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Author Topic: Who's used WW on moose?  (Read 1810 times)

Offline JC

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Re: Who's used WW on moose?
« Reply #40 on: November 21, 2005, 03:42:00 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Terry Green:
...but not sure just how you deal with a one inch flat spot turned at a 45% angle...any ideas guys?
Ummmm, wait till he's broadside?  "[tunglaff]"  

There's lots to the dead perpindicular broadside shots, not quartering for them big ones. I think as the critter's bones get bigger and tougher, our shots get more and more confined to one particular scenario.
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Online Terry Green

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Re: Who's used WW on moose?
« Reply #41 on: November 21, 2005, 03:47:00 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by JC:
 
Quote
Originally posted by Terry Green:
...but not sure just how you deal with a one inch flat spot turned at a 45% angle...any ideas guys?
Ummmm, wait till he's broadside?    "[tunglaff]"    

 [/b]
Joe,

The vitals on the American Buff are forward like African game...and Doug said that was the best angle for a heart shot or double lung.....and he also told me he's never gotten deflected by a rib.  He's killed a pile of them with a bow, so I went with what he told me to do.  Like I said earlier....Murphy can and will show up at any time.
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Offline JC

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Re: Who's used WW on moose?
« Reply #42 on: November 21, 2005, 03:51:00 PM »
Didn't know that Tarz. I'd like to take one apart and look at it. I know it sure taught me a volume when I did that with a hog.

And yer right on bout Murph, best laid plans....well...you know the rest.
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Offline Stykbowslim

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Re: Who's used WW on moose?
« Reply #43 on: November 21, 2005, 03:52:00 PM »
I believe Mike Mitten used a WW on this Alaskan moose.

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Offline Bowspirit

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Re: Who's used WW on moose?
« Reply #44 on: November 21, 2005, 04:11:00 PM »
Okay, Im only 17, I've never killed any big game, and I've never even used the Wensel Woodsman broadhead.
 But, I do know that, every year, people head to the woods with vast assortments of bowhunting gear. Each year, compound shooters cleanly kill moose and bison with punch-type or now even expandable heads, and some don't shoot that much weight.
 Dr. Ashby wrote how superior penetration demands a cutting-tip and 3:1 cut ratio. The WW has em both. With a heavy arrow, I don't think any animal in North America can stand up to the WW.   With PROPER shot placement included in that aspect. If you hit a heavy moose bone, I'm guessing not even the Grizzly or STOS heads will bail you out
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Online deerfly

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Re: Who's used WW on moose?
« Reply #45 on: November 21, 2005, 04:21:00 PM »
Thats some pretty interesting info there DG. The slower projectile deflection seems sensible too, but I still have a hard time discounting moose ribs as little or no concern for an arrow.

There's got to be some flex or give to the rib that will rob the arrow of some energy before it breaks the bone or deflects in another direction too. Really hard to figure this stuff and this thread seems to lead directly to Ashby's work.

From the little bit of moose carcass that I've seen personally, the ribs on a moose are probably more like what you see on the Flinstones. Nothing even remotely like the ribs you'll likely get on Saturday night at some resturant. I'm thinking I could beat a crack-crazed attacker into a pulp with a moose rib.   :)  

So I think, well most of us anyway, that don't hunt these things regularly, its easy to not realize just how big these animals are. At 1400-1500lbs a large bull moose is roughly one and a third or more as a large bull elk. Plus these dudes quite often survive car collisions and such. It is remarkable that so many have been effectively killed with the various archery set-ups. But planning for and expecting the worse on these critters sounds like good advice to me.

Maybe Dan or one of the other local boys up there could get us some dimensions, weight characteristics and what not from a few moose ribs. I think it would surprise a lot of us. I scanned the web a bit and couldn't find any good skeletal facts, but I'm sure there's something out there somewhere. - eric

Offline AkDan

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Re: Who's used WW on moose?
« Reply #46 on: November 21, 2005, 09:41:00 PM »
Well our late season did open today and someone did just put me onto a 50" bull that was spotted yesterday and I am off for the next FOUR DAYS.....hmmmmmmmm

I disagree though with most of what you said bowspirit.  2 blades vs 3 blades react differently when dead centering bone.  Again I am not talking about shoulder blades here, specifically rib bones, something that can and often is encountered in a "perfect shot" scenario.  I am starting to think this thread should read "when good shots go bad"   :scared:    
I am sure you could contact Dr Ashby for more information regarding this as he is by far more of an authority at this hole game then I am.  You've got my opinion and minimal experience with a few moose.

Offline Rick Kearney

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Re: Who's used WW on moose?
« Reply #47 on: December 08, 2005, 02:50:00 PM »
Was referred to this particular site and thread after posting a question on the Michigan Forum of the Bowsite regarding broadhead choice for Bison.  I will be shooting one this winter for a freezer of meat and am debating which head to use, a WW or a Journeyman.  I shoot laminated birch arrows  with a finished weight of 640 gr. out of a 63# longbow.

I have learned from experience to file the tip off of the WW and do so.  They have worked well for me on black bear and whitetail as have the Journeyman on elk, whitetails, and hogs.  I have full confidence in either head, just like the hole from the WW.  Do know from observation that a bison is built much more stout than anything that I have shot.

Input would be appreciated.

Rick K(still a bowhunter)

Offline Vance in AK.

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Re: Who's used WW on moose?
« Reply #48 on: December 08, 2005, 03:02:00 PM »
Hi Rick,
As the one that started this thread I'm all in favor of you trying thw WW on bison & giving us a full report.  I'd also prefer you hit a rib on the way in if you don't mind ;-)
Seriously, please let me know how it ends up.
I trust you saw Terry's post on this thread about his bison?
Myself, I'll be shooting between 650 & 700 gr grizzly sticks out of either a #59 BW MA III, or a #64 Pronghorn longbow for moose.
Jesus said "Abide in Me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself unless it abides in the vine, so neither can you unless you abide in Me.
“I am the vine, you are the branches; he who abides in Me and I in him, he bears much fruit, for apart from Me you can do nothing."
John 15:4&5

Offline grizz

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Re: Who's used WW on moose?
« Reply #49 on: December 08, 2005, 10:34:00 PM »
Rick, I shot a 1500# bison last march with a 145gr grizzly broadhead (two blade) with a 500gr ash shaft. First shot dead centered a rib, 1/2" thick, 2" wide. I wish I knew how to post a picture of the bent head, but the arrow still penetrated at least 8 inches. I had to shoot him again, yes, struck another rib but this time I made it half way through the heart! If I had to do it over I would use the WW and my 640gr lam birch shafts. I learned that one of the keys to the penetration issue is to wait for the quartering away shot. Good luck!
mike

Offline bishs

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Re: Who's used WW on moose?
« Reply #50 on: December 09, 2005, 04:58:00 PM »
I really don't think a WW or a 2-blade will be much different when centering a rib. There are too many factors. Shoot a heavy tuned arrow. Forget the rib, when shooting at large game penetration is still key. Assuming your arrow is tuned and has enough weight, hole cutting diameter is a big factor. Face it, the less tissue you are cutting the more penetration you will get. The same diameter 3 blade is going to have to cut more tissue than the same diameter 2 blade. That is why the Grizzly, and the modified grizzly on Dr Ashby's test do so well. The modified has 1" cutting diamter.

When I went after moose, I used a 1 1/8" diameter 2 blade Silver Flame. I don't think you can buy a sharper broadhead. I had complete pass-thru 57 lbs, 600 gr arrow. I shoot 3 and 4-blade heads for deer.

   

   

Offline bishs

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Re: Who's used WW on moose?
« Reply #51 on: December 09, 2005, 05:20:00 PM »
I bought them for large game only. I am using 4 blade stingers for deer. I went to BC with 6 Silver flames, even after shooting a moose I still have 6 razor sharp heads. they are really something. I was out of blunts and Darryl was trying to get me to fling one at a grouse on a limb! It's like buying a good quality knife.

My brother Gregg manages a machine shop, they make "high end" indexible tooling. He spent some time looking at the head. He said they would sell over $40 each if they were to make them. He doesn't believe for a minute anyones getting rich.
They are far cry from a production head.. I hope he keeps making them. I talked to Markus from German Kinetics on the phone, he is a great guy. Making these heads is his hobby, not his job. He just wanted to make a better broadhead, and is surprised how they have taken off.
I just hope he keeps making them.


It's nice to find them after you shoot.    :)

Offline Dalebow

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Re: Who's used WW on moose?
« Reply #52 on: December 09, 2005, 06:14:00 PM »
ok guys what about an easton axis with 100 gr insert and the new 225gr phantom head?? two blade with bleeder, big hole and the bleeders will break off if needed to pass thru bone, does this sound right??

Iam going to try some laminated birch with 125gr two blade Magnus vented heads in a few months, Iam hoping that 700 grains and that head would do it out of a 56# bow??

Offline Rick Kearney

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Re: Who's used WW on moose?
« Reply #53 on: March 13, 2006, 10:50:00 AM »
Took me a while to get back here but finally did.  Vance I honored your request and went in through a rib.  This past weekend I shot a cow bison (estimated weight 1100-1200#)and used the WW on a laminated birch shaft (640gr.) out of my longbow (63#).

Had a slightly quartering away shot (NNE instead of NE) and got 24" of penetration, through the third rib from the back, that resulted in an 80 -90 yard mad dash before piling up.  It took everything that three of us had to get her upright for the hero photo's.  After skinning the guys looked at the hole that the WW made going through that rib and asked me what gauge shotgun I had used!

We have a pot luck banquet coming up this weekend for our district of Michigan Bow Hunters and I plan on serving bison ribs.

Thanks again for the advice.

Rick K (still a bowhunter)

Offline Steve O

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Re: Who's used WW on moose?
« Reply #54 on: March 13, 2006, 11:18:00 AM »
Rick--awesome!  Wish I was not in District 6 right about now   :D

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