AM:
Mudd! Its got to be 2:30am there! You are as crazy as I am - fun isn't it?? HA!
Ok
- I had made my decision last week to buy a Tembo but I could never get
the concept of the Half Breed out of my mind. I know and can
appreciate the bamboo but I also learned that Yew can also be efficient
while adding a smoother feel. So I pulled the trigger on the Half
Breed...thinking the combination of caramelized boo enveloping two lams
of yew would be the ticket. I really am tired of the "hyper
performance" thing...just want a good bow that'll dance with me..(I did
not say beau)
Stats: Stringfollow 69" - 57@29", tillered at 30".
Craig will mark the actual draw weight at 28" on the bow (thanks
Rob...good advice)
Cocobolo riser, moderate locator, with black Elk stiched wrap. Black glass on the back, clear glass on the belly over Caramelized Bamboo. Bamboo limb tips (delicate)
A
while back, you were wondering what happened to my handle
"macatawa"....I gave it to my bow. Macatawa means "black water" in
Native American tongue. I grew up on the shores of Lake Macatawa and,
way back then I learned about Howard Hill...sweet memories.
Now....get some sleep! Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 12, 2011 05:26 AM:
Sounds like a jewel in the making.
It's been one of those nights where sleep is evading me.
The
knee is making sure that even if I thought about it(which I
haven't..lol).. well let's just say it's not gonna happen most likely
unless I break down and take a real pain killer pill. I actually hate taking those, they just about wipe my slate clean.
Thanks for taking your time to tell me all about what you've ordered.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Tique (Member # 2782) on February 12, 2011 09:20 AM:
I'd like to know who did the "hinge" on Westbrooks bow too. When I
ordered my Tembo I wanted a 2 piece but since I don't like the sleeve
design I ordered a 1 piece. Having the option to retro-fit a "hinge"
later would be nice.
Posted by Bent Rig (Member # 11592) on February 12, 2011 10:57 AM:
Do the 2 pieces on that "connexion" hinge come apart - like a quick hook connect hinge or just hinge back on itself ?
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 12, 2011 11:03 AM:
Are there more than a couple of designs of hardware for making two piece takedowns.
The one that was on my BW wasn't either the sleeve nor the hinge but I don't know the name.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on February 12, 2011 11:09 AM:
Westbrook's bow is a Northern Mist. Steve uses the hinge exclusively and
it's a good design! It comes apart into two pieces for transport unlike
the GN hinge that does not. I owned a Liberty Contender with the hinge
and liked it very much! There are some other systems like the bow bolt,
and some that require tools to assemble, but some of them are also not
compatible with the narrow Hill risers.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 12, 2011 11:25 AM:
for me, the best 2pc hinge is still the connexion, as on my 'hawks.
a
t/d sleeved 68" hill wouldn't fit into my coleman 36" luggage. but a
connexion 68" hill would just fit. maybe i just need to cut up a hill
and do it myself ... to a tembo bow blank.
Posted by WESTBROOK (Member # 8854) on February 12, 2011 11:55 AM:
Kens right, its a Northern Mist Classic, Steve put the hinge in it when it was built. The overlays on the front of the riser (normally
not on a Classic) allow the hinge to appear flush. I could not even
feel it there. This was my absolute favorite bow to shoot, it seemed I
could do no wrong with it.
BUT..It made a "clap" noise at the
time of the shot, which turned out to be the handle opening and closing
real quick(as you would open it to take it apart). The hinge was
installed properly, operateted smoothly with ZERO slop. I tried every
thing I could think of to put between the handles, leather, cork, gasket
material..It all worked for a little while but always came back.
I
attribute the noise to nothing other that a combination of a 30" draw,
limb mass of a 68" Hill style bow and low tension at brace height of a
Hill style bow. Your bending alot of wood on a 68" Hill bow with a 30"
draw, with all that energy moving forward and coming to an abrupt stop,
the low brace tension was allowing the handle to open up. And yes, I
shoot heavy arrows, that all I got. I could also draw the bow 3-4" and
dry fire and make the same noise.
In no way what so ever do I
question Steves wormanship or methods, he's done alot of these with no
issue, If he suspected anything he would have fixed it without
hesitation. I just dont think the hinge is best suited for this
(my)scenario.
But anyway, thats my story. I was ready to put a 3" deck screw through the handle and make it a 1 piece, it shot so well.
Eric
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 12, 2011 12:01 PM:
quote:Originally posted by WESTBROOK: ... I was ready to put a 3" deck screw through the handle and make it a 1 piece, it shot so well.
Eric
yep,
that's an easy, quick fix - and still have it function as a viable t/d.
why not just do it? recess for a small allen bolt and make that the
last part of the t/d assembly function. that's what i'd do, for sure.
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 12, 2011 12:12 PM:
interesting...and a bit disappointing.
An "extra bolt" would not
bother me a bit for the convenience of the system. I just can't imagine
a good way/place to put the bolt without turning the bow into a cobble
job.
I don't think it would be a difficult installation but it would be nice to do it as a part of the build like Eric said.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 12, 2011 12:24 PM:
for an experienced woodworker, not all that difficult to accomplish.
drill a 5/16" forstner bit hole from just below the bottom of the
handle, where the leather grip meets the riser, at about a 15deg angle
for about 1/2" to 5/8". into that hole drill a 1/8" hole to connect the
two halves of the riser. tap the wood for a long allen bolt screw
thread. wick in thin cya to harden the wood threads - allow to
thoroughly harden. wax the bolt and screw it in. or just use a dry
wall screw - the forstner bit recess covers the screw head.
Posted by Tique (Member # 2782) on February 12, 2011 06:57 PM:
maybe i just need to cut up a hill and do it myself ... to a tembo bow blank.
Go
ahead Rob, practice on your blank. When your done and have the
technique mastered, I'll send my Tembo to you for the conversion.
Posted by chupa (Member # 17556) on February 12, 2011 10:58 PM:
I ordered a Northern Mist Shelton at the Kazoo show and Steve is going
to do a socket type take down for me. I ordered it 65#@28 66" long. I
recently picked up a 57 pounder with the same specs on the classifieds
and I really like it, but I would like more pounds and the ability to
break it down so that one will have to go pretty soon. Steve said he
has done the socket type before but has mostly done the connection
hinges. Me personally, I much prefer the socket to anything I have ever
used or shot. If you weren't told it was there I doubt a person could
tell by merely looking at the bow.
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 12, 2011 11:18 PM:
Rick, when you say "socket" is that the same thing as a "sleeve" - where
the lower half of the bow is pushed into the upper half..??
Posted by chupa (Member # 17556) on February 12, 2011 11:38 PM:
Tony, It is the style Black Widow, Big Jim and Abe Penner at Cari-Bow
builds....Nate Steele is doing them at Bama Bow and also Jack Harrison.
To answer your question, yes it slips together in the middle. Very
nice as it leaves the bow looking exactly like a one piece more so than
the brass sleeve and I think it looks much cleaner. The bowyer can also
easily make any type of grip you prefer vs. a broomstick style that
most get with a sleeve.
Posted by Greg Skinner (Member # 2665) on February 12, 2011 11:38 PM:
I've been following this thread since its beginning and have a few comments regarding several of the topics discussed.
First
of all about the bow blank and the connexion hinge. In my opinion the
HH blank is really the route to go. I did my first one about 9 years
ago on a 66" Cheetah blank. There had been a thread on another forum in
which someone had installed the hinge on his Wesley Special, so I
decided to try it on the blank. It turned out great and wasn't that
tough to do, nor was the finishing of the blank itself. I felt the
advantage of doing it myself was that I could shape the handle exactly
the way I wanted it. I never had any trouble whatsoever with the hinge
system and it was one of my favorite bows - it was about 53# @27" - too
bad it got burned in a house fire 6 years ago.
After I lost that
bow and the shop with which to build another, I ordered a HalfBreed from
Craig, finished with a small sleeve. I ordered it 53#@27". Unlike
Rob's experience, when I checked it on my scale it checked at 49# @ 27",
which was a little lighter than I wanted.
So, when I ordered
my Tembo blank a couple of years ago I figured to get a final weight of
53-54 # I should order a couple pounds over. So I ordered a 66" Tembo
with the carbon strip on the back covered with black glass to be 56#
@27". The blank came to me marked 56# + 5. When I checked it, sure
enough it was 61# on the money. I did alot of sanding to get it down to
57#, which was about the most I wanted to pull. I went ahead and
finished it, using the Massey epoxy wipe-on finish, which, incidentally
was easy to apply, is extremely tough and has proven to be a great
finish.
I have been shooting that bow for two years, now, and it
is hands down my favorite bow. The only downside is it is not a TD. So
I am chomping at the bit to order another blank with which to create a
TD. I purchased a Hinge when I got that blank, but I didn't have all
the equipment to install it, so I just finished that blank as a
one-piece. Also, when Craig roughed out the handle he rounded the back a
little too much for the width of the Hinge. If you think you want to
try the Hinge I would recommend telling Craig to leave the back side of
the handle square so you have plenty of width for the Hinge.
I
really like the shooting characteristics of the Tembo with the carbon
and black glass. It seems a bit snappier and faster with that set up,
but the new one I order will be with either lamboo or the carmelized
bamboo.
This has been a great thread and very informative. The
other area of discussion covered on previous pages was the relationship
between bow length and draw length. My draw length is right at 26 1/2
and the 66" length has been great for me. The 68" Cheetah I got from
Mudd in a trade (it is marked 60#@28" but measures 53# @27")is a very
smooth shooter but I definitely notice more thump at the shot than with
my Tembo. It is an older model with more back set than what Craig is
using now - at least it has more than my Tembo. Also, it feels as
though I'm not getting as much out of that length of bow at my draw
length as I do with the 66". I've never tried a 64" and would like to,
but don't want to buy one at that length in case I don't like it.
I
have some pics of the Tembo I finished but never could figure out how
to post them. I'd be glad to e-mail to someone if he would be kind
enough to post them for me.
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 13, 2011 01:36 AM:
Greg, great info. I am looking at the back of a Craig-finished
riser...typically narrow and comfortable. Take a look at the hinge
take-down on the bow that Rob is holding in the pic of his profile. He
did not install it..and I'm sure he has the same thing in mind as
you..start from scratch..Rob will do it up right, talented boy he is!
I
also learned a metric ton of good stuff here. This has been a great
resource for many. Interesting about the carbon...does Craig use it
and, if so, what is the cost to add it?
Posted by bicster (Member # 15907) on February 13, 2011 06:35 AM:
I would like to thank everybody for their input on here. I have been
shooting a 64" 50@28" HH Longbowman's Choice for 2 years now. I have a
26.5" draw and wanted a 66" straight grip TD bow for some time to try
out. After saving my money and reading these threads I found a 66"
Shelton that was owned by Okie Man and before that by Mudd. I bought
this bow to try out the longer lenghth, straight grip, and string follow
characteristics. I absolutely love it. I don't know if it is the grip
or the string follow but I seem to be more consistent from day to day
with it. Now I know what I would like to order when I get enought cash
saved up again.
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 13, 2011 06:55 AM:
You guys are so bad.. for me...lol
Maybe I'm easily swayed but now you've got me thinking about a take-down model.
That can't be good as it means I'll need to find one or have one of mine fixed. (more money gone!)
I thought I was in trouble when I started trying the different grips other than straight and now this.....lol
I love it!!!..lol I doubt I'll run out of new things to try for a very long time.
Thank you folks!!
PS:
If any of you know of a miniaturized version of a hill style bow like a
Martin "The Stick" you might point me in that direction. Had one and and now it's memory keeps popping back up. I loved how it shot and felt. "A dwarf Hill style!"
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 13, 2011 07:14 AM:
the connexion hinge on my 'hawk ...
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 13, 2011 07:20 AM:
another 'hawk with a connexion and a rubber roll-down grip ...
Posted by Tique (Member # 2782) on February 13, 2011 07:44 AM:
Rob, that looks like a real solid design. Does it make any noise or ever need adjustment?
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 13, 2011 07:59 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Tique: Rob, that looks like a real solid design. Does it make any noise or ever need adjustment?
zero noise or adjustment, no matter what.
i'll add - unlike a sleeve, the hinge fits perfectly every time with no fumbling or worry about dirt, debris, air temps.
talked myself into it - tembo bow blank and connexion hinge. Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 13, 2011 08:10 AM:
Rob "talked myself into it - tembo bow blank and connexion hinge."
When you do this project is it possible you could do it as a "build along"?
Not that I would ever try it myself(too much at risk) for my shaky hands.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 13, 2011 08:18 AM:
yep, it'll be a 'build-a-long' for sure. gonna do it the super simple way - external and not recessed.
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 13, 2011 08:38 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Mudd: When you do this project is it possible you could do it as a "build along"?
God bless,Mudd
Good deal!! I suspect this will be "down the road" a bit, eh? I guess for a build along the "simple" was would be best.
...but...Rob, I know you can tuck that thang flush into the riser...not too difficult and it will be killer!!
Been studying it a bit more...no biggie, especially if you have all the tools.
Either way it'll be a great show! Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 13, 2011 08:56 AM:
no, not that difficult to mortise the hinge in, just takes a jig and a
router with carbide bit, after the hinge "hole" is created. however, a
simplistic installation will make it more accessible to the masses using
"hand" tools.
also, instead of recessing the hinge plate it
could be "covered" with a riser overlay veneer (as done on mohawks).
this method insures that narrow throated handles don't lose any
integrity/strength, and i like that kinda handle/grip.
Posted by Mohawkbows (Member # 8650) on February 13, 2011 09:22 AM:
The hinge clap referred to in this thread is something that I have heard
about but only seen once and it was caused by a long draw [30"] and
extremely light arrows resulting in too much energy staying with the bow
instead of transferring to the arrow, once a reasonable arrow weight
was used it stopped in that case. It could be that there are bows out
there that just may leave too much energy with the bow for the hinge to
work well. I tend to use thinner leather than most do because most
of my TD's are ordered with locator grips and by the time that I overlay
the hinge the riser gets pretty deep resulting in a larger grip, I like
thick leather because it will help greatly with "perceived" or felt
handshock as well, if I build a Hill style grip I use a thicker Elk
hide. The thin leather will move to the side a little more where the
hinge slides together, maybe that's why it looks "not as beautiful" to
some....or maybe it's just not as beautiful! But they do work well for
me. Strong, no tools for takedown and you don't know its there when you
have it in your hand. Look forward to your build along Rob.
Posted by Tique (Member # 2782) on February 13, 2011 09:23 AM:
I can't wait for the "build along" to begin! If it looks like something I
can do I'll have to buy a Tembo blank and give it a try.
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 13, 2011 09:40 AM:
Hi Vince. Didn't mean to put your work down..yes, it is the thin leather bunching up...the leather not your bow!!
You do beautiful work...I hope to own one of your creations some day. Posted by Mohawkbows (Member # 8650) on February 13, 2011 10:04 AM:
No problem Tony.......I been beat up by every expert that comes down the
pike and I'm gettin pretty thick skinned! I think everybody that has
this obsession of ours should build at least one bow.....I built my
first one 18 years ago and haven't said a negative word about anyone's
product since. Have fun.
Posted by canopyboy (Member # 24537) on February 13, 2011 10:08 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Mohawkbows: I
think everybody that has this obsession of ours should build at least
one bow.....I built my first one 18 years ago and haven't said a
negative word about anyone's product since. Have fun.
Absolutely!
Posted by Greg Skinner (Member # 2665) on February 13, 2011 05:38 PM:
"no, not that difficult to mortise the hinge in, just takes a jig and a router with carbide bit"
My
question is, would mortising have a possible consequence of weakening
the strip of fiberglass across the back of the handle, or is the flex in
that area minimal or non-existent? Since I like a straight grip I
don't think it would create a weak area in the grip, but I would not
want the fiberglass to lift at the mortised spot.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 13, 2011 05:46 PM:
greg, as to whether or not to mortise the hinge, for me that would
depend on the depth of the handle. for a standard wedge/teardrop hill,
not a problem. i like narrow handles, so not mortising is the way to go
as i feel that would compromise riser strength at a critical point.
what vince does with mohawks (which have nice slim, narrow handles) is
to inlay the hinge into the riser's back overlay.
Posted by Greg Skinner (Member # 2665) on February 13, 2011 05:59 PM:
Thanks, Rob. The one I did on the Cheetah blank nine years ago I did not
mortise and it worked fine. My Liberty by Allen Boice is done the same
way Vince does his, within the overlay.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 13, 2011 06:06 PM:
i'm ordering the tembo blank tomorrow. i'll include special
requirements for the handle back to be left squared up. got a line on a
connexion hinge for a good price, too.
like i need another project added to the looooong list. Posted by RC (Member # 162) on February 13, 2011 10:20 PM:
Had a good day and a half hunt ,Just got home. Saw Turkeys everywhere it
seemed,a few deer, missed at least a dozen shots at squirrels but did
kill a small porker.Anybody can hit a big one....With a Hill Big 5 of
course.RC
Midday nap. I had a flock of hens walk up within 15
yards of me while I was laying in the grass napping.Snored em up I
guess. Skyward pic..
Drone of some sort...
grill pig. My first with a wood arrow in 5-6 years..RC
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on February 13, 2011 10:34 PM:
Onya RC !!! A hog that size is just about perfect for eating .
and wood arrows rock !!!!!
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 13, 2011 10:41 PM:
Hoorah! Good shooting RC.
Thanks for sharing brother.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by RC (Member # 162) on February 13, 2011 10:50 PM:
Gotta have a pic of the bow...RC
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on February 13, 2011 10:54 PM:
Once again RC,table fare. Good shootin!!!
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 13, 2011 11:37 PM:
Posted by droz il (Member # 24230) on February 14, 2011 12:02 AM:
WTG RC, good hunt.
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 14, 2011 12:17 AM:
RC...man, the squirrels are huge in GA! LOL Looks to be a tender one for sure! At least somebody is havin' fun... Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 14, 2011 04:37 AM:
biggin's for braggin', li'l ones for eatin'!
good day for ya, rc! Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on February 14, 2011 05:27 AM:
Nice one, RC, nice one.
Posted by Kevin L. (Member # 4270) on February 14, 2011 06:43 AM:
Very nice RC!!
Posted by Tique (Member # 2782) on February 14, 2011 10:57 AM:
Very nice! Posted by RC (Member # 162) on February 14, 2011 12:40 PM:
Turkey season is right around the corner here. any of you guys gonna get after a Gobbler with your Hill bow?RC
Posted by Tique (Member # 2782) on February 14, 2011 03:55 PM:
Our turkey season doesn't open until May. I'll have my Tembo tuned and ready to go by then.
Posted by Two Tracks (Member # 19120) on February 14, 2011 04:24 PM:
That is a fine shot RC, Cool stuff buddy. Way to go.
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 14, 2011 05:23 PM:
Here is a few pictures of Greg Skinners' Tembo.
Posted by Greg Skinner (Member # 2665) on February 14, 2011 07:53 PM:
Thanks for posting those, Roy. This is the bow I described a couple of
pages back that I finished from the blank. Bocote riser, black glass
over carbon backing. I used bocote for the tips, too, but those pieces
didn't match the riser real well.
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on February 14, 2011 09:13 PM:
Great looking bow Greg.
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 14, 2011 09:46 PM:
Nice Greg! You do good work.
The bow I ordered will look very similar to yours....great choice of riser material. A beautiful piece of bocote.
"Carbon" - now that is something I didn't think of...I'll bet she's peppy..
Very Cool! Posted by straitera (Member # 13875) on February 14, 2011 10:48 PM:
Great job RC! Saw 10 hogs again yesterday after church but they were
running after a volley of rifle shots must have killed their leader/s.
Hope your Tembo is what you wanted Greg. Mine sure is.
Tony, guess you don't need to borrow my Hill now huh? Good for you bud!
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on February 15, 2011 10:23 AM:
Got my Big 5 in on saturday. Carmalized bamboo, padauk riser, 61# at 28
with string follow. Shoots like a dream. Rob can I email you pictures to
post? not sure how to do that with photo bucket. Craig did a fine job
on this one.
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 15, 2011 10:35 AM:
Awesome Blue! I think there are lots of guys that can help you with
that (I don't know either) Mudd does this routinely - maybe he'll chime
in.
Congrats!! Can't wait to see her..
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on February 15, 2011 10:54 AM:
I think it's a him. More of a "man" than my Wesley at 56#. But it shoots real good
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 15, 2011 11:22 AM:
Hey Blue get the pictures to me and I'll gladly get them up for you.
God bless, Mudd
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on February 15, 2011 11:34 AM:
thanks Mudd, on the way shortly
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 15, 2011 12:08 PM:
We need a ringing hands in anticipation icon! Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 15, 2011 12:16 PM:
Here it is Blue.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 15, 2011 12:19 PM:
Oh yes, that's a beauty for sure. I like the color of that Padauk. Congrats on your fine looking stick! Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 15, 2011 12:21 PM:
Dandy!! Another masterpiece! Posted by Gerardo (Member # 15145) on February 15, 2011 12:30 PM:
Had there been a longer thread? This is amazing!!!!
Posted by Kevin L. (Member # 4270) on February 15, 2011 12:55 PM:
Nice bow BR, I like the look of those limbs.
Kevin
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on February 15, 2011 04:28 PM:
Blue-
It's a looker for sure! What arrows are you shooting with it?
Darren
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on February 15, 2011 04:31 PM:
Gorgeous bows guys...congrats!! Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on February 15, 2011 04:49 PM:
Trad, I am shooting 70-75 spine poc , 2018 alum, and a gt 3555 with 240
gn up front. I draw 28.5 and it shoots all of these just fine. My
cedars are right at 10gpi with 160 blunts .
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on February 15, 2011 09:37 PM:
Im sending my new HH bow back to get the handle reworked i dont like the pointyness on my palm.Going to copy my takedown handle.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 15, 2011 09:57 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Mudd: Here it is Blue.
God bless,Mudd
HEY!!! NO FAIR!!!! that's a mirror image of MY bow!!!!! Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 15, 2011 09:59 PM:
quote:Originally posted by longbowben:
Im sending my new HH bow back to get the handle reworked i dont like
the pointyness on my palm.Going to copy my takedown handle.
i'm with you - i hate that dang 'wedge teardrop' handle. Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 15, 2011 10:03 PM:
i don't need no steenkin' red devil yew! just look at the beautious hue
of those caramelized limbs ... i'd say there's gonna be a lot more
orders for that flavor of 'boo, craig best stock up ...
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on February 15, 2011 10:30 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano:
i don't need no steenkin' red devil yew! just look at the beautious
hue of those caramelized limbs ... i'd say there's gonna be a lot more
orders for that flavor of 'boo, craig best stock up ...
I'll second that.
Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on February 15, 2011 11:16 PM:
Blue,That is a nice looking bow,I can't wait for mine!I think its great
how they can pour caramel now on bamboo to make it look like that
beautiful Yew! LOL
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 15, 2011 11:37 PM:
Purrrrrrfectly delicious.
Probably would have never known this about boo except for this educational, inspirational, and highly addictive thread.
I have the same thing comin' my way....now where is that "wringing of hands" icon.. Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on February 16, 2011 10:22 AM:
Rob, sorry about that I had ordered a Shedua riser but changed my mind at the last moment. I really like the string follow, very smooth. Does everyone shoot a B-50 dacron string? If not what do you use? Craig has a string shortage problem and i'm open for suggestions. I like the D97 strings on my Widow lb's but not sure if they will harm the HH's.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 16, 2011 10:32 AM:
hey stan, that's a beauty of a bow, hope mine looks as good.
i use a padded 8 strand endless d'02 string for all my bows. definitely for the hills, too.
Posted by canopyboy (Member # 24537) on February 16, 2011 01:24 PM:
Blueridge -- I asked Craig that question when I was there last month.
He said his bows will do any of the low stretch strings. But then he
said that a bow has a certain number shots in it essentially, and you
cut that number in half with low stretch strings in his opinion. Of
course, the majority of people won't wear out their bow regardless of
string type or half life. If you only get 5 million shots instead of
10, will it really matter to a person who won't take into the 7 digits
period?
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on February 16, 2011 02:02 PM:
If a selfbow will last years with a FF string, then a laminated glass
Hill with a tip wedge should last a couple of lifetimes! I use D97 and
D10 on all of mine.
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on February 16, 2011 02:09 PM:
I used to only use Dacron, but decided to be a bit daring with my latest
Hill, and make up a TS1+ string, twelves strands with loops padded. I
really like the feel and the silence. Not that it was bad before, but I
think it is even better now.
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on February 16, 2011 02:27 PM:
This weekend I got out to the range and shoot some 3-D's, It was about
10 tradionalist. We had a good time, so, thought I share some pics. The
weather was great around 60-65 degrees then it got into the 70's after
lunch.
Darren
Focusing on the shoot
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on February 16, 2011 02:59 PM:
i guess I need an education; the only strings I have ever used are b50
on my old Bears and now the Hills and FF and D97 on my Widows. not familiar with d02,d10 etc....
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on February 16, 2011 03:06 PM:
I have some BCY8125 that I bought last year that I haven't used yet. A
fella told me yesterday that Dave Wallace uses the BCY8125 on his bows.
I might just stick with B-50, It's cheap to buy, doesn't damage the bow, and very quiet....
Darren
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 16, 2011 03:06 PM:
That's a beauty of a bow Darren! Thanks for sharing that with us. Wish it was 70 degrees here. Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on February 16, 2011 03:08 PM:
Blue-
Do a search for BCY, they make string material just like Brownell.
Darren
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on February 16, 2011 03:09 PM:
Good pic's Darren, something cool about the longbow at full draw.
Posted by canopyboy (Member # 24537) on February 16, 2011 03:13 PM:
quote:Originally posted by tradlongbow: I might just stick with B-50, It's cheap to buy, doesn't damage the bow, and very quiet....
That's my current thought. If it's quiet and the arrow goes where it's supposed to, what else matters?
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on February 16, 2011 03:14 PM:
Wannabe1-
That's the new bow that I got in January, It's the
first bow that was posted with the carmelized limbs and cocobola riser
with no lam up the sweep.
I shot with a guy name Tom 2 years ago
from Oregon, I forgot his last name, good people though. The weather's
nice here, but you have Mountain views, everything here is flat.
Darren
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 16, 2011 03:20 PM:
I am hoping to get out to the hills again this weekend. I'll post up some pics if the weather cooperates.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 16, 2011 04:05 PM:
quote:Originally posted by canopyboy:
quote:Originally posted by tradlongbow: I might just stick with B-50, It's cheap to buy, doesn't damage the bow, and very quiet....
That's my current thought. If it's quiet and the arrow goes where it's supposed to, what else matters?
string stretch and elasticity, that's what matters most to me.
string speed? mass string weight? could care less.
dacron (polyester = b50, b55) has lots of stretch and creep. it never ever goes away, 'cept just before it breaks.
hmpe
(polyethylene = d'97, d'02, ff. etc) has lots less stretch/creep,
therefore the string is far more stable (no changes in brace height
before, during and after shooting).
i use less strands of hmpe
not for speed, but to better balance a compromise of stretch/creep.
less strands of this stuff is less resistant to stretch/creep than more
strands, but significantly more resistant than a wad of dacron all
twisted up. as a by-product, noise levels are less with low strand
count strings.
ymmv.
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on February 16, 2011 05:09 PM:
Thank you Rob. That clears it up for me
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on February 16, 2011 05:29 PM:
Thank you Rob. That clears it up for me
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on February 16, 2011 06:26 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano: [/qb]
string stretch and elasticity, that's what matters most to me.
string speed? mass string weight? could care less.
dacron (polyester = b50, b55) has lots of stretch and creep. it never ever goes away, 'cept just before it breaks.
hmpe
(polyethylene = d'97, d'02, ff. etc) has lots less stretch/creep,
therefore the string is far more stable (no changes in brace height
before, during and after shooting).
i use less strands of hmpe
not for speed, but to better balance a compromise of stretch/creep.
less strands of this stuff is less resistant to stretch/creep than more
strands, but significantly more resistant than a wad of dacron all
twisted up. as a by-product, noise levels are less with low strand
count strings.
ymmv. [/QB][/QUOTE]
Rob- Very true the
brace height is more consistent with hmpe, but if you know your brace
height, you could check it from time to time. that's what I used to do.
Dacron has worked well for decades before the new stuff came out. Also,
Dacron will be less stressful on the bow as well, but I know guys don't
keep bows that long anyway I'm guilty of that. I like dacron on my Hills and wood arrows only, maybe it's that traditional thing.
Darren
Posted by canopyboy (Member # 24537) on February 16, 2011 07:00 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano: string stretch and elasticity, that's what matters most to me.
string speed? mass string weight? could care less.
dacron (polyester = b50, b55) has lots of stretch and creep. it never ever goes away, 'cept just before it breaks.
hmpe
(polyethylene = d'97, d'02, ff. etc) has lots less stretch/creep,
therefore the string is far more stable (no changes in brace height
before, during and after shooting).
i use less strands of hmpe
not for speed, but to better balance a compromise of stretch/creep.
less strands of this stuff is less resistant to stretch/creep than more
strands, but significantly more resistant than a wad of dacron all
twisted up. as a by-product, noise levels are less with low strand
count strings.
ymmv.
I'll
give you creep. But I haven't found it to creep enough that I need to
check it all that often. Of course, if you're shooting high draw weight
bows, maybe it's more of an issue.
Elasticity is what makes dacron slower and quieter.
But back to my point. If it's quiet and the arrow goes where I want, what else matters?
Creep
only means I need to make an adjustment if the arrow isn't going where I
want. I find I make adjustments elsewhere more often than I have to
tweak my brace height.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 16, 2011 07:09 PM:
quote:Originally posted by canopyboy: .... Creep
only means I need to make an adjustment if the arrow isn't going where I
want. I find I make adjustments elsewhere more often than I have to
tweak my brace height.
by
the time you make yer adjustment i'd have killed the dang critter with
one well placed arra from my noiseless, hmpe strung, longbow. Posted by canopyboy (Member # 24537) on February 16, 2011 07:33 PM:
I'm glad you've found what works for you.
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 16, 2011 07:39 PM:
Kenny Cookus's Wesley and Black Bear. I'll let him chime in with specs and such. Fantastic bows Kenny!
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on February 16, 2011 07:42 PM:
I like Dacron ... because i have a bunch of it and i am very cheap ! I realy like low stretch and with silencers attached it is my preferred hunting string ... Oh the choices !
As a side bar ... i had Craig send me a bunch of 66" strings [ 11 in all ] so the delay in strings may be my fault ... Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on February 16, 2011 07:43 PM:
Kenny-
What riser wood is on your Wesley, it looks brown? I like it.
Darren
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 16, 2011 07:43 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Ben Maher: I like Dacron ... because i have a bunch of it and i am very cheap ! I realy like low stretch and with silencers attached it is my preferred hunting string ... Oh the choices !
As a side bar ... i had Craig send me a bunch of 66" strings [ 11 in all ] so the delay in strings may be my fault ...
you buggah you!!!
not so my big5, it's in the mail as of yesterday ... Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on February 16, 2011 07:51 PM:
Rob ... I reckon we could get these Hills a chasin Elk in 2012 .....
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 16, 2011 07:58 PM:
ben, that would be a dream hunt!
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on February 16, 2011 08:44 PM:
Rob- Now get ready, it's time to call the local Post Office, ask them to
give you a call when a very long box comes in from Montana. That way
you can pick it up at 9am, post pics and start shooting...
Darren
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 16, 2011 08:46 PM:
haven't got the big5 and already planning a tembo. i need help .... please.
Posted by sunset hill (Member # 2674) on February 16, 2011 08:52 PM:
Darren,
just curious, seeing your photo...what's your draw length and arrow length bop, and your bow poundage at 28"..? thanks.
Posted by Cookus (Member # 17834) on February 16, 2011 09:25 PM:
Darren, The Wesley Special's riser is bacote (64" bow that's 51
lbs. @ 26"). The Black Bear's riser is cocobolo (68" bow that's 55
lbs. @ 28"). Both bows tune and shoot wonderfully with a 2018 cut to
30" BOP. I draw 28" and use 225 grain fieldtips or a 200 grain
Woodsman Elite broadhead. Wraps on my arrows are by our own
Onestringer. Both bows also shoot beautifully and tune well with a
2016 pushing a 145 grain fieldpoint... I prefer the slower and heavier
2018 for hunting! Thanks for posting the pics for me TW!
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 16, 2011 09:52 PM:
quote:Originally posted by canopyboy: [/qb]
If it's quiet and the arrow goes where it's supposed to, what else matters? [/QB][/QUOTE] ******************* Wow, you guys have been busy!!
In essence, my feelings are the same as Canopy here - but....
My
bow will be here (there) in three weeks so, just to pass time, I have
been looking for arrow options, especially woodies. Playing with Stu's
calculator and I found myself constantly tweaking to try to squeeze the
best "performance" out of my selection - one obvious tweak is changing
the new stock dacron string to FF.
Now, in reading y'alls
comments it seems there are endless choices of materials, some padded,
some fewer stands, etc. My how things have changed in the past ten
years.
Without getting into a full-blown discussion, can you guys give me a "best choice" range for the string?
Love the pics gentlemen!!
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on February 16, 2011 09:57 PM:
Tony ... I'd start with the string Craig send with the bow . You can get him to either send b50 or low stretch .
To
be honest I don't notice a huge difference between strings , in so much
as soon as I put silencers on my low stretch 12 strand it shoots
exactly the same place with the same arrows as my B50 without silencers
out to 30/35 yards . YMMV
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 16, 2011 10:12 PM:
Thanks Ben!! Sounds like a good plan.
I suspect if B50 was not
a good string, Craig would not supply it with a new bow but I know he
has FF strings too. Don't know what is his default is.
I also know that there are many good/great string options out there but I can't make them myself (yet)..
Rob, since you have nothing to do, can you do a "string-along" for us all?
Again...I'm just hangin' and learnin...day by day..
Thanks y'all...
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on February 17, 2011 03:19 AM:
I am absolutely flat-out at work, and as buggered as I was late today, I
still made time for twenty-five arrows out of the new Redman, and it
sure was therapeutic!
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 17, 2011 07:54 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Tony Van Dort: T...
Rob, since you have nothing to do, can you do a "string-along" for us all? ...
quote:Originally posted by Ben Kleinig:
I am absolutely flat-out at work, and as buggered as I was late today, I
still made time for twenty-five arrows out of the new Redman, and it
sure was therapeutic!
Exactly.
It's days like that when I make the extra effort to get a few shots
off. I've been known to use headlights to light up the target on an
especially bad day.
It's funny that the new Hill bow you all
talked me into and the woodies I got to go with it have turned out to be
more therapeutic than what I was shooting previously. At times like
that I don't even care where they hit.
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 17, 2011 08:08 AM:
Rob,
I should have known...ha!
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 17, 2011 08:51 AM:
Tony I don't have any of the new low stretch material but I do have B-50.
I can twist up good functional strings and I am starting to learn to do a better job serving them too.
If you have need of one just let me know.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on February 17, 2011 09:56 AM:
I used to know how to make a flemish string and made my own in the 90's ,
have a jig made out of a 2x4 and nails. I can't remember how but will
see if it comes back to me. It was kinda fun
Posted by canopyboy (Member # 24537) on February 17, 2011 12:35 PM:
If you did it before, it'll probably be like riding a bike. Twist right, wrap left... or something like that.
It's a lot of fun, something to do in the evening in front of the fire.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 17, 2011 12:50 PM:
twisting strings - yuka-doo!
spinning strings - yeah man!
ah, the new big 5 has arrived pix comin' ...
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 17, 2011 02:06 PM:
Again, ringing of hands in anticipation icon needed here! Posted by canopyboy (Member # 24537) on February 17, 2011 02:08 PM:
Congrats on the new arrival!
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 17, 2011 02:35 PM:
oooooo it's niiiiiiiice, too. the caramelized boo is THE way to go for me. pix and full review in the making ...
Posted by Kevin L. (Member # 4270) on February 17, 2011 03:05 PM:
C'mon Rob, bring it on. Need my daily dose of eye candy.
Posted by Rik (Member # 1872) on February 17, 2011 03:42 PM:
DON'T DO IT ROB!
DON'T DO IT!
Do not show pictures of
the new Carmelized Big Five. There are many reading this who are
staggering on the very precipice of ordering a new Hill bow for spring,
and I fear that those pictures are all it would take to push them right
over the edge.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 17, 2011 04:23 PM:
oops, sorry rik and fellas ....
68"
big 5, labled as 50@28, it's 51.2@28 and 54.4@29 (my draw length).
padauk riser and tip overlays, caramelized boo limbs, string follow,
locator handle, laced black leather grip.
this is by far the most comfortable craig hill handle yet - it's absolutely *perfect* for me.
mostly
interested in comparing this big 5's string follow against my other big
5's slight backset (68", 52.8@29, backset boo, modded straight handle).
after about 35 shots through each bow with a pair of woodies,
they're too close to call at about 10 yards in terms of feel of draw and
release. if the weather warms for tomorrow, as they say it should,
i'll get to fling some at 20 and 35 yards.
both of these big 5's sorely need some skinny strings, as well.
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 17, 2011 04:26 PM:
Man, that is a beauty! I really love the looks of that Padauk on a Hill bow. Congrats Rob. Posted by droz il (Member # 24230) on February 17, 2011 04:33 PM:
Real beauty Rob. Congrats
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on February 17, 2011 04:39 PM:
Hey! That looks familiar. Congrats Rob, I should have let you show your bow first. Thats a great looking combination.
Posted by Rooselk (Member # 1588) on February 17, 2011 04:41 PM:
That's a great looking bow! Congrats. Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 17, 2011 04:56 PM:
i just can't rave enuf about the "new and improved" craig hill locator
grip - it's SO comfy and perfect for "web" shooters like me. Posted by Cookus (Member # 17834) on February 17, 2011 05:03 PM:
That's a nice looking bow Rob! Congratulations!
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on February 17, 2011 05:32 PM:
I don't say it lightly but the paduak and caramalised 'boo is about as
nice I have seen . Rik was right , you shouldn't have posted pics 'coz
bow I'm gonna ......
Good stuff mate !
Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on February 17, 2011 05:58 PM:
I have to admit,with even that Candy Wood that is one nice looking bow ,Kudus my friend.
Posted by Joe Subler (Member # 8721) on February 17, 2011 06:27 PM:
Great looking bow Rob!!
Joe
Posted by RC (Member # 162) on February 17, 2011 06:32 PM:
Mighty purty.RC
Posted by Tique (Member # 2782) on February 17, 2011 07:21 PM:
Real nice looking bow Rob! Glad you like the grip.
Posted by straitera (Member # 13875) on February 17, 2011 07:32 PM:
Very nice woods on that HIll Robert! Excellent choice.
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 17, 2011 07:38 PM:
OOOOO! Nice!
You weren't kidding when you said "mirror image".
Good news on the "new" locator - what is new Rob.. aside from missing the "pointy"?
Craig did himself proud again.
********
Roy, thanks my friend! I'll take you up on that offer! How sweet it is....
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 17, 2011 07:52 PM:
There is a beautiful Half Breed on the classifieds right now! All the perfect specs. Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on February 17, 2011 07:58 PM:
Wannabe1, all the right specs 'cept one--taint a lefty! Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 17, 2011 08:03 PM:
You wanna know what the crazy thing is? I'm left handed but, do all my shooting right handed. Go figure! Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on February 17, 2011 08:38 PM:
Sweet looking bow Rob!!!!
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 17, 2011 08:51 PM:
<on soapbox> i got a chance to compare both big 5's, the slight
backset and the string follow, at 27 yards. couldn't tell the
difference with 10.4gpp woodies. they both drew and released just fine,
and grouped about the same at that distance.
iow, the string
follow limbs held their own against the slight backset limbs at a 27
yard distance - that is, there wasn't an increased trajectory that
required my 'gray bowsight' to recalculate the bow hand hold for both
bows.
not at all a 'controlled scientific' test, there many
parameters left to consider testing, and i'm sure some differences will
surface over time. just nothing glaring after flying almost 70 arrows
from each longbow. <off soapbox>
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on February 17, 2011 08:53 PM:
That's a looker Rob...congrats! Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on February 17, 2011 09:01 PM:
Rob,Thanks ever so much for the comparrison,I'm patiently waiting for my
new HH Red Cheetah with string follow and that was my major concern.Did
you notice it easier to shoot and or any differance in accuracy,just
curious.Thanks again
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on February 17, 2011 09:02 PM:
Rob , I do a fare bit of roving /stumping at longer ranges and I have
not noticed any real difference where I'd have to 'calibrate '
differently .... Mind you my 'reflex/backset' Hills are 68 " and my
string follows are 66"
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 17, 2011 09:17 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano: <on soapbox> i
got a chance to compare both big 5's, the slight backset and the string
follow, at 27 yards. couldn't tell the difference with 10.4gpp
woodies. they both drew and released just fine, and grouped about the
same at that distance.
iow, the string follow limbs held their
own against the slight backset limbs at a 27 yard distance - that is,
there wasn't an increased trajectory that required my 'gray bowsight' to
recalculate the bow hand hold for both bows.
Now
that's interesting... Prolly the biggest two questions I have pondered
is the percieved differences in feel and where the arrow ends up at
any given distance. IMO 27 yards is a perfect distance to judge,
especially at 10+GPP. Now I'm happy to have ordered the string follow.
It'll be interesting to hear about the subtile differences you realize over time..
Who cares (really) about the "scientific" aspect of this initial test...the proof is in the pudding. Posted by Terry Green (Member # 3) on February 17, 2011 09:33 PM:
81 pages????? HOW COOL.
They just became a sponsor.....that's dandy!!!
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on February 17, 2011 09:36 PM:
Awesome Terry ! My favourite bowyer just became a sponsor on my favourite archery website .....
Cool !
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 17, 2011 09:39 PM:
YES!!! Great news....was hoping that would happen some day...
Awesome.. Welcome Craig and gang!
Posted by Kevin L. (Member # 4270) on February 17, 2011 09:42 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Terry Green: They just became a sponsor.....that's dandy!!!
Nice to hear. Other than Appalachians by Dave Guthrie, Hills are my hands down favorite bows.
Posted by Cookus (Member # 17834) on February 17, 2011 09:49 PM:
Howard Hill Archery spans / endures the test of time and still produces!
Welcome (and thanks) Craig! You're customer service is second to
none!
Posted by GingivitisKahn (Member # 13331) on February 17, 2011 10:03 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Terry Green: 81 pages????? HOW COOL.
They just became a sponsor.....that's dandy!!!
Rock on!
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 17, 2011 10:07 PM:
Outstanding! Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on February 17, 2011 10:08 PM:
Craig probably noticed a slight interest in HH bows,81 pages,unbelievable !
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 17, 2011 10:29 PM:
Wahoo!
Welcome aboard Howard Hill Archery(Craig, Evie, and Jason, thank you for becoming one of our sponsors.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on February 17, 2011 10:47 PM:
Rob great contrast on the woods.I want to here the long term test on the two bows.Congrats
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on February 17, 2011 11:44 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Mudd: Wahoo!
Welcome aboard Howard Hill Archery(Craig, Evie, and Jason, thank you for becoming one of our sponsors.
God bless,Mudd
Absolutely Fantastic. Love the bows and love them as a sponsor!
Matt
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on February 17, 2011 11:46 PM:
Terry-
I'm glad the deal is sealed. Last week, I was talking to
Jason and he told me that they were moving forward with being a sponsor.
I was telling Jason about the thread, and how much interest there is in
the Hill bows on this site. Also, I added that Capt. Dick did a
wonderful job with his Howard Hill shooters web-site and the information
that it offers, but what I liked about Tradgang is it brought all the
Hill shooters together at one place, where we can go to share our
experiences with the Hill bow on one thread.
Darren
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on February 17, 2011 11:54 PM:
Rob-
I love the bow,Congrats! The question that I have is do you
find that the carmelized bamboo stiffer then regular bamboo? The reason
that I'm asking is that I find my bow with carmelized bamboo to be
stiffer and also faster. If it's not the carmelized bamboo that's
stiffer, it must be a few pounds more than the 50#'s that it's marked. I
haven't checked the poundage on my scale yet, I will tomorrow. I
thought maybe it was the carmelized bamboo that was making the
difference.
Darren
Posted by far rider (Member # 14108) on February 18, 2011 12:49 AM:
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 18, 2011 06:47 AM:
quote:Originally posted by tradlongbow: Rob-
I
love the bow,Congrats! The question that I have is do you find that the
carmelized bamboo stiffer then regular bamboo? The reason that I'm
asking is that I find my bow with carmelized bamboo to be stiffer and
also faster. If it's not the carmelized bamboo that's stiffer, it must
be a few pounds more than the 50#'s that it's marked. I haven't checked
the poundage on my scale yet, I will tomorrow. I thought maybe it was
the carmelized bamboo that was making the difference.
Darren
at this point, other than for looks i can't tell the difference 'tween the standard heat tempered and the "candy wood".
i've
yet to find a craig hill that tested out at the inked draw weight - all
have been heavier by at least 1.5#, with some lots heavier (almost 4#).
i use a "usps calibrated" easton digital bow scale.
Posted by Kevin L. (Member # 4270) on February 18, 2011 07:10 AM:
I haven't tried a Hill with carmelized bamboo yet, but in making bamboo
flyrods, the browning or carmelization, does increase the quickness of
the rod for the same taper. How this compares to a bow lamination, I
couldn't say, since we're talking about a completely different
application, but the difference in a fly rod is distinct.
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on February 18, 2011 07:23 AM:
Rob, my experience with the weight of my Hills as well--all have been 3-4# heavier than marked.
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 18, 2011 07:35 AM:
quote:Originally posted by David Mitchell: Rob, my experience with the weight of my Hills as well--all have been 3-4# heavier than marked.
Dave,Rob,
I learned about Craig's propensity for slightly heavy finished weights
in recent readings here in this mega-thread. I am hoping that will be
fairly consistent because I ordered mine three pounds lighter than my
target. Looking for 60ish at 29" and ordered 57#.
Has anybody
discussed this with Craig? Several years ago I built a few mild r/d
longbows and used a mechanical (spring) scale...it was consistently
heavier than when other's pulled them on their scales. Maybe this is par
for the course.. If his scale indicates heavy (consistently) I should
I'll be okay... Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on February 18, 2011 07:38 AM:
Nice bow, Rob. I haven't weighed my second two Hills, but my first (I think I mentioned) was spot-on on my mate's scales.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 18, 2011 07:54 AM:
there are analog and digital weigh scales. there are known reference
weights for calibration of all scales. imo, all analog scales are
inaccurate in one weigh (pun intended) or another. some are grossly
inaccurate. digital scales, once calibrated, are extremely accurate.
like comparing an 8 track audio tape to digital mp3.
also
important is how the bow weight is measured. i use a 32" arrow shaft
with nock, measure from the nock groove to make 26, 27, 28, 29, 30 inch
marks right on the shaft. simply put a clothespin at the 28" mark, nock
the shaft, pull 'till the clothespin touches the riser front. humans
doing this weight check thing will find digital variances of between 2
and 4 ounces. i make 6 pulls and take the average.
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on February 18, 2011 08:42 AM:
I think my new bow is to light im going to have him check that also
before he changes the handle.And i talked to craig on the carmelized
bamboo he said there is no difference in performance they are both heat
treated.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 18, 2011 09:05 AM:
quote:Originally posted by longbowben: ....And i talked to craig on the carmelized bamboo he said there is no difference in performance they are both heat treated.
yep, both heat tempered, but not alike.
i've
heat tempered lots of locally grown bamboo taken from large groves
around my town ... really excellent stuff that i use for crafting
flutes. i've even made a few arrows from it. imo, this is bow quality
boo. dunno the specific genus of my boo, but there are over 1600
varieties of boo/cane around the globe.
the culm sheath
(outer skin) changes color and stiffness with the intensity and duration
of heat, as the internal grass resin heats up and forms a hard varnish
coating over the sheath. in the process, huge amounts of steam is
generated as any internal moisture is vaporized.
i flame the
green boo with a propane torch and can easily change the color from
light beige to amber to chocolate brown/black. the longer it's flamed,
the darker the color and stiffer the boo gets ... that is, it's harder
to bend, for sure. i haven't done any scientific tests, but with the
added stiffness it appears there's a loss of elasticity that brings the
grass somewhat closer to the threshold of snapping. now, this is with
tubular, sheathed boo. grinding the sheath off the culm to expose the
pith is another story i would think and i have no experience with that.
so,
is the long tempered boo faster/stiffer than the short tempered boo?
imo, probably. can that difference be measured? probably. can that
difference be perceived in comparable longbows. i think not. ymmv.
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on February 18, 2011 10:08 AM:
On bow wts. Can anybody really tell the difference in 2 or 3 pounds. Sounds like a diff in scales, Just shoot em ! Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 18, 2011 10:14 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Blueridge: On bow wts. Can anybody really tell the difference in 2 or 3 pounds. Sounds like a diff in scales, Just shoot em !
oh
yes indeedy, sir. but for me it don't matter all that much. rather
have more weight than less. with craig hill bows, if you want 55@28,
order it as 53@28. Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on February 18, 2011 10:35 AM:
I can tell instantly that a bow is 2 or 3 lbs off.
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on February 18, 2011 11:00 AM:
I agree, a few pounds more is more better.
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 18, 2011 11:46 AM:
And yes, you can feel the difference. My Owl is 51# @ 29" and it feels
more like 55#. My Tembo is 51# @ 29" and it feels spot on or possibly a
pound lighter.
Posted by tg2nd (Member # 16218) on February 18, 2011 12:52 PM:
All three of mine are spot on.
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on February 18, 2011 01:26 PM:
Rob- When is Howard Hill Archery going to get a cool advertising spot on Tradgang?
Darren
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 18, 2011 01:36 PM:
quote:Originally posted by tradlongbow: Rob- When is Howard Hill Archery going to get a cool advertising spot on Tradgang?
Darren
that's pretty much up to craig, and when banner ad space becomes available - we're full up right now on the big stuff.
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on February 19, 2011 09:53 AM:
SpankyNeal-
Did you get your new SunSet Hill?
Darren
Posted by canopyboy (Member # 24537) on February 19, 2011 10:30 AM:
So you guys got me thinking. I know some of you pull sizeable weights
all the time. But I've only ever shot a Hoyt 45# recurve. My new Owl
blank that I finished recently seemed a lot bigger of a jump than what I
thought my requested 55# @ 29" should have been. (The recurve is a bit
heavy and comes in at almost 50# at 29".)
So I weighed the Owl
this morning. Used tape instead of a clothes pin. First I checked my
draw and had my daughter mark it. Average 28-7/8". Close enough for
government work. Marked 29" from where the string would sit in the
nock, and pulled until the tape touched the riser.
Any guesses?
How
about 62#? I guess if Craig is a few pounds heavier on a finished bow,
there's a few more on top of that at the blank stage and I didn't take
enough off.
I checked my digital scale with NIST traceable calibration weights at work. So I'm pretty sure the reading is accurate.
I still love the bow. I just need to keep eating spinach!
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 19, 2011 10:54 AM:
Ouch! Not sure spinach would cut it for me. I'd re-sand it and try and
take more off if it was me. Good luck and make sure you don't hurt your
shoulder! You will have problems later, trust me. Posted by straitera (Member # 13875) on February 19, 2011 10:58 AM:
62# will sling an arrow pdq. Exercise yourself into fit & you may be sorry you didn't do it before. JMHO. Best of luck.
Posted by canopyboy (Member # 24537) on February 19, 2011 12:26 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Wannabe1:
Ouch! Not sure spinach would cut it for me. I'd re-sand it and try and
take more off if it was me. Good luck and make sure you don't hurt your
shoulder! You will have problems later, trust me.
Well,
on the yardstick of life I'm only about half way. I'm generally still
pretty fit and my shoulders are still ok. I just need a bit of strength
training. The other bow made me sore a bit at first too, but now I can
hold steady at full draw for quite awhile if need be. I figure this
will be the same.
quote:Originally posted by straitera: 62# will sling an arrow pdq. Exercise yourself into fit & you may be sorry you didn't do it before. JMHO. Best of luck.
Yup. Was hoping to work up to the 65-70 range some day anyhow. I just was planning on a couple steps in between, not one.
Posted by canopyboy (Member # 24537) on February 19, 2011 12:32 PM:
Just a new thought though...
Arrows. Bought them spined for 55#.
They're also about 550 grns, or real close to 10 gpp based on where I
thought I was. Now I guess they're a bit light. That's about 8.9.
Hmmm....
They still seem to fly ok, but I've still got some tweaking to do. Now I have a better idea as to why.
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 19, 2011 12:47 PM:
Let us know how things turn out. Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 19, 2011 01:23 PM:
quote:Originally posted by canopyboy:
So you guys got me thinking. I know some of you pull sizeable weights
all the time. But I've only ever shot a Hoyt 45# recurve. My new Owl
blank that I finished recently seemed a lot bigger of a jump than what I
thought my requested 55# @ 29" should have been. (The recurve is a bit
heavy and comes in at almost 50# at 29".)
So I weighed the Owl
this morning. Used tape instead of a clothes pin. First I checked my
draw and had my daughter mark it. Average 28-7/8". Close enough for
government work. Marked 29" from where the string would sit in the
nock, and pulled until the tape touched the riser.
Any guesses?
How
about 62#? I guess if Craig is a few pounds heavier on a finished bow,
there's a few more on top of that at the blank stage and I didn't take
enough off.
I checked my digital scale with NIST traceable calibration weights at work. So I'm pretty sure the reading is accurate.
I still love the bow. I just need to keep eating spinach!
i'd
heard from more than a few folks that hill blanks are a good 5# over
the ordered target weight. you are expected to do a fair amount of
final sanding, through a variety of grits. i suspect sanding is where
one can easily get in trouble with messing up the tiller. if i wanted a
50# target weight i'd order out 47#, and do far less sanding and only in
fine grits of 220 .
Posted by pavan (Member # 21538) on February 19, 2011 02:56 PM:
The ones I have have done ended up a couple of pounds over as well. I
gave it then a rounded trap and a narrower profile towards the ends of
the limb and left the width of the limb as is near the fade outs.
Rounding into a a belly side trap and getting the limb width to 3/8" at
the string groove will reduce it about four pounds.
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 19, 2011 03:28 PM:
quote:Originally posted by straitera: 62# will sling an arrow pdq. Exercise yourself into fit & you may be sorry you didn't do it before. JMHO. Best of luck.
***********
X2
- My thinking exactly! I am hoping mine will come in at 59-60, roughly
5# more than my bows are now. In the end, if I decide to go lighter,
as Paven said, it is no big deal to shave 4#...any more than that can be
risky depending on the bow.
Posted by Kapellmeister (Member # 22999) on February 19, 2011 04:57 PM:
'Boo & Yew and Walnut, too!
I finally took some
pictures of my new Hill 68" Half-Breed 55# @ 28" backset longbow that I
got from Craig a couple of weeks ago. Walnut riser with a straight grip
and laced elk wrap. The more I shoot it, the more I love this bow!
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 19, 2011 05:19 PM:
real nice, gene - me like. Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 19, 2011 06:17 PM:
I agree! I'm liking the looks of that Half Breed. Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 19, 2011 06:47 PM:
Wow! Yew...and...bamboo!!!!
The best of both worlds!
Great looking bow.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on February 19, 2011 06:54 PM:
Darren i've got a couple more weeks left on it I think, but it is the
bow Nate's working on right now so it shouldn't be too much longer. You
can bet it will show up on this thread, and have one of it's own when it
arrives!
Very nice Halfbreed Gene...I like that walnut! Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on February 19, 2011 07:04 PM:
Spanky, when you get done playing with it, you can send it to me. I promise I'll give it a good home.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 19, 2011 07:32 PM:
spanky, what are all the spex for yer new-to-come sunset?
Posted by droz il (Member # 24230) on February 19, 2011 07:45 PM:
Another nice Hill. Congrats Gene.
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 19, 2011 09:58 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Kapellmeister: 'Boo & Yew and Walnut, too! ..... The more I shoot it, the more I love this bow!
************** Gene, she's a beauty!
Yeah! I really like the contrast between the dark boo and light yew limbs...pretty, and it shoots to boot!!
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on February 19, 2011 10:09 PM:
Nice bow!
Posted by far rider (Member # 14108) on February 19, 2011 10:46 PM:
Hey Mudd, what's the wood on your Big 5 riser. I have it's twin at home.
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 19, 2011 10:50 PM:
I think Craig told me it was Paudka or Paduak(not sure of spelling)
God bless,Mudd
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on February 19, 2011 11:41 PM:
I already listed the new one in my signature (got the ants in my pants
ya know) it's named "El Tigre" after the Jaguar Howard took in Mexico.
This is a new one for Nate in that it has glass on the back only like
the Schulz Naturals. It is 65" long and should finish out around
58@26.5" with brown glass on the back, caramelized lams, and according
to Nate, a stunning Myrtle riser.
The shorter length works to
keep the cast up, and works fine with this style bow...John liked his
Naturals at 64" for his 26" draw. The difference is this one is setup
for modern strings! This style of bow naturally has more string follow
than a glass bow which makes them even softer at the shot, and more
stable, just not quite as fast which really doesn't matter much to me
anyway.
I think it's going to do a great job of replacing my Pete
George natural that I had to sell last year, and I suspect that it's
going to be even better!
David, this one won't work for you beautiful people...the shelf is on the wrong side! Posted by Owlmagnet (Member # 18785) on February 20, 2011 11:32 AM:
I currently own and enjoy a pair of 66" Wesley Specials, one with
backset, the other with string follow. Love'em. I am getting inspired
by Dick Wrightman's fondness for the shelfless, shoot off the knuckle,
HH longbow. I assume I would have to drop the spine of my spruce shafts
five or ten pounds to get around the riser. Anybody else working with a
shelfless Hill? If so, how's it working for ya? Thanks, guys--I've
been lovin' this thread.
Posted by Joe Subler (Member # 8721) on February 20, 2011 03:30 PM:
Just curious if anyone who knows who got Robin Hood #1?
Joe
Posted by Claymore (Member # 17440) on February 20, 2011 04:56 PM:
I have heard that Craig has a customer that get all the #1. Can't remember where I read that.
Posted by Claymore (Member # 17440) on February 20, 2011 06:07 PM:
Dick Wightman I believe will know. I don't know if he knows the person or not.
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 20, 2011 06:29 PM:
Shoot! Why go through Dick when Craig is now one of our sponsors and we can ask him directly.
Unless that person doesn't want that fame it shouldn't be a problem getting a name, assuming the story is true to begin with.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Kelly (Member # 1777) on February 20, 2011 06:29 PM:
quote:Originally posted by SpankyNeal:
I already listed the new one in my signature (got the ants in my pants
ya know) it's named "El Tigre" after the Jaguar Howard took in Mexico.
This is a new one for Nate in that it has glass on the back only like
the Schulz Naturals. It is 65" long and should finish out around
58@26.5" with brown glass on the back, caramelized lams, and according
to Nate, a stunning Myrtle riser.
The shorter length works to
keep the cast up, and works fine with this style bow...John liked his
Naturals at 64" for his 26" draw. The difference is this one is setup
for modern strings! This style of bow naturally has more string follow
than a glass bow which makes them even softer at the shot, and more
stable, just not quite as fast which really doesn't matter much to me
anyway.
I think it's going to do a great job of replacing my Pete
George natural that I had to sell last year, and I suspect that it's
going to be even better!
David, this one won't work for you beautiful people...the shelf is on the wrong side!
As
far as I know the Schulz Naturals never had any glass in them. They
were all bamboo backed with either bamboo, or yew or osage cores-no
glass.
I'm expecting a new Sunset Hill sometime this Spring. Hope it arrives in time for Spring Bear. Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on February 20, 2011 06:37 PM:
Thanks Kelly, I always thought that was the Grandpa's and
Tonkins...shows how much I know LOL! I'm still learning about all the
different models John made! Someone who knows John's bows should pipe in
and fill us in!
Hope yours gets there in time for your hunt! Posted by far rider (Member # 14108) on February 20, 2011 06:51 PM:
Did a little Hill stumpin' today.
Posted by RC (Member # 162) on February 20, 2011 07:22 PM:
Posted by RC (Member # 162) on February 20, 2011 07:23 PM:
I`m prolly gonna have to trade this sweet Big 5 with an extra lam of yew
in the middle for one 4-5 pounds less weight.Its 55@28 and 66 long with
straight grip.I`ve tried ti "build" up but as I get older I find I
"tear" up.
no wheelin or dealin on the powwow please
[ February 20, 2011, 08:06 PM: Message edited by: Rob DiStefano ]
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 20, 2011 07:45 PM:
Far Rider that's a beauty!
Thanks for sharing.
God bless,Mudd
PS: Apologies Rob!
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on February 20, 2011 07:50 PM:
RC-I have a GORH t-shirt I'll trade ya!!!
Posted by RC (Member # 162) on February 20, 2011 07:53 PM:
Thanks for the Shirt Brother. I`ll wear it to a few shoots Lord Willing.I`m not sure its a good trade though...lol.RC
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on February 20, 2011 08:00 PM:
It was worth a shot!
I'll get it out to you tomorrow.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 20, 2011 08:08 PM:
please guyz - no sellin or horse tradin on the powwow, classifieds only - thank you Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on February 20, 2011 08:12 PM:
Rob can you post a closeup picture of that modified locator grip on your new bow.Thanks
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 20, 2011 08:18 PM:
ben, that's not a modified grip, that's the way craig is now shaping them, according to jason.
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on February 20, 2011 08:22 PM:
Your probably right Rob,that looks identical to my new one.
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on February 20, 2011 08:23 PM:
Thanks im going to give that grip a try.I didn't like that pointy
straight grip so i sent it back to round it off, but im going to ask for
that grip.Thanks again Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on February 20, 2011 09:06 PM:
Gents,
Got this 100# HH from Joseph Garvon, originally owned by Leo Markert.
THe grip was huge. For those of you that know Leo, he is a big man. I am only 5' 9" so I don't have big hands.
Anyway, the Riser is covered with Elephant Skin.
I sent the bow to Craig to reduce the grip and make it dished. While, Craig was at it, he added the Elephant Silver Inlay.
What do you think?
Here is the original HUGE Grip!
Here is the re-sized Grip!
Original Straight Versus Dished
No Inlay and with the Elephant Inlay
Posted by RC (Member # 162) on February 20, 2011 09:07 PM:
Sorry Rob.RC
Posted by far rider (Member # 14108) on February 20, 2011 09:25 PM:
Thanks Roy, it was my first custom made bow. Had Craig make it. I found
some really nice claro walnut for the riser, some curly maple for the
outer lams, along with some mastodon ivory for the tip overlays. Then I
just shipped to Craig and he did the rest. She's a real sweet shooter
too. 53# @ 30 1/2"
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 20, 2011 09:46 PM:
Matt, that bruit of a bow is beautious! The elephant is cool too. I like the wood in the riser..
************
Tim, Craig did an EXCELLENT job on your custom bow..
Posted by canopyboy (Member # 24537) on February 20, 2011 10:38 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Joe Subler: Just curious if anyone who knows who got Robin Hood #1?
Joe
I held it in my hands when I was there. Craig said he was keeping it for himself.
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on February 21, 2011 04:28 AM:
I said it before, but I'll say it again here: Far Rider, your bow is absolutely stunning! Well-done on those great choices!
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on February 21, 2011 04:30 AM:
Matt, I can't quite tell from the pictures: What are the limb veneers? Some timber under clear glass? Or brown glass?
I am a sucker for bocote. Does anybody know if Craig would put bocote veneers over bamboo, with a bocote riser?
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on February 21, 2011 04:32 AM:
Matt and Far Rider, I do NOT need or wish to be pushed over the edge
again so soon, but your pictures aren't helping! I will resist... Until
next time...
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 21, 2011 05:42 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Ben Kleinig: I am a sucker for bocote. Does anybody know if Craig would put bocote veneers over bamboo, with a bocote riser?
*****
Ben, Me
too! Most of the Bocote I see lately on these bows has been
gorgeous...dark and deeply figured - Another tribute to Craig - he puts
absolutely no junk into his craft.
There's
a pic of a beautiful bow on this thread (far rider) showing a Craig
built using specially hand picked materials by the customer including a
lam of curly maple on the belly...I would think he
would/could/has....thought about that too.
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on February 21, 2011 08:19 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Ben Kleinig: I said it before, but I'll say it again here: Far Rider, your bow is absolutely stunning! Well-done on those great choices!
x2!!! Beautiful bow.
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on February 21, 2011 09:50 AM:
Yes x2 would be an understatement.Congrats
Posted by ErikT (Member # 3345) on February 21, 2011 11:06 AM:
Northern Mist? Who happens to know how deep the shelves are cut on a
NM long bow? I ordered a Whisper and trying to run a spine calculator
to see what spine to start with but I'm not sure how deep the riser is
cut.
Posted by RC (Member # 162) on February 21, 2011 11:07 AM:
What brace height do you guys run on your 66" Hill Bows?RC
Posted by Buckwheaties (Member # 10410) on February 21, 2011 12:03 PM:
Craig recommends 6 1/4" on the 66"er. That works well for me.
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 21, 2011 12:50 PM:
Ben, Craig has and will do Bacote veneers. I talked to him about a week and a half ago and he says he has some in stock veneers.
Posted by Kevin L. (Member # 4270) on February 21, 2011 01:08 PM:
RC, mine vary from 6 1/8"- 6/1/4". These seem to be the "sweet spot" for mine.
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on February 21, 2011 01:23 PM:
Yep, 6 1/8" - 6 3/8" for the ones i've had.
Craig built a bow
that came with Bacote veneers at one time, but I can't remember the name
of it, "Wapiti" I think. He is pretty open to your desires as long as
it will work.
Posted by far rider (Member # 14108) on February 21, 2011 02:19 PM:
Wow! Thanks guys, I appreciate the compliments. I have to hand it to
Craig, he sure was patient with me while I simmered over my choices. Was
over a year in the making, but for sure, there were no disappointments.
Thanks again, and likewise, I have seen a number of truly stunning Hill
bows in this thread.
Tim
Posted by sunset hill (Member # 2674) on February 21, 2011 02:23 PM:
Spanky,
a clarification on the Schulz bow thing...
John's
Trophy Hunter's were glass faced and backed and in the 64" range for
his 26" draw..ie. the one in his video. His Naturals were in the 60 -
62" range for his draw. The bow I'm building you is glass on the back
only, to replace the bamboo backing. Similar to what Steve Schulz made
and is going to be remaking. David Miller is making the all
bamboo/bamboo backed bows right now, per Schulz's instruction. These
bows are generally a little shorter than the glass faced/backed bows.
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 21, 2011 04:17 PM:
Far Rider I stand corrected. Here's what I learned from Craig. "I am
guessing that the riser is bubinga (a reddish colored wood)".
God bless,Mudd
Posted by huntinoly (Member # 6666) on February 21, 2011 04:37 PM:
Someone want to see Bacote on a hill bow. This is mine 52# @ 28" 70" ntn \
images no wider than 640, please
http://i576.photobucket.com/albums/ss206/fishinoly/Picture108.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]<a
href="http://s576.photobucket.com/albums/ss206/fishinoly/?action=view¤t=Picture108.jpg"
target="_blank"><img
src="http://i576.photobucket.com/albums/ss206/fishinoly/Picture108.jpg"
border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>[/IMG]
Posted by Rooselk (Member # 1588) on February 21, 2011 04:44 PM:
Wow! Very nice indeed. Posted by Overspined (Member # 12800) on February 21, 2011 04:47 PM:
I was shooting one of my NM classics at the bunny stomp in MI this past
weekend and one of the guys turned around and said "did you just shoot?
It barely makes a sound!" I replied that it allows me to shoot a quiver
full of arrows at animals before they escape!
Truth is, all of
my hill and hill style bows are extremely quiet so long as the arrow
mass is sufficient. I prefer 68", and all I hear is the swoosh of the
string!
I will have to post a pic of my current herem...
Posted by MJB (Member # 11159) on February 21, 2011 04:49 PM:
huntinoly
That's beautiful
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 21, 2011 05:02 PM:
Greg, that is one of the best looking Hills I've seen in a while! Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on February 21, 2011 05:02 PM:
Super nice bow, mate! Thanks for sharing that.
Posted by Montauks (Member # 1215) on February 21, 2011 05:34 PM:
This thread gets better and better!
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on February 21, 2011 06:33 PM:
Hey Greg, very nice "Jungle Cat" there man...love the Zebra grip!
Thanks
Nate for straightening me out on that one. I guess I got the Natural
thing from Steve's website and assumed that is how John's were made.
Can't wait to get it bud!
Posted by far rider (Member # 14108) on February 21, 2011 06:56 PM:
huntioly, very nice, love the scrimshaw tigress. Very nice and very unique.
Posted by far rider (Member # 14108) on February 21, 2011 06:57 PM:
Bubinga, got it, thanks Mudd!
Tim
Posted by GMASIUK (Member # 12175) on February 21, 2011 07:00 PM:
Hey far rider, I really like that maple and walnut Hill of yours. Very classy! It's almost too nice to hunt with!
Glen
Posted by RC (Member # 162) on February 21, 2011 07:07 PM:
MMYYY GGOOODNESSSS what a purty bow!!RC
Posted by far rider (Member # 14108) on February 21, 2011 07:10 PM:
Thanks, the key being "almost" too pretty to hunt with! Just can't leave it on the rack, she shoots way to sweet!
huntinoly, love the outer lams on yours!
Tim
Posted by Raging Water (Member # 22308) on February 22, 2011 10:30 AM:
Wow, this thread finally made it to the second page of Pow Wow after 1300 + posts. Amazing.
Oops, now it's back on top. Dang!
Matt
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 22, 2011 01:51 PM:
This bow might look familiar 68" Big 5. 3rd set of three at approx 15yds. Surewood cut 30" bop, 145gr tip.
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 22, 2011 02:11 PM:
SEE THE CLASSIFIEDS! Posted by Oliverstacy (Member # 13039) on February 23, 2011 04:30 PM:
All this HH talk has finally gotten to me also and the bug is dug in
deep! So I sit here trying to figure out exactly what I want. I wanted
Wannabe1’s bow but can’t swing the money right now so I think I’m going
the order and pay over the build time approach.
I have it narrowed down to 2 bows that are completely different one is plain the other would be fancy:
Bow
Option #1 68” Wesley Special with the lams caramelized, Grey Glass,
Myrtle riser and laced leather wrap and Myrtle tip overlays. Might add a
Whitetail inlay but I’m not sure yet.
Bow Option #2 68” Redman (edited) all yew…riser and lams under clear glass with a laced leather wrap with antler tip overlays.
I’m
looking for a straight limb model with a standard grip and around 53 @
29” but will have the weight on the bow at the 28” mark.
Got the bug bad!
What do you think?
Josh
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 23, 2011 04:37 PM:
I'd like to see bow option #1. Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 23, 2011 04:42 PM:
josh - ultimately, it's yer bow and yer call. if you have a true 29"
draw, a 70" length will be noticeably smoother when pulling string. my
68" big 5 with caramelized boo and string follow is a tad under 55@29
and pulls ok, but i shudda got it at 70". hmmm, i hear the classifieds
calling ....
personally, i prefer all boo for the limbs and i'm liking the caramelized flavor even better.
i
just ordered a tembo blank, 70", 47@ 29 (knowing full well the bow will
finish well over 50#), tillered to 30", caramelized boo limbs, slight
string follow, clear glass, plain reinforced ends, cocobolo riser. will
install a connexion hinge.
the fun never ends, as it should be Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on February 23, 2011 04:54 PM:
Isn't the Cheetah made of Juniper and bamboo?
Personally, I like the looks of plain bamboo under clear glass, and think that it isn't too gaudy for the bush at all.
And,
going for the 70" bow was the best thing I ever did to improve my
ability with Hills. However, I jumped from 66" to 70", without ever
trying the 68". The 70" bow is fine in the bush - no problems.
Posted by Kevin L. (Member # 4270) on February 23, 2011 05:07 PM:
Ben, you're right. A Cheetah is Juniper and bamboo. All yew is a Redman and yew and bamboo is a halfbreed.
Posted by Oliverstacy (Member # 13039) on February 23, 2011 05:32 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Kevin L.: Ben, you're right. A Cheetah is Juniper and bamboo. All yew is a Redman and yew and bamboo is a halfbreed.
I
knew whatever I picked was going to be wrong...didn't have the site in
front of me and thought the Redman was the Juniper and the Cheetah was
the yew.
So option #2 would be the Redman...sorry about that! I'm going to get edit that!
quote:josh
- ultimately, it's yer bow and yer call. if you have a true 29" draw, a
70" length will be noticeably smoother when pulling string. my 68" big 5
with caramelized boo and string follow is a tad under 55@29 and pulls
ok, but i shudda got it at 70". hmmm, i hear the classifieds calling
....
Rob...I
do draw to 29 to 29.5 if I remember to hit anchor...my shooting
accuracy suffers if I short draw so I know when I'm not hitting my
anchor. Concentrating on a full draw with good back tension helps me
shoot the best!
Josh
Posted by Kevin L. (Member # 4270) on February 23, 2011 05:34 PM:
Josh, don't sweat it. I have to write down little things like my address and phone #, but I have the Hill lineup memorized
Kevin
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on February 23, 2011 05:38 PM:
Oliver, definitely go 70" length.
Posted by Oliverstacy (Member # 13039) on February 23, 2011 06:09 PM:
quote:Originally posted by David Mitchell: Oliver, definitely go 70" length.
I have a 66" Cumberland and if I go with 70" it's going to be a 2-piece!
Josh
Posted by MikeM (Member # 5117) on February 23, 2011 06:10 PM:
Ditto on going with the 70" length
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on February 23, 2011 08:13 PM:
Josh, by your draw your right in the middle of the two lengths so i'm
going to offer something different. Some folks are fine going longer,
and others are perfectly happy going shorter. If you can't shoot both
lengths then I would suggest that you think seriously about which is
most important to you in this bow, smoothness (70") or performance (68")
then make your choice accordingly. When it all comes down to it, either
will work JMHO!
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on February 23, 2011 08:16 PM:
Oliverstacy-
I spoke with Craig a few months ago about a Myrtle
riser. Craig has plain Myrtle, not the burl or fiddleback fancy stuff.
You might want to order the fancy Myrtle and have it shipped to Craig. I
think he said he needed 18x2x2.
Darren
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on February 23, 2011 09:03 PM:
Just sold one of my old Widows, trying to figure out what to get to go
with my Wesley and Big 5. Thinking about a Redman, comments welcome
about this all Yew bow.
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on February 23, 2011 09:34 PM:
I love my Redman ! But I also just got a t/d Rhino that is a sweet shooter . I
thinks perhaps though that the Robin Hood Special Ed is the pic of the
bunch . It just shoots so very very nice ... Some lovely Yew with a
backing of 'boo . sweeeetttt!!!!!
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 23, 2011 09:44 PM:
quote:Originally posted by SpankyNeal:
Josh, by your draw your right in the middle of the two lengths so i'm
going to offer something different. Some folks are fine going longer,
and others are perfectly happy going shorter. If you can't shoot both
lengths then I would suggest that you think seriously about which is
most important to you in this bow, smoothness (70") or performance (68")
then make your choice accordingly. When it all comes down to it, either
will work JMHO!
*********
Just a thought - Craig is making mine at 69". Guess you could do that...
I
don't have the experience to share on whether or not sure that one
inch would make a difference either say but I learned within this thread
that it could so, with my draw at 29" I opted for 69"er.
Obviously, the consensus here has always been to go longer if there is any question.
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on February 23, 2011 09:55 PM:
Hmmm, lot a choices! How does all yew compare to all bamboo. My Wesley
is 4/boo lams with a lam of yew on the back and very smooth. The Big 5
is all boo w/string follow . Both shoot great but the Big 5 is 6#
heavier (61@28) and my favorite to shoot.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 23, 2011 10:02 PM:
though there are exceptions, for the most part i agree about the bow
length for 29" - you can easily get by with 68", but there can be a tad
more smoothness at the last inch with a 70" length. dunno that you can
feel that at 69". i think these little nitty gritty things come down to
the bowyer, you, and ... luck.
Posted by Joe Subler (Member # 8721) on February 23, 2011 11:01 PM:
I've always wondered, and maybe someone can answer, if combining
different woods on bow limbs kinda defeats the purpose of the core lams.
For instance, on a Cheetah with 2 bamboo lams and 2 juniper lams, will
the juniper (as beautiful as it may be) take away some of the
smoothness/performance of the bamboo since the juniper has different
characteristics from the bamboo?
Cheers Joe
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on February 23, 2011 11:37 PM:
Aside from maybe Osage I have never noticed any difference in how any of the woods shoot . Bamboo seems to have a feel of its own and after many years I have come to prefer shooting yew, elm and osage over 'boo . Mixing
and matching seems to make no diffrence to me but some bowyers will add
that mixing woods etc ain't a good thing and prefer single species /
type and glass rather than the mix and match . My halfbreed sure does shoot nice but !
Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on February 24, 2011 12:02 AM:
Blueridge,Today the delivery man brought a "Long Box" to the door.It is
in my opinion THE nicest looking longbow I have ever seen.A HH Red
Cheetah,Yew cores with Juniper veneers,Cocobolo Riser and tips ,It has
an antique look and is absolutely stunning.Shes 66",56@28" with a slight
string follow and smooth as Butta.Check out the Yew and juniper combo.
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 24, 2011 12:14 AM:
Steve, without pics, I just can't believe ya! Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on February 24, 2011 12:47 AM:
Tw I'll send em to you tommorrow as I'm computer challanged ! (Spelling too!)I know you'll post for all to enjoy !LOL.
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on February 24, 2011 02:07 AM:
Nice Steve ... looking foward to pics , great sounding combo !
Posted by GingivitisKahn (Member # 13331) on February 24, 2011 06:51 AM:
Yep - that's a pretty flimsy description. Better show us some pics just to be safe. Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on February 24, 2011 07:57 AM:
Pics Sent to TW for posting.I just had Spine Surgery three weeks ago and
am not suppose to even string my bows,according to my Dr., the
Surgeon,My wife,My son and daughter. ( My God she draws Smooth !)To things I don't do well LISTEN and work a Computer !LOL
Posted by Kevin L. (Member # 4270) on February 24, 2011 08:01 AM:
Ooohh! That sounds like a nice combo Steve. Can't wait to see it. Can
you give us more info on the "antique" finish? I've had the matte and
hand-polished gloss, but I never heard of this one.
Kevin
Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on February 24, 2011 08:18 AM:
Kevin,I don't think its the finish (Matte) as much as its the matching
of the Wood combos.The Cocobolo riser blending with the Juniper limbs
and Yew cores.I notice reg. bamboo is very white and compared to the Yew
looks very Bright and New looking.The grain of the Juniper skins is
just fantastic,no camera can capture that look.
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on February 24, 2011 08:27 AM:
Can't wait to see her Steve,don't mess your back up though . Leaning toward a Redman, all yew, don't really need another bow but this will be something different. Rob I can't believe you are selling that beauty of a bow!!
Posted by Kevin L. (Member # 4270) on February 24, 2011 08:46 AM:
OK, I gotcha. Sounds like a nice combo, can't wait to see it.
Posted by far rider (Member # 14108) on February 24, 2011 09:09 AM:
Haven't seen the Cheetah done with Yew cores, I'm intrigued! Sounds very nice. T.
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 24, 2011 12:42 PM:
Sorry for the delay folks. We had a dumping of snow which is unusual for
my area. Been out with the son playing. Steve's Red Cheetah
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 24, 2011 12:43 PM:
Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on February 24, 2011 01:00 PM:
Tw,Thanks a million my friend,Iowe you !
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on February 24, 2011 01:11 PM:
that is a great looking bow, is that a locator grip?
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 24, 2011 01:44 PM:
Not at all Steve. That bow sure is a beaut! Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 24, 2011 02:11 PM:
beautiful bow for sure!
Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on February 24, 2011 02:11 PM:
Blue,yes its a locator grip,fits like a glove,like I said pics don't do this bow justice, it is stunning.
Posted by Blake Dustin Adams (Member # 11826) on February 24, 2011 02:16 PM:
You guys are killing me. I already bought three bows this year and now I
want another two or three. Just got a Paxton Talon as my first D-bow
but haven't had a chance to take it out. Now I'm really wanting a combo
of a Redman and a Crocodile. Also a Black Cougar would be nice, you
know Black Locust instead of Honey locust.
It's all murder on my
bank account as I'm saving to take my girlfriend on vacation while I'm
stationed over here. I gotta say she's great though. We were talking
about our faults last week and I mentioned wanting bows. She asked if
there was something I wanted right then. "Yeah" I said, "buy it" she
said. I think I need to marry her, plus she wants to shoot with me, bow
buying for her too. I'd be maybe too lucky.
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on February 24, 2011 02:19 PM:
Ha! Marry the girl ASAP. Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on February 24, 2011 04:16 PM:
Sounds like a great girl, Blake!
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on February 24, 2011 04:18 PM:
Nice bow, Steve!
Posted by OPRick (Member # 5480) on February 24, 2011 04:32 PM:
Holy Moley - 91 pages! Who'd a' thought? Great stuff and beautiful bows.
Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on February 24, 2011 05:06 PM:
Thanks Ben,Its all those pctures of you,your mates and all that hunting
that got me stoked again with these bows.Memories of simpiler times and
the way things should be ,so glad to be back aboard.
Posted by cacciatore (Member # 17855) on February 24, 2011 05:14 PM:
Congrats Steve,very nice HH.I love Juniper veneers,I think those are native from MT.
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on February 24, 2011 05:16 PM:
Steve ... wow mate ! I knew it would look nice but ... just awesome ... Now we need some pics afield eh !
Posted by far rider (Member # 14108) on February 24, 2011 06:38 PM:
Man, sweet combo! Really sharp bow.
Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on February 24, 2011 06:55 PM:
Ben,Iwould love to be in the field right now,most days in my mind I'm
there,but spine Surgery 3 weeks ago is kind of slowing it down,plus
today was -39 degrees,It'll come !
Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on February 24, 2011 06:58 PM:
Felix,lots of Juniper in Alberta and British Columbia where I'm from
along with Yew,thats why these two combos.I remember years ago hunting
with my Dad and he'd point out the differant trees,lots of memories !My
friend we have so much to talk about around a campfire !LOL
Posted by Cookus (Member # 17834) on February 24, 2011 10:10 PM:
That's a beautiful bow Steve! I wish you well in your recovery... Take
your time! Look forward to finding the perfect shaft... You've got a
wonderful spring ahead!
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 24, 2011 10:29 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Steve Clandinin:
Thanks Ben,Its all those pctures of you,your mates and all that hunting
that got me stoked again with these bows.Memories of simpiler times and
the way things should be ,so glad to be back aboard.
"simpler times and the way things should be" Exactly my feeling! This is refreshing!!
Steve, hoping for the best regarding your recovery - take your time, you'll be rompin around the woods before you know it!
Posted by far rider (Member # 14108) on February 24, 2011 10:55 PM:
Look what showed up at the post office today!
Half Breed! Boo and Yew, what's not to love. I'll try to get a better pic tomorrow.
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on February 24, 2011 11:02 PM:
HH Archery sure has been busy building Some beautiful bows!!
Posted by far rider (Member # 14108) on February 24, 2011 11:10 PM:
Like most of mine, I bought it second hand, but this one is as new as it
can be for a used bow. I just couldn't pass it by. It's a sickness! I
wonder if there is a 12 step for Hill owners?
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on February 24, 2011 11:14 PM:
I look every day for left hand hill bows.Im sick
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on February 24, 2011 11:25 PM:
Nice going Far Rider !
My first Hill was a halfbreed and day in day out it has managed to take game all over Australia ...
Awesome choice !
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 24, 2011 11:27 PM:
Far Rider,"It's a sickness! I wonder if there is a 12 step for Hill owners?"
If there is such a program I might be in need of a sponsor...lol
God bless,Mudd
PS:
Would someone please post some pictures of ugly Hills so all of these
beauty's that have been being posted lately can be flushed from my
brain. I could also use some kind of moisture absorption stuff to dry out the drool from my keyboard..lol
Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on February 24, 2011 11:52 PM:
Far Rider,that is one nice stick! I always thought that would be a great
combo,sorta the best of both worlds,All the best with her.
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on February 25, 2011 03:24 AM:
Nice one, FR!
Posted by GingivitisKahn (Member # 13331) on February 25, 2011 06:31 AM:
quote:Originally posted by longbowben: I look every day for left hand hill bows.Im sick
That's a very specific malady. Bet there's no name for it. I name it Longbowben's Disease. Tada!
Posted by Kevin L. (Member # 4270) on February 25, 2011 08:15 AM:
quote:Originally posted by far rider: I wonder if there is a 12 step for Hill owners?
Lordy, I hope not. It's way too much fun being sick!
Posted by SpankyNeal (Member # 11151) on February 25, 2011 08:40 AM:
Two beautiful new Hills...congrats guys! I'll have one to show here pretty soon...I'm really starting to get itchy for this one!
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on February 25, 2011 10:06 AM:
I'm with Kevin....if there's a cure for this PLEASE don't tell me about it. Longbowben, you better act fast if you see a used lefty Hill because I'm watchin' too. Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on February 25, 2011 01:44 PM:
TW-
The bow is really nice, I like the cocobola riser on the
cheetah. It also looks like you got the gloss finish. I had Craig put
gloss on my last Hill, the grain in the wood really pops.
Darren
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 25, 2011 02:04 PM:
Darren, that's Steve Clandinin's bow. Not mine. I just helped out so
that others could see it. In fact, he didn't read the fine line where I
get first dibs on all Red Cheetahs that I have to post! Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on February 25, 2011 02:13 PM:
This is getting out of hand !! someone make me stop !! LB Ben and Dave, you aren't the only lefty's on the prowl.
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on February 25, 2011 03:20 PM:
Blueridge and LongbowBen--maybe we should set up a system as to who gets
to go first when one comes up. I know, let's do it by member number,
yeah, that would work for me; how about you guys? Lowest number gets
first dibs! Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on February 25, 2011 05:07 PM:
Tw gets first dibs on my bow...BUT... I hope hes not holding his breath
gonna be a long time !LOL.In all honesty they all have such a unique
look ,thats why guys like us keep buying them.So many combinations.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 25, 2011 05:36 PM:
the madness continues, just ordered a 2nd tembo. Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 25, 2011 05:40 PM:
Steve, I was just razzin ya! 66" is to short for me anyway. I hope she bring you many hours of shooting enjoyment.
Rob, is this one gonna be a 1pc?
Posted by Oliverstacy (Member # 13039) on February 25, 2011 05:40 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano: the madness continues, just ordered a 2nd tembo.
Congrats...I'm very close to ordering!
I'll call tomorrow and see if I can pull the trigger.
What did he say the current wait time was?
Josh
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 25, 2011 05:41 PM:
Josh, they are not open on Sat.
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 25, 2011 05:45 PM:
it's a 1pc tembo, 70", 50@28, candy boo under clear glass, string
follow, plain tips, coco riser, locator handle, black laced grip.
wait time is now 5-6 weeks - and counting.
the tembo blank is due to me inside 3 weeks.
plus another 'hawk t/d ordered as well.
yeah, the fun just never ends ...... Posted by far rider (Member # 14108) on February 25, 2011 06:34 PM:
WOW, This has been a pretty good thread for Hill buying, selling or in my case.....buying! Rob, Mudd myself and a few others are considering a support group called HillLongbowManiacsR-Us anonymous! You in?
Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on February 25, 2011 06:56 PM:
Might as well sign us all up,I'm sure we've all done crazier things! LOL
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on February 25, 2011 06:58 PM:
Rob...haha ! I am going to try a new one with the same grip as you
ordered . I'm normally a straight grip fella but if I can get a well
rounded one I can see it gracing a new Redman or crocodile ...
I'll call them this week , those new sponsors of ours !
I am thinking a new Redman or Crocodile 66" 55# @ 27 " no limb tips ....
Mmmmmm ?
Posted by stik&string (Member # 18418) on February 25, 2011 07:19 PM:
Wow guys I thought I got it bad as I just ordered a Robin Hood. Craig
told me about 5 weeks, and I also like the looks of Rob's grip so I
ordered that as well. Jeez maybe I need the support group too.
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on February 25, 2011 07:24 PM:
Stik, you will love the Robin Hood ... man is it a sweet shooter ! I am tempted to order another one .
Posted by RC (Member # 162) on February 25, 2011 07:25 PM:
I`ve decided with my Wifes prodding to send my Big 5 to Craig and get a
weight reduction as its a bit to stout for me. I`m also gonna get him to
turn the straight grip into a slight locator like the one Rob had
posted of his.I had thought about swapping with Brother Mudd..actually
decided to swap then changed my mind. Sorry Brother I`m gonna keep this
one a bit but thank You for your trouble. Should get it back in a couple
of weeks. Just in time whack a swamp rooster.
Is this thread
some sort of a "record"? We are all sick. Nothing a big gathering around
a campfire for a few nights and some trips through the swamp will not
heal though....RC
Posted by GMASIUK (Member # 12175) on February 25, 2011 07:48 PM:
I just ordered a new Tembo today also! It's gonna be a long 5 weeks. It
should have a different look. At least I haven't seen one with this
combo.
Glen
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 25, 2011 07:54 PM:
you guyz will LOVE the new locator - totally revamped and no longer that dang wedge-in-the-hand, she's all nice and rounded REAL COMFY.
Posted by GMASIUK (Member # 12175) on February 25, 2011 07:54 PM:
I know what ya mean Rob, bows coming in from all directions. Two weeks
ago I received another BW PCHX, yesterday my lost creek Life-Ender
showed up and, in 5 weeks a new Hill Tembo! So many bows and so little
time.
Glen
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 25, 2011 08:20 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano: the madness continues, just ordered a 2nd tembo.
LOL!!
Stark ravin' madmen...every one of you! A pitiful but happy group...slurrp...
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on February 25, 2011 08:53 PM:
Dave, I don't think that is a good idea at all. You have more than I do!
Posted by Ben Kleinig (Member # 10583) on February 25, 2011 08:56 PM:
Yep, that new shape to the locator has grown on me, and I really like it.
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on February 25, 2011 10:38 PM:
I sent mine back to get the locator grip.Now im having problems
sleeping.Man i didnt think thier was that many leftys looking for HH
bows Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on February 25, 2011 11:14 PM:
That locator grip is the cats meow.My hand just fell into the grip.
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 26, 2011 03:56 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Ben Kleinig: Yep, that new shape to the locator has grown on me, and I really like it.
Ben, did you have to ask specially for the "new and improved" locator?
I
gave Craig some pretty good dimensions to work with because I have very
large hands and ordered a the locator but did not know there was "lack
of pointy" option..
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 26, 2011 05:28 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Tony Van Dort:
quote:Originally posted by Ben Kleinig: Yep, that new shape to the locator has grown on me, and I really like it.
Ben, did you have to ask specially for the "new and improved" locator?
I
gave Craig some pretty good dimensions to work with because I have very
large hands and ordered a the locator but did not know there was "lack
of pointy" option..
the "new and improved" rounded grip is now the standard. no more pointy-wedge-teardrop. amen.
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 26, 2011 05:52 AM:
Cool! (amen) I never had to experience that displeasure..
BTW,
has any of your recent Hills been string follow? And if so, have you
been able to shoot enough to get a feel for the difference?
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 26, 2011 05:57 AM:
as i've noted elsewhere ...
"there is a feeling on the release
with string follow longbows that i can only best describe as 'soft' and
'forgiving'. some like it, some don't - most do. i do, too."
is
string follow slower than backset/reflex? probably. didn't notice that
in a big5 comparison (both 68" and 50#, string follow and backset) @ 27
yards.
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 26, 2011 06:49 AM:
Yeah, I remember reading the first part recently...must have missed the "comparison" thing..
Thanks Rob!
Posted by canopyboy (Member # 24537) on February 26, 2011 08:55 AM:
Wow, looks like there was another round of bow buying. Some of you guys are ordering machines! Rob, I'm looking your way....
Can I ask people to post how many Hills they own/ordered?
I'm at 1/0. (And thinking there's something wrong....)
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on February 26, 2011 09:09 AM:
I own five and have none on order (at the moment)! Posted by Two Tracks (Member # 19120) on February 26, 2011 09:10 AM:
I am at 1/0(/and one on the design table). I have a really nice Northern Mist Classic 57#@30"
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 26, 2011 09:22 AM:
2/2
Posted by mysticguido (Member # 4426) on February 26, 2011 09:32 AM:
I only have a Jerry Hill if that counts.. Shoots really Nice for Me..
Posted by canopyboy (Member # 24537) on February 26, 2011 09:33 AM:
Aw Rob, I was thinking bigger than that. So is this a new sickness, or are you just good at passing along the older ones?
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 26, 2011 09:40 AM:
quote:Originally posted by mysticguido: I only have a Jerry Hill if that counts.. Shoots really Nice for Me..
Don't fool yourself buddy, you are just as sick as the rest of us...lol Congratulations!
God bless,Mudd
Posted by mysticguido (Member # 4426) on February 26, 2011 09:43 AM:
quote:Originally posted by Mudd:
quote:Originally posted by mysticguido: I only have a Jerry Hill if that counts.. Shoots really Nice for Me..
Don't fool yourself buddy, you are just as sick as the rest of us...lol Congratulations!
God bless,Mudd
Thanx Sir Mudd, I feel Better Now..
Posted by far rider (Member # 14108) on February 26, 2011 10:00 AM:
5/1
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 26, 2011 10:00 AM:
quote:Originally posted by canopyboy: Aw Rob, I was thinking bigger than that. So is this a new sickness, or are you just good at passing along the older ones?
over
the decades i can count at least 7 hill longbows, not counting the 2
coming. in the short and long runs, you only need and can shoot one at a
time. the rest are part of the journey and obsession.
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 26, 2011 10:03 AM:
Well spoken Rob!
Posted by far rider (Member # 14108) on February 26, 2011 10:07 AM:
I started my journey Rob just trying different bows, with different
draws as a trial to get the combo that fit me. Then I ordered the bow I
shoot the most often.....problem is, I'm having a hard time selling the
others! I do so love grabbing a different one down occasionally just for
a change of pace. I think I should have built a smaller bow rack, then
I'd have to sell one to get one!
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 26, 2011 10:13 AM:
quote:Originally posted by far rider: .....problem
is, I'm having a hard time selling the others! I do so love grabbing a
different one down occasionally just for a change of pace. I think I
should have built a smaller bow rack, then I'd have to sell one to get
one!
I found that my bow rack is just too far away so I'm right now using two couches, they seem to hold plenty.
Once
the weather changes I will go back to hanging them along the edge of
the shop overhang so I can shoot whichever one grabs my eye.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on February 26, 2011 10:59 AM:
1/0,
I sold 2 Hill bows,now I only have one. I'm trying to be a
one bow guy, but I'am having a little problem because I've been
thinking, and thinking, and thinking, and dreaming, and dreaming and
dreaming, and fantasizing, and fantasizing and fantasizing about a
stringfollow Tembo. Oh my God, I'm addicted...
Hello my name is Darren and I'm a Hill enthusiast, And I love it!!
Posted by Wannabe1 (Member # 7774) on February 26, 2011 11:04 AM:
I have 5 now and none on order. I've gone through 3 already so, 8 total in my bow career. Posted by Archer 1 (Member # 5446) on February 26, 2011 11:20 AM:
I've had the sickness for a long time now, and there is no cure. I only have one Big Five 68" 60#@28" right now, but have 7 other hill style bows, and shoot them all. Thinking about a 66" Hill at about 55#@28 Just don't know which one yet. I'll figure it out, sooner or later. Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on February 26, 2011 11:22 AM:
I only have two for now Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on February 26, 2011 11:23 AM:
1/0 for me. Just swapped a Mist this past weekend that was too light for
me or I would be at 2. Picked up a 68" Dwyer classic for it. Waiting
for my Wesley to get back as we speak. Had a piece of glass crack on
the upper limb. Craig says it must have been a weak spot. Craig took
good care of me and didn't bat an eye about fixing it. I wasn't sweating
it,things happen. Just hate not having my bow to shoot.
I do LOVE that locator grip on my bow!
Posted by Steve Clandinin (Member # 17084) on February 26, 2011 11:23 AM:
John,I bit the bullet Awhile back and ordered a new HHill in your exact specs.Yew and Juniper,Beautiful bow.Just Do It ! LOL
Posted by leatherneck (Member # 11436) on February 26, 2011 11:26 AM:
I've actually been thinking about the woods for my next bow. I'm leaning
toward Tulipwood veneers with Ebony handle. I love me some Tulipwood!
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on February 26, 2011 11:43 AM:
I can see a Cheetah in my future.With string follow and some extras.
Posted by GMASIUK (Member # 12175) on February 26, 2011 12:17 PM:
I've owned 8, and have a new one on order hopefully this is the last one! YA right! LOL
Posted by Oliverstacy (Member # 13039) on February 26, 2011 12:35 PM:
If I order (and I'm almost certain I'm going to...today’s overtime is
helping sway my decision) I want to get a 2-piece. Calling Monday when
they open back up.
Can you still get a dished or locator grip with the 2-piece sleeve or will I need to get the standard?
I don't have huge hands and I'm worried about the finished grip size.
Looking
at a grey glass Wesley Special…caramelized boo, Snakewood riser/tip
overlays with laced wrap…probably 70” and about 52-54 @ 29”
Thanks,
Josh
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on February 26, 2011 12:45 PM:
Oliverstacy, are you sure you want to cover up that gorgeous carmelized
boo with gray glass? I have a gray glass Hill with ebony riser--cool
bow, but if I got the carmelized boo I would only get the gray on one
side and let that candy lam show on the other--just my thoughts. Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 26, 2011 01:06 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Oliverstacy: If
I order (and I'm almost certain I'm going to...today’s overtime is
helping sway my decision) I want to get a 2-piece. Calling Monday when
they open back up.
Can you still get a dished or locator grip with the 2-piece sleeve or will I need to get the standard?
the
t/d sleeve is only a straight grip, no locator or dished. this is one
reason i'm cutting a tembo blank in half and installing a connexion
hinge.
I don't have huge hands and I'm worried about the finished grip size.
if
the ordered weight is 55# or under, get the small sleeve. better yet,
get a 1pc - too many issues with oval metal sleeves, been there, done
that, won't do it again. the connexion is the better t/d answer for all
american flatbows.
Looking at a grey glass Wesley
Special…caramelized boo, Snakewood riser/tip overlays with laced
wrap…probably 70” and about 52-54 @ 29”
gray glass over candy boo??? seriously rethink that, josh!!!
Thanks,
Josh
Posted by Oliverstacy (Member # 13039) on February 26, 2011 01:37 PM:
quote:Originally posted by Rob DiStefano:
quote:Originally posted by Oliverstacy: If
I order (and I'm almost certain I'm going to...today’s overtime is
helping sway my decision) I want to get a 2-piece. Calling Monday when
they open back up.
Can you still get a dished or locator grip with the 2-piece sleeve or will I need to get the standard?
the
t/d sleeve is only a straight grip, no locator or dished. this is one
reason i'm cutting a tembo blank in half and installing a connexion
hinge.
I don't have huge hands and I'm worried about the finished grip size.
if
the ordered weight is 55# or under, get the small sleeve. better yet,
get a 1pc - too many issues with oval metal sleeves, been there, done
that, won't do it again. the connexion is the better t/d answer for all
american flatbows.
Looking at a grey glass Wesley
Special…caramelized boo, Snakewood riser/tip overlays with laced
wrap…probably 70” and about 52-54 @ 29”
gray glass over candy boo??? seriously rethink that, josh!!!
Thanks,
Josh
Okay
so I'll put everything back in the mental hopper and reevaluate
everything…I just don’t want the edges of the boo to be bright like they
normally are, can they just dull the edges of the boo?
I wish
they offered a Connexion hinge…I also agree this is the best one for the
job! One reason I’m hesitant in ordering a HH over a Northern
Mist…Steve uses a hinge.
Josh
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on February 26, 2011 06:04 PM:
Oliverstacy, here is a photo of my Hill Big Five string follow bow in
gray glass and ebony riser. If you don't want the clear bamboo to show
this light, I would ask Craig to stain it to either match the riser
color or the gray. By the way, like all the bows I've ordered from HH,
this one is marked 48@28 but is 51@28. They have all come out 3-4#
heavier than marked.
Posted by Oliverstacy (Member # 13039) on February 26, 2011 06:46 PM:
quote:Originally posted by David Mitchell:
Oliverstacy, here is a photo of my Hill Big Five string follow bow in
gray glass and ebony riser. If you don't want the clear bamboo to show
this light, I would ask Craig to stain it to either match the riser
color or the gray. By the way, like all the bows I've ordered from HH,
this one is marked 48@28 but is 51@28. They have all come out 3-4#
heavier than marked.
I remember that one from the many pages of this thread...awesome looking bow!
Josh
Posted by sou-pawbowhunter (Member # 11815) on February 26, 2011 08:07 PM:
Oh my! Here I am with my one Jerry Hill, looking at all these beautiful
bows thinking about different riser and glass combinations. Tell me,
is it too late for me to get help, or do I just call Craig and start on
the list? Posted by far rider (Member # 14108) on February 26, 2011 08:24 PM:
This is one of the reasons I love Hills, so many combos, there is something for everyone.
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on February 26, 2011 08:57 PM:
3/0 a Wesley , Big 5 and one I bought 15 years ago a Free Spirit. Does anyone remember that bowyer?
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 26, 2011 09:40 PM:
OliverStacy wrote:
"Okay so I'll put everything back in the
mental hopper and reevaluate everything…I just don’t want the edges of
the boo to be bright like they normally are, can they just dull the
edges of the boo?"
**********
Josh, I also do not like the
brightness of the boo and that is the main reason I chose caramelized
(also blends better with the two lams of yew in the core). The
caramelized boo does not cost you a penny more and it looks good covered
and/or exposed under clear glass.
Upon seeing how pretty the
"candy boo" looked, I opted to put the belly under clear glass and cover
the back with Black glass but could have just as easily covered it and
would have been happy.
Have Craig build it just the way you envision it...that is the beauty of this process.
Looking forward to the pic
As
a side note, I just got an email from Craig telling me the bow will
ship in just a few days! That is less than three weeks from the my
initial contact with him.. Love the service, can't wait to shoot it!
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on February 26, 2011 09:41 PM:
sou-pawbowhunter, yes, you're too far gone. There is no treatment at
this point that will cure the marvelous affliction. Just go ahead and
call Dr. Craig Ekin at Howard Hill Archery and he can give you the
medicine that will at least ease your pain for a while. But like other
narcotic potions, it wears off before long and you have to have another
fix. Posted by WESTBROOK (Member # 8854) on February 26, 2011 10:38 PM:
Another beauty David! How come everyone else has their shelf on the wrong side?
Eric
Posted by tg2nd (Member # 16218) on February 27, 2011 03:00 AM:
Own 6 and 2 on order.
Posted by David Mitchell (Member # 85) on February 27, 2011 07:13 AM:
Eric, maybe they just don't know any better. Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 27, 2011 07:56 AM:
I'm trying one of Capt. Dick's hill style bows that can be shot either way.
That's right, no shelf just shoot off your knuckle like a self bow.
I hope it's like riding a bicycle...lol
It's
been a while since I've shot any of my selfbows so it may take a few
shots to find the right spine wt for my arrows and to get the old hair
covered computer to make it's adjustments.
I know that what Straitera says is true "Trad is 60% mental & about 40% mental"...lol
Anyway
if the rain stops today I'm going to try to get outside after church
with "Chocolate Moose" and see if I can hit anything.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 27, 2011 09:00 AM:
Have fun Mudd! Don't drain your "mental" too much... Posted by far rider (Member # 14108) on February 27, 2011 09:07 PM:
Interesting Mdd. Pics?
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 27, 2011 09:29 PM:
I haven't taken any pictures but I will if it ever quits raining.
My indoor pictures stink at their very best.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by stik&string (Member # 18418) on February 27, 2011 10:23 PM:
Mudd, I like the new photo!!!
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 28, 2011 12:47 AM:
quote:Originally posted by stik&string: Mudd, I like the new photo!!!
*************
Me too!! Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on February 28, 2011 08:46 AM:
Hey Gang-
I have several books from Hill, and when I seen this
rare picture the other day I thought this was the best closeup pic that I
have seen of Howards form. I just wanted to share with it with guys,
Hope you enjoy it.
Darren
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 28, 2011 08:49 AM:
that pic tells the full story of how a man who should be using a 30" arrow shoots 28" instead.
also, notice how he "aims the arrow", from his eye, to the string, to the nock, to the point, to the mark.
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 28, 2011 09:01 AM:
Timely.... Thanks for posting!
Rob spent some time with me yesterday on this exact form...A picture IS worth a thousand words..
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 28, 2011 09:28 AM:
I now have a new desktop background.
It will serve as a great reminder to myself.
Thank you tradlongbow for sharing that one!
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 28, 2011 09:34 AM:
the above image should be a constant reminder of just how great an
archer howard hill was when he handicapped himself by adapting his
physique to the arrow instead of doing it correctly the other way
around. though the aiming technique is spot on, it should not be a
poster for overall correct archery form!
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 28, 2011 09:42 AM:
That didn't last long...lol It just hit me after I went away from this thread..
I said to myself..."Hey I just changed my desktop and... maybe I learned something.
I really did...now Brindlee and I are my new desktop background.
Oh I saved Howard but I'd much rather look at Brindle more frequently than him.
"Priorities!"
God bless,Mudd
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 28, 2011 09:49 AM:
Posted by coyote1956 (Member # 13369) on February 28, 2011 11:14 AM:
Howard is proof that if you are consistant you can be good at it!
Posted by Kelly (Member # 1777) on February 28, 2011 11:44 AM:
quote:Originally posted by tradlongbow: Hey Gang-
I
have several books from Hill, and when I seen this rare picture the
other day I thought this was the best closeup pic that I have seen of
Howards form. I just wanted to share with it with guys, Hope you enjoy
it.
Darren
Please
note the bow Howard is using. That is an carmelized bamboo
backed/bamboo bellied bow. Everyone on the other thread was wondering
what a Convex/concave bow looks like. Well there it is.
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on February 28, 2011 11:54 AM:
Rob, what is the correct archery form?
Posted by longbowben (Member # 13980) on February 28, 2011 12:09 PM:
This is going to get interesting.Just talked to Jason my bow is mailing out today Posted by sunset hill (Member # 2674) on February 28, 2011 12:25 PM:
Great Photo!
Howard adapted his form to the equipment of the day,
but more importantly, he adapted his form for the needs of a hunting
archer...meaning he was very fluid and not 'locked out'. This helped
him make moving shots as well as stationary shots and all the trick
shots inbetween. He was not a static target archer in the sense of the
term. You can see photos of Larry Hughes and others at that time who
have what is commonly termed today as target form.
Howard also
was left eye dominate, which blows away the concept that your dominate
eye has to be over the arrow and lined up with the string. This photo
shows how large and intense his left eye would stare at the target.
Schulz commentated on this fact quite a bit.
Posted by Swamp Yankee (Member # 4917) on February 28, 2011 12:30 PM:
How in the world did anyone shoot "correctly" before the days of online forums like this...
Posted by tradlongbow (Member # 1620) on February 28, 2011 12:51 PM:
Nate-
I'm glad you chimed in. I thought the picture of the bow
was interesting because it looks like the nodes are somewhat raised on
the back of the bow and as noted by Kelly the bamboo seems to be
stained.
This is the first time that I have noticed Howard's fingers exposed while drawing the string. It must be just for the photo.
Darren
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 28, 2011 12:59 PM:
Here's "The Mirkat" and Wilson with one of Snags beautiful 4 fletched arrows.
"Mirkat" is 66" and 55@28. Cheetah with diamondback skins.
God bless,Mudd
Posted by pavan (Member # 21538) on February 28, 2011 01:04 PM:
He was probably practicing his Jay Kidwell technique on his wife's
favorite chair. Like Mudd apparently does in his backyard. He would
never let go without an arm guard on, his bows had really low brace
heights. I would enjoy hearing some trad gang style analysis of that
form.
Posted by chupa (Member # 17556) on February 28, 2011 01:30 PM:
Posted by Mudd (Member # 184) on February 28, 2011 01:32 PM:
Pavan"Like Mudd apparently does in his backyard."
Huh? What" Did I do something?...lol
God bless,Mudd
Posted by coyote1956 (Member # 13369) on February 28, 2011 01:41 PM:
when Howard's Eye got big lookout!!! now thats funny
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 28, 2011 01:54 PM:
"correct archery form" always has, and always will be, the form that's most consistent for you, not me, and not anyone else.
with
that said, if you truly have a 30" draw length that works yer deltoids,
don't hunker down, lean forward into the bow, and shoot a 28" arrow -
what, you think yer a howard hill???
aim
however ya like, but do consider and try "aiming the arrow" - it's a
very positive alignment process/method. you don't directly look at the
arrow, it's part is strictly to get your "gray bow sight" (brain)
centered on the mark for left/right. then set the trajectory with yer
bow hand.
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on February 28, 2011 01:56 PM:
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on February 28, 2011 01:57 PM:
That face was for Howards "big eye"
Posted by Blueridge (Member # 24304) on February 28, 2011 02:04 PM:
maybe he did that to be able to shoot 90-100lbs for as long as he did? It sure did work for him though.
Posted by pavan (Member # 21538) on February 28, 2011 02:06 PM:
Hey Mudd that couch cushion has the same pattern as ours did. I offered
to turn it into a target, but my wife insisted that we give the couch
away to someone that needed it. It would have made a fine target. If it
worked for Hill, there is a strong possibility that the same form could
work for someone else as well. It did for me. 99 pages
Posted by Ben Maher (Member # 5543) on February 28, 2011 03:15 PM:
"aiming the arrow " as Rob puts it is sort of how I do it . a very quick
way to get the arrow consistently where it needs to be ... as long as
your bow hand is solid . I think of it is a sort of pre shot aiming
combined at the shot " bore a hole through it " instinctive .
as
for the dominant eye ... i grew up shooting right handed , killed a lot
of animals as a youngster doing it that way until i began competing with
sights . The guy at the pro shop giggled as i drew back my first new
bow with sights on it ... "you can't close your right eye if shooting
right handed " he giggled ... I went home with a brand new useless
bow, too embarrassed to tell him about both my lack of archery knowledge
and my near completely blind right eye ! Been left eye dominant ever since !!! haha
Hills form is great ! great pic by the way ... i have never seen that one before.
Posted by far rider (Member # 14108) on February 28, 2011 05:00 PM:
Well, I sure have poor form, now if I could just start hittin' em like Howard I'd be set!
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 28, 2011 06:00 PM:
quote:Originally posted by sunset hill: Great Photo!
Howard
adapted his form to the equipment of the day, but more importantly, he
adapted his form for the needs of a hunting archer...meaning he was very
fluid and not 'locked out'. This helped him make moving shots as well
as stationary shots and all the trick shots inbetween. He was not a
static target archer in the sense of the term. You can see photos of
Larry Hughes and others at that time who have what is commonly termed
today as target form.
Howard also was left eye dominate, which
blows away the concept that your dominate eye has to be over the arrow
and lined up with the string. This photo shows how large and intense
his left eye would stare at the target. Schulz commentated on this fact
quite a bit.
Nate,
interesting to read your take, especially to differentiate between a
fluid (personal, adaptive) form and a highly tuned form for competition.
Makes perfect sense to me.
And that does not negate what Rob
has taught me recently. Howard is "aiming the arrow" (Jim Ploen)which is
apparently the foundational principal for good shooting no matter what
the flavor.
Posted by Tony Van Dort (Member # 137) on February 28, 2011 06:19 PM:
quote:Originally posted by far rider: Well, I sure have poor form, now if I could just start hittin' em like Howard I'd be set!
Tim, I just tried to figure out how to forward you the shooting form stuff Rob sent me via PM...I'm not smart enough...lol
I am sure he will be happy to shoot it to you. He's been a great help to me these past few weeks..
********************** LongbowBen
Ben, Will be looking for pics of your new bow!! I think mine will be ready to ship tomorrow. Posted by Tique (Member # 2782) on February 28, 2011 06:25 PM:
Allllllmoooooooost 100 pages!!! Who would have thought that would ever happen?
Posted by far rider (Member # 14108) on February 28, 2011 07:24 PM:
Hey Rob! Could you please send me the shooting form info you sent to Tony? Uh, please!
Posted by Rob DiStefano (Member # 99) on February 28, 2011 07:34 PM:
Jim Ploen's two part article on "Aiming the Arrow", taken from the
Spring and Summer issues of Instinctive Archer Magazine. Jim was a
champion archer and avid bowhunter back in the 60's and 70's. He was
one of the first, if not the first to shoot a perfect 300 indoor round.
Jim & Buddy teamed up to form the original 21st Century Longbows and
their "ringer" Edge hybrid "D" longbow was cutting edge technology that
won many tournaments around the world including the classic FITA
Championships.
3.7 meg PDF file ...
Aiming the Arrow Posted by OPRick (Member # 5480) on February 28, 2011 07:41 PM:
Note the back muscles - WOW...
Posted by Two Tracks (Member # 19120) on February 28, 2011 07:42 PM:
![[knothead]](hhbug1_files/knothead.gif)
![[Roll Eyes]](hhbug1_files/rolleyes.gif)
![[laughing]](hhbug1_files/laughing.gif)
![[thumbsup]](hhbug1_files/thumbsup.gif)
![[dead horse]](hhbug1_files/deadhorse.gif)
![[smileystooges]](hhbug1_files/smileystooges.gif)
![[nono]](hhbug1_files/nono.gif)
![[biglaugh]](hhbug1_files/xxc_laugh.gif)
![[Big Grin]](hhbug1_files/biggrin.gif)
![[saywhat]](hhbug1_files/saywhat.gif)
![[clapper]](hhbug1_files/xxtaclap.gif)
![[goldtooth]](hhbug1_files/xxdsmile.gif)
![[jumper]](hhbug1_files/xxxjumper.gif)
And
i cant wait for the new one.I couldnt believe how easy it was to shoot a
D bow with a straight grip.And all this talk about hand shock is ![[dunno]](hhbug1_files/dunno.gif)
I must be holding it right.
![[help]](hhbug1_files/help.gif)
Thank goodness the treatments aren't TOO expensive LOL!
![[archer2]](hhbug1_files/archer2.gif)
![[bigsmyl]](hhbug1_files/bigsmyl2.gif)
![[wavey]](hhbug1_files/wavey.gif)
![[campfire]](hhbug1_files/campfire.gif)
![[archer]](hhbug1_files/archer.gif)
![[banghead]](hhbug1_files/banghead.gif)
![[Wink]](hhbug1_files/wink.gif)
![[Smile]](hhbug1_files/smile.gif)
![[scared]](hhbug1_files/scared.gif)
![[Eek!]](hhbug1_files/eek.gif)
![[dntthnk]](hhbug1_files/dntthnk.gif)
![[readit]](hhbug1_files/readit.gif)
![[Not Worthy]](hhbug1_files/notworthy.gif)
![[pray]](hhbug1_files/xxwpray.gif)
![[Razz]](hhbug1_files/tongue.gif)
![[Confused]](hhbug1_files/confused.gif)
![[coffee]](hhbug1_files/xxmcoffee.gif)
![[Cool]](hhbug1_files/cool.gif)
![[Frown]](hhbug1_files/frown.gif)
![[Mad]](hhbug1_files/mad.gif)
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href="http://s576.photobucket.com/albums/ss206/fishinoly/?action=view¤t=Picture108.jpg"
target="_blank"><img
src="http://i576.photobucket.com/albums/ss206/fishinoly/Picture108.jpg"
border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>[/IMG]
