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Author Topic: Beat Target Panic (Maybe?)  (Read 2337 times)

Online Jim Casto Jr

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Beat Target Panic (Maybe?)
« on: December 31, 2018, 03:27:46 PM »
Okay, I’ll admit, I’ve suffered from this damnable stuff for years. I’ve tried everything I’ve seen and read on the topic and still, no cure. I hunted and shot with a clicker for years, then, started anticipating it and blew up. I shot left- handed for years and did okay, but have never been able to shoot as well as I did, right-handed.


After much trial and error, I’ve come up with a regimen of drills that DID IT for me, a close friend and several volunteers who also suffered from this demon for years. We finally have SUCCESS. Some report a complete cure while others report the confidence to maintain control over the demon.


Now… I’m not a good shot, not a psychologist, not an archery coach or anything of the sort. I’m just a desperate archer who’s tried everything. Nothing worked—until now. I honestly think if you're willing to put in the work and spend 63 days (maybe more) following the drills I’ve put together, you'll have success too. If you're as frustrated and as desperate as I was, in the words of President Trump, “What in the hell do you have to lose?"


So far, EVERYONE that has followed the drills “TO-THE-LETTER" has been successful.
If you’re interested, just PM me your email address and I’ll forward you the drills and a spreadsheet  to keep track of your progress in a PDF document. I’d appreciate communication along the way with updates of your progress too.


Please note:  To keep from being derailed, this thread is not intended to be a discussion of what target panic is, or what your thoughts about it are.  It's simply to offer a set of drills that have been tested and found to be successful.  If you want to give it a go, just let me know.
« Last Edit: December 31, 2018, 05:45:48 PM by Jim Casto Jr »
"Archery is really very simple. You just have to do the exact same thing on every shot."
Bill Leslie, July 22, 2017

"Form is everything." 
Al Cole, June 7, 2008

Offline McDave

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Re: Beat Target Panic (Maybe?)
« Reply #1 on: December 31, 2018, 03:36:48 PM »
I've also suffered from TP for many years, and have tried a lot of different things to cure it.  At the moment, it seems to be under control and I can anchor and come to full draw dependably, but still have the urge to rush the shot.  I'd be interested to see what you've come up with, and will send you a PM.
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Online Jim Casto Jr

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Re: Beat Target Panic (Maybe?)
« Reply #2 on: December 31, 2018, 07:13:34 PM »
Gee Whiz folks!   The requests are "almost" overwhelming.  I'm doing my best to keep up.  If I miss someone, please contact me again.  I'm getting old and sometimes things fall threw the cracks.  :)

Please be advised:  You must be willing to spend 20 to 30 minutes a day for 63 days (maybe more) on a very strict discipline, and you MUST follow the drills TO-THE-LETTER. If you aren't prepared to "pay the price" of admission, there's really no need to start-seriously. It'll also void your warranty. ;)
"Archery is really very simple. You just have to do the exact same thing on every shot."
Bill Leslie, July 22, 2017

"Form is everything." 
Al Cole, June 7, 2008

Online Jim Casto Jr

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Re: Beat Target Panic (Maybe?)
« Reply #3 on: January 01, 2019, 11:18:46 AM »
Here are a few reports from folks as they progressed through the drills:

“Cecil has been keeping me posted all along with his progress. I was very eagar to hear how everyone did on day 22 (the first day to shoot arrows). I was thrilled to learn cecil shot his day 22 arrows in complete control. I was thrilled for him.... and me. lol lol"


Quote
"So, closing in on my drill to actually shoot an arrow, I shot day 19's regimen on the Field course today. My bud was shooting close range cause he is still chasing deer, it is a lot more enjoyable to me to walk the wooded course and do the drills than in the garage.
I am so comfortable with my shot sequence this week, trying to really pay attention to some of the finer points of the expansion movement. Thinking about direction of elbow movement and engaging scapula. There is so much to be said about this process and how it has brought me back on track to just that, the process, and not the outcome of any shot. When all you do is try to perform the steps in your shot sequence as perfectly as possible then that indeed becomes the focus...which is the purpose after all. lol
Seems very logical. Absolutely no urges anymore even as I practice the expansion and imagine setting off the clicker. Very confident is how I feel. Also curious how, or if , adding the loose is going to change things. I'm guessing not much. So..about a third of the way through and feeling good."


Quote
"This is my day 30. I had a late start cause we got married.. and yadda, yadda, yadda.....anyway this is working great. I think the real reinforcement is drawing 9 times and shooting once, it teaches you to let down for sure. I even had a couple instances where on the 10th arrow it didn’t feel right. And I was able to say... NO. And just let down. And then shoot the 11th. Working well man. I’ll keep you posted! Thanks for a great system"


Quote
"For the first time in over 10 years I can anchor, aim and shoot in control. Sometimes I still get antsy but I can let down and start over. When I feel insecure I just move closer and do a few let down drills…"


Quote
"I've been following your formula to the tee EXCEPT I stayed with my same weight bow(44lbs). Today I ran down to Lancaster archery and bought 30 lb limbs for my Satori. Today was day 43 and I shot from 5-30 with the lighter limbs with complete control. Shoulda bought them to start. I'll finish these last 20 days with them. Thanks for your help"


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"Jim, day 18 is under my belt and doing great to this point. I have utterly no urge to release. I have settled into a comfortable 31” draw. I am following the program to a “T”."


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"Day 23 and all is well. I am enjoying drawing and shooting without that hellish urge to SHOOT IT!! :o)"
"Jim, I just completed day 50. I'm in complete control and it feels sooooo good. Thanks so much..."

Quote
"Up-date. I just finished the day 27 exercises and boy am I pleased. Now shooting at 15 yards with utterly no urge to blow up. LOL Jim emphasizes "immersing" yourself in aiming. That needs to be emphasized because one of the big issues with TP is the urge to release the moment you get even close to the target. To retrain your brain not to have that "idea" it is crucial to do the shot sequence steps and then FOCUS, FOCUS, Focus on the spot you intend to shoot...when you are ready. Thus far I am extremely pleased with the results. It requires discipline to follow the regimen as laid out. You have nothing to lose and everything to gain. It is so pleasant to shoot an arrow at 15 yards now in control. "


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"Today is day 61 I have 3 days to make up. my shots are controlled shots now. I plan to keep right on with the 4 let downs and shoot one arrow."


Quote
"Performed day 32 drills earlier today, really amazing how this works. I was at the range and had some folks show up, had to explain why I was letting down so much. ha ha They were familiar with TP though and also amazed at how these brain exercises are working.
Of course they wanted to see how the actual shots went too and I was glad to have the pressure myself, the real deal. Executed the shots just like executing the "let downs" , great stuff...."


Quote
"Jim, day 54 is under my belt. I had a hiccup the other day. My very first draw at 5 yds I let loose. I have no idea why except my mind was somewhere else. I got right back on track though and am doing well. I've been mixing my excersizes up between 30 lb and 39 lb bows.... There is no doubt in my mind that this is working and I can feel confidence growing and doubt lessening."


Quote
"Day 31 checked off this afternoon--half way through nearly. I got to shoot at 20 yards! No yips, jerks, no little demon in my head screaming SHOOT. This is so cool and I am actually having fun doing it--look forward to my daily sessions. Feeling calm and in control feels so good, AAAAH."


Quote
"Just finished day 8. Anxiety is way down as can be expected at this point. Having been relegated to snap shooting I've never been able to concentrate on a point of aim for more than a flash but now doing it 30 times a day before let down. Tomorrow I need to go out to 20yd so need to be at the club range at sunrise to make it to work on time. Guess you can say I've committed to make this happen. Thanks for the opportunity, Jim."


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"Merry Christmas Jim. I’m in Michigan for Christmas and took my bow. I just have 2 days left and this is a great Christmas present to be shooting in control..."


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"Day 38 done today and still amazed at the results I am experiencing. This is the best approach to treating the dreaded archer's affliction I have seen."


Quote
"I’ve had target panic for over 50 years in all forms imaginable shooting compounds with releases and fingers and also with my traditional bows. I took Joel Turners online course and though that helped me a LOT, I still had tp.
So when Jim graciously made his off for 12 volunteers to try what helped him, I signed up. I committed and gave up my archery season to try and once for all get this demon off me. So it began and I followed it to the Tee except I started it using my hunting bow and not going with a real light bow. I did eventually get new 30 pound limbs and kept going following Jim’s program as he spelled out.
His program WORKS. I am now shooting controlled shots.
I believe I will always have to fight it at times, but have learned how to combat it and only shoot controlled shots.
I want to thank Jim publicaly on here for his encouragement through out this program through emails and phone conversation. I love shooting and shooting in control is so much better...."
« Last Edit: January 01, 2019, 11:31:43 AM by Jim Casto Jr »
"Archery is really very simple. You just have to do the exact same thing on every shot."
Bill Leslie, July 22, 2017

"Form is everything." 
Al Cole, June 7, 2008

Online David Mitchell

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Re: Beat Target Panic (Maybe?)
« Reply #4 on: January 03, 2019, 05:48:08 PM »
Well, I want to throw in my own thoughts and experience with Jim's program.  I will move to day 44 tomorrow.  I am still amazed at what is happening.  My form has been tweaked (through some personal help from Jim as he does not live real far away) and my draw length and anchor moved to a much better place, the urge to release has been gone for quite some time--since the very first few days.  I will echo Jim's words...you MUST be willing to make the commitment to stay with the program from day 1 and don't mess around with adding or leaving out steps.  Some won't be willing to stick with it as they will think that all these steps are not necessary....don't do it! Use what is working for a bunch of folks who have not gotten help from other efforts.  I assure you that if you do the program as designed you will be oh so glad. After two hunts this season, I gave up hunting the rest of the  season to focus on doing this as I realized that I had no business shooting at a live animal the way things were, and I have to say that I have enjoyed every minute of it--even those days when no arrows could be loosed yet, because it felt so good to be getting control.  I have used (or tried to) a clicker for years, attended Joel Turner's seminar, read Jay Kidwell's book--nothing got me in control like this program has.  I have a friend who refers to it as my "detox" program and in a sense that is just what it is.  TP is a toxic thing for an archer and if you struggle with it you should at least give this a try. Jim has worked hard on this, studied what others have written, attended seminars as I have, and he has put this together and generously offered it to any one who needs/wants it free of charge!  Again I say, a huge thanks to you, Jim. :thumbsup:

Please note that you really need to start with a bow that you can "dominate" in Jim's word.  Too much bow weight will be detrimental at the start.  You can tell your wife that you "need" that new bow or set of limbs for your detox program.  Tell her Dr. Dave said you must.  :biglaugh:

If I were starting a new archer out who was new to traditional bows, I would insist that he/she work through this program first.  If they do, I doubt seriously that  they will ever struggle with target panic.
The years accumulate on old friendships like tree rings, during which time a kind of unspoken care and loyalty accrue between men.

Offline McDave

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Re: Beat Target Panic (Maybe?)
« Reply #5 on: January 03, 2019, 07:11:51 PM »
I'm going to do this.  A question about procedure: in your instructions, you say to do 30 drills a day.  Later, you say, for example, to anchor and let down 5 times, and then do that again at a different distance. When I anchor and let down 5 times, is that 5 drills or 1 drill?
TGMM Family of the Bow

Would someone please make up my mind for me?

Online Jim Casto Jr

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Re: Beat Target Panic (Maybe?)
« Reply #6 on: January 03, 2019, 07:23:29 PM »
30 times a day, total throughout the drills. 

Beginning on day 2, you draw and let down 5 times and each yard to 6 yards.  5 x 6 = 30

Some folks need to 10 in the morning; 10 after lunch and 10 in the evening.  :)


More is okay if you're strong not fatigued ...but NEVER less than 30
"Archery is really very simple. You just have to do the exact same thing on every shot."
Bill Leslie, July 22, 2017

"Form is everything." 
Al Cole, June 7, 2008

Offline McDave

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Re: Beat Target Panic (Maybe?)
« Reply #7 on: January 03, 2019, 07:27:45 PM »
Thanks JIm!
TGMM Family of the Bow

Would someone please make up my mind for me?

Online Jim Casto Jr

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Re: Beat Target Panic (Maybe?)
« Reply #8 on: January 03, 2019, 07:36:23 PM »
Dave,

I read you to be one with the metal fortitude to stay with the drills TO-THE-LETTER.  It might be nice if the fella's I sent these to, might report back with their progress on this thread now and again. 

You wouldn't beleive how many emails I've sent out the last few days--several hundred.

Bad news about that is, there sure are a lot of us closet sufferers out there.   

"Archery is really very simple. You just have to do the exact same thing on every shot."
Bill Leslie, July 22, 2017

"Form is everything." 
Al Cole, June 7, 2008

Offline McDave

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Re: Beat Target Panic (Maybe?)
« Reply #9 on: January 03, 2019, 07:48:20 PM »
Yes, I would imagine we're all over the spectrum, from not being able to make it past 2/3 draw to being able to draw and anchor but still having that last little bit of nervousness that makes us shoot too soon and not get as good a score as we should.  That's where I’ve been stuck for about a year.  It doesn't seem like it should take a comprehensive program to get rid that, but wishing it would go away doesn't seem to work either, so as you say, what have I got to lose?
TGMM Family of the Bow

Would someone please make up my mind for me?

Online Jock Whisky

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Re: Beat Target Panic (Maybe?)
« Reply #10 on: January 03, 2019, 10:32:36 PM »
Interesting the things that come with this. I started today and when I focused on the target my eyes would cross, wander and lose focus. I found I was looking out of the extreme corner of my eyes. I turned my head a bit more and that issue seemed to go away and so did the string hitting my nose. I wonder if the eyes being at the extreme limit of their travel to the left (I'm right handed) are under a lot of tension and become somewhat unstable? Just an observation.

I am looking forward to this exercise. It sure makes you concentrate on a repeatable shot sequence.
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Online David Mitchell

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Re: Beat Target Panic (Maybe?)
« Reply #11 on: January 05, 2019, 06:57:00 PM »
Guys, I have been on Jim's program now for quite a while.  Today I completed day 45.  I'm at that point where we do the draw/let down reps and then shoot an arrow from 5, 10, 15, 20, 25, and 30 yards.  I can't believe I have had no issues even out to 30 yards.  Have confidence in the program, don't take short cuts.  It sure doesn't seem like I have been doing this that long.  I gave up this hunting season to work on this and it has been worth it without a doubt.  Stay with it....what do you have to lose but the evil demon?   :clapper:
The years accumulate on old friendships like tree rings, during which time a kind of unspoken care and loyalty accrue between men.

Online David Mitchell

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Re: Beat Target Panic (Maybe?)
« Reply #12 on: January 05, 2019, 07:23:05 PM »
Jock, interesting things have happened to me as well.  Working with Jim in person, we changed my anchor to a much better spot which I really like a lot--it gives me
three points of reference. The result is a considerably longer draw length.  Guess what that does!  I have arrows now that are too short and some bows that are heavier than I care to shoot.....so I have been thinning the herd and have picked up a little bow I really love--the Galaxy Ember longbow and some more limbs for my Bear TD.  I got it to start the program with a light draw weight and found that it has the best grip (for me) that I have ever had.  I now have two of them.  :saywhat: It sure is fun to have a good reason to pick up some new stuff.  Gotta do it for my "detox" program.  I'm having a ball. :bigsmyl:
The years accumulate on old friendships like tree rings, during which time a kind of unspoken care and loyalty accrue between men.

Online Jim Casto Jr

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Re: Beat Target Panic (Maybe?)
« Reply #13 on: January 05, 2019, 07:39:43 PM »
Dr. Dave Mitchell,

Since you're further along than anyone else on this forum, I'm curious.....


How long has it been since you shot an arrow in complete control without the aid of a clicker, or the TARGET PANIC?

"Archery is really very simple. You just have to do the exact same thing on every shot."
Bill Leslie, July 22, 2017

"Form is everything." 
Al Cole, June 7, 2008

Online David Mitchell

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Re: Beat Target Panic (Maybe?)
« Reply #14 on: January 05, 2019, 08:02:55 PM »
Jim, I can't even remember. I even had trouble getting through the clicker--especially if I was shooting with other people.  All of my early years of shooting I was shooting right handed because I am right handed and just figured that was how I ought to shoot and had no one to tell me differently.  I developed TP shooting compound bows around 1980 with sights and fingers.  Same problem when I started shooting trad bows.  Mike Fedora told me I needed to be shooting left handed since I am strongly left eye dominant--I mean REAL left eye dominate.  I got a lefty bow and was amazed....the sight picture was incredibly better and I had not one iota of TP. I was one happy camper.  That lasted maybe 2-3 years, then TP began raising its head on the left side.  If I had this program back then, I don't think I would have developed TP.  But I made the switch to lefty bows about 26 years ago and the TP came back with a vengeance a couple of years later. I have had so much discouragement with it.

I might mention that I am 75 years old and I am excited...so one is never too old to work on this issue. :goldtooth:
 

« Last Edit: January 05, 2019, 08:14:36 PM by David Mitchell »
The years accumulate on old friendships like tree rings, during which time a kind of unspoken care and loyalty accrue between men.

Offline McDave

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Re: Beat Target Panic (Maybe?)
« Reply #15 on: January 05, 2019, 11:27:26 PM »
Like David, my target panic increases when I shoot with other people, and increases more as I shoot in tournaments or any situation with higher pressure than shooting alone.  Assuming a person is able to get to place where they feel confident when shooting alone using your method, how do you recommend taking it to the next level, when there is more pressure than when shooting alone?
TGMM Family of the Bow

Would someone please make up my mind for me?

Online Jim Casto Jr

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Re: Beat Target Panic (Maybe?)
« Reply #16 on: January 05, 2019, 11:57:06 PM »
Now that, Dave, is an excellent question.  Unfortunately, these drills are so new, no one can answer that question with certainty, but I believe you touched on with the question.  I’m convinced the ability to perform under pressure situations will be directly proportional to how much CONFIDENCE you've gained in your shot sequence during the drills.  They were designed to allow the archer to gain confidence daily.  So far, EVERYONE is reporting just that.  We simply need more time for any confirmation.

I did try to touch on that in the last paragraph of the drills. "If you’re at the range or shooting with others, just remember, just because you drew the bow, doesn’t mean you have to shoot the arrow.  Let down as often as needed and make sure you ONLY shoot strong controlled shots. "

We do know one thing for sure.  Everyone who has followed the drills TO-THE-LETTER  is reporting being able to shoot controlled shots when alone and they weren't able to do that previously.
"Archery is really very simple. You just have to do the exact same thing on every shot."
Bill Leslie, July 22, 2017

"Form is everything." 
Al Cole, June 7, 2008

Offline BruceT

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Re: Beat Target Panic (Maybe?)
« Reply #17 on: January 06, 2019, 10:00:31 AM »
     First off , I would like to thank Jim,for being , so generous with his time and effort to try and help a lot of people, with a problem that may be affecting a lot of archers in a lot of different ways !!!
     I am new , starting into day two, using a very lightweight kids bow . The concern I have is . When I let down with my regular bow ,45# @ 28” it is really hard on my bow arm shoulder . I am concerned with the transition, from kids bow to my regular bow. I’m thinking at day 22 , I should be using my regular bow .
Any suggestions ?   
     Bruce

Online Jim Casto Jr

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Re: Beat Target Panic (Maybe?)
« Reply #18 on: January 06, 2019, 10:29:43 AM »
Bruce,

I can only assume, if it’s “hard" on your shoulders it's too much weight.  I'm sure you just need to build into more weight gradually.  I suggest in the drills, when you feel comfortable beginning to increase weight, you only do it by three to five pounds at time.

I’m convinced there is a direct correlation between the pressure on your body (bow weight) and the pressure on your mind.  We don’t want any “shock” to the system to add that extra pressure to your mind while going through the drills.
"Archery is really very simple. You just have to do the exact same thing on every shot."
Bill Leslie, July 22, 2017

"Form is everything." 
Al Cole, June 7, 2008

Offline McDave

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Re: Beat Target Panic (Maybe?)
« Reply #19 on: January 06, 2019, 12:07:31 PM »
This is day three, and I thought I’d share my preliminary observations. I found in drawing 5 arrows one after the other, I’m not always drawing the bow the same way. So I settled in on what I think is best, and always try to draw the bow the same way. Probably my age, but I find I lose track of which arrow I’m drawing, and which group of 5 I’m on. So since my quiver has 2 compartments, I empty one and put each arrow I draw into the empty compartment until there are 5 there. This also adds realism, because I’m nocking an arrow before each draw. To add further realism, I walk away after each draw and re-position my feet for the next draw. To know which group of 5 I’m on, I start with 6 field points in one pocket, and move one of them to the other pocket after I shoot each group.

So everything is as realistic as I can make it, right up to the point where I would normally shoot the arrow.
TGMM Family of the Bow

Would someone please make up my mind for me?

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