Trad Gang

Topic Archives => Hunting => Topic started by: Madpigslayer on December 11, 2004, 01:24:00 AM

Title: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: Madpigslayer on December 11, 2004, 01:24:00 AM
I think that the best thing that could happen to a bowhunter/hunter of any persuasion would be to have a web link that would allow us to view "internal" views of all the differant game animals.

the way I picture this is...having a 'search' feature for whatever animal you want, say 'black bear' or 'kudo' or whatever, then you can move the 'xrayed' animal around however you want (like a 3D drawing or something) to persieve shot angle/kill zone.

the kill zones are so differant on all the differant animals that I think it would be a nice thing to be able to access.

this thing has been brought on by watching the african game animals, that always seem to be shot "too far forward" and then always die post haste.

I would like to KNOW the anatomy of whatever I want, whenever I want.

comments?
Title: Re: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: Windknot on December 11, 2004, 03:00:00 AM
Good point, MPS. If you shoot a blue wildebeest in the same place as a whitetail you're gonna be tracking for DAYS. I think there is a video like that in South Africa, and there used to be a set of cards that showed you where the heart and lungs of African species are located.

If there is enough interest I'll get my father to send me some, and I can pass them on to any interested Tradgangers.
Title: Re: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: herb haines on December 11, 2004, 03:42:00 AM
yes african animals the heart lungs are way forward and also they have a lot more tenasity tio live .
African antalope you come up front leg about 4" above the body line and place arrow right there on broad side shot .
here in NA we try for behind back leg  on whitetails in the little pocket on African game as Windnot said that is a gut shot and in Africa if you  draw blood you just bought it    :D  so you need to know shot placement !!
Calvin would love to see a site like that ,need some piggy info !!---- herb
Title: Re: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: Guru on December 11, 2004, 06:37:00 AM
Cool concept Calvin,interesting.

Herb,you can almost think of a hog like an african animal..forward and low gets the job done fast!Bring you safari gear  :bigsmyl:
Title: Re: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: Dano on December 11, 2004, 08:29:00 AM
You'd have to shoot the 67 Ford shortbox in the junk yard  :bigsmyl:
Title: Re: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: sticshooter on December 11, 2004, 10:09:00 AM
Good idea calvin.Ya would have to shoot the 67 ford more then once.There tuff!<><
Title: Re: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: Windknot on December 11, 2004, 10:12:00 AM
Dano,

Wouldn't that be a canned hunt?
Title: Re: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: Meathook on December 11, 2004, 10:14:00 AM
Quote
Originally posted by Madpigslayer:
I would like to KNOW the anatomy of whatever I want, whenever I want.

comments?
That would certainly be helpful now that you are dating again.   :p
Title: Re: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: Doc Nock on December 11, 2004, 10:19:00 AM
Ohhhh, Meathook.  You didn't just go and say that!   :rolleyes:
Title: Re: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: LBR on December 11, 2004, 10:50:00 AM
Haven't found them on-line, but there are books that show the position of the vitals, skeletal structure, etc.  I have "The Perfect Shot, North America" that has everything from antelope to walrus listed, and there is a version for African game too.  The one I have is written by a rifle hunter, and he mostly discusses shot placement and calibers for guns, but you can see the bones and vitals just the same to know what would be a good shot with a bow.

Chad
Title: Re: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: kyle on December 11, 2004, 11:10:00 AM
I've got some of African game that I got online somewhere.  I'll see if I can get someone to help me get them posted.

Kyle
Title: Re: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: kyle on December 11, 2004, 11:21:00 AM
Calvin, I sent you an e-mail with the pics I've got.  I'm not sure they're exactly like you're talking about....the 3-d feature would be way cool.....but this is a good start.  I can't remember where I picked these up at but I can take no credit as a source for them.

Kyle
Title: Re: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: Mark Baker on December 11, 2004, 03:20:00 PM
Try on the NBEF site.   I know we get supplied with a lot of anotomical "layered" acetate artwork that shows bone structure, circulatory, respiratory, guts, etc. of most N. American game animals.   They may have those available on-line (especially since they are trying to get the course put on-line).   Not quite 3-d, but very useful.
Title: Re: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: Ontario Longbow on December 11, 2004, 03:37:00 PM
I love this site ,,, I too would like to see different animals in this format ,, Frank.
 http://home.mn.rr.com/deerfever/Anatomy.html
Title: Re: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: Madpigslayer on December 11, 2004, 10:40:00 PM
good stuff guys.

I will take a minute and post the pics that Kyle "lover of the nutter" sent to me. (for you to steal and use however you want.  :)  )
Title: Re: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: Jamie Dawson on December 11, 2004, 10:47:00 PM
cool
Title: Re: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: Madpigslayer on December 11, 2004, 11:01:00 PM
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v75/madpigslayer/kill%20zone%20pictures/zebra.jpg)
 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v75/madpigslayer/kill%20zone%20pictures/Warthog.jpg)
 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v75/madpigslayer/kill%20zone%20pictures/viziabig.jpg)
 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v75/madpigslayer/kill%20zone%20pictures/vantilopbig.jpg)
 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v75/madpigslayer/kill%20zone%20pictures/tehenabig.jpg)
 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v75/madpigslayer/kill%20zone%20pictures/oryx.jpg)
 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v75/madpigslayer/kill%20zone%20pictures/leopardbig.jpg)
 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v75/madpigslayer/kill%20zone%20pictures/Kudu.jpg)
Title: Re: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: Madpigslayer on December 11, 2004, 11:02:00 PM
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v75/madpigslayer/kill%20zone%20pictures/klipsprbig.jpg)
 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v75/madpigslayer/kill%20zone%20pictures/javorabig.jpg)
 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v75/madpigslayer/kill%20zone%20pictures/impala.jpg)
 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v75/madpigslayer/kill%20zone%20pictures/gnubig.jpg)
 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v75/madpigslayer/kill%20zone%20pictures/DikDik.jpg)
 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v75/madpigslayer/kill%20zone%20pictures/CapeBuffalo.jpg)
 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v75/madpigslayer/kill%20zone%20pictures/bozotabig.jpg)
Title: Re: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: coaltroll on December 12, 2004, 12:20:00 AM
Those are good, would like to see some of the same for NA game animals. If a person could see that while trying to make a shot, might make a difference. Still have to pick a spot.
Title: Re: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: Scooby on December 12, 2004, 01:07:00 AM
So where is the scoring rings on these animals.  Of course there also should be an x-ring right???  Just joking.   Do you need one of a squirrel MPS????
Title: Re: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: Brute killer on December 12, 2004, 01:40:00 AM
Straight up the foreleg.
Title: Re: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: Windknot on December 12, 2004, 05:29:00 AM
Well, based on practical experience I can confirm that the springbuck's anatomy is 100% correct! Really great pics MPS- do you have the URL for us?
Title: Re: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: Madpigslayer on December 12, 2004, 10:43:00 AM
windknot, Kyle just emailed me those...he didnt remember (I think) where he got them. So I just put them in my photobuckut account. You all can steal them right off of this thread, or you can right-clik on the actual picture...left-clik on 'properties' and copy the URL link to each picture. I will probably leave those pictures up indefinatly, so feel free to link to them.

Scooby, as soon as you forward me the picture of the squirrel kill zone, I will post it  :)
Title: Re: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: kyle on December 12, 2004, 10:56:00 AM
Roger that MPS.  I have been trying to remember where I found those and can't.  The thread I was reading was about how shots on african game need to be straight up the front leg.  It may have come from a link from a thread on here but it would have been about a year ago or so.  I take no credit for them, I'm just passing along something I picked up along the way.

Kyle
Title: Re: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: Madpigslayer on December 12, 2004, 11:02:00 AM
cool. When we watched the DVD, it seemed every shot was punched through the foreleg...sometimes only 10 inches of penetration...then they walked up to a dead animal. This has been a real educational thread for me.
Title: Re: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: Dr. Ed Ashby on December 12, 2004, 02:07:00 PM
I've learned all my animal anatomy through dissections - knowing where the entrance and exit wounds were and seeing what the shot hit as it passed through.

I've shot all the above animals, except for springbok.  Most 'anatomical drawings' (including most of the above) do not have the organs correctly placed.  This, I believe, is because people dissect the animal with it laying on its side and sketch out where they see the organs.  In that position the organs shift higher and more 'rearward' in the body cavity than they are when the animal is standing.

Some genuine x-rays of standing animals would be a great way to see exactly where they were.  The important thing to remember is that all the animals "live between the shoulders".  I try to keep all shots as far forward as I feel I can, and is one reason I strive so for extreme penetration from my set-ups.  I probably do hit more bone more often than most bowhunters - but I don't get very many hits 'too far back'.  Over the last 1/4 century my wound/loss rate for bowhunted animals is well below 1 percent.

Ed
Title: Re: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: kyle on December 12, 2004, 02:13:00 PM
Dr. Ashby, in your experince, do the pictures posted seem even close to what you've seen?  I completely understand what you mean about dissecting animals on the ground but how much would you "trust" the pictures I found?

Thanks for your hard work and passing along for all of us out here.

Very Respectfully,
Kyle
Title: Re: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: Dr. Ed Ashby on December 12, 2004, 02:29:00 PM
Kyle,

I would say most of the drawings are "sorta close", but they can be somewhat misleading.  They often give the impression of a kill-zone that is way to far back.  Many of what would look like killing hits, based on the sketches, will actually be at or behind the diaphram.

If one wishes to avoid bone and be sure of getting into boiler room, the best thing is to take the quartering away shots and angle directly to the point of the off shoulder or at the front edge of the off shoulder.  The down side is that one again needs high penetration in order to get an exit wound - but at least the vitals will be reached with minimum tissue resistance until after the thorax has been penetrated.

On broadside shots it's best to really keep all shots tucked up tight to the shoulder crease.  Myself, on 'standard' big game I like to put it through the shoulder meat just back of the articulation of the humurus and scapula - and use "enough" to bust through when I do hit the bones.

Ed
Title: Re: interactive animal 'xray' views
Post by: kyle on December 12, 2004, 02:41:00 PM
Dr. Ashby, I thank you for your quick response.  I'd say that in my experience, what I'm looking for in my shot placement is very much what you describe.  Thanks again.

Kyle