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Author Topic: " Primal Dreams "  (Read 1711 times)

Offline pseman

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Re: " Primal Dreams "
« Reply #20 on: August 23, 2007, 09:49:00 AM »
I thought it was very enjoyable. The scenery was great and the messages from Gene Wensel's narration were right on. I would have liked to have seen a little more actual hunting though. It is not often that one gets to see the Wensel's or other archery legends hunt. I hope they will make a "hunting video" sometime soon that will share not only their philosophy, but also their strategy with us.

Mark
Mark Thornton

It doesn't matter how or what you shoot, as long as you hit your target.

Offline Tom Mussatto

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Re: " Primal Dreams "
« Reply #21 on: August 23, 2007, 10:05:00 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Herdbull:
Thanks for your opinion guys. We know that videos are not for everyone, and yes we did try to make PD a little different. Your comments are very helpful if we make another one.
If we make another one???????

I was kinda' hoping you were at least 90% finished with the sequel.  :)  

Yes, PD was different from the run of the mill hunting video, but where is it written that a hunting video cannot be made with taste, class, quality videography, and a strong, meaningful message? I mean really, just how many times does one need to view a cameraman and a hunter  sitting in a tree whispering to each other before, during, and after a shot. They all start looking alike after about the third one.

Great job with PD guys.
Tom Mussatto

Offline NOMAD88

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Re: " Primal Dreams "
« Reply #22 on: August 23, 2007, 10:18:00 AM »
Sounds like an awesome video where can i get a copy?

Online Herdbull

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Re: " Primal Dreams "
« Reply #23 on: August 23, 2007, 11:19:00 AM »
NOMAD88   You can check it out at  www.brothersofthebow.com

Tom    You are right, we are working on another one.... the brothers are never in a hurry. Ha! I guess Barry tore a tendon and may miss early season scouting and filming, but he should be OK.

Offline PaulRoberts

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Re: " Primal Dreams "
« Reply #24 on: August 23, 2007, 12:02:00 PM »
I bought a copy because I heard that it was beautiful and non-hunters would enjoy it -a good family video that might even help introduce people to the beauty in hunting.

My wife and I watched it -she is a non-hunter -and the film was beautiful in places. She especially enjoyed watching the turkeys -until the arrows started to fly. I had to admit it was pretty gruesome. The juxtaposition between wild turkeys doing their thing in the utter silence of the woods, then one after another, about a dozen turkeys being skewered on film was hard to watch, and my wife left the room.

I know hunting videos are an acquired taste, but I think in general kill scenes should be limited, and chosen with some care.

The process of the hunt is what brings us out there. The crescsendo may be the shot, but the kill itself is violent, and non-hunters are sensitive, and I hope most hunters are not entirely insensitive, to that fact.

PD was good and attempted to capture many of the reasons we spend such long hours in the woods. It succeeds in many places. But the number of turkey kills in succession killed it for my
wife. A single kill and Barry carrying out that Tom, and maybe a game dinner with family and friends, with recounts of the hunt, would have been much more effective, and more akin to most hunters experience.

Offline TexasBubba

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Re: " Primal Dreams "
« Reply #25 on: August 23, 2007, 12:37:00 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by PaulRoberts:

 I had to admit it was pretty gruesome.
Such a strong statement.........gruesome?  Hardly
Bill Graves
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Iraq - Afghanistan Veteran

I was a soldier - I am a soldier- I will always be a soldier

Online Gene Wensel

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Re: " Primal Dreams "
« Reply #26 on: August 23, 2007, 02:36:00 PM »
We have to always remember that most hunters have been PROGRAMMED to either expect or reject kill scenes. Its hard to stay in the gray zone and yet pass the message. Some people love big bucks in velvet while others get bored. Many potential customers immediately ask "How many kill shots are in it?" before they buy. I'm tempted to ask them how many they need...
 As has been said, we'll never make everyone happy. We've had suggestions everywhere from no music whatsoever, to hating it, to asking to buy the sound track. Some people thought we shot ten turkeys before we actually killed one (in reality, all turkeys hit were killed). We have two seasons of all five of us filming since we made Primal Dreams. I must say we have got some outstanding footage and more rare footage and freak antlers, etc. We also have close to a hundred kills on film but very few of them are good enough to share with the general public. We'll see. Stay tuned. Thanks for the comments. They help.

Offline T.J.

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Re: " Primal Dreams "
« Reply #27 on: August 23, 2007, 03:32:00 PM »
Gene,

Does this mean we can hope for a sequel of some sort? Both PD and Spirit of the bow were great. Thanks!
"...Watching a buck turn back seeing his form melt away, a hunter will feel an inner smile. There's no other place he wishes to be and never does he feel more alive..."

~Gene Wensel (Primal Dreams)


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Offline PaulRoberts

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Re: " Primal Dreams "
« Reply #28 on: August 23, 2007, 03:36:00 PM »
Thanks Gene. IMO, beauty and process are too rare in hunting videos, yet commonplace in hunting. I'm looking forward to what you have coming. For me anyway, your efforts are in the right direction.

Online Herdbull

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Re: " Primal Dreams "
« Reply #29 on: August 23, 2007, 03:45:00 PM »
TJ ,
 Gene had to go out of town, but yes you are correct. We are working on a sequel of sorts, but we don't feel it will be ready until maybe a year and half or so. There is a lot we would like to do better. When dealing with nature, some of it takes time and opportunity along with a little luck. Thanks.  Mike

Offline Bard1

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Re: " Primal Dreams "
« Reply #30 on: August 23, 2007, 03:55:00 PM »
I'd like to throw my thoughts in the rings as well.  
First off, I love PD And have watched it many times.  I loved the music and naration. Though I didn't find the turky shots gruesome at all, I did find it too repatative.  I liked Paul's idea of a kill shot, then walking away with the bird and then a scene with the hunter and family sitting down to eat, or maybe with friends all laughing and having a good time telling stories over the cooked bird.  
On a similar vein There were a number of scenes which showed one of the brothers release an arrow, then cut to the scene with the downed animal.  This I thought a nice classy touch.  Personaly I have no need so see the actually arrow hitting the animal.  On the other hand I can see some arguments for having such arrow impact scenes as well.  We ARE killing animals out there after all, Why hide it or gloss it over?  
  The thing with the moose hunt however, had no scene with the hunter shooting at all.  One min.
Mike is calling to some moose, next he's walking up to the "fallen monarch".  I think it would have been a much smoother story telling if you had included a scene that showed him coming to full draw and release, then him walking up to the moose.  Even if it was filmed later.  
The elk hunt section was great.  The deer in the Fields, though I enjoyed it, I felt it was a little to long.  I think that's it for my opinions.  Over all its a great DVD and I enjoy it far and away better then any other modern hunting DVD.  
Derek
got arrows?

Offline Roughcountry

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Re: " Primal Dreams "
« Reply #31 on: August 23, 2007, 04:12:00 PM »
Bard 1 pretty much said most everything I think about PD. Best dang DVD I've ever watched  :thumbsup:  
 Wished it had a mule deer in it, and my favorite, the mt lion. I really liked the shot of the little bob getting the bushy tail. Rare footage.
Thanks guys, waitin for the next one.

Offline T.J.

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Re: " Primal Dreams "
« Reply #32 on: August 23, 2007, 05:27:00 PM »
Mike,

Thanks for the response  :)  I agree and second Paul's ideas. I also like Bard1's idea about the moose. But in the end mother nature is the ultimate director of a film like this. You can only put in the movie what mother nature allows you to catch on tape. 1 1/2 years is a wait well worth waiting for another dvd of this caliber.

Thanks to you, your brothers, Gene, Barry, and anyone I might have missed who is working on these dvd's. They're what gets a lot of us through the off season and gets us dreaming of what's to come.

T.J.
"...Watching a buck turn back seeing his form melt away, a hunter will feel an inner smile. There's no other place he wishes to be and never does he feel more alive..."

~Gene Wensel (Primal Dreams)


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Offline Ray Hammond

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Re: " Primal Dreams "
« Reply #33 on: August 23, 2007, 05:46:00 PM »
JSD3,

succumb to the hype?

I don't know what YOUR definition of hype is...but my definition is " extravagant exaggeration "(as "mile-high ice-cream cones")  

I don't think the discussion by hundreds of bowhunters who liked the message of the video when you and John didn't find anything of value in it - necessarily MAKES our praise of it "hype".

Some folks are stage one hunters their whole lives- ie- gotta kill something. Some are stage two all their lives- ie filling tags. Stage 3 is hunting trophies I think, and four is hunting specific animals.

That doesn't necessarily make them any less skilled or any less of a hunter than a stage five(there for the entire experience, and the process is more important than the end result) but it does make them different.

Maybe the thrill you get from hunting is more closely tied to taking game, and because of that you get less out of "the rest of the story" ?? I'm not picking on you, or trying to be mean or insulting...I just think that your response - and John's - were unique and interesting enough that I wanted to explore why you feel the way you do.

I spend a lot of time in bowhunter education and it's something I think about a great deal.
“Courageous, untroubled, mocking and violent-that is what Wisdom wants us to be. Wisdom is a woman, and loves only a warrior.” - Friedrich Nietzsche

Offline 3dmuzzy

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Re: " Primal Dreams "
« Reply #34 on: August 23, 2007, 06:04:00 PM »
Wow,This is not what I expected from this post!I was just saying I like to watch this dvd before the season starts,Every one has there opinion I like to watch Kill scenes as much as the next guy,But this dvd is much more than that,It gets us in tune to whats around us,Thanks Barry and Gene looking foward to the next one well done!  :clapper:  >>>----> ED
Put some air under it.

Online Keefer

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Re: " Primal Dreams "
« Reply #35 on: August 23, 2007, 06:27:00 PM »
:bigsmyl:     :)     ;)     :D   Just a few more of my thoughts on a job well done. Thanks Mike, Barry,Gene and everyone else who took part in P.D. God Bless! Keefers <")))><

Offline Gary Logsdon

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Re: " Primal Dreams "
« Reply #36 on: August 23, 2007, 07:58:00 PM »
"The Journey IS the Destination".  "Process over Product."  Two themes I once discussed with Fred Bear after viewing his great film The Restless Spirit.  Over 20 years passed before those concepts, IMHO, were adequately addressed by a bowhunting film. Primal Dreams, like Fred's film, addresses why we hunt.
Gary Logsdon

Offline Talondale

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Re: " Primal Dreams "
« Reply #37 on: August 24, 2007, 04:04:00 PM »
Since we're giving opinions I'll voice mine.  I just recently purchased the video and enjoyed it.  I felt it was a blend of "River Runs Through It"/Wild Kingdom/and a hunting video. I have to agree with Bard1 in that I felt it would have been better (for me) if the "hunting" segments had more of progression feel to them.  Sometimes they did and sometimes they almost felt like they were less of a visual narrative and more part of the other images that glided past, and that may have been the intent.  I would also have liked someone else to have done the narrative.  That is not a critisicm against Gene but I kept envisioning a different voice, probably one from many movies I have seen, and I distracted myself.  Kind of like hearing a favorite tune played on a piano and thinking you wish you could hear it played on an acoustic guitar.  A mear matter of artistic interpretation.  I appreciate the quality of the images and the music and the sentiment of the narrative.  I like many types of hunting videos, from the over-the-shoulder, to the instructional and "interprative".  We get so few of the last two.

Offline B-DOG

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Re: " Primal Dreams "
« Reply #38 on: August 24, 2007, 04:10:00 PM »
does this video have a lot of traditional kill shots?

Offline Ray Hammond

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Re: " Primal Dreams "
« Reply #39 on: August 24, 2007, 04:30:00 PM »
Nope.
“Courageous, untroubled, mocking and violent-that is what Wisdom wants us to be. Wisdom is a woman, and loves only a warrior.” - Friedrich Nietzsche

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