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Main Boards => The Bowyer's Bench => Topic started by: Fishinglink on October 13, 2020, 06:59:56 PM

Title: Riser design
Post by: Fishinglink on October 13, 2020, 06:59:56 PM
Hey guys. Getting ready to build my first ASL and need an opinion on this riser design. 14” overall length, 2” deep, top fade is 6”, bottom fade is 4”. This is literally 15 mins or so of sketching so critique away. The guy who gifted me the maple is willing to do the cuts for me, obviously the dish in the handle will be post glue up. Thanks in advance.
Title: Re: Riser design
Post by: Bvas on October 13, 2020, 08:25:05 PM
Glass or wood bow?
Title: Re: Riser design
Post by: Fishinglink on October 13, 2020, 08:30:43 PM
Sorry glass, guess that makes a difference.
Title: Re: Riser design
Post by: Bvas on October 13, 2020, 09:07:45 PM
The deepest part of your grip should be at the center of the bow. 1-3/4” is pretty standard depth at that point. Just remember you will have half your stack adding depth there.
Your upper radius isn’t terrible, but still a little tight/steep. I think you will have one heck of a time getting your lams tight on the bottom radius.
The flatter you can get your ramps/radius the easier glue up will be.
Title: Re: Riser design
Post by: Flem on October 13, 2020, 09:33:27 PM
Brad makes a good point, I think I would run all my lams on the back of the riser and just run the glass up the fades. You can sand down the glass a little if needed to achieve that curve. Thats one hell of dish on your grip. Looks painful actually.
Title: Re: Riser design
Post by: Longcruise on October 13, 2020, 09:36:27 PM
Adjust the depth to 1 3/8 to 1 1/2 to arrive at about 1 3/4 depth.  This will make your ramps less radical too.
Title: Re: Riser design
Post by: Fishinglink on October 13, 2020, 09:51:30 PM
That’s why I come to you guys. Also why pencils have erasers. So less dramatic ramps and take stack into consideration for riser depth. How are the proportions for the asymmetrical design? My plan was to only run the fiberglass up the ramps figuring that would reduce some stress of getting wood to bend like that. Gonna keep this one simple and just go with flat limbs with possible sting follow.

Here’s a new sketch. Definitely see the difference and looks a bit better.
Title: Re: Riser design
Post by: Flem on October 13, 2020, 10:26:02 PM
Not sure what you have going, but you only need 1" difference on the fade lengths, unless you are going for a more radical design with a bigger limb length differential. Personally I think Hill style Bows are more enjoyable to tiller without any lams running up the fades.
Title: Re: Riser design
Post by: Mad Max on October 13, 2020, 10:35:59 PM
Not sure what you have going, but you only need 1" difference on the fade lengths, unless you are going for a more radical design with a bigger limb length differential. Personally I think Hill style Bows are more enjoyable to tiller without any lams running up the fades.


Got pictures Flem????????
Title: Re: Riser design
Post by: Fishinglink on October 13, 2020, 11:02:00 PM
Not sure what you have going, but you only need 1" difference on the fade lengths, unless you are going for a more radical design with a bigger limb length differential. Personally I think Hill style Bows are more enjoyable to tiller without any lams running up the fades.

Looks like I was bringing the fade all the way to the shelf.
Title: Re: Riser design
Post by: Longcruise on October 13, 2020, 11:09:30 PM
Your fade transition is rather abrupt.  It will put strain on the transition and create a hinge effect.   It's a common point of failure.   Typically the riser should be no more than 1/16" thick at a point 1" from the end of the fades.  Yours are approximately 3/16" thick.
Title: Re: Riser design
Post by: Mad Max on October 14, 2020, 09:28:49 AM
what length riser does a ASL need to have?
Title: Re: Riser design
Post by: Flem on October 14, 2020, 11:56:15 AM
Got pictures Flem????????


No sure what pictures your looking for Mark?

12-14" risers are pretty standard for Hill style, I personally like shorties.

Mike is spot on about the fades. The first drawing fades look good and the top drawing of the second sketch also looks good, but the bottom drawing is a no go.
Title: Re: Riser design
Post by: Mad Max on October 14, 2020, 12:03:19 PM
show him some risers Flem
Title: Re: Riser design
Post by: Flem on October 14, 2020, 12:14:23 PM
show him some risers Flem

Duh :banghead:

I will post some pics shortly
Title: Re: Riser design
Post by: Flem on October 14, 2020, 02:15:26 PM
OK, here are a few roughed out risers. Dimensions are not exact yet, but you can see they are all a little longer on the right side. Going for about an 1" on average. [ You are not allowed to view attachments ]
  Most of the grips are destined to be around 4" long. Definitely don't need a big, long grip on a Hill style, unless you have a real big meaty hand. I have had the opportunity to examine a few of Hill's personal bows, they don't have big grip and Hill was a big dude with big hands. They are not the kind of bows you grip with your pinky sicking out. They are made for a dynamic shooting style which requires a firm grip
Title: Re: Riser design
Post by: Buemaker on October 14, 2020, 02:55:28 PM
Did Howard Hill make the risers that way, about an inch longer on the upper limb?
Title: Re: Riser design
Post by: Flem on October 14, 2020, 05:59:58 PM
Actually I think of it as an inch shorter on the lower limb. If done right, the limbs balance/time without having to adjust the stack from limb to limb, or having to resort to extreme tillering.
Title: Re: Riser design
Post by: Flem on October 14, 2020, 06:07:48 PM
Sorry Bue forgot to answer your question. I don't think Howard made asymmetrical risers, but I have not seen that many of his bows. I know some of the bowyers contracted over the years by Howard Hill Archery have used them. Don't ask me which ones.
Title: Re: Riser design
Post by: Fishinglink on October 14, 2020, 08:21:40 PM
Adjusted the angles to thin out toward the tips of the riser.
Title: Re: Riser design
Post by: jsweka on October 14, 2020, 08:52:05 PM
I make mine with symmetrical risers (and limb length) and then let the bow tell me which end is up at first stringing.  But I’m kind of lazy and it makes tillering go quicker.
Title: Re: Riser design
Post by: Longcruise on October 14, 2020, 11:48:04 PM
I make mine with symmetrical risers (and limb length) and then let the bow tell me which end is up at first stringing.  But I’m kind of lazy and it makes tillering go quicker.

Ditto,  although I have an asymmetrical design that I'll try.  I go 14 or 15 inches so it is a little easier.
Title: Re: Riser design
Post by: algstick on October 15, 2020, 12:58:56 PM
I build all my risers symmetrical 14-15" fade to fade depending on bow length. I place the shelf 1 1/4" above the centerline of the bow making the bottom limb slightly shorter, this creates a built in positive tiller. I only run the belly glass up the riser ramp. I like the looks of the steep ramps but it does make for difficulty getting a good glue line especially with .050" fiberglass. This is just my 2 cents and what I see most In Hill style bows.